Scoop Airport/Hotel/Travel Thread

[MU82]

My daughter was planning to go to Chicago o visit some friends and her brother, but she was stunned at how much it would cost - more than $2,500 for her family of 4 to fly in the main seating section of any airline.

She's always been good at booking during sales, and regularly found Seattle-to-Chicago fares under $300 apiece, sometimes even under $200. That's ancient history now, and she has decided to postpone their trip indefinitely.

How long will regular consumers and small businesses (and many larger businesses) be able to keep traveling at the rate they have been?

[JWags85]

Is she trying to fly around a holiday/long weekend? My buddy is flying from Chicago to Seattle in 2 weeks to visit Costco HQ for like $405, United Economy Plus on the standard (not cost efficient schedule) business Sunday night-Thursday afternoon schedule. It's still like $455 for a lot of itineraries through June. Still a bit inflated but not $650-700 like she apparently saw.

International routes/fares are still a bit screwy and pricy depending on destination.  I've postponed some international travel as a result, though both would have transited in the Middle East which is a key complication point as much as pure price.

I don't know anyone that has cancelled or significantly altered short haul domestic travel based on pricing.  I'm flying from Florida to Ohio later this month and the ticket price is less than $50 higher than when I bought it 2 months ago 

[MU82]

Is she trying to fly around a holiday/long weekend? My buddy is flying from Chicago to Seattle in 2 weeks to visit Costco HQ for like $405, United Economy Plus on the standard (not cost efficient schedule) business Sunday night-Thursday afternoon schedule. It's still like $455 for a lot of itineraries through June. Still a bit inflated but not $650-700 like she apparently saw.

International routes/fares are still a bit screwy and pricy depending on destination.  I've postponed some international travel as a result, though both would have transited in the Middle East which is a key complication point as much as pure price.

I don't know anyone that has cancelled or significantly altered short haul domestic travel based on pricing.  I'm flying from Florida to Ohio later this month and the ticket price is less than $50 higher than when I bought it 2 months ago 

They were talking about mid-July to late-July. My wife and I are going to Chicago in August for our grand-twins' birthday and it's the same: $629 per ticket in the main cabin. I do have a discounted ticket on Alaska Air through a branded credit card, and I also have lots of miles, so we, unlike our daughter, have options to reduce our fare.

Maybe the high Seattle-to-Chicago fares are an anomaly ... though one would think with all the competition (Alaska, American, United and Delta all fly the route non-stop), it would have kept the price from skyrocketing the way it has.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

My daughter was planning to go to Chicago o visit some friends and her brother, but she was stunned at how much it would cost - more than $2,500 for her family of 4 to fly in the main seating section of any airline.

She's always been good at booking during sales, and regularly found Seattle-to-Chicago fares under $300 apiece, sometimes even under $200. That's ancient history now, and she has decided to postpone their trip indefinitely.

How long will regular consumers and small businesses (and many larger businesses) be able to keep traveling at the rate they have been?

Try flying on a Tuesday or a Wednesday.  Prices are usually less.  Delta has a thing where you click "my dates are flexible" and it will give you a price matrix.
I also found if for example I choose "New York City" instead of LaGuardia I will see fares $10-20 cheaper for some reason.

[JWags85]

They were talking about mid-July to late-July. My wife and I are going to Chicago in August for our grand-twins' birthday and it's the same: $629 per ticket in the main cabin. I do have a discounted ticket on Alaska Air through a branded credit card, and I also have lots of miles, so we, unlike our daughter, have options to reduce our fare.

Maybe the high Seattle-to-Chicago fares are an anomaly ... though one would think with all the competition (Alaska, American, United and Delta all fly the route non-stop), it would have kept the price from skyrocketing the way it has.

Have her check United.  Its not $300 but plenty of stuff in the mid $400s all across dates all through July, and thats not for basic economy.  Competition does usually fence in pricing a bit, but not always.  There was a solid 1.5 year period where I'd pay $100-125 more a roundtrip to NYC on United than my wife did on Delta for the same route (I needed the spend I rolled with it) cause there are tons of factors at play in the airline algos.  If there is only one flight each day that works, well that complicates things, but that's an entirely different discussion.

I'm certainly not accusing you or her of it, but misrepresenting airline ticket prices for a route based solely on the most popular or "ideal" flights has always been a super common and regular tactic, regardless of geopolitical or oil influences, and as such a particular pet peeve of mine.  There has been so much written about rising airline prices for years and the algo-heavy way that its priced that people automatically assume that it must be true...which in turn makes me always say "did you check everything?" cause of what Ive seen from people in my own life experiences.

My sister in law once cancelled a trip to meet my wife and their mother because flights were "exorbitantly expensive".  But that's cause she would only leave in a 3 hour window on Thur or Fri and had to leave Sunday early evening, despite not having to pay for a hotel. 

I had a business project delayed a few months last year because another partner couldn't make flights to the retailer work due to cost/availability...turns out there were 2 flights out from their airport that they would prefer to take and one was sold out and the other nearly sold out, so very expensive, over a few days, so they just said they couldn't make it due to it not being worth the cost, instead of having any flexibility.  So everything got pushed back until everyone could meet again 

Travel is one of those things that is SO broad, whether it be ranges and costs of flights or the huge breadth of accommodation types and pricing, that data easily gets rearranged into stories to fit a narrative...usually how nobody can afford to travel because of XYZ or alternatively how too many people are traveling to a certain spot to drive alternatives/how everyone is traveling on a certain trend to cause FOMO.  Its 99% of the time overblown to drive clicks which then turns into sentiment that people share with each other.  So yea, its a bit of a personal niggle (sort of when I got super aggravated by everyone falling over themselves to declare the death of international business travel as we know it back in 2021  ) but this is the travel thread after all

[MU82]

Have her check United.  Its not $300 but plenty of stuff in the mid $400s all across dates all through July, and thats not for basic economy.  Competition does usually fence in pricing a bit, but not always.  There was a solid 1.5 year period where I'd pay $100-125 more a roundtrip to NYC on United than my wife did on Delta for the same route (I needed the spend I rolled with it) cause there are tons of factors at play in the airline algos.  If there is only one flight each day that works, well that complicates things, but that's an entirely different discussion.

I'm certainly not accusing you or her of it, but misrepresenting airline ticket prices for a route based solely on the most popular or "ideal" flights has always been a super common and regular tactic, regardless of geopolitical or oil influences, and as such a particular pet peeve of mine.  There has been so much written about rising airline prices for years and the algo-heavy way that its priced that people automatically assume that it must be true...which in turn makes me always say "did you check everything?" cause of what Ive seen from people in my own life experiences.

My sister in law once cancelled a trip to meet my wife and their mother because flights were "exorbitantly expensive".  But that's cause she would only leave in a 3 hour window on Thur or Fri and had to leave Sunday early evening, despite not having to pay for a hotel. 

I had a business project delayed a few months last year because another partner couldn't make flights to the retailer work due to cost/availability...turns out there were 2 flights out from their airport that they would prefer to take and one was sold out and the other nearly sold out, so very expensive, over a few days, so they just said they couldn't make it due to it not being worth the cost, instead of having any flexibility.  So everything got pushed back until everyone could meet again 

Travel is one of those things that is SO broad, whether it be ranges and costs of flights or the huge breadth of accommodation types and pricing, that data easily gets rearranged into stories to fit a narrative...usually how nobody can afford to travel because of XYZ or alternatively how too many people are traveling to a certain spot to drive alternatives/how everyone is traveling on a certain trend to cause FOMO.  Its 99% of the time overblown to drive clicks which then turns into sentiment that people share with each other.  So yea, its a bit of a personal niggle (sort of when I got super aggravated by everyone falling over themselves to declare the death of international business travel as we know it back in 2021  ) but this is the travel thread after all

Thanks, Wags.

The $629 RT price I gave was on Alaska Airlines flights in the main cabin for our August dates.

I just plugged in her dates (July 10-15) for United main cabin on non-crack-of-dawn and non-redeye flights, and I'm seeing $519 RT. That's better than the $629, for sure, but it's still more than $2,000 for a family of 4. And they aren't Premier or credit-card holders, so they'd have to pay for checked bags, too (unless all 4 of them somehow could get by only with carry-ons). I will relay that price to her.

All in all, based on what I've read (which perhaps is less than you have read), I do not think most people are exaggerating the cost of air travel right now. Personally, we just went to Chicago in January, and it's considerably more expensive now.

[Dish]

I'll assume Scott Kirby is trolling American by having it be leaked that United wants to merge with American.

That would be an unmitigated disaster on every level, especially if ORD or LAX are your home airports.

[dgies9156]

I'll assume Scott Kirby is trolling American by having it be leaked that United wants to merge with American.

That would be an unmitigated disaster on every level, especially if ORD or LAX are your home airports.

The anti-trust implications of an American/United merger are so great even this administration would oppose it.

The parallel hubs in Texas, along the east coast and, as Brother Dish acknowledges, in Chicago and on the west coast, are so great that there's just no way this could work. Add to that massive opposition from labor groups, local communities, airport authorities and a host of other stakeholders and such a merger would be a non-starter.

If Jet Blue and Spirit couldn't merge, no way this would ever happen. Sounds like Kirby is yanking AA's chain -- again!

[JWags85]

The anti-trust implications of an American/United merger are so great even this administration would oppose it.

The parallel hubs in Texas, along the east coast and, as Brother Dish acknowledges, in Chicago and on the west coast, are so great that there's just no way this could work. Add to that massive opposition from labor groups, local communities, airport authorities and a host of other stakeholders and such a merger would be a non-starter.

If Jet Blue and Spirit couldn't merge, no way this would ever happen. Sounds like Kirby is yanking AA's chain -- again!

I mean there have been anti-trust talks/speculation when United and JetBlue have discussed a merger beyond just their current partnership.  AA/United wouldn't even be a realistic discussion.

[pbiflyer]

I will be in Budapest at the end of May for four nights/3 days.
Did not realize the parliament tours sell out so far in advance. So now my only option is to use Vader or similar. More than doubles the entrance fee to over $80.
Has anyone been through the tour? Is it worth the extra cash? Since I only have three days, one of which is a Monday when parliament is closed, I have limited options.
Obviously, I can afford the extra cost, but I am wondering if time and money is better spent elsewhere.

[WarriorFan]

One night coming up in Sydney.  Never really liked the place.  Last time I was there for any duration was 1998.  Good restaurant recommendation?

[MuggsyB]

Newark seriously sucks.  What an absolute garbage airport. 

[Hards Alumni]

Newark seriously sucks.  What an absolute garbage airport. 

I never have a problem with it... but I do know it is widely disliked.

DFW is my least favorite.

[dgies9156]

DFW is my least favorite.

My least favorite is LAX, followed by IAD and EWR. I hate LAX because the rental cars are in Kern County and the roadways to the United and American terminals are hopelessly clogged. Security wait times are a crapshoot!

EWR has only one active runway, unless you count the use by United of the New Jersey Turnpike. Security is a crapshoot and the space between A and C is ridiculous.

IAD has some of the most uncaring, indifferent and entitled staff members of any airport in America.

[JWags85]

Newark seriously sucks.  What an absolute garbage airport. 

Did you fly in/out of Terminal B?  If so, I could understand it, Terminal B sucks.

Otherwise, silly and ridiculous exaggeration.  Terminal A is sparkly new and beautiful and very well done.  And Terminal C is a perfectly fine airport terminal.  I've had plenty of issues with EWR over the years, but very few once Terminal A was renovated and re-opened.  Slightly annoying with the train into Terminal A sometimes, but otherwise NBD.  Most people who still claim EWR sucks haven't flown there in years.  Lord knows what minor annoyance happened here to prompt such exaggeration though.

In the realm of major US aiports, EWR doesn't even ping on the terrible meter.  Not even in the top 3 worst hubs for any Big 3 airline, or even United alone.  LAX is worse (who doesn't love arriving on an international flight and walking 20+ min outside to another terminal for a domestic connection).  IAD is worse.  ORD is worse (and I don't even mind ORD compared to most).  DFW is worse. I prefer EWR far more than IAH (which isn't even that terrible for a mega airport).

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

My least favorite is LAX, followed by IAD and EWR. I hate LAX because the rental cars are in Kern County and the roadways to the United and American terminals are hopelessly clogged. Security wait times are a crapshoot!

EWR has only one active runway, unless you count the use by United of the New Jersey Turnpike. Security is a crapshoot and the space between A and C is ridiculous.

IAD has some of the most uncaring, indifferent and entitled staff members of any airport in America.

In that case a few weeks ago, good thing my flight only passed through IAD. 

[MuggsyB]

I never have a problem with it... but I do know it is widely disliked.

DFW is my least favorite.

I just had an awful experience at Newark but don't fly there very often.  It didn't help flying into the C gates when my connection was at the A gates.  Tight connection (waited 40 mins for someone to fix the jet bridge), too many people, and not enough shuttle busses.  It was basically a s-show. 

[Dish]

My 16 year old son & I are going to fly into Denver (end of July) and then drive to San Francisco to start a MLB stadium tour of the California teams.

He's wanted to explore the West and thought this would be a fun trip before he goes to college in a few years.

I'm going to ask this broadly speaking...what route would someone with knowledge recommend to get from Denver to Salt Lake? I realize 80 is the quickest, but looks boring relatively speaking. Our plan is going to be to get up at 6am and start the drive and explore along the way. I don't think we'll have time to explore a national park on the way to SLC. 70 a better option? Or going 70 to 40?

Appreciate any recommendations!

[JWags85]

My 16 year old son & I are going to fly into Denver (end of July) and then drive to San Francisco to start a MLB stadium tour of the California teams.

He's wanted to explore the West and thought this would be a fun trip before he goes to college in a few years.

I'm going to ask this broadly speaking...what route would someone with knowledge recommend to get from Denver to Salt Lake? I realize 80 is the quickest, but looks boring relatively speaking. Our plan is going to be to get up at 6am and start the drive and explore along the way. I don't think we'll have time to explore a national park on the way to SLC. 70 a better option? Or going 70 to 40?

Appreciate any recommendations!

I haven't done the drive personally, but I have a number of friends in Denver who have driven to Utah multiple times for various outdoor excursions.  If you're not solely focused on time, definitely avoid 80.  Its largely a largely uninteresting trek through Wyoming at best, very boring at worst.

Meanwhile, I-70 all the way through the ski resorts is an amazing drive.  Even moreso in the summer where you don't need to worry about weather and snow making things hellish.  Taking it all the way to I-15 in Utah is out of the way, but it does give you a route through some very cool Utah scenery and terrain.  Otherwise, splitting off onto Highway 13 around Rifle and taking it up to Highway 64 and then over is a cool drive as well.  As opposed to 40, you get a good bit more interstate driving going West before going onto the state highways.

[Dish]

I haven't done the drive personally, but I have a number of friends in Denver who have driven to Utah multiple times for various outdoor excursions.  If you're not solely focused on time, definitely avoid 80.  Its largely a largely uninteresting trek through Wyoming at best, very boring at worst.

Meanwhile, I-70 all the way through the ski resorts is an amazing drive.  Even moreso in the summer where you don't need to worry about weather and snow making things hellish.  Taking it all the way to I-15 in Utah is out of the way, but it does give you a route through some very cool Utah scenery and terrain.  Otherwise, splitting off onto Highway 13 around Rifle and taking it up to Highway 64 and then over is a cool drive as well.  As opposed to 40, you get a good bit more interstate driving going West before going onto the state highways.

This is great stuff, thanks!

[pbiflyer]

This is great stuff, thanks!

I have driven the route JWags suggested, at least most of it. He is spot on.

[Dish]

I have driven the route JWags suggested, at least most of it. He is spot on.

For both of you guys, is taking 70 to 15 worth the extra time?

[pbiflyer]

For both of you guys, is taking 70 to 15 worth the extra time?

That's why I added the qualifier. I did 70 to 15 to Vegas. And the ride was definitely interesting very different than the Rocky Mountain part.
But I have not been the other route into Salt Lake City. So I can't compare.
By the way, I don't know if your son is into aviation, but the Hill areas pace  museum in Ogden is pretty cool.