MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: MuggsyB on October 22, 2021, 02:27:57 PM
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WTH? There are reports the gun was shot with a live round? Crazy if true.
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This is literally out of an episode of Psych and I'm sure like every other crime show.
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Horrible accident. Tragedy for all involved.
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WTH? There are reports the gun was shot with a live round? Crazy if true.
one would think producers would have learned their lesson after what happened with Bruce and Brandon Lee. What a tragedy.
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Horrible accident. Tragedy for all involved.
Involuntary manslaughter charges?
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Involuntary manslaughter charges?
Not necessarily, I'd imagine gross negligence for whoever's in charge of props. There's a reasonable expectation from Alec that the gun would've been safe as he's not a prop expert. If a car's breaks fail and you're driving and hit someone that's on the manufacturer or recent mechanic not on you.
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I just heard a blip on the radio speculating that it could have been a live round. If that's true I would think someone could be charged with manslaughter?
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Not necessarily, I'd imagine gross negligence for whoever's in charge of props. There's a reasonable expectation from Alec that the gun would've been safe as he's not a prop expert. If a car's breaks fail and you're driving and hit someone that's on the manufacturer or recent mechanic not on you.
While I wouldn’t mind if Alec was charged as he is an asswipe, there was a union dispute with a walk-out a few hours before this, with complaints of unsafe working conditions. Likely, some one will get charged with at least this charge if not more.
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WTH? There are reports the gun was shot with a live round? Crazy if true.
All you can do is pray
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While I wouldn’t mind if Alec was charged as he is an asswipe, there was a union dispute with a walk-out a few hours before this, with complaints of unsafe working conditions. Likely, some one will get charged with at least this charge if not more.
Interesting didn't know about the walkout. There's gonna be some crazy conspiracies to this
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one would think producers would have learned their lesson after what happened with Bruce and Brandon Lee. What a tragedy.
Bruce Lee died of a cerebral edema 20 years before the tragedy involving Brandon...
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I would be surprised if there are criminal charges. I expect the family of the deceased to get a low 8 figure settlement.
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Ooooffff
https://twitter.com/nycsouthpaw/status/1451634746061168646?s=21
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WTH? There are reports the gun was shot with a live round? Crazy if true.
A source close to union said Local 44 does not know what projectile was in the gun and clarified that “live” is an industry term that refers to a gun being loaded with some material such as a blank ready for filming.
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Alec Baldwin is not at fault here, he can’t be charged unless he knew the gun had some type of live round in it.
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Alec Baldwin is not at fault here, he can’t be charged unless he knew the gun had some type of live round in it.
If he influenced the call to replace the union crew with unqualified individuals he might be
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If he influenced the call to replace the union crew with unqualified individuals he might be
It was a union camera crew that walked off the set. Not the props people.
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All you can do is pray
Nah, just thoughts from Nads, hey?
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Alec Baldwin is not at fault here, he can’t be charged unless he knew the gun had some type of live round in it.
He was a producer on the movie and fired the round. He’s probably screwed.
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It was a union camera crew that walked off the set. Not the props people.
Got it thanks
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Got it thanks
Sounds like the whole production was a mess right from the start, though. Mostly cuz of a lack of $$$.
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If he influenced the call to replace the union crew with unqualified individuals he might be
I highly doubt it. The only way I see any criminal charges here is if someone, possibly even on the union crew, intentionally switched guns, or rounds.
Otherwise, this is just a terrible tragic accident.
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I highly doubt it. The only way I see any criminal charges here is if someone, possibly even on the union crew, intentionally switched guns, or rounds.
Otherwise, this is just a terrible tragic accident.
I still maintain someone getting hit with negligence is a possibility
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He was a producer on the movie and fired the round. He’s probably screwed.
That's not how this works.
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He was a producer on the movie and fired the round. He’s probably screwed.
Almost any big name gets producer credit for a bigger paycheck and shot at more publicity.
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I still maintain someone getting hit with negligence is a possibility
Looking more and more like this was due to negligence more than just being an accident as more info comes out. Gun had caused problems before and producers had gotten an email complaining about it just a few days prior.
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I’m wondering why the gun was pointed at the director of photography, not an actor. Odd.
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A close up shot of him firing, perhaps at a slight angle.
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I’m wondering why the gun was pointed at the director of photography, not an actor. Odd.
Just spitballing here, but an actor aiming a gun at the camera or some THING usually tracks better than just picking a spot on the wall.
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there are supposed to be armorers or weapon masters and assistants present at ALL productions where ANY gun is involved. they are responsible for checking, loading and advising the actors properly. the actors themselves should always handle the gun(s) as if it were loaded with a live round. trust AND verify.
i believe baldwin is a world class a$$hole, but i really do feel bad for him and worse for the actor who died and the one who was injured. he has to live with this incident and wouldn't wish this upon my worst enemy
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I’m wondering why the gun was pointed at the director of photography, not an actor. Odd.
I read an article that mentioned typically the actors are staggered when firing the gun to avoid this from happening.
It will be interesting as more comes out. Most articles I’ve read mentioned this isn’t out of the realm of possibility with these guns. There is some risk.
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there are supposed to be armorers or weapon masters and assistants present at ALL productions where ANY gun is involved. they are responsible for checking, loading and advising the actors properly. the actors themselves should always handle the gun(s) as if it were loaded with a live round. trust AND verify.
i believe baldwin is a world class a$$hole, but i really do feel bad for him and worse for the actor who died and the one who was injured. he has to live with this incident and wouldn't wish this upon my worst enemy
Yes. I would think there are all sorts of protocols and safety precautions. That's why I find this story so strange and that someone or ones will be held responsible.
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there are supposed to be armorers or weapon masters and assistants present at ALL productions where ANY gun is involved. they are responsible for checking, loading and advising the actors properly. the actors themselves should always handle the gun(s) as if it were loaded with a live round. trust AND verify.
i believe baldwin is a world class a$$hole, but i really do feel bad for him and worse for the actor who died and the one who was injured. he has to live with this incident and wouldn't wish this upon my worst enemy
Agree.
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https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/business/story/2021-10-22/alec-baldwin-rust-camera-crew-walked-off-set?s=09
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It sounds like the Assistant Director told Baldwin the "gun was safe'?. Beyond messed up. It appears protocols were not followed at all.
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And of course we remember that possibly facing lawsuits is not the same as being charged criminally, lawsuits will probably end up being filed against the production company and those involved in protocols, I would think.
It’s terrible all the way around.
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The big unanswered question is....
Why was a live round in the chamber?
Big question #2....
Who placed it there?
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My wife's theory is some deranged Trumpie slipped in a live bullet 'to get back at A Baldwin for playing Trump on SNL."
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Now Obama's gonna take away all the prop guns.
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My wife's theory is some deranged Trumpie slipped in a live bullet 'to get back at A Baldwin for playing Trump on SNL."
Lost in the sauce tho.
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Union is to blame, aina
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It sounds like the Assistant Director told Baldwin the "gun was safe'?. Beyond messed up. It appears protocols were not followed at all.
I've read she was a "rookie" armorer and was hired via nepotism after a career as a model.
What could go wrong? Oh, wait. That.
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Why is live ammunition even available on the set?
Why are actual guns used?
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Why is live ammunition even available on the set?
Why are actual guns used?
This. It seems like if you don't have any live rounds anywhere on set and you make sure the guns are emptied before bringing them on set, this would never happen. Again, I don't know the movie business, but it seems this could be prevented by very modest means and a simplest procedures. It has to be either criminal neglect or intentional, one would think.
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The big unanswered question is....
Why was a live round in the chamber?
Big question #2....
Who placed it there?
It may even go beyond the live round. From what I have read a prop gun cannot fire a blank. So was this actually shot from a real gun? What in the H is going on here?
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It may even go beyond the live round. From what I have read a prop gun cannot fire a blank. So was this actually shot from a real gun? What in the H is going on here?
I thought the risk with these was a blank is still a projectile, so there’s still a risk, although much, much lower.
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I thought the risk with these was a blank is still a projectile, so there’s still a risk, although much, much lower.
Do we know how far away the gun was fired from the the victim? If this was a real gun? WTF? Crazy, crazy, crazy. They should be able to determine if it was a live round from an actual gun. I'm not blaming Baldwin but wouldn't he know if the gun he was holding was real?
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There is a TMZ report this afternoon that set workers were stealing the pistol afterhours (after filming shut down for the evening) for target practice and then putting it back before morning.
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There is a TMZ report this afternoon that set workers were stealing the pistol afterhours (after filming shut down for the evening) for target practice and then putting it back before morning.
So it's been verified it was s real pistol?? How could a real gun be on the set?
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I'm pretty sure that some of the confusion is surrounding in-industry terms that aren't general colloquial terms for things.
Real guns are used in Hollywood productions.
They are used to create live actor reactions to recoil, muzzle flashes, etc.
They are never loaded with bullets--that is a round with projectile bullet.
They are loaded with rounds that the industry calls "live" but that non industry people would probably call "blanks."
A "live" (blank) round discharges hot gas and occasionally wadding/minor debris that can be harmful/lethal for 15ish feet from the end of the barrel.
An actor famously died on set by placing a gun loaded with a live (blank) round to his head and pulling the trigger not realizing that was a lethal decision.
I've read several accounts of currently active hollywood armorers who describe the practice and procedure for use of "live" rounds on set. They include, only the armorer ever handling the weapon. The armorer loading the weapon. The armorer certifying the number of "live" rounds in the weapon between every take. The armorer handing the weapon directly to the actor. The armorer and an assistant certifying whether the weapon is "hot" or "cold" and calling that out before and after handing the weapon to the actor.
(Allegedly here's where someone called out "cold gun" and Baldwin assumed that was legit to disastrous effect).
It still sounds like a great deal of the chain of custody of the weapon is disputed, but every time you read a hollywood person or source use the term "live" round, it's almost certainly (absent true murder mystery style intent) meaning what you and I would call a blank.
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So it's been verified it was s real pistol?? How could a real gun be on the set?
Real guns are used all the time. Usually there is a qualified 'gun guy' who is in charge of everything firearm related.
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This. It seems like if you don't have any live rounds anywhere on set and you make sure the guns are emptied before bringing them on set, this would never happen. Again, I don't know the movie business, but it seems this could be prevented by very modest means and a simplest procedures. It has to be either criminal neglect or intentional, one would think.
As others have said, I’ve read in a number of places that “live” rounds on a movie set is what most would think of as blanks. They make a realistic bang and can have projectiles.
I also read that proper protocol is that real ammunition is absolutely never, ever supposed to be on a movie set. Ever. So, exactly as you’re suggesting. Sometimes they want real-looking bullets that will be seen, but those aren’t live and don’t have powder (and I read they make them so they rattle when you shake them to prevent confusion).
Based on what I’ve read, there are many rules and regulations to prevent this sort of tragedy from occurring (including, not insignificantly, never pointing the gun at anyone). This likely isn’t the result of not enough rules. This is the result of not following the rules.
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An actor famously died on set by placing a gun loaded with a live (blank) round to his head and pulling the trigger not realizing that was a lethal decision.
I remember this. Jon-Erik Hexum in the mid-eighties. He was on the set of his TV show and responded to a continued delay in filming by jokingly holding a prop gun to his temple and pulling the trigger. The wadding in the gun expelled and killed him.
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I heard it was an elephant gun.
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This likely isn’t the result of not enough rules. This is the result of not following the rules.
True here and in the vast majority of all tragic accidents.
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True here and in the vast majority of all tragic accidents.
True but many of the actors on the set are saying the environment was an utter s-show.
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True but many of the actors on the set are saying the environment was an utter s-show.
Apparently cutting corners and not properly staffing the prop/armory.
So a person died because people tried to save a few bucks. Meanwhile I'm sure several actors were being paid millions. Them cutting their salary by a small fraction would mean a life would have been saved.
So bottom line, it comes down to greed.
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Anyone see the interview with George S.? I was initially sympathetic to Baldwin. No more. Narcissistic, lying POS.
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Anyone see the interview with George S.? I was initially sympathetic to Baldwin. No more. Narcissistic, lying POS.
I didn't see it but heard that he said he thought this woman fainted and he didn't realize she was shot until 45 mins later?? How on earth Is that plausible? I guess I thought I tomahawk dunked on Kur Kuath but didn't realize I couldn't have until 45 mins later?
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I didn't see it but heard that he said he thought this woman fainted and he didn't realize she was shot until 45 mins later?? How on earth Is that plausible? I guess I thought I tomahawk dunked on Kur Kuath but didn't realize I couldn't have until 45 mins later?
You thought you were Ners. Happens to us all at some point.
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Baldwin for all his wealth and connections has some seemingly brain dead lawyers
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Da devil maid 'im due it, aina?
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I watched the entire interview and could not believe what I was hearing. Strange interview and I struggled believing anything that he said.
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Anyone see the interview with George S.? I was initially sympathetic to Baldwin. No more. Narcissistic, lying POS.
Anyone surprised by that? You nailed it.
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Anyone see the interview with George S.? I was initially sympathetic to Baldwin. No more. Narcissistic, lying POS.
Yeah ... he looked like a dirtbag. And probably is one.
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Yeah ... he looked like a dirtbag. And probably is one.
He has quite a track record of abuse, assault and general dickness, but he played Trump on SNL (poorly) so he gets a pass.
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Personally .. I had more sympathy for Baldwin after watching the interview.
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He has quite a track record of abuse, assault and general dickness, but he played Trump on SNL (poorly) so he gets a pass.
I'm not sure his tenure as DJT on SNL buys him as much love as you think.
He's always been a huge douche nozzle.
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I'm not sure his tenure as DJT on SNL buys him as much love as you think.
He's always been a huge douche nozzle.
Last good thing he did was Hunt for Red October.
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Last good thing he did was Hunt for Red October.
He's great on 30 Rock.
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Last good thing he did was Hunt for Red October.
Much better in that role than Harrison Ford was.
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Last good thing he did was Hunt for Red October.
He's a decent actor. I thought he was fabulous in Team America.
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Last good thing he did was Hunt for Red October.
He was good playing himself in Glengarry Glen Ross
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He was good playing himself in Glengarry Glen Ross
Ha! But that was pre Red October, no?
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Ha! But that was pre Red October, no?
I wanna say it was a year or 2 after? I think HFRO was 1990 and GGR was 91/92
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I wanna say it was a year or 2 after? I think HFRO was 1990 and GGR was 91/92
92.
GGR seems like an 80s movie to me, for some reason.
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He was good playing himself in Glengarry Glen Ross
His scene is one of the great 8 minutes in movie history, especially a non-action movie.