SLU Protest..

[ChicosBailBonds]

Having graduated from Marquette and SLU Law, I must say the "Island" effect is jarring at SLU. Campus is 2.5 to 3 miles from the Arch and downtown St. Louis, and while it is an extremely well-manicured campus with statues and artificial ponds, the neighborhood goes south REAL fast once you get two blocks out in pretty much any direction.

Based on what is likely to happen in the St. Louis area in the next few weeks, I think a lot of parents of SLU kids are going to be rather happy for that island effect.  Just sayin....

[warriorchick]

Based on what is likely to happen in the St. Louis area in the next few weeks, I think a lot of parents of SLU kids are going to be rather happy for that island effect.  Just sayin....

Didn't stop the protesters from getting on Campus and using extortion to get what they wanted out of the school:

http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2014/10/here_are_the_agreements_that_ended_occupy_slu.php

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/10/slu-president-buys-off-occupyslu-protesters-hides-payoff-from-parents/

[ChicosBailBonds]

Didn't stop the protesters from getting on Campus and using extortion to get what they wanted out of the school:

http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2014/10/here_are_the_agreements_that_ended_occupy_slu.php

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/10/slu-president-buys-off-occupyslu-protesters-hides-payoff-from-parents/

The way things are shaping up, things could get really really ugly in the next few weeks.  The forensics aren't matching the witnesses and that doesn't seem to matter as someone is going to pay, either through violence or property damage (or both).  I'm sure SLU is preparing, but the NY Times article yesterday, the Wa Post today and the Post Dispatch today, not going to be pretty.

[mu_hilltopper]

Split this off from the Warrior thread .. I had no idea about the SLU protests until you posted it.

Really fascinating event, solution, et cetera.

[jesmu84]

The way things are shaping up, things could get really really ugly in the next few weeks.  The forensics aren't matching the witnesses and that doesn't seem to matter as someone is going to pay, either through violence or property damage (or both).  I'm sure SLU is preparing, but the NY Times article yesterday, the Wa Post today and the Post Dispatch today, not going to be pretty.

I'll admit, I haven't been paying any attention to the situation. But is there no chance that there is any tampering or falsifying of the "forensics" or official statements, etc.? It wouldn't be the first attempt at a cover-up in a high profile situation

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'll admit, I haven't been paying any attention to the situation. But is there no chance that there is any tampering or falsifying of the "forensics" or official statements, etc.? It wouldn't be the first attempt at a cover-up in a high profile situation

Let's reverse the question, any chance witnesses made stuff up and "bear false witness?"   Let's not forget that feds are doing this stuff now by the Fed AG, not just the locals.  Three independent investigations in tandem.

The easiest thing to do is give up a body and let someone take the fall.  If it doesn't go that way, kind of kills your conspiracy theory in my opinion.  There is clearly an easy solution, but if that isn't what happens and Rome burns, it will be because the evidence backs that up.  

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

I'll admit, I haven't been paying any attention to the situation. But is there no chance that there is any tampering or falsifying of the "forensics" or official statements, etc.? It wouldn't be the first attempt at a cover-up in a high profile situation

Who on this board would have any credible answer to this?

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'm sure SLU is working on contingency plans, but this may be a time they are quite happy to be in an island situation.  USC was in a similar fix when South Central burned back in the day, but because their campus is also "on an island" and the campus police did a great job of protecting life, property, etc.

We'll see how it goes, sure hope it doesn't get to that point, but based on the rehtoric in those articles and the claims of one side, well I'm glad my kids aren't at SLU at this point in time. 

[warriorchick]

Let's reverse the question, any chance witnesses made stuf and "bear false witness?"   

This.

As someone who has had a neighborhood "witness" brazenly lie to a police officer about some wrongdoing I allegedly did to their friend, I am extremely sensitive to this.  For the record, it wasn't nearly as serious as murder.

[jesmu84]

Let's reverse the question, any chance witnesses made stuf and "bear false witness?"   Let's not forget that feds are doing this stuff now by the Fed AG, not just the locals.  Three independent investigations. 

The easiest thing to do is give up a body and let someone take the fall.  If it doesn't go that way, kind of kills your conspiracy theory in my opinion.  There is clearly an easy solution, but if that isn't what happens and Rome burns, it will be because the evidence backs that up. 

Absolutely all possible. And, again, as I said, I haven't been following it. I don't have a conspiracy. Just acknowledging that there are many possibilities of how the conclusions can be drawn out. Any investigation can have many different influences. We all hope that the investigations have no bias or prejudice and let the facts do the talking. Many times, however, powers that be wield influence outside the scope of those facts. And you're right, it works both ways.

[GGGG]

I really, really hope that if the forensics show that the officer was justified, that some of the people who helped to lead the protests will work to keep things calm.  That's probably too much to ask.

I also hope that the Ferguson PD, as well as others, can learn from this how they can work to build greater trust within their communities so that the relationship isn't so adversarial.  That probably is also too much to ask.

My guess is that there will be no black and white answer.  Shades of gray that can be used to protest for and against, and by Fox, MSNBC and their ilk to support their agendas.

It will all be very depressing cause nothing will come of it.

[jesmu84]

I really, really hope that if the forensics show that the officer was justified, that some of the people who helped to lead the protests will work to keep things calm.  That's probably too much to ask.

I also hope that the Ferguson PD, as well as others, can learn from this how they can work to build greater trust within their communities so that the relationship isn't so adversarial.  That probably is also too much to ask.

My guess is that there will be no black and white answer.  Shades of gray that can be used to protest for and against, and by Fox, MSNBC and their ilk to support their agendas.

It will all be very depressing cause nothing will come of it.

Good stuff

[jesmu84]

Who on this board would have any credible answer to this?

I would argue everyone on this board has a credible answer to this as we can all point to examples in the past of wrong-doings by organizations or individuals during investigations that were later uncovered.

[Lighthouse 84]

Didn't stop the protesters from getting on Campus and using extortion to get what they wanted out of the school:

http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2014/10/here_are_the_agreements_that_ended_occupy_slu.php

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/10/slu-president-buys-off-occupyslu-protesters-hides-payoff-from-parents/

I've got a freshman daughter at SLU so I was following the occupy movement pretty closely. A week ago Sunday, they arrived on campus and kept it up until at least 2:30-3:00 am and continued through Saturday morning.  This is while mid-terms were going on.  It was extremely disruptive to the students and the pres. lied and said the protesters were students.  The lead protester was Jessica Hollie, aka Bella Eiko.  She's a professional protester from Oakland.  I figured they left because this past weekend was fall break and a lot of students were gone.  Either way, I'm glad they are gone.  

The protesters vowed violence if no indictment is handed down.  While the agreement permanently ends the encampment, my fear is that it won't prevent violence from occurring if Wilson isn't indicted, and it looks like he won't be.  

[Lighthouse 84]

Split this off from the Warrior thread .. I had no idea about the SLU protests until you posted it.

Really fascinating event, solution, et cetera.

Which thread was this split from?

[mu03eng]

I've got a freshman daughter at SLU so I was following the occupy movement pretty closely. A week ago Sunday, they arrived on campus and kept it up until at least 2:30-3:00 am and continued through Saturday morning.  This is while mid-terms were going on.  It was extremely disruptive to the students and the pres. lied and said the protesters were students.  The lead protester was Jessica Hollie, aka Bella Eiko.  She's a professional protester from Oakland.  I figured they left because this past weekend was fall break and a lot of students were gone.  Either way, I'm glad they are gone.  

The protesters vowed violence if no indictment is handed down.  While the agreement permanently ends the encampment, my fear is that it won't prevent violence from occurring if Wilson isn't indicted, and it looks like he won't be.  

So what is you opinion and your daughters opinion of how the SLU prez handled this situation.  Seems pretty slimy to me.  I applaud the efforts in general, though it feels like extortion and to do so while at a minimum obfuscating the truth is no something I would accept from Prez Lovell.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

So is Marquette turning into SLU?

[Lighthouse 84]

So what is you opinion and your daughters opinion of how the SLU prez handled this situation.  Seems pretty slimy to me.  I applaud the efforts in general, though it feels like extortion and to do so while at a minimum obfuscating the truth is no something I would accept from Prez Lovell.

Like many other parents, we're not happy about the fact that we were lied to by the president.  My daughter, as well as many, many others, were clear that the vast majority of the protesters were not students but the prez consistently stated they were and that's why they were allowed to remain on campus.  It didn't give us a warm and fuzzy feeling that we felt we were entitled to in order to make us believe he was doing everything he could to keep our kids safe.  Is that too much to ask of a university?

[jficke13]

My guess is that there will be no black and white answer.  Shades of gray that can be used to protest for and against, and by Fox, MSNBC and their ilk to support their agendas.

Yellow journalism. Provide the pictures, they'll provide the war.

The only thing that I'd add is that their agenda is more about attracting eyeballs than about ideology. If there were ratings in calm, measured, and objective reporting such a channel would exist... but alas...

[Pakuni]

Yellow journalism. Provide the pictures, they'll provide the war.

The only thing that I'd add is that their agenda is more about attracting eyeballs than about ideology. If there were ratings in calm, measured, and objective reporting such a channel would exist... but alas...

So, do we blame (some of) the media, which is simply chasing the necessary ratings (dollars), or the consumer for choosing to ignore calm, measured and objective reporting, and viewing the loud, blathering idiots on cable news instead?
After all, it's not the media's fault y'all prefer People to the The Economist and "The O'Reilly Factor" to "The McLaughlin Group."
There's plenty of calm, measured and objective material out there if you're willing to look for it. If you're like most people, you aren't looking.
It's a bit like blaming 7-11 for selling Big Gulps instead of sensible servings of pomengranate juice. Media outlets know exactly what you're watching/clicking on and when, and they're going to respond to those habits.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

Maybe some of us  read People to take a crap and the Economist for the left's slant, O'Reilly to hear  tough questions asked and the McLaughlin Group for things that don't get addressed elsewhere. Pretty elitist to paint persons you don't know with a condescending brush.

[PuertoRicanNightmare]

This.

As someone who has had a neighborhood "witness" brazenly lie to a police officer about some wrongdoing I allegedly did to their friend, I am extremely sensitive to this.  For the record, it wasn't nearly as serious as murder.

Did this have to do with acoustics at the neighborhood block party?

[Galway Eagle]

Maybe it's just me but I feel like if keefe made this thread it'd be locked by now...

[Pakuni]

Maybe some of us  read People to take a crap and the Economist for the left's slant, O'Reilly to hear  tough questions asked and the McLaughlin Group for things that don't get addressed elsewhere. Pretty elitist to paint persons you don't know with a condescending brush.

If preferring The Economist to People makes me elitist, I'll gladly carry that label.
And I'm willing to wager there's not a big crossover market of people who read both publications.
I also suspect people who actually read The Economist do so for "the left slant."

[warriorchick]

Did this have to do with acoustics at the neighborhood block party?

No.  When I was sixteen and a newly licensed driver, I was in downtown Nashville and I switched lanes without looking in my rear view mirrors.  I heard someone lean on their horn, and I swerved back into my original lane.  At the next stop light, the woman driving the other car came up to my window and started screaming, "You hit my car!" Then her passenger got out and started screaming at me as well.

I know I hadn't, and I told them that, but these women were very adamant and I was a shy, easily intimidated driver.  After a couple of minutes a policeman driving by saw us standing in the intersection and stopped.  The driver pointed to one of the dents on her car and claimed I caused it, and her passenger backed her up 100%.  The officer looked at these two unhinged women, looked at me, a sobbing girl in her Catholic school uniform, and then looked at the dent.

He very calmly said to the other driver, "You have a silver car.  There is blue paint on this dent.  This young girl here is driving a green car. It is obvious she did not cause this damage."  With that, he waited until the grumbling women drove off and made sure I  had calmed down enough to drive.

I hate to think all the trouble I would have ended up having to go through if that policeman hadn't backed me up.  But to this day, I remember how appalled I was that someone would tell such a bald-faced lie to a police officer.

[mu_hilltopper]

Maybe it's just me but I feel like if keefe made this thread it'd be locked by now...

I hear you.   I was hoping we'd stay on point about the SLU protest story, and not slip into Fergusonmania.

[Gato78]

1. College campuses have traditionally been the place where social issues are protested. Wisconsin, Columbia and even Marquette in the '60's. Dean Meminger quit MU's basketball team for about 48 hours during a racial/Vietnam War protest at Marquette in 1969.
2. The FBI is damn good and will have the case done in a first rate manner--which the Ferguson police and St. Louis County cops cannot duplicate.
3. Big picture the forensics--pretty easy. Multiple deadly shots fired at an unarmed person. A police officer cannot use deadly force unless the officer has a reasonable belief that deadly force is about to be, or is actually being, used against the officer or in defense of others. So please, enough of the "forensics" arguments. Having tried hundreds of cases in my career, I can say unequivocally that no witness has the exact same perception of events observed as the others. That will never be determinative. What is determinative is the lack of firearm in the hands of the deceased while walking away from the officer after already being wounded.

[brandx]

2. The FBI is damn good and will have the case done in a first rate manner--which the Ferguson police and St. Louis County cops cannot duplicate.
 

Except the former officers and officials of the FBI employed by the NFL weren't smart enough to pick up a phone and call the casino to ask for the Ray Rice tape.

[muwarrior69]

I really, really hope that if the forensics show that the officer was justified, that some of the people who helped to lead the protests will work to keep things calm.  That's probably too much to ask.

I also hope that the Ferguson PD, as well as others, can learn from this how they can work to build greater trust within their communities so that the relationship isn't so adversarial.  That probably is also too much to ask.

My guess is that there will be no black and white answer.  Shades of gray that can be used to protest for and against, and by Fox, MSNBC and their ilk to support their agendas.

It will all be very depressing cause nothing will come of it.

What gets me is that Furgeson is 60+ percent black. They should change things by voting in those folks who they think will make their community represent them and hopefully better for all....but they have not.

[WellsstreetWanderer]

NO!  They should go to NFL games and hurl spit and racial invectives at innocent fans.

[jesmu84]

NO!  They should go to NFL games and hurl spit and racial invectives at innocent fans.

http://deadspin.com/cardinals-fans-get-ugly-in-clash-with-ferguson-proteste-1643282285

Maybe more of a baseball crowd?

[martyconlonontherun]

http://deadspin.com/cardinals-fans-get-ugly-in-clash-with-ferguson-proteste-1643282285

Maybe more of a baseball crowd?

Wow what a great combo of racist whites and protestors hurting their cause. The racists are explained in the link but waving an American flag upside down and saying you want someone dead is not the way to gain the American public hearts.

[mu03eng]

To maybe steer this away from Locked Land, what would the expectations of the board be for President Lovell should something like this occur at MU?  Is the deal cut acceptable if it was above board, or is making a deal with "protesters" an issue in of itself?

[Henry Sugar]

I hear you.   I was hoping we'd stay on point about the SLU protest story, and not slip into Fergusonmania.

[ChicosBailBonds]

This.

As someone who has had a neighborhood "witness" brazenly lie to a police officer about some wrongdoing I allegedly did to their friend, I am extremely sensitive to this.  For the record, it wasn't nearly as serious as murder.

It's not going to matter to a number of people. They could have incontrovertible video evidence and some folks would claim it is doctored or filmed on a sound stage.  Doesn't matter.  No justice, no peace.

[mu_hilltopper]

To maybe steer this away from Locked Land, what would the expectations of the board be for President Lovell should something like this occur at MU?  Is the deal cut acceptable if it was above board, or is making a deal with "protesters" an issue in of itself?

That's the crazy part.  From the above reports, it would appear that a professional, out-of-town protester got some folks together and took over a private college campus with demands that .. we're met!    

I get how .. SLU is a Jesuit institution and they do have an underlying mission to help the poor, disenfranchised, minority, etc, folks .. so I can see how they could be "on the same page" or at least "reading the same book" as the protesters .. But wow, that sure seems like extortion to me.

One would think SLU's agreement would be a playbook for the protesters to just move to another private / catholic / religious school and re-enact that episode, make the same demands that worked at SLU and the victim college would be hard pressed to fight it.

[ChicosBailBonds]

So, do we blame (some of) the media, which is simply chasing the necessary ratings (dollars), or the consumer for choosing to ignore calm, measured and objective reporting, and viewing the loud, blathering idiots on cable news instead?
After all, it's not the media's fault y'all prefer People to the The Economist and "The O'Reilly Factor" to "The McLaughlin Group."
There's plenty of calm, measured and objective material out there if you're willing to look for it. If you're like most people, you aren't looking.
It's a bit like blaming 7-11 for selling Big Gulps instead of sensible servings of pomengranate juice. Media outlets know exactly what you're watching/clicking on and when, and they're going to respond to those habits.

Yes, the media is to blame on some of this stuff.  They sensationalize an agenda and push an agenda.  They put the right hucksters on tv, give them the platform, etc.  Absolutely they are partially culpable.  Amazing how prescient many of them are about what happened when they have no idea, but that isn't going to stop them from inserting their opinion as fact and drumming up business....or in this case, drumming up hatred, votes, etc, all under the guise of moving forward....progress.

[GGGG]

That's the crazy part.  From the above reports, it would appear that a professional, out-of-town protester got some folks together and took over a private college campus with demands that .. we're met!   

I get how .. SLU is a Jesuit institution and they do have an underlying mission to help the poor, disenfranchised, minority, etc, folks .. so I can see how they could be "on the same page" or at least "reading the same book" as the protesters .. But wow, that sure seems like extortion to me.

One would think SLU's agreement would be a playbook for the protesters to just move to another private / catholic / religious school and re-enact that episode, make the same demands that worked at SLU and the victim college would be hard pressed to fight it.

So the SLU president was really faced with three choices.  Call the police and get the protesters forcibly removed from campus.  Continue ignoring them and having a group of people living in the heart of your campus.  Or signing this document, which frankly doesn't include anything remarkable.

I'm not saying he did the right thing, but it's not as though he committed a great deal of university resources to sign this.  I bet half this stuff they already do.  I can see why he made the choice he did.

[GGGG]

Except the former officers and officials of the FBI employed by the NFL weren't smart enough to pick up a phone and call the casino to ask for the Ray Rice tape.

I'm not exactly sure how this is at all relevant to what Gato is saying here.

[drewm88]

So the SLU president was really faced with three choices.  Call the police and get the protesters forcibly removed from campus.  Continue ignoring them and having a group of people living in the heart of your campus.  Or signing this document, which frankly doesn't include anything remarkable.

I'm not saying he did the right thing, but it's not as though he committed a great deal of university resources to sign this.  I bet half this stuff they already do.  I can see why he made the choice he did.

Agreed.

I'm guessing SLU saw a lot of these conditions as things they're already doing or things they could easily do (especially given lack of terms for increased funding) and potentially should be doing based on their mission and their community.

[mu_hilltopper]

So the SLU president was really faced with three choices.  Call the police and get the protesters forcibly removed from campus.  Continue ignoring them and having a group of people living in the heart of your campus.  Or signing this document, which frankly doesn't include anything remarkable.

I'm not saying he did the right thing, but it's not as though he committed a great deal of university resources to sign this.  I bet half this stuff they already do.  I can see why he made the choice he did.

Your assessment is the same as mine.   Although there's /some/ amount of money and effort that SLU will need to put forth.  Again .. their missions line up, so it's not that big of a deal, but still. 

[mu03eng]

So the SLU president was really faced with three choices.  Call the police and get the protesters forcibly removed from campus.  Continue ignoring them and having a group of people living in the heart of your campus.  Or signing this document, which frankly doesn't include anything remarkable.

I'm not saying he did the right thing, but it's not as though he committed a great deal of university resources to sign this.  I bet half this stuff they already do.  I can see why he made the choice he did.

I think it's extortion plain and simple, and to Topper's point earlier....what prevents a group from doing the same thing at MU?  Granted you would have to have a larger controversy (ala Ferguson) to come in under to make it less arbitrary, but this could be a template.

I don't have an issue with the social cause ultimately served here by the agreement, they are noble causes.  However, I have multiple issues in the manner it which it was "forced" and the underhanded nature by which the university leadership went about it.

What would the SLU president have done had a group of students started protesting in chemistry building because of student debt, and they dangled the hook of "well we'll stop protesting if our protest group gets better funding, or our grades are improved one letter grade"?  I recognize it is an imperfect comparison, but I think it conveys the point.

Additionally, while the funding is minimal, where is it going to come from?  Is another program going to have funding reduced to support this agreement?  If so, can anyone with enough media leverage come in and demand funding changes at the university?

Lastly, was this whole episode conducted in an intellectually and academically honest way?  Is this an example of leadership we would want to pass on to the next generation currently enrolled at the university?

[Henry Sugar]

I think it's extortion plain and simple, and to Topper's point earlier....what prevents a group from doing the same thing at MU?  Granted you would have to have a larger controversy (ala Ferguson) to come in under to make it less arbitrary, but this could be a template.

A physicist, a chemist, and an economist were stranded on a desert island with no implements and a can of food. The physicist and the chemist each devised an ingenious mechanism for getting the can open; the economist merely said, "Assume we have a can opener".

[GooooMarquette]

What gets me is that Furgeson is 60+ percent black. They should change things by voting in those folks who they think will make their community represent them and hopefully better for all....but they have not.

Agreed.  This was pointed out in an editorial (NYTimes?) shortly after the shooting.  The writer justifiably put some of the blame on the black citizens of Ferguson for not running for elected office and/or voting for their preferred candidates.  The "we're an oppressed minority" argument rings more true when a group actually is a minority.

In the small picture (the shooting), the citizens might be right in protesting...but they lose credibility by protesting the bigger picture of other supposed abuses by those in charge.

[GooooMarquette]

Your assessment is the same as mine.   Although there's /some/ amount of money and effort that SLU will need to put forth.  Again .. their missions line up, so it's not that big of a deal, but still.  

I agree with this.  My main criticism of SLU leadership was misrepresenting what was happening to the university community (including parents).

Let's just hope SLU's African Studies department is run better than UNC's was....

[reinko]

How many of us, have decried college kids and current parents of college kids of being too nurturing, over protective, helicoptoring, giving every kid a trophy...

And all of sudden, a few people show up in tents and it's like WWIII.

[drewm88]

How many of us, have decried college kids and current parents of college kids of being too nurturing, over protective, helicoptoring, giving every kid a trophy...

And all of sudden, a few people show up in tents and it's like WWIII.

+1

[mu_hilltopper]

I've read a number of reports .. it would appear that the vast majority of those protesters weren't college kids.    So .. I don't think those comments apply.  Generally, they were not students.

From downtown STL to Ferguson is about the same distance as downtown MKE to Brown Deer.  If there was a Ferguson episode in Brown Deer and 100 Brown Deerites / out-of-town protesters encamped for 6 days @ Marquette during mid-semester break (like at SLU) .. not good.

[source?]

To maybe steer this away from Locked Land, what would the expectations of the board be for President Lovell should something like this occur at MU?  Is the deal cut acceptable if it was above board, or is making a deal with "protesters" an issue in of itself?

I personally would hope MU would (1) Have the police remove any non-student protesters. (2) Have the police remove any student protesters who harass other students [this was during mid-terms and there are videos of the protesters harassing students]. (3) If any demands are being made they should be done in a public way. This not only clarifies the position of the protesters, but keeps the university from being extorted as it appears happened at SLU.

I don't care whether the agreement was reasonable. It was not reasonable for a group to take advantage of an unrelated situation to extort a private institution.

[reinko]

I've read a number of reports .. it would appear that the vast majority of those protesters weren't college kids.    So .. I don't think those comments apply.  Generally, they were not students.

From downtown STL to Ferguson is about the same distance as downtown MKE to Brown Deer.  If there was a Ferguson episode in Brown Deer and 100 Brown Deerites / out-of-town protesters encamped for 6 days @ Marquette during mid-semester break (like at SLU) .. not good.

To each their own, everything I have read on this board and in the articles posted is how upset the parents are.  The parents weren't informed.  The parents, the parents, the parents.  SLU dealt with it, and by and large sounds like they handled it pretty damn well, and the students played a role in helping the admin seemed to act with maturity as well.  It seems like the only people huffing and puffing are media members and the select parents of kids @ SLU the media looks for to support their narrative, and people inventing narratives that start with "what happens if that happens (insert school)

[314warrior]

So the SLU president was really faced with three choices.  Call the police and get the protesters forcibly removed from campus.  Continue ignoring them and having a group of people living in the heart of your campus.  Or signing this document, which frankly doesn't include anything remarkable.

I'm not saying he did the right thing, but it's not as though he committed a great deal of university resources to sign this.  I bet half this stuff they already do.  I can see why he made the choice he did.

I agree.  Most action items probably align with current initiatives, and they all fit with SLU's mission.  I think university administrations frequently make these kinds of concessions to protests around race issues.  I'm out in California, and it seems like UC schools do this all the time. 

I think MU would behave similarly - offer to strengthen the school's connection and support of the surrounding community.  Hauling protestors off campus in police vans would be a terrible PR image.  Much more costly than a few constructive steps.

Side note: I wonder why the protestors didn't hit up Wash U.  Lots more money to be found on that campus if you're looking for some new outreach programs and a beefed up African Studies program.

[warriorchick]

I agree.  Most action items probably align with current initiatives, and they all fit with SLU's mission.  I think university administrations frequently make these kinds of concessions to protests around race issues.  I'm out in California, and it seems like UC schools do this all the time. 

I think MU would behave similarly - offer to strengthen the school's connection and support of the surrounding community.  Hauling protestors off campus in police vans would be a terrible PR image.  Much more costly than a few constructive steps.

Side note: I wonder why the protestors didn't hit up Wash U.  Lots more money to be found on that campus if you're looking for some new outreach programs and a beefed up African Studies program.

I think Al Sharpton's beeper just went off.

[314warrior]

I think Al Sharpton's beeper just went off.

Doubtful.  He probably doesn't like to cross paths with the Anti-Defamation League.

[GGGG]

I think it's extortion plain and simple, and to Topper's point earlier....what prevents a group from doing the same thing at MU?  Granted you would have to have a larger controversy (ala Ferguson) to come in under to make it less arbitrary, but this could be a template.

I don't have an issue with the social cause ultimately served here by the agreement, they are noble causes.  However, I have multiple issues in the manner it which it was "forced" and the underhanded nature by which the university leadership went about it.

What would the SLU president have done had a group of students started protesting in chemistry building because of student debt, and they dangled the hook of "well we'll stop protesting if our protest group gets better funding, or our grades are improved one letter grade"?  I recognize it is an imperfect comparison, but I think it conveys the point.

Additionally, while the funding is minimal, where is it going to come from?  Is another program going to have funding reduced to support this agreement?  If so, can anyone with enough media leverage come in and demand funding changes at the university?

Lastly, was this whole episode conducted in an intellectually and academically honest way?  Is this an example of leadership we would want to pass on to the next generation currently enrolled at the university?

What would you have done if you were the SLU president?

[Benny B]

What would you have done if you were the SLU president?

Hire Larry Williams as Athletic Director and Sergeant-At-Arms.

[Lighthouse 84]

Included in this link Is a clip of a protester at SLU a week ago:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/10/ferguson-protest-leader-raps-about-slapping-choking-raping-white-women-video/

Am I wrong or did the guy steal this bit from 1975-6?

http://youtu.be/vKXZCbpYgSo

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'll admit, I haven't been paying any attention to the situation. But is there no chance that there is any tampering or falsifying of the "forensics" or official statements, etc.? It wouldn't be the first attempt at a cover-up in a high profile situation

From CNN tonight.....imagine if they would have actually balanced the story from day one instead of months later.  Sigh


"In recent days, The New York Times received information from a federal source and the St. Louis Post-Dispatch was given Brown's autopsy report and spoke to a source with knowledge of the investigation. The Washington Post, meanwhile, reported that at least six black witnesses gave grand jury testimony that supported Wilson's side of the story."

[mu03eng]

What would you have done if you were the SLU president?

I would have disclosed what was going on and probably had an open dialogue with the protesters in front of the cameras.  I also would have waited them out a little bit, make them protest for a while before engaging to see if they are committed.

It's kind of like the filibuster thing in Congress.  If you want to filibuster, fine do it, don't just talk about it and have everyone follow along simply because you said you would filibuster.

[Benny B]

I would have disclosed what was going on and probably had an open dialogue with the protesters in front of the cameras.  I also would have waited them out a little bit, make them protest for a while before engaging to see if they are committed.

It's kind of like the filibuster thing in Congress.  If you want to filibuster, fine do it, don't just talk about it and have everyone follow along simply because you said you would filibuster.

Sounds like the good basis for an episode of Most Extreme Elimination Challenge to me.

[mu03eng]

Sounds like the good basis for an episode of Most Extreme Elimination Challenge to me.

Man, I kinda miss that show.  I remember reading a USA Today in an airport as they breathlessly described that as where television would go for the next 10 years.  I think it was off the air a year later.

[Benny B]

Man, I kinda miss that show.  I remember reading a USA Today in an airport as they breathlessly described that as where television would go for the next 10 years.  I think it was off the air a year later.

And not surprisingly, television indeed went there.

[GGGG]

I would have disclosed what was going on and probably had an open dialogue with the protesters in front of the cameras.  I also would have waited them out a little bit, make them protest for a while before engaging to see if they are committed.

It's kind of like the filibuster thing in Congress.  If you want to filibuster, fine do it, don't just talk about it and have everyone follow along simply because you said you would filibuster.

OK that's a fair answer.  In other words you would have basically waited longer.

[mu03eng]

OK that's a fair answer.  In other words you would have basically waited longer.

Correct.  And to be fair to the prez, while I don't think this was done with integrity I do think from a PR perspective it was smart.  This doesn't have any legs, some SLU parents will be enraged for a while but it will go very quickly and quietly into the good night.  Not even the angry radio crowd is going to go after this with much if any fervor.

SLU pays a little bit of tribute and moves right along.