MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: hegel23 on May 27, 2008, 08:14:47 AM
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Rivals said he is coming.
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Can anyone confirm? ANyone in Madison hearing anything?
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confirmed.
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Excellent...now grow 2 Inches and work on those grades!!! Nice job to Buzz and the staff on closing the deal last week... :)
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good get. Congrats Buzz!
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Sweet! Nice job Buzz on your first commit for your first recruiting class. Looking forward to Maymon on the court in a year and a half.
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First non-Texas recruit for Buzz! Good job!
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(http://www.vujer.com/material/files/Borat_Two_thumbs_up_yours.jpg)
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Scout has him committed to MU.
http://marquette.scout.com/a.z?s=415&p=8&c=1&nid=2428477
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Pretty amazing job by Buzz, he steps in and basically steals a top 100 recruit in 2 months. He deserves a lot of credit for pulling this off.
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Sweet! Nice job Buzz on your first commit for your first recruiting class. Looking forward to Maymon on the court in a year and a half.
I'm going to count Erik Williams and O'Tule as Buzz's recruits and this will be his 2nd 09' commit. ;)
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Great job BUZZ!!!!! One down and two to go.
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Does this help with Jamil?
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Great job BUZZ!!!!! One down and two to go.
don't we have 3 more scholarships available in '09, 5 total (assuming we don't fill the one available for '08)?
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Great job BUZZ!!!!! One down and two to go.
If one of "the two" is Wilson I think you can kiss that goodbye. I'm positive that Maymon was pretty clear on playing time and more specifically, Jamil Wilson. Considering they play the same position I think you can count Wilson out.
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Excellent commitment. Buzz was hired by MU for the specific purpose of getting these types of recruits and this is a great start. Now finish the deal with the remaining slots for 2009. PG please.
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If one of "the two" is Wilson I think you can kiss that goodbye. I'm positive that Maymon was pretty clear on playing time and more specifically, Jamil Wilson. Considering they play the same position I think you can count Wilson out.
right, because players NEVER change positions, and its much more important to have a 'position' guy out there than to have your best players.
right.
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Bring on Wilson and Lacy and you will have MU's best recruiting class in a long, long time. Wilson and Maymon are two different players. Wilson can play 2, 3 or 4.
Eso--Wilson and Maymon can play together ALL day long. Study the players and their strengths before you state your case. The two can be running mates with no problem.
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Well, even though I am a little worried about the playing time issue, the grades and the father, I think it speaks very well for Buzz that he got a player that he wanted.
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If Wilson is not coming to MU becuase Maymon is going to share time with him, why is he considering MSU and Duke? If he's afraid of Maymon, why does he think he can start on a team of former McDonald's AA at Duke/MSU?
Unless you tell me Wilson and Maymon don't get along, this is good news for getting Wilson (but doesn't mean he's coming). It shows that good recruits are not afraid of Buzz/MU without Crean. No longer can other schools say "with Crean gone MU will never get another decent recruit." EW and Mymon put that to rest.
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It is funny that Crean couldn't bring in a highly ranked forward lately to save his life. Now Buzz has 2 "top-100" forward commits for 2009. Now is time to see Buzz's prowess at recruiting guards. Lacy in '09 and Johnson in '10 would be pretty sweet!
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If Wilson is not coming to MU becuase Maymon is going to share time with him, why is he considering MSU and Duke? If he's afraid of Maymon, why does he think he can start on a team of former McDonald's AA at Duke/MSU?
Unless you tell me Wilson and Maymon don't get along, this is good news for getting Wilson (but doesn't mean he's coming). It shows that good recruits are not afraid of Buzz/MU without Crean. No longer can other schools say "with Crean gone MU will never get another decent recruit." EW and Mymon put that to rest.
Agreed, I think this commit along with Erik's helps get the word out there to other players, coaches, and AAU reps that Buzz and MU are still key players with big recruits...
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Here's the story from the Madison paper...
http://www.madison.com/tct/sports//288287
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WORD!!!
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6'7" within the last 2 weeks? Good to hear...now just stretch another inch or 2 and keep working on those grades and jump shot...GO MU!
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This is a huge get for Buzz and staff on many levels -- fills a need for true beast on the boards, gets the best '09 in-state player, affirms Buzz's rep as a recruiter, gets a verbal from a player with a chip on his shoulder for the reds to the west (and understands the rivary), and continues to build momentum for a great overall '09 class (which we need sorely need post-James, McNeal and Matthews).
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Officially.
Excited.
;D
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If Wilson is not coming to MU becuase Maymon is going to share time with him, why is he considering MSU and Duke? If he's afraid of Maymon, why does he think he can start on a team of former McDonald's AA at Duke/MSU?
Unless you tell me Wilson and Maymon don't get along, this is good news for getting Wilson (but doesn't mean he's coming). It shows that good recruits are not afraid of Buzz/MU without Crean. No longer can other schools say "with Crean gone MU will never get another decent recruit." EW and Mymon put that to rest.
You're missing the point, all Maymon talked about was starting right away...though its possible, I don't think he would take the chance if Wilson and Williams were going to be on the squad. Read between the lines.
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You're missing the point, all Maymon talked about was starting right away...though its possible, I don't think he would take the chance if Wilson and Williams were going to be on the squad. Read between the lines.
Read between the lines? You do know that Wilson isn't committing until next year...March 2009? So does that mean he already committed and talked with maymon and said he isn't coming to MU? Get over it Chicken Little, the sky isn't falling and we don't know where Wilson is or isn't landing...wait to see before we read between the lines of a March 2009 decision.
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right, because players NEVER change positions, and its much more important to have a 'position' guy out there than to have your best players.
right.
My esoteric mind tells me that you're being sarcastic, which is fine. It also tells me MU has Williams, Fulce, Maymon, Wilson, and Lazar all playing the same two positions? Based on what I've read Maymon said he wanted to start right away, importance of 10 on a 1-10 scale. I'm sorry, but he wouldn't have come here had he been told MU had a shot at Wilson.
It doesn't take George W. to figure out that Wilson is likely out for MU.
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My esoteric mind tells me that you're being sarcastic, which is fine. It also tells me MU has Williams, Fulce, Maymon, Wilson, and Lazar all playing the same two positions? Based on what I've read Maymon said he wanted to start right away, importance of 10 on a 1-10 scale. I'm sorry, but he wouldn't have come here had he been told MU had a shot at Wilson.
It doesn't take George W. to figure out that Wilson is likely out for MU.
Speculation is fine... but let's not treat your interpretation of Maymon's quotes as if they are factual.
You could be right about everything... but let's be honest, there is a lot of conjecture in your statement.
Unless you know either Maymon or Wilson personally, you have know way of knowing what is "important to them".
Again, your speculation about a log jam is valid, but I'm not sure I'm ready to jump off the bridge that Wilson isn't coming simply because Maymon is.
You can read between the lines all you want... but these are 17 year old kids... things can change quickly.
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If Wilson wants to go to the NBA, which I strongly suspect, I would recommend playing the 2. I think he can still come here and we would have starting lineup with incredible athleticism with him at the 2, Williams at 3 and Maymon at the 4.
Edit: Lazar will get plenty of minutes at 3/4 as well, probably starting at the 3.
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Story on Maymon's commitment now up at ...
http://www.wissports.net/sports/hoopsb/article.asp?nid=14845
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It seems as though teams like Louisville and Memphis have been very successful [Each having been to a Final Four in the last two years] with multiple players that on paper would seem to play the same position.
I'm just fine with a lineup that goes:
PG & then 4 athletic players between 6'5 & 6'10
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You're missing the point, all Maymon talked about was starting right away...though its possible, I don't think he would take the chance if Wilson and Williams were going to be on the squad. Read between the lines.
Why wouldn't Williams be on the squad? Has he stated that he isn't going to honor his verbal? Not that I am aware of.
As for Wilson, it is going to be difficult to land the guy, but that doesn't mean that Buzz should be on a Wilson-or-Bust type of mission. This is a good get.
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Is he SF or PF at MU?
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Jeronne Maymon to Marquette
Written by: noreply@blogger.com (Henry Sugar)
Jeronne Maymon (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball_recruits/jeronne_maymon), a highly ranked 6'6" 235 pound forward from Madison Memorial High School, committed to Marquette this morning per IWB from the Scout.com board (http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=415#s=415&f=2850&t=2517069). Dave Telep (http://scouthoops.scout.com/) also has the story up.
The Madison Capital Times (http://www.madison.com/tct/sports//288287) has a story about the commitment. Rosiak's blog (http://blogs.jsonline.com/muhoops/archive/2008/05/27/maymon-commits-to-mu.aspx) is also on the case with an update as well. Mark Miller (http://www.wissports.net/sports/hoopsb/article.asp?nid=14845) has a great article at Wissports.net.
With Maymon (ranked #58 in the junior class by Scout.com) Buzz has now secured two top 100 commitments for his first two spots in the 2009 recruiting class. Last year, 6'7" Erik Williams (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball_recruits/erik_williams) from Cy Springs High School in suburban Houston committed to Marquette.
The combination of Maymon and Williams is intriguing and provides a glimpse into the roster re-build underway at MU. For more than a decade, the Warriors have been vulnerable to opponents that were more athletic on the blocks and on the wings. It seems that Buzz Williams had enough of those mismatches. With Maymon, likely a 3/4 combo forward in college, and Erik Williams, more of a small forward/wing player, Buzz Williams (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball/buzz_williams) is fast building a roster of versatile, athletic players at positions where MU failed to land high-ceiling talent in the past.
Nicely done, Buzz. Stay tuned for more information and coverage regarding this highly talented player.
http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2008/05/jeronne-maymon-to-marquette.html
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Is he SF or PF at MU?
PF - he weighs almost 240 and has apparently grown an inch 6'7".
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Hey, I hope I'm wrong....it is pure speculation.
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chicos - time to get on board
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I can see Maymon playing the 2,3 or 4 at MU. We are supposedly running a 4 out 1 in motion offense so those positions are fairly interchangeable
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perfect - The young man sounds like he has grown to 6'7" 239 lbs. Must be that Wisconsin Milk.
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It is funny that Crean couldn't bring in a highly ranked forward lately to save his life. Now Buzz has 2 "top-100" forward commits for 2009. Now is time to see Buzz's prowess at recruiting guards. Lacy in '09 and Johnson in '10 would be pretty sweet!
Great get by Buzz.
As for your comment, didn't Erik Williams commit to MU while Tom Crean was the head coach? Just asking
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Great get by Buzz.
As for your comment, didn't Erik Williams commit to MU while Tom Crean was the head coach? Just asking
Chicos,
I understand your argument that most kids committ to coaches and I agree with that statement as evidence shows with NW, TT, and any other recruit we were after before Crean left that is now on "indiana's list". however, EW remain committed to MU after Crean left, with Buzz as the head coach, as did Fulce and O'Tule which tells me they were more committed to either the program or Buzz, the guy who recruited them.
Of course EW committed when Crean was here but let's be honest...it wasn't until Buzz was there that we landed him and before that Crean hadn't even seen Texas on a map let alone recruited anyone out of that state. I'm still including EW and JM as Buzz's recruits...
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I can see Maymon playing the 2,3 or 4 at MU. We are supposedly running a 4 out 1 in motion offense so those positions are fairly interchangeable
Where did you hear this? I haven't read anything about it. Would love a link.
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Here's the story from the Madison paper...
http://www.madison.com/tct/sports//288287
Those numbers in the state tournament are SICK! Glad to have him!!
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Where did you hear this? I haven't read anything about it. Would love a link.
Jimmy Butler mentioned it either when he committed or right after he committed in one of the Tyler papers. That's the only time anyone on the team has said it was going to happen, but given Buzz's background it wouldn't surprise me.
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I just saw the picture of Maymon and his dad in the Wisconsin State Journal. Without realizing it, I had a conversation with Tim Maymon about ten days ago in Madison at a low level AAU tournament. My son's team played a team he coached, and my son played fairly well in a close loss. He came up to me and talked for about five minutes on what a nice shot he has and some things he should work on to make him a better player. Really nice guy. Very funny on the sidelines too. "What part of man-to-man defense don't you understand?" was a classic.
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Great get by Buzz.
As for your comment, didn't Erik Williams commit to MU while Tom Crean was the head coach? Just asking
Since Buzz has been getting bashed about the continuity of the team with Nick Williams and Ty Taylor leaving then Buzz and not TC deserves all the credit for Eric Williams coming to MU. Eric Williams came to MU mainly due to his relationship with Buzz and once Buzz received the job he had to re-recruit everyone. Or so that is story being pushed around here by those that don't like the Buzz hire.
Now is this a great get? I don't know. I guess it depends on if he qualifies.
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PF - he weighs almost 240 and has apparently grown an inch 6'7".
But if you read the articles, his father mentions he's been training Jeronne to be anything from a 1-4 and looking at our squad next season I don't see him starting at the 3 or 4 and he's been promised a starting spot so it's got to be the 2.
Great job by Buzz. He immediately made Maymon the #1 target of the 2009 class and landed him only three weeks later.
IMO, this means 3 things:
1) Between Erik Williams and Jeronne Maymon, the writing is on the wall re: Jamil Wilson. Yes, yes, MU will still pursue him but unless they land Johnnie Lacy (and pray on the books) and exploit that friendship to the brink I don't see Wilson at MU.
2) Perception means more then reality. Buzz landed a Wisconsin kid. Along with the news that he is pursuing Kyle Kelm, and we remain the team to beat for Lacy, this shows the state that the Texas cowboy won't ignore his homestead.
3) Along the lines of point #2, this should be big news on the recruiting circuit. Erik Williams is highly thought of and highly rated. The same with Maymon. When news spreads this week that MU has two outstanding forward prospects, you have to think highly rated point guards will give a closer look to MU.
I hope the early pledge allows Maymon the time and energy to hit the books and make sure he qualifies. You can't make Bucky regret their decision if you can't get into MU.
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My esoteric mind tells me that you're being sarcastic, which is fine. It also tells me MU has Williams, Fulce, Maymon, Wilson, and Lazar all playing the same two positions? Based on what I've read Maymon said he wanted to start right away, importance of 10 on a 1-10 scale. I'm sorry, but he wouldn't have come here had he been told MU had a shot at Wilson.
It doesn't take George W. to figure out that Wilson is likely out for MU.
I have no idea what Wilson will do and won't pretend to know something I don't.
But, as to your remarks re: Maymon, those comments about starting were, in fact, made by his father, not Jeronne himself. And, they're comments his father has backed away from as recently as today.
So, if you're going to make a big deal about those comments, at least be aware of who made them and when they were made.
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As for your comment, didn't Erik Williams commit to MU while Tom Crean was the head coach? Just asking
Houston prep writer Jim Hicks speaking to Cracked Sidewalks about Erik Williams and Chris Otule:
Was MU in on these kids before Buzz Williams joined the Marquette staff?
I doubt very seriously that Marquette was anything more than Dwyane Wade's old school before Buzz arrived. Actually, after the results of Karon Bradley (from the same HS as Erik Williams), it was a very long shot for you guys to land another kid from that very same high school, especially an underclassman. That just simply proves the impact of pre-existing relationships in recruiting.
http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2007/11/in-depth-look-at-chris-otule-and-erik.html
I'd say it's pretty evident that E. Williams and Otule (not to mention Joseph Fulce) came to Marquette because of Buzz Williams.
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A couple of key quotes from the Mark Miller article:
“My mom wants me to still be around people of God,” Maymon said. “She liked the fact Marquette is a Christian school. She wants me to be around God and still be listening to the word.”
“They guaranteed me a starting spot, but I know I will have to work hard to keep that starting spot,” Maymon said.
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Chicos,
I understand your argument that most kids committ to coaches and I agree with that statement as evidence shows with NW, TT, and any other recruit we were after before Crean left that is now on "indiana's list". however, EW remain committed to MU after Crean left, with Buzz as the head coach, as did Fulce and O'Tule which tells me they were more committed to either the program or Buzz, the guy who recruited them.
Of course EW committed when Crean was here but let's be honest...it wasn't until Buzz was there that we landed him and before that Crean hadn't even seen Texas on a map let alone recruited anyone out of that state. I'm still including EW and JM as Buzz's recruits...
Yes, but if Crean had stayed would people say Erik Williams committed to Buzz? Please. Of course not...the head coach ALWAYS gets the final credit for landing a kid because that's who he is playing for. Downtown apparently forgot about top 100 Trevor Mbakwe just the year prior....another forward. Or some guy named Lazar Haywar, another top 100 player...another forward.
Crean signed plenty of forwards, just not plenty of power forwards or centers.
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Madison Memorial's Maymon commits
Written by: Todd Rosiak
For the second year in a row and the third year in the last four, the Marquette Golden Eagles have landed Wisconsin's state high school player of the year.
Jeronne Maymon, a forward from Madison Memorial who's finishing his junior year, has given an oral commitment to play for MU and new coach Buzz Williams.
He announced his commitment earlier today, selecting MU over, among others, Tennessee, Southern California, Providence, Iowa State and Baylor. NCAA champion Kansas also expressed interest in Maymon as recently as last week.
"I was definitely elated that he picked somewhere close that wouldn't stress the family out," said Tim Maymon, Jeronne's father. "We're his support and we're always going to be his backbone, and be there for him. We just want to make sure my son will have the best college career he can have, and we want to do everything possible to be pleasing in his eyes as well as God's."
Maymon averaged 21.0 points and 11.7 rebounds last season at Madison Memorial, which is also the alma mater of MU senior guard Wesley Matthews, who was named Wisconsin's Mr. Basketball in 2005. He will enter next season just 133 points shy of breaking Matthews' school scoring record (1,322) and 30 rebounds shy of breaking Keaton Nankivil's rebounding record (581).
Nankivil was named co-state player of the year in 2007 along with former MU guard Scott Christopherson, and currently plays at Wisconsin.
"They've got a great relationship. They're pretty much buddy-buddy," said Tim Maymon. "Him and my two sons talk all the time. Jeronne and Devonte both talk to Wesley. They do a lot of 1-on-1 techniques at Memorial, a lot of players come back and they do a lot of scrimmaging. They just help each other out, and I thank Wesley and Keaton and all them guys for being an influence and role models for Jeronne and Devonte, I really do."
Ranked as the 58th-best player overall heading into the summer by Scout.com, Maymon burst onto the scene in March when he averaged 30.0 points, 14.6 rebounds, 4.7 blocks, 3.7 steals and 3.0 assists per game for the Spartans in the WIAA state basketball tournament, where they lost to Wauwatosa East in overtime in the Division 1 championship game.
Memorial finished with a 23-3 record.
Maymon, who visited MU unofficially on May 20, is the second member of MU's 2009-'10 recruiting class, joining 6-7 forward Erik Williams of Cypress Springs (Texas) High School. The Golden Eagles have three additional scholarships available, one of which is almost certain to be earmarked for a point guard.
He is also the first in-state recruit for Williams, who replaced Tom Crean on April 7.
Maymon likely will be projected as a combination forward at MU, although his size and strength would seem to make him a natural fit at power forward -- he's measured out at 6 feet 7 inches and 238 pounds within the last two weeks, and also boasts an impressive 7-6 wing span to go along with an estimated 36-inch vertical leap.
"(Williams) said Jeronne will play pretty much the two, three, four, and Jeronne loves the three," said Tim Maymon. "He'll play some two and some four depending on the teams. We're going to create a lot of matchups."
Williams, ranked 83rd overall by Scout.com, is projected as a small forward who might be able to play some shooting guard as he develops.
There are questions about Maymon' s academic standing; his GPA is currently a 2.0. Tim Maymon said his son's grades have been on an uptick lately, however, and that he'll be attending summer school in an attempt to improve them even more heading into his senior year.
"His grades are decent," said Tim Maymon. "He has Bs and Cs. He has one D in chemistry that he's brought up already. He took a test and I think he brought it up to a C+, but he still has the final to go. His grades are decent. The only thing we're worried about is the core GPA, which we've got to bring up over a 2.1.
"Jeronne, I project him a 2.3, 2.4 GPA by the time his senior year is over. We're definitely glad we're committed because now we have the structure in place to get Jeronne to the right grade level."
Williams, due to NCAA regulations, is unable to comment on Maymon until he signs a national letter of intent with MU in November.
(http://blogs.jsonline.com/aggbug.aspx?PostID=235111)
http://blogs.jsonline.com/muhoops/archive/2008/05/27/maymon-commits-to-mu.aspx
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Houston prep writer Jim Hicks speaking to Cracked Sidewalks about Erik Williams and Chris Otule:
Was MU in on these kids before Buzz Williams joined the Marquette staff?
I doubt very seriously that Marquette was anything more than Dwyane Wade's old school before Buzz arrived. Actually, after the results of Karon Bradley (from the same HS as Erik Williams), it was a very long shot for you guys to land another kid from that very same high school, especially an underclassman. That just simply proves the impact of pre-existing relationships in recruiting.
http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2007/11/in-depth-look-at-chris-otule-and-erik.html
I'd say it's pretty evident that E. Williams and Otule (not to mention Joseph Fulce) came to Marquette because of Buzz Williams.
I don't disagree...but when you say who landed a kid, it's the head coach that always gets the final credit because that's who he's playing for. Afterall, last I checked it was the head coach that hires the assistant coaches. ;) You hire assistant coaches to bring in players and the captain of the ship gets the ultimate credit for that....always has and always will.
Point is, the past coaching staff signed several forwards in the last few years that were highly rated....not sure where some people suggest that wasn't the case. Williams, Mkwabe, Hayward, Saunders were all signed by the previous coaching staff....all were top 100 or 4 star players. It's terrific Williams is staying and I love the Maymon get but to suggest that MU under Crean wasn't landing quality forwards recently is just not factually correct.
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Congrats to Buzz and the staff. Great get!!!
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Besides GPA, what does he need to do on the ACT/SAT to be in good academic standing going into his Freshman year at MU?
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+1
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I don't disagree...but when you say who landed a kid, it's the head coach that always gets the final credit because that's who he's playing for. Afterall, last I checked it was the head coach that hires the assistant coaches. ;) You hire assistant coaches to bring in players and the captain of the ship gets the ultimate credit for that....always has and always will.
Fair enough.
But at this point, unlike Fulce and Otule, Erik Williams is a junior who could easily re-open his recruitment and go anywhere else without any paperwork or penalties. He chose instead to re-affirm his verbal to Marquette and head coach Buzz Williams.
If the fact that he only committed to MU because of assistant coach Buzz Williams isn't enough for you to call him a Buzz recruit, then the fact he re-affirmed his verbal to head coach Buzz Williams should be all the persuasion you need.
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Besides GPA, what does he need to do on the ACT/SAT to be in good academic standing going into his Freshman year at MU?
Good luck making sense of this, but it appears that if he can get a 2.1 GPA, he'd need a 970 on his SAT.
http://www.jacksonville.k12.al.us/uploadedFiles/Image/NCAAeligibility.pdf
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Most Midwesterners take the ACT instead of the SAT. With a 2.1, he'd need an ACT composite of 82, which averages out to be a 20.5 on each section. Given that the minimum ACT is a 17 (68 composite), lets hope that he takes the test early and gives himself enough opportunities to repeat if need be (in addition to getting that core GPA up).
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Fair enough.
But at this point, unlike Fulce and Otule, Erik Williams is a junior who could easily re-open his recruitment and go anywhere else without any paperwork or penalties. He chose instead to re-affirm his verbal to Marquette and head coach Buzz Williams.
If the fact that he only committed to MU because of assistant coach Buzz Williams isn't enough for you to call him a Buzz recruit, then the fact he re-affirmed his verbal to head coach Buzz Williams should be all the persuasion you need.
+1
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Thats not good. If he has had academic trouble, I think he might have some problems getting a 970 which is slightly above average if memory serves me well.
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Fair enough.
But at this point, unlike Fulce and Otule, Erik Williams is a junior who could easily re-open his recruitment and go anywhere else without any paperwork or penalties. He chose instead to re-affirm his verbal to Marquette and head coach Buzz Williams.
If the fact that he only committed to MU because of assistant coach Buzz Williams isn't enough for you to call him a Buzz recruit, then the fact he re-affirmed his verbal to head coach Buzz Williams should be all the persuasion you need.
LOL. I'm not saying he isn't a Buzz recruit...in fact I'll say out loud HE'S A BUZZ RECRUIT. I took exception to Downtown's comments about MU not signing quality forwards the last few years...that was incorrect. Glad Buzz is reeling them in, let's hope it continues. So far so good.
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I don't disagree...but when you say who landed a kid, it's the head coach that always gets the final credit because that's who he's playing for. Afterall, last I checked it was the head coach that hires the assistant coaches. ;) You hire assistant coaches to bring in players and the captain of the ship gets the ultimate credit for that....always has and always will.
Point is, the past coaching staff signed several forwards in the last few years that were highly rated....not sure where some people suggest that wasn't the case. Williams, Mkwabe, Hayward, Saunders were all signed by the previous coaching staff....all were top 100 or 4 star players. It's terrific Williams is staying and I love the Maymon get but to suggest that MU under Crean wasn't landing quality forwards recently is just not factually correct.
I find it funny how Chicos always comes to the defense of Crean even though it is nearly universally recognized that he proved to be pretty lousey at recruiting forwards. I would like to mention that Hayward was projected to be a "2" out of prep school (he played the 2 in prep school) and was not projected to play the "4" like he has been at MU. It was only the logjam at guards that forced him to play at the "4." Chicos, here is a challange, name one "Crean" forward recruit (besides Hayward who is really a guard playing out of position) amongst the list you mentioned, or not on the list you mentioned, that has had a positive impact on the program. RJax is the only forward who comes to mind but is he really a Crean recruit? The results have been mixed at best. I hope Buzz can right the ship here.
On the other hand, college ball is a guards game and having lots of highly ranked forwards will not do us any good if we don't have the guards who can get them the ball and can play defense. I have always said, you need balance.
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YES! Maymon_toMU09! :D
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Pretty amazing job by Buzz, he steps in and basically steals a top 100 recruit in 2 months. He deserves a lot of credit for pulling this off.
Was this kid recruited at all by TC before he left for IU?
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Was this kid recruited at all by TC before he left for IU?
From an interview with Jeronne's dad, any recruiting by Crean was tepid at best. It only heated up after Buzz became the head coach. Buzz essentially sealed the deal in less than two months without any substantial contact with Jeronne beforehand.
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Thats not good. If he has had academic trouble, I think he might have some problems getting a 970 which is slightly above average if memory serves me well.
1990Warrior - I am guessing from your name you took the SAT in the late 1980s, so you might not be aware the test changes a few years ago and a third section was added. All three scores are reported on the 200-to-800 scale. So before a perfect score was a 1600, now it is a 2400 I believe.
2007 College-Bound Seniors' Average Scores
* Critical reading: 502
* Mathematics: 515
* Writing: 494
http://www.collegeboard.com/student/testing/sat/scores/sending/sendingFAQ.html (http://www.collegeboard.com/student/testing/sat/scores/sending/sendingFAQ.html)
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So he would need a 325 in Math, 325 in Reading and a 325 in Writing to get the 970? My son, who took the new SAT two years ago (brag time here - got a 2150) told me you get a 200 in each section just for taking it. Sure it will all work out, but interesting.
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I find it funny how Chicos always comes to the defense of Crean even though it is nearly universally recognized that he proved to be pretty lousey at recruiting forwards. I would like to mention that Hayward was projected to be a "2" out of prep school (he played the 2 in prep school) and was not projected to play the "4" like he has been at MU. It was only the logjam at guards that forced him to play at the "4." Chicos, here is a challange, name one "Crean" forward recruit (besides Hayward who is really a guard playing out of position) amongst the list you mentioned, or not on the list you mentioned, that has had a positive impact on the program. RJax is the only forward who comes to mind but is he really a Crean recruit? The results have been mixed at best. I hope Buzz can right the ship here.
On the other hand, college ball is a guards game and having lots of highly ranked forwards will not do us any good if we don't have the guards who can get them the ball and can play defense. I have always said, you need balance.
Downtown...before I asnwer your question...do you think a 3 is a forward. When you answer that question, I can answer your question. For the record, I consider the 3 a small FORWARD.
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Was this kid recruited at all by TC before he left for IU?
Not much....Crean's staff was worried about the kids grades as was Bo Ryan's staff.
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Not much....Crean's staff was worried about the kids grades as was Bo Ryan's staff.
It wasn't just grades. Maymon wasn't really considered to be a high major prospect until the end of the prep season, but his game exploded over the last few months. Prior to that his only high major interest was from Baylor and Clemson. The rest of the schools were places like UWM, UWGB, Temple etc.
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nyg
The referred to 970 total is in the two original areas;critical reading and math. Most schools are still trying to figure out what to do with the third score other than for placement purposes.
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A couple of key quotes from the Mark Miller article:
“They guaranteed me a starting spot, but I know I will have to work hard to keep that starting spot,” Maymon said.
Did Buzz really guarantee him a starting spot? Is that wise? Combined with his comment that he'll have to "work hard to keep that starting spot," what exactly does it mean to have a guaranteed starting spot? I thought a guarantee meant you would not have to work hard to keep it. If you work hard to earn it, then a guarantee is not necessary. Was he guaranteed to start his first game, or eventually if he worked hard?
Please explain???
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It wasn't just grades. Maymon wasn't really considered to be a high major prospect until the end of the prep season, but his game exploded over the last few months. Prior to that his only high major interest was from Baylor and Clemson. The rest of the schools were places like UWM, UWGB, Temple etc.
He definitely blew up of late, but UW-Madison and the state schools knew of the grades issue long ago.
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Did Buzz really guarantee him a starting spot? Is that wise? Combined with his comment that he'll have to "work hard to keep that starting spot," what exactly does it mean to have a guaranteed starting spot? I thought a guarantee meant you would not have to work hard to keep it. If you work hard to earn it, then a guarantee is not necessary. Was he guaranteed to start his first game, or eventually if he worked hard?
Please explain???
I don't believe in guaranteeing anything to any recruit....definitely a change from the previous regime. Hope this makes sense. Sounds like if you think you're good enough, you can make some demands. Steve Lavin used to do that out here at UCLA. Certainly helped him land some great players but some would argue presented some other issues regarding team chemistry, etc.
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It wasn't just grades. Maymon wasn't really considered to be a high major prospect until the end of the prep season, but his game exploded over the last few months. Prior to that his only high major interest was from Baylor and Clemson. The rest of the schools were places like UWM, UWGB, Temple etc.
I don't know about that.......I remember reading and hearing about Maymon quite a bit when Nankivil was still at Memorial. A lot of people felt he had the talent level and physical maturity to play college basketball but almost immediately upon people discussing him there was always a "yeah....but" and then either the academics or misbehavior story would follow.
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Chico's----If Buzz made a starting promise it is a major mistake. That is my only fear with Buzz...he might make promises to get players. You cannot do that for long. I hope he did not promise anything, but I have a feeling that he did. The quicker you recruit from strength the better. We do not want to have a Lavin situation. I tried to ignore the promise but it is a black cloud to me if true.
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Chico's----If Buzz made a starting promise it is a major mistake. That is my only fear with Buzz...he might make promises to get players. You cannot do that for long. I hope he did not promise anything, but I have a feeling that he did. The quicker you recruit from strength the better. We do not want to have a Lavin situation. I tried to ignore the promise but it is a black cloud to me if true.
I am repeating from another post, but this REALLY worries me. How can you make this sort of promise. In the 2-4 positions, we have Cubillan, Hayward, Butler, Mbakwe, E. Williams, Fulce.. I read in his father's interview 25-30 minutes a game! I hope he was exaggerating. You just can't make that kind of promise unless this is next Beasley or something.
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A coach should never promise a starting spot. No one needed to promise Beasley because he knew he would start virtually anywhere. A small fear here, but promises usually = trouble. Lets hope that Buzz is recruiting from strength and not empty promises. I don't care if we have one guy at that position or 22 guys you never make a promise.
When I think of making promises the first thing that comes to mind is slippery. Lavin is scary comparison.
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I don't know about that.......I remember reading and hearing about Maymon quite a bit when Nankivil was still at Memorial. A lot of people felt he had the talent level and physical maturity to play college basketball but almost immediately upon people discussing him there was always a "yeah....but" and then either the academics or misbehavior story would follow.
People felt he had the talent level to be a D-1 player sure, but not high major until very recently. Remember, up until the updates of a few weeks ago, Maymon was not even thought of as a top 100 player. He was a 3 star fringe top 150 player. Now he's a 4 star top 60 player. For over a year, he had a total of two high major offers. Since mid-April he received offers from MU, Tennessee, Iowa State and USC. In that time, the academic concerns haven't changed, and there are still questions about his behavior. What has changed is his play. He had one of the most dominating performances in State Tournament history. He was consistently at a high level during the regular season, and he's been very good in AAU ball. He's turned out a lot better than people though he would even just 6 months ago.
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If Buzz made a starting promise it is a major mistake. That is my only fear with Buzz...he might make promises to get players. You cannot do that for long. I hope he did not promise anything, but I have a feeling that he did.
How surprised can we be that Buzz might make a questionable promise, what with the incredible pressure to overcome the poor hire that he is?! MU fans have put him in a really challenging position, with little room for growth. He knows he needs to perform, and quickly, or MU nation is going to come down hard.
That said, it does really worry me that Maymon's commitment seems to highlight two undesirables: offering promises of starting and a certain number of minutes, and putting the university in a position were the athletic department wants the university to accept someone who barely squeaks by with his grades and scores. Aren't MU's admission standards higher than that? They were when I was there (even for people in the Freshman Frontier Program, lovingly known as Freshman Fu**-ups!). I was really turned off my Maymon's dad's comments that seemed to imply that getting by and qualifying was acceptable to him.
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That said, it does really worry me that Maymon's commitment seems to highlight two undesirables: offering promises of starting and a certain number of minutes, and putting the university in a position were the athletic department wants the university to accept someone who barely squeaks by with his grades and scores.
Ever hear of a guy named Dwyane Wade?
Maymon certainly isn't the first MU recruit who's needed to do some work in the classroom in order to qualify, and he won't be the last. Heck, the academics of the top recruit in each of Crean's last two classes were gone over with a fine-tooth comb by the NCAA before they were declared eligible.
In a perfect world, Maymon and every MU recruit would be a 3.8 GPA or better student with a 31 ACT. But that's not the case now, nor has it ever been.
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Ever hear of a guy named Dwyane Wade?
Maymon certainly isn't the first MU recruit who's needed to do some work in the classroom in order to qualify, and he won't be the last. Heck, the academics of the top recruit in each of Crean's last two classes were gone over with a fine-tooth comb by the NCAA before they were declared eligible.
In a perfect world, Maymon and every MU recruit would be a 3.8 GPA or better student with a 31 ACT. But that's not the case now, nor has it ever been.
Wade came under the umbrella of partial-qualifier, a wise, yet now extinct practice of the NCAA. I'm was a big fan of the partial-qualifier rule.
Hayward and Mbakwe were hyper-reviewed, not for their grades or scores, but for the institutions that had granted their diplomas. There is a difference.
I'm not opposed to granting admission leniency to some athletes (especially given MU's commitment to and track of academic success and graduation). If anything, I worry that one of Buzz's first commitments might be coming from the need to lower our standards a bit, if only because we (MU nation) are putting great, perhaps unrealistic, pressure on him to perform. I don't want this example of guaranteeing playing time and of lowering admission standards to become regular practice, and I assume you don't either.
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I find it funny how Chicos always comes to the defense of Crean even though it is nearly universally recognized that he proved to be pretty lousey at recruiting forwards. I would like to mention that Hayward was projected to be a "2" out of prep school (he played the 2 in prep school) and was not projected to play the "4" like he has been at MU. It was only the logjam at guards that forced him to play at the "4." Chicos, here is a challange, name one "Crean" forward recruit (besides Hayward who is really a guard playing out of position) amongst the list you mentioned, or not on the list you mentioned, that has had a positive impact on the program. RJax is the only forward who comes to mind but is he really a Crean recruit? The results have been mixed at best. I hope Buzz can right the ship here.
On the other hand, college ball is a guards game and having lots of highly ranked forwards will not do us any good if we don't have the guards who can get them the ball and can play defense. I have always said, you need balance.
I have to assume you think a small forward is a forward. Lazar Hayward was recruited as a small forward and shooting guard, but as a 3 first to play at Marquette, not a 2 as you suggested. Is he out of position at the 4...yes and I would agree he was not recruited to play the 4. But he was still recruited to play as a 3 primarily and then slide over as a 2.
Lazar Hayward...Small Forward 4 star recruit for Marquette (link below)
http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=39578&Sport=2 (http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=39578&Sport=2)
Secondly, some guy named Steve Novak...a wing forward...made a positive impact at Marquette I believe.
I'd add Scott Merritt into that group as a positive impact.
Marcus Jackson. Odartey Blankson. Dan Fitzgerald. Etc. Many have made positive impacts...I don't know what that definition means to you.
I have high hopes for Erik Williams...who signed with MU while Crean was head coach. I have high hopes for Trevor Mbakwe, another top 100 player, who signed while Crean was head coach.
I don't think Crean has a problem signing forwards....he had a problem signing high level POWER FORWARDS...but he continued to get plenty of solid small forwards over the years.
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Wade came under the umbrella of partial-qualifier, a wise, yet now extinct practice of the NCAA. I'm was a big fan of the partial-qualifier rule.
Hayward and Mbakwe were hyper-reviewed, not for their grades or scores, but for the institutions that had granted their diplomas. There is a difference.
I'm not opposed to granting admission leniency to some athletes (especially given MU's commitment to and track of academic success and graduation). If anything, I worry that one of Buzz's first commitments might be coming from the need to lower our standards a bit, if only because we (MU nation) are putting great, perhaps unrealistic, pressure on him to perform. I don't want this example of guaranteeing playing time and of lowering admission standards to become regular practice, and I assume you don't either.
A few points:
- I'm not sure how you can call youself a big fan of the partial-qualifier rule, then question Marquette for accepting a committment from a kid who will have to be a full qualifier to gain admission. How is it that partial qualifiers are OK, but accepting a kid who has to do some work to become a full qualifier is dubious?
- Mbakwe's issues had nothing to do with the school that gave him diplomas. It was an issue of whether he had successfully completed enough "core" courses to be eligible. Regardless, both are recent examples of kids with academic questions marks who were recruited and committed to Marquette without the kind of fanfare Maymon's academics have drawn.
- I certainly don't want MU to make a regular habit of lowering its admission standards. And at this point, we have no evidence that Maymon has been or will be treated any differently than any past recruit.
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Thanks for the feedback.
-I'm a big fan of the partial qualifier rule because it allowed schools with (relatively) higher standards (such as MU) to accept athletes (such as Dwyane Wade) with the obligation to help them achieve a certain level academically before they could play their sport. Fits in perfectly with MU's commitment to academics, and I had no problem with admissions within that context. Perhaps I have a gripe with the NCAA rather than MU in this regard.
-Still, you ask "How is it that partial qualifiers are OK, but accepting a kid who has to do some work to become a full qualifier is dubious?" Maybe I sense a difference between a risk and an investment. Wade was an investment, where NCAA rule allowed (and encouraged?) schools such as MU to accept athletes that didn't quite cut the mustard, giving them a year to help them qualify on campus. Wade got to be with the team, with MU paying his way, (and stories abound that he was already the star of the team) while he was ineligible to play (without losing any of his 4 years of eligibility). It was a positive situation all the way around.
The situation with Maymon, I fear, is that he needs to meet NCAA standards in high school, and MU doesn't have an opportunity to academically support him. That's how it is a risk. First, we don't know if he'll qualify, nevermind meet MU admissions standards. Then, MU doesn't have the luxury (afforded by the partial qualifier rule) to help him be eligible.
To me, there is a difference between a partial qualifier (which no longer exists) and someone who must be a full qualifier but might not meet MU standards.
-I may be wrong, but I recall that Mbakwe changed schools, and it was a question of where he took those core courses. Regardless, your point is well made. Does it change my fear that admissions are being lessened (though it does indeed change my fear that they are being lessened in the Buzz era)?
My hope is that Maymon qualifies, that MU supports him academically and athletically, and that he graduates while helping the team achieve success during his 4 years.
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I have to assume you think a small forward is a forward. Lazar Hayward was recruited as a small forward and shooting guard, but as a 3 first to play at Marquette, not a 2 as you suggested. Is he out of position at the 4...yes and I would agree he was not recruited to play the 4. But he was still recruited to play as a 3 primarily and then slide over as a 2.
Lazar Hayward...Small Forward 4 star recruit for Marquette (link below)
http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=39578&Sport=2 (http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=39578&Sport=2)
Secondly, some guy named Steve Novak...a wing forward...made a positive impact at Marquette I believe.
I'd add Scott Merritt into that group as a positive impact.
Marcus Jackson. Odartey Blankson. Dan Fitzgerald. Etc. Many have made positive impacts...I don't know what that definition means to you.
I have high hopes for Erik Williams...who signed with MU while Crean was head coach. I have high hopes for Trevor Mbakwe, another top 100 player, who signed while Crean was head coach.
I don't think Crean has a problem signing forwards....he had a problem signing high level POWER FORWARDS...but he continued to get plenty of solid small forwards over the years.
Yes, you are correct. Novak was great (particularly his senior year) and even though he sort of played the small forward position on offense and PF on defense. I would say Crean occasionally (i.e., Novak) got a good small forward but at the classic PF and C positions for whatever reason he couldn't close the deal.
Look at Creans recruiting of projected PF and C positions since 2003. I use scout as a reference. I know to most on this board this is not news (we all know Crean sucked at recruiting bigs) but to others it might be news. To me, it warms my heart that Buzz is able to walk into the living room of a highly rated PF recruit and close the deal.
2003
PF James Matthews (not ranked)
PF Marcus Jackson (JC Transfer)
2004
Ryan Amoroso (not ranked)
Ousmane Barro (17th best Center, not in Scouts or RSCI top 100)
Mike Kinsella (JC transfer)
2005
Dwight Burke (unranked)
Jamil Lott (JC transfer)
2006
No PF or C recruited according to Scout
2007
Patrick Hazel (unranked)
Trevor Mbakwe (Scout's 30th best PF, not in scout top 100, RSCI 91st)
I can only hope that looking back after Buzz's first 5 years at MU the recruiting record on bigs will be better than our last 5 has been. If we include small forwards, Hayward is the only true quality one we got in the years mentioned. Barro and MJax were adequate but hardly upper tier BE quality. Trevor is still a question mark but I remain hopeful. I predict Buzz's record at recruiting bigs will be better since 1) he is off to a good start, and 2) it can't be much worse than the last 5 recruiting classes. That being said, Buzz needs to show balance in recruiting. We not only need highly rated forwards but highly rated guards as well.
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We agree...power forwards were the problem.
I just hope looking back 5 years from now we are at the level we are today, that will be my criteria for determining if we were successful or not as a program. A top 25 team, top half of the Big East, no NCAA violations, kids graduating.
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Jeronne retired from basketball. (http://www.utsports.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/091815aad.html)
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Jeronne retired from basketball. (http://www.utsports.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/091815aad.html)
His quote about leaving MU and then starting with TN shows some maturity.
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Great story about Jeronne. Have to have a lot of "GUTS" to have those surgeries and then
again play basketball. Surprised me with his "Love" for the game. To him, physical health in his
later years was more important.
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That quote about being unhappy with his playing time at Marquette only to find himself in the same situation more than a year later at Tennessee after having sat out as a transfer should be must-reading for every recruit.
I agree that Maymon being able to talk about it so candidly shows how much he has matured. It also might represent what he can say now that Daddy isn't saying it for him.
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Where is dad going to get his money now?
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Happy for him. Sounds like Jeronne is quite intelligent and has matured tremendously over the past 5 years, ai na?
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Best part of the story ....
While he was sidelined during the 2013 Spring semester, Maymon took 18 credit hours and posted an impressive 3.34 GPA. He received his Psychology degree on May 9, 2014.
Good for J-May! He made great use of his opportunity.
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Best part of the story ....
While he was sidelined during the 2013 Spring semester, Maymon took 18 credit hours and posted an impressive 3.34 GPA. He received his Psychology degree on May 9, 2014.
Good for J-May! He made great use of his opportunity.
So he could have just been playing mind games with us?
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Like Noskowiak, a top Wisconsin player that the Badgers learned enough about to not go after who ended up a MU recruit for a short time. Lesson to be learned, if there's a great player from the Madison area that Wisconsin isn't showing interest in, it's probably best to do the same.
Hopefully, Nick will start a similar journey soon.
It probably benefited Jeronnie's maturity greatly to get some physical distance between himself, his dad and his AAU coach. Maybe, Nick would do best starting over again somewhere a distance away, as well.
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Like Noskowiak, a top Wisconsin player that the Badgers learned enough about to not go after who ended up a MU recruit for a short time. Lesson to be learned, if there's a great player from the Madison area that Wisconsin isn't showing interest in, it's probably best to do the same.
Hopefully, Nick will start a similar journey soon.
It probably benefited Jeronnie's maturity greatly to get some physical distance between himself, his dad and his AAU coach. Maybe, Nick would do best starting over again somewhere a distance away, as well.
I don't agree with this in the slightest.
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Why are we still so concerned about Maymon? He played a handful of games for Marquette a long time ago.
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Why are we still so concerned about Maymon? He played a handful of games for Marquette a long time ago.
Simple, skip the thread. It's pretty clear who this one is about, so if you're not interested in the topic, pass right over it.
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Like Noskowiak, a top Wisconsin player that the Badgers learned enough about to not go after who ended up a MU recruit for a short time. Lesson to be learned, if there's a great player from the Madison area that Wisconsin isn't showing interest in, it's probably best to do the same.
Hopefully, Nick will start a similar journey soon.
It probably benefited Jeronnie's maturity greatly to get some physical distance between himself, his dad and his AAU coach. Maybe, Nick would do best starting over again somewhere a distance away, as well.
Yea Wisconsin has been known to land huge black recruits. Oh wait.
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Happy for him. Sounds like Jeronne is quite intelligent and has matured tremendously over the past 5 years, ai na?
Yes
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Yea Wisconsin has been known to land huge black recruits. Oh wait.
???????????????????????????
You seem to be saying that Wisconsin has never landed a African-American big man which
a) isn't true, and
b) has nothing to do with what I was saying.
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Jeronne retired from basketball. (http://www.utsports.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/091815aad.html)
Thanks for sharing that article.
Feel for the guy. Glad he has made some peace with the situation.
I felt betrayed when he left but I got over it and now feel better because he acknowledged that he wasn't humble.
I wonder where he will land as a coach...
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Oh Oh Oh Let's talk about Dameon Mason next!
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Oh Oh Oh Let's talk about Dameon Mason next!
Please share any information you find out.