Durley granted release

[brewcity77]

Someone in an earlier post said that Durley had to request his release....it needed to be mutual.  Is that correct?

If that is the case, Enlund's choice to exclude that in his article would be most interesting.

Once a LOI is signed, the school is obligated to give the scholarship, so there had to be some mutual consent. Marquette couldn't simply pull the scholarship, but I have a feeling Durley wanted to be at Marquette, but was convinced that it wasn't the best thing for him.

Personally, I think this just doesn't look very good, and I'm sure that while Durley agreed to the decision, it still wasn't what he wanted. It looks a lot better to hold off on offering a guy until you're sure, especially with a project player. With Buzz's track record in Spring, I'd rather he try to leave at least one scholarship open every year, and if you get to Spring and haven't filled it, then offer it to the big project kid.

[CTWarrior]

Honestly, I don't get it.  Why would it ever be anything than your second paragraph? 

I think Durley still wanted to come because of this tweet referenced earlier in the thread.

Aaron Durley‏@ADurley24

It's hurts... I'm not gonna lie... But it's just Fuel to My Fire thats gonna drive me to become the best I can be.. #Back2TheLab #TheLead'

That doesn't sound like someone who wanted out.  Of course I may be misinterpreting it which is why I said "I get the feeling..." in my original post.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

You guys may feel squirmy about it, but in the end, it was Durley's decision whether or not he would be at Marquette this summer/fall.

Well, my guess is the coaching staff convinced him he didn't want to come, which is pretty easy to do.

"Durley, you aren't going to play as a frosh., and scholarships are year to year. You probably won't be back as a soph."

At that point, Durley would want out of his NLI.

Now, in the above scenario, the coaching staff is just being bluntly honest, which I can appreciate. However, I still feel bad for the kid, and I wish it didn't have to go down like this.

This is probably how big time hoops has to work now, but I wish it didn't have to. Maybe I'm just naive.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

The school always retains the power: the scholarships are only for a year, they control the playing time, and the kid is the one who has to sit out for a year when he transfers. Its hard  to imagine the  decision was  "mutual"

[Lennys Tap]

Well, my guess is the coaching staff convinced him he didn't want to come, which is pretty easy to do.

"Durley, you aren't going to play as a frosh., and scholarships are year to year. You probably won't be back as a soph."

At that point, Durley would want out of his NLI.

Now, in the above scenario, the coaching staff is just being bluntly honest, which I can appreciate. However, I still feel bad for the kid, and I wish it didn't have to go down like this.

This is probably how big time hoops has to work now, but I wish it didn't have to. Maybe I'm just naive.

Or maybe the conversation went like this: "Aaron, you've got qualities, size and athletic ability, that only God can give. Coach Courtney and I believed last November that with a year of hard work you would be ready to be an asset to Marquette University. Maybe we were wrong, or maybe you didn't work hard enough. That's a question only you can answer. The bottom line is that progress wasn't made and right now you're not ready, and given that you're probably better off somewhere you can play and improve your game."
Like you, I wish things like this never had to happen. I don't know whether Buzz and Courtney were just wrong on this kid or if he's not motivated. But in either case, would his coming to MU for a year be in his or Marquette's best interests? I'd say no, and with time and perspective I think Aaron will also.

[MU82]

Once a LOI is signed, the school is obligated to give the scholarship, so there had to be some mutual consent. Marquette couldn't simply pull the scholarship, but I have a feeling Durley wanted to be at Marquette, but was convinced that it wasn't the best thing for him.

Personally, I think this just doesn't look very good, and I'm sure that while Durley agreed to the decision, it still wasn't what he wanted. It looks a lot better to hold off on offering a guy until you're sure, especially with a project player. With Buzz's track record in Spring, I'd rather he try to leave at least one scholarship open every year, and if you get to Spring and haven't filled it, then offer it to the big project kid.

Agree 100 percent with this.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Or maybe the conversation went like this: "Aaron, you've got qualities, size and athletic ability, that only God can give. Coach Courtney and I believed last November that with a year of hard work you would be ready to be an asset to Marquette University. Maybe we were wrong, or maybe you didn't work hard enough. That's a question only you can answer. The bottom line is that progress wasn't made and right now you're not ready, and given that you're probably better off somewhere you can play and improve your game."
Like you, I wish things like this never had to happen. I don't know whether Buzz and Courtney were just wrong on this kid or if he's not motivated. But in either case, would his coming to MU for a year be in his or Marquette's best interests? I'd say no, and with time and perspective I think Aaron will also.

I agree, and you can frame it however you want. I'm sure they were more gentle than my quotes.

My point is, at the end of the day, MU has the hammer because no matter what Durley wants to do this year, MU can indicate that he won't be invited back as a soph., and that really makes his decision for him.

[MU82]

The school always retains the power: the scholarships are only for a year, they control the playing time, and the kid is the one who has to sit out for a year when he transfers. Its hard  to imagine the  decision was  "mutual"

Coaches have all the power at successful athletic schools. They can leave whenever they want, regardless of the terms of their contracts. They can toy with the athletes, saying "it's all about the kids" when clearly it isn't. They can play loose and fast with NCAA rules and (in all but a few cases in history) get away without any significant personal repercussions. And in the rare situations in which an AD/president/school "forces" a coach to leave, that coach leaves with plenty of money in his pocket and usually a new (often better) job waiting.

So while none of us are privy to exactly how "mutual" this Durley decision was ...

Given the facts we do know and the tone of the kid's tweet, I stand by my opinion that this whole thing reflects very poorly on Buzz, a coach I like very much.

[MerrittsMustache]

Let's say that after his junior year, a Marquette student with respectable grades and decent internship gets a very good job lined up for after he graduates. During his senior year, however, his grades slip significantly and he gets a very poor performance review at his internship.

If you're the hiring manager who offered him the position but you're now pretty sure it was a mistake and that his hiring will hinder your department's production, do you bring him aboard anyway or do you pull the offer?

I know what I'd do.

[Dr. Blackheart]

FWIW, I didn't see this linked here...from IWB

Just into the weekend it came out the Marquette had honored 6'10 C Aaron Durley of Ft. Bend Bush High School in Texas' request to be released from his letter of intent. Those on the attack claimed that MU ran him off, but from what I have been able to gather, Marquette strongly recommended that he attend a prep school for a year to further help his development. You see, Durley missed the majority of his junior year with an injury, and his senior year he spent a lot of time on the bench behind All-American Cameron Ridley. Well, Durley didn't like that idea and opted out of his release. He seems like a good kid, hopefully he finds what he is looking for.

http://www.brewcityball.com/forums/content.php?318

[CTWarrior]

The school always retains the power: the scholarships are only for a year, they control the playing time, and the kid is the one who has to sit out for a year when he transfers. Its hard  to imagine the  decision was  "mutual"

Scholarships are one year at a time, but no school worth their salt would take a scholarship away from a kid who is doing all that is asked of him because he turns out not to be a good player.  I think kids leave all the time because they want to play and think their chances for playing may be better elsewhere.  I guess it's semantics, but you shouldn't throw a human being away because you made a mistake recruiting him.

[NersEllenson]

Coaches have all the power at successful athletic schools. They can leave whenever they want, regardless of the terms of their contracts. They can toy with the athletes, saying "it's all about the kids" when clearly it isn't. They can play loose and fast with NCAA rules and (in all but a few cases in history) get away without any significant personal repercussions. And in the rare situations in which an AD/president/school "forces" a coach to leave, that coach leaves with plenty of money in his pocket and usually a new (often better) job waiting.

So while none of us are privy to exactly how "mutual" this Durley decision was ...

Given the facts we do know and the tone of the kid's tweet, I stand by my opinion that this whole thing reflects very poorly on Buzz, a coach I like very much.

"The successful athletic schools," you mention are successful because of their Head Coaches..so without the coach...the school by virtue of name alone is not successful....thus why coaches are paid the big $$$$$.  Elite coaches, CEO's, etc., generally always have the power, because of the results they are able to achieve.  As soon as the results aren't to the liking of a fanbase, administrator, Wall Sreet - guess what - the CEO/Coach is fired...so...the school/Wall Street also have power too.  

It is a little pollyana/self righteous to want to think MU and Buzz shouldn't operate as a business...as big time college athletics is exactly that - a business.  We can kid ourselves and hope NCAA basketball and football are "pure" worlds, but that is totally naive.  Kids can transfer - Taylor, Maymon, Smith, Williams, etc.  IF there is any tragedy in all of this, it is that Division 1 basketball and football players don't get paid a dime for their efforts at schools...and no...a scholarship isn't an argument for them getting paid....schools hump the legs of these kids to try to get them to attend...they are blue chip commodities...

[MerrittsMustache]

Scholarships are one year at a time, but no school worth their salt would take a scholarship away from a kid who is doing all that is asked of him because he turns out not to be a good player.   I think kids leave all the time because they want to play and think their chances for playing may be better elsewhere.  I guess it's semantics, but you shouldn't throw a human being away because you made a mistake recruiting him.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Oh wait, are you being serious?

[🏀]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Oh wait, are you being serious?

+1. Reality check.

[tower912]

FWIW, I didn't see this linked here...from IWB

http://www.brewcityball.com/forums/content.php?318

Crazy.   Not run off, recommended to attend prep school for a year because he hadn't progressed.    He didn't want to do that and come in with a '13 scholarship.    MU said we want you to develop for a year and he wanted to play in college right away.     I continue to not see the conspiracy here. 

[Lennys Tap]

I agree, and you can frame it however you want. I'm sure they were more gentle than my quotes.

My point is, at the end of the day, MU has the hammer because no matter what Durley wants to do this year, MU can indicate that he won't be invited back as a soph., and that really makes his decision for him.

I'd agree that the deck is stacked in the school's favor and since the coach controls playing time it always will. That's what most transfers are about, after all.

[GGGG]

Crazy.   Not run off, recommended to attend prep school for a year because he hadn't progressed.    He didn't want to do that and come in with a '13 scholarship.    MU said we want you to develop for a year and he wanted to play in college right away.     I continue to not see the conspiracy here. 

Well, IWB didn't say that we would offer him a '13 scholarship.

[tower912]

You are correct, Sultan.   I extrapolated that from IWB saying that MU wanted Durley to go the prep route.   I inferred that meant they were still interested in him after a year of prep school.   That is not explicitly stated.
I know this one rubs you the wrong way, but I'm just not feeling it.   

[GGGG]

You are correct, Sultan.   I extrapolated that from IWB saying that MU wanted Durley to go the prep route.   I inferred that meant they were still interested in him after a year of prep school.   That is not explicitly stated.
I know this one rubs you the wrong way, but I'm just not feeling it.   

IF Buzz wanted him to go prep AND said something like "look, if you work hard down there, the offer still stands for 2013," then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

[tower912]

IF Buzz wanted him to go prep AND said something like "look, if you work hard down there, the offer still stands for 2013," then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

I assumed that, though it was not explicity stated. 

[brewcity77]

Crazy.   Not run off, recommended to attend prep school for a year because he hadn't progressed.    He didn't want to do that and come in with a '13 scholarship.    MU said we want you to develop for a year and he wanted to play in college right away.     I continue to not see the conspiracy here. 

I feel a little better seeing that, but when he signed the LOI, there was a mutual agreement that he would be coming here on a 2012 scholarship. As it seems Durley's first desire was to come to Marquette, I'd still rather see us either honor those commitments or not make the offer in the first place. If the options were (1) prep school, (2) come in 2012 and at best get significant PT in 2014-15, or (3) give up the scholarship and he picked option 3, I guess it is what it is. Still doesn't change that it all could have been avoided by simply waiting to commit to a LOI until Spring.

[Dr. Blackheart]

IF Buzz wanted him to go prep AND said something like "look, if you work hard down there, the offer still stands for 2013," then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

I would...because as it stands today, there is no scholarship available in 2013 for him if Otule stays.  Why put the kid through the wash cycle twice? That is a hollow promise and one that is very empty for the kid.

In this case, both sides of this argument are right. The objective side (MU should honor all commitments no matter what happens...even though the NCAA allows a school to oversign on a LOI contract).  And the subjective side (why waste a year of the kid's life at the wrong school?  He may have to red shirt next year, and even then he most likely won't crack it at the high major level, and then the kid is screwed out of another year of playing when he transfers).  In this case, I side with the subjective side as it gives the kid the best options in the end.  I also don't believe in coincidences and believe this option was always in this discussion...of which none of us will know.

Roseboro:  I had no problem with as the kid didn't cut it and wanted out.  This saved the kid a year and he quickly went to a school who wanted him originally.  

Newbill;  I blame MU as I don't think the coach communication was very good.  That said, they kid never applied to MU, and that implies there was more to the story, whether true or not.  I just don't think it was handled very well all the way around by MU, including admissions and compliance.  

[Lennys Tap]

I would...because as it stands today, there is no scholarship available in 2013 for him if Otule stays.  Why put the kid through the wash cycle twice? That is a hollow promise and one that is very empty for the kid.

In this case, both sides of this argument are right. The objective side (MU should honor all commitments no matter what happens...even though the NCAA allows a school to oversign on a LOI contract).  And the subjective side (why waste a year of the kid's life at the wrong school?  He may have to red shirt next year, and even then he most likely won't crack it at the high major level, and then the kid is screwed out of another year of playing when he transfers).  In this case, I side with the subjective side as it gives the kid the best options in the end.  I also don't believe in coincidences and believe this option was always in this discussion...of which none of us will know.

Roseboro:  I had no problem with as the kid didn't cut it and wanted out.  This saved the kid a year and he quickly went to a school who wanted him originally.  

Newbill;  I blame MU as I don't think the coach communication was very good.  That said, they kid never applied to MU, and that implies there was more to the story, whether true or not.  I just don't think it was handled very well all the way around by MU, including admissions and compliance.  

Correct on all counts as usual Doc.

[strotty]

IF Buzz wanted him to go prep AND said something like "look, if you work hard down there, the offer still stands for 2013," then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Given the kinds of players Marquette is in on for '13, I doubt that was the case.

[Ellenson Guerrero]

Let's say that after his junior year, a Marquette student with respectable grades and decent internship gets a very good job lined up for after he graduates. During his senior year, however, his grades slip significantly and he gets a very poor performance review at his internship.

If you're the hiring manager who offered him the position but you're now pretty sure it was a mistake and that his hiring will hinder your department's production, do you bring him aboard anyway or do you pull the offer?

I know what I'd do.

The difference is this isn't at will employment. The player is signing a contract with his NLI that binds him to the school and forces him to sit out for a year if he decides to leave. Regular junior undergrads don't do that, they are free to walk whenever and wherever they want. If you want to play the whole free market game, you shouldn't be locking down the kids while retaining effective free rein yourself.