This Board Is Not Melting Down After UWGB Loss, Have We All Really Given Up

[WarriorHal]

For a while I've felt this season is just a long funeral.  

Obviously, the Big East is dying as we know it, and I'm just not optimistic Buzz will remain at MU after this year .. which means we'll lose big chunks of the awesome recruiting class too.  

Losing to UWGB?  Just chapter 4 of this year's funeral.

Why is there a growing expectation that Buzz will leave after this season? Please spell it out for those of us who are big fans, but don't follow all the ins and outs of MU bball. If he does go and MU loses its highly ranked 2013 recruiting class, the program will be devastated...

[Groin_pull]

Why freak out? That's would be like getting upset at an obese guy because he couldn't run a four-minute mile. This team has serious limitations—and we can't expect miracles. MU can't shoot at all...so this loss is hardly a shock.

[CTWarrior]

I am not as upet as I would have been in years past because I just don't think we're that good.  I figured we'd win a close one, but a loss didn't surprise me.  I thought before the season started that we were either going to be among the last in or first out of the NCAA tournament, and now I just think we'll be among the first out.

Still love the guys and will be rooting for the team to turn it around, but several guys are going to have to elevate their game if that is going to happen.

[LloydMooresLegs]

I melt down by myself in a dark corner of my basement.  Just back to the board after signing off about 2 minutes after the game.  You all don't need to experience that with me. 

[RJax55]

Why is there a growing expectation that Buzz will leave after this season? Please spell it out for those of us who are big fans, but don't follow all the ins and outs of MU bball. If he does go and MU loses its highly ranked 2013 recruiting class, the program will be devastated...

Hal, go back and read the board from late March and April. See any threads on Buzz to SMU, Larry Williams or the always entertaining "Hiroshima" debate.

Frankly, I don't see Buzz leaving after this season, but that's my humble opinion. What I can say though, is that there is a portion of the MU fan base that is constantly worried about the program blowing up, simply waiting for that proverbial other shoe to drop. Whether that has to do with Buzz, the MU administration, conference realignment, recruiting, etc., it can make it rather difficult to determine what is real.

For the past 20 years, MU has had a successful program, especially compared to its peers. As posted yesterday, MU run this decade has been excellent:

2 NITs, 8 NCAAs, 1 Final Four, 1 Elite Eight, 3 Sweet Sixteens (10 NCAA wins)

In that time, MU has faced numerous changes and challenges... New coaches, conferences, administrations and yet the program remains strong. Now, I'm an older, but still recent alum, so my views are not shaped by MU's elite success in the 70s or the dark days of Dukiet.

However, I don't see this season as funeral procession, even if MU is a NIT team. Honestly, I see the opposite, a bright future, with a program that is lead by a solid coach, with incoming talent, administration support (even with all the drama here, so far the evidence shows there's nothing to indicate the opposite in the Williams/Pilarz era) and a future conference arraignment that looks like a best case scenario for MU.

But, if changes do happen and say Buzz leaves, I still have faith that in the end that MU will be ok.

[frozena pizza]

I still think upper-middle of the conference and a tourament birth are very attainable. For those who think we finish in the bottom half and out of the tournament, I wonder what BE teams you put ahead of us?

Attainable, maybe.  But based on what I've seen so far I'd put us behind the following teams.  I don't see the BE getting 8 teams into the tournament this year.

Syracuse
Louisville
Notre Dame
Cincinnati
Georgetown
UConn
Pittsburgh

[The Equalizer]

I still think upper-middle of the conference and a tourament birth are very attainable. For those who think we finish in the bottom half and out of the tournament, I wonder what BE teams you put ahead of us?

If you looked at this objectively, we have 8 games against six teams that are look to be better than us:
@Cincy, Syracuse, Pitt (x2), Notre Dame, @UL, and Georgetown (x2).  

UConn is one wild card.  Buzz isn't coaching that game--its his suspension game for Monarch.  On one hand, you'd think missing a coach for one game wouln't make much of differenece--its all in the game prep. On the other, we're 2-0 over the last few years against UConn without Calhoun on the bench.

Providence is another wild card. No impressive wins and a bad loss vs. Penn State.  But Kris Dunn's first game was Tuesday of this week--a 27 minute 7 point, 13 assist performance in a 34 point blowout against Colgate. And Colgate isn't that bad--lost to Illinois by 20, MU by 18 and Syracuse by 25.   We'll have to keep an eye on him--but if his first game is any indication, they may be better than they look.

That leaves eight games: @Villanova, USF(x2), and @Rutgers, @St. Johns, DePaul, Seton Hall (x2) are probably the safest-looking wins.  Unfortunately five of them are on the road.

[AirPunches]

Attainable, maybe.  But based on what I've seen so far I'd put us behind the following teams.  I don't see the BE getting 8 teams into the tournament this year.

Syracuse
Louisville
Notre Dame
Cincinnati
Georgetown
UConn
Pittsburgh

Good. Then we can be the seventh team in and replace UCONN since they can't go this year.

[JD]

I don't think Buzz is leaving, but even if he did, i'd be MORE than happy with Chew.  I really hope MU would promote him.

[bilsu]

The more we lose this year makes Buzz a less desirable attraction to other schools. A lot of people here were speculating about Banres being fired at Texas. Texas beat North Carolina last night. The odds of Texas firing Barnes to go after Buzz went significantly down last night.

[WarhawkWarrior]

NIT at best this year.

[akmarq]

Attainable, maybe.  But based on what I've seen so far I'd put us behind the following teams.  I don't see the BE getting 8 teams into the tournament this year.

Syracuse
Louisville
Notre Dame
Cincinnati
Georgetown
UConn
Pittsburgh

I agree that all those teams would seem to be better than us right now, but I suppose I'm also accounting for a surprise win or two. I also don't think that Pitt and ND are SO far ahead of us in terms of talent as to be unassailable. Again, call it rose colored glasses, but MU has improved during the season every year that Buzz has coached. Though I don't think Mayo makes us as good as Louisville/GT/SYR, he certainly brings some improvement to the table.

Again, can't fault where you put us in the pecking order, but I am optimistic that last night was not a true representation of where we are headed. Play to expectations in conference play, get a first round bye in the BE tournament and win a game and I'm pretty confident about our tourney chances (even if BE only gets 6-7 teams this year).

[ATL MU Warrior]

If you looked at this objectively, we have 8 games against six teams that are look to be better than us:
@Cincy, Syracuse, Pitt (x2), Notre Dame, @UL, and Georgetown (x2).  

UConn is one wild card.  Buzz isn't coaching that game--its his suspension game for Monarch.  On one hand, you'd think missing a coach for one game wouln't make much of differenece--its all in the game prep. On the other, we're 2-0 over the last few years against UConn without Calhoun on the bench.

Providence is another wild card. No impressive wins and a bad loss vs. Penn State.  But Kris Dunn's first game was Tuesday of this week--a 27 minute 7 point, 13 assist performance in a 34 point blowout against Colgate. And Colgate isn't that bad--lost to Illinois by 20, MU by 18 and Syracuse by 25.   We'll have to keep an eye on him--but if his first game is any indication, they may be better than they look.

That leaves eight games: @Villanova, USF(x2), and @Rutgers, @St. Johns, DePaul, Seton Hall (x2) are probably the safest-looking wins.  Unfortunately five of them are on the road.

Based on how we've looked so far this year I'd think going 8-10 in conference is probably realistic.

At best, go 2-6 in the first set of games above (win Pitt @ home and Gtown @ home)
1-1 in next set (lose to UCONN win vs Providence)
Go 5-3 in the last set (win USF/Depaul/SH at home, go 2-3 on the road)

Just don't see us winning on the road except against the bottom of the barrel.  Hoping for some improvement sometime soon, but we've played a third of the season and we should have seen something by now...

[akmarq]

What I can say though, is that there is a portion of the MU fan base that is constantly worried about the program blowing up, simply waiting for that proverbial other shoe to drop. Whether that has to do with Buzz, the MU administration, conference realignment, recruiting, etc., it can make it rather difficult to determine what is real.

I'm not going to go digging in the post history, but I bet a lot of this segment of the fanbase also thought the sky was falling when MU hired Buzz after Crean defected. (not a big name, didn't conduct a real search, not ready to be a HC in a power conference).

You can always find a negative way to spin news/events and some people move from uncertainty to "the worst is sure to happen because the best isn't assured" very quickly. Something I keep in mind when I read Scoop is "these are opnions of fans like me, not of experts or professionals."

In order to think that Buzz isn't happy or is looking to leave, you have to base your conclusion on *at best* major speculation. Why panic about something that we can neither control nor have any concrete reason to expect?

[LAZER]

I agree that all those teams would seem to be better than us right now, but I suppose I'm also accounting for a surprise win or two. I also don't think that Pitt and ND are SO far ahead of us in terms of talent as to be unassailable. Again, call it rose colored glasses, but MU has improved during the season every year that Buzz has coached. Though I don't think Mayo makes us as good as Louisville/GT/SYR, he certainly brings some improvement to the table.

Again, can't fault where you put us in the pecking order, but I am optimistic that last night was not a true representation of where we are headed. Play to expectations in conference play, get a first round bye in the BE tournament and win a game and I'm pretty confident about our tourney chances (even if BE only gets 6-7 teams this year).

I think the Big East has a real good shot at 8 bids this year. The ACC sucks this year, the Big 12 is mediocre, and the SEC and the Pac 12 are bad again.  While it's really not worth the time to look breakdown bids per conference this early in the year, I think 8-9 Big East teams is reasonable this year.

[akmarq]

I think the Big East has a real good shot at 8 bids this year. The ACC sucks this year, the Big 12 is mediocre, and the SEC and the Pac 12 are bad again.  While it's really not worth the time to look breakdown bids per conference this early in the year, I think 8-9 Big East teams is reasonable this year.

I agree - it's far too early to tell. I don't even really pay attention to rankings/results outside of the BE until conference play starts. Too much noise to really get a good picture of who the favorites are (beyond the top echelon of teams).

[79Warrior]

The more we lose this year makes Buzz a less desirable attraction to other schools. A lot of people here were speculating about Banres being fired at Texas. Texas beat North Carolina last night. The odds of Texas firing Barnes to go after Buzz went significantly down last night.

I disagree. His record this season will have minimal impact. His recruiting class is stellar. He is a rising star. Don't kid yourself.

[brewcity77]

The more we lose this year makes Buzz a less desirable attraction to other schools. A lot of people here were speculating about Banres being fired at Texas. Texas beat North Carolina last night. The odds of Texas firing Barnes to go after Buzz went significantly down last night.

Disagree. Hiring (or not hiring) Buzz won't be a kneejerk reaction based on one season. He's proven he can recruit, he's proven he can win NCAA games, he's proven he can steady a program after turmoil. Any blue-blood would still have him at or near the top of their list, even if this season ends in the NIT.

[Goose]

He is a rising star and most likely can write his own ticket. He is a proven commodity and a major player. Lets hope MU realizes that and makes things happen. We need to find way to upgrade C7 and keep ourselves in upper tier of conferences.

[RJax55]

I'm not going to go digging in the post history, but I bet a lot of this segment of the fanbase also thought the sky was falling when MU hired Buzz after Crean defected. (not a big name, didn't conduct a real search, not ready to be a HC in a power conference).

You can always find a negative way to spin news/events and some people move from uncertainty to "the worst is sure to happen because the best isn't assured" very quickly. Something I keep in mind when I read Scoop is "these are opnions of fans like me, not of experts or professionals."

In order to think that Buzz isn't happy or is looking to leave, you have to base your conclusion on *at best* major speculation. Why panic about something that we can neither control nor have any concrete reason to expect?

Exactly right. Success can do funny things to a fan base. Some become smug (look at Wisconsin fans), others elitist and some groups become paranoid. Unfortunately, MU's success has caused some of our fans to become paranoid... Waiting for and convinced that the day is coming when the program goes over the cliff.

[Tugg Speedman]

I'm not going to go digging in the post history, but I bet a lot of this segment of the fanbase also thought the sky was falling when MU hired Buzz after Crean defected. (not a big name, didn't conduct a real search, not ready to be a HC in a power conference).

You can always find a negative way to spin news/events and some people move from uncertainty to "the worst is sure to happen because the best isn't assured" very quickly. Something I keep in mind when I read Scoop is "these are opnions of fans like me, not of experts or professionals."

In order to think that Buzz isn't happy or is looking to leave, you have to base your conclusion on *at best* major speculation. Why panic about something that we can neither control nor have any concrete reason to expect?

Remember that Cottingham only interviewed Buzz for the job.  This board not only thought Buzz was a bad idea, they thought it was a suicidally bad idea.  They were hoping it would only get as bad as the dark days of Dukiet, and not worse.

Then Bob Hurley Sr, engineered Ty Taylor to Kansas and rebuffed Buzz and it was a guarantee we were headed back the Dukiet days.

Did not quite work out that way.

[4everwarriors]

Remember that Cottingham only interviewed Buzz for the job.  This board not only thought Buzz was a bad idea, they thought it was a suicidally bad idea.  They were hoping it would only get as bad as the dark days of Dukiet, and not worse.

Then Bob Hurley Sr, engineered Ty Taylor to Kansas and rebuffed Buzz and it was a guarantee we were headed back the Dukiet days.

Did not quite work out that way.

Gotta wait 5 years before a judgment can accurately be rendered.

[Tugg Speedman]

Gotta wait 5 years before a judgment can accurately be rendered.

What poster on this board famously said that?  This poster also thought Buzz was about the worst decision the administration could have possibly made, especially since no one else was interviewed for the job.

Will post the answer later if no one gets it.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

What poster on this board famously said that?  This poster also thought Buzz was about the worst decision the administration could have possibly made, especially since no one else was interviewed for the job.

Will post the answer later if no one gets it.

I was always a 5 year guy.

I'm not afraid to admit that.

[JD]

Chico's or Hoop?