OT: Calipari Gets $500,000 as NCAA Student Must Change Water

[brandx]

 

Why doesn't music major Sally get to go home to Alaska...or student athlete Ben, who happens to play volleyball and not basketball?

You know why that is a bogus argument. Why don't teachers make $20 mil a year like some athletes? They are much more important to society.

We need to remember this post going forward - Chicos arguing for socialism. Never thought I'd see it 

[Tugg Speedman]

Totally disagree.  It won't happen.  What can those players offer that lesser players who would simply accept a scholarship and play?

You have to address the leverage that they would have as a Union.  I dont see any.

180 degrees wrong.  The players have all the leverage and the schools and NCAA have virtually  none.

The schools want us to believe they are amateurs, and history shows if you crush a movement like this ("tell them to pound sand") they are martyrs and the schools and the NCAA are toast.  NU will unionize and many more will follow.

Above Chicos ranted about what the union wanted.  Well I set him up ... the list I put up was not the union demands but what the power conferences are willing to give them to NOT start a union.

Kain Cotler has already won.  We're just toting up the size of the victory.

Here is the story of what the schools are ready to give to stop a union.  All the stuff you told them to pound sand over.

So who has the leverage?



http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/24509028/document-details-effort-for-autonomy-among-five-power-conferences

Document details effort for autonomy among power conferences
March 31, 2014 2:33 pm ET

CBSSports.com has obtained a document detailing NCAA rules the power conferences would seek to change or amend in upcoming governance discussions.

The broad outline more formally recognizes those five conferences' desire to adjust rules dealing with agent contact, limits on coaching staff size and scholarship renewal.

According to sources, the document was distributed to college leaders by Wake Forest president Nathan Hatch, chair of the NCAA Steering Committee for Governance. That committee is overseeing the autonomy discussion among those five conferences – Big 12, Pac-12, SEC, ACC and Big Ten.

“I think what was reflected in that memo is a growing consensus,” Pac-12 commissioner Larry Scott said. “I think we're going to get there.”

Among the topics addressed in what is labeled an “Attachment to Memorandum”:

-- A lifetime opportunity fund that would allow former players to complete their education after leaving school. It would benefit players who depart early for the draft or who don't graduate after their eligibility expires.

This point was mentioned specifically by Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany last summer.

-- Provide full cost of attendance to players. This long-discussed topic seems to a certainty in the future. Players would be given a prescribed amount extra in living expenses based on the cost of living in the particular college town.

-- Redefine rules governing agents. That's a preference of SEC commissioner Mike Slive. While Slive hasn't been specific about what those changes would be, assume that new rules would allow more contact with agents while players are in school.

Slive often uses the example of students in other majors having access to experts in that field. Why shouldn't an athlete be given the same advantages of a concert pianist who consults with great composer?

-- Meet the healthy, safety and nutritional needs of players.

Those first four bullet items had been previously mentioned among the commissioners.

New to the memorandum are these points the commissioners may want to change “if future circumstances warrant revision." …

-- Addressing scholarships that are reduced, cancelled or not renewed at the whim of a coach. Coaches have been criticized for promising a full-ride in recruiting then have the power to cancel scholarships on a year-to-year basis.

In 1973, the NCAA went from four-year scholarships to one-year renewable scholarships.

-- Provide paid transportation for parents for official recruiting visits to championship events. (College Football Playoff, NCAA Tournament, bowls etc.)

-- Rescinding rules that inhibit a player's desire to pursue a non-athletic career. A Minnesota wrestler was declared ineligible last year because he posted music videos of himself online. NCAA rules prohibit a player from using his name or image for commercial use.

That rule seems to going away one way or another. Players' rights to their image and likeness are at the heart of the O'Bannon lawsuit.

-- Permit schools or players to get loans regarding “career-related” insurance.

-- Policies regarding athletes' time demands. Northwestern players were allowed to unionize, in part, because a National Labor Relations Board official concluded that players do devote at least 40 hours per week to their sport.

-- More flexible transfer rules.

At the January NCAA Convention, 70 percent of those at a governance dialogue voting in a straw poll were not against the five conferences gaining voting power in the legislative process.

"I've been impressed with the degree of alignment throughout Division I for allowing autonomy," Scott said. “There is a recognition that has evolved for schools that have more resources up to the cost of attendance."

The commissioners of those leagues began publicly lobbying last summer for voting autonomy. They want rules that fit the high-end stakeholders in college football and basketball (their schools). They also seek enhanced student-athlete welfare.

Last week, that steering committee advocated the addition of an AD, an athlete and faculty-athletic representative in the new governance system. Those new additions would have voting power and be part of a new legislative group called the "The Council." As a whole, The Council would be made up of reps from the 32 Division I conferences and two athletes.

The 34 members would have votes, but those votes would be weighted. The five power conferences would have 37 percent of the vote. No Division I entity would have a majority of the vote.

Several big five ADs and commissioners have advocated more representation at the decision-making level.

[Hards Alumni]

180 degrees wrong.  The players have all the leverage and the schools and NCAA have virtually  none.

The schools want us to believe they are amateurs, and history shows if you crush a movement like this ("tell them to pound sand") they are martyrs and the schools and the NCAA are toast.  NU will unionize and many more will follow.

Above Chicos ranted about what the union wanted.  Well I set him up ... the list I put up was not the union demands but what the power conferences are willing to give them to NOT start a union.

Kain Cotler has already won.  We're just toting up the size of the victory.

Here is the story of what the schools are ready to give to stop a union.  All the stuff you told them to pound sand over.

So who has the leverage?



http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/24509028/document-details-effort-for-autonomy-among-five-power-conferences

Document details effort for autonomy among power conferences
March 31, 2014 2:33 pm ET

CBSSports.com has obtained a document detailing NCAA rules the power conferences would seek to change or amend in upcoming governance discussions.

The broad outline more formally recognizes those five conferences' desire to adjust rules dealing with agent contact, limits on coaching staff size and scholarship renewal.

According to sources, the document was distributed to college leaders by Wake Forest president Nathan Hatch, chair of the NCAA Steering Committee for Governance. That committee is overseeing the autonomy discussion among those five conferences – Big 12, Pac-12, SEC, ACC and Big Ten.

“I think what was reflected in that memo is a growing consensus,” Pac-12 commissioner Larry Scott said. “I think we're going to get there.”

Among the topics addressed in what is labeled an “Attachment to Memorandum”:

-- A lifetime opportunity fund that would allow former players to complete their education after leaving school. It would benefit players who depart early for the draft or who don't graduate after their eligibility expires.

This point was mentioned specifically by Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany last summer.

-- Provide full cost of attendance to players. This long-discussed topic seems to a certainty in the future. Players would be given a prescribed amount extra in living expenses based on the cost of living in the particular college town.

-- Redefine rules governing agents. That's a preference of SEC commissioner Mike Slive. While Slive hasn't been specific about what those changes would be, assume that new rules would allow more contact with agents while players are in school.

Slive often uses the example of students in other majors having access to experts in that field. Why shouldn't an athlete be given the same advantages of a concert pianist who consults with great composer?

-- Meet the healthy, safety and nutritional needs of players.

Those first four bullet items had been previously mentioned among the commissioners.

New to the memorandum are these points the commissioners may want to change “if future circumstances warrant revision." …

-- Addressing scholarships that are reduced, cancelled or not renewed at the whim of a coach. Coaches have been criticized for promising a full-ride in recruiting then have the power to cancel scholarships on a year-to-year basis.

In 1973, the NCAA went from four-year scholarships to one-year renewable scholarships.

-- Provide paid transportation for parents for official recruiting visits to championship events. (College Football Playoff, NCAA Tournament, bowls etc.)

-- Rescinding rules that inhibit a player's desire to pursue a non-athletic career. A Minnesota wrestler was declared ineligible last year because he posted music videos of himself online. NCAA rules prohibit a player from using his name or image for commercial use.

That rule seems to going away one way or another. Players' rights to their image and likeness are at the heart of the O'Bannon lawsuit.

-- Permit schools or players to get loans regarding “career-related” insurance.

-- Policies regarding athletes' time demands. Northwestern players were allowed to unionize, in part, because a National Labor Relations Board official concluded that players do devote at least 40 hours per week to their sport.

-- More flexible transfer rules.

At the January NCAA Convention, 70 percent of those at a governance dialogue voting in a straw poll were not against the five conferences gaining voting power in the legislative process.

"I've been impressed with the degree of alignment throughout Division I for allowing autonomy," Scott said. “There is a recognition that has evolved for schools that have more resources up to the cost of attendance."

The commissioners of those leagues began publicly lobbying last summer for voting autonomy. They want rules that fit the high-end stakeholders in college football and basketball (their schools). They also seek enhanced student-athlete welfare.

Last week, that steering committee advocated the addition of an AD, an athlete and faculty-athletic representative in the new governance system. Those new additions would have voting power and be part of a new legislative group called the "The Council." As a whole, The Council would be made up of reps from the 32 Division I conferences and two athletes.

The 34 members would have votes, but those votes would be weighted. The five power conferences would have 37 percent of the vote. No Division I entity would have a majority of the vote.

Several big five ADs and commissioners have advocated more representation at the decision-making level.

Sorry, I just live in reality.  In what reality do amateur athletes have any leverage? 

Player A is a great player, and decides to be in the Union and has a chance to go pro.

Player B is a great player, and decides to NOT be in the Union and has a chance to go pro.

Player C is an okay player, and decides to be in the Union and has no chance to go pro.

Player D is an okay player, and decides to NOT be in the Union and has no chance to go pro.

Consequences:

Player A gets locked out because the NCAA won't negotiate with the Union... Player A ages, losing MILLIONS of dollars in potential pro salary, has to pay to attend school.

Player B gets his scholarship, plays in games, impresses scouts, and turns pro.

Player C gets locked out because the NCAA won't negotiate with the Union... Player C ages, loses nothing because he isn't going pro anyway, but has to attend school and pay off his scholarship... basically he becomes an everyday student.

Player D gets his scholarship, plays in game, and graduates with no debt.

Do you honestly believe that that players are all going to band together and skip out on the chance of their life to turn pro?  Not a chance.

What can the players do to force others to join the Union?  Nothing.

If the NCAA locks out the Unionized players what can the Union do?  Nothing.  The NCAA can find replacement players.

[Tugg Speedman]

Sorry, I just live in reality.  In what reality do amateur athletes have any leverage? 

Player A is a great player, and decides to be in the Union and has a chance to go pro.

Player B is a great player, and decides to NOT be in the Union and has a chance to go pro.

Player C is an okay player, and decides to be in the Union and has no chance to go pro.

Player D is an okay player, and decides to NOT be in the Union and has no chance to go pro.

Consequences:

Player A gets locked out because the NCAA won't negotiate with the Union... Player A ages, losing MILLIONS of dollars in potential pro salary, has to pay to attend school.

Player B gets his scholarship, plays in games, impresses scouts, and turns pro.

Player C gets locked out because the NCAA won't negotiate with the Union... Player C ages, loses nothing because he isn't going pro anyway, but has to attend school and pay off his scholarship... basically he becomes an everyday student.

Player D gets his scholarship, plays in game, and graduates with no debt.

Do you honestly believe that that players are all going to band together and skip out on the chance of their life to turn pro?  Not a chance.

What can the players do to force others to join the Union?  Nothing.

If the NCAA locks out the Unionized players what can the Union do?  Nothing.  The NCAA can find replacement players.

In the other thread we talked about how Uthoff wanted to transfer and Bo was too restrictive and made to look bad.

Here is reality ... any school, and I mean any school that locks out a player will see the following

* Human cry about the unfairness (the vast majority of the public will side with the players).

* The school is portrayed as a Slave Camp on the cover of Time

* The admission director tells the BoT that he/she cannot conceive of a worse situation to kill student applications

* All this will lead to the head coach and AD resigning before the following Saturday

* The debate will be if the President of the University should reign.  He/she probably goes too.

So who has the leverage?  They are daring the university to lock them out.  The first school to do this will lose in so many ways they you cannot count them all.  The union will win over and over and over.

This is the worst possbile advice.  The schools know this which is why they are caving and trying to give into the demands to prevent the union from creating in the first place.

[ChicosBailBonds]

You know why that is a bogus argument. Why don't teachers make $20 mil a year like some athletes? They are much more important to society.

We need to remember this post going forward - Chicos arguing for socialism. Never thought I'd see it 

Who said teachers are more important to society?   

[mikekinsellaMVP]

Sorry, I just live in reality.  In what reality do amateur athletes have any leverage?

How about the reality of Marquette basketball?  People want to argue the value is in the name on the front, not on the back.  That's partially true.  But look back through the posts from this season, with people complaining about who got playing time and how that affected the season's outcome, followed by threats not to renew season tickets.  The name on the front may be why I'm interested, but the combination of the names on the back is what provides us with a quality product.  I don't mean to be harsh, but why isn't women's basketball a revenue sport?

As much as you think otherwise, I suspect your player B would be a rarity.  He knows his skill is a valuable commodity, and something he can profit off of if he sticks with player A.  So that means we're gonna have a team full of player Cs.  And while they may fill the void, I guarantee fans will cry out about product quality, likely via their wallets.

I ultimately don't think they'll unionize, but I think it's foolish to close your eyes, shake your head and say it's fine the way it is.  For all the talk about reform in the last ten years, I'm glad someone finally did something that caught the NCAA's attention.

[ChicosBailBonds]

You're making a mistake in thinking this is unique to Northwestern.  They have plans to unionize dozens of programs.  See the first post, Zach Bohannon from Bucky has been on the conference call about unionizing.

Epic change is going to happen. 

I have no doubt they plan on unionizing elsewhere and just as unions have done in business, it will cost plenty.  Some programs will drop football all together...how's that for opportunities to play.  Awesome.

Do I think someone like NW will drop...no.  Is it possible that middle tier and lower tier programs that are hanging on for dear life...absolutely.

Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.

[77ncaachamps]

Here is the really interesting part according to Bilas ...

* Maintain a minimum 2.0 GPA to stay eligible (remember this is still a rule, you are still a student and expected to act like one).  And now that your getting paid, we will not provide you with counselors and special classes.  You can hire your own counselors and no more "theory of basketball" class.  If you're ineligible, we will have a damage clause and you owe the school hundreds of thousands of dollars.  So go ahead and blow off class, it will cost you a ton.

Finally, since you're getting paid, you can sign endorsement deals and sell your likeness.


I have no problem with this kind of arrangement and think MU will do just fine in this type of world.

Endorsement deals STILL need school approval as the paid student-athlete is still a representative of the university, and...

the GPA is a joke. Can be manipulated to help the University (UNC) or kick a kid out (like Creaned).

[ChicosBailBonds]

Above Chicos ranted about what the union wanted.  Well I set him up ... the list I put up was not the union demands but what the power conferences are willing to give them to NOT start a union.

Kain Cotler has already won.  We're just toting up the size of the victory.

Here is the story of what the schools are ready to give to stop a union.  All the stuff you told them to pound sand over.

So who has the leverage?

You didn't set me up at all, I said why all those things are a bad idea...and they are.  They may do it, that is their decision to make.  Guess what will happen as result, more corruption than ever, more cheating than ever and the haves will have more and the have nots will lie in ruins.

But hey, they can choose to do what they want.  I have zero doubt that there will be some "grand bargain" that comes of this and everyone will kiss the ring and say how great it is for everyone, until a few years from now when it isn't enough and the bitching continues.  Am I against everything on the list?  Not at all.  Do I have serious concerns about a bunch of it? Yes, because it has been done in the past and failed miserably.

Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.....that extends to Marquette hoops as well.  You just might get it.

[ChicosBailBonds]

In the other thread we talked about how Uthoff wanted to transfer and Bo was too restrictive and made to look bad.

Here is reality ... any school, and I mean any school that locks out a player will see the following

* Human cry about the unfairness (the vast majority of the public will side with the players).

* The school is portrayed as a Slave Camp on the cover of Time

* The admission director tells the BoT that he/she cannot conceive of a worse situation to kill student applications

* All this will lead to the head coach and AD resigning before the following Saturday

* The debate will be if the President of the University should reign.  He/she probably goes too.

So who has the leverage?  They are daring the university to lock them out.  The first school to do this will lose in so many ways they you cannot count them all.  The union will win over and over and over.

This is the worst possbile advice.  The schools know this which is why they are caving and trying to give into the demands to prevent the union from creating in the first place.

Slave camp....only a fool would buy that argument or go with that nonsense.  Ask the other students on campus if student athletes are working the slave camps with all their tutors, free tuition, free clothes, trips to some great places (bowl games, Maui Classic, etc), television exposure, alumni giving them $100 hand shakes.  Yeah, those slaves.

How do schools without solid athletic departments survive and prosper?  Those darn student admissions.

[Tugg Speedman]

Billy Packer with some interesting comments.

I especially like him tearing tOSU AD Gene Smith a new one over his bonus detailed in the first post above.  If he can get a $18,000 bonus for a wrestler winning a championship, it really blows up the idea that their is no money after football and basketball.  

Also, his "out of control" remark is consistent with my "broken clusterf**k" comment.  As I noted above, I start with the assumption that college athletics are broken now and a union movement can't break what's broken.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-04-04/picker-picks-florida-for-ncaa-warns-about-unionization.html

Picker Picks Florida for NCAA, Warns About Unionization
By Ryan Kerr  Apr 4, 2014 9:00 PM PT

Packer, 74, also said college athletics in general are “completely out of control.” He said a special panel should be created to investigate and make recommendations on the future of college sports.

Special Committee

“I’d like to see a committee headed up by guys like Bill Bradley,” he said, referring to the former all-American college basketball player at Princeton University, professional for the New York Knicks and former U.S. senator from New Jersey.

As an example of his concerns, Packer cited the Ohio State University athletic director receiving a bonus from the school for one of the college’s wrestlers winning the NCAA championship.

“If I’m a student athlete there, I’m saying you’ve got to be crapping me?,” Packer said. “He didn’t recruit him, he didn’t coach him, he doesn’t even know him and he’s getting a bonus on championships.”

Packer questioned the feasibility of college athletics unionizing after the National Labor Relations Board ruling last month that would allow football players Northwestern University in Evanston, Illinois, to create the first union for college athletes.

NCAA Reaction

“If I was the NCAA, I would applaud it and I would say, ‘OK, we’re going to make the 500,000 kids that participate in intercollegiate athletics employees,’” he said. “So they’ve got to understand what an employee is. It’s a person that can be fired. It’s a person that -- that basically gets paid based on performance -- and it’s also a person that we withhold taxes on them.”

The NCAA should “just take a ridiculous position to show those student athletes that there are ramifications to following somebody like the United Steelworkers,” he said.

In college basketball, Packer opposes the “one and done” rule that allows players to attend college for only a year and then turn professional. He said the rule has hurt professional basketball even more.

“In the last seven years, there have been 59 kids that have gone one and done,” he said. “Of those 59, 14 of them are now starters in the NBA, seven, you could say, have star status and nine of them aren’t even in the league,” Packer said. “The NBA has really been hurt by the one and done.”

Dominant Teams

With the one and done system, he predicted that college basketball soon will be dominated by five or six teams following the model of Kentucky coach John Calipari, who frequently recruits high school basketball all-Americans who play only one year and then go to the NBA.

He said this model has caused particular problems for perennial basketball powerhouse Duke University, the Durham, North Carolina-based school that Packer noted has been knocked out of the NCAA tournament’s first round in two of the last three years.

He also said the Atlantic Coast Conference, to which Duke belongs, in general has been hurt by the one-and-done rule.

“The ACC really hasn’t made that transition as well as some of the other conferences,” said Packer.

Although picking Florida to win, Packer highlighted Wisconsin coach Bo Ryan, who is set to make his Final Four debut after leading the Badgers to their 14th consecutive NCAA tournament appearance. Packer said that while Ryan, 66, doesn’t get the national attention he deserves, he’s one of the most respected coaches in the college ranks.

“He sticks to his fundamentals,” Packer said. “He recruits toward his program, as opposed to going out and trying to recruit stars. And he does an incredible job getting guys to play his style of basketball and the consistency by which he coaches is something to be admired.”

[Tugg Speedman]

Other schools looking to unionize and Bucky basketball mentioned as a possibility.



http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/10730058/union-says-players-other-college-teams-expressed-interest-forming-unions

Players from other universities have expressed interest in forming unions in the wake of the landmark decision last week involving the Northwestern football team, a union organizer said Friday.

Tim Waters of the United Steelworkers would not disclose the players or their schools, saying it was too early to reveal who they are. But he said they reached out following the decision last week by a regional director of the National Labor Relations Board declaring Northwestern's football players have the right to form a union.

"We're not giving out who it is or who they are, but the answer is yes," Waters said. "There's a lot of excitement out there. We've been contacted by a number of players."

A member of Wisconsin's Final Four basketball team said he participated in weekly conference calls in recent months with the union and Ramogi Huma, head of the National College Players Association, and other players. The NCPA and the steelworkers are working together on the union push, with the NCAA, Big Ten Conference and Northwestern opposing the move.

"I don't know exactly how many there were. But on average on a weekly call there were probably 10 or 20, at least," said Zach Bohannon, a reserve on the team. "So it was definitely a unique experience just hearing the concerns that players all over the country had, and then just voicing my opinion."

Northwestern players will vote April 25 on whether to become the first college athletes represented by a union. But it could be years, if ever, before college athletes are given a seat at the bargaining table to discuss things like practice hours, medical care and concussions.

Still, Waters said the publicity generated by the ruling that Northwestern football players are employees and can unionize has made more players aware that they, too, could have bargaining rights.

"We've been contacted and are taking every one of them seriously," he said. "It's a process, a long process. But leaders of teams across the country have reached out and said we support it and are interested in looking at this for our team."

Complicating any effort for the steelworkers is that the NLRB ruling only applies to private schools like Northwestern. Public schools are covered by state labor laws, and in some states public employees are not allowed to unionize at all.

Huma and the union have been working since 2000 to try and organize college players. Their goal, they say, is not to get schools to pay players but to give them bargaining rights over issues that affect their lives and could affect their health.

It wasn't, however, until after they had collected union authorization cards from a majority of players on the Northwestern football team in January that organizers announced the effort to unionize the team. Huma said Friday that was part of a strategy not to alert the NCAA or the schools in advance about any union activity.

"They've been very out front all along that they don't want any change like this," said Huma, a former UCLA linebacker.

Bohannon said he learned about the NCPA last summer from a former Wisconsin player, Jared Berggren, who suggested he get on the organization's email list. That led to his participation, beginning in the fall, in a weekly conference call with organizers and players from other schools, he said.

" It was just an hour weekly conference call and we talked about different issues that we found with the NCAA, what we can do going forward as student-athletes to help," Bohannon said.

Bohannon, who is in his final year of eligibility, said he wasn't necessarily advocating for a union but wanted athletes to have more rights.

"Being a Republican, I don't like the whole unionization thing, I don't think that's probably the best option," he said. "But right now it's really, there's not many other options for our student-athletes, so I think it got the necessary publicity that we need, and hopefully the NCAA listens to some of our voices."

[ChicosBailBonds]

Zach Bohannon better be careful, the lunatics in Madison might have a sit in right in front of his apartment or dorm room.

[77ncaachamps]

Is Collins's job at risk because of the possible unionization?
Is he on record for supporting it?

[Tugg Speedman]

Is Collins's job at risk because of the possible unionization?
Is he on record for supporting it?

Not the basketball team, the football team, head coach Pat Fitzgerald is fine.

They are treating it like all campus protests, no matter how loopy or stupid it may be (see the Dartmouth President getting locked out of his office this week by a sit-in for "gender and social justice") they will respect it and the left-leaning professors (read all of them) are actually encouraging it.  Kain Colter is a hero in Evanston.

This is why their will never ever ever ever be a lock out like Hards wants, the universities are caving to the union now and will continue to cave until the union gets everything go it wants.

Like I said before, Kain Cotler has won, the only question is the size of the victory.  And with it will be a radical change in College sports.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Colter hasn't won a damn thing yet.  Slow down.


What Packer was suggesting is exactly what I said last week....you want to unionize and get those perks, fine.  Here you go ladies...that scholarship is now taxed.  You don't perform...bye bye.  Etc, etc.  Lots of ways to play this.

These kids (unions in general) want their cake and eat it too, which is why they ultimately fail.  At some point other people's money can't keep them afloat. 

This has a long long way to go. 

[Tugg Speedman]

Colter hasn't won a damn thing yet.  Slow down.


What Packer was suggesting is exactly what I said last week....you want to unionize and get those perks, fine.  Here you go ladies...that scholarship is now taxed.  You don't perform...bye bye.  Etc, etc.  Lots of ways to play this.

These kids (unions in general) want their cake and eat it too, which is why they ultimately fail.  At some point other people's money can't keep them afloat.  

This has a long long way to go.  

Their won't be a union ... See the link above, which you discussed.  The power conferences are essentially proposing to change the rules to the pro-union forces everything they want.  What is not said, but implied, is they will give them everything in change for no union.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Their won't be a union ... See the link above, which you discussed.  The power conferences are essentially proposing to change the rules to the pro-union forces everything they want.  What is not said, but implied, is they will give them everything in change for no union.

If that is the case, the power conferences are stupid beyond repair.  Because as is the case always, its never enough.  Give an inch, they will take a mile.  They will threaten again in a few years, and demand more.  And again, and demand more...so on and so forth.

Call their bluff.  You want to unionize, unionize and here come the consequences of doing so.

[Tugg Speedman]

If that is the case, the power conferences are stupid beyond repair.  Because as is the case always, its never enough.  Give an inch, they will take a mile.  They will threaten again in a few years, and demand more.  And again, and demand more...so on and so forth.

Call their bluff.  You want to unionize, unionize and here come the consequences of doing so.

Their a bunch of lefties ... Why didn't the president of Dartmouth send in the cops with billy clubs to get his office back?  That's what they do, cave and cave and cave.

[Coleman]

Their a bunch of lefties ... Why didn't the president of Dartmouth send in the cops with billy clubs to get his office back?  That's what they do, cave and cave and cave.

THEY'RE

[ChicosBailBonds]

Well, if these power conferences have given in, I wonder why Fitzgerald is urging his players to vote against it since this is all a #done deal

http://espn.go.com/chicago/college-football/story/_/id/10734087/pat-fitzgerald-urges-northwestern-wildcats-players-vote-union

[brandx]

Colter hasn't won a damn thing yet.  Slow down.
 

These kids (unions in general) want their cake and eat it too, which is why they ultimately fail.  At some point other people's money can't keep them afloat. 
 

Just as college prez's want to have their cake and eat it too

[ChicosBailBonds]

Just as college prez's want to have their cake and eat it too

Some, absolutely.   Those losing money in athletics and having to subsidize the athletic department with student fees, etc...not so much.

[MUsoxfan]

Some, absolutely.   Those losing money in athletics and having to subsidize the athletic department with student fees, etc...not so much.

Serious question....

If the colleges consistently lose so much money on athletics, why wouldn't they trim or cut their programs? Seems to me, that if I was in charge of something that's bleeding my budget dry, I'd eliminate the cost

[ChicosBailBonds]

Serious question....

If the colleges consistently lose so much money on athletics, why wouldn't they trim or cut their programs? Seems to me, that if I was in charge of something that's bleeding my budget dry, I'd eliminate the cost

For some, it is a matter of pride.  They've had a football team for 75 years and they don't want to let it go.  For others, it is a matter of staying at the D1 level.  You need a certain number of sports to be allowed to play D1.  MU, was at the lowest limit allowed prior to adding LAX.  If MU were to drop one sport, we could not stay at D1 at the time.  I believe the requirement is 14 sports (7 men / 7 women or 6 men / 8 women).