Class of 2020 Acceptance Rate 77%

[Disco Hippie]

I've brought this issue up before and after reading this story, feel compelled to mention it again.  It's great that this year's incoming Freshman class is significantly higher than last year, but that fact that they had to admit 77% of all applicants to get there is very troubling.

http://marquettewire.org/3951973/tribune/tribune-news/applications-decreases-but-enrollment-is-higher-for-class-of-2020/

Am I the only one who feels this way?  I suspect this stat will have a very negative impact on MU's USNWR ranking which has gone down in each of the last 2 years and likely will again this year when the 2017 rankings are released in a couple of weeks due to 40+ schools jumping from Regional Universities to National Universities as a result of the revised Carnegie Classification of Institutions of Higher Learning released earlier this year.  For the record, MU moved up this year from an R3 (Moderate Research Activity) to R2 (Higher Research Activity) among doctoral universities which is great, but with 40+ schools moving from the regional to national category this year (Villanova is one of them), I suspect that coupled with a 77% acceptance rate will cancel out the move up from R3 to R2.  It seems to me the administration just flat out doesn't care about or outright dismisses the negative consequences of having an acceptance rate that high.  Thoughts?

[Tugg Speedman]

All it means is MU has a very low yield (percentage of kids that are accepted that actually enroll).  How does MU get the yield up?  Simple, cut the price of tuition!  More specifically, they need a bigger endowment to offer more grants and scholarships to make the effective cost lower. (I've noted this before ... Harvard has a "list price" of $41k/year.  However 65% of the undergraduates get tuition breaks making the average tuition for them less than $12k.  So they are paying a little more than one-quarter the list price).

Otherwise, Milwaukee needs to raise its profile to make it a more desirable place ... think of why Georgetown is so popular.  I would argue a lot of it that DC is a "cool place" for millennials.  The problem is this summer's riots probably did the opposite for Milwaukee's desirability.

Question, how does MU's acceptance rate and yield compare to similar private urban universities around its ranking?  I'll bet it is "competitive."

(Note you have to compare it to its peers.  Bucky is a bad comparison because it is a state school and it is far cheaper to attend.  So it will naturally have a higher yield meaning a lower acceptance rate.  The size of the tuition bill is the dominate driver of the college choice for most families.)

[Tugg Speedman]

It seems to me the administration just flat out doesn't care about or outright dismisses the negative consequences of having an acceptance rate that high.  Thoughts?

This is wrong.  The administration cares a great deal. 

As a private university MU is huge (yuge!)

Biggest Private Colleges in the US By On-Campus Undergraduate Enrollment

Brigham Young University   30,409
New York University   21,646
Northeastern University   18,579
University of Southern California   17,112
Boston University   16,624
DePaul University   15,801

http://blog.prepscholar.com/the-biggest-colleges-in-the-united-states

-----------------

Did you know that Depaul was the 6th largest private university in the country?  MU is not that much behind them.

MU could cut the incoming class by a third and get the acceptance rate down, but they would have to cut everything else by a third due to the loss of revenue.

Acceptance rate is a very complicated number and I don't think any of your arguments in the first post explain why it is 77%.  It has more to do with the price of tuition, desirability of the location, desirability of the school and the size of the incoming class.

MU is a very large private university, Milwaukee is not a place that "sounds cool" to people outside of southeast Wisconsin, and it is far more expensive that the public school options.  These are the things holding it back.

[GGGG]

Oh here we go again.  The hand-wringing over statistics and the odd role they play in meaningless rankings.

[Tugg Speedman]

Here are the private universities of the Big East using this site

https://colleges.niche.com/

 
                                     Marquette       St. John       Nova       Depaul      Prov      Xavier    G-Town     S Hall
Total Applications           23,432          51.634      14,966      19,957     9,660    10,907   20,115     10,735

Total accepted                 13,462         27,449       7,319       11,948      5,776    7,632     3,413       8,498

Acceptance rate                57%              53%          49%           60%         60%      70%       17%        79%     

Yield                                 15%               10%          23%           20%         18%      17%       46%        16%

MU is #2 applications (behind St. Johns)

MU is fourth is acceptance rate (middle)

MU 7th in Yields  but 5th to 7th are a rounding error better than MU.

Compared to this group, I don't think MU is that bad.

You see different?  Is this the wrong crowd to measure against?

[Herman Cain]

I've brought this issue up before and after reading this story, feel compelled to mention it again.  It's great that this year's incoming Freshman class is significantly higher than last year, but that fact that they had to admit 77% of all applicants to get there is very troubling.

http://marquettewire.org/3951973/tribune/tribune-news/applications-decreases-but-enrollment-is-higher-for-class-of-2020/

Am I the only one who feels this way?  I suspect this stat will have a very negative impact on MU's USNWR ranking which has gone down in each of the last 2 years and likely will again this year when the 2017 rankings are released in a couple of weeks due to 40+ schools jumping from Regional Universities to National Universities as a result of the revised Carnegie Classification of Institutions of Higher Learning released earlier this year.  For the record, MU moved up this year from an R3 (Moderate Research Activity) to R2 (Higher Research Activity) among doctoral universities which is great, but with 40+ schools moving from the regional to national category this year (Villanova is one of them), I suspect that coupled with a 77% acceptance rate will cancel out the move up from R3 to R2.  It seems to me the administration just flat out doesn't care about or outright dismisses the negative consequences of having an acceptance rate that high.  Thoughts?

MU needs to learn to play the ratings game better. It is actually stated as part of the strategic plan. So I think the Board of Trustees should start putting a bit of pressure on Dr. Lovell to take a more proactive posture.

One of the things that US News considers is high school counselor ratings of the school. I asked MU admissions many times to come to the very highly rated local public schools in our area, and they just seem to be asleep at the wheel.

The biggest problem we have is our endowment is not high enough. We need to be able to offer full ride scholarships , which will get the stats of accepted students up . Also unfortunately one of  the factors US News considers is faculty pay, and we need to be able to get that up as well.

If MU falls out of top 100, I think it is time to revisit the whole Dr. Lovell situation.

[GGGG]

One of the things that US News considers is high school counselor ratings of the school. I asked MU admissions many times to come to the very highly rated local public schools in our area, and they just seem to be asleep at the wheel.

Yes.  Let's send our administrators across the country to various public high schools.  Not because it would be fruitful in terms of attracting students, but because it would impact a survey that has NO MEANINGFUL IMPACT on the education that Marquette provides.

The biggest problem we have is our endowment is not high enough. We need to be able to offer full ride scholarships , which will get the stats of accepted students up . Also unfortunately one of  the factors US News considers is faculty pay, and we need to be able to get that up as well.

I would agree that Marquette needs to increase its endowment in support of both scholarships and faculty support.  (More endowed chairs, etc.)  Both will substantively impact the education Marquette provides at a reasonable cost.

[Herman Cain]

Yes.  Let's send our administrators across the country to various public high schools.  Not because it would be fruitful in terms of attracting students, but because it would impact a survey that has NO MEANINGFUL IMPACT on the education that Marquette provides.


I would agree that Marquette needs to increase its endowment in support of both scholarships and faculty support.  (More endowed chairs, etc.)  Both will substantively impact the education Marquette provides at a reasonable cost.

I agree the survey has no meaningful impact on education. Unfortunately, parents who pay the bills look at these things.  Life is competitive and we need to get our numbers to more accurately reflect the quality of our education.

[GGGG]

I agree the survey has no meaningful impact on education. Unfortunately, parents who pay the bills look at these things.  Life is competitive and we need to get our numbers to more accurately reflect the quality of our education.

Parents who base their decisions on where their kid goes to school on USN&WR rankings are morons.

[Disco Hippie]

One of the things that US News considers is high school counselor ratings of the school. I asked MU admissions many times to come to the very highly rated local public schools in our area, and they just seem to be asleep at the wheel.

Could not agree more with your above statement MU Fan in NY!  I too, am both originally from, and moved back to the NYC area after graduation where I've lived ever since.  With the exception of southeastern WI and the greater Chicago area, MU makes virtually no effort to recruit at public high schools. Only catholic schools and that's a huge mistake in my view, because they're always going to get students from Catholic schools to apply there.  Perhaps they just don't have the bandwidth or maybe they're afraid doing so will decrease the Catholic character of the institution.  I personally could give a crap about the latter but I understand that's a concern of the admin.  In any event, I received the accepted student list for this year's class of those who applied from southeastern CT and of 40 or so students all but 7 or so were from private Catholic high schools.  Interestingly, the 7 accepted students from public high schools all attended THE SAME public high school.  Why?  Because 1 student from that particular public high school matriculated at MU 5 years ago, had an incredibly positive experience so much so that 2 of this student's 3 younger siblings also ended up at MU, have told their friends and now you have 10+ people applying to MU from that high school every year due to positive world of mouth and also because it's now on that schools' guidance counselors' radar.  (Full disclosure I know a counselor there).   MU did not have a single accepted applicant from any other public high school in Fairfield County, CT (The NYC suburb part of the state).  Given MU's very high acceptance rate, I suspect that means they didn't have a single applicant, accepted or rejected, from any other public high school in southeastern CT.    Because 1 student and 2 of their younger siblings went to MU several years ago and all had a good experience, you now have 10+ students applying there every year.   I suspect that could easily be replicated if they made even a cursory effort to recruit at public schools.  All it takes is one!  Instead, they seem content with getting the 1 or 2 students they always do from the few catholic schools there.  It's a shame.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Parents who base their decisions on where their kid goes to school on USN&WR rankings are morons.

Yes. But there are a lot of morons out there.

My hot take on the situation without little to no background knowledge is that the acceptance rate is likely higher because they tried to grow the class size in an effort to curb the cost of tuition.

[forgetful]

Parents who base their decisions on where their kid goes to school on USN&WR rankings are morons.

Two things.  The rankings are most definitely not meaningless (the 77% statistic is meaningless though); if they were it wouldn't be a priority for just about every administration in the country.  Won't go into all the details but here are a couple. 

1.  Like TAMU says, there are a lot of morons out there.  In fact, they make up the vast majority of the population.

2.  USNWR is important publicity.

If a University saw a drop in one year of 10-20 pts, heads would roll many would be fired. 

[forgetful]

The biggest problem we have is our endowment is not high enough. We need to be able to offer full ride scholarships , which will get the stats of accepted students up . Also unfortunately one of  the factors US News considers is faculty pay, and we need to be able to get that up as well.

If MU falls out of top 100, I think it is time to revisit the whole Dr. Lovell situation.

Endowment is a problem.  Faculty pay is not.  MU's faculty salaries are competitive with the top 100, so they are not dropping because of that. 

I'm not saying salaries aren't low for faculty (they are), they are just low almost everywhere.

As for dropping out of the top 100.  If it happens, Lovell will likely have a year to fix it, or he will be gone.

[GGGG]

Two things.  The rankings are most definitely not meaningless (the 77% statistic is meaningless though); if they were it wouldn't be a priority for just about every administration in the country.  Won't go into all the details but here are a couple. 

1.  Like TAMU says, there are a lot of morons out there.  In fact, they make up the vast majority of the population.

2.  USNWR is important publicity.

If a University saw a drop in one year of 10-20 pts, heads would roll many would be fired. 

That's the problem.  Too many people think it means something substantive, but it doesn't.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

That's the problem.  Too many people think it means something substantive, but it doesn't.

Unfortunately, we can't change that. We can't control the masses. We can only control how we react to them.

To be clear, I'm not saying going all in on USNWR. I'm just saying ignoring it could lead to negative (even if unfair) publicity.

[4everwarriors]

Parents who base their decisions on where their kid goes to school on USN&WR rankings are morons.

Spoken like an administrator stuck in da 80's. Kids have choices and universities, like it or not, are locked in a very competitive race for da best and the brightest. Eater a school can change as need be, or it will likely end up dyin' on da vine, ai na?

[GGGG]

Spoken like an administrator stuck in da 80's. Kids have choices and universities, like it or not, are locked in a very competitive race for da best and the brightest. Eater a school can change as need be, or it will likely end up dyin' on da vine, ai na?

I'm not stuck anywhere.  The school I work for does nothing proactively with regards to rankings.  And you know what has happened?  Record enrollment.  Graduation rates at our highest levels in over a generation.  Best fundraising years ever the last two years.  Believe me, there are plenty of alternatives to playing the rankings game.

Let's go back up to what Disco Hippie said above...  "I received the accepted student list for this year's class of those who applied from southeastern CT and of 40 or so students all but 7 or so were from private Catholic high schools.  Interestingly, the 7 accepted students from public high schools all attended THE SAME public high school.  Why?  Because 1 student from that particular public high school matriculated at MU 5 years ago, had an incredibly positive experience so much so that 2 of this student's 3 younger siblings also ended up at MU, have told their friends and now you have 10+ people applying to MU from that high school every year due to positive world of mouth and also because it's now on that schools' guidance counselors' radar."


BINGO!  This is it.  There is no more positive marketing exercise than giving your students the AUTHENTIC and positive experience they are expecting.  That is worth 100 times more than directing resources toward the ranking system FOR THE SAKE OF THE RANKINGS.

Put it this way.  Increase professor pay because it attracts better professors who can give your students a better educational experience.  Increase your endowment because you can be better able to compete for students that you want in your class.  If you do this type of stuff, and your ranking increases....great!  BUT DON'T DO IT FOR THE SAKE OF RANKINGS! 

[Herman Cain]

I'm not stuck anywhere.  The school I work for does nothing proactively with regards to rankings.  And you know what has happened?  Record enrollment.  Graduation rates at our highest levels in over a generation.  Best fundraising years ever the last two years.  Believe me, there are plenty of alternatives to playing the rankings game.

Let's go back up to what Disco Hippie said above...  "I received the accepted student list for this year's class of those who applied from southeastern CT and of 40 or so students all but 7 or so were from private Catholic high schools.  Interestingly, the 7 accepted students from public high schools all attended THE SAME public high school.  Why?  Because 1 student from that particular public high school matriculated at MU 5 years ago, had an incredibly positive experience so much so that 2 of this student's 3 younger siblings also ended up at MU, have told their friends and now you have 10+ people applying to MU from that high school every year due to positive world of mouth and also because it's now on that schools' guidance counselors' radar."


BINGO!  This is it.  There is no more positive marketing exercise than giving your students the AUTHENTIC and positive experience they are expecting.  That is worth 100 times more than directing resources toward the ranking system FOR THE SAKE OF THE RANKINGS.

Put it this way.  Increase professor pay because it attracts better professors who can give your students a better educational experience.  Increase your endowment because you can be better able to compete for students that you want in your class.  If you do this type of stuff, and your ranking increases....great!  BUT DON'T DO IT FOR THE SAKE OF RANKINGS!

MU set for improvement in the rankings as part of the strategic plan. Bottom line is Lovell needs to figure it out. He is an engineer and they lay out all the formulas in the wide open.

What I am saying and the Disco Hippie are saying is that we need to use the resources we  have more intelligently. High School counselor ratings are part of the forumula. In the NY suburbs there are lots of great public schools, among the best in the country.  They are scattered among the catholic schools we already recruit from. Many of the kids know each other from extra curricular or living in the same town. Very easy to show up at the public high school counselor office and give our pitch. I was on the school board for many years and know the weight these counselors have on university reputations. All it takes is to consistently come in and give your speech and get to know the counselors. We are ideally positioned to make the counselors life easy because not every kid in the school is going to get into an Ivy League and MU can provide a very compelling alternative where the kid can actually get admitted.

Strangely enough, One of the schools MU competes  for kids with in the northeast is Boston University. It is larger but has the same sort of urban feel to the kids. I have spent hours convincing parents and kids to take choose Marquette and the one big hurdle I always have to overcome is the US News ranking. I can usually close the deal by making the case they will get more personal attention at MU and  make the claim it is the BC of the Midwest ( BC rated higher than BU for the snob appeal) and we have dedicated alumni, which I can demonstrate by getting them to go to one of our road games and they see all the gold shirts in the stands. It would be a helluva lot easier if we were in the 50s in the US News.

[forgetful]

I'm not stuck anywhere.  The school I work for does nothing proactively with regards to rankings.  And you know what has happened?  Record enrollment.  Graduation rates at our highest levels in over a generation.  Best fundraising years ever the last two years.  Believe me, there are plenty of alternatives to playing the rankings game.

Edit:  I was wrong about who Sultan worked for, I know nothing about his university. 

Do you honestly believe this?  Because I know for a fact that they have lobbied hard and spent considerable money and efforts ensuring that USNWR (and other rating agencies) don't change some of their metrics that favor your University and other like minded institutions. 

But to be clear, I agree with most of your general sentiments. 

[keefe]

Endowment is a problem. 

Speak for yourself, son...

[muwarrior69]

Endowment is a problem.  Faculty pay is not.  MU's faculty salaries are competitive with the top 100, so they are not dropping because of that. 

I'm not saying salaries aren't low for faculty (they are), they are just low almost everywhere.

As for dropping out of the top 100.  If it happens, Lovell will likely have a year to fix it, or he will be gone.

Maybe, just maybe if Marquette sent a letter to it's freshman like the University of Chicago did; alumni, parents and students would know MU is interested in "education" where all ideas and opinion are welcome for discussion. Then maybe, just maybe donations to the University may increase the endowment.

http://www.npr.org/2016/08/26/491531869/university-of-chicago-tells-freshmen-it-does-not-support-trigger-warnings

[4everwarriors]

Maybe try somethin' like dis, hey?

Georgetown University to offer preferential admissions status to descendants of 272 slaves whose sale it profited from in 1838 - New York Times - Breaking News
https://apple.news/AZ2wfOVw0OrG0VPFBtCeoNw

[GGGG]

Maybe, just maybe if Marquette sent a letter to it's freshman like the University of Chicago did; alumni, parents and students would know MU is interested in "education" where all ideas and opinion are welcome for discussion. Then maybe, just maybe donations to the University may increase the endowment.

http://www.npr.org/2016/08/26/491531869/university-of-chicago-tells-freshmen-it-does-not-support-trigger-warnings

Why on earth would you make this political?

Marquette has actually done a very good job fundraising over the past decade.  While a lot of it has been focused on buildings, the market value of the endowment has increased from about $400M in 2010 to $550M last year.  Still below its peer institutions no doubt, but hardly insignificant. 

[mu03eng]

Marquette has actually done a very good job fundraising over the past decade.  While a lot of it has been focused on buildings, the market value of the endowment has increased from about $400M in 2010 to $550M last year.  Still below its peer institutions no doubt, but hardly insignificant.

While I agree, my concern is that they don't seem to have expanded the group of people they are getting the money from. I believe we're less than 20% of the alumni population donating so I think we're doing good getting money from the "converted" but we haven't seemingly increased the amount of available converts.

[GGGG]

While I agree, my concern is that they don't seem to have expanded the group of people they are getting the money from. I believe we're less than 20% of the alumni population donating so I think we're doing good getting money from the "converted" but we haven't seemingly increased the amount of available converts.

That's actually very common these days where 5% of the people give 95% of the donations.  Simply put, the most cost-effective way to raise money is by focusing on bigger gifts from a smaller number of donors.  That doesn't mean you ignore everyone else.  You just don't invest the time to raise it.  You just have to make sure to keep adding people to the pipeline.

[muwarrior69]

Why on earth would you make this political?

Marquette has actually done a very good job fundraising over the past decade.  While a lot of it has been focused on buildings, the market value of the endowment has increased from about $400M in 2010 to $550M last year.  Still below its peer institutions no doubt, but hardly insignificant.

What? So the exchange of ideas in an academic setting is political?

[GGGG]

What? So the exchange of ideas in an academic setting is political?

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Maybe, just maybe if Marquette sent a letter to it's freshman like the University of Chicago did; alumni, parents and students would know MU is interested in "education" where all ideas and opinion are welcome for discussion. Then maybe, just maybe donations to the University may increase the endowment.

http://www.npr.org/2016/08/26/491531869/university-of-chicago-tells-freshmen-it-does-not-support-trigger-warnings

I applaud University of Chicago for taking a stand on free speech and education. But they went a step too far. Trigger warnings are critical when discussing certain topics. You wouldn't send a kid with epilepsy into a room with a strobe light. Forcing a rape survivor to have a discussion about sexual assault can be just as dangerous.

I mentioned my feelings on safe spaces in the NFL thread. It was a good idea that has been warped by both sides to a point where it is actually detrimental to students. Wanting to make students feel safe on campus is not a bad thing but if progress is to be made then we need to make them uncomfortable.

The hilarious thing about this to me is that many of the same people who criticize safe spaces are the same ones who are furious that SUNY Binghamton did a program called "stop white people 2k16." Many of these safe space haters don't give a rats arse about educating students. They want to create their own safe spaces where it is ok make bigoted statements and programs and not OK to teach liberal ideas such as social justice.

[Disco Hippie]

While I agree, my concern is that they don't seem to have expanded the group of people they are getting the money from. I believe we're less than 20% of the alumni population donating so I think we're doing good getting money from the "converted" but we haven't seemingly increased the amount of available converts.

It's definitely way less than 20%.  Last I checked it was 6 or 7%.   Alumni giving rate is also a metric that USNWR uses to calculate their rankings.  I don't think it counts for much but it does comprise a small component of the overall ranking.

When MU Alum James Foley passed away, MU established a College of Communication scholarship in his name.  I was not only shocked but downright ashamed to learn that despite the extraordinarily high profile news event his brutal murder was, only about 1370 people out of a living alumni base of almost 80,000 contributed to the cause raising something like $320K I think the university said at the time and yes, I was one of the 1370 who contributed. The scholarship is $8K a semester, $16K annually.  Not insignificant but it why couldn't it have been a full ride?  Not sure how much $$ would have needed to be raised to make it a full ride and I acknowledge I don't work in philanthropy or know the first thing about fundraising generally, let alone in the world of higher education, but to an outside observer, it seems to me those numbers are barely worth mentioning in a press release.  For those that know more about this than I, how do those figures stack up?  Am I wrong to assume those are week results?

[GGGG]

It's definitely way less than 20%.  Last I checked it was 6 or 7%.   Alumni giving rate is also a metric that USNWR uses to calculate their rankings.  I don't think it counts for much but it does comprise a small component of the overall ranking.

When MU Alum James Foley passed away, MU established a College of Communication scholarship in his name.  I was not only shocked but downright ashamed to learn that despite the extraordinarily high profile news event his brutal murder was, only about 1370 people out of a living alumni base of almost 80,000 contributed to the cause raising something like $320K I think the university said at the time and yes, I was one of the 1370 who contributed. The scholarship is $8K a semester, $16K annually.  Not insignificant but it why couldn't it have been a full ride?  Not sure how much $$ would have needed to be raised to make it a full ride and I acknowledge I don't work in philanthropy or know the first thing about fundraising generally, let alone in the world of higher education, but to an outside observer, it seems to me those numbers are barely worth mentioning in a press release.  For those that know more about this than I, how do those figures stack up?  Am I wrong to assume those are week results?

It's not bad.  Look, many, if not most, of the 80,000 alumni aren't engaged in Marquette University in the least.  They don't own MU gear, don't follow the basketball team and don't really care all that much.  And they never donate, nor will they.  My uncle fell into that category.

I mean he was charitable.  But to other causes that he found important.  Just not his alma mater. 

And a basic rule of thumb is that an endowment will pay out between 4-5% annually.  So 5% of $320,000 is $16,000.

[Badgerhater]

It's not bad.  Look, many, if not most, of the 80,000 alumni aren't engaged in Marquette University in the least.  They don't own MU gear, don't follow the basketball team and don't really care all that much.  And they never donate, nor will they.  My uncle fell into that category.

I mean he was charitable.  But to other causes that he found important.  Just not his alma mater. 

And a basic rule of thumb is that an endowment will pay out between 4-5% annually.  So 5% of $320,000 is $16,000.

Already gave to MU when I attended.  Have more important things to donate to now.

[Pakuni]

Already gave to MU when I attended.  Have more important things to donate to now.

Same.
I suspect when I'm older and no longer worried about helping to fund my kids' college education, I'll have some more discretionary money to consider donating to MU. Right now, it's just not a priority.
I suspect it's the same with most people, and the majority of donors are older alums (or non alums) not raising a family.

[forgetful]

Already gave to MU when I attended.  Have more important things to donate to now.

I understand the sentiment, but if ratings are important to you as an alumni, a way to help is to donate even $10 a year.

For ranking purposes, it doesn't matter how much they donate, rather just the percentage of alumni that do donate. 

Thats why some Universities are manipulating the rankings by having a big donor agree to lets say 10x match any donations up to $20-50.  It gets people to join the ranks and up the percentage without actually raising much more money.

[GGGG]

I understand the sentiment, but if ratings are important to you as an alumni, a way to help is to donate even $10 a year.

For ranking purposes, it doesn't matter how much they donate, rather just the percentage of alumni that do donate. 

Thats why some Universities are manipulating the rankings by having a big donor agree to lets say 10x match any donations up to $20-50.  It gets people to join the ranks and up the percentage without actually raising much more money.

Some schools also manipulate the rankings by not finding lost alumni.  So the "alumni of record" denominator decreases.

[forgetful]

Some schools also manipulate the rankings by not finding lost alumni.  So the "alumni of record" denominator decreases.

Very true.  Some also don't include all students SAT/ACT scores, but still check the box saying all scores are included.

Lots and lots of deception.

[mu03eng]

Very true.  Some also don't include all students SAT/ACT scores, but still check the box saying all scores are included.

Lots and lots of deception.

Welcome to marketing, politics, and higher education

[Herman Cain]

Same.
I suspect when I'm older and no longer worried about helping to fund my kids' college education, I'll have some more discretionary money to consider donating to MU. Right now, it's just not a priority.
I suspect it's the same with most people, and the majority of donors are older alums (or non alums) not raising a family.

Send them $5 -10 and up our alumni giving count.

[Badgerhater]

Send them $5 -10 and up our alumni giving count.

So the school can spend $100 over the next year sending me solicitations for more donations?

[Herman Cain]

So the school can spend $100 over the next year sending me solicitations for more donations?

Every little bit helps.

[jsglow]

Ok, my 2 cents.

I believe I recall that our most recent contribution rate is around 15%; not nearly good enough.  Mid 20s would be much better.

Second,  very modest contributions are highly prized by Advancements. Marquette truly appreciates even small contributions. Getting the participation rate up is a big deal.

Third, it doesn't take millions to be a rock star. I'm pretty sure all you guys know that chick and I contribute. We get invited to everything. We have access if and when we need it. We're frequently asked to serve on various boards and committees. We feel like we're part of the university.

So my advice,  step up for $100 this year. It's one night out on the town skipped. Get off the bench and in the game. You'll feel Warrior pride writing that modest check.

[vogue65]

I have a friend who has a grandson who could not get into MU engineering but just graduated from Purdue. He really wanted to enroll at Marquette, I even called admissions and all they wanted to know was my status as a Blue and Gold member, what?  They wanted to know if I was a heavy hitter in the contribution race.  They should have asked about my will, ha.

What much does MU now charge as an application Fee?  The driver is the number of applications not the number of acceptances.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

What much does MU now charge as an application Fee?  The driver is the number of applications not the number of acceptances.

Marquette uses common ap so they don't charge anything.

[forgetful]

I have a friend who has a grandson who could not get into MU engineering but just graduated from Purdue. He really wanted to enroll at Marquette, I even called admissions and all they wanted to know was my status as a Blue and Gold member, what?  They wanted to know if I was a heavy hitter in the contribution race.  They should have asked about my will, ha.

What much does MU now charge as an application Fee?  The driver is the number of applications not the number of acceptances.

Marquette, and other schools, do not see it this way anymore.  MU's applications are down, because they intentionally tried to target individuals more likely to actually attend.

To get people to enroll, you need to sway them, offer resources etc. If you are spending money to try to woo 20,000 when only 15,000 would even remotely consider your institution then you are wasting resources.  MU last year tried to target the 15,000 that would consider MU.  Right call in my opinion.

[GGGG]

Which is why they don't send counsellors to public high schools 1,000 miles from campus.

[Herman Cain]

Which is why they don't send counsellors to public high schools 1,000 miles from campus.

Except they send the admission reps to the catholic school .5 miles from 4 great public schools in the same area...

[GGGG]

Except they send the admission reps to the catholic school .5 miles from 4 great public schools in the same area...

Gee.  I wonder why the difference?

[warriorchick]

Except they send the admission reps to the catholic school .5 miles from 4 great public schools in the same area...

When chick jr. was in high school, a bunch of Jesuit Schools held their own college fair at the Oak Brook (suburban Chicago) Marriott.  Most of them were the Midwest schools, but there were a few outliers (Regis from Denver, as I recall).  I wonder if they hold similar events in larger cities that Marquette attends (or could attend).

As a member of the Parents Council, they did have someone from admissions talk to us a couple of years ago, who told us that they are expanding their geographic focus, but more towards where the growth areas of the U.S. population are (the Southwest and South).  They realize that if they continue to rely on students in the Midwest, the demographic trends are not in their favor.

[4everwarriors]

Doesn't take much for a kid ta apply, if so inclined, wit da common app, ai na?

[rocket surgeon]

What? So the exchange of ideas in an academic setting is political?

Whaaaaaaaat?  Did I miss something?  What was political about MU's comments.  The only reason I axk is do we need a referee on the side so we don't get CHICO'D?

[Herman Cain]

When chick jr. was in high school, a bunch of Jesuit Schools held their own college fair at the Oak Brook (suburban Chicago) Marriott.  Most of them were the Midwest schools, but there were a few outliers (Regis from Denver, as I recall).  I wonder if they hold similar events in larger cities that Marquette attends (or could attend).

As a member of the Parents Council, they did have someone from admissions talk to us a couple of years ago, who told us that they are expanding their geographic focus, but more towards where the growth areas of the U.S. population are (the Southwest and South).  They realize that if they continue to rely on students in the Midwest, the demographic trends are not in their favor.

Sometimes MU will invite kids who are interested to a presentation at one of Jesuit schools in NYC which is helpful. However, I think what would be far better would be to make a commitment to showing up year after year at the public high schools and private schools in the area.  Some of the markets are pretty dense so it is not hard to get from one school to the next. Kids may or may not show up at the presentations, but at least the Marquette name is on the college visit roster at the beginning of the school year, and you get an audience with a guidance counselor etc. Over time this will yield fruit, as we have a valuable product .

One of the positive things MU did was to institute the Lacrosse program and not necessarily for sports reasons. In the NY/CT/NJ/ Phil/ Baltimore/DC area the games are on local TV and the announcers are constantly mentioning MU commits , in addition these kids  and MU are touted in the local media.  We are definitely seeing the visibility benefits with kids who are not athletes, but have a friend who is one, and are starting to look at MU as a viable option. Frequently these MU Lacrosse kids have alternatives that are attractive schools. So the message is getting out there that we are among the academic leaders.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Ok, my 2 cents.

I believe I recall that our most recent contribution rate is around 15%; not nearly good enough.  Mid 20s would be much better.

Second,  very modest contributions are highly prized by Advancements. Marquette truly appreciates even small contributions. Getting the participation rate up is a big deal.

Third, it doesn't take millions to be a rock star. I'm pretty sure all you guys know that chick and I contribute. We get invited to everything. We have access if and when we need it. We're frequently asked to serve on various boards and committees. We feel like we're part of the university.

So my advice,  step up for $100 this year. It's one night out on the town skipped. Get off the bench and in the game. You'll feel Warrior pride writing that modest check.

University of Chicago's goal is 70% of alumni giving at least a dollar and the overall engagement goal of $4.5 billion.  The dollar goal will be blown away. 15% is pathetic.

https://news.uchicago.edu/article/2014/05/08/university-sets-goal-45-billion-university-chicago-campaign-inquiry-and-impact

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

I'm surprised Marquette still hasn't called me for donations. The only way I would donate is if they could guarantee it went to the basketball or volleyball program.

[GGGG]

I'm surprised Marquette still hasn't called me for donations. The only way I would donate is if they could guarantee it went to the basketball or volleyball program.

Yeah they will guaranty that. 

[4everwarriors]

In all fairness Pat, one school is world class and highly selective and da utter is, ....
Not a fair comparison, hey?

[warriorchick]

University of Chicago's goal is 70% of alumni giving at least a dollar and the overall engagement goal of $4.5 billion.  The dollar goal will be blown away. 15% is pathetic.

https://news.uchicago.edu/article/2014/05/08/university-sets-goal-45-billion-university-chicago-campaign-inquiry-and-impact

Well, for one thing, University of Chicago aren't bent out of shape about no longer having football - even though the Heisman trophy is literally a statue of one of their own players.

[GGGG]

Well, for one thing, University of Chicago aren't bent out of shape about no longer having football - even though the Heisman trophy is literally a statue of one of their own players.

Pedant time:  They have a D3 football team.

[4everwarriors]

Moon da Maroons, hey?

[Dr. Blackheart]

In all fairness Pat, one school is world class and highly selective and da utter is, ....
Not a fair comparison, hey?

Fill a couple of extra cavities.  BeeJay can donate a few shekels from his penny stock earnings.  It takes a village, ai-na?

[vogue65]

?

[dgies9156]

My comments on all of this:

1) I am less concerned about what goes in than what comes out. If Marquette is producing well-educated young men and women who understand that the world about them is a continual learning process built on the foundation they received in the classroom, then the university has done its job. 77% is OK if Marquette prepares students for the real world.
    A) It is notable that students self-select. If you can't do Marquette work at the price Marquette is charging today, chances are you probably won't go there.

2) As for contributions, my father, MU-1955, all but ordered me  to start giving the day I walked out of Marquette with my degree. He noted there were foundations and other entities that will give to Marquette based on the percentage of alumni who give.  He said even in my impoverished state, I could afford $25 to the  Annual  Marquette Fund. I gave out of respect for what I received at Marquette and out of respect for what my parents did for me. I still do.

3) Keep in mind that for those of us who have long-ago been graduated from Marquette (yeah, anyone, pre-2010), there is nothing Marquette can do today that will change our station in life. It is what we do with what we learned that governs where we go. I want Marquette to do well so that when their students are coming looking for opportunity, we say "no" at our own peril.  It's also a pride thing and a reaffirmation of our own choice. Don't kid yourself though, that's ego!

4) I do care how well the basketball team does! It is an addiction started in the 1960s and runs through today.  That I use Scoop to scream about!!!!!!! And that, folks, is raw emotion!!!!

[jsglow]

I'm surprised Marquette still hasn't called me for donations. The only way I would donate is if they could guarantee it went to the basketball or volleyball program.

Wow Chi. You of all people.  How bout that first in one's family type kid.

[Atticus]

USNWR rankings came out today for 2017.

#86

Is that the same as last year?

Also, USNWR transferred a bunch of regional schools to the national ranking this year. Nova came in at #50.

[Disco Hippie]

USNWR rankings came out today for 2017.

#86

Is that the same as last year?

Also, USNWR transferred a bunch of regional schools to the national ranking this year. Nova came in at #50.

Yes it is the same as last year.  Glad it didn't go down.  Nova moved up from the regional U to lowest level national university with an R3 Carnegie Classification.  Marquette actually moved up this year as well, from an R3 (Moderate Research Activity Doctoral University) to R2 (Higher Research Activity Doctoral University) which is a really good thing and a stated goal of the strategic plan that Pliarz put in place 3 years ago.  In fact they issued a press release about it earlier this year.  Unfortunately it means absolute jack because as long as we let in 77% of those who apply we won't move up in the rankings.  Play the game Marquette!  Be superficial!  Snob appeal matters!

[GGGG]

Bullsh*t.

Marquette should continue doing what it's doing.  It's working. If it prevents some dork from the coast from bothering to head to Milwaukee because his 'rents can't imagine their little precious one going to such a bad school, fine by me.

[forgetful]

Yes it is the same as last year.  Glad it didn't go down.  Nova moved up from the regional U to lowest level national university with an R3 Carnegie Classification.  Marquette actually moved up this year as well, from an R3 (Moderate Research Activity Doctoral University) to R2 (Higher Research Activity Doctoral University) which is a really good thing and a stated goal of the strategic plan that Pliarz put in place 3 years ago.  In fact they issued a press release about it earlier this year.  Unfortunately it means absolute jack because as long as we let in 77% of those who apply we won't move up in the rankings.  Play the game Marquette!  Be superficial!  Snob appeal matters!

[Herman Cain]

Bullsh*t.

Marquette should continue doing what it's doing.  It's working. If it prevents some dork from the coast from bothering to head to Milwaukee because his 'rents can't imagine their little precious one going to such a bad school, fine by me.

We do not need to cater to people like you. That gets us no where fast. We can fill the school overnight with mediocrity if we want to.

We want to appeal to people who will write 7 figure checks.  When we get more of those we can be paternalistic and do all the service and be even more charity minded.

You are  looking at the world upside down. The world is a cold hard competitive place . Marquette can compete in that world but it has to be way smart and way more sophisticated about it.

Northeastern is crap school and they have played the game and look where they are. Now it is becoming a self fullfilling prophecy. Kids whose parents 10 years ago would never countenance sending precious little Johnny and Buffy there are proudly displaying the Northeastern Sticker on the car.

[RJax55]

Bullsh*t.

Marquette should continue doing what it's doing.  It's working. If it prevents some dork from the coast from bothering to head to Milwaukee because his 'rents can't imagine their little precious one going to such a bad school, fine by me.

I always find it fascinating hearing this desire by some alums (not just at MU) pressing so hard to turn their alma mater into a school that they would hardily recognize.

[jsglow]

While we've strayed a little off the original purpose which basically indicates that MU took a more targeted approach with respect to recruiting this year (that in fact ended up being quite successful), it is interesting to note that folks here seem to have a vastly different opinion on what Marquette should be.  On one hand we can strive to be a Georgetown clone. On the other, a version of Loyola 75 miles to the north.

Marquette's already a different place than the school I went to 35 years ago.  In some ways better and in some ways maybe not.  Be interesting to see where the next 20 years takes us.

[GGGG]

We do not need to cater to people like you. That gets us no where fast. We can fill the school overnight with mediocrity if we want to.

We want to appeal to people who will write 7 figure checks.  When we get more of those we can be paternalistic and do all the service and be even more charity minded.

You are  looking at the world upside down. The world is a cold hard competitive place . Marquette can compete in that world but it has to be way smart and way more sophisticated about it.

Northeastern is crap school and they have played the game and look where they are. Now it is becoming a self fullfilling prophecy. Kids whose parents 10 years ago would never countenance sending precious little Johnny and Buffy there are proudly displaying the Northeastern Sticker on the car.

Apparently you failed to read again.

Marquette has increased the quality and the quantity of its freshman class WITHOUT playing the acceptance rate game.

If you want your kids at Northeastern cause it its rank, go ahead. Hope they have fun.

[vogue65]

Pedant time:  They have a D3 football team.

Like many other world class universities, Johns Hopkins, MIT, "Georgetown" or Division 2A or Div. 1A or whatever, better that then the numb-nuts Division 1 football schools.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

I'm happy we don't cater towards the wealthy, elite, northeast families. That's the kind of student body I want no where near Marquette.

[jsglow]

I'm happy we don't cater towards the wealthy, elite, northeast families. That's the kind of student body I want no where near Marquette.

You would have liked MU back in my day skywalker.  Back then we asked 'Where's Naperville?'

[UNC Eagle]

Well, for one thing, University of Chicago aren't bent out of shape about no longer having football - even though the Heisman trophy is literally a statue of one of their own players.

University of Chicago has a football team, that competes in D3. They are also still an academic member of the Big Ten. So they are having it both ways.

[GGGG]

University of Chicago has a football team, that competes in D3. They are also still an academic member of the Big Ten. So they are having it both ways.

The University of Chicago is no longer a member of the Committee on Institutional Cooperation, now known as the Big Ten Academic Alliance.  They were a guest member until this summer.

[UNC Eagle]

The University of Chicago is no longer a member of the Committee on Institutional Cooperation, now known as the Big Ten Academic Alliance.  They were a guest member until this summer.

http://www.btaa.org/about/expansion/name-change-faq

[GGGG]

http://www.btaa.org/about/expansion/name-change-faq

Right.  This is what I said.

[dgies9156]

You would have liked MU back in my day skywalker.  Back then we asked 'Where's Naperville?'

Back in the late 1970s, that was a legit question. Naperville had about a quarter of the population it has today. The restaurants were mediocre and the town's staple was white bread and clear broth.