Vander's Draft Selection Poll

[MUSF]

Not much love for Vander around here.

I have no idea if / when he gets drafted, but I think he is a better pro prospect than Jerel and DJO.

[mu_hilltopper]

Not much love for Vander around here.

I have no idea if / when he gets drafted, but I think he is a better pro prospect than Jerel and DJO.

I think most here would disagree with you.   Jerel was a tremendous defender, not to mention prolific scorer (and has continued that in his D-League seasons) .. DJO was better in every category than Vander.

We'll see what NBA GMs have to say.

[Goose]

Hilltopper
 
You are without a doubt a great MU fan and I respect that, but I think you let your fan opinion shine too much. Vander has wanted to be NBA guy for years and he is in good position to achieve it. Cheer him on and cheer him on going forward.

[🏀]

Hilltopper
 
You are without a doubt a great MU fan and I respect that, but I think you let your fan opinion shine too much. Vander has wanted to be NBA guy for years and he is in good position to achieve it. Cheer him on and cheer him on going forward.

Goose, you pulling out the Vander pom poms too? 

It's okay to have doubts about Vander and give your opinion, it's what Scoop is for.

[keefe]

Hilltopper
 
You are without a doubt a great MU fan and I respect that, but I think you let your fan opinion shine too much. Vander has wanted to be NBA guy for years and he is in good position to achieve it. Cheer him on and cheer him on going forward.

Goose

Well said. Thanks for saying it.

[Goose]

PTM

I have been a Vander fan from day one. None of this surprises me.

[🏀]

PTM

I have been a Vander fan from day one. None of this surprises me.

I'm really not that surprised either, and I've been a stout Vander defender.

In my opinion it's a poor decision, but my opinion could be poor. Who knows?

Hope he got the right information and made the best choice.

[Warriors10]

I don't understand this notion that because people here (including me) don't believe Vander will be drafted, that we are all of sudden Vander haters.  I'll cheer for the man to do great things in the upcoming months/years hopefully and I don't any doubt that Vander will work his ass off to achieve his dream/goals, but sorry for not seeing things through rose glasses just because he is from Marquette.  He is an undersized NBA 2 guard and doesn't have the outside shot to makeup for that (hell, even DJO couldn't among other things), his defense is average, MAYBE a little above average, for NBA talent, and did I mention he doesn't have that great of a jumpshot.  Yes he's pretty quick and can drive, but most people at the NBA level can/are as well.  Another year would have done him better from a basketball perspective, but I am not one to judge any other motives he probably had.

He did great things for this school's program over the past three years, especially this past year.  His game this year was leaps and bounds better than the past two years and it was great to see that.  He's a great player in college there is no doubt about that.

[Lennys Tap]

I think most here would disagree with you.   Jerel was a tremendous defender, not to mention prolific scorer (and has continued that in his D-League seasons) .. DJO was better in every category than Vander.

We'll see what NBA GMs have to say.

I'll take your word that the stats say Jerel and DJO were better than Vander, but neither of those guys were the complete player Vander was vs Butler or had the ability to finish at the rim to win games like Vander. Jerel and DJO are better three pioint shooters than Vander. I'd give Blue a tie or the edge in every other category.

[mu_hilltopper]

I'll take your word that the stats say Jerel and DJO were better than Vander, but neither of those guys were the complete player Vander was vs Butler or had the ability to finish at the rim to win games like Vander. Jerel and DJO are better three pioint shooters than Vander. I'd give Blue a tie or the edge in every other category.

It is interesting to compare these 3 players.  Vander and DJO both had 3 seasons at MU, albeit DJO didn't have a freshman year.  Jerel was a 4 year guy, but indeed, had to share his time with a future NBA player plus a near-NBA player (DJames).

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=darius-johnson-odom&darius-johnson-odom=career&i=1&jerel-mcneal=career&p1=vander-blue&p2=jerel-mcneal&vander-blue=career

Jerel was simply a complete package at MU.  His Freshman year, he scored 10+ 21 times (Vander: 7).  His Junior year, Jerel hit 20+ points 9 times, Vander 6.  (His Senior year, Jerel hit 20+ points an unreal 21 times.  Not sure you can be much more offensively dominant.)   While hard to quantify beyond steals, one could easily suggest Jerel was a tremendous defender subjectively better than Vander.   I'd say Jerel was elite, while Vander was quite good.  Could opinions differ?  Sure.

Comparing junior years, Jerel bested Vander in nearly every category, points, FG%, 3-FG%, assists, steals, rebounds, blocks.  The only major category Vander was better at was turnovers, with 20 fewer.   

Jerel's senior year was just unreal, but Vander is going to skip it, leaving us with only a hypothetical.  If I were to have to bet, I'd bet Vander's senior year wouldn't be as thoroughly dominant as Jerel's was.  Subjective, yet well based on their collective 3 year histories.

As for being able to finish at the rim?  McNeal did that plenty, building through 4 years.  Vander?  How can anyone forget his first two years?  Or heck, November and December of this year?   

Vander's comparison to DJO is better, although should we compare their Junior years, or their 3rd years at MU?  Not sure which is fairer, obviously DJO was better his 3rd/Senior year.

Junior year comparisons, DJO has more ppg, 3fg%, more assists, blocks, fewer turnovers.
Vander had a better FG%, steals, committed fewer fouls.

DJO certainly drove to the basket plenty, plus he had a solid jump-shot and 3 point shot.  Vander has neither.

In a statistical comparison, Jerel ranks first by a large margin, followed by DJO.  Vander appears to be 3rd.

[Groin_pull]

None of this matters if the shot goes in. This is the same form that lead us to the Elite 8. If you look at the NBA and its history, some of the ugliest shot were the most effective (Adrian Dantley, Vinnie Johnson, Shawn Marion, etc.).

That's fine, but their shots went in on a consistent basis.

[Aughnanure]

Was Vander even a 1,000 point scorer? Never heard anything about it.

[MUfan12]

I think the tourney success since the amigos left has led to them being underrated by MU fans. Especially Dominic and Jerel, since they haven't had the pro success Wesley has had.

All-time ranks: All three were top 10 scoring. James was #2 in assists, McNeal #7. McNeal #1 in steals, James #4.

Jerel was a second team All-American by the time he left! He was better than either of those guys, by far.

[Otule's Glass Eye]

Was Vander even a 1,000 point scorer? Never heard anything about it.

He was close, I think he had around 950.

EDIT: He had 982. One good game away from getting there.

[Chicos' Buzz Scandal Countdown]

It is interesting to compare these 3 players.  Vander and DJO both had 3 seasons at MU, albeit DJO didn't have a freshman year.  Jerel was a 4 year guy, but indeed, had to share his time with a future NBA player plus a near-NBA player (DJames).

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=darius-johnson-odom&darius-johnson-odom=career&i=1&jerel-mcneal=career&p1=vander-blue&p2=jerel-mcneal&vander-blue=career

Jerel was simply a complete package at MU.  His Freshman year, he scored 10+ 21 times (Vander: 7).  His Junior year, Jerel hit 20+ points 9 times, Vander 6.  (His Senior year, Jerel hit 20+ points an unreal 21 times.  Not sure you can be much more offensively dominant.)   While hard to quantify beyond steals, one could easily suggest Jerel was a tremendous defender subjectively better than Vander.   I'd say Jerel was elite, while Vander was quite good.  Could opinions differ?  Sure.

Comparing junior years, Jerel bested Vander in nearly every category, points, FG%, 3-FG%, assists, steals, rebounds, blocks.  The only major category Vander was better at was turnovers, with 20 fewer.   

Jerel's senior year was just unreal, but Vander is going to skip it, leaving us with only a hypothetical.  If I were to have to bet, I'd bet Vander's senior year wouldn't be as thoroughly dominant as Jerel's was.  Subjective, yet well based on their collective 3 year histories.

As for being able to finish at the rim?  McNeal did that plenty, building through 4 years.  Vander?  How can anyone forget his first two years?  Or heck, November and December of this year?   

Vander's comparison to DJO is better, although should we compare their Junior years, or their 3rd years at MU?  Not sure which is fairer, obviously DJO was better his 3rd/Senior year.

Junior year comparisons, DJO has more ppg, 3fg%, more assists, blocks, fewer turnovers.
Vander had a better FG%, steals, committed fewer fouls.

DJO certainly drove to the basket plenty, plus he had a solid jump-shot and 3 point shot.  Vander has neither.

In a statistical comparison, Jerel ranks first by a large margin, followed by DJO.  Vander appears to be 3rd.

Comparing players from different draft years doesn't give a strong indication of likelihood of being drafted.... only comparisons with other players in this years draft.

Vander isn't competing with Jerel for a draft spot.

[flash]

Decent shot he gets a trip to Vegas for summer ball.  That's as close to the NBA as he's getting.  Plenty of overseas opportunity though.

I would give him a 100 percent chance of playing in this years NBA summer league.  Its not exactly difficult to make a summer league roster these days, Dwight Buycks was on a summer league roster, and suprisingly played well.  Having said that, I have a feeling Vander will suprise a lot of people, 1st round wouldnt completley shock me. 

[mu_hilltopper]

Comparing players from different draft years doesn't give a strong indication of likelihood of being drafted.... only comparisons with other players in this years draft.

Vander isn't competing with Jerel for a draft spot.

That is completely understood.  The post was about their college careers.

[mu72warrior]

One thing about bad advice, it always tells you what you want to hear!

[Groin_pull]

I would give him a 100 percent chance of playing in this years NBA summer league.  Its not exactly difficult to make a summer league roster these days, Dwight Buycks was on a summer league roster, and suprisingly played well.  Having said that, I have a feeling Vander will suprise a lot of people, 1st round wouldnt completley shock me. 

It would shock me. But then again, this is the weakest NBA draft in many years.