UWM fans (some of them) respond

[ecompt]

Please stop with the Barry BS. What Wisconsin has done in football is terrific. Congrats. They went the way of the other Big Ten powerhouses and prostituted themselves. How many schools in that conference HAVEN'T been in trouble with the NCAA in the past 15 years? Barry and Richter were given a blank check and told to make UW football a winner, no matter what. Good for them. They'll win their four cupcake games, go 6-2 in the Big Ten and win a bowl game. You may dislike Crean for whatever reason, but please don't tell me you'd rather have Alvarez running the show. The NCAA would be at the door every year.

[Frozen Caveman Coach]

The shoe scandal was one of the most trivial of many trivial violations the NCAA has investigated.  That store owner offered discounts to all UW students and non students as well.  You make it sound like they were forced to forfeit games, banned from bowls or received the death penalty.  Probation??  They had a handful of players receive 1-3 game suspensions most before conference play.  It was an example of the NCAA over legislating and looking for any violation to slap WI on the wrist.  Are you referring to Brent Moss??  Show me any winning D1 football program with a roster of 80-100 players that hasn't kicked a player off its team.  You are really reaching in your hatred of this incredibly successful coach. 

Perhaps next time before you respond you first should get a few of your facts correct.

The Shoe Box investigation (and other violations that occurred at about the same time) was so "trivial" that the NCAA deemed it a major infraction and placed the athletics department on probation for five years, an unusually long period by NCAA standards. The football program lost 10 scholies over two seasons and the basketball program lost two.
Trivial, indeed.

It was, by the way, the third time UW had been found guilty of a major NCAA infraction during Barry's tenure. In fact, if memory serves, no other school in NCAA Division I was found guilty of more major infractions than Wisconsin during Barry's time there.

Now I'm sure Barry is a swell guy and he did wonders with the football program. But he didn't always abide my the most ethical of standards, nor by NCAA rules, in achieving that turnaround.

p.s. And, to the best of my knowledge, the children of Tom Crean have never microwaved anyone's pet.

p.s.s. The irony of that UWM poster's rant is that Crean and Alvarez are pretty tight.

Good factual post.  As a lifelong resident of WI and an MU grad, I knew that the remark "The clown who got his school placed on probation by offering massive "student-athlete discounts?" was not true since he did not own the store and all athletes and non athletes could walk into this store and receive the same discounts.  In my opinion and many others, this was a trivial infraction.  I'll fault Alvarez for ignorance on this one.  It was wrong for his players and other student athletes to receive the discounts that anyone off the street would receive.   

I don't know why the Crean defense mechanism is springing up?  Alvarez coached football and I would never consider him a worthy replacement should Crean ever leave.  It is not really apples to apples to compare the duties of AD of MU to UW.  It is not surprising to hear that Tom & Barry pals.  Crean has been a master of befriending all the state's coaches. 

[ecompt]

Sorry, Frozen, but the fact Barry didn't own the store doesn't wash. There were a series of infractions under his watch and the school was placed on probation. He's made UW football a winning program and has a good young coach. Please don't tell us he didn't do it without knowing what rules were being bent. 

[augoman]

One more point, you are probably one of the clowns that gives all the credit to Crean for the Al Center.  Look at the Kohl Center and renovations of Camp Randall to give WI some of the best facilities and revenue streams in D1.  I doubt much of this would be possible w/o Alvarez's success.  Their athletic budget was deeply in the red before Ritcher and he came on board.

Interestingly enough, it wasn't Richter or Alvarez that bailed out the UW athletic dept deficit- it was the WI tax-payer.  Donna Shalala, then chancellor, and Ade Sponberg(sp), then AD were guilty of terrible mis-management.  The state dealt w/ their approx $5,000,000. shortfall by raising our taxes and a special appropriation.  THAT's why I love it when Northwestern (the smallest and only private school in the big eleven) occaisionally beats UW!  And I was in the stands when Alvarez' son was ejected from a UW/NW football game for drunkeness, snuck back in and was arrested.  He was at the fence behind the NW players' bench yelling obscenities!  A real touch of class.  And yes, NW won that one too!  (Ron Dane fumbled a handoff at the end when they were trying sit on their lead).  Now, if you had defended Alvarez as a great recruiter, I couldn't argue.  Lousy coach, poor role model, but great recruiter!

[spiral97]

alright guys.. if you want to debate about alvarez's class feel free to take it over to the superbar in a new topic.. let's not hijack this topic any further.