MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: rgoode57 on January 22, 2023, 11:13:23 AM
-
The one player who frustrates me the most is Joplin. He obviously can be a very good player - and, at times, he is. But, he has two traits that really frustrate me. First, his ball handling is poor. It scares me to death when he starts dribbling because it ends badly way too often. Second, the ball tends to stop when it gets to him. He wants to score and sometimes just puts his head down and tries to bull his way to the basket. That usually ends badly too. If he can improve his ball handling and change is "shoot first" mindset, he can be a really, really good player.
-
Second, the ball tends to stop when it gets to him. He wants to score and sometimes just puts his head down and tries to bull his way to the basket.
Joplin did not take the leap I expected. That said, I am still a fan and think he will get there. Your point above is the area where he needs to grow, in my opinion. He makes up his mind he is doing something and then sticks to it even when it isn’t going to work. He needs to see the floor better and be seeing two or three options all the time not just one. He will get there.
-
rgoode
I will say it again, if Joplin is our biggest frustration, we have a good thing going.
-
He shot poorly yesterday and had turnover issues, but despite that I thought he’d did some good things. His drive and dish to Oso was exactly the play that he needs to be able to make and he did it perfectly. I also thought he was very active defensively and had his best game of the year on that end, surprised in looking at the box score that he didn’t have more steals. He’s improving.
-
I think has a very high upside and I thought I heard last night he has the highest 3 point average on the team.
-
Goose is correct, and , other than rebounding, Joplin is my only frustration. And, I agree that he seems to be improving defensively.
-
Yes, MU's 6th man who sees his role as instant offense has a tendency to stop the ball movement and force shots. Accept that he is a conscience-free gunner and move on.
-
I have been consistently complaining about him... However yesterday was his best defensive game in a long time. I acknowledge SH doesn't have the offensive talent to take advantage of him. But that side of the ball is all that matters with him and his success.
Go from the worst defender on the team to an average one and he'll be okay. Maybe a little too high usage, but he'll be a positive contributor.
Part of it is the rest of the team is so good that he and 2 of the freshmen, sometimes stick out like a sore thumb.
-
The one player who frustrates me the most is Joplin. He obviously can be a very good player - and, at times, he is. But, he has two traits that really frustrate me. First, his ball handling is poor. It scares me to death when he starts dribbling because it ends badly way too often. Second, the ball tends to stop when it gets to him. He wants to score and sometimes just puts his head down and tries to bull his way to the basket. That usually ends badly too. If he can improve his ball handling and change is "shoot first" mindset, he can be a really, really good player.
He's also moving toward that last sentence. Lots of improvement over past 2.
-
Yes, MU's 6th man who sees his role as instant offense has a tendency to stop the ball movement and force shots. Accept that he is a conscience-free gunner and move on.
Shaka has him taking over the Wrightsil role. Work in progress on the interior (my comp is Lazar his first few years but Jop is a better perimeter player).
Btw, many of his interior plays are called ISO's to at least threaten the paint. He needs to kick it out though more often.
-
Joplin hasn’t taken as big a leap as the other returning players, but he still needs to play a major role on this team and has a sky high ceiling longer-term. I think the consternation about his play from scoopers is overwrought.
There are two main issues with his game right now: defense and ballhandling. He’s a below average defensive player on this team, but to my eyes he’s made incremental improvement throughout the season. He’s made impact defensive plays every game recently, including yesterday’s block and typically one or two anticipated steals. Most importantly, he generally brings the energy and focus Shaka is looking for on that end of the floor. I can live with that.
His propensity to turn the ball over while driving stands in stark contrast to the other (elite) ball handlers on this team. It was clear that 10-12 games ago Shaka and the team challenged him to start getting to the rim more often. The results haven’t been pretty, but I think we’ve seen incremental improvement there too, perhaps saving yesterday. Otherwise offensively, we we’re getting an elite shooter at 6’7”. That’s extremely valuable.
I think Shaka’s stated goal for MU to grow as much as any team in the country this season is really important as it pertains to Joplin. Of course we want to be maximizing our chances to win every game. That means guys who are showing out like Chase Ross demand more minutes. But even as we creep toward February, we can’t lose sight of the importance of players getting an opportunity to improve, especially on such a young team. Every time Jop takes it to the rim, that’s one more rep in the experience bank. One more rep closer to his potential. And even if those reps might not help the team win a game in January, they might in March. And they certainly will in 2024.
-
The one player who frustrates me the most is Joplin. He obviously can be a very good player - and, at times, he is. But, he has two traits that really frustrate me. First, his ball handling is poor. It scares me to death when he starts dribbling because it ends badly way too often. Second, the ball tends to stop when it gets to him. He wants to score and sometimes just puts his head down and tries to bull his way to the basket. That usually ends badly too. If he can improve his ball handling and change is "shoot first" mindset, he can be a really, really good player.
Right about the ball tends to stop when it gets to him and shoot first mentality. It does appear that he has the green light from Shaka on this. We shall see how that develops going forward.
-
To my eyes, Joplin defends better when guarding a big player in the paint than guarding a quicker player in space.
-
Nice post two words, even though that was substantially more than two words.
Several other nice posts in this one as well.
Rgoode is right that Jop can be frustrating at times, more-so than others on this years team, and I often catch myself yelling for Shaka to give him a bench break.
That said, as y’all have already noted, a lot of that needs context.
In comparison to several of the extremely impressive ball handlers on this years team he’s a very poor ball handler, it makes him look worse since few others make mistakes. In comparison to many on past teams he’s probably average or even better than some guys in his size range.
His main purpose and skill is scoring, and making 3s. His big role this year will be a spark off the bench ala Novak his freshman season, when the rubber inevitably meets the road in an elimination game and Marquette is in dire need of some buckets.
Jop will have to be there, at the right time, and if he’s not there when he’s needed at that time, aka he can’t hit those tough shots, Marquette may very well lose and it’s season may end.
I think Shaka knows that. It seems like he’s pushing David a lot and giving him minutes, letting him play through mistakes to try to get better and more prepared for the late grind when the team needs him.
I’ve also seen defensive improvement, incremental but he’s shown some flashes- that block yesterday was a great EGB.
I like that at times he seems to rebound well- he had 4 yesterday and has had 4/5 in several conference games.
You might say big whoop, but when OMax is getting 1-2 boards on 10+ more minutes the 4-5 Jop gets seen valuable.
One change I’d like to see-
Seems like the staff wants him to iso and get inside to score. I’m fine with that as he’s seemed capable, if not consistent.
What I’d like to see more offensively is Jop running and moving more without the ball, off screens, in an attempt to cause more chaos and to make his defender have to defend him away from the basket allowing more lane space for the others.
Even though he isn’t very quick, I think more movement off screens and catch and shoot 3s from him would really benefit the already #1 offense in the land, especially at a time when they’ve gone on a bit of a drought.
Keep getting strong and hitting the glass, don’t get beat badly on defense and keep the defensive energy intensity, and give the team huge buckets like he’s done all year, especially big 3s, and he will have a huge importance in March.
As for his future, I’m not sure, I’m not there yet. I do think a few strong games in March could catapult him for next season however.
-
He's a ball-stopper and he makes some mistakes.
He also made a fantastic shot-clock buzzer beater that definitely deflated SH and brought me out of my seat.
-
To my eyes, Joplin defends better when guarding a big player in the paint than guarding a quicker player in space.
This. He's stout but not sudden. The bigger frustration for me is his offense is not a plus to the team play in and play out. When he's not scoring, he's not adding
-
David's in season improvement is obvious. His defense is much better. Early on, he seemed completely disinterested. Now there's effort and active hands. Offensively, he looks to pass. Not all the time, but he had a really nice assist yesterday and another play where he drove in and kicked it out instead of trying to score. That wouldn't have happened in November.
Like goose said, if David is the biggest problem, we're in a good place.
-
After watching David for a year and a half, I think his best game is as a catch and shoot jump shooter. Maybe a little more drive and kick action from Tyler and Kam will get him some good looks and get him going. When he gets to square up and step into a shot, he's good. When he has to or decides to put the ball on the floor, then not so much.
-
He's averaging double digits off the bench.
I'm critical of him at times because I think he has another level, but you don't score double digits off the bench for a Top 10ish team by accident. He's really good at what they need him to be good at (scoring) and anything else he gives is a bonus right now. I think over time he will be reliable defensively in spurts, but growth takes time. See Oso for example. Jop will be alright.
-
I have said earlier and I will say it again. I look for Joplin to have the same kind of a ha moment that Kam had earlier this year. The one where he realizes that he can get all of the looks he wants in the framework of the offense without forcing 'degree of difficulty' shots. When that light comes on, ;D
-
I’m looking at joplin through the same lense I’d evaluate a bouncy big transitioning from high school where he used his height/athleticism to dominate.
Jop was such a good shooter at the HS/AAU level that the he could simply rely on shooting over and powering through smaller weaker opponents. Moving up a level, those easy buckets he could rely on are no longer available. His decision making at this level needs a lot of work, but he’s going to be a high level college player once the game slows down for him a bit. His defense is quickly improving and he’s turned himself into a more than capable rebounder.
He’s a frustrating player now because everyone who knows ball can see the potential he has. Simply needs to improve his decision making on the bounce.
-
Joplin did not take the leap I expected. That said, I am still a fan and think he will get there. Your point above is the area where he needs to grow, in my opinion. He makes up his mind he is doing something and then sticks to it even when it isn’t going to work. He needs to see the floor better and be seeing two or three options all the time not just one. He will get there.
Joplin has an issue with ball handling/turnovers, but per 36 minutes, he is in the top two scorers and rebounders on the team.
IMO, he has taken a very big leap.
-
Agree with earlier posts that he had a great defensive game and he's improving in that regard.
I get the dribbling concers but the real issue is that he is a below the rim player. When he takes it to the hoop he is going against better athletes so needs to get wily like Kam does around the rim. Kam does for lack of size, Jop needs to because of quickness/jumping.
-
The Jop flake is getting kinda annoying.
His D yesterday was probably the best its been
-
The Jop flake is getting kinda annoying.
His D yesterday was probably the best its been
Pretty darn good! There was a point I even said I'd rather have him out there for the remainder of the game in favor of OMax. OMax goes through stretches where he looks lost. Yesterday Jop was great in covering that up.
-
He shoots it from 3 better than anyone on the team percentage wise.
He adds size to a small team.
His defense is improving.
His ability to attack the rim is improving.
O-Max had similar struggles off the dribble last year...Joplin needs to make that jump over the summer. If O-Max isn't back next year...Joplin becomes extremely important. He doesn't have great lift or quickness...he plays like a Carmelo Anthony type player.
-
I've been impressed with Jops Defense the past few games. He's still not a great defend but there's been noticeable improvement on that end
-
He shoots it from 3 better than anyone on the team percentage wise.
He adds size to a small team.
His defense is improving.
His ability to attack the rim is improving.
O-Max had similar struggles off the dribble last year...Joplin needs to make that jump over the summer. If O-Max isn't back next year...Joplin becomes extremely important. He doesn't have great lift or quickness...he plays like a Carmelo Anthony type player.
Marquette is not a small team.
-
Marquette is not a small team.
We're not small for a D1 team. We are small for a high major team, especially if you consider girth in addition to height
-
This conversation is hilarious.. because despite shooting 2-10 against Seton Hall. That was probably the best Joplin played since baylor?
He was so putrid to start big east play, but he gets criticism for his first positive contributing game in a long time because he played well on defense.
Do i think his overall defense has improved at all taking the whole season into account, no not really. But him playing above average in defense for once gives me hope. He had a one game RAPM defense rating of -12.7 (lower the better) and the best on the team.
Seton Hall had 0.484 PPP with him on the court. Which is hilarious
-
Feels like he's of two minds a lot on the offensive end. Early in the year when he was really shooting it well, there was no flinch. Now, he's hesitant or passing them up completely to go one one of those meandering drives to the basket. And those are usually an adventure.
That end shot clock three... The decision was taken out of his hands. He just had to shoot. This week in practice I'd sure like Shaka to turn him back into a shooter. That's where he'll help most.
-
Feels like he's of two minds a lot on the offensive end. Early in the year when he was really shooting it well, there was no flinch. Now, he's hesitant or passing them up completely to go one one of those meandering drives to the basket. And those are usually an adventure.
That end shot clock three... The decision was taken out of his hands. He just had to shoot. This week in practice I'd sure like Shaka to turn him back into a shooter. That's where he'll help most.
Think you hit the nail on the head here. Great observation. I would add that our Offensive strategy of 3's or shots at the rim probably isn't the best for Jop. I feel he'd be more effective scoring in the mid-range than trying to get all the way to the basket at this stage of his development/athleticism.
If he gets run off the three he'd be best served by taking 1 or 2 dribbles into a midrange pullup. But, that's not our offense/code.
-
He shot poorly yesterday and had turnover issues, but despite that I thought he’d did some good things. His drive and dish to Oso was exactly the play that he needs to be able to make and he did it perfectly. I also thought he was very active defensively and had his best game of the year on that end, surprised in looking at the box score that he didn’t have more steals. He’s improving.
I had the same impression yesterday. Seems like things clicked or slowed down for him like it did for Kam against Baylor. He didn’t have a great day shooting personally, but made good decisions and played good defense. If he keeps playing this way but shoots a little better the sky’s the limit.
-
David Joplin was +14 today and only took 1 shot.
That is growth from Jop. Just wanted to shout him out as someone who will get lost in the shuffle of today's game.
-
David Joplin was +14 today and only took 1 shot.
That is growth from Jop. Just wanted to shout him out as someone who will get lost in the shuffle of today's game.
I thought both him and Sean Jones had great minutes that won’t show up in the box score.
-
Thought Jop's minutes at the 4 guarding Kalkbrenner were important minutes tonight. He's not the most athletic but he has the potential to get hot on offense and be serviceable on defense in the right role.
-
+/- is not a great stat, but he played well defensively when he needed to.
-
Thought this was his best defensive effort of the season. Awesome to see him contribute in other ways
-
I thought both him and Sean Jones had great minutes that won’t show up in the box score.
Great comment. Both were a factor in the win but it won show up in the box score. They played with the violence that Shaka preaches.
-
Amazing defensive effort, minus him trying to go for the steal and leaving Trey Alexander, their best shooter, with an open 3 when we are up 2.
-
His rebounding is greatly improved (team rebounding greatly improved the past month as well) his work ethic and defensive awareness is totally different. He's a great asset for this team coming off the bench.
-
Guys develop at different paces. I would not be surprised if Jop takes a big leap between this year and next.
Trying not to look ahead too far, but if all of the pieces remain in place next year, this team is scary good, and probably our best chance for a title since 1977. 2003 was a great year, and D Wade was an all time great, but as a team I think this group has even more potential.
-
I thought both him and Sean Jones had great minutes that won’t show up in the box score.
Agree. So did O-max on defense. I know people hate the flailing, but dude was a force on defense today.
-
And I think he opened up the floor on offense with his potential. Seems a lot more open spaces when he was in there.
-
Agree. So did O-max on defense. I know people hate the flailing, but dude was a force on defense today.
I don't think we watched the same game. about 50% of Creighton's buckets were on OMAX missed assignments or because he was out of position or was guarding no-one at that particular point in time.
-
I don't think we watched the same game. about 50% of Creighton's buckets were on OMAX missed assignments or because he was out of position or was guarding no-one at that particular point in time.
He’s really struggled on back side help defense. Last night was a bit better but Xavier game he lost his man or didn’t rotate way too often.
On ball defense is really solid though.
-
He’s really struggled on back side help defense. Last night was a bit better but Xavier game he lost his man or didn’t rotate way too often.
On ball defense is really solid though.
I thougth he closed out really well last night after the misses in the X game. There was some "oh god they're wide open" shots that he completely disrupted and moved them off the line. Maybe I was fixated on that and missed some other things, but felt he was closing pretty well.
-
I thougth he closed out really well last night after the misses in the X game. There was some "oh god they're wide open" shots that he completely disrupted and moved them off the line. Maybe I was fixated on that and missed some other things, but felt he was closing pretty well.
Agree - length helps him a ton with that. We’re talking about two separate things defensively with him. On ball activity is always solid for him imo
-
Agree - length helps him a ton with that. We’re talking about two separate things defensively with him. On ball activity is always solid for him imo
I see what you're saying. Agree on the on-ball for sure. What's becoming fun is this defense is nowhere near it's ceiling...and it's still pretty darn good. The metrics may not love it, but the team can really clamp for 10 minute stretches like last night.
-
I've been impressed with Jops Defense the past few games. He's still not a great defend but there's been noticeable improvement on that end
Jop and Kam are similar. Neither is a great defender, but both have bought in to playing hard on the defensive end.
-
6 points
5 rebounds
5 steals
4 assists
What a game from Jop!
-
Star of the game
-
Jop
-
FWIW, Jop’s defensive rebounding % is tops of our nOine rotation players
-
Joplin is a pretty funny dude
https://twitter.com/bigeastmbb/status/1634748811280097280?s=46&t=vzpt-zjb3EWbQ_hnQmF3QQ
Just an awesome weekend from him overall. Think he liked MSG?
-
FWIW, Jop’s defensive rebounding % is tops of our nOine rotation players
I remember you made fun of me after last season when I said Jop was gonna be a good rebounder this year.
-
Since I started this thread sometime back and was expressing frustration with Joplin, I want to make sure I congratulate him on a great BE tournament. He played his ass off. Great job.
-
Last two games were very good for him.
St. John’s game was definitely not. -16 in 12 minutes. 40 ortg. 29% usage.
But his play in the UConn game was very important to minimize sanogo with his offense and hurleys stupidity.
He’s starting to get better and better on defense. And he’s starting to stop dribbling into post ups.
He is still inconsistent, but there is a 3 point shooter with less usage in there who could be a really good player.
-
David Joplin has been a very big part of the teams success and only going to get better. Give me a kid that loves the bright lights any day of the week. Plus, he is working his ass off on defense and rebounding and only going to get better.
-
They have all been fine. Joplin has run hot and cold. He has worked hard and has gotten better. He is an integral piece of a 28-6 team. Nothing but appreciation and respect.
-
Joplin had a better year than I was expecting. A lot of you were high on him before the season started.
I think he takes another big step-up next season.
The other players I think will have big step-ups our Gold and Ross. Ross should learn not to foul so much.