Siena, UDM, no Creighton, wtf?

[JTBMU7]

Where did any of this come from? Seems way off the mark... Surprised they are saying creighton is out too...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/catholic-7-schools-including-georgetown-charting-a-new-yet-familiar-path/2013/02/16/f1eaa870-7876-11e2-aa12-e6cf1d31106b_story.html

[tower912]

Relax.    Creighton, xavier, Butler, Dayton and SLU are all going to say yes. 

[lab_warrior]

Relax.    Creighton, xavier, Butler, Dayton and SLU are all going to say yes. 

This. 

[hoyasincebirth]

Don't listen to anything written by Feinstein. He's a BUM! He hates the Hoyas. He's the worst. He has no sources. He has no clue what he's talking about. Feinstein =BUM.

[lab_warrior]

Don't listen to anything written by Feinstein. He's a BUM! He hates the Hoyas. He's the worst. He has no sources. He has no clue what he's talking about. Feinstein =BUM.

Agreed.

Someone who hates the Hoyas = someone who I should hate. 

[Tugg Speedman]

Relax.    Creighton, xavier, Butler, Dayton and SLU are all going to say yes. 

+1

It is about money.  The C7 TV deal will offer more money.  If they say no to more money, the Board of Directors will be fired.

[keefe]

Don't listen to anything written by Feinstein. He's a BUM! He hates the Hoyas. He's the worst. He has no sources. He has no clue what he's talking about. Feinstein =BUM.

Feinstein writes books. He ain't no print journalist

[ChicosBailBonds]

Feinstein writes books. He ain't no print journalist

Plus, if he says Creighton is too far west, then Gonzaga isn't even in the discussion.   

[keefe]

Plus, if he says Creighton is too far west, then Gonzaga isn't even in the discussion.   

Like I said, Zags have been approached about interest and their saddle point was a home for Olympic sports. Not sure where it's at today. I would love for them to be a part of it and so would my bud but he's just a spectator, too.

Last I heard they were looking at offering a package of mountain state schools but haven't heard if that got traction. Not sure I want SMC, USF, BYU, LMU in the deal just to get the Zags. This will all get sorted after the Final Four and then the guessing can end and reality take over.

[ChicosBailBonds]

I'm sure they were approached.  It would be a gross error in judgment if they weren't.  I just don't see the fit for either side. To this day, I don't know who would take on their dreadful non men's basketball sports.  They just aren't good...why would another conference do that?  Also don't understand why they would put their men's hoops team through that travel gauntlet...I get more money, but they would be at a competitive disadvantage.  Just my two cents.

[warriorstrack]

Who do we believe ESPN Brett McMurphy, who said on 2/15

The new league, yet to be formed, is expected to have 12-to-14 members. The most likely candidates to join the Catholic schools, sources have told ESPN, are Butler, Xavier, Creighton, Dayton, Saint Louis, Richmond and VCU.

Or  John Feinstein?
Detroit, et al.

[Dawson Rental]

Plus, if he says Creighton is too far west, then Gonzaga isn't even in the discussion.   

Maybe Creighton will get back into the discussion as a travel partner for Gonzaga! 

[keefe]

I'm sure they were approached.  It would be a gross error in judgment if they weren't.  I just don't see the fit for either side. To this day, I don't know who would take on their dreadful non men's basketball sports.  They just aren't good...why would another conference do that?  Also don't understand why they would put their men's hoops team through that travel gauntlet...I get more money, but they would be at a competitive disadvantage.  Just my two cents.

I know they were approached because Hertz headed up the study group. The concerns were very much on the Olympic sports and I think the C7 and GU both knew that was a non-starter because of travel issues ($ and Days Out of Class.) My gut tells me GU will take a pass but I would love to see them jettison everything but Men's and Women's basketball. Of course, Hertz would kill his first born before ever cutting their baseball team.

As for Feinstein, he is not a beat journalist like Todd Rosiak who hung out in the locker room and the Al and really had his finger on the pulse of the team. Feinstein is a rock star. I saw the same thing happen with Mitch Albom at the Freep. He went from covering Michigan to writing books. The Freep wanted his byline so he was technically a staff writer though he had a lot of time away from Detroit. Feinstein is the same sort so I would not think he has the contacts within GU to get such insight.

[Dawson Rental]

Okay everybody get set to tee off.

I think that Feinstein is quite possibly spot on.

Splitting the league into midwestern and eastern divisions makes a lot of sense.

Not including public universities makes some sense.

Siena over Creighton?  Well, yeah.  Remember, in the article, Siena is being discussed as the fallback position if the league doesn't go with Richmond as the sixth member of the east division.  So, really what is being discussed is Siena vs. VCU.  If the presidents want to stay away from public schools, then VCU isn't really an option.  Since Villanova doesn't want LaSalle or St Joseph who else would there be out east?  St Bonaventure?  Canisius?  Loyola Maryland?

Creighton is 436 miles from St Louis, 470 miles from Chicago, 511 miles from Milwaukee.  Those are the three closest schools.  Not a problem for men's basketball, Olympic sports would all pretty much have to travel by plane, to avoid 7 hour plus bus trips.  Like I said, those are the close schools.

Marquette, DePaul, SLU, Butler, Xavier and Dayton form a nicely packed division with the farthest distance between two schools the 390 miles between Milwaukee and Dayton.

Detroit Mercy over Creighton?  Both are Jesuit universities.  Detroit keeps the midwest division geographically compact.  Does a decent Detroit program get better in the new league?  I don't think so.  Michigan and Michigan State are just too close to allow them to recruit effectively or to draw TV eyeballs, IMO.  So, I'd definitely go with Creighton here.  That doesn't mean that the C7 presidents agree with me, though.

Two divisions each closely packed for easier travel for teams in olympic sports.  One centered in the prime basketball recruiting areas of the midwest.  The other in a straight line along the northeastern seaboard.

All the schools private urban universities sharing similar characteristics, outlooks and challenges.  This sounds to me like something that could remain stable for a very long time.  That's an attractive quality for 7 schools fleeing the chaos of the Big East.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Okay everybody get set to tee off.

I think that Feinstein is quite possibly spot on.

Splitting the league into midwestern and eastern divisions makes a lot of sense.

Not including public universities makes some sense.

Siena over Creighton?  Well, yeah.  Remember, in the article, Siena is being discussed as the fallback position if the league doesn't go with Richmond as the sixth member of the east division.  So, really what is being discussed is Siena vs. VCU.  If the presidents want to stay away from public schools, then VCU isn't really an option.  Since Villanova doesn't want LaSalle or St Joseph who else would there be out east?  St Bonaventure?  Canisius?  Loyola Maryland?

Creighton is 436 miles from St Louis, 470 miles from Chicago, 511 miles from Milwaukee.  Those are the three closest schools.  Not a problem for men's basketball, Olympic sports would all pretty much have to travel by plane, to avoid 7 hours plus bus trips.  Like I said, those are the close schools.

Marquette, DePaul, SLU, Butler, Xavier and Dayton form a nicely packed division with the farthest distance between two schools the 390 miles between Milwaukee and Dayton.

Detroit Mercy over Creighton?  Both are Jesuit universities.  Detroit keeps the midwest division geographically compact.  Does a decent Detroit program get better in the new league?  I don't think so.  Michigan and Michigan State are just too close to allow them to recruit effectively or to draw TV eyeballs, IMO.  So, I'd definitely go with Creighton here.  That doesn't mean that the C7 presidents agree with me, though.

Two divisions each closely packed for easier travel for teams in olympic sports.  One centered in the prime basketball recruiting areas of the midwest.  The other in a straight line along the northeastern seaboard.

All the schools private urban universities sharing similar characteristics, outlooks and challenges.  This sounds to me like something that could remain stable for a very long time.  That's an attractive quality for 7 schools fleeing the chaos of the Big East.

He's flat out wrong.

[keefe]

Okay everybody get set to tee off.

I think that Feinstein is quite possibly spot on.

Splitting the league into midwestern and eastern divisions makes a lot of sense.

Not including public universities makes some sense.

Siena over Creighton?  Well, yeah.  Remember, in the article, Siena is being discussed as the fallback position if the league doesn't go with Richmond as the sixth member of the east division.  So, really what is being discussed is Siena vs. VCU.  If the presidents want to stay away from public schools, then VCU isn't really an option.  Since Villanova doesn't want LaSalle or St Joseph who else would there be out east?  St Bonaventure?  Canisius?  Loyola Maryland?

Creighton is 436 miles from St Louis, 470 miles from Chicago, 511 miles from Milwaukee.  Those are the three closest schools.  Not a problem for men's basketball, Olympic sports would all pretty much have to travel by plane, to avoid 7 hours plus bus trips.  Like I said, those are the close schools.

Marquette, DePaul, SLU, Butler, Xavier and Dayton form a nicely packed division with the farthest distance between two schools the 390 miles between Milwaukee and Dayton.

Detroit Mercy over Creighton?  Both are Jesuit universities.  Detroit keeps the midwest division geographically compact.  Does a decent Detroit program get better in the new league?  I don't think so.  Michigan and Michigan State are just too close to allow them to recruit effectively or to draw TV eyeballs, IMO.  So, I'd definitely go with Creighton here.  That doesn't mean that the C7 presidents agree with me, though.

Two divisions each closely packed for easier travel for teams in olympic sports.  One centered in the prime basketball recruiting areas of the midwest.  The other in a straight line along the northeastern seaboard.

All the schools private urban universities sharing similar characteristics, outlooks and challenges.  This sounds to me like something that could remain stable for a very long time.  That's an attractive quality for 7 schools fleeing the chaos of the Big East.

I follow your logic but I pray God that you are wrong

[MU82]

Siena and Detroit, huh? I guess that means Binghamton and UIC already declined invitations.

[Dawson Rental]

Siena and Detroit, huh? I guess that means Binghamton and UIC already declined invitations.

Siena would only be a place holder until the ACC collapsed and Duke dropped football.

UIC will not be invited because DePaul would never allow a better team from Chicago into the league.

[4everwarriors]

Well, how 'bout Slippery Rock and Wash U., then? Gotta have some bottom feeders, aina?

[keefe]

Siena and Detroit, huh? I guess that means Binghamton and UIC already declined invitations.

I can just see it - picking up the paper and reading that Siena has poached Buzz Williams from Marquette as its next head basketball coach...

[Jet915]

Sienna's AD pretty much shot it down.

“It’s always flattering when the college’s name is put in a group of schools like that,” Siena athletic director John D’Argenio said today while attending the women’s basketball game. “But it’s just somebody that wrote an article and speculates.”

D’Argenio said Siena hasn’t been contacted by representatives from any of the Catholic 7 schools.

“Nobody’s made any outreaches or overtures, and I don’t know who they’ve made outreaches or overtures to,” D’Argenio said. “But I know it’s not us.”

http://blog.timesunion.com/collegesports/siena-ad-responds-to-report-of-possible-catholic-7-invite/15440/

[tower912]

Cardinal Stritch, Loyola Chicago, and Alverno would work, by that logic. 

[Dawson Rental]

Cardinal Stritch, Loyola Chicago, and Alverno would work, by that logic. 

Under no circumstances are you to contact Georgetown President John J. DeGioia with that information.

[The Equalizer]

Siena over Creighton?  Well, yeah.  Remember, in the article, Siena is being discussed as the fallback position if the league doesn't go with Richmond as the sixth member of the east division.  So, really what is being discussed is Siena vs. VCU.  If the presidents want to stay away from public schools, then VCU isn't really an option.  Since Villanova doesn't want LaSalle or St Joseph who else would there be out east?  St Bonaventure?  Canisius?  Loyola Maryland?

Boston University or Northeastern.  Both private schools in Boston.  From both a recruting and local-alumni relations perspective for probably every team in the league, Boston would be a much better road trip than Albany.   

And it provides a small hope that the new league gets some media coverage in the #7 televsion market. 

Detroit Mercy over Creighton?  Both are Jesuit universities.  Detroit keeps the midwest division geographically compact.  Does a decent Detroit program get better in the new league?  I don't think so.  Michigan and Michigan State are just too close to allow them to recruit effectively or to draw TV eyeballs, IMO.  So, I'd definitely go with Creighton here.  That doesn't mean that the C7 presidents agree with me, though.

I think the value of recruiting in this example is not that we add Detroit Mercy so they can compete against Michigan and MSU for recruits--we add them to the league to give teams like Marquette & Georgetown & perhaps Xavier and Butler another talent-rich recruiting base.  Plus, as with BU above, every team in the league probably has more alums in Detroit than in Omaha.  Plus, thinking ahead to national sponsorships, it probably woulnd't hurt with automakers and their huge ad budgets if we had a league presence in Detroit. 

And if we get 100% attention in Omaha, its still only the #86 televison market.  Detroit is #11. 

[77ncaachamps]

Boston University or Northeastern.  Both private schools in Boston.  From both a recruting and local-alumni relations perspective for probably every team in the league, Boston would be a much better road trip than Albany.   

And it provides a small hope that the new league gets some media coverage in the #7 televsion market. 

I think the value of recruiting in this example is not that we add Detroit Mercy so they can compete against Michigan and MSU for recruits--we add them to the league to give teams like Marquette & Georgetown & perhaps Xavier and Butler another talent-rich recruiting base.  Plus, as with BU above, every team in the league probably has more alums in Detroit than in Omaha.  Plus, thinking ahead to national sponsorships, it probably woulnd't hurt with automakers and their huge ad budgets if we had a league presence in Detroit. 

And if we get 100% attention in Omaha, its still only the #86 televison market.  Detroit is #11. 

But is 100% in Omaha better than 1% in Detroit? I say yes.

It's one thing to go for television markets, and it's another to drop the prime college program in a basketball crazed city for one that is not just mediocre but struggles to get views in a city with major league teams and major state university intrusion.

[Norm]

But is 100% in Omaha better than 1% in Detroit? I say yes.

It's one thing to go for television markets, and it's another to drop the prime college program in a basketball crazed city for one that is not just mediocre but struggles to get views in a city with major league teams and major state university intrusion.

But it won't just be Detroit Mercy fans tuning in - it will be the Marquette, Xavier, DePaul, St. Louis, Georgetown and other team alums and fans watching their teams play. There are a lot of MU alumni in the Detroit area. It'll also be all the bars in the Detroit metro area having the games on, whether it's UDM or other teams in the league.

It will be hard to get the best players from the area, but a lot of great talent in Detroit and Michigan goes to play out of state. Just a few of these players over the past 25 years include:

Roy Marble (Flint Beecher) - Iowa
Derrick Coleman (Detroit Northern) - Syracuse
Doug Smith (Detroit MacKenzie) - Missouri
Marc Macon (Saginaw Bunea Vista ) - Temple
BJ Armstrong (Birmingham Brother Rice) - Iowa
Negele Knight (St. Martin DePorres) - Dayton
Willie Burton (St. Martin DePorres) - Minnesota
Voshon Leonard (Detroit Southwestern) - Minnesota
Arthur Johnson (Detroit Pershing) - Missouri
Ricky Paulding (Detroit Renaissance) - Missouri
Anthony Roberson (Saginaw) - Florida
Shane Battier (Detroit Country Day) - Duke
Brandon Jenkins (Detroit Southeastern) - Louisville
Al Horford (Grand Ledge) - Florida
Joe Crawford (Detroit Renaissance) - Kentucky
Tory Jackson (Saginaw Buena Vista) - Notre Dame
Chris Douglas-Roberts (Detroit Cass Tech) - Memphis
Malik Hairston (Detroit Renaissance) - Oregon
Donovan Kirk (Detroit Country Day) - DePaul
Amir Williams (Detroit Country Day) - Ohio State

[keefe]

But it won't just be Detroit Mercy fans tuning in - it will be the Marquette, Xavier, DePaul, St. Louis, Georgetown and other team alums and fans watching their teams play. There are a lot of MU alumni in the Detroit area. It'll also be all the bars in the Detroit metro area having the games on, whether it's UDM or other teams in the league.

It will be hard to get the best players from the area, but a lot of great talent in Detroit and Michigan goes to play out of state. Just a few of these players over the past 25 years include:

Roy Marble (Flint Beecher) - Iowa
Derrick Coleman (Detroit Northern) - Syracuse
Doug Smith (Detroit MacKenzie) - Missouri
Marc Macon (Saginaw Bunea Vista ) - Temple
BJ Armstrong (Birmingham Brother Rice) - Iowa
Negele Knight (St. Martin DePorres) - Dayton
Willie Burton (St. Martin DePorres) - Minnesota
Voshon Leonard (Detroit Southwestern) - Minnesota
Arthur Johnson (Detroit Pershing) - Missouri
Ricky Paulding (Detroit Renaissance) - Missouri
Anthony Roberson (Saginaw) - Florida
Shane Battier (Detroit Country Day) - Duke
Brandon Jenkins (Detroit Southeastern) - Louisville
Al Horford (Grand Ledge) - Florida
Joe Crawford (Detroit Renaissance) - Kentucky
Tory Jackson (Saginaw Buena Vista) - Notre Dame
Chris Douglas-Roberts (Detroit Cass Tech) - Memphis
Malik Hairston (Detroit Renaissance) - Oregon
Donovan Kirk (Detroit Country Day) - DePaul
Amir Williams (Detroit Country Day) - Ohio State

I lived in Ann Arbor when Detroit was actually in their heyday just after Dickie V left for the Pistons. Trust me when I say NOBODY in Michigan gives a sh1t about Detroit Mercy. Nobody. Detroit was actually ranked back then and the News and Freep had them buried on page 8. For Hoops it is MSU, the Pistons, UofM, and then the other state MAC schools (Eastern, Central, Western.) Detroit has a full time enrollment of appox 2,500 and is a commuter school so the kids leave campus at dusk. It is a fine liberal arts college but they would add nothing to the new conference. We can do much better in terms of athletics and TV markets.

[dgies9156]

Oh joy, Dayton is back. Maybe we can play the C-7 tournament at University of Dayton Arena for the next 200 years!

Gee, isn't that what broke up the MCC years ago?

Find a way for Creighton and Gonzaga and worry about the Dayton fill-in later!

[Norm]

So, keefe, your 2-3 years in Ann Arbor, surrounded by probably the most arrogant fan base in Michigan, makes you an expert on what the people in Michigan and Detroit care about? OK. If Detroit has a competitive team they get enough coverage in the Detroit media. They may not get as much as MSU or U of M (just like Marquette does not get as much coverage as UW), but there's enough coverage for them to do okay. And, like most other teams, when they are good they sell tickets and when they are bad, they struggles to do so. There are plenty of people in the Detroit area with a connection to the school that they could sell more tickets in a bigger and better conference.

But you missed my point completely. I'm not arguing for Detroit to be included in the league, I was just trying to show that there could be advantages overall if they were selected, mainly by getting the Marquette name more prominent among Michigan high schoolers. Even if Detroit is not the most loved team in the state, having Marquette come to the state once a year, playing in the Detroit market, having their games on TV throughout the season, can help with recruiting.

[bradley center bat]

Oakland (Mi.) gets more love than Detroit in the city.

[billyjack]

Boston University on paper might seem sensible (absolute boatloads of money, great new 6k on-campus arena right in the city near Fenway right on subway line, plus the new Boston Garden available for big crowds), but the city doesn't care about college basketball at all (yes for college hockey). 

Northeastern is below even Boston U in city interest and plays in a historic but tiny arena.

Having said that, Boston Univ should rank ahead of Siena and Detroit Mercy.

[Avenue Commons]

But it won't just be Detroit Mercy fans tuning in - it will be the Marquette, Xavier, DePaul, St. Louis, Georgetown and other team alums and fans watching their teams play. There are a lot of MU alumni in the Detroit area. It'll also be all the bars in the Detroit metro area having the games on, whether it's UDM or other teams in the league.

It will be hard to get the best players from the area, but a lot of great talent in Detroit and Michigan goes to play out of state. Just a few of these players over the past 25 years include:

Roy Marble (Flint Beecher) - Iowa
Derrick Coleman (Detroit Northern) - Syracuse
Doug Smith (Detroit MacKenzie) - Missouri
Marc Macon (Saginaw Bunea Vista ) - Temple
BJ Armstrong (Birmingham Brother Rice) - Iowa
Negele Knight (St. Martin DePorres) - Dayton
Willie Burton (St. Martin DePorres) - Minnesota
Voshon Leonard (Detroit Southwestern) - Minnesota
Arthur Johnson (Detroit Pershing) - Missouri
Ricky Paulding (Detroit Renaissance) - Missouri
Anthony Roberson (Saginaw) - Florida
Shane Battier (Detroit Country Day) - Duke
Brandon Jenkins (Detroit Southeastern) - Louisville
Al Horford (Grand Ledge) - Florida
Joe Crawford (Detroit Renaissance) - Kentucky
Tory Jackson (Saginaw Buena Vista) - Notre Dame
Chris Douglas-Roberts (Detroit Cass Tech) - Memphis
Malik Hairston (Detroit Renaissance) - Oregon
Donovan Kirk (Detroit Country Day) - DePaul
Amir Williams (Detroit Country Day) - Ohio State

What about Chris Webber, Jalen Rose.....

[Dawson Rental]

What about Chris Webber, Jalen Rose.....

They did not go out of state for school.

[Norm]

What about Chris Webber, Jalen Rose.....

They both played at University of Michigan. This list is just some of the Michigan high school players who ended up going out of state for college.

[LAMUfan]

Boston University on paper might seem sensible (absolute boatloads of money, great new 6k on-campus arena right in the city near Fenway right on subway line, plus the new Boston Garden available for big crowds), but the city doesn't care about college basketball at all (yes for college hockey). 

Northeastern is below even Boston U in city interest and plays in a historic but tiny arena.

Having said that, Boston Univ should rank ahead of Siena and Detroit Mercy.

I'd bet money that Notre Dame is the most popular CBB team in Boston

[keefe]

They did not go out of state for school.

A lot of people in Michigan say that Ann Arbor is a part of New York...

[Dawson Rental]

A lot of people in Michigan say that Ann Arbor is a part of New York...

I bet that they only say it when they are in Ann Arbor...

[MUMonster03]

Where did any of this come from? Seems way off the mark... Surprised they are saying creighton is out too...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/catholic-7-schools-including-georgetown-charting-a-new-yet-familiar-path/2013/02/16/f1eaa870-7876-11e2-aa12-e6cf1d31106b_story.html

When I see Washington Post and Sports together I take it with a grain of salt. Not where I go to get my sports news.

[Pakuni]

MU official says Post story not correct:

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/191910991.html

[keefe]

When I see Washington Post and Sports together I take it with a grain of salt. Not where I go to get my sports news.

Shirley Povich was one of the greats

[Jet915]

MU official says Post story not correct:

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/191910991.html

Seems to rule out Richmond as well.  Still think it's going to be Butler, Xavier, Creighton, SLU and Dayton which is what Thamel said and what the Providence boards are saying...

[Norm]

Seems to rule out Richmond as well.  Still think it's going to be Butler, Xavier, Creighton, SLU and Dayton which is what Thamel said and what the Providence boards are saying...

Would love to see Butler, Xavier and Creighton make it a 10 team league to start, adding St. Louis and another school to make it 12 if they want it that size. I'd rather even have Detroit or Sienna over Dayton - can't help it, I'm in the ABD camp.

[Avenue Commons]

Seems to rule out Richmond as well.  Still think it's going to be Butler, Xavier, Creighton, SLU and Dayton which is what Thamel said and what the Providence boards are saying...

I was told the same by MU source I trust. Keep in mind that there are 7 interests here and there are going to be some disagreements. Also, TV powers that be will have great sway.

[bradley center bat]

Doug Russell on AM 620 WTMJ said of this Washington Post report, ask a Marquette Sr. person and said Detroit and Siena is not in the mix.

[Zephyr820]

Richmond is getting in.  If Creighton can somehow get back into conversation, it would be at the expense of Dayton

[bradley center bat]

Why Richmond over VCU?

[Dawson Rental]

Why Richmond over VCU?

Private school over public school, similar in outlook to the rest of the league.  Also, no freedom of Information Act issues.

[bradley center bat]

Private school over public school, similar in outlook to the rest of the league.  Also, no freedom of Information Act issues.

I'll buy it.

[keefe]

Also, no freedom of Information Act issues.

Is this really a consideration?

[Dawson Rental]

Is this really a consideration?

Yup, one school subject to Freedom of Information Act requests makes the league office also subject to such requests.

[TinyTimsLittleBrother]

Yup, one school subject to Freedom of Information Act requests makes the league office also subject to such requests.

That's not really true.

However it would make any written correspondence on the conference between that member and the other members and/or the league office potentially public.

But it really isn't that big of a deal.

[keefe]

But you missed my point completely. I'm not arguing for Detroit to be included in the league, I was just trying to show that there could be advantages overall if they were selected, mainly by getting the Marquette name more prominent among Michigan high schoolers. Even if Detroit is not the most loved team in the state, having Marquette come to the state once a year, playing in the Detroit market, having their games on TV throughout the season, can help with recruiting.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

[Pakuni]

But it won't just be Detroit Mercy fans tuning in - it will be the Marquette, Xavier, DePaul, St. Louis, Georgetown and other team alums and fans watching their teams play. There are a lot of MU alumni in the Detroit area. It'll also be all the bars in the Detroit metro area having the games on, whether it's UDM or other teams in the league.

It will be hard to get the best players from the area, but a lot of great talent in Detroit and Michigan goes to play out of state. Just a few of these players over the past 25 years include:

Roy Marble (Flint Beecher) - Iowa
Derrick Coleman (Detroit Northern) - Syracuse
Doug Smith (Detroit MacKenzie) - Missouri
Marc Macon (Saginaw Bunea Vista ) - Temple
BJ Armstrong (Birmingham Brother Rice) - Iowa
Negele Knight (St. Martin DePorres) - Dayton
Willie Burton (St. Martin DePorres) - Minnesota
Voshon Leonard (Detroit Southwestern) - Minnesota
Arthur Johnson (Detroit Pershing) - Missouri
Ricky Paulding (Detroit Renaissance) - Missouri
Anthony Roberson (Saginaw) - Florida
Shane Battier (Detroit Country Day) - Duke
Brandon Jenkins (Detroit Southeastern) - Louisville
Al Horford (Grand Ledge) - Florida
Joe Crawford (Detroit Renaissance) - Kentucky
Tory Jackson (Saginaw Buena Vista) - Notre Dame
Chris Douglas-Roberts (Detroit Cass Tech) - Memphis
Malik Hairston (Detroit Renaissance) - Oregon
Donovan Kirk (Detroit Country Day) - DePaul
Amir Williams (Detroit Country Day) - Ohio State

Doesn't this list largely disprove your point?
Most of the schools on this list have no regular presence in the Detroit market, much less a conference mate there, and yet have successfully recruited top players there.

Also, MU, GTown, etc. alums in Detroit are going to watch their team's games whether they're playing Detroit or Creighton or Richmond.

Bringing Detroit into this conference would be an abomination.

[Norm]

This makes no sense whatsoever.

What's so hard to understand? You don't think Marquette could have an easier time recruiting Michigan if they were actually in a league that included a team from Michigan?

[Norm]

Doesn't this list largely disprove your point?
Most of the schools on this list have no regular presence in the Detroit market, much less a conference mate there, and yet have successfully recruited top players there.

Also, MU, GTown, etc. alums in Detroit are going to watch their team's games whether they're playing Detroit or Creighton or Richmond.

Bringing Detroit into this conference would be an abomination.

Almost all of those players went to a Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, ACC, or Big East school - conferences that have always had a good presence on TV. Norm Stewart had a pipeline of Detroit kids going to Missouri and Quinn Snyder continued it. Marquette has only recently had the same amount of TV coverage by joining the Big East. Hopefully Marquette gets great TV coverage in the new conference too.

My point with the list is that there are good players to be had from Michigan that don't go to the in-state schools. TV presence helps get them, but a league member in the state could also help too.

[keefe]

What's so hard to understand? You don't think Marquette could have an easier time recruiting Michigan if they were actually in a league that included a team from Michigan?

No. I do not. In fact, adding Detroit Mercy degrades our brand equity in Detroit among kids there. Adding UofM or MSU would be different.

Amazing how many kids Buzz gets from Texas and Tidewater without a conference footprint. Just think what would happen if we added Prairie View and ODU!

[keefe]

Almost all of those players went to a Big Ten, Big 12, SEC, ACC, or Big East school - conferences that have always had a good presence on TV. Norm Stewart had a pipeline of Detroit kids going to Missouri and Quinn Snyder continued it. Marquette has only recently had the same amount of TV coverage by joining the Big East. Hopefully Marquette gets great TV coverage in the new conference too.

My point with the list is that there are good players to be had from Michigan that don't go to the in-state schools. TV presence helps get them, but a league member in the state could also help too.

This I agree with. Detroit has a lot of talent and Stewart mined it effectively despite not playing any Michigan teams. Buzz has a national footprint for recruiting that is proving to be rather effective. Adding teams like Detroit cheapens our brand and would hurt recruiting. All of our games are on TV as it is. We don't need Detroit to robust TV coverage.

[Norm]

No. I do not. In fact, adding Detroit Mercy degrades our brand equity in Detroit among kids there. Adding UofM or MSU would be different.

Amazing how many kids Buzz gets from Texas and Tidewater without a conference footprint. Just think what would happen if we added Prairie View and ODU!

What? Are you kidding me? When was the last time you were even in Detroit, let alone Michigan? Nobody would think less of Marquette because Detroit is in their league. Do you think the people of Detroit think Butler sucks and is "degraded" because they played in the same league and made annual treks to Calihan Hall? Lots of people in the Detroit metro area root for U of D, as they are considered an underdog and people like that.

By the way, if you say that about Detroit, then you have to say that Marquette's brand equity is degraded by DePaul and St. John's, both of whom have lower winning percentages than Detroit does in the past 10 years. And Providence is barely better than Detroit.

And I'm not even arguing for Detroit to be in the league - I'm only saying that there could be some benefits if they were added. My top 5 to join the league are Xavier, Butler and Creighton, followed by St. Louis and VCU. If Gonzaga is willing to join, bump out VCU.

[dgies9156]

What? Nobody would think less of Marquette because Detroit is in their league.

I have my doubts we'll be adding Detroit. But let's think about this:

We lose games against Pittsburgh, Notre Dame, West Virginia (with the Huggie Bear), Syracuse, Louisville, Cincinnati, Rutgers and UConn

We add Creighton, St. Louis, Detroit, Xavier, Dayton, Butler and Richmond.

Ummm, I'm sorry but I have tickets to Notre Dame and Syracuse next week and I am really fired up for both. I've been to Marquette games against every single one of these replacement teams except Butler and I can't ever envision feeling the same way about any of these teams that I do about ND, Syracuse and Pitt, all of which I have seen this year.

Look, the Big East break-up is inevitable and I know we have to do what we have to do. But for heaven's sake, our brand will be diluted. We won't draw as many people to a Detroit game (unless we have a Dickey V nostalgia night and Dickey V coaches Detroit) as we would to any of the lost games, sans Rutgers. We just won't. Syracuse is sold out Monday night and the Notre Dame game  also is sold out. Those are "must see" games.

[Norm]

dgies9156,

I was saying that few people in the Detroit metropolitan area would think any less of Marquette than they did prior if Detroit Mercy were added to the league. For sure UDM would not be a big draw initially at the Bradley Center - which is why I'm not arguing for them to be in the league. A 10-team league with Xavier, Butler and Creighton would be the best possible scenario if Gonzaga can't join because of travel logistics for non-basketball sports. By having a 10 team league you have home-and-home with each team and have more out of conference games available which you could then schedule the likes of Notre Dame, Louisville, Syracuse and other former Big East partners. If the league has to go to 12 teams due to TV pressure, then add St. Louis and VCU.

[Mr. Nielsen]

Don't pass bad info. Monday's game versus Syracuse has about 1,000 tickets or so left. MU is giving some seats up for $10.

[dgies9156]

dgies9156,

I was saying that few people in the Detroit metropolitan area would think any less of Marquette than they did prior if Detroit Mercy were added to the league.

Unless we successfully recruit Detroit, do we care what folks in the Detroit metro region think of us?

[The Equalizer]

Unless we successfully recruit Detroit, do we care what folks in the Detroit metro region think of us?

Zoom in to Nebraka.  Then Zoom into Michigan.  There's your answer.

"Marquette marks another banner year of freshman applications and admission letters have been received by the Class of 2017. See how many students from your area have been accepted to Marquette. The deadline for students to make their decision is May 1."

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