[PaintTouches]The truth about Vander Blue's complete game

[PaintTouchesSays]

The truth about Vander Blue's complete game
      

Written by: Mark Strotman
            

There's more to a basketball game than putting the ball in the basket. This accurate, albeit obvious, statement easily can be overlooked at times, and nowhere is that seen more often than in the case of Vander Blue. Marquette's sophomore ... Continue reading →


         

http://painttouches.com/2012/01/10/the-truth-about-vander-blues-complete-game/
      

[PVMagic]

+1.

[g0lden3agle]

Prior to the season, both Derrick Wilson and Todd Mayo mentioned Blue by name as the one player who took both under his wing and showed them the way transitioning from the high school to collegiate level. Wilson said that Blue used his turbulent freshman season as a teaching tool for the underclassmen.

Surely a lesson on when to offer a slap of 5 was one of these tools.

[GGGG]

Wow...that's more Blue-love than even I've given.  Well done!

[Nukem2]

Vander has been very good this season.  He pretty much led the charge against Cuse along with Junior.  These two really seem to be the true leaders of this team.  Wish the coaches could rid Vander of that flick motion on his shot and get a true follow through motion.  Glad we have him.

[MerrittsMustache]

Surely a lesson on when to offer a slap of 5 was one of these tools.

Clearly Vander was just showing Wilson some tough love.

Very well written article. Nice job, Mark!

[MUMac]

I sense the article will not sway his detractors.  Logic and facts seem to escape them or their inability to get over their long cemented disgust towards Vander (as a player &\or as a person, I am afraid).  That stated, it was a very well thought out, written and supported article. 

[Stretchdeltsig]

Very well written article about Blue.  Agree with the sentiment for Blue.  I enjoy watching him play, but, can't help but think of Dean Memminger who was able to finish layups and shoot over 7 footers.  Wish Vander could study film on how Dean played to help him improve his offensive game.

[nycwarrior]

Well reasoned and written defense of our growing ballplayer.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Like with Junior when he is distributing the ball with five or more assists per game, when Vander scores, MU wins...in fact when Vander scores in double digits, MU wins to the tune of 13-1. The kid runs on momentum, and when he has it, MU rolls....when Van isn't feeling it, MU has inconsistent halves spent by having Buzz trying to find the mojo elsewhere. 

To me, the good news is, in spurts, he is feeling it more against high major opponents. Still very inconsistent...but that is the story with underclassmen.  Lots of parts of his offensive game to work on.  He has talent to play point, but not the experience yet. You can see that in his approach as he initiates play not having a plan where he is going with the ball. Again, experience but a lot of pure talent there once he matures and understands what he can do best (and what he cannot).

[Bieberhole69]

Am I the only one here who thinks that this article did nothing to validate his "complete game"?

[strotty]

Rebound, assist, steal and free throw rate numbers and leadership intangibles. Seems complete.

[Bieberhole69]

Rebound, assist, steal and free throw rate numbers and leadership intangibles. Seems complete.

PPG, FG%, FT%, 3PT%, AST/TO seems incomplete to me.

So what I got from the article is that he plays good D and can rebound well...

[We R Final Four]

Bieber--why do you hate Vander so much?

[🏀]

Bieber--why do you hate Vander so much?

He got punched out in Qdoba.

[strotty]

PPG, FG%, FT%, 3PT%, AST/TO seems incomplete to me.

So what I got from the article is that he plays good D and can rebound well...

You didn't get that he can pass the ball and has filled in behind Cadougan as the backup PG, a position Marquette desperately needs?

You listed two categories of the game: shooting (points, FG, FT, 3PT) and turnovers.

He's very solid everywhere else.

[GGGG]

Vander is far from having a "complete game."  And I am sure he realizes that more than anyone.

[strotty]

Vander is far from having a "complete game."  And I am sure he realizes that more than anyone.

His multiple positives are overlooked by many because he "doesn't have a jumper" and makes a careless turnover now and again. Buzz has complimented Van on being able to contribute in so many areas, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

[Bieberhole69]

His multiple positives are overlooked by many because he "doesn't have a jumper" and makes a careless turnover now and again. Buzz has complimented Van on being able to contribute in so many areas, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

I agree that many people ignore his contributions because of his terrible shot, but to sit here and applaud how "complete" his game is is a joke.  If you want him to be a SG then he needs to shoot way better, if you want him to be a PG he needs to stop turning the ball over.  There's a lot to be desired in his game and it's far from complete.

[Henry Sugar]

His multiple positives are overlooked by many because he "doesn't have a jumper" and makes a careless turnover now and again. Buzz has complimented Van on being able to contribute in so many areas, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

I like how you put that.  A careless turnover now and again.  Or it's a turnover rate of 22% (worse than average) and an Offensive Rating of 97 (again, worse than average).  That offensive rating is trending downward against tougher competition, for the record.

Vander does make many contributions that go above and beyond his poor shooting, and I think you did a nice job laying those out in your article.  However, those additional contributions essentially turn him back into an average player.  Which is fine.

Don't oversell how good Vander is.

[GGGG]

His multiple positives are overlooked by many because he "doesn't have a jumper" and makes a careless turnover now and again. Buzz has complimented Van on being able to contribute in so many areas, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

How can you say that he has a "complete game" when he has a poor outside shot and has trouble finishing consistently?  It goes against the very definition of "complete game."  

[MerrittsMustache]

Like with Junior when he is distributing the ball with five or more assists per game, when Vander scores, MU wins...in fact when Vander scores in double digits, MU wins to the tune of 13-1. The kid runs on momentum, and when he has it, MU rolls....when Van isn't feeling it, MU has inconsistent halves spent by having Buzz trying to find the mojo elsewhere. 

True, albeit misleading.

Vander's double digit scoring games were...
UWGB (won by 20)
Longwood (won by 31)
Texas A&M-CC (won by 36)
Centenary (won by 29)
Miss Valley State (won by 25)
Vandy (lost by 1)
DePaul (won by 30)
Mount St. Mary's (won by 54)
Norfolk State (won by 31)
Winthrop (won by 22)
Ole Miss (won by 30)
Washington (won by 2)
UWGB (won by 18)
Northern Colorado (won by 21)

Only 2 of those games were even marginally competitive (they split those) and only 1 was a conference game. The rest were VB putting up points in blow-outs.

I've been one of the Vander defenders on this board so I don't want to give the impression that I'm trying to knock him. I'm just pointing out that Vander's scoring isn't a major influence on winning or losing key games.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I'm a Vander fan, but I wouldn't describe him as "complete" (few sophs are).

Maybe "hard to appreciate" is a better description. He does a lot of things that don't show up in the scoring column of the box score.

As far as turnovers, get used to it. Buzz has an aggressive dribble drive offense. Before Vander and DJO, it was DJO and Buycks. Before them, it was McNeal. If part of the strategy is to get the guards to drive hard into the lane, you have to live with them getting blocked or knock away sometimes.

[strotty]

How can you say that he has a "complete game" when he has a poor outside shot and has trouble finishing consistently?  It goes against the very definition of "complete game."  

Maybe the title is worded incorrectly then, but nowhere in the article did I say he was flawless. Rather, he has many positives for a player 16 games into his sophomore season and that outside of shooting and below average turnover rates (yes, both important facets of anyone's game) he does everything else fairly well.

Of course my story was pro-Blue and I focused on his positives (I did mention his weaker areas) but it was needed to balance out the constant bashing he receives on boards from fans who don't understand the game. Case in point would be high five-gate.

[Henry Sugar]

As far as turnovers, get used to it. Buzz has an aggressive dribble drive offense. Before Vander and DJO, it was DJO and Buycks. Before them, it was McNeal. If part of the strategy is to get the guards to drive hard into the lane, you have to live with them getting blocked or knock away sometimes.

Before last year, the Buzz offense was never worse than the eleventh best team in the country at protecting the ball.

UNO - #11, 2009 - #11, 2010 - #7

Quite the opposite... I am used to Marquette not turning over the ball.