ESPN Team Preview: Marquette

[brewcity77]

Gardner will play more than 20 minutes per game.

I think a lot of it will be need. If we don't need Gardner for 20 minutes, will he still play it? In tight games, yes. But in blowouts, I think some of the starters will get short minutes to rest them. The only guy on the team I see playing truly heavy minutes is Jamil. Though if he plays 26 mpg, that will probably be enough to lead the team.

[GGGG]

not having NBA talent....get the heck outta here!!!!

This team has more NBA talent then any team they have had here in years if they stay 4 years! Give me a break!

Jamil Wilson has NBA size and skill, so does Mayo with a big year and the others need to develop more and use all of their eligibility.

The question was whether they have "obvious" NBA talent, and I don't think either of the players you mention do.  Jamil may have a great year, but while he has NBA size, I don't think he has NBA skill.  Not enough foot-speed and too inconsistent a shot. 

And Todd Mayo?  There isn't much room in the NBA for a 6'3" guard who can't play PG and shoots 33% from the college three.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Here's my starting five:

PG De. Wilson (25 mpg)
SG Mayo (25 mpg)
SF J. Wilson (32 mpg)
PF McKay (22 mpg)
C Otule (15 mpg)

And my guess at primary guys off the bench:

Gardner (20 mpg)
Anderson (18 mpg)
Taylor (15 mpg)
Du. Wilson (10 mpg)
Thomas (8 mpg)
Burton (5 mpg)
Johnson (4 mpg)
Dawson (1 mpg)

You really think the highest rated recruit we have gotten since Doc Rivers (JJJ) will only get 4 minutes off the bench? People are sleeping on him way too much. He's been on everyone's preseason Big East Freshman of the Year short list. Vander Blue, whose rating was close to JJJ's but lower got 19 minutes a game his freshmen year despite struggling. Granted, this team is better than that one, but there is no way that JJJ does not get at least 15 minutes a game. I honestly think he will get the lion's share of the minutes at shooting guard. Maybe Mayo will prove me wrong but I have seen nothing from his game to give me a great amount of confidence.

I respect your opinion. You are right that Buzz definitely rewards seniority and that freshmen tend to struggle. But we have never had freshmen like these. They will be competing for starter's minutes from day one. Honestly, I love that we have this problem. We are so deep that we have no idea how everyone who deserves minutes will get them.

[GGGG]

You really think the highest rated recruit we have gotten since Doc Rivers (JJJ) will only get 4 minutes off the bench? People are sleeping on him way too much. He's been on everyone's preseason Big East Freshman of the Year short list. Vander Blue, whose rating was close to JJJ's but lower got 19 minutes a game his freshmen year despite struggling. Granted, this team is better than that one, but there is no way that JJJ does not get at least 15 minutes a game. I honestly think he will get the lion's share of the minutes at shooting guard. Maybe Mayo will prove me wrong but I have seen nothing from his game to give me a great amount of confidence.

I respect your opinion. You are right that Buzz definitely rewards seniority and that freshmen tend to struggle. But we have never had freshmen like these. They will be competing for starter's minutes from day one. Honestly, I love that we have this problem. We are so deep that we have no idea how everyone who deserves minutes will get them.

Vander was also a fantastic defender and rebounder for his position.

That being said, it really is going to depend on how well he shoots versus how well Mayo shoots.  I tend to think that 25 for Mayo is probably right, but I think JJJ will get more like 8 or 10.  I don't see any reason why Thomas would get that much.  He had one basket during the BE season last year.

[Brewtown Andy]

Disagreed. From February 6 through the end of the year last year, Jamil averaged 11.9 ppg and was in double-digits scoring in 13 out of 15 games. He also averaged 5.3 rpg (13/15 were 4+ rebounds) and shot well from beyond the arc, 36.8% while making at least 1 three in 13/15 games. If anything, Jamil was our most consistent performer from the beginning of February through the end of the season.

That was kind of my point.

[Brewtown Andy]

I respect your opinion. You are right that Buzz definitely rewards seniority and that freshmen tend to struggle. But we have never had freshmen like these. They will be competing for starter's minutes from day one. Honestly, I love that we have this problem. We are so deep that we have no idea how everyone who deserves minutes will get them.

Where this gets interesting is that Marquette's glaring weaknesses are exactly where the freshmen fit in.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Where this gets interesting is that Marquette's glaring weaknesses are exactly where the freshmen fit in.

Pay the man

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

I don't see any reason why Thomas would get that much.  He had one basket during the BE season last year.

To Thomas' credit, it was a pretty epic basket

[PistolPete]

Here's my starting five:

PG De. Wilson (25 mpg)
SG Mayo (25 mpg)
SF J. Wilson (32 mpg)
PF McKay (22 mpg)
C Otule (15 mpg)

And my guess at primary guys off the bench:

Gardner (20 mpg)
Anderson (18 mpg)
Taylor (15 mpg)
Du. Wilson (10 mpg)
Thomas (8 mpg)
Burton (5 mpg)
Johnson (4 mpg)
Dawson (1 mpg)

I will be very surprised if Thomas logs more MPG than JJJ, or even Burton. Thomas was significant in our regular season victory over Syracuse, and helped spread the floor throughout the year (most notably on the last possession v. Davidson). Having said that, he has failed in the role he was brought here to fill. He shot an uninspired .278 3P% last year, behind Jamil (.360), Lockett (.333), Blue, who was constantly ripped on this board for his inability to shoot from the perimeter (.303), Juanito (.286), and Mayo (.279). Why McKillop chose to face-guard an unproven perimeter shooter and not double team Blue on that last possession is beyond me, but thank God for it.

I understand that JJJ and Burton are 'raw' and 'unproven'. I also understand that if they can't play Big East caliber defense, they won't see many minutes, but if I were a betting man, I'd bet they are better defenders than Thomas out of the gate.

[Lighthouse 84]

But we have never had freshmen like these. They will be competing for starter's minutes from day one.

Oh I don't know.  Seems to me in 2005-06, we had some "decent" freshmen who competed for starter's minutes from day one.  

Just sayin'

[ChicosBailBonds]

I respect your opinion. You are right that Buzz definitely rewards seniority and that freshmen tend to struggle. But we have never had freshmen like these. They will be competing for starter's minutes from day one. Honestly, I love that we have this problem. We are so deep that we have no idea how everyone who deserves minutes will get them.

Wes Matthews, Dominic James, Jerel McNeal

Damon Key, Jim McIlvaine, Logterman

Hopefully these freshmen coming in are as good as advertised.  It can be a tough transition.  For every example like the two classes above, there are examples where it took quite a few years to get rolling...some guy named Vander Blue comes to mind and he was rated higher than most of the guys above. 

[mu03eng]

This may be a cop out answer but I really think we can't predict the line up minutes.  This is the first team I think Buzz truly has all the pieces he needs to play his system.  With what Buzz has he can literally play every style of basketball so each line-up and the players that get the most minutes will change with every game. 

If he needs to go big, he can easily do that(DuWil, Juan, Jamil, Gardner, Otule)

If he needs to go defensive he can easily do that (DeWil,Mayo,Jamil,McKay or Taylor, Otule)

If he needs to go with an arc team he can easily do that (DuWil,Mayo,Jamil or JJJ,Taylor,Gardner)

If he wants rebounds and high eFG% (DeWil,Juan,Burton,Taylor,Gardner)

If he wants a jack of all trades (DuWil,Mayo,Jamil,McKay,Gardner)

I think there will be people even more frustrated with substitutions and starting line-up patterns, but Buzz is going to go with a lot of pace adjusted metrics to attack other team's weaknesses.

[GGGG]

I think there will be people even more frustrated with substitutions and starting line-up patterns, but Buzz is going to go with a lot of pace adjusted metrics to attack other team's weaknesses.

If people can't figure out why Buzz what he does with regards to substitutions by now, there really is no hope for them.

[brewcity77]

You really think the highest rated recruit we have gotten since Doc Rivers (JJJ) will only get 4 minutes off the bench?

In a word, yes. Because by looking at him and hearing reports about him, he doesn't have a body ready to compete at this level and his best attributes are on the offensive end, but if he can't play defense, he won't get into the game to showcase them. I think Johnson could end up being the best of the three top-100 freshmen long-term, but as a freshman, I think he will be the least impactful. I simply don't think he's ready to be a 15 mpg guy at this level.

In addition, it comes down to need. With the guys we have ahead of him, we just don't need him to play that kind of minutes right away. That wasn't the case with Blue or Mayo, both of whom were (in my opinion) more physically ready and showed more on the defensive end, and also didn't have the quality in front of them Johnson does now. Also, it wouldn't surprise me if Johnson was our best player as soon as his sophomore year. I just don't think it happens for him as a freshman.

That was kind of my point.

I'm clearly missing it then. Jamil was remarkably consistent the second half of this past season. If he puts together a season that follows what he did in the second half of last season with even marginal improvement, say 13 ppg, 6 rpg, and 38% from three while getting double-digits and 4+ rebounds in 85% of our contests, he is probably first or second team all league. You said Jamil has never consistently put in outstanding performances. His statlines those last 15 games show otherwise. That's a pretty long stretch to be consistent over.

[Galway Eagle]

I'm confused wasnt vander ranked higher than Johnson? I know espn ranks Johnson higher but I thought blue was a five star and Johnson a four star.

[GGGG]

I'm confused wasnt vander ranked higher than Johnson? I know espn ranks Johnson higher but I thought blue was a five star and Johnson a four star.

Scout had Vander as a four star.  Rivals had him as a five star.

No idea how each service determines who earns how many stars.

[Nukem2]

Scout had Vander as a four star.  Rivals had him as a five star.

No idea how each service determines who earns how many stars.

Looking at the RSCI composite rankings, Vander was #48 and JaJuan was #30.

[Aughnanure]

EDIT: What he said ^

[Jay Bee]

Usage in 2013-14.. Jamil.. what say you?

I hope/think he could be a 23-24% guy and STILL raise his eFG% a touch this season.

Could be a pretty stat line for him (speaking non-traditional stats... don't know if this is odd, but I rarely pay any attention to a players points per game average [directly, that is]).

[Badgerhater]

Buzz will play everybody in non-conference, play 10-11 in the early conference season and as competition permits and tighten up to 7-8 at the end of the season and into the tournaments.   The toughest and most talented at the end of the season will play 35 minutes a game.

Has happened every year.

[mu03eng]

Buzz will play everybody in non-conference, play 10-11 in the early conference season and as competition permits and tighten up to 7-8 at the end of the season and into the tournaments.   The toughest and most talented at the end of the season will play 35 minutes a game.

Has happened every year.

Disagree.  Unless injuries or or a just complete lack of progression happen, I don't think any one player will consistently see more than 32 minutes at the end of the season.  I'm sure there will be the occasional game where one player is crushing it or the match-up is just stupid good in our favor, but there is no way we underutilize our depth that way.

[brewcity77]

Disagree.  Unless injuries or or a just complete lack of progression happen, I don't think any one player will consistently see more than 32 minutes at the end of the season.  I'm sure there will be the occasional game where one player is crushing it or the match-up is just stupid good in our favor, but there is no way we underutilize our depth that way.

Jamil can play 2-5 and will be hard to take off the court. There's no one else I can see averaging 32 mpg, but I could easily see him cracking that barrier. Vander, DJO, Crowder, Jimmy (twice), Lazar, Jerel, and WesMat all averaged over 32 mpg in their last season here. Buzz usually has at least 1-2 guys he virtually never takes off the court. I think Jamil will be one. Not sure there will be another, but I'd put DeWil, Mayo, and Gardner as the most likely candidates if there is a second.

[Lennys Tap]

Oh I don't know.  Seems to me in 2005-06, we had some "decent" freshmen who competed for starter's minutes from day one.  

Just sayin'

Those guys were great, but they really didn't have to "compete" for starter's minutes. They were given out of necessity. Buzz has the program at a much higher level. Rather than fill gaping holes, freshmen have talented, more experienced guys ahead of them. Tough on the frosh, great for our program.

[mug644]

Where this gets interesting is that Marquette's glaring weaknesses are exactly where the freshmen fit in.

Which is exactly why there is so much uncertainty not only about minutes, but about wins and losses, winning the BEast, making the tournament, reaching the Sweet 16 again and on and on is particularly difficult for this year.

Wondering how Jamil Wilson and Davante will perform is tough enough, and they are relative known entities is tough enough, but needing to rely on unknown freshmen to fill in some notable weaknesses is another.

That said, this is the best thread about the season that I've read in a long time.

[humanlung]

He wasn't at the end of the season, either...

Was Vander considered an "obvious" NBA talent at the start of last season?  If not, how is this year any different from the last?