Not the Buzz Williams fan club in New Orleans

[ChicosBailBonds]

It's been months since I went down to the NOLA boards, thought I'd check them out.  In a weird way, their fans feel the way about Buzz that some here feel about Crean. 

Nothing much has changed....jilted fans feel jilted, no matter where they are and what teams they cheer for.


http://forums.neworleans.com/showthread.php?p=29212&posted=1#post29212


http://forums.neworleans.com/showthread.php?t=2261&page=2

[MUBasketball]

Exactly. I chatted with them a while back and everybody was pissing and moaning about Buzz. Me thinks if he were still coaching there they would love him right about now.

[bma725]

If he's such a bad guy, then why has Joe Fulce followed him to three different schools?  If he lied to his UNO players, then why is one of his former players(Jamie McNeilly) now at MU working for Buzz as a graduate assistant?

Seems as if the UNO fans don't know what they are talking about.

[TallTitan34]

I was always under the impression that Buzz left because the school promised him a number of things when he was hired and then didn't deliver.

[CTWarrior]

What did we expect?  Of course they're going to hate Buzz.  He left after ONE season to be AN ASSISTANT elsewhere!  Many here trash Crean at every opportunity for leaving for a premiere head coaching after 9 years here. 

[MUCrew]

If he's such a bad guy, then why has Joe Fulce followed him to three different schools?  If he lied to his UNO players, then why is one of his former players(Jamie McNeilly) now at MU working for Buzz as a graduate assistant?

Seems as if the UNO fans don't know what they are talking about.

Couldn't the same be said about Brian Barone and Crean?  Nick Williams too (to a smaller degree)? 

[MR.HAYWARD]

Ct i think that is where you are wrong...I dont think very many people have trashed Crean for leaving.  I in fact hapen to feel that IU is a better gig, I hate to say it but IU is a better gig, and I dont think many people hold that gainst him.  

I think the reason most people that hate Crean hate him for is his lack of character that he should so often and in so many ways all the way up to ditching his players without letting them know about it first and then attempting to lure MU commits to IU.  Additionally many of us felt he was an average coach and recruiter at best.  I will never hold him going to IU against him,  I hated him for his caracter and underachievement love before that.

Funny how theese fans say that...I am not going to take the time to sign up...but would be interested if someone could ask for these reason why they dont like BUzz....was it becuase he left or whatever else specifically did he do?

[Kramerica]

Ct i think that is where you are wrong...I dont think very many people have trashed Crean for leaving.  I in fact hapen to feel that IU is a better gig, I hate to say it but IU is a better gig, and I dont think many people hold that gainst him.  

I would say that Crean leaving and the way he did it are the main reason most people hate him.  Well besides you. 

[nola03]

Couldn't the same be said about Brian Barone and Crean?  Nick Williams too (to a smaller degree)? 

Thinking the same thing. Some MU fans love to point out how phony Tom Crean was/is (like UNO fans with Buzz) but yet he also has a former player on staff and a recruit followed him to Indiana (like Buzz and MU).

One of two things: the scum they are portrayed as is overblown; or, there is always an exception that proves the rule.  

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

If he's such a bad guy, then why has Nick Williams followed him to a different school?  If he lied to his MU players, then why is one of his former players(Brian Barone) now at IU working for Tom as a graduate assistant?

Seems as if some of the MU fans don't know what they are talking about.

Fixed it for you (but not calling you out, BMA)

It's all about perspective and expectations.

Some people here think Buzz is a hero while some people at UNO are saying/thinking "just wait..."

Some people at IU think Tom is a hero while some people here are saying/thinking "just wait..."

The 2 situations aren't exactly the same, but they are pretty damn close.

This stuff happens EVERY YEAR in college basketball.

So far, I'm pleasantly surprised by Buzz, but I don't expect him to be a saint/savior. I expect that he is a basketball coach.

[Shack]

Even though Crean was here for 9 years he was constantly putting his name out there for every job opportunity that came up.  And if anyone thinks he wasn't behind the job rumors every year then you're just being naïve.  Your name isn't being mentioned ALL the time unless you want it to be.  Maybe that was good for Tom Crean's resume/exposure but I don't care what anyone says that is not a good thing for Marquette.  It's a pain in the ass to recruit that way and it makes us look like a mid-major stepping stone.  Granted there are elite schools that are better jobs then Marquette, but don't treat us like we're Tulsa either.  And I think the reason Nick Willams went to IU had more to do with the relationship he had with Seltzer then with Crean. 

The situation had to be more personal with Buzz and New Orleans.  You just don't give up head coaching jobs after one year to become an assistant.  Sounded more like a family issue and New Orleans fans should not feel used in the same way we were by Crean. 

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Even though Crean was here for 9 years he was constantly putting his name out there for every job opportunity that came up.  And if anyone thinks he wasn't behind the job rumors every year then you're just being naïve.  Your name isn't being mentioned ALL the time unless you want it to be.  Maybe that was good for Tom Crean's resume/exposure but I don't care what anyone says that is not a good thing for Marquette.  It's a pain in the ass to recruit that way and it makes us look like a mid-major stepping stone.  Granted there are elite schools that are better jobs then Marquette, but don't treat us like we're Tulsa either.  And I think the reason Nick Willams went to IU had more to do with the relationship he had with Seltzer then with Crean. 

The situation had to be more personal with Buzz and New Orleans.  You just don't give up head coaching jobs after one year to become an assistant.  Sounded more like a family issue and New Orleans fans should not feel used in the same way we were by Crean. 

Just to be clear, you say that it is naive not to speculate about Crean leaking his name for jobs, but New Orleans fans shouldn't feel bad (and most likely speculate) on why Buzz left?

Couldn't a New Orleans fan just say you are naive for believing that Buzz was leaving due to a family issue? Couldn't they say that he decided he just couldn't hack it at UNO so he bailed and ran to Milwaukee? Couldn't they say that Buzz certainly knew (wink wink) that he would very good assistant job if he left?

It's all just perspective, I guess.

[RawdogDX]

Even though Crean was here for 9 years he was constantly putting his name out there for every job opportunity that came up.  And if anyone thinks he wasn't behind the job rumors every year then you're just being naïve.  Your name isn't being mentioned ALL the time unless you want it to be. 

Based on what?  Espn owns what, 5 stations?  plus fox sports, plus the big east network and the big ten network.  Not to mention the web, espn.com, si.com, cbssportsline.com, rivals.com the list goes on forever.
 
There are how many sports writers in America covering college basketball alone?  If it's your job to write about it and in the last 7 years you look at a big name program and think to yourself: "hmm... I wonder who they might go after?"  Guess what one of the names you would think of would be, CREAN.  
Why wouldn't they think that crean was a possibility and write about it?  That is their job, you think there is really enough going on in the world of sports that all of those networks and sites could survive on "Just the facts."
Your comment is baseless and more proof that people are just hurt by the fact that someone got a better job offer and took it.

I just hope Buzz performs well enough that he starts circulating rumors about himself since 1000's of reporters wouldn't be able to do it.

[Niv Berkowitz]

Forget about all the publications mentioning Crean. Hell...his team's FANS do that enough for him.

Jesus Christ...there's a thread here of people wondering if Buzz will leave. Are you kidding me?

Too many MU fans have such an inferiority complex it's ridiculous.

[Nukem2]

Lets face it, MOLA has not been a great place to raise a family the past few years.  On top of that, poor facilities and broken promises.  Buzz simply admitted he made a mistake going to NOLA.  Lots of folks leave jobs for the same reason in that they made a mistake.  Its not like Buzz was there for 3 or 4 years and left them high and dry.

[nola03]

Lets face it, NOLA has not been a great place to raise a family the past few years.  On top of that, poor facilities and broken promises.  Buzz simply admitted he made a mistake going to NOLA.  Lots of folks leave jobs for the same reason in that they made a mistake.  Its not like Buzz was there for 3 or 4 years and left them high and dry.

I think a few of your points open the door to a discussion that could get ugly. I hope we don't see a replay this week of what we had seven months ago.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

I think a few of your points open the door to a discussion that could get ugly. I hope we don't see a replay this week of what we had seven months ago.

Agreed.

It's very easy for us (MU) to sit and say "It wasn't a good situation, he moved on to bigger and better things."

People who actually live down there, invest and watch the team/program simply aren't going to accept that. That's their home and their team.

HYPOTHETICAL: if Buzz were to quit MU in July and move to be an assistant in a warmer climate (because raising a family in the cold is too hard), people around here would go crazy and never forgive him. (regardless if Buzz thought he was doing what was best for his family).

[avid1010]

Comparing the reasons and way Buzz left NOLA to the reasons and way TC left MU is ridiculous...  The only comparison you can make is that they both broke their contract.

[RawdogDX]

Comparing the reasons and way Buzz left NOLA to the reasons and way TC left MU is ridiculous...  The only comparison you can make is that they both broke their contract.

and yet fan reactions are remarkably similar.  because most people decide to hate coaches when they leave no matter what the reasons are.

[Tribby]

and yet fan reactions are remarkably similar.  because most people decide to hate coaches when they leave no matter what the reasons are.

Similarly, most people defend their coaches tooth and nail, regardless of what he's done to deserve it.

Sports fans in general tend to be embarrasingly fickle; MU fans even more so than most.

[Marquette84]

Comparing the reasons and way Buzz left NOLA to the reasons and way TC left MU is ridiculous...  The only comparison you can make is that they both broke their contract.

Crean did not break his contract.  He had a buyout clause, which he exercised.  Buzz actually tried to leave without paying his buyout, claiming that UNO breached the contract first.  

Other than that, I find the two situations are extremely comparable:
--Both Crean and Buzz left for what they perceived to be better career opportunities.  
--Both coaches left behind players they recruited to their former programs.  
--Both programs have fans that are upset with their former coaches for leaving.  
--Both coaches brought a recruit along to their new school.  

The differences:  
--Crean was at MU for 9 seasons, Buzz at UNO for only 1.  
--Crean had more success at MU than Buzz had at UNO.  
--The IU head coaching job is arguably better than an assistant's job at MU.  
--There was no media feeding frenzy looking to break the news over who MU's new assistant would be.  
--Even if someone at MU had leaked the news that they hired Buzz before Buzz had shared it with the UNO AD's office, nobody at ESPN would have cared.  It wasn't going be the lead on SportsCenter that night.  
--IU fans and boosters had made it clear they wanted IU to hire Crean--no MU boosters made it clear that they even knew who Buzz Williams was.  

The unknowns:  We don't know whether the players learned from Buzz that he resigned.  

[Skatastrophy]

What you guys are describing is referred to as a fanboy in other circles besides sports.

Being a fanboy (or fanboyism) is loosely defined as "obsessive loyalty to one brand or subject in an emotional or fanatical manner."  If you replace 'brand or subject' with 'coach' then the behavior is similar.

Generally calling someone a fanboy of something refers to them being so fanatically devoted to that particular person/subject that their devotion is not based on reason or fact.

While I don't think there are too many Buzz fanboys around these forums quite yet, about two years ago this place was infested with Tom Crean fanboys.

The problem with fanboys is that they swing incredibly far to the opposite side of the fence with regards to their feelings for the subject of their devotion once they become disillusioned with the focus of their fanboyism.  These disillusioned fanboys will tear down the focus of their ex-fanboyism as fervently as they had once built them up.  Thusly balance is restored and zen is achieved.

[mosarsour]

What you guys are describing is referred to as a fanboy in other circles besides sports.

<--------- I'm a Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf and an MU fanboy and damn proud of it!!

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

What you guys are describing is referred to as a fanboy in other circles besides sports.

Being a fanboy (or fanboyism) is loosely defined as "obsessive loyalty to one brand or subject in an emotional or fanatical manner."  If you replace 'brand or subject' with 'coach' then the behavior is similar.

Generally calling someone a fanboy of something refers to them being so fanatically devoted to that particular person/subject that their devotion is not based on reason or fact.

While I don't think there are too many Buzz fanboys around these forums quite yet, about two years ago this place was infested with Tom Crean fanboys.

The problem with fanboys is that they swing incredibly far to the opposite side of the fence with regards to their feelings for the subject of their devotion once they become disillusioned with the focus of their fanboyism.  These disillusioned fanboys will tear down the focus of their ex-fanboyism as fervently as they had once built them up.  Thusly balance is restored and zen is achieved.

Interesting...

I think you also have to take expectations into account.

I expect MU's coach to win games, graduate good players/people and be a good representative of Marquette.

I think sometimes people heap more expectations than that (not on purpose, but just the nature of being a fan or fanboy) and then are ultimately left disappointed or disenfranchised.

Sometimes expectations create an environment where success is almost impossible (and/or "good success" isn't good enough).

ie: I want MU to win a national title, I want the roster to have rhodes scholars on it, I want the coach to raise 5 million dollars at Al's run, I don't want the coach's name mentioned for any other jobs, I want the coach and players to embrace the old nickname, I want the old logo brought back, etc. etc.

I'd venture to say this happens in every sports organization.