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Author Topic: Cincinnati gorilla  (Read 6152 times)

jsglow

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Cincinnati gorilla
« on: May 30, 2016, 04:19:26 PM »
I'll bet we can get a few pages on this little tidbit.  Parents, please keep an eye on your young kids.  This ended very badly but could have been much worse.  Lots to talk about including barriers, tranquilizer guns, scum sucking lawyers and the lawsuits to come, etc.

rocket surgeon

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2016, 04:46:45 PM »
As the Monday morning qb's are coming out just as they do in many other situations where quick decisions need to be made.  All they know at that moment is young boy in harms way. how are they going to save the YOUNG BOY'S LIFE? 

Now, afterwards, oh, the animal was holding hands with the kid??
don't...don't don't don't don't

jsglow

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2016, 05:04:02 PM »
As always.  It does seem that most gorilla experts agree with the decision.  Too bad he didn't heed the audible warning that apparently the two females obeyed.  I suppose there will also be some that argue that a barrier that's been perfectly safe for 38 years isn't good enough anymore.  We all need to live in our plastic bubble.

4everwarriors

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2016, 05:23:36 PM »
At first glance, seemed like this was gonna be 'bout da Bearcats. Relieved we're not goin' der, hey?
"Give 'Em Hell, Al"

GGGG

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2016, 05:41:31 PM »

warriorchick

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2016, 05:47:19 PM »


Honkey Kong would have totally gotten away with it.
Have some patience, FFS.

brandx

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2016, 06:12:17 PM »

Skatastrophy

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2016, 06:52:16 PM »
Should have let the mom fight the gorilla for the baby.

rocket surgeon

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2016, 06:53:15 PM »


hmmmmmmm ?-(  steeeeeeeeeee-rike heyheyheyn'a?
don't...don't don't don't don't

GGGG

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2016, 06:54:04 PM »
Thanks, Sultan. That made me laugh.


I steal Facebook memes with the best of them.

jsglow

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2016, 07:46:58 PM »
Good work Sultan.

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2016, 08:14:34 PM »
I thought it was funny, but not sure if art imitates...or what....cuz cuz.  Of course, the little boy was actually black, so the outrage makes it even more crazy.

http://www.bizpacreview.com/2016/05/30/killing-a-gorilla-to-save-a-white-boy-was-a-racist-move-according-to-public-outcry-346410
« Last Edit: May 30, 2016, 08:31:59 PM by ChicosBailBonds »

GGGG

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2016, 08:34:21 PM »
Handful of tweets, some of which may not be serious.  <yawn>

Herman Cain

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2016, 09:09:52 PM »
I am not sure they needed to kill the Gorilla. I read that they did not think tranquilizers would take effect quick enough. I would think they could have wounded the Gorilla enough to get the kid.

I am Pro Gorilla and blame the parents in this case.
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real chili 83

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2016, 10:12:38 PM »
Tastes like chicken?


MUsoxfan

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2016, 10:39:12 PM »
I am not sure they needed to kill the Gorilla. I read that they did not think tranquilizers would take effect quick enough. I would think they could have wounded the Gorilla enough to get the kid.

I am Pro Gorilla and blame the parents in this case.

Agreed. I'm not a big tort guy, but would love to see the parents sued

forgetful

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2016, 11:53:51 PM »
As always.  It does seem that most gorilla experts agree with the decision.  Too bad he didn't heed the audible warning that apparently the two females obeyed.  I suppose there will also be some that argue that a barrier that's been perfectly safe for 38 years isn't good enough anymore.  We all need to live in our plastic bubble.

Its funny that some will blame a gorilla for not obeying an audible warning, but not the parents or the kid who couldn't obey common sense.

rocket surgeon

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2016, 04:37:52 AM »
Agreed. I'm not a big tort guy, but would love to see the parents sued

last i heard was the gorilla family has retained the services of hanna, barbera, peebles and ogee to represent them in a probable wrongful death
don't...don't don't don't don't

StillAWarrior

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2016, 07:21:02 AM »
I am not sure they needed to kill the Gorilla. I read that they did not think tranquilizers would take effect quick enough. I would think they could have wounded the Gorilla enough to get the kid.

I am Pro Gorilla and blame the parents in this case.

I think it's a horrible tragedy -- and I certainly lean toward the pro-gorilla side of things.  But I'm not sure that wounding the gorilla (i.e., pissing him off) would have been the best way to go.  Wounded animals tend to be a little unpredictable.
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jsglow

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2016, 07:32:48 AM »
Its funny that some will blame a gorilla for not obeying an audible warning, but not the parents or the kid who couldn't obey common sense.

Perhaps you misunderstand me.  I'm simply saying it's unfortunate that he didn't.  I don't blame the gorilla at all.  He was simply, well, being a silverback male gorilla.  But he was placed in a situation he was completely unprepared for and the consequences could have been horrific.

I guess view this as a very unfortunate situation.  Not interested in 'blaming mom' for her poor parenting.  Certainly don't think they need to alter the barrier that has worked just fine for nearly 40 years.  Think that second guessing the response team that felt the need to put down the animal is too Monday morning QBing.

warriorchick

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2016, 08:37:18 AM »
Have some patience, FFS.

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2016, 09:19:11 AM »
Handful of tweets, some of which may not be serious.  <yawn>

Handful that we know of, point was there are people that actually think the way the meme was constructed.  Truly amazing.

MerrittsMustache

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2016, 09:36:02 AM »
Perhaps you misunderstand me.  I'm simply saying it's unfortunate that he didn't.  I don't blame the gorilla at all.  He was simply, well, being a silverback male gorilla.  But he was placed in a situation he was completely unprepared for and the consequences could have been horrific.

I guess view this as a very unfortunate situation.  Not interested in 'blaming mom' for her poor parenting.  Certainly don't think they need to alter the barrier that has worked just fine for nearly 40 years.  Think that second guessing the response team that felt the need to put down the animal is too Monday morning QBing.

Agree. It's always easy for an outsider to say, "Well, I would have done X,Y and Z." From the accounts that I read, it appears that the mother was tending to her crying daughter when the 4yo bolted away and climbed the fence. She wasn't on her phone or chatting with friends or consciously neglecting her child, she was parenting. It was an unfortunate, flukish event. The only issue that I have with the mother is her FB post (since deleted), in which she doesn't take accountability or apologize for what happened.

GGGG

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2016, 09:54:15 AM »
Handful that we know of, point was there are people that actually think the way the meme was constructed.  Truly amazing.


Yes.  Everyone should think alike in every situation.

ATL MU Warrior

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2016, 09:56:46 AM »
Agree. It's always easy for an outsider to say, "Well, I would have done X,Y and Z." From the accounts that I read, it appears that the mother was tending to her crying daughter when the 4yo bolted away and climbed the fence. She wasn't on her phone or chatting with friends or consciously neglecting her child, she was parenting. It was an unfortunate, flukish event. The only issue that I have with the mother is her FB post (since deleted), in which she doesn't take accountability or apologize for what happened.
Sorry, this is BS.  You can't "parent" one of your kids while losing track of another in a place where something horrible could happen. 


Benny B

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #25 on: May 31, 2016, 10:00:43 AM »
Sorry, this is BS.  You can't "parent" one of your kids while losing track of another in a place where something horrible could happen.

Well, if said horrible thing were to happen and the parent is left with the one child, I think hindsight would dictate that you can parent one of your kids while losing track of the other.
Wow, I'm very concerned for Benny.  Being able to mimic Myron Medcalf's writing so closely implies an oncoming case of dementia.

GGGG

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #26 on: May 31, 2016, 10:25:09 AM »
Kids have wondered off in stores and at the park when a parent is distracted tending to another child.  It happens and isn't a reflection on their parenting skills.  If that is indeed what happened, I chalk the whole thing up to an unfortunate incident. 

Coleman

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #27 on: May 31, 2016, 10:32:23 AM »
Perhaps you misunderstand me.  I'm simply saying it's unfortunate that he didn't.  I don't blame the gorilla at all.  He was simply, well, being a silverback male gorilla.  But he was placed in a situation he was completely unprepared for and the consequences could have been horrific.

I guess view this as a very unfortunate situation.  Not interested in 'blaming mom' for her poor parenting.  Certainly don't think they need to alter the barrier that has worked just fine for nearly 40 years.  Think that second guessing the response team that felt the need to put down the animal is too Monday morning QBing.

Agree with all this.  Its too bad it happened. The situation sucks.

But so do the self-righteous people blaming the mom, zoo, etc.

jsglow

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #28 on: May 31, 2016, 10:58:01 AM »
Kids have wondered off in stores and at the park when a parent is distracted tending to another child.  It happens and isn't a reflection on their parenting skills.  If that is indeed what happened, I chalk the whole thing up to an unfortunate incident.

+1

I can think of examples in my own life as a parent where I was less than 100% perfectly attentive and felt fortunate that nothing happened.  Sometimes I'd forget to feed the kids for two, three weeks at a time.   ?-(
« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 12:28:48 PM by jsglow »

tower912

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #29 on: May 31, 2016, 11:00:11 AM »
There is no good here and no blame.    4 year olds bolt.   It is what they do.   Mom was distracted for a moment with another child.   It is what they do.    The gorilla reacted to the intruder into its domain.   It is what they do.    The zookeepers protected the child.      It is what they had to do.       
      I am going to pull out the 26 years of firefighting card again.  Every rescue we perform, be it high angle, trench, extrication from cars, rollovers, river rescues, ice-water rescues.... and I have done some version of all of them,  is because something goes wrong.  It is never a single event that causes these events, it is a series of them.   There is something to learn from every fire, as something goes wrong at almost all of them.
    The best that can be done here is to analyze what went wrong and learn from it.    And then have the employees practice and train for the next unplanned incident.    I'm sure the AF and Navy do the same thing as the fire service.   You take an incident and break it down and analyze it for every possible lesson to be learned, for every technique to be refined.   
    So, a most unfortunate event.   I am sympathetic to the mom, as I have had unruly children.   I am sympathetic to the 4 year old, as my wife will tell you I still act like an impetuous 4 year old from time to time.   I am sympathetic to the personnel from the zoo, as they were forced to make a very difficult judgement very quickly.   I am not sympathetic to the whiners and the bleaters who can't handle a traffic jam without screaming and cursing, who are too busy on their smartphones to parent, who take no chances and expect others to do all of the actual work, who somehow still think they are smarter and would have handled the situation more wisely.   
« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 11:06:00 AM by tower912 »
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Golden Avalanche

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #30 on: May 31, 2016, 12:04:24 PM »
I think it was a suicide by zookeeper on Harambe's part. Years in captivity and he eventually thinks, "unnatural carnal knowledge it, this blows, I'm out". Saw an opportunity to not outright harm another being (now there's a crazy mindset) but do just enough where "they" would have to take action.

The blood of Harambe is on the family. They were negligent.

real chili 83

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #31 on: May 31, 2016, 12:43:06 PM »
I blame the gun manufacturer.

3....2....1....

Tugg Speedman

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #32 on: May 31, 2016, 01:07:00 PM »
Meet the Parents

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3617016/EXCLUSIVE-PICTURES-parents-four-son-fell-zoo-enclosure-sparking-controversial-killing-Harambe-gorilla-emerges-father-lengthy-criminal-history.html

EXCLUSIVE: Parents-of-four whose son fell into zoo enclosure sparking killing of Harambe the gorilla as it emerges father has a lengthy criminal history - including kidnap and drug trafficking
   
These are the parents of the four-year-old boy whose 15-feet fall into the gorilla exhibit moat in Cincinnati Zoo resulted in the death of 17-year-old silverback gorilla, Harambe.

Seen here for the first time is mother Michelle Gregg, 32, who has four children by father Deonne Dickerson, 36, a man who, Daily Mail Online can disclose, has a lengthy criminal history.

Criminal filings against Dickerson stretch over a decade and include burglary, firearms offences, drug trafficking, criminal trespass, disorderly conduct and kidnap.

In 2006 he was sentenced to one year behind bars for a drug trafficking conviction.

But in numerous pictures posted on Dickerson's Facebook site in recent years he appears to have turned his life around to become the proud father of four.

Indeed, the majority of his postings to the social media site are updates of his children and his working life.


MomofMUltiples

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #33 on: May 31, 2016, 04:53:13 PM »
This is a tragic situation that has become altogether too frequent in the era of social media shaming.  I can attest that it is altogether too easy to lose track of one child, particularly when you are wrangling more than one, but even with only one you can turn around in a grocery store and the kid who was tugging on your pant two seconds ago whining for gummy snacks has disappeared.    My husband always joked that when the third kid came along, we went from man-to-man defense to zone (and when they started coming two at a time, we quit!). As glow said, I'm only thankful that nothing terrible happened as a result of my supposed "inattentiveness" to my children.

As a society, we are so determined to fix blame, but this is not the fault of the parents, or the zookeeper, or the gorilla (or the four year old boy, for that matter).  It was an accident in a world where we refuse to admit anymore that accidents happen, or where we acknowledge that accidents happen but we intend to use them to our advantage to profit from them.  Imagine the inverse conversation we would be having had the zookeepers decided, a'la the internet "activists," that the gorilla was far too valuable and so they did nothing and allowed the gorilla to inadvertently, or even intentionally, kill the young boy?  I have become so tired of the self righteous individuals who believe they can definitively say what a life is worth.  One could even argue that the zoo acted in its own self-interest, in this day when juries are awarding victims or their survivors tens of millions of dollars for supposed negligence that costs someone a body part or a life, even when the victim was ignoring clear safety instructions (or common sense) that resulted in their injuries.

It appears to me that the zookeepers quickly assessed the situation (as Tower said, because quick decisions were called for at this juncture) and determined that they could not end this incident and keep both of the participants safe.  It is great that all of the Twittersphere have declared themselves experts in the topic of rescuing a child from a gorilla enclosure in an emergency, but it would surprise me if a fraction of them could have reacted in the moment with a clear head and a decisive action.  And that, folks, is what separates the Tweeters from the Doers.
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jsglow

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #34 on: May 31, 2016, 05:22:43 PM »
As always, mom knows best.

tower912

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #35 on: May 31, 2016, 05:28:49 PM »
This is a tragic situation that has become altogether too frequent in the era of social media shaming.  I can attest that it is altogether too easy to lose track of one child, particularly when you are wrangling more than one, but even with only one you can turn around in a grocery store and the kid who was tugging on your pant two seconds ago whining for gummy snacks has disappeared.    My husband always joked that when the third kid came along, we went from man-to-man defense to zone (and when they started coming two at a time, we quit!). As glow said, I'm only thankful that nothing terrible happened as a result of my supposed "inattentiveness" to my children.

As a society, we are so determined to fix blame, but this is not the fault of the parents, or the zookeeper, or the gorilla (or the four year old boy, for that matter).  It was an accident in a world where we refuse to admit anymore that accidents happen, or where we acknowledge that accidents happen but we intend to use them to our advantage to profit from them.  Imagine the inverse conversation we would be having had the zookeepers decided, a'la the internet "activists," that the gorilla was far too valuable and so they did nothing and allowed the gorilla to inadvertently, or even intentionally, kill the young boy?  I have become so tired of the self righteous individuals who believe they can definitively say what a life is worth.  One could even argue that the zoo acted in its own self-interest, in this day when juries are awarding victims or their survivors tens of millions of dollars for supposed negligence that costs someone a body part or a life, even when the victim was ignoring clear safety instructions (or common sense) that resulted in their injuries.

It appears to me that the zookeepers quickly assessed the situation (as Tower said, because quick decisions were called for at this juncture) and determined that they could not end this incident and keep both of the participants safe.  It is great that all of the Twittersphere have declared themselves experts in the topic of rescuing a child from a gorilla enclosure in an emergency, but it would surprise me if a fraction of them could have reacted in the moment with a clear head and a decisive action.  And that, folks, is what separates the Tweeters from the Doers.

Testify.    You said it far more eloquently than I did.   
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

wadesworld

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #36 on: May 31, 2016, 07:18:12 PM »
I haven't really followed the story about how the kid got there, but do we know for certain that the mom was just dealing with her other crying child?  Is it just her word?

Having said that, we're talking about killing a gorilla, right?  I mean, not that I want animals dead, but really?  A 400 lb gorilla was swinging a 4 year old human being through the water like the child was a dog's tug-o-war chew toy.  Heck, even if the gorilla just continued to stand there cornering the child like he was for the first 15 seconds of the video, you're really going to leave it up to chance that the gorilla won't harm the kid?  All it takes is 1 instinctual move from the gorilla and the kid's life is over.  If you ask me, I would've been fine with them shooting the gorilla the second it approached the kid, and I have nothing against gorillas.  But a human life or a gorilla life?  Tough choice...
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StillAWarrior

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #37 on: May 31, 2016, 07:26:22 PM »
I haven't really followed the story about how the kid got there, but do we know for certain that the mom was just dealing with her other crying child?  Is it just her word?

Having said that, we're talking about killing a gorilla, right?  I mean, not that I want animals dead, but really?  A 400 lb gorilla was swinging a 4 year old human being through the water like the child was a dog's tug-o-war chew toy.  Heck, even if the gorilla just continued to stand there cornering the child like he was for the first 15 seconds of the video, you're really going to leave it up to chance that the gorilla won't harm the kid?  All it takes is 1 instinctual move from the gorilla and the kid's life is over.  If you ask me, I would've been fine with them shooting the gorilla the second it approached the kid, and I have nothing against gorillas.  But a human life or a gorilla life?  Tough choice...

I've also seen people claiming that the gorilla was acting in a protective way toward the child.  Even if we accept as truth that the gorilla wanted to protect the child (and I don't), you just have to look at the way he dragged him through the water to understand that the kid was in grave danger (is there any other kind?).  That gorilla was just as likely to hurt/kill the kid unintentionally -- maybe more -- as intentionally.
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wadesworld

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #38 on: May 31, 2016, 07:32:13 PM »
I've also seen people claiming that the gorilla was acting in a protective way toward the child.  Even if we accept as truth that the gorilla wanted to protect the child (and I don't), you just have to look at the way he dragged him through the water to understand that the kid was in grave danger (is there any other kind?).  That gorilla was just as likely to hurt/kill the kid unintentionally -- maybe more -- as intentionally.

+1
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brewcity77

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #39 on: May 31, 2016, 08:47:19 PM »
Saw this posted on Facebook, written by a former zookeeper. Gives good perspective:

I am going to try to clear up a few things that have been weighing on me about Harambe and the Cinci Zoo since I read the news this afternoon.
I have worked with Gorillas as a zookeeper while in my twenties (before children) and they are my favorite animal (out of dozens) that I have ever worked closely with. I am gonna go ahead and list a few facts, thoughts and opinions for those of you that aren't familiar with the species itself, or how a zoo operates in emergency situations.

Now Gorillas are considered 'gentle giants' at least when compared with their more aggressive cousins the chimpanzee, but a 400+ pound male in his prime is as strong as roughly 10 adult humans. What can you bench press? OK, now multiply that number by ten. An adult male silverback gorilla has one job, to protect his group. He does this by bluffing or intimidating anything that he feels threatened by.

Gorillas are considered a Class 1 mammal, the most dangerous class of mammals in the animal kingdom, again, merely due to their size and strength. They are grouped in with other apes, tigers, lions, bears, etc.

While working in an AZA accredited zoo with Apes, keepers DO NOT work in contact with them. Meaning they do NOT go in with these animals. There is always a welded mesh barrier between the animal and the humans.

In more recent decades, zoos have begun to redesign enclosures, removing all obvious caging and attempting to create a seamless view of the animals for the visitor to enjoy watching animals in a more natural looking habitat. *this is great until little children begin falling into exhibits* which of course can happen to anyone, especially in a crowded zoo-like setting.

I have watched this video over again, and with the silverback's postering, and tight lips, it's pretty much the stuff of any keeper's nightmares, and I have had MANY while working with them. This job is not for the complacent. Gorillas are kind, curious, and sometimes silly, but they are also very large, very strong animals. I always brought my OCD to work with me. checking and rechecking locks to make sure my animals and I remained separated before entering to clean.
 
I keep hearing that the Gorilla was trying to protect the boy. I do not find this to be true. Harambe reaches for the boys hands and arms, but only to position the child better for his own displaying purposes.

Males do very elaborate displays when highly agitated, slamming and dragging things about. Typically they would drag large branches, barrels and heavy weighted balls around to make as much noise as possible. Not in an effort to hurt anyone or anything (usually) but just to intimidate. It was clear to me that he was reacting to the screams coming from the gathering crowd.

Harambe was most likely not going to separate himself from that child without seriously hurting him first (again due to mere size and strength, not malicious intent) Why didn't they use treats? well, they attempted to call them off exhibit (which animals hate), the females in the group came in, but Harambe did not. What better treat for a captive animal than a real live kid!

They didn't use Tranquilizers for a few reasons, A. Harambe would've taken too long to become immobilized, and could have really injured the child in the process as the drugs used may not work quickly enough depending on the stress of the situation and the dose B. Harambe would've have drowned in the moat if immobilized in the water, and possibly fallen on the boy trapping him and drowning him as well.

Many zoos have the protocol to call on their expertly trained dart team in the event of an animal escape or in the event that a human is trapped with a dangerous animal. They will evaluate the scene as quickly and as safely as possible, and will make the most informed decision as how they will handle the animal.

I can't point fingers at anyone in this situation, but we need to really evaluate the safety of the animal enclosures from the visitor side. Not impeding that view is a tough one, but there should be no way that someone can find themselves inside of an animal's exhibit.

I know one thing for sure, those keepers lost a beautiful, and I mean gorgeous silverback and friend. I feel their loss with them this week. As educators and conservators of endangered species, all we can do is shine a light on the beauty and majesty of these animals in hopes to spark a love and a need to keep them from vanishing from our planet.  Child killers, they are not. It's unfortunate for the conservation of the species, and the loss of revenue a beautiful zoo such as Cinci will lose. tragedy all around.
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Tugg Speedman

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #40 on: June 01, 2016, 02:38:52 PM »

ChicosBailBonds

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #41 on: June 01, 2016, 10:18:46 PM »



54X the coverage per a stat today on CNN.  Priorities.

brewcity77

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #42 on: June 01, 2016, 11:43:22 PM »


For a story to get big, it needs to be out of the ordinary. Is 6 dead over a 3 day weekend in a city of 3 million even newsworthy? I don't even think that would be all that newsworthy in Milwaukee.
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mu-rara

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #43 on: June 02, 2016, 12:19:29 PM »
For a story to get big, it needs to be out of the ordinary. Is 6 dead over a 3 day weekend in a city of 3 million even newsworthy? I don't even think that would be all that newsworthy in Milwaukee.
Maybe that's the problem?

WarriorInNYC

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #44 on: June 02, 2016, 01:06:59 PM »
This is a tragic situation that has become altogether too frequent in the era of social media shaming.  I can attest that it is altogether too easy to lose track of one child, particularly when you are wrangling more than one, but even with only one you can turn around in a grocery store and the kid who was tugging on your pant two seconds ago whining for gummy snacks has disappeared.    My husband always joked that when the third kid came along, we went from man-to-man defense to zone (and when they started coming two at a time, we quit!). As glow said, I'm only thankful that nothing terrible happened as a result of my supposed "inattentiveness" to my children.

As a society, we are so determined to fix blame, but this is not the fault of the parents, or the zookeeper, or the gorilla (or the four year old boy, for that matter).  It was an accident in a world where we refuse to admit anymore that accidents happen, or where we acknowledge that accidents happen but we intend to use them to our advantage to profit from them.  Imagine the inverse conversation we would be having had the zookeepers decided, a'la the internet "activists," that the gorilla was far too valuable and so they did nothing and allowed the gorilla to inadvertently, or even intentionally, kill the young boy?  I have become so tired of the self righteous individuals who believe they can definitively say what a life is worth.  One could even argue that the zoo acted in its own self-interest, in this day when juries are awarding victims or their survivors tens of millions of dollars for supposed negligence that costs someone a body part or a life, even when the victim was ignoring clear safety instructions (or common sense) that resulted in their injuries.

It appears to me that the zookeepers quickly assessed the situation (as Tower said, because quick decisions were called for at this juncture) and determined that they could not end this incident and keep both of the participants safe.  It is great that all of the Twittersphere have declared themselves experts in the topic of rescuing a child from a gorilla enclosure in an emergency, but it would surprise me if a fraction of them could have reacted in the moment with a clear head and a decisive action.  And that, folks, is what separates the Tweeters from the Doers.

This is very well written.  I read an article on cnn.com the other day that had a very similar sentiment.  Why do we need to set blame here?  Lets just realize this is an unfortunate, sad incident that could have ended much worse.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/30/opinions/gorilla-zoo-death-dont-judge-mel-robbins/index.html

buckchuckler

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #45 on: June 02, 2016, 02:43:28 PM »
Meet the Parents

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3617016/EXCLUSIVE-PICTURES-parents-four-son-fell-zoo-enclosure-sparking-controversial-killing-Harambe-gorilla-emerges-father-lengthy-criminal-history.html

EXCLUSIVE: Parents-of-four whose son fell into zoo enclosure sparking killing of Harambe the gorilla as it emerges father has a lengthy criminal history - including kidnap and drug trafficking
   
These are the parents of the four-year-old boy whose 15-feet fall into the gorilla exhibit moat in Cincinnati Zoo resulted in the death of 17-year-old silverback gorilla, Harambe.

Seen here for the first time is mother Michelle Gregg, 32, who has four children by father Deonne Dickerson, 36, a man who, Daily Mail Online can disclose, has a lengthy criminal history.

Criminal filings against Dickerson stretch over a decade and include burglary, firearms offences, drug trafficking, criminal trespass, disorderly conduct and kidnap.

In 2006 he was sentenced to one year behind bars for a drug trafficking conviction.

But in numerous pictures posted on Dickerson's Facebook site in recent years he appears to have turned his life around to become the proud father of four.

Indeed, the majority of his postings to the social media site are updates of his children and his working life.



Dad wasn't even there.  Seems pretty irrelevant. 

Pakuni

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #46 on: June 02, 2016, 02:48:35 PM »
I am not sure they needed to kill the Gorilla. I read that they did not think tranquilizers would take effect quick enough. I would think they could have wounded the Gorilla enough to get the kid.

I am Pro Gorilla and blame the parents in this case.

Wounding a gorilla while it's holding a four-year-old child seems like a terrific idea.

warriorchick

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #47 on: June 02, 2016, 02:49:54 PM »


Have some patience, FFS.

Benny B

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #48 on: June 02, 2016, 03:12:35 PM »
Wounding a gorilla while it's holding a four-year-old child seems like a terrific idea.

Yeah... everybody knows you just send it a candygram instead.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/e/TK7ZvZNAiKY" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/e/TK7ZvZNAiKY</a>
Wow, I'm very concerned for Benny.  Being able to mimic Myron Medcalf's writing so closely implies an oncoming case of dementia.

brewcity77

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #49 on: June 02, 2016, 03:53:36 PM »
Maybe that's the problem?

Could be. Having worked both sides (media and on the streets) it's really just a case of where our society is today. The reason the bloody stories are the leads on the news is because that's what people want to see, whether they admit to themselves or not. And we're at the point where it takes fantastical violence (like this gorilla) to really grasp everyone's attention. That's just the America we live in.
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MomofMUltiples

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #50 on: June 02, 2016, 05:04:39 PM »
Could be. Having worked both sides (media and on the streets) it's really just a case of where our society is today. The reason the bloody stories are the leads on the news is because that's what people want to see, whether they admit to themselves or not. And we're at the point where it takes fantastical violence (like this gorilla) to really grasp everyone's attention. That's just the America we live in.

More than that, I believe the media created this problem due to the 24 hour news cycle and the stiff competition between network, non-network, online, print and social media for diminishing advertising dollars.  It's at the point where every media outlet is a tabloid, because what you need to do is grab attention/make a sale/get clicks, etc.  so you lead with gorilla stories and not hard news, or write bombastic headlines that have little to do with article content. Much less in-depth and investigative reporting, way more sound bites designed to grab attention. People are really lazy about their news these days. More interested in what some Kardashian wore than what's going on in the world.
I mean, OK, maybe he's secretly a serial killer who's pulled the wool over our eyes with his good deeds and smooth jumper - Pakuni (on Markus Howard)

tower912

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #51 on: June 02, 2016, 06:53:36 PM »
Luke 6:45   ...A good man produces goodness from the good in his heart; an evil man produces evil out of his store of evil.   Each man speaks from his heart's abundance...

It is better to be fearless and cheerful than cheerless and fearful.

Pakuni

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Re: Cincinnati gorilla
« Reply #52 on: June 02, 2016, 07:40:42 PM »
More than that, I believe the media created this problem due to the 24 hour news cycle and the stiff competition between network, non-network, online, print and social media for diminishing advertising dollars.  It's at the point where every media outlet is a tabloid, because what you need to do is grab attention/make a sale/get clicks, etc.  so you lead with gorilla stories and not hard news, or write bombastic headlines that have little to do with article content. Much less in-depth and investigative reporting, way more sound bites designed to grab attention. People are really lazy about their news these days. More interested in what some Kardashian wore than what's going on in the world.

Meh ... this is like blaming McDonald's for overweight people and Miller for alcoholics.
The media, like every other business, simply tries to respond to market demand. If the market primarily demanded 3,000-word thinkpieces on the impact of free trade on developing nations, we'd be awash with them. Believe me, every journalist I know would rather write that than compile some crappy listicle about the 10 best dogs for kids.
But the fact is, that's not what the majority of viewers/listeners/readers demand. And, in reality, it's never been what the market demands. Go read some newspapers from 100 years ago. Some of the sensationalism makes today's NY Post look like the Economist in comparison.