NBA '17

[Silkk the Shaka]

The last 5 seconds of OT were reffed terribly.  You know it's gonna take a lot to actually get suspended a game at this point so just let the players talk and the clock run down.  Understand why Livingston shot, understand why Thompson contested, but there was no need to blow the whistle at all at that point.

The one real gripe I had with the officiating was the reversal of the block/change call in regulation.  It's the hardest call to make in basketball, and you should be able to review to see if the defender is in the restricted area, but reversing the foul call should not be an option unless the call on the court was made with the wrong info regarding the restricted area.  Using replay to call fouls is a slippery slope IMO.  Lebron was clearly outside of the restricted area, so I don't even know why they were reviewing it at all.

Totally agree with this. Review in that situation should be an in/out of circle yes/no check, not overturning the subjective aspect. It was borderline (as with most charge/block calls), but to overturn it on replay blew my mind. Not a fan

[Lennys Tap]

Everyone attacking JR for a world-class mistake.

No one mentioning George Hill missing the free throw

Missing free throws happens to everyone. Not knowing the score with 4.7 seconds left in the game is a world class, unforgivable blunder.

[jesmu84]

The refs were not good throughout.  That 50-50 call reversal was NBA RIGGED CONSPIRACY THEORISTS DREAM exhibit.  Even in the OT, you do not throw a guy out for trying to block a shot.

I didn't think the refs should throw Tristan out. But he definitely, intentionally, led with his elbow at Shaun's head.

[GGGG]

I'm guessing you want the Cavs to win.  There were a lot more key calls wrong than that (or which could have been called wrong). 

Yes, Lebron did get hit on the hand there, but that is rarely called in the NBA, as the defender also hit the ball clearly. 

If the strip on Lebron is a foul, than the strip on Durant is certainly a foul.  He was hacked across both arms.  There was another play just like this not too long earlier that was called a clean strip that gave a steal to the Cavs that was a clear foul.

Lebron's 3-pt play, was not a foul.  He shouldn't have been shooting an and 1. 

The 50/50 call was not a 50/50 call.  It was a clear blocking foul.  The ref clearly wasn't sure which way to call it, he hesitated for a good 5 seconds, trying to consult with the other official.  Apparently the other official wasn't sure either.  That is why they allow replay.  They made a call, because it didn't matter what they choose they could over-rule it on replay. 

The Lebron drive to close it to a 4 point game was an obvious travel.  Took 3 full steps before jumping after picking up his dribble.

There are a number of other calls that are similar.  Overall, officiating benefitted the Cavs (game long) more than the warriors. 

I agree though, the refs were not good in this game. 

Benefitted the Cavs?  Cmon...

[GGGG]

Missing free throws happens to everyone. Not knowing the score with 4.7 seconds left in the game is a world class, unforgivable blunder.

Yep.

[forgetful]

Benefitted the Cavs?  Cmon...

I think it was called pretty even.  Missed calls on both sides that impacted the game.  They largely balance out.

I say benefitted the Cavs, because the style of officiating.  Largely on missed shots.  They let the teams bang (leading to a 15 rebound advantage for the Cavs). Similarly, no whistles on contact on the perimeter, but tight whistles on drives.  Again, that style, although balanced, slightly favors the Cavs.

Style of officiating, is why I say slight overall benefit to the Cavs.  Calls wise, even.

[MerrittsMustache]

Missing free throws happens to everyone. Not knowing the score with 4.7 seconds left in the game is a world class, unforgivable blunder.

You're right that Smith's blunder was worse but an 80% FT shooter badly missing a potential game-winning free throw in the Finals should not just be brushed aside.

Also, I'd be willing to bet that JR wasn't the only player on the floor who was unaware the game was tied.

[Vander Blue Man Group]

You're right that Smith's blunder was worse but an 80% FT shooter badly missing a potential game-winning free throw in the Finals should not just be brushed aside.

Also, I'd be willing to bet that JR wasn't the only player on the floor who was unaware the game was tied.

Let's not forget that any of the players or Lue could have called a timeout.  They still could have won in OT.

[forgetful]

Let's not forget that any of the players or Lue could have called a timeout.  They still could have won in OT.

That's the craziest part in my opinion.  No one, not the coach, not even Lebron bothered to call timeout when it was clear he was confused. 

Even at the last second, Lebron points out Hill in the corner instead of calling TO.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I think Lebron did try to call a timeout but the refs didn't see it in time.

[forgetful]

I think Lebron did try to call a timeout but the refs didn't see it in time.

He did, after pointing to Hill, and JR passed it. But time had expired at that point (maybe 0.5 seconds left, but no one had possession of the ball at that point).

I'm not sure if a TO can be granted if the ball is not in possession (in air on a pass).  I didn't think it could, but if it could then Lebron did call TO.

Regardless, it does mean that Lebron tried to call TO, which makes my statement at best, incomplete.

[brewcity77]

TONI KUKOC
Kukoc is known to Bulls fans as the Sixth Man winner in 1996 with the 72-win greatest team ever and a sixth man and starter for the three-time Bulls champions from 1996-1998. But worldwide in basketball, Kukoc is regarded as one of the greatest ever and one of the pioneers that led to the globalization of the NBA. His Split team won the Euroleague three times and he was named MVP twice. Then he went to play in Italy and his team won the championship and he again was Euroleague MVP. He won multiple Euroleague player of the year awards and is regarded as the most accomplished Euroleague player ever. His teams won the FIBA junior world title, a World Championship and two Olympic silver medals. Kukoc was a clutch shot maker for those Bulls teams, generally the choice for coach Phil Jackson to take the big shot other than Michael Jordan. He played 13 seasons in the NBA and averaged 12.1 points despite being primarily a sixth man. Kukoc recently was hired as special advisor to the Bulls' team president.

Everything bolded was outside his NBA career. So essentially, his case as a NBA player is a 6th Man of the Year award, not being the top option on his team to take a big shot, and averaging 12.1 ppg. If that's HOF calibur, you have some really low standards.

[Lennys Tap]

You're right that Smith's blunder was worse but an 80% FT shooter badly missing a potential game-winning free throw in the Finals should not just be brushed aside.

Also, I'd be willing to bet that JR wasn't the only player on the floor who was unaware the game was tied.

An 80% FT shooter goes 2 for 2 64% of the time. Making both is the most likely outcome but not by an overwhelming margin. It's understandable.

Not know the score with 4.7 seconds left (after a stoppage in play) is IMO not understandable. If there were multiple players on the court who didn't know what the score was I would be shocked/disappointed. And if you (the coach) knows that one (or more) of his players is a space cadet and needs to be reminded of score/time/situation he should have done it.

[Pakuni]

Everything bolded was outside his NBA career. So essentially, his case as a NBA player is a 6th Man of the Year award, not being the top option on his team to take a big shot, and averaging 12.1 ppg. If that's HOF calibur, you have some really low standards.

Well, there was that one time ...

[GGGG]

Well, there was that one time ...

Lol. That’s right.

[brewcity77]

Well, there was that one time ...

I thought of that as I wrote the post 

[WarriorDad]

The 50/50 call was not a 50/50 call.  It was a clear blocking foul.  The ref clearly wasn't sure which way to call it, he hesitated for a good 5 seconds, trying to consult with the other official.  Apparently the other official wasn't sure either.  That is why they allow replay.  They made a call, because it didn't matter what they choose they could over-rule it on replay. 

No way.  Even on replays it was iffy. The game is reffed at real time, not slow motion.  The refs claimed they needed to see if he was outside the restricted arc, that is awful. He was way over it.  That call never should have been reviewed.  Awful awful awful. Then to reverse that call, a 50-50 call slowed down when it is a judgment call to begin with at full speed?  Terrible.

http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=23668696

[WarriorDad]

Everything bolded was outside his NBA career. So essentially, his case as a NBA player is a 6th Man of the Year award, not being the top option on his team to take a big shot, and averaging 12.1 ppg. If that's HOF calibur, you have some really low standards.

Sam Smith's opinion as a professional basketball writer on his Hall of Fame credentials vs Fireman's opinion of basketball playing career

Hard to decide.   

[forgetful]

No way.  Even on replays it was iffy. The game is reffed at real time, not slow motion.  The refs claimed they needed to see if he was outside the restricted arc, that is awful. He was way over it.  That call never should have been reviewed.  Awful awful awful. Then to reverse that call, a 50-50 call slowed down when it is a judgment call to begin with at full speed?  Terrible.

http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=23668696

It was even more obvious that it was a clear blocking foul in real time.  And regarding the restricted arc.  Lebron's foot was still on the line after Durant had already picked up his dribble.  Lebron then jumps slides underneath Durant as Durant is going up for his shot.  Had he stayed in the initial legal guarding position, he would have been in the restricted zone, which is why he slid under Durant, to make sure he was not in the restricted zone (which he wasn't, but then he slid under him which makes it a blocking call).

Lebron is both leaning and moving (crashes into the other defender, whose foot is in the restricted zone) when the collision occurs. 

Very clear blocking call.  The exact type of play the NBA had in mind when they allowed replay in these particular incidents.  But should have been called a block in real time.  The NBA reviewed it, and agrees with what I wrote.

[wadesworld]

Sam Smith's opinion as a professional basketball writer on his Hall of Fame credentials vs Fireman's opinion of basketball playing career

Hard to decide.   

I’m sure if writers found it worth their time to discuss players not worthy of the HOF plenty of people would write about Toni Kukoc, after they wrote about many other players first.

Toni Kukoc is not a HOF basketball player. But calling him such fits your agenda so that you can say MJ got to play with 3 (hilarious) HOFers and that’s why he went 6-0 in NBA Finals and is the difference between LBJ’s Finals success (or lack thereof) and MJ’s Finals success.

The obvious problem here is that your agenda is so strong it apparently blocked out your memory of LBJ going 2-2 in NBA Finals series with the Heat, where he played with 3 (no, really, 3 legitimate, not 2 and some solid 6th man who was great overseas) HOFers.

Oops?

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Sam Smith's opinion as a professional basketball writer on his Hall of Fame credentials vs Fireman's opinion of basketball playing career

Hard to decide.   

Sam Smith now writes for bulls.com so he was probably asked to write that article specifically about 10 Bulls. It's a puff piece.

[wadesworld]

Sam Smith now writes for bulls.com so he was probably asked to write that article specifically about 10 Bulls. It's a puff piece.

Outstanding.

[Pakuni]

Sam Smith's opinion as a professional basketball writer on his Hall of Fame credentials vs Fireman's opinion of basketball playing career

Hard to decide.   

Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy you should have learned about in your freshman philosophy class.

[WarriorDad]

Sam Smith now writes for bulls.com so he was probably asked to write that article specifically about 10 Bulls. It's a puff piece.

Only one problem with that theory.

This paragraph at the top of the article  https://www.nba.com/bulls/news/samsmith/9-bulls-hall-fame-case

"The contents of this page have not been reviewed or endorsed by the Chicago Bulls. All opinions expressed by Sam Smith are solely his own and do not reflect the opinions of the Chicago Bulls or its Basketball Operations staff, parent company, partners, or sponsors. His sources are not known to the Bulls and he has no special access to information beyond the access and privileges that go along with being an NBA accredited member of the media."


And to summarize, not only is it not a puff piece, but you are also impugning Sam Smith's credibility as a journalist in the process. 

[WarriorDad]

Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy you should have learned about in your freshman philosophy class.

I'm appealing to expertise vs someone that doesn't have the same level of expertise.  I learned that in life through common sense.

It's why I hire season mechanics, why I employed (back in the day) experienced people, why I vote for people with gov't experience and not hair brains that have never done it, and so many other examples.

Outstanding

In the most non-outstanding way possible because the site calls out clearly the views and opinions have not been seen, reviewed, expressed by the Bulls.   

On further review of your 250 candidates for Hall of Fame probability that you incorrectly passed off, did you know that 109 of your 250 are already in the HOF, or 43.6% of that list.  The hint was the * next to each name, repeated 109 times.  Even that list had players like Bill Walton only having a 2% chance of getting in and he did.