MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MuggsyB on February 03, 2023, 09:22:18 AM
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He should be considered for Nat COY. In my lifetime this is without question the best coached MU team that I have witnessed. It's certainly not the most talented team, but when it comes to overall cohesion, and in particular guys understanding their roles and contributing as a group, this squad stands on top imo.
You add what Shaka has done as far as player development, in game and halftime adjustments, along with how guys respond to his tutelage in general and we're talking about a beautiful symphony on the floor.
This is as fun a team we've been lucky enough to watch and support for a very long time. We've definitely had aesthetically pleasing teams during the Buzz years, the mighty mites were also thrilling at times, but consistently this group is the most fun.
Why? Because the barrages have come from every spot on the floor with TyKo leading the way. The ball movement is an absolute thing of beauty, 5 guys playing as 1 doesn't suck. On the flipside if you had the misfortune of watching Wisky/Ohio St. yesterday you are probably still suffering from what I call: PTSE. Post-Traumatic-Stress-Ennui. I also hope people have recovered from the most horrid looking uniforms ever designed in the history of sports.
In closing, MU is back!!! Period. The fact that we are now in a position to compete at the highest level, for many years, after intense suffering for about a decade is assuaging some of my anxieties. It gives me tremendous hope and confidence that sustained greatness is in all of our futures. Props and more props to Shaka and this group for the fantastic ride we have all been able to watch. Let's keep the train rolling through February, March, and the 1st week in April.
#Resurgence
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Uh, the season's not over. Let's not start handing out grades yet.
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Muggs, I give you a grade of "incomplete" in Anxiety Assaugement 101.
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Yeah,
We still have 8 conference games and 2 tournaments left.
A+ is a bit premature.
I do think itll be hard for him to not end up with a grade in the A's. But lets hold off.
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He should be considered for Nat COY. In my lifetime this is without question the best coached MU team that I have witnessed. It's certainly not the most talented team, but when it comes to overall cohesion, and in particular guys understanding their roles and contributing as a group, this squad stands on top imo.
You add what Shaka has done as far as player development, in game and halftime adjustments, along with how guys respond to his tutelage in general and we're talking about a beautiful symphony on the floor.
This is as fun a team we've been lucky enough to watch and support for a very long time. We've definitely had aesthetically pleasing teams during the Buzz years, the mighty mites were also thrilling at times, but consistently this group is the most fun.
Why? Because the barrages have come from every spot on the floor with TyKo leading the way. The ball movement is an absolute thing of beauty, 5 guys playing as 1 doesn't suck. On the flipside if you had the misfortune of watching Wisky/Ohio St. yesterday you are probably still suffering from what I call: PTSE. Post-Traumatic-Stress-Ennui. I also hope people have recovered from the most horrid looking uniforms ever designed in the history of sports.
In closing, MU is back!!! Period. The fact that we are now in a position to compete at the highest level, for many years, after intense suffering for about a decade is assuaging some of my anxieties. It gives me tremendous hope and confidence that sustained greatness is in all of our futures. Props and more props to Shaka and this group for the fantastic ride we have all been able to watch. Let's keep the train rolling through February, March, and the 1st week in April.
#Resurgence
I agree with this analysis.
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Yeah,
We still have 8 conference games and 2 tournaments left.
A+ is a bit premature.
I do think itll be hard for him to not end up with a grade in the A's. But lets hold off.
I should have written to this point but I absolutely love this team PG and what Shaka's has done thus far.
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Anything less than a national championship is an F
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I am waiting until the Blue Book is submitted.
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There certainly is cause for excitement this year and I think most of us would have said day one we would be thrilled to be at 18-5 and 10-2 in the BE! So this has been an exciting season! But there is a lot left and we are all hoping the success continues. Muggsy can get excited as we all are….. but the final exams are still coming before any grades are officially handed out haha!
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We're past the midterms but still have the big group project and the final left. Gotta earn the final grade
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You gotta love Scoop. Either in complete meltdown panic or assigning A+ when the assignment is only 60% over. There is no in between.
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You gotta love Scoop. Either in complete meltdown panic or assigning A+ when the assignment is only 60% over. There is no in between.
"There is no finish line"
-Shaka Dingani Smart
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OTOH, my last semester at MU, I took a history class from Karel Bicha. The last day before the final, he asked if there were any graduating seniors - a few of us raised our hands. He said "if you just want your midterm grade to be your final grade, just let me know."
AB...good enough...I'm gone.
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You gotta love Scoop. Either in complete meltdown panic or assigning A+ when the assignment is only 60% over. There is no in between.
Joyous.
A program that has suffered a February/March swoon for, what, eight of the last 11 seasons seems an odd place for unbridled optimism.
Suppose it speaks to the current set of vibes emanating from the Al. And those vibes are titles.
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Anything less than a national championship is an F
I will say your comedic timing is pretty good sometimes. Had a solid chuckle on this one.
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Too early to grade Shaka but I've seen more than enough to give Muggsy an A+ for his scoop performance for the season.
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You gotta love Scoop. Either in complete meltdown panic or assigning A+ when the assignment is only 60% over. There is no in between.
In true scoop fashion, can someone start a poll now of how many wins Shaka needs to earn an A+?
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We're 2/3 through so I got ahead of myself but I think everyone catches my drift. This group has to tools to ascend to greater heights. That's really my main point. And we are definitely not excruciatingly boring like other teams.
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In true scoop fashion, can someone start a poll now of how many wins Shaka needs to earn an A+?
Because I put more value on the regular season than a lot of others do, in my book a regular season conference championship would be an A. To get to an A+ would require making it at least to the Sweet 16 in the NCAA tournament.
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Because I put more value on the regular season than a lot of others do, in my book a regular season conference championship would be an A. To get to an A+ would require making it at least to the Sweet 16 in the NCAA tournament.
Blue, he took a program in complete disarray and in less than two years has us in prime position despite only having one big and modest size. If we get a 2/3 seed that's an A+ in my book. Especially when you consider we were picked 9th by the coaches. Meanwhile Michigan is a unmitigated disaster.
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How can you possibly give any grade if we don't take advantage of the opportunity?
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Muggsy go 1 day without making a new thread challenge: impossible
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How can you possibly give any grade if we don't take advantage of the opportunity?
Muggsy has been known to get ahead of himself. It has been a fun ride so far. Still a lot of season to go.
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Seriously, all this needed was a "so far."
I don't think many of us would say Shaka should grade less than A (if not A+) for this season SO FAR.
That's fair and it's real and it still allows for great things to happen over the next 2 months.
And I'm pretty sure that's what Muggs was saying.
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Seriously, all this needed was a "so far."
I don't think many of us would say Shaka should grade less than A (if not A+) for this season SO FAR.
That's fair and it's real and it still allows for great things to happen over the next 2 months.
And I'm pretty sure that's what Muggs was saying.
Indeed. So far.
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We're 2/3 through so I got ahead of myself but I think everyone catches my drift. This group has to tools to ascend to greater heights. That's really my main point. And we are definitely not excruciatingly boring like other teams.
Not only do they have what it takes, this team is playing with house money. They have something to prove (“F em”) and there’s no pressure on them.
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Anything less than a national championship is an F
Loss to Wisconsin means even with a natty the ceiling is a C
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Seriously, all this needed was a "so far."
I don't think many of us would say Shaka should grade less than A (if not A+) for this season SO FAR.
That's fair and it's real and it still allows for great things to happen over the next 2 months.
And I'm pretty sure that's what Muggs was saying.
I jumped the gun a bit so I changed it. Ty.
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Loss to Wisconsin means even with a natty the ceiling is a C
Yup. Al McGuire never lost to Wisconsin
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Blue, he took a program in complete disarray and in less than two years has us in prime position despite only having one big and modest size. If we get a 2/3 seed that's an A+ in my book. Especially when you consider we were picked 9th by the coaches. Meanwhile Michigan is a unmitigated disaster.
Michigan missing the NCAA tournament after 5 straight years of reaching the Sweet 16 (or better) has nothing to do with anything here.
I guess I'm just a tougher grader than you are. A+ suggests to me that it couldn't possibly be better. and if the team wins the Big East and gets a preferred seed, it isn't unreasonable to expect an NCAA win or two to top it off.
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Yup. Al McGuire never lost to Wisconsin
While Al dominated UW, that isn't true. His record against Bucky was 20-3. They often played twice a season in those years.
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Idk about grades until after he's had his first test
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Michigan missing the NCAA tournament after 5 straight years of reaching the Sweet 16 (or better) has nothing to do with anything here.
I guess I'm just a tougher grader than you are. A+ suggests to me that it couldn't possibly be better. and if the team wins the Big East and gets a preferred seed, it isn't unreasonable to expect an NCAA win or two to top it off.
Blue,
A 2 seed is in play and we were picked to finish 9th in our conference. Now yes, NCAA wins are ultimately what matters but you know me well enough that this goes without saying.
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How can you possibly give any grade if we don't take advantage of the opportunity?
That's fair. I can get overzealous and ahead of things.
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That's fair. I can get overzealous and ahead of things.
Yeah. You should smoke some weed
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Idk about grades until after he's had his first test
Outstanding.
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Idk about grades until after he's had his first test
I can't believe I missed this one. Bravo.
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Yup. Al McGuire never lost to Wisconsin
This. As well as his blatant aversion to winning close games by having his teams win by a lot. What’s he afraid of???
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Anything less than a national championship is an F
Yes
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No close game wins disqualifies Shaka
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Muggsy
I do not think you are ahead of yourself. In less than two years Shaka has build an identity for the program and the excitement is real. More importantly, many folks think they are just getting started. What he has done in short order is well above of my lofty expectations.
Negative to that, my expectations have risen a great deal. MU needs to win in March and keep the mojo going. This program is just getting out of the starting blocks and they need to keep winning.
I still am hesitant to say out loud what I think they can accomplish this year, but it is much bigger than winning the BE title. It is time to show the country that MU basketball is back.
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Muggsy
I do not think you are ahead of yourself. In less than two years Shaka has build an identity for the program and the excitement is real. More importantly, many folks think they are just getting started. What he has done in short order is well above of my lofty expectations.
Negative to that, my expectations have risen a great deal. MU needs to win in March and keep the mojo going. This program is just getting out of the starting blocks and they need to keep winning.
I still am hesitant to say out loud what I think they can accomplish this year, but it is much bigger than winning the BE title. It is time to show the country that MU basketball is back.
I hear you Goose. Imo we can play at a higher level which excites me moving towards the NCAA tournament.
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Muggsy
The program is still in second gear. Lot of upside to enjoy in the upcoming weeks.
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Muggsy
No one who attended Marquette ever got an A+. But A and AB are acceptable grades.
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When Smart took the job I looked at the roster and considered the trajectory of the young talent and tried to factor in what was leaving and envisioned MU being in a position to be highly successful next season. The 3rd year. And I posted my opinion on this forum at the time. The development we have seen this year has surprised me because of Oso and the fact that the youngsters are talented enough to compete as sophomores and even freshmen. Wrightsil’s injury hurt. Darn it. But the coaching and the concept Shaka believes in has elevated the team much more quickly than I believed would happen. Getting to 32 or even 16 in this year’s tournament will motivate this young team to work harder and come back next year even more determined because they will have worked together long enough to make the effort easier by recognizing their strengths and playing team basketball. Next year a great recruiting class will come in and push everyone in practice more and more. I’m not saying that this team is going to crash and burn in the next 5 weeks, I’m just saying, I don’t expect to see an elite 8 finish this year. Next year is a different story. When I look at the situation this year I see a MU team that could surprise a lot of folks because the field isn’t as talented as it was in previous years. I wish we could have next years MU team playing this year. Go Warriors.
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Goose, we are going to New Orleans with friends the first weekend in April. My wife and I were talking about whether we wanted to go to our next destination on that Monday or if we want to stay another night in NOLA.
I said, "Well, whatever we decide, we need to be settled in plenty of time for me to watch the national championship game that Monday night. I know this sounds crazy, but Marquette really could be playing in it."
Actually, I don't think it's all that crazy. So I guess you could say I have some lofty expectations, too.
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I would also give Shaka an A+. However, this team would not beat the 1975/76 team, which is my favorite MU team of all-time.
Top 6 scorers Tatum, Lee, Ellis, Walton, Whitehead and Toone all played in NBA.
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I would also give Shaka an A+. However, this team would not beat the 1975/76 team, which is my favorite MU team of all-time.
Top 6 scorers Tatum, Lee, Ellis, Walton, Whitehead and Toone all played in NBA.
So? There are lots of teams this one probably wouldn't beat, including the Indiana team that beat those Warriors on the way to the last unbeaten championship season in college basketball.
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Bilsu
‘76 is my favorite team as well. They were stacked!!
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Nice post Muggsy.
Only thing it truly lacks is some Medieval flare.
In order for it to truly become an A+ season, through to the end, is for you to bring that back.
We don’t want an early guillotine
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Oso is the key to everything that's happening here. Tall enough and smooth enough to score and not really force it because there are so many ways for this team to score. Team player. Makes smart decisions and runs up the court like a gazelle and plays press in the back court. He's a shot blocker. Amazing talent. Next year he will come back after adding on 10 pounds and become a beast.
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I would also give Shaka an A+. However, this team would not beat the 1975/76 team, which is my favorite MU team of all-time.
Top 6 scorers Tatum, Lee, Ellis, Walton, Whitehead and Toone all played in NBA.
If you could put them in a time machine to play a game, this team would beat 76 team 9 times out of 10 if today's rules were used. Maybe evenly matched if 76 rules were used
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If you could put them in a time machine to play a game, this team would beat 76 team 9 times out of 10 if today's rules were used. Maybe evenly matched if 76 rules were used
Says someone who never saw MU’s 1976 team. Unless you’re saying as the 76 roster is current day. Then maybe.
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Says someone who never saw MU’s 1976 team. Unless you’re saying as the 76 roster is current day. Then maybe.
I don't need to have seen the 1976 team. Athletes now are bigger, faster, stronger, and have had better coaching and training for much longer than they did in the 1970s. The new rules would also be hell to adjust to.
This isn't mean to disparage. The 1976 team was a much better team for their time period than the current team is for this time period (though this team has time to prove that wrong) and should be held in higher esteem. Comparing across eras doesn't really work in basketball, all you can really do is judge teams how good they were for their own era and compare that to how good other teams were for their eras.
Also, are you old enough to have seen the 1976 team? If so I apologize, I've always assumed you were a lot younger.
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A- cause of the Badger game
:-*
Seriously, all this needed was a "so far."
I don't think many of us would say Shaka should grade less than A (if not A+) for this season SO FAR.
That's fair and it's real and it still allows for great things to happen over the next 2 months.
And I'm pretty sure that's what Muggs was saying.
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Nice post Muggsy.
Only thing it truly lacks is some Medieval flare.
In order for it to truly become an A+ season, through to the end, is for you to bring that back.
We don’t want an early guillotine
I think I have only invoked going "medieval" a hand full of times this year. Jop went off with 8 triples and that was one example of medievability. I like teams that possess SZM traits Dr. V: Spurtability, Zoomability, and of course Medievability. I'm hopeful that in the very near future we will have rosters littered with SZM guys which will lead to ruthless domination. :)
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TAMU
Six guys on the ‘76 team saw NBA action. Unfortunately they ended playing a team that the starting five were all first round draft picks.
Impossible to compare teams from different era’s on a head to head basis, only how they fared during their era. ‘76 is way beyond this team in talent and accomplishments. That said, I would have to think hard on a team being more exciting to watch than this year.
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TAMU
Six guys on the ‘76 team saw NBA action. Unfortunately they ended playing a team that the starting five were all first round draft picks.
Impossible to compare teams from different era’s on a head to head basis, only how they fared during their era. ‘76 is way beyond this team in talent and accomplishments. That said, I would have to think hard on a team being more exciting to watch than this year.
Love him or hate him, Robert could recruit and coach like few others in his prime.
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TAMU
Six guys on the ‘76 team saw NBA action. Unfortunately they ended playing a team that the starting five were all first round draft picks.
Impossible to compare teams from different era’s on a head to head basis, only how they fared during their era. ‘76 is way beyond this team in talent and accomplishments. That said, I would have to think hard on a team being more exciting to watch than this year.
I was at that game in Baton Rouge and it felt like Championship Monday. Obviously, IU was loaded, but we were right there, aina?
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I kills me how the NCAAs didn’t become modern until 1979, much like pro football didn’t until Super Bowl I.
Fans don’t understand the tournament didn’t seed back then. Us & Indiana in the same bracket. Ridiculous.
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I don't need to have seen the 1976 team. Athletes now are bigger, faster, stronger, and have had better coaching and training for much longer than they did in the 1970s. The new rules would also be hell to adjust to.
This isn't mean to disparage. The 1976 team was a much better team for their time period than the current team is for this time period (though this team has time to prove that wrong) and should be held in higher esteem. Comparing across eras doesn't really work in basketball, all you can really do is judge teams how good they were for their own era and compare that to how good other teams were for their eras.
I do understand what you're saying, TAMU, so I'll posit this:
Put the 1975-76 Warriors in a time machine to the future, and give them all the training and coaching and offseason programs and charter flights and other advantages that current players have, and I think they'd fare pretty darn well against the current Golden Eagles -- or any current team.
I won't go all hyperbole and say they'd win 9 times out of 10, which is a fun phrase but obviously impossible to prove no matter which of us might say it about which team in which era.
If you don't think Tatum, Lee, Walton, Whitehead, Ellis, Toone and Rosenberger were plenty athletic and skilled enough to have played in this era -- especially if they could have received even a little modern training -- well, I'm not one to throw out a "know basketball" line against a fellow knower of basketball!
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I kills me how the NCAAs didn’t become modern until 1979, much like pro football didn’t until Super Bowl I.
Fans don’t understand the tournament didn’t seed back then. Us & Indiana in the same bracket. Ridiculous.
Wasn't the Ohio St. loss that one year in the dance also a travesty?
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Goose, we are going to New Orleans with friends the first weekend in April. My wife and I were talking about whether we wanted to go to our next destination on that Monday or if we want to stay another night in NOLA.
I said, "Well, whatever we decide, we need to be settled in plenty of time for me to watch the national championship game that Monday night. I know this sounds crazy, but Marquette really could be playing in it."
Actually, I don't think it's all that crazy. So I guess you could say I have some lofty expectations, too.
On this MU82 world tour, why not make Houston the next destination and see our heroes live in person play for the trophy? Should be plenty of seats available, since the Houston Unbeatables aren't going to be there.
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Doc
That game in Baton Rouge was the National Championship game, unfortunately it was played a week early. Two fantastic teams filled with NBA players on both sides. They were a better team, but '76 was sacked beyond belief.
I have no idea how to compare that team with the current team and it seems like a silly debate to me. This team will go down as my favorite post Al team if we have a run in March. There is nothing not to like about this team.
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On this MU82 world tour, why not make Houston the next destination and see our heroes live in person play for the trophy? Should be plenty of seats available, since the Houston Unbeatables aren't going to be there.
Right now, we're scheduled to go to Florida after NOLA ... but I think Houston is only about 5 hours away.
I like how you think, lawdog. I don't think I'll make any reservations with cancellation penalties just in case we have to go watch Marquette win the national title!
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I don't need to have seen the 1976 team. Athletes now are bigger, faster, stronger, and have had better coaching and training for much longer than they did in the 1970s. The new rules would also be hell to adjust to.
This isn't mean to disparage. The 1976 team was a much better team for their time period than the current team is for this time period (though this team has time to prove that wrong) and should be held in higher esteem. Comparing across eras doesn't really work in basketball, all you can really do is judge teams how good they were for their own era and compare that to how good other teams were for their eras.
Also, are you old enough to have seen the 1976 team? If so I apologize, I've always assumed you were a lot younger.
...and the opposite would be true also. With no 3pt play don't have to defend the arc. With no clock shot you could hold the ball with a modest lead (Dean's 4 corner offense). The game is quite different as I do prefer today's game. Big centers dominated the game back then, not so much now.
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I don't need to have seen the 1976 team. Athletes now are bigger, faster, stronger, and have had better coaching and training for much longer than they did in the 1970s. The new rules would also be hell to adjust to.
This isn't mean to disparage. The 1976 team was a much better team for their time period than the current team is for this time period (though this team has time to prove that wrong) and should be held in higher esteem. Comparing across eras doesn't really work in basketball, all you can really do is judge teams how good they were for their own era and compare that to how good other teams were for their eras.
Also, are you old enough to have seen the 1976 team? If so I apologize, I've always assumed you were a lot younger.
Yes it is hard to judge athletes across eras.
However, the 75-76 MU Squad was loaded with guys who were very unique athletic specimens. These guys had physical skills that could transcend eras. They had quickness and cohesiveness which made them a force to be reckoned with. I saw this team play live many games and can testify that not only where they elite athletically, their individual and collective basketball IQ was off the charts.
Al has said this was his best squad. They won 23 straight games for a reason.
Bo Ellis a silky smooth and quick 6-9 forward , 4 year starter with big production scoring and rebounds every year. Guys like that don't grow on trees.
Butch Lee a powerful and quick 6 foot guard who knew how to use his broad shouldered body driving to the hoop , was ultimately a National Player of The Year.
Lloyd Walton, Team Captain, All American, Lightning quick and smart leader of the offense.
Earl Tatum, A 6-5 strong body , quick guard with all time great skills , All American, Who could score rebound and was tenacious as hell on defense. Very hard to defend against. Played within Al's offensive structure which was about team not individual play
Jerome Whitehead, 6-10, Rugged and Agile , Commanded an inside presence and struck fear into those coming into the lane.
Bernard Toone, 6-9, Incredible Skills and Range on Jumper, Was a player well ahead of his time. Unfortunately , no three pointer then.
The 75-76 team had the misfortune of being in the same region as the Indiana team, who as was pointed out by MU82, had one of the all time great starting lineups, with guys who were all ahead of the their time in skills and athleticism as well.
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Next year is the 50th anniversary of the natty runner up team. They will have their night like this year's F4 team.
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CBS Sports Weekly Report Card
Marquette A Shaka Smart's club posted another perfect week in the win column with home wins over Villanova and Butler to improve to 13-1 at home this season. Picked to finish ninth in the league this preseason, the Golden Eagles remain a tremendous story as a legitimate contender in the Big East.
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In true scoop fashion, can someone start a poll now of how many wins Shaka needs to earn an A+?
I would say 21.57 conference wins before the tournament starts.
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I stand by my original comments. Marquette is the greatest story of this college basketball season. Shaka should be NCOY.
#RESURGENCE
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Muggsy
Better than A+, I hope MU gives Shaka big raise an extension ASAP.
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Muggsy
Better than A+, I hope MU gives Shaka big raise an extension ASAP.
Couldn't agree more Goose. Don't screw around, give him an immediate raise/extension.
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Only 3 years and 1 month before we can form an initial opinion on Shaka
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I hope I’m not being too naive, but I feel like Shaka likes being at MU and there’s a good chance he’ll be with us for a long time
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Only 3 years and 1 month before we can form an initial opinion on Shaka
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I hope I’m not being too naive, but I feel like Shaka likes being at MU and there’s a good chance he’ll be with us for a long time
Probably. I think he might be here for the rest of his career but i could also see him retiring in his 50s
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Couldn't agree more Goose. Don't screw around, give him an immediate raise/extension.
Sure, he's earned it.
But an extension won't keep him from leaving if he wants to go.
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I was at that game in Baton Rouge and it felt like Championship Monday. Obviously, IU was loaded, but we were right there, aina?
I was in Baton Rouge too, Doc - drove over from Houston where I was living then. If you remember a guy in a red golf shirt wildly cheering on the Warriors - that was me. Wife was nice enough to pack but somehow forgot IU’s and MU’s colors.
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What happened to waiting 5 years?
Edit: Just saw I made the same joke as JB. Don't whip me for it
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What happened to waiting 5 years?
Edit: Just saw I made the same joke as JB. Don't whip me for it
All Shaka has proven is he can win with Wojo’s recruits……which is more than Wojo ever did. ;D ;D
Nice call on this Mugs!
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All Shaka has proven is he can win with Wojo’s recruits……which is more than Wojo ever did. ;D ;D
Nice call on this Mugs!
OUCH!
But true
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Sure, he's earned it.
But an extension won't keep him from leaving if he wants to go.
He's not bolting Pakumi.
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What happened to waiting 5 years?
Edit: Just saw I made the same joke as JB. Don't whip me for it
We already had 12 years to judge Shaka before he ever arrived at MU.
Everyone seems to forget the "five year" comment was made with respect to MU's track record of hiring either promoted assistants (Crean, Wojo, O'Neill, Buzz) or low-major coaches (Deane, Dukiet).
Shaka arrived with 12 years of head coaching experience under his belt, including six at a high major. He came to MU already a known quantity--something you couldn't say for any prior MU coach.
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We already had 12 years to judge Shaka before he ever arrived at MU.
Everyone seems to forget the "five year" comment was made with respect to MU's track record of hiring either promoted assistants (Crean, Wojo, O'Neill, Buzz) or low-major coaches (Deane, Dukiet).
Shaka arrived with 12 years of head coaching experience under his belt, including six at a high major. He came to MU already a known quantity--something you couldn't say for any prior MU coach.
I think it originally started due to Chicos not wanting to jump on the Buzz bandwagon.
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Only 3 years and 1 month before we can form an initial opinion on Shaka
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I hope I’m not being too naive, but I feel like Shaka likes being at MU and there’s a good chance he’ll be with us for a long time
Agreed. He's winning, he's in his home state, coaches the way he wants and best of all, he does not have to put up with the Blue Blood BS.
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He's not bolting Pakumi.
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I have no idea if/when he's bolting. None of us do.
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I have no idea if/when he's bolting. None of us do.
When Marquette starts messing with his happy...
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I think Shaka is here for the long haul, but if he left MU in four weeks I would give him a standing ovation and wish him well. He proved it can be done at MU and that is what I have waited a long time to witness.
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Probably. I think he might be here for the rest of his career but i could also see him retiring in his 50s
I would like nothing more than Shaka having so much success that this is possible.
Also the five year concept is, at best, not applicable in todays world. At worst a bad argument.
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Pakuni
Just curious, why would you post anything remote in nature of Shaka leaving down the road? For many on here, today is a milestone day in our fandom and I think the excitement is fantastic. Not exactly sure why you, or anyone, would chose to discuss Shaka leaving.
I could not be happier for the 1000’s of MU fans today. I have heard from countless people today and the common theme is excitement for the future, even more than the reminder of this season.
Again, post away, but I hope MU nation is enjoying a historic day for the program.
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It is a message board. He speculated. I am sure it has at least crossed many posters minds. I know it has crossed mine.
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I think Shaka is here for the long haul, but if he left MU in four weeks I would give him a standing ovation and wish him well. He proved it can be done at MU and that is what I have waited a long time to witness.
Bingo
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tower
It has not crossed my mind for a second. As I mentioned, yesterday was an exciting day for the program and a good number of fans. It seemed to be a strange comment, in a positive thread that came from a very infrequent contributor to MU basketball discussions.
Again, I have zero concern of Shaka leaving and am enjoying the team and the season. I appreciate you pointing out it is a message board and I will keep that in mind.
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Message boards are full of different ideas. And most of them get challenged. Yes, I have pondered a Shaka departure. Having pondered it, I am not worried about it.
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tower
If Farley had mentioned it would you have felt it was a message board full of opinion? Pakuni has not made a direct MU basketball related post in quite some time. Farley is a troll, we get it. IMO pakuni was throwing cold water on a great day.
I have no idea if he is a Shaka or MU fan based off of his posts on basketball threads, because they do not happen often. Again, seemed like a strange time/thread to get involved in for an infrequent basketball poster.
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I defend Farley's right to be wrong. I defend my right to judge him by his posts and put him on ignore. I defend your right to be critical of Pakuni. I defend my right to disagree with you.
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tower
This is a silly discussion. Imo, if someone wants to have a thread or discussion on the potential of Shaka leaving, I’m all for it. I would not agree with it, but a fair talking point for some people. Again, I thought the timing was strange and it was posted in a positive thread about the job Shaka has done.
I have no problem if there are people wondering, or even concerned, if Shaka could possibly leave. As I mentioned in another post, if Shaka were to leave, I would thank him for putting hope and excitement back to a dormant program. There would be zero hard feelings from this fan.
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tower
It has not crossed my mind for a second. As I mentioned, yesterday was an exciting day for the program and a good number of fans. It seemed to be a strange comment, in a positive thread that came from a very infrequent contributor to MU basketball discussions.
Again, I have zero concern of Shaka leaving and am enjoying the team and the season. I appreciate you pointing out it is a message board and I will keep that in mind.
Plus, we could bring Brian Wardle home
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I defend Farley's right to be wrong. I defend my right to judge him by his posts and put him on ignore. I defend your right to be critical of Pakuni. I defend my right to disagree with you.
I didn't realize how big a champion you are of free speech Tower. As if that has anything to do with Goose's point or my original thoughts beginning this thread. Do you think the timing of Pakumi's comments were weird and absurd? In light of what the team has accomplished thus far and how special this season and yesterday was for them, the coaches, and the fan base? Why don't you just answer the question in lieu of some "I defend free speech" drivel?
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I have been looking for some national perspective on the NCOY and while everyone on Scoop thinks Shaka should win it seems like the prevailing thoughts are Painter or Tang. I was watching the Baylor-OK State game last night and the announcers were ready to hand it to Tang on the spot. I’m just not sure I understand why. What Shaka has done with a young, unproven team that lost so much scoring is just incredible.
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I have been looking for some national perspective on the NCOY and while everyone on Scoop thinks Shaka should win it seems like the prevailing thoughts are Painter or Tang. I was watching the Baylor-OK State game last night and the announcers were ready to hand it to Tang on the spot. I’m just not sure I understand why. What Shaka has done with a young, unproven team that lost so much scoring is just incredible.
I'm biased obviously but I truly believe Shaka deserves it.
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I didn't realize how big a champion you are of free speech Tower. As if that has anything to do with Goose's point or my original thoughts beginning this thread. Do you think the timing of Pakumi's comments were weird and absurd? In light of what the team has accomplished thus far and how special this season and yesterday was for them, the coaches, and the fan base? Why don't you just answer the question in lieu of some "I defend free speech" drivel?
Because it’s a legit concern. Shaka’s name would at least be bandied about were a big job to open. Extension or not, college basketball coaches contracts aren’t hard to break.
All that said, unless money is his primary driver, I don’t think it’s a concern. Unless there’s a dream job of his we’re unaware of, I don’t think it’s a concern.
Also, despite all of the accomplishments this year, you still worry yourself sick over each and every game. Relax. Smoke a bowl
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I have been looking for some national perspective on the NCOY and while everyone on Scoop thinks Shaka should win it seems like the prevailing thoughts are Painter or Tang. I was watching the Baylor-OK State game last night and the announcers were ready to hand it to Tang on the spot. I’m just not sure I understand why. What Shaka has done with a young, unproven team that lost so much scoring is just incredible.
One of the guys on Field of 68 after dark picked Shaka as NCOY. Heard it this morning on the radio.
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Rico
I can only speak for myself, but there a good number of active posters discussing the program on a daily basis and Pakuni is not one of them. He is an active poster in the superbar, but not much on MU basketball.
Imo, if an active poster on the program brought it up, I would have thought crazy timing or wrong thread, but not WTF.
I will add, if one of the MS guys would have brought it up, I would told them they are off base much more clearly than I did on Pak’s post.
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Because it’s a legit concern. Shaka’s name would at least be bandied about were a big job to open. Extension or not, college basketball coaches contracts aren’t hard to break.
All that said, unless money is his primary driver, I don’t think it’s a concern. Unless there’s a dream job of his we’re unaware of, I don’t think it’s a concern.
Also, despite all of the accomplishments this year, you still worry yourself sick over each and every game. Relax. Smoke a bowl
How do you know I'm not relaxed? I'm having a great cup of coffee and huevos rancheros. I think you're missing Goose's point but whatever.
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How do you know I'm not relaxed? I'm having a great cup of coffee and huevos rancheros. I think you're missing Goose's point but whatever.
I’m not. I understand his point.
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I have been looking for some national perspective on the NCOY and while everyone on Scoop thinks Shaka should win it seems like the prevailing thoughts are Painter or Tang. I was watching the Baylor-OK State game last night and the announcers were ready to hand it to Tang on the spot. I’m just not sure I understand why. What Shaka has done with a young, unproven team that lost so much scoring is just incredible.
Brian Wardle should be in the discussion.
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I didn't realize how big a champion you are of free speech Tower. As if that has anything to do with Goose's point or my original thoughts beginning this thread. Do you think the timing of Pakumi's comments were weird and absurd? In light of what the team has accomplished thus far and how special this season and yesterday was for them, the coaches, and the fan base? Why don't you just answer the question in lieu of some "I defend free speech" drivel?
Goose is the one who brought up an extension. You then followed it up with "don't mess around" or some such comment.
Pakuni's comment followed yours and was absolutely on point. And he doesn't need to have some type of magic threshold on posts discussing basketball in order to make it.
So no, I don't think his comment was "weird and absurd." In fact, I think Goose and your responses to it are by far more weird and absurd. It's a message board - not a pep rally.
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Goose is the one who brought up an extension. You then followed it up with "don't mess around" or some such comment.
Pakuni's comment followed yours and was absolutely on point. And he doesn't need to have some type of magic threshold on posts discussing basketball in order to make it.
So no, I don't think his comment was "weird and absurd." In fact, I think Goose and your responses to it are by far more weird and absurd. It's a message board - not a pep rally.
LOL. Enjoy your lunch at the Mecca Bar Fluffy.
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I think the biggest risk to retaining top coaches is the slow motion conference shakeup. Coaches have their finger on the pulse of the realignment, and will make career decisions based on that. Hopefully the BEast continues to weather the storm.
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I think the biggest risk to retaining top coaches is the slow motion conference shakeup. Coaches have their finger on the pulse of the realignment, and will make career decisions based on that. Hopefully the BEast continues to weather the storm.
For all we know, Shaka is reciting the order of the presidents as we speak.
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For all we know, Shaka is reciting the order of the presidents as we speak.
Wonder if he’s a flusher or someone who delegates that role?
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LOL. Enjoy your lunch at the Mecca Bar Fluffy.
LOL, you get on tower for the response to your post, but when someone actually answers the question you posed, THIS is how you respond?
So very weak.
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
The Vero Beach Babbler has spoken
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
Well said Brother dgies.
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dgies
Now, that is the kind of post that creates some real discussion. All very solid points, and all real possibilities. Great post.
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Well said Brother dgies.
Yes. Well said. I think the recruiting part is a key. We have yet to see Shaka’s recruits develop into prime time players. Likely they will because we CAN say, that even though three starters are Wojo recruits, Shaka did keep them, and Shaka and team have developed them which is key. Good group on paper coming in next year. And Top 10 should help recruiting in general.
So . . . I amhoping Shaka is thinking we found a home, his family is happy (which is key) and that they success continues. He is a great rep for the University too.
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I didn't realize how big a champion you are of free speech Tower. As if that has anything to do with Goose's point or my original thoughts beginning this thread. Do you think the timing of Pakumi's comments were weird and absurd? In light of what the team has accomplished thus far and how special this season and yesterday was for them, the coaches, and the fan base? Why don't you just answer the question in lieu of some "I defend free speech" drivel?
I don't think the timing is odd. In fact, due to the spectacular nature of the season, I am surprised it hasn't been discussed more. Give you something else to obsess over. For the record, I don't think he is going anywhere. But I have pondered it.
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
I will point out that if you add up these probabilities, and round down the two "less than 10%" to 5%, it still is about 40%.
Which IMO is way too high. At least for now. 5-10 years from now? Who knows. As I have said before, I don't even know if HE knows what that future looks like.
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Unlike TC, Shaka isn’t recruiting multiple 5* kids and blaming MU if they choose to go other places. Shaka can recruit #50-150 kids and make it work.
Recruiting is the last concern I have with Shaka.
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Recruiting is the least of my concerns. I think Shaka has made a point to not go after 5 stars, but I have no doubt he could land them if that is the direction he takes.
I have no idea what Shaka’s future holds, but firmly believe that he will be at MU for quite some time.
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Recruiting is the least of my concerns. I think Shaka has made a point to not go after 5 stars, but I have no doubt he could land them if that is the direction he takes.
I have no idea what Shaka’s future holds, but firmly believe that he will be at MU for quite some time.
The bolded is exactly what Pakuni said.
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Yeah, but Goose judged that to be weird timing. When Goose did it, it was by definition good timing.
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Yeah, but Goose judged that to be weird timing. When Goose did it, it was by definition good timing.
LOL...yep.
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
So you are saying there is a less than a 50% chance Shaka leaves?
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tower
If Farley had mentioned it would you have felt it was a message board full of opinion? Pakuni has not made a direct MU basketball related post in quite some time. Farley is a troll, we get it. IMO pakuni was throwing cold water on a great day.
Yep, I wrote that Shaka has earned a raise and an extension. A real wet blanket of a remark.
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I will point out that if you add up these probabilities, and round down the two "less than 10%" to 5%, it still is about 40%.
Which IMO is way too high. At least for now. 5-10 years from now? Who knows. As I have said before, I don't even know if HE knows what that future looks like.
Brother Sultan:
These are not cumulative. They are stand-alone. Realistically, very little chance Coach Shaka out the door.
Brother Doc: Sorry if you think I babble. Next time, just don't read it.
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Unlike TC, Shaka isn’t recruiting multiple 5* kids and blaming MU if they choose to go other places. Shaka can recruit #50-150 kids and make it work.
Recruiting is the last concern I have with Shaka.
Actually, that is more or less my only concern with Skaka.
He has proven he can build culture. He has proven he has a vision and a system. He has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that he can develop players.
I think his record is still in progress in proving whether he can consistently recruit at the level to keep what he has built going. I certainly hope he can, and I *think* he can, but I wouldn't yet to say he has proven it at MU. A bit too early to say it with certainty IMO.
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Everything I own...
The only thing MU needs to worry about is the NBA. Collegewise, Shaka is home.
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Brother Doc: Sorry if you think I babble. Next time, just don't read it.
Au contraire. When Brother Dgies gets on a roll and waxes on poetically, this is must see TV.
Someone put some Brussel spouts in your eggs today?
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Pakuni
Real simple, you seldom post anything on the MU basketball program, and I thought your post and timing was strange. Truthfully, you really said little of note and I should have ignored your post. I might be in the minority, but yesterday was a special day for the program and I was extremely proud to be supporting a program that is being run by Shaka Smart.
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Pakuni
Real simple, you seldom post anything on the MU basketball program, and I thought your post and timing was strange.
You mean when he responded to something that Muggsy said, who initially was responding to you? How on earth is that post and timing in any way "strange" on a message board?
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Pakuni
I should have ignored your post.
There's still time. You're somewhere around 7-10 comments about Pakuni's post (and counting). It's never to late to start ignoring a post and move on. Resume celebrating MU's big day (and year).
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Pakuni
Real simple, you seldom post anything on the MU basketball program, and I thought your post and timing was strange. Truthfully, you really said little of note and I should have ignored your post. I might be in the minority, but yesterday was a special day for the program and I was extremely proud to be supporting a program that is being run by Shaka Smart.
Just so we understand the timeline:
Goose: "I hope MU gives Shaka big raise an extension ASAP."
Mugsy: "Couldn't agree more Goose. Don't screw around, give him an immediate raise/extension."
Pakuni: "Sure, he's earned it."
Goose: The timing of that remark is strange.
Methinks you're trying too hard to be surly.
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Just so we understand the timeline:
Goose: "I hope MU gives Shaka big raise an extension ASAP."
Mugsy: "Couldn't agree more Goose. Don't screw around, give him an immediate raise/extension."
Pakuni: "Sure, he's earned it."
Goose: The timing of that remark is strange.
Methinks you're trying too hard to be surly.
I'm shocked the guy who publicly pronounced (twice, actually) that he was done as a fan with the Marquette program and wouldn't even stoop to the level of accepting free tickets to a game because he was too embarrassed would be playacting surly.
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Golden
What brings you to a Marquette basketball thread?
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I have been looking for some national perspective on the NCOY and while everyone on Scoop thinks Shaka should win it seems like the prevailing thoughts are Painter or Tang. I was watching the Baylor-OK State game last night and the announcers were ready to hand it to Tang on the spot. I’m just not sure I understand why. What Shaka has done with a young, unproven team that lost so much scoring is just incredible.
Shaka certainly belongs in the conversation and it wouldn't be an upset if won it, but Tang is just as worthy of a candidate. We were picked 9/11 in the second or third toughest conference. Kansas State was picked 10/10, dead last in the toughest conference. Right now, Kansas State is most likely one spot ahead of us on the S-Curve. I can understand the argument that K-State was expected to be worse than we were and is likely going to finish in roughly the same spot as us. I think the luster has come off of Painter a little bit in recent weeks but he also deserves to bein the conversation. Personally, I would take Shaka and Tang over the field if I was betting.
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It's Shaka, Tang or Painter.
With Shaka trending up fast. Painter trending down fast. Tang staying very steady.
Oats torpedo'd absolutely any chance he had by publicly revealing himself as a scumbag.
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Golden
What brings you to a Marquette basketball thread?
Your gatekeeping is cringe, stop
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In College Basketball, there's always a chance someone could throw so much of what a Coach wants at him that the subject Coach leaves. I don't know Coach Shaka but I'll take him at his word and I do think he's here for the long-haul. I believe there are limited reasons he could leave, including, which my SWAG estimates:
1) Restructuring -- If the Power 5 conferences go off on their own and leave the Big East behind, then I'll definitely be worried. If this happens, we will have much larger concerns than our head coach. I think it's possible in the sense the SEC, ACC, Big12, BIG, and Pac12 reorganize and form their own competitive league. In this scenario, all of these conferences may not survive but most of the brand names in them will. The Big East, along with parts of the ACC and Big12 will be out in the cold. Probably of happening: Less than 10 percent.
2) Recruiting -- Coach Shaka has done a marvelous job this year. Probably should be coach of the year nationally. But, three of his starting five are Wojo recruits. Coach Shaka has shown an ability to recruit at Texas, but whether that carries over to Marquette remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about recruiting but the risk is Coach Shaka could be a high-end Mike Deane. Probability of happening: About 10 percent.
3) An Incident -- We've been reminded of the problems incidents could cause down in Alabama in the past week. We've seen these sorts of issues happen over the years. The Chicago Tribune reported one, which got Buzz in deep doodoo. These incidents stretched the patience of the powers that be. Marquette also has a periodic tendency to self-destruct, which happens when some arrogant professors question why we are a "basketball school" or why the basketball coach is the highest paid university employee. From the players standpoint, there's something about the guys Coach Shaka recruits that says incidents are less likely. Probability of happening: Less than 10 percent.
4) The Right Power 5 Offer -- If Coach Shaka had come to us when we first asked him, this would be about 50 percent likely. But, after Texas, I'd think this might be washed out of his system. You never know, but Marquette has been generous and very welcoming. If Coach Shaka can recruit here and we keep putting 17,000 people in the FiServ, this won't happen either. One other reason: any of us who have or had small children know how tough it is to uproot and move families. If Coach and Mrs. Smart are happy here, we'll be fine! Probability of Happening: 20 percent.
I don't think any of these circumstances are likely, which is why I believe Coach Smart is around for the long-haul.
I think #2 and #4 are close to 0%. #3 is always possible but I have no fears about that currently.
#1, I think is a concern but I don't think the restructure will look like how you described, though your guess is as good as mine. I think the Big East will have a place in the new world order should it come but I honestly don't expect it to come in the foreseeable future.
I think the one you're missing is what Lens brought up, the NBA. I've never gotten the impression that Shaka aspires to be an NBA coach but I don't think anyone knows (including Shaka) how he would respond if he got that phone call.
I think what will ultimately bring Shaka's reign to an end is early retirement. He strikes me as the kind of guy who may retire in his early 50s which I certainly wouldn't fault anyone for. I think we are going to have a lot of fun between now and then.
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I think #2 and #4 are close to 0%. #3 is always possible but I have no fears about that currently.
#1, I think is a concern but I don't think the restructure will look like how you described, though your guess is as good as mine. I think the Big East will have a place in the new world order should it come but I honestly don't expect it to come in the foreseeable future.
I think the one you're missing is what Lens brought up, the NBA. I've never gotten the impression that Shaka aspires to be an NBA coach but I don't think anyone knows (including Shaka) how he would respond if he got that phone call.
I think what will ultimately bring Shaka's reign to an end is early retirement. He strikes me as the kind of guy who may retire in his early 50s which I certainly wouldn't fault anyone for. I think we are going to have a lot of fun between now and then.
I wonder how Billy Donovan views the NBA lifestyle. I’m sure him and Shaka have had some conversations. Shaka really seems to embrace the development of men piece of the college game.
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Bill Self is in the discussion.
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I wonder how Billy Donovan views the NBA lifestyle. I’m sure him and Shaka have had some conversations. Shaka really seems to embrace the development of men piece of the college game.
Billy's on his 2nd NBA job and could have any college job in America right now. That should answer your question.
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The Lens
I think it is natural for any college basketball coach to have some type of interest in coaching in the NBA. For the first time in a long time, I cannot think of a good reason why an MU coach would explore another college job. I would be beyond floored if Shaka took another college job in the upcoming years.
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Ben Steele did a pod recently where he said he gets vibes that Shaka is here to stay as long as he coaches basketball. But that his interests change so much he thinks he'll retire young
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Ben Steele did a pod recently where he said he gets vibes that Shaka is here to stay as long as he coaches basketball. But that his interests change so much he thinks he'll retire young
Maybe I’m being naive but this is kind of what I expect. He’s seen what else is out there and is more likely to be our coach K than Crean.
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Came to Marquette so he could play the underdog card and he's already blown that in his second season.
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Dgies, nice post.
I’m also of the belief that in this Coach Shaka and Marquette union both sides will find happiness for a long long time.
Hard to say how long that is, as life can be fickle, here today gowne tomorrow.
That said, if I had to pick one route of potential “early” exit it would be the incident.
I don’t worry much about an incident from Shaka’s end, I think we are good there.
I would worry more about an incident from the University’s end.
Something along the lines of what the rumors were with Coach Jay Wright’s exit at Villanova.
Shaka seems like a man that is extremely intuitive, very intelligent and has great abilities in leadership.
Along the same lines, both he and his wife have a strong core of beliefs that mean a great deal to them.
If those beliefs were to ever come at a crossroads with those of the University or board of trustees/higher “donating” members of the Marquette fanbase, and he or his wife felt “wronged” in some way, or misaligned at the very least, I could see a mode of exit.
Again, I expect a long reign at Marquette.
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Dgies, nice post.
I’m also of the belief that in this Coach Shaka and Marquette union both sides will find happiness for a long long time.
Hard to say how long that is, as life can be fickle, here today gowne tomorrow.
That said, if I had to pick one route of potential “early” exit it would be the incident.
I don’t worry much about an incident from Shaka’s end, I think we are good there.
I would worry more about an incident from the University’s end.
Something along the lines of what the rumors were with Coach Jay Wright’s exit at Villanova.
Shaka seems like a man that is extremely intuitive, very intelligent and has great abilities in leadership.
Along the same lines, both he and his wife have a strong core of beliefs that mean a great deal to them.
If those beliefs were to ever come at a crossroads with those of the University or board of trustees/higher “donating” members of the Marquette fanbase, and he or his wife felt “wronged” in some way, or misaligned at the very least, I could see a mode of exit.
Again, I expect a long reign at Marquette.
Brother Doctor:
One of the things that happens when you're really good for a really long time is complacency. There becomes a sense that you'll always be good, regardless of circumstances and there's nothing that can change the inherent excellence of our program.
I don't know what Jay Wright felt about Villanova but I can speak to Marquette, a little bit. Coach McGuire made us complacent. We felt it was an obligation of the college basketball world to include us in the NCAA. We were Final Four twice and probably should have been two or three more times between 1967 and 1977. After Coach McGuire left, there was a general view that we were going to be a Top 5 or 10 team forever, kind of like Duke.
When we lost to Miami of Ohio in 1978, it was the beginning of the end. Few of us knew it, but it was. Hank wasn't Al and the recruits that used to go to Marquette, for one reason or another, went elsewhere. We went from Cracked Sidewalks to the Back 40 and never fully appreciated how hard Coach McGuire worked.
We're in a honeymoon with Coach and Mrs. Smith now. Coach can do no wrong and both he and Mrs. Smith's commitment to Milwaukee is strong. They're new in town and we love them. But what's going to happen if we're not sixth next year? Or higher? Even North Carolina and Duke have off years. Dean Smith and Coach K were incredible people too but what kept them off the first bus out of town is they win.
The message is we as MU fans have to be grateful. The day the professors or administrators start complaining about the basketball program; the day anyone questions the commitment to it or simply the day we become complacent and wonder why we don't have more banners next to the 1977 one is the day we are on borrowed time with our coach. Lets enjoy what we have.
Most of all, don't forget to say thank you to the team and Coach!
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dgies
Another great post. I will add that this season very easily could prove to be a once in long time type season. Complacency sucks and so does unrealistic expectations.
I truly believe this is a once in a blue moon season and it is going to be hard to replicate. Have said it many times, I believe Shaka will have more talented teams, but very likely not one with this magic.
That has been my point along, we all should be enjoying every minute of the rest season and being grateful for what we are watching. It has been beyond unbelievable, imo, and hope it has some more legs to it.
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I’ve been told here that nothing means nothing if you don’t win in March. We’re 0-0 in March, we’re 0-0 in the BET, we’re 0-0 in the NCAAT. Until the season is done, everyone gets an incomplete. Regular season accolades are nice, but in 12 days, everything resets.
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Ben Steele did a pod recently where he said he gets vibes that Shaka is here to stay as long as he coaches basketball. But that his interests change so much he thinks he'll retire young
Yup never say never. But its been my thought as well. I think he stays here for good.
My worries would more be along the lines he hangs it up a lot earlier than expected. I think hes got another 10 in him though. But def strikes me as a guy who gets out in his 50s.
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Yup never say never. But its been my thought as well. I think he stays here for good.
My worries would more be along the lines he hangs it up a lot earlier than expected. I think hes got another 10 in him though. But def strikes me as a guy who gets out in his 50s.
Another Al McGuire? Win it all and then step away? I'd be ok with that!
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Another Al McGuire? Win it all and then step away? I'd be ok with that!
Several times……lol
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I originally titled this thread: "Shaka A+ This Season". I caved and changed it to "A+ so far". I should have been more confident with my opinion. I think A+ is more than accurate. :)
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I originally titled this thread: "Shaka A+ This Season". I caved and changed it to "A+ so far". I should have been more confident with my opinion. I think A+ is more than accurate. :)
Can't get an A+ if you fail the final. No finish line Muggsy.