Creighton

[wadesworld]

So in hindsight, was it still a horrible decision? Looks like the right buttons were pressed!

Yes, still a terrible decision.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yes, still a terrible decision.

.....

Glad to be wrong.  Wojo pushing the right buttons.

Let's give them 40 minutes of Warriors basketball.

Huh?

[wadesworld]

Why? Coach felt starting two of the seniors was the right buttons to push.  He even took your advice and took Katin off the bench. We won. Not only did we win, but we played our basketball early in the game. So what proof do you have that it was a terrible decision?

That's like saying a well contested 26 foot 3 pointer up by 6 with a minute to go and 27 seconds left on the shot clock that rims in is a good shot.

Glad everyone came to play. Terrible decision to mix a starting lineup that has worked in a must win game.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

That's like saying a well contested 26 foot 3 pointer up by 6 with a minute to go and 27 seconds left on the shot clock that rims in is a good shot.

Glad everyone came to play. Terrible decision to mix a starting lineup that has worked in a must win game.

Glad to be wrong.  Wojo pushing the right buttons.

Let's give them 40 minutes of Warriors basketball.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Yes, still a terrible decision.

No.

[brewcity77]

I've seen people own up to mistakes and admit they were wrong, but this may be there first time someone has admitted to being wrong, then said "no, I wasn't wrong!"

I mean...you said you were wrong... 

[wadesworld]

I've seen people own up to mistakes and admit they were wrong, but this may be there first time someone has admitted to being wrong, then said "no, I wasn't wrong!"

I mean...you said you were wrong... 

Yeah. I'm glad I was wrong that JJ and Luke played well in a different role.

It was still a bad decision.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Yeah. I'm glad I was wrong that JJ and Luke played well in a different role.

It was still a bad decision.

So....if he had made your suggested decision we would have won by more? I wish I had your ability to see alternate realities!

[Vander Blue Man Group]

Yeah. I'm glad I was wrong that JJ and Luke played well in a different role.

It was still a bad decision.

No. it wasn't.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

No...NO.....NOOOOOH      Yeah!

[wadesworld]

So....if he had made your suggested decision we would have won by more? I wish I had your ability to see alternate realities!

Who said that?

Again, results don't justify decisions. "Well, hunny, had you not cheated on me I would've never realized something was missing and our relationship would've never been this strong now. I'm so glad you slept with your secretary, what a great decision!"

[Smokin' Jae]

I would certainly hope so.

I also would certainly hope that Wojo understands that a win against Creighton puts us into the NCAA Tournament and there's no need to risk changing what has worked better than when we were starting our 3 seniors.

This would literally be the first time I had a question about whether Wojo had "it" if he started guys in a must-win game simply so the fans can give them a cheer.

These guys are all contributors.  They've all played before.  They've all heard their names announced in the starting lineups at Marquette before.  They'll all have their families walk onto the court with them to receive their framed jerseys.  And at the end of the game if the game is already decided within the last minute one way or the other, they'll all get to exit the court one last time, one at a time, to a standing ovation.

A win locks us into the NCAA Tournament, somewhere we haven't been in 4 seasons.  A loss puts us squarely on the bubble.  This isn't a team that has its fate decided already.  I don't even care if you start the 3 seniors with Deon and Cam and tell Deon or Cam to foul 1 second into the game to sub all 5 out, you don't do it.  You treat this like it is any other game.  Because at the end of the day that is what it is.  Except that it's the biggest game of the year, and the biggest game of Wojo's coaching career.

Haahahaha wojo doesn't have it

[wadesworld]

Haahahaha wojo doesn't have it

Your words.

[Smokin' Jae]

Yeah. I'm glad I was wrong that JJ and Luke played well in a different role.

It was still a bad decision.

This fucking pretty boy^

[wadesworld]

This unnatural carnal knowledgeing pretty boy^

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Who said that?

Again, results don't justify decisions. "Well, hunny, had you not cheated on me I would've never realized something was missing and our relationship would've never been this strong now. I'm so glad you slept with your secretary, what a great decision!"

I'm just trying to discern what makes you so sure it was a terrible decision. You thought Wojo should use a different starting lineup. Wojo, who I assume knows more about basketball and about how to get the best out of his players than you or I ever will, disagreed. If it hadn't worked, I could see an argument for it being a terrible decision. I would still say the coach knows his players best but could understand the reasoning. But it did work. So I'm just curious what makes you so sure that it was such a bad decision. I'm not faulting you for having a different opinion, but to say it with such finality "Yes, still a terrible decision." I just assumed there was some reasoning behind it.

[wadesworld]

I'm just trying to discern what makes you so sure it was a terrible decision. You thought Wojo should use a different starting lineup. Wojo, who I assume knows more about basketball and about how to get the best out of his players than you or I ever will, disagreed. If it hadn't worked, I could see an argument for it being a terrible decision. I would still say the coach knows his players best but could understand the reasoning. But it did work. So I'm just curious what makes you so sure that it was such a bad decision. I'm not faulting you for having a different opinion, but to say it with such finality "Yes, still a terrible decision." I just assumed there was some reasoning behind it.

My thoughts on why it is a bad decision has not changed since when I said it was prior to the game. The result of something being positive doesn't automatically justify something. Just like people continue to use Cuse still not having deserved to be in the NCAA Tournament field last year even if they did make the Final Four run. Just because the result is good doesn't mean it was the correct decision. I am of the opinion that in a must win situation you don't change what has been working for you just so a few guys feel good about themselves. You don't change what has been working.

[MuMark]

This is one of the most scoop threads ever.......and that is saying something....lol

We won.....he started the seniors.....I wouldn't have but who the F cares?

WE WON!

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

My thoughts on why it is a bad decision has not changed since when I said it was prior to the game. The result of something being positive doesn't automatically justify something. Just like people continue to use Cuse still not having deserved to be in the NCAA Tournament field last year even if they did make the Final Four run. Just because the result is good doesn't mean it was the correct decision. I am of the opinion that in a must win situation you don't change what has been working for you just so a few guys feel good about themselves. You don't change what has been working.

Thank you. You admitted it was an opinion. All I was looking for.

[79Warrior]

Yeah. I'm glad I was wrong that JJ and Luke played well in a different role.

It was still a bad decision.

Disagree. The right move. You are wrong.

[Smokin' Jae]

Not that long ago I spoke with one of the coaches who mentioned that the biggest issue in the program was that there was not a hierarchy. He feels that great programs have seniors that show the younger guys how the program is run and lead by example. I was not in the slightest surprised to see Jjj or Luke in the starting lineup today. Wojo is a believer in rewarding his seniors and the younger guys will most certainly take notice of this.

[GGGG]

Who said that?

Again, results don't justify decisions. "Well, hunny, had you not cheated on me I would've never realized something was missing and our relationship would've never been this strong now. I'm so glad you slept with your secretary, what a great decision!"

This is horrible logic.

Cheating on your spouse is clearly a moral wrong because of the harm it causes to your partner as well as to those affected by the relationship.  It is never the right thing to do, even though some good can come of it.

Deciding who to start in a basketball game isn't a "right" or "wrong" in that regard because no one is really harmed by the choice.  IMO, the results of decisions like these most definitely justify the decision itself.  Just like when Wojo changed the line up a few games ago.

[brewcity77]

My thoughts on why it is a bad decision has not changed since when I said it was prior to the game. The result of something being positive doesn't automatically justify something. Just like people continue to use Cuse still not having deserved to be in the NCAA Tournament field last year even if they did make the Final Four run. Just because the result is good doesn't mean it was the correct decision. I am of the opinion that in a must win situation you don't change what has been working for you just so a few guys feel good about themselves. You don't change what has been working.

I think you might have an argument if we had a stock starting five for the past 20-25 games. But we haven't. We've mixed and matched starters all year. Maybe part of the starting lineup was trying to replicate what worked in Omaha.

If you look at the SOTG thread from that game, it is almost 100% for either Luke or Katin. Katin declined the start, but JJ had 18/5 that day. Maybe part of pushing the right buttons was using a lineup that was effective against Creighton before. Here's what you said about that game:

Sorry Katin, but this was Luke all the way.  Great for 40 minutes.  And most importantly made Patton his biotch.

Luke was named SOTG and was huge at both defending Patton and getting him into foul trouble. Starting him may have been a plan to try doing that again. Similarly, using JJ early because he also had a nice game the first time around.

Part of good coaching is being able to make the right adjustment before something goes wrong. Isn't it possible that tinkering with the starters against an opponent you've already seen might be such a move?

[wadesworld]

I think you might have an argument if we had a stock starting five for the past 20-25 games. But we haven't. We've mixed and matched starters all year. Maybe part of the starting lineup was trying to replicate what worked in Omaha.

If you look at the SOTG thread from that game, it is almost 100% for either Luke or Katin. Katin declined the start, but JJ had 18/5 that day. Maybe part of pushing the right buttons was using a lineup that was effective against Creighton before. Here's what you said about that game:

Luke was named SOTG and was huge at both defending Patton and getting him into foul trouble. Starting him may have been a plan to try doing that again. Similarly, using JJ early because he also had a nice game the first time around.

Part of good coaching is being able to make the right adjustment before something goes wrong. Isn't it possible that tinkering with the starters against an opponent you've already seen might be such a move?

I think there's a 0% chance Duane and Heldt come off the bench yesterday if we have 1 or more home games left in the season.

[brewcity77]

I think there's a 0% chance Duane and Heldt come off the bench yesterday if we have 1 or more home games left in the season.

Maybe so, and I'd think it's likely he'd have stuck with the same starting lineup, but if the argument is to stick with what works, look at the combined stat lines from Creighton in Omaha:

Luke/JJ: 54 minutes, 14/22 FGs, 70.5 eFG%, 36 points, 13 rebounds, 5 assists, 6 blocks
Heldt/Duane: 21 minutes, 1/2 FGs, 50.0 eFG%, 2 points, 2 rebounds, 0 assists, 0 blocks

You said stick with what works, and Luke and JJ worked in Omaha. That said, in the past 4 games with the new lineup, we played a Xavier team we hadn't previously faced, Providence and St John's teams that beat our old starting lineup, and a Xavier team again that already lost to the new lineup.

So Wojo used the new lineup against teams that beat the old lineup and one team that we hadn't yet faced, and went back to the old lineup against a team that had previously struggled with said old lineup. If he's sticking with what works, running Luke and JJ out against Creighton is the very definition of that.