Bo Retiring

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

I don't understand the ignorance on salary and negotiation on this board.  Not singling out this person because others have concluded MU > UW in terms of salary.

Do any of you actually consider the one-on-one salary negotiations before making these broad-brushed statements?

Just considering MU's situation, we would have paid far more if we could have landed Shaka.  We would have paid far less had we had to settle for promoting Issac Chew. The salary isn't a function of the program--its a function of what the other guy at the table wants (and can command) in a negotiation.  We don't care less about the program because we paid less to Wojo than we would have for Shaka. 

Don't like that comparison?  How about this: we paid far less for Buzz his first year than we would have been willing to pay for Bennett or Miller. Again, its not a sign that MU cares less about its program--its the reality of the negotiation process.

If UW falls in love with a guy and he wants $3.5 million, UW will give him $3.5 million, which would according to the logic of some on this board be evidence that they suddenly care more about their program.  That's stupid.

Im not an insider, but I'll just share my basis for the salary discussion.

While UW has a healthy AD balance sheet, I'd say there is evidence to support them being penny wise pound foolish with regard to resources. Two well-known examples are Beiliema leaving for more money in Arkansas (for both himself and assistants), and Gary Anderson mentioning that there was a promise made by BA to supply his staff with UW-leased vehicles, which never happened.

If you look at schools like IU, Michigan, Ohio State, Alabama, etc... They don't have these problems because they seem to have the attitude that resources and money are not going to be the reason they lose out on a coach/recruit/etc

In MU's case, Basketball means more to us than football means to UW. We are fortunate to have the alumni and fan support not only in dollars but in expectation that we pay for quality with our coaches/program.

You're definitely right that a salary is negotiated uniquely in each situation, but I think it's clear that there do exist cultural differences among schools who COULD pay top dollar, and those that are actually willing to.

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

I think the fact that Bo isn't paid more in appreciation of his performance, especially given the relatively slim recruiting budget, says they're maybe tighter than some.

I'll also share that, anecdotally, Badger fans I wa around during the Harbaugh-to-Michigan thing went on and on about how no coach would be worth $5m/year.

In the case of Harbaugh we'll see if that works or not, but there's not a single Michigan fan I've heard that had issue with paying him even more.

That's not a meaningful sample, but i think it illustrates a truth about the attitudes of both fan bases, and is part of the reason Paul Chryst is the coach at UW.

Buzz was no Harbaugh but I'd say MU's attitude is a little closer to the Michigan example than the UW with regard to paying for excellence.

[dgies9156]

Applying this to the business world, Tim Cook has done an awesome job, but continues to be compared to Steve Jobs. Jeff Immelt succeeded Jack Welch, and is still compared with his success.

Both CEOs are doing well because of their execution and the healthy businesses they were left, but in either case, their legendary predecessor is a drag on their evaluations.

Could be the same case with Bo, Izzo, etc

I believe that was Kevin O'Neill's problem with our place in the 1990s. Too much Al. Too little Kevin.

In our case, I would compare our last hire to Madison's last hire. We retained Duke's Number 1 assistant. They went to Platteville. I also suspect they may be going down the "Hank" road if they hire their number 1 assistant, as Dracula wants. I hope for the Red Rodent's sake, they do what we did and embark on a national search to hire the best coach they can get. It would be good for basketball and good for us.

Who knows... Marquette -- Wisconsin could become the new Duke/North Carolina or Louisville/Kentucky!

[GGGG]

Bo was at UWM before coming to Madison. 

[Galway Eagle]

I believe that was Kevin O'Neill's problem with our place in the 1990s. Too much Al. Too little Kevin.

In our case, I would compare our last hire to Madison's last hire. We retained Duke's Number 1 assistant. They went to Platteville. I also suspect they may be going down the "Hank" road if they hire their number 1 assistant, as Dracula wants. I hope for the Red Rodent's sake, they do what we did and embark on a national search to hire the best coach they can get. It would be good for basketball and good for us.

Who knows... Marquette -- Wisconsin could become the new Duke/North Carolina or Louisville/Kentucky!

Would be hilarious if they hired a UNC alum who was an associate head coach over there

[Brewtown Andy]

Would be hilarious if they hired a UNC alum who was an associate head coach over there

Unfortunately, neither of Roy's long time assistants are UNC alums.  There is Hubert Davis, though, but he's only been an assistant since 2012-13.

[GGGG]

Unfortunately, neither of Roy's long time assistants are UNC alums.  There is Hubert Davis, though, but he's only been an assistant since 2012-13.

Davis might end up being the choice however.

[mugrad2006]

How could recent success not matter to a new coach as far as attractiveness. Most definitely its positively correlated with resources (especially donors), recruiting (players wanna go to a winner), and attendance (arena size is a moot point if it's half full).

[Galway Eagle]

arena size is a moot point if it's half full.

Not entirely true, I'd take a half full Bradley center over a 100% full 9,000 seated stadium. If a coach truly believes in themselves then they'd take it as a challenge to get that stadium filled again. 

[mugrad2006]

Not entirely true, I'd take a half full Bradley center over a 100% full 9,000 seated stadium. If a coach truly believes in themselves then they'd take it as a challenge to get that stadium filled again. 

That's fair. I was thinking of a coach comparing similar arenas like MU and UW.

[GGGG]

Not entirely true, I'd take a half full Bradley center over a 100% full 9,000 seated stadium. If a coach truly believes in themselves then they'd take it as a challenge to get that stadium filled again. 

I would take a 9,000 seat arena where tickets are fought over rather than a 1/2 full BC.  No question.

[Galway Eagle]

I would take a 9,000 seat arena where tickets are fought over rather than a 1/2 full BC.  No question.

So you'd rather always be content with a 9,00 seat arena filled than ever have the years like 11-12 where we averaged absurd numbers and had plenty of sold out games?

[GGGG]

So you'd rather always be content with a 9,00 seat arena filled than ever have the years like 11-12 where we averaged absurd numbers and had plenty of sold out games?

Yes.  I have said since it opened that I think the BC is too big.  (Honestly, I would prefer a 12,000 seat arena over 9,000, but would prefer the 9,000 over the BC.)

[brewcity77]

I think the problem is the BC isn't built for basketball. The sight lines aren't right, the court isn't the focal point of all the seats, and the crowd is in most cases too far away. I'd rather have a smaller basketball arena than a bigger hockey arena any day. Hopefully the new stadium is built and addresses all that. I don't think MU will ever play in a 12,000 seat venue, but I do think a successful program here can regularly fill a 17,000 seat venue to 85-90% capacity.

[Galway Eagle]

Yes.  I have said since it opened that I think the BC is too big.  (Honestly, I would prefer a 12,000 seat arena over 9,000, but would prefer the 9,000 over the BC.)

Well to each their own. I just know coming to the MU-SU in the 08-09 season that went to overtime (most attended game all time) was what officially sealed the deal for me to come to MU. It was just incredible seeing that massive crowd. Not sure the effect would've been the same at a smaller place.

I do agree with what Brewcity said about the way the BC was built though.

[Litehouse]

Any discussion comparing Bo Ryan's salary to anyone else is meaningless without taking into account his state pension.  He's been a WI state employee for 40 years and will finish with an extremely high salary for his final years of employment.  He's getting ready to start collecting the mother of all pensions at taxpayer expense beginning next year and continuing for the rest of his life.

[GGGG]

Any discussion comparing Bo Ryan's salary to anyone else is meaningless without taking into account his state pension.  He's been a WI state employee for 40 years and will finish with an extremely high salary for his final years of employment.  He's getting ready to start collecting the mother of all pensions at taxpayer expense beginning next year and continuing for the rest of his life.

Taxpayer expense?  It's sitting in his account at WRS.  He's not collecting anything that wasn't earned.

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

Taxpayer expense?  It's sitting in his account at WRS.  He's not collecting anything that wasn't earned.

I must be way off - is that all interest earnings?

[GGGG]

I must be way off - is that all interest earnings?

It is basically an annuity.  You have a big pot of money, that has been built through employee and employer contributions over time, and that is used to pay the retiree.  (It isn't that simple since there is a formula involved, but still...)

[brewcity77]

It is basically an annuity.  You have a big pot of money, that has been built through employee and employer contributions over time, and that is used to pay the retiree.  (It isn't that simple since there is a formula involved, but still...)

Both the City of Milwaukee and the State of Wisconsin have excellent pension plans. I know the city's is fully funded, mostly because of excellent management over the years that has come from members of the respective unions rather than politicians. Numerous municipalities from across the country have come here to study how we keep the fund solvent without a reliance on taxpayer dollars.

[Litehouse]

It is basically an annuity.  You have a big pot of money, that has been built through employee and employer contributions over time, and that is used to pay the retiree.  (It isn't that simple since there is a formula involved, but still...)

By "taxpayer expense" I didn't mean to imply it hasn't been earned, it has as part of his contract.  But it's a defined benefit program, not defined contribution, so the state ETF is on the hook for paying based on the formula (highest 3 earning years, and years of service, among other things).  As Brewcity mentioned, fortunately Wisconsin's system is very well run.

My point is that when we see articles reporting Bo Ryan's salary, I doubt they're taking into account the additional employer contributions that have been put in the state pension program for him, which have given him an added incentive to stick around the UW system.

[dgies9156]

Yes.  I have said since it opened that I think the BC is too big.  (Honestly, I would prefer a 12,000 seat arena over 9,000, but would prefer the 9,000 over the BC.)

Hello... where do you think the money to support our basketball program comes from?

Yes, I know TV plays a role. But having a 17,000 seat arena and the ability to fill it when we're really good matters. It really does.

For years, we played in an arena with 11,700 seats. We sold out every game, to the rafters. We moved to the Bradley Center and average these days about 12,000 to 14,000 tickets sold. Under these circumstances, I see no situation where a 10,000 seat arena would assist us.

[GGGG]

Hello... where do you think the money to support our basketball program comes from?

Yes, I know TV plays a role. But having a 17,000 seat arena and the ability to fill it when we're really good matters. It really does.

For years, we played in an arena with 11,700 seats. We sold out every game, to the rafters. We moved to the Bradley Center and average these days about 12,000 to 14,000 tickets sold. Under these circumstances, I see no situation where a 10,000 seat arena would assist us.

I think having games filled to the rafters is more important than being able to satisfy the demands of every single customer interested in buying a ticket.  Its a better atmosphere.

If I had my choice, I would want a 12,000 seat arena on campus.

[MUfan12]

If I had my choice, I would want a 12,000 seat arena on campus.

Make it 15K and allow beer sales, and I'm on board.

[GGGG]

Make it 15K and allow beer sales, and I'm on board.

I could go for that.