MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: MU82 on March 23, 2021, 06:37:48 AM
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... another mass shooting in America.
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....another criminal that wouldn't follow any laws against guns or murder no matter how strong they are.
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Another sign we are returning to normal.
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Terrible news.
https://twitter.com/adamcbest/status/1374189790623629313?s=19
https://news.yahoo.com/nra-bragged-blocking-boulder-ar-040000858.html#click=https://t.co/Kle76shPjn
https://twitter.com/MichaelSkolnik/status/1374195623684096000?s=19
Another day, another AR-15.
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....another criminal that wouldn't follow any laws against guns or murder no matter how strong they are.
100% agree. Why people just can't accept that it's normal to arm deranged (mostly) white men with weapons capable of killing large numbers of people is beyond me. Having strong gun laws and moving mass amounts of federal $ towards mental health is a waste and should be fought at every opportunity.
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100% agree. Why people just can't accept that it's normal to arm deranged (mostly) white men with weapons capable of killing large numbers of people is beyond me. Having strong gun laws and moving mass amounts of federal $ towards mental health is a waste and should be fought at every opportunity.
Why people don't understand that criminals don't follow the law is beyond me.
If someone is demented enough to go shoot up a building, they are going to buy a gun however they can.
They.
Don't.
Follow.
The law.
Agree mental health needs to be a focus.
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....another criminal that wouldn't follow any laws against guns or murder no matter how strong they are.
Ah yes, more brilliant "why do we even have laws?" logic.
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Why people don't understand that criminals don't follow the law is beyond me.
If someone is demented enough to go shoot up a building, they are going to buy a gun however they can.
They.
Don't.
Follow.
The law.
Agree mental health needs to be a focus.
Again 100% agree. Zero chance we change the gun culture in this country and we shouldn't try to. We need to accept that this is normal and move on.
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Stricter gun laws work in preventing mass murders all over the world. But they wouldn't work in America.
Logic is not your strength Ziggy.
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Again 100% agree. Zero chance we change the gun culture in this country and we shouldn't try to. We need to accept that this is normal and move on.
You clearly aren't thinking far enough ahead. Since criminals don't follow laws, the only possible solution is to not even bother with laws at all. If we have laws criminals will just break them! What's the point of laws???
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More guns=more gun deaths:
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/2/16399418/us-gun-violence-statistics-maps-charts
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You clearly aren't thinking far enough ahead. Since criminals don't follow laws, the only possible solution is to not even bother with laws at all. If we have laws criminals will just break them! What's the point of laws???
Especially when it comes to things like domestic abuse or sexual assault. Humans have been dealing with those for tens of thousands of years, we've demonstrated over those millennia that it isn't going to change and our current laws don't stop people who abuse. Facts don't lie!
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Stricter gun laws work in preventing mass murders all over the world. But they wouldn't work in America.
Logic is not your strength Ziggy.
No, they just use knives, machetes and trucks to kill. Look at England.
Talk about logic. How many people have thought "damn, I was going to kill those people but suddenly remembered that murder is against the law. I think I'll go have a soda pop instead."
Did I advocate for no laws? Talk about a typical tsmith strawman. ::)
FTR, I don't own a gun, don't plan on owning a gun, and do not support the NRA.
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https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/United-Kingdom/United-States/Crime/Violent-crime
United States vs United Kingdom.
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No, they just use knives, machetes and trucks to kill. Look at England.
Talk about logic. How many people have thought "damn, I was going to kill those people but suddenly remembered that murder is against the law. I think I'll go have a soda pop instead."
Did I advocate for no laws? Talk about a typical tsmith strawman. ::)
FTR, I don't own a gun, don't plan on owning a gun, and do not support the NRA.
I could be wrong but with a knife or machete it would seem you have a fighting chance, distance yourself, a well timed block, etc. not to mention it would seem exceedingly more difficult to stab a ton of people to death without getting either overwhelmed by a group, or having everyone run away.
Between the rock of a gun (especially high capacity magazine guns) and hard place of knife or machete I would choose the later.
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I could be wrong but with a knife or machete it would seem you have a fighting chance, distance yourself, a well timed block, etc. not to mention it would seem exceedingly more difficult to stab a ton of people to death without getting either overwhelmed by a group, or having everyone run away.
Between the rock of a gun (especially high capacity magazine guns) and hard place of knife or machete I would choose the later.
Do a truck next.
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Do a truck next.
We're already using them. See Charlottesville. So I'm not quite sure what your broader point is there? It's also not the easiest thing to take out dozens of people in a theater or school with a truck. Luckily we also have a lot of those anti terrorism concrete pillars around populated areas from the first World Trade Center bombing.
I mean we can sit here and figure out way after way that person could kill someone, "What if they just got really strong and learned MMA?!" But at the end of the day I'd personally prefer one less way that doesn't give people a fighting chance at survival.
For the record I'm not advocating we ban guns, I think a buyback program could be good for a lot of them so they aren't sold second hand to idiots as well as think high capacity magazines can be taken down. Some other restrictions as well but not an outright ban.
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We're already using them. See Charlottesville. So I'm not quite sure what your broader point is there? It's also not the easiest thing to take out dozens of people in a theater or school with a truck. Luckily we also have a lot of those anti terrorism concrete pillars around populated areas from the first World Trade Center bombing.
I mean we can sit here and figure out way after way that person could kill someone, "What if they just got really strong and learned MMA?!" But at the end of the day I'd personally prefer one less way that doesn't give people a fighting chance at survival.
For the record I'm not advocating we ban guns, I think a buyback program could be good for a lot of them so they aren't sold second hand to idiots as well as think high capacity magazines can be taken down. Some other restrictions as well but not an outright ban.
I generally agree with your last paragraph.
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No, they just use knives, machetes and trucks to kill. Look at England.
Talk about logic. How many people have thought "damn, I was going to kill those people but suddenly remembered that murder is against the law. I think I'll go have a soda pop instead."
Did I advocate for no laws? Talk about a typical tsmith strawman. ::)
FTR, I don't own a gun, don't plan on owning a gun, and do not support the NRA.
No, no, you were right the first time. Criminals break laws! Therefore we shouldn't even bother with guns laws. What's the point?? Criminals will break them! We're helpless.
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Well, it wasn't a white trump supporter, so this story will disappear.
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Well, it wasn't a white trump supporter, so this story will disappear.
batting 1.000 with me today Ziggy! The MSM will bury this because of his skin color - happens all the time. Though, unlike mass shootings, I think this is the real threat to our way of life and we should fight to make sure this story i.e. non white, non Trump supporters getting a pass by the MSM because of political correctness never dies down.
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Well, it wasn't a white trump supporter, so this story will disappear.
Yeah because nobody remembers the Boston marathon bombings...
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Yeah because nobody remembers the Boston marathon bombings...
Ban pressure cookers, hey?
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Well, it wasn't a white trump supporter, so this story will disappear.
No, it'll just get shoved back in the que with the next mass shooting, scheduled to occur in 3..2..1..
The Colorado attack is the 7th mass shooting in 7 days in the US
https://www.cnn.com/2021/03/23/us/7-mass-shootings-7-days-trnd/index.html
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Classic "No way to prevent this, says only nation where this regularly occurs" moment. The Onion has gotten ALOT of milage out of that doozy.
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Classic "No way to prevent this, says only nation where this regularly occurs" moment. The Onion has gotten ALOT of milage out of that doozy.
They repeated the mantra today.
Isn't any clearer than that.
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Another dollar.
There, saved you all some time.
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We're already using them. See Charlottesville. So I'm not quite sure what your broader point is there? It's also not the easiest thing to take out dozens of people in a theater or school with a truck. Luckily we also have a lot of those anti terrorism concrete pillars around populated areas from the first World Trade Center bombing.
I mean we can sit here and figure out way after way that person could kill someone, "What if they just got really strong and learned MMA?!" But at the end of the day I'd personally prefer one less way that doesn't give people a fighting chance at survival.
For the record I'm not advocating we ban guns, I think a buyback program could be good for a lot of them so they aren't sold second hand to idiots as well as think high capacity magazines can be taken down. Some other restrictions as well but not an outright ban.
They did that in Trenton a few years ago only to find that those who got money for their old revolvers just bought a newer fancier gun with a clip.
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batting 1.000 with me today Ziggy! The MSM will bury this because of his skin color - happens all the time. Though, unlike mass shootings, I think this is the real threat to our way of life and we should fight to make sure this story i.e. non white, non Trump supporters getting a pass by the MSM because of political correctness never dies down.
It's on every news channel and in every newspaper - so yes it has disappeared. Anyone using the term MSM is not qualified to comment on this. Your terrain is the talking point of the day from Fox.
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It's on every news channel and in every newspaper - so yes it has disappeared. Anyone using the term MSM is not qualified to comment on this. Your terrain is the talking point of the day from Fox.
You are so thick in the head.
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It's on every news channel and in every newspaper - so yes it has disappeared. Anyone using the term MSM is not qualified to comment on this. Your terrain is the talking point of the day from Fox.
I'm mocking Ziggy by aggressively agreeing with him.
What I really believe related guns/gun violence is:
Every gun should be registered
Background checks and waiting periods should be implemented for every gun sale
Ammo should be taxed to the next planet and back
Penalties for having an unregistered gun should be extreme
Police and military spending should be used to fund extensive mental health and anti domestic terrorism efforts
Certain types of guns should be illegal
The RATM avatar doesn't count for anything anymore?
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I'm mocking Ziggy by aggressively agreeing with him.
What I really believe related guns/gun violence is:
Every gun should be registered
Background checks and waiting periods should be implemented for every gun sale
Ammo should be taxed to the next planet and back
Penalties for having an unregistered gun should be extreme
Police and military spending should be used to fund extensive mental health and anti domestic terrorism efforts
Certain types of guns should be illegal
The RATM avatar doesn't count for anything anymore?
Not since Paul Ryan said they were his favorite band 😂
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I'm mocking Ziggy by aggressively agreeing with him.
What I really believe related guns/gun violence is:
Every gun should be registered
Background checks and waiting periods should be implemented for every gun sale
Ammo should be taxed to the next planet and back
Penalties for having an unregistered gun should be extreme
Police and military spending should be used to fund extensive mental health and anti domestic terrorism efforts
Certain types of guns should be illegal
The RATM avatar doesn't count for anything anymore?
That's racist. What happens when an inordinate percent of the people caught with unregistered guns are minorities? That's not fair! It discriminates against poor people who can't afford to pay high taxes on ammo. What about poor people who can't afford to have an ID--can they legally get a gun? Blah blah blah
IBTL
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I'm mocking Ziggy by aggressively agreeing with him.
What I really believe related guns/gun violence is:
Every gun should be registered
Background checks and waiting periods should be implemented for every gun sale
Ammo should be taxed to the next planet and back
Penalties for having an unregistered gun should be extreme
Police and military spending should be used to fund extensive mental health and anti domestic terrorism efforts
Certain types of guns should be illegal
The RATM avatar doesn't count for anything anymore?
You have to use the daily MSNBC talking points to get through to jockey. He ain't the sharpest tack in the solar system.
Bet it felt good agreeing with me, aina? ;D
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Wel, this is going well.
I know a few people that frequent that particular store. Some that just pop in occasionally because they're driving by (I fall in that category). Fortunate that nobody I know happened to get killed yesterday, but sad day all around.
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You have to use the daily MSNBC talking points to get through to jockey. He ain't the sharpest tack in the solar system.
Bet it felt good agreeing with me, aina? ;D
I was wondering what that spring in my step was from
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I was wondering what that spring in my step was from
My life is like a musical, just spontaneous shortness all the time.
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It was a great day for NRA fundraising
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My life is like a musical, just spontaneous shortness all the time.
either I'm reading this wrong, 'musical' is a euphemism for something I'm not aware of, it's a typo, or I need to pay more attention when going to Broadway shows (touring crew here in KC >:()
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either I'm reading this wrong, 'musical' is a euphemism for something I'm not aware of, it's a typo, or I need to pay more attention when going to Broadway shows (touring crew here in KC >:()
Meant show tunes. Lol.
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What I really believe related guns/gun violence is:
Every gun should be registered
Background checks and waiting periods should be implemented for every gun sale
Ammo should be taxed to the next planet and back
Penalties for having an unregistered gun should be extreme
Police and military spending should be used to fund extensive mental health and anti domestic terrorism efforts
Certain types of guns should be illegal
Agree with all of this -- and the vast majority of Americans agree with most of it. "Every gun should be registered" has 90%+ support, but even closing the gun show loophole seemingly is a non-starter for hundreds of our legislative leaders.
Or we can just say, "Nah. Nothing will work. It's hopeless." Because totally ignoring this situation has worked wonders.
Ted Cruz today: “Every time there’s a shooting, we play this ridiculous theater where this committee gets together and proposes a bunch of laws that would do nothing to stop these murders. If you want to stop these murders, go after the murderers."
What does that last sentence even mean? Hire a psychic to tell us who the murderers will be in advance so we can go after them before they plan these murders? Is that the way we would have "stopped" this guy, the guy who killed all the Asians last week, Dylann Roof, the Las Vegas guy, etc?
Apparently, Caribbean Cruz needs another vacation "for his daughters."
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Wel, this is going well.
I know a few people that frequent that particular store. Some that just pop in occasionally because they're driving by (I fall in that category). Fortunate that nobody I know happened to get killed yesterday, but sad day all around.
That close to your home/routine has to hit hard. Sucks!
Meant show tunes. Lol.
Much better/borderline admirable - the opposite of the original self own.
Agree with all of this -- and the vast majority of Americans agree with most of it. "Every gun should be registered" has 90%+ support, ........
And like most Americans my list wasn't that long 5 years ago, won't be that short in 2 years, and if nothing has changed in 5 years I can easily see myself in the "you know what? screw it, take all the guns" camp.
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That's Cancun Cruz.
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Left: Let's try to address this with universal background checks and assault weapon bans.
Right: No. But we will offer thoughts and prayers.
Lather, rinse, repeat.
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....another criminal that wouldn't follow any laws against guns or murder no matter how strong they are.
You sound angry.
Need a hug?
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You sound angry.
Need a hug?
Keg and eggs on a Wednesday? Strong move.
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The vast, vast, vast, majority of death from gun violence in America are from guns bought illegally. And by the way. they happen every weekend in our major cities and primarily from handguns. So, while everyone is rightly horrified about mass shootings and what happened in Boulder, why is there 1000 times the passion for changing gun laws after these horrible incidents and basically minimal interest/passion for the average weekend on the South Side of Chicago?
The question is what laws can be calibrated to stop gun deaths across the board? Are you for a blanket gun ban? Should hand guns be banned? Why do I never hear a single peep from politicians about changing our gun laws after a 6 yr old kid is shot in her bedroom doing her homework in Chicago?
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The vast, vast, vast, majority of death from gun violence in America are from guns bought illegally. And by the way. they happen every weekend in out major cities and primarily from handguns. So, while everyone is rightly horrified about mass shootings and what happened in Boulder, why is there 1000 times the passion for changing gun laws after these horrible incidents and basically minimal interest/passion for the average weekend on the South Side of Chicago?
The question is what laws can be calibrated to stop gun deaths across the board? Are you for a blanket gun ban? Should hand guns be banned? Why do I never hear a single peep from politicians about changing our gun laws after a 6 yr old kid is shot in her bedroom doing her homework in Chicago?
People have long held a "just let them kill each other" mindset toward gang violence in cities (source: Uncle was a Captain in CPD & FBI consultant). So it's shouldn't be surprising to you that those don't get as much publicity.
The issue is different for every group. For the dumb rural people who kill each other and say "I thought it wasn't loaded" or get drunk and kill each other. A ban would probably be best. For inner city gang violence, job opportunities, after school opportunities and education are probably your best bets. For these mass shootings by disturbed people (this one, aurora CO, sandyhook, parkside, Columbine) the perpetrator clearly wasn't mentally healthy. Mental health services and background checks would probably be beneficial there.
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People have long held a "just let them kill each other" mindset toward gang violence in cities (source: Uncle was a Captain in CPD & FBI consultant). So it's shouldn't be surprising to you that those don't get as much publicity.
The issue is different for every group. For the dumb rural people who kill each other and say "I thought it wasn't loaded" or get drunk and kill each other. A ban would probably be best. For inner city gang violence, job opportunities, after school opportunities and education are probably your best bets. For these mass shootings by disturbed people (this one, aurora CO, sandyhook, parkside, Columbine) the perpetrator clearly wasn't mentally healthy. Mental health services and background checks would probably be beneficial there.
Would certain laws, background checks, etc prevented some of these mass shootings? I think each situation is different but for example the Las Vegss rooftop murderer? Other than a blanket gun ban how exactly could that have been prevented?
Legally and culturally we cannot have a blanket gun ban. People since the Obama administration have been buying guns and ammo like toothpaste so perhaps taxing is a good idea. But there is a 0.0 % chance, nor is anyone proposing a gun ban. Because history is replete with example after example after example of governments going tyrannical or usurpatious we absolutely must have the right to bear arms.. Not to mention the fact that I'm not going to tell a single mother in the middle of nowhere or in violent parts of our cities that she can't legally protect herself and her family.
I think no matter where you stand on this politically most people agree that getting rid of guns isn't happening nor can it happen. So again, what laws can be calibrated to quell as much gun violence as possible? And why is anyone more troubled by a mass shooting or a specific weapon than a hand gun which accounts for 100 times or more as many deaths? Is it 1000? I would have to look at the stats.
I People have long held a "just let them kill each other" mindset toward gang violence in cities (source: Uncle was a Captain in CPD & FBI consultant). So it's shouldn't be surprising to you that those don't get as much publicity.
The issue is different for every group. For the dumb rural people who kill each other and say "I thought it wasn't loaded" or get drunk and kill each other. A ban would probably be best. For inner city gang violence, job opportunities, after school opportunities and education are probably your best bets. For these mass shootings by disturbed people (this one, aurora CO, sandyhook, parkside, Columbine) the perpetrator clearly wasn't mentally healthy. Mental health services and background checks would probably be beneficial there.
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Would certain laws, background checks, etc prevented some of these mass shootings? I think each situation is different but for example the Las Vegss rooftop murderer? Other than a blanket gun ban how exactly could that have been prevented?
Legally and culturally we cannot have a blanket gun ban. People since the Obama administration have been buying guns and ammo like toothpaste so perhaps taxing is a good idea. But there is a 0.0 % chance, nor is anyone proposing a gun ban. Because history is replete with example after example after example of governments going tyrannical or usurpatious we absolutely must have the right to bear arms.. Not to mention the fact that I'm not going to tell a single mother in the middle of nowhere or in violent parts of our cities that she can't legally protect herself and her family.
I think no matter where you stand on this politically most people agree that getting rid of guns isn't happening nor can it happen. So again, what laws can be calibrated to quell as much gun violence as possible? And why is anyone more troubled by a mass shooting or a specific weapon than a hand gun which accounts for 100 times or more as many deaths? Is it 1000? I would have to look at the stats.
I
Well let me be clear that I'm not for an overall gun ban. I want to get that hurdle out of the way.
Next, I believe it's about calculated risk. If a pistol is the gun of choice for inner city violence the vast majority of America isn't effected by that so it doesn't pose a risk to people who aren't a part of that. Whereas we all go to theaters, go to a grocery store, have gone to school, have attended a concert. See how it's more relatable? Then you add in the just mental stats of "with this gun were all dead with that gun we aren't" and the choice becomes obvious.
the protection thing I'm not going to get into because you're right. Sure stats overwhelmingly show that having a gun is more dangerous than not but stats don't matter to the individual and if it worked for someone more power to them.
Regarding your first paragraph, it seems to be a response that expects any solution to fix literally every issue. Unfortunately laws are always going to be patch fixes and sort of like banning high capacity magazines so that a shooting is 5 people instead of 50, it's about minimizing casualties and risk.
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Oh yeah, wee kneed more gun control. Izant killin' folks alreddy illegal. Deez dudes ar sick ass holes so laws no matta, hey?
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Well let me be clear that I'm not for an overall gun ban. I want to get that hurdle out of the way.
Next, I believe it's about calculated risk. If a pistol is the gun of choice for inner city violence the vast majority of America isn't effected by that so it doesn't pose a risk to people who aren't a part of that. Whereas we all go to theaters, go to a grocery store, have gone to school, have attended a concert. See how it's more relatable? Then you add in the just mental stats of "with this gun were all dead with that gun we aren't" and the choice becomes obvious.
the protection thing I'm not going to get into because you're right. Sure stats overwhelmingly show that having a gun is more dangerous than not but stats don't matter to the individual and if it worked for someone more power to them.
Regarding your first paragraph, it seems to be a response that expects any solution to fix literally every issue. Unfortunately laws are always going to be patch fixes and sort of like banning high capacity magazines so that a shooting is 5 people instead of 50, it's about minimizing casualties and risk.
I'm no expert but I believe women prefer the AR-15 for protection. Your overall point is well taken: many people don't relate to handgun violence because of where they live... ..or even think about it for that matter.. But isn't that a tragedy ? Why should we be more passionate about something that occurs far less frequently like Boulder than what happens every fking weekend?? Tbis is what I don't understand. Worse, five seconds after this happened there is discussion about the race of the killer? Who gives a crap? If 200 people a month are murdered by handguns bought illegally vs 50 people per year by assault rifles why is the bigger problem never part of the overall discussion? That's all I'm saying. The passion after these specific tragedies is not philosophically consistent with the overall problem of gun violence .
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Oh yeah, wee kneed more gun control. Izant killin' folks alreddy illegal. Deez dudes ar sick ass holes so laws no matta, hey?
You know the black market isn't a place you just walk into right? I mean your average schizoid isn't going to get onto the dark web to order a high capacity rifle with a trigger attachment to enhance the rate of fire, plus armor piercing rounds.
What is your solution?
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I'm no expert but I believe women prefer the AR-15 for protection. Your overall point is well taken: many people don't relate to handgun violence because of where they live... ..or even think about it for that matter.. But isn't that a tragedy ? Why should we be more passionate about something that occurs far less frequently like Boulder than what happens every fking weekend?? Tbis is what I don't understand. Worse, five seconds after this happened there is discussion about the race of the killer? Who gives a crap? If 200 people a month are murdered by handguns bought illegally vs 50 people per year by assault rifles why is the bigger problem never part of the overall discussion? That's all I'm saying. The passion after these specific tragedies is not philosophically consistent with the overall problem of gun violence .
I completely agree. For me I was extremely anti gun since two of my high school classmates were shot, very sobering feeling seeing an empty chair in the classroom. But as I've grown older I get there's a middle ground to come to and being anti gun isn't feasible.
I think the immediate check on race is the default due to polarization of our country. The left is hoping it's a right wing nut job, the right is hoping it's someone with a Hispanic or Islamic last name or even better someone with "Antifa" tattooed on them. It's all a political game and those who deal with it on a daily basis get left behind.
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Oh yeah, wee kneed more gun control. Izant killin' folks alreddy illegal. Deez dudes ar sick ass holes so laws no matta, hey?
Compare/contrast gun violence in the US to other first-world nations then.
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I completely agree. For me I was extremely anti gun since two of my high school classmates were shot, very sobering feeling seeing an empty chair in the classroom. But as I've grown older I get there's a middle ground to come to and being anti gun isn't feasible.
I think the immediate check on race is the default due to polarization of our country. The left is hoping it's a right wing nut job, the right is hoping it's someone with a Hispanic or Islamic last name or even better someone with "Antifa" tattooed on them. It's all a political game and those who deal with it on a daily basis get left behind.
I think most people are and have been in the middle ground for a long time. Look at most of the laws being proposed have like 80%+ favorability to be implemented.
I have a friend who was all for loosening gun laws, etc. He has some kind of semi-automatic legally purchased in Virginia at the time. Then Sandy Hook happened and he changed his mind that all the closing loophole laws, limitations, etc. should be passed. His thought was that the proposed laws are not gun bans and the responsible people would have no issue following restrictive gun laws because they're responsible. The irresponsible owners ruin it for everyone. (Along these lines.)
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Lots of things going on here with regards to guns.
First, the simple response is that less access to guns both legal and illegal is the only way the U.S. will ever approach numbers similar to other developed countries.
The longer discussion is the break down of types of gun violence. Suicides, urban gun violence, domestic violence, mass shootings.
Racial apathy is a repeated occuring theme in these situations.
Beginning with mass shootings, often times, the victims of mass shootings are White, and, therefore get more attention. And,. studies have shown that mental health is much more often the focus and discussion when the shooter is White.
By far the vast majority of gun deaths are suicides. This also is an example of the fact that most people with mental health issues are non-violent towards others. In fact, people with mental illness and/or mental health issues are much more likely to be victims of gun violence and violence, than be the cause of it towards others. I realize some, perhaps many people know this, but, far too many don't know this and/or don't care.
With urban gun violence, there needs to be a focused deterrence, instead of broad one size fits all policies. The old school policies of only focusing on law enforcement aspects are less effective,...the old guns and drugs on the table.
You have to target the people who commit and are more likely to commit gun violence, and, you have to target the people who are more likely to be victims of it. These are smaller percentages of people than the general population. Homicide clearance rates are massively higher for White victims than people of color victims. That is a combination of systemic racism, racial profiling which causes police distrust, which also causes police apathy to solve some of these crimes. Instead many civilians take matters into their own hands do to this mistrust and repeat cycles of violence.
Disingenous people will say police shoot more White people than Black people annually. What they don't add is that there are more White people. And the percentage of people that police shoot are much higher with Black people.
There is way to much empahsis on petty crimes, traffic violations, City ordinances, or even harrassment for no reason at all.
Social Services, jobs, education, healthcare, cognitive behavioral therapy, teen interrupters, recreational activities are complimentary to the focus on the small percentage who commit the crimes, and the small percentage who are victims of it. Much more focus and resource emphasis needs to be on these areas, but they aren't overly costly.
If you took a group of White kids from White Folks Bay and dropped them into a rough inner city neighborhood with few resources, no escape, murders all around, nobody cares etc...what would happen?
The U.S. doesn't necessarily have more crime than other developed nations. It does however have much more lethal crime because there are way more guns in the U.S. with easy access to them. Much of the proposed, often discussed legislation, doesn't go anywhere near far enough to address the problem.
In 1959, 60% of Americans wanted all hand guns banned (Gallup) except for police. By 1980 it was 38%, and more recently roughly 28%. What changed? NRA and Republicans. What is necessary is a shift to reverse that, and it can be done, instead of focusing so many years on small incremental change. One very small example of many is having a license to own a gun goes beyond universal background checks. It means less people will go to the trouble to own a gun and therefore less guns out there and less gun violence. There is a Johns Hopkins study on this which also references Massachusetts. Research also supports buyback programs. Banning assault weapons and handguns. Yes handguns. More than 70% of gun violence is committed with a handgun.
The United States gun problem is unique to the United States. The United States has a higher homicide rate than any other developed country because it has more guns than any other country. The United States makes up less than 5% of the World's population, but makes up 45% of private gun owners. You can look at the data upside down, backwards, forwards, side to side, up and down, but more gun ownership=more gun deaths.
You will hear mental illness when a mass shooting occurs even though the percentage of mass shooters with mental illness is very small. You will see an increase in gun buys after mass shooting because some will say they have to protect themselves.But high gun ownership rates don't reduce deaths, they increase deaths. Simulations show most people would not be able to protect themselves or others in active shooter situations.
There are other propoganda things such as don't take away my guns even though many are for this, or don't make me wear a mask, even though many are for this and benefit from this or government Affordable Care Act, even though many like and benefit from specific aspects of it etc...
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^^^well stated and laid out
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I'm no expert but I believe women prefer the AR-15 for protection. Your overall point is well taken: many people don't relate to handgun violence because of where they live... ..or even think about it for that matter.. But isn't that a tragedy ? Why should we be more passionate about something that occurs far less frequently like Boulder than what happens every fking weekend?? Tbis is what I don't understand. Worse, five seconds after this happened there is discussion about the race of the killer? Who gives a crap? If 200 people a month are murdered by handguns bought illegally vs 50 people per year by assault rifles why is the bigger problem never part of the overall discussion? That's all I'm saying. The passion after these specific tragedies is not philosophically consistent with the overall problem of gun violence .
handguns are more likely to be owned by the average citizen. My wife got one due to the proliferation of homeless camps in town (here the homeless have more rights than us "gentrifiers") and after being attacked by a homeless individual. Oh, and the anti-Asian violence.
Handguns serve a specific purpose as far as the general public is concerned but "nobody needs" an AR-15.
As far at the recent media focus on the Boulder gun control law being struck down, it wouldn't have mattered in the end. The guy could have gone to a neighboring municipality to purchase his gun. Chicago has strict gun control laws and more than 70% of the guns confiscated come from out of state.
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handguns are more likely to be owned by the average citizen. My wife got one due to the proliferation of homeless camps in town (here the homeless have more rights than us "gentrifiers") and after being attacked by a homeless individual. Oh, and the anti-Asian violence.
Handguns serve a specific purpose as far as the general public is concerned but "nobody needs" an AR-15.
As far at the recent media focus on the Boulder gun control law being struck down, it wouldn't have mattered in the end. The guy could have gone to a neighboring municipality to purchase his gun. Chicago has strict gun control laws and more than 70% of the guns confiscated come from out of state.
Most of Chicago's gun control laws were struck down in this lawsuit from what I recall.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald_v._City_of_Chicago
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handguns are more likely to be owned by the average citizen. My wife got one due to the proliferation of homeless camps in town (here the homeless have more rights than us "gentrifiers") and after being attacked by a homeless individual. Oh, and the anti-Asian violence.
Handguns serve a specific purpose as far as the general public is concerned but "nobody needs" an AR-15.
As far at the recent media focus on the Boulder gun control law being struck down, it wouldn't have mattered in the end. The guy could have gone to a neighboring municipality to purchase his gun. Chicago has strict gun control laws and more than 70% of the guns confiscated come from out of state.
That doesn't go far enough.
Increased handgun ownership results in increased gun violence and gun death. It doesn't reduce or prevent it. 70% of gun deaths are from handguns.
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1. Mandatory background checks for all firearm purchases (absolute no brainer to try to keep firearms away from criminals/mentally unstable)
2. Trigger lock requirements on firearms that aren't in use (saves kids from messing with guns, reduces gun theft)
3. A national firearm registry. One year grace period to register your firearm. (Think of this as contact tracing for guns. We do this for cars, so it shouldn't be difficult)
4. Culpability of firearm owners for crimes committed using their firearm. (To prevent people from loaning their weapons to people. Also, forces people to be serious about #2)
Violation of any of these rules carries a 10 year penalty. Of course, this won't fix everything, but it's a good start.
Do these four simple things if we want to reduce gun death in the US. Both sides should easily be able to agree.
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Most of Chicago's gun control laws were struck down in this lawsuit from what I recall.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald_v._City_of_Chicago
they are still able to have strict (not the strictest in the nation as the right claims) gun laws, including an assault weapons ban.
It is true that Illinois has tougher gun laws than many other states. The state is one of seven that requires licenses or permits to buy any firearm, and it's one of five that requires waiting periods for buying any firearm. The Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, which tracks gun laws nationwide, has given the state a B+ for its gun laws.
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Shoot hoops-
That was incredible
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Lots of things going on here with regards to guns.
First, the simple response is that less access to guns both legal and illegal is the only way the U.S. will ever approach numbers similar to other developed countries.
The longer discussion is the break down of types of gun violence. Suicides, urban gun violence, domestic violence, mass shootings.
Racial apathy is a repeated occuring theme in these situations.
Beginning with mass shootings, often times, the victims of mass shootings are White, and, therefore get more attention. And,. studies have shown that mental health is much more often the focus and discussion when the shooter is White.
By far the vast majority of gun deaths are suicides. This also is an example of the fact that most people with mental health issues are non-violent towards others. In fact, people with mental illness and/or mental health issues are much more likely to be victims of gun violence and violence, than be the cause of it towards others. I realize some, perhaps many people know this, but, far too many don't know this and/or don't care.
With urban gun violence, there needs to be a focused deterrence, instead of broad one size fits all policies. The old school policies of only focusing on law enforcement aspects are less effective,...the old guns and drugs on the table.
You have to target the people who commit and are more likely to commit gun violence, and, you have to target the people who are more likely to be victims of it. These are smaller percentages of people than the general population. Homicide clearance rates are massively higher for White victims than people of color victims. That is a combination of systemic racism, racial profiling which causes police distrust, which also causes police apathy to solve some of these crimes. Instead many civilians take matters into their own hands do to this mistrust and repeat cycles of violence.
Disingenous people will say police shoot more White people than Black people annually. What they don't add is that there are more White people. And the percentage of people that police shoot are much higher with Black people.
There is way to much empahsis on petty crimes, traffic violations, City ordinances, or even harrassment for no reason at all.
Social Services, jobs, education, healthcare, cognitive behavioral therapy, teen interrupters, recreational activities are complimentary to the focus on the small percentage who commit the crimes, and the small percentage who are victims of it. Much more focus and resource emphasis needs to be on these areas, but they aren't overly costly.
If you took a group of White kids from White Folks Bay and dropped them into a rough inner city neighborhood with few resources, no escape, murders all around, nobody cares etc...what would happen?
The U.S. doesn't necessarily have more crime than other developed nations. It does however have much more lethal crime because there are way more guns in the U.S. with easy access to them. Much of the proposed, often discussed legislation, doesn't go anywhere near far enough to address the problem.
In 1959, 60% of Americans wanted all hand guns banned (Gallup) except for police. By 1980 it was 38%, and more recently roughly 28%. What changed? NRA and Republicans. What is necessary is a shift to reverse that, and it can be done, instead of focusing so many years on small incremental change. One very small example of many is having a license to own a gun goes beyond universal background checks. It means less people will go to the trouble to own a gun and therefore less guns out there and less gun violence. There is a Johns Hopkins study on this which also references Massachusetts. Research also supports buyback programs. Banning assault weapons and handguns. Yes handguns. More than 70% of gun violence is committed with a handgun.
The United States gun problem is unique to the United States. The United States has a higher homicide rate than any other developed country because it has more guns than any other country. The United States makes up less than 5% of the World's population, but makes up 45% of private gun owners. You can look at the data upside down, backwards, forwards, side to side, up and down, but more gun ownership=more gun deaths.
You will hear mental illness when a mass shooting occurs even though the percentage of mass shooters with mental illness is very small. You will see an increase in gun buys after mass shooting because some will say they have to protect themselves.But high gun ownership rates don't reduce deaths, they increase deaths. Simulations show most people would not be able to protect themselves or others in active shooter situations.
There are other propoganda things such as don't take away my guns even though many are for this, or don't make me wear a mask, even though many are for this and benefit from this or government Affordable Care Act, even though many like and benefit from specific aspects of it etc...
A lot of good points but I'm curious about your "focused deterrence" of urban gun violence. I haven't looked at recent stats but it used to be something like 75% of the gun murders in Chicago where from black men and the victims were over 70% black. I have no doubt police profile but police killings, even if they are disproportionate statistically towards blacks, are infinitesimal compared to suicides and black on black shootings.
So, the real issue is how can we make it far more difficult for gangs and people acquiring guns illegally? And with the distrust and various issues police departments have had over the years it seems like an extremely complex situation to me. Because fewer police in the hardest hit areas seems like a terrible solution.
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I appreciate that positive feedback. But these are accessible things statistics, studies, data, analysis etc...for anyone.
It's a problem that can be greatly improved if different, specific, coordinated measures are taken.
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A lot of good points but I'm curious about your "focused deterrence" of urban gun violence. I haven't looked at recent stats but it used to be something like 75% of the gun murders in Chicago where from black men and the victims were over 70% black. I have no doubt police profile but police killings, even if they are disproportionate statistically towards blacks, are infinitesimal compared to suicides and black on black shootings.
So, the real issue is how can we make it far more difficult for gangs and people acquiring guns illegally? And with the distrust and various issues police departments have had over the years it seems like an extremely complex situation to me. Because fewer police in the hardest hit areas seems like a terrible solution.
I know on at least one instance a gun used in multiple shootings was tracked back to bumble f*ck Wisconsin. Seems like banning private sales could easily end this. Also make the original gun owners and manufactures have mandatory insurance. If the manufacturers were able to be sued I'm quite confident they'd be all in favor of stricter measures. Additionally if the original owner was permanently liable for where the gun was given to they'd be much more careful about sales.
Here's the article I was referencing:
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-met-chicago-police-paul-bauer-gun-20180228-story.html
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A lot of good points but I'm curious about your "focused deterrence" of urban gun violence. I haven't looked at recent stats but it used to be something like 75% of the gun murders in Chicago where from black men and the victims were over 70% black. I have no doubt police profile but police killings, even if they are disproportionate statistically towards blacks, are infinitesimal compared to suicides and black on black shootings.
So, the real issue is how can we make it far more difficult for gangs and people acquiring guns illegally? And with the distrust and various issues police departments have had over the years it seems like an extremely complex situation to me. Because fewer police in the hardest hit areas seems like a terrible solution.
Now do Native Americans, Hispanic people etc...because police shoot those people at mich higher percentages too.
It takes a very coordinated effort from a great deal of people. It also takes targeting the small % of people doing the crimes and being the victims of the crimes. It takes all of the other things mentioned.
Now do suicides. Suicides is #1 cause of gun deaths. Now do domestic violence which is #3. Now do mass shootings which is #4.
It isn't just about the prevention of illegally obtained handguns. It's about not having handguns, as in any, none, zero, legal or illegal. This isn't a band aid problem with band-aid solution. And so forth.
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I know on at least one instance a gun used in multiple shootings was tracked back to bumble f*ck Wisconsin. Seems like banning private sales could easily end this. Also make the original gun owners and manufactures have mandatory insurance. If the manufacturers were able to be sued I'm quite confident they'd be all in favor of stricter measures. Additionally if the original owner was permanently liable for where the gun was given to they'd be much more careful about sales.
Here's the article I was referencing:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-met-chicago-police-paul-bauer-gun-20180228-story.html%3foutputType=amp
FYI google.com/amp articles are bad for the internet. Don't use em!
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FYI google.com/amp articles are bad for the internet. Don't use em!
I've been trying so hard not to. And I knew the moment I saw that posted you'd say something 😂
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Now do Native Americans, Hispanic people etc...because police shoot those people at mich higher percentages too.
It takes a very coordinated effort from a great deal of people. It also takes targeting the small % of people doing the crimes and being the victims of the crimes. It takes all of the other things mentioned.
Now do suicides. Suicides is #1 cause of gun deaths. Now do domestic violence which is #3. Now do mass shootings which is #4.
It isn't just about the prevention of illegally obtained handguns. It's about not having handguns, as in any, none, zero, legal or illegal. This isn't a band aid problem with band-aid solution. And so forth.
This sounds like a blanket gun ban which simply isn't plausible as I'm sure you would admit. However, I think it's a really important conversation because neither political side ever brings this up as a solution. We have 2nd Amendment issues as well as cultural issues that would make this impossible as far as I can tell so are you advocating amending the Constitution?
Because the die hard 2nd amendment advocates will point to the actual purpose of the law and historically I think it's a convincing argument. Now, certainly there are many that think it's insane to think governments like the USA could go tyrannical and that no one who owns a gun is thinking about this possibility. I just think it's a total non-starter to think a gun ban is remotely possible in this country. Unfortunately, we can't all be like Iceland. :)
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This sounds like a blanket gun ban which simply isn't plausible as I'm sure you would admit. However, I think it's a really important conversation because neither political side ever brings this up as a solution. We have 2nd Amendment issues as well as cultural issues that would make this impossible as far as I can tell so are you advocating amending the Constitution?
Because the die hard 2nd amendment advocates will point to the actual purpose of the law and historically I think it's a convincing argument. Now, certainly there are many that think it's insane to think governments like the USA could go tyrannical and that no one who owns a gun is thinking about this possibility. I just think it's a total non-starter to think a gun ban is remotely possible in this country. Unfortunately, we can't all be like Iceland. :)
Big problems require big solutions.
But even some of the things I mentioned would improve the situation substantially.
Right now we see partisan discussion whether or not to ban assault rifles and have universal background checks. We can’t have even accomplish this, which is just a small aspect of the problem and solution. There’s a lot more to do than just that.
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Because the die hard 2nd amendment advocates will point to the actual purpose of the law and historically I think it's a convincing argument. Now, certainly there are many that think it's insane to think governments like the USA could go tyrannical and that no one who owns a gun is thinking about this possibility. I just think it's a total non-starter to think a gun ban is remotely possible in this country. Unfortunately, we can't all be like Iceland. :)
I don't think anyone is advocating for a total gun ban.
That said, what's even more insane than thinking the US can't "go tyrannical" is thinking that a bunch of Jethroes and their AR-15s is going to defeat an Army that has drones, cruise missiles and tanks.
There may have been a time when am armed citizenry served as a check on government tyranny, but that time is long past.
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I, for one, don’t want to live in a police state where we aren’t even able to shoot lots of people in just a few seconds time.
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The taxing/increased cost of ammo as a deterrent is interesting. But just empirically, a good friend of mine has a handgun he has solely for range shooting (he lives in a condo complex in Mequon, he's not worried about easy access for self defense) and his brother has the same as well as a large rifle. He really likes going to the range to relax and let off steam, but he says he goes so infrequently now because ammunition has become exponentially more expensive in the last 18-24 months. Anyone else hear similarly?
Im fairly anti-gun, selfishly as I don't hunt or overly subscribe to the self-defense notion. That being said, Ive always been intrigued by the differences in the historical fundamental mentality on guns in the US against other developed nations. Cause I think the psychology of it is a bit trickier than people want to admit. Viewing European nations, their foundings, by and large, were just the ongoing transformation and developments of city states, kingdoms, etc... Revolutions were either removing kings or dictators. France or the UK or Sweden didnt have a citizens rising up with guns to expel a foreign government and gain their freedom. So while I think its antiquated and dumb, the "right to bear arms" as some defense against tyranny, foreign or domestic, is just so much more deeply baked into the American psyche than elsewhere. I have a rep and good friend in Belgium, another country with incredible strict gun laws, he's very amusing in perspective when it comes to American things. His take was roughly "yeah, gun culture isn't really a thing here, we're too close together, you're not off in the country shooting at things. But Americans, I get it, we Belgians never had to band together to get the f***ing Brits off our backs. Its a point of pride. That sort of identity is often hard to shake, takes generations, and its not always a bad thing even if the byproduct can be."
Look at the UK gun laws. Going back hundreds of years, it was just a gradual response by the Crown and then the government to perceived threats. Gradually, before the age of modern weaponry.
The NRA is an insidious earworm in terms of gun culture, no doubt, but there is a very different base they were building off of and tapping into as opposed to "other developed countries".
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I don't think anyone is advocating for a total gun ban.
That said, what's even more insane than thinking the US can't "go tyrannical" is thinking that a bunch of Jethroes and their AR-15s is going to defeat an Army that has drones, cruise missiles and tanks.
There may have been a time when am armed citizenry served as a check on government tyranny, but that time is long past.
Fair point.
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I'm open-minded on this stuff, and I thank those of you who have put forth several things you'd like to see done.
Unfortunately, those who defend the status quo respond by saying even potential laws that 90% of Americans favor "wouldn't stop gun violence," or they make knee-jerk references to the 2nd Amendment, or they get dramatic about people trying to take away everybody's guns, or they say no law will stop all criminals, or they say we already have laws against murder so we don't need gun legislation.
Well, even the staunchest gun-control advocate doesn't believe that enacting some (or even all) of these measures will "solve" the problem by eliminating all gun violence.
What if it curbs even 10-20%? How about even 3-5%? How about if it prevents even a couple mass murders every year?
One thing all of us on every side of this issue knows with total certainty: Too many Americans are dying from gun violence. What we have been doing for centuries isn't working. Shouldn't we try something else? Why do some folks have to wait until they or one of their loved ones is victimized before they want change?
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
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John Donohue is an excellent resource for this discussion
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https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html
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JWags - One of the main items my sister factory in Appleton makes is shell casings. They have some unique patented process that makes them less expensive to make. They have been printing money the last 5 years and actually dropped a bunch of longtime products to allow more machine time for casting brass for casings. Plus copper had increased significantly the last 4-5 months in cost
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https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html
That’s stunning.
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That’s stunning.
Yet you hear very little of it. In Chicago, it’s been relegated to “statistics”.
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I don't think anyone is advocating for a total gun ban.
That said, what's even more insane than thinking the US can't "go tyrannical" is thinking that a bunch of Jethroes and their AR-15s is going to defeat an Army that has drones, cruise missiles and tanks.
There may have been a time when am armed citizenry served as a check on government tyranny, but that time is long past.
Yep. At this point, a well-armed citizenry will mostly just kill one another.
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https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html
Wow...that really is jarring.
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The map is especially stark.
On one hand, it’s a swift rebuttal for all the ignorant idiots and non-Midwesterners who act like visiting Chicago is dangerous and would clutch their pearls hearing that I lived in the city.
On the other hand, it shows how neighborhood centric and concentrated the violence is and what a challenge that is to try and combat. It’s truly a tale of two cities.
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As several brilliant minds here have told us, there is absolutely nothing that can be done to curb gun violence. Why even try? No one anywhere in the world has been able to solve this problem.
(https://images2.imgbox.com/a1/76/BKqn9g24_o.png) (https://imgbox.com/BKqn9g24)
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"Carrying guns in public is not a Constitutional right, 9th circuit rules."
https://www.courthousenews.com/carrying-guns-in-public-is-not-a-constitutional-right-ninth-circuit-rules/?amp&__twitter_impression=true
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Chauvin's trial starts today. Hopefully, justice will be served.
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Without looking up the numbers, I'm guessing more people have died in shootings in Chicago in this year alone then in the past 20 from all mass shootings.
Why are we so hyper focused on the mass shootings and not the overall issue?
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Reducing the incredibly, stupidly easy access to guns would help reduce both.
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Without looking up the numbers, I'm guessing more people have died in shootings in Chicago in this year alone then in the past 20 from all mass shootings.
Why are we so hyper focused on the mass shootings and not the overall issue?
You couldn't be more embarrassingly wrong.
137 dead to date in Chicago 139 in Vegas Blacksburg and Orlando alone. Jesus get away from the news that's earmarked Chicago as hell on earth and overlooks every mass shooting.
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Reducing the incredibly, stupidly easy access to guns would help reduce both.
Yup.
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I don't think anyone is advocating for a total gun ban.
That said, what's even more insane than thinking the US can't "go tyrannical" is thinking that a bunch of Jethroes and their AR-15s is going to defeat an Army that has drones, cruise missiles and tanks.
There may have been a time when am armed citizenry served as a check on government tyranny, but that time is long past.
The problem is there are factions that are on the far left ("no reason for anyone to own a gun"). Then you have those on the far right who freak out and scream "second amendment" and "government tyranny!" They shout over t the sane middle, who want real background checks, waiting periods, and bans on military-style weapons like AR-15 and high capacity magazines that really serve no purpose in a civilized society.
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You couldn't be more embarrassingly wrong.
137 dead to date in Chicago 139 in Vegas Blacksburg and Orlando alone. Jesus get away from the news that's earmarked Chicago as hell on earth and overlooks every mass shooting.
Shoot guess I could have said 2020. Where there was 769. Again mass shootings are such a small portion of gun violence that you all do a disservice. If you want to solve the overall problem, look at the overall problem.
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Shoot guess I could have said 2020. Where there was 769. Again mass shootings are such a small portion of gun violence that you all do a disservice. If you want to solve the overall problem, look at the overall problem.
You would still be wrong. So let me just give you the data before you keep moving the goal posts till you can finally make an accurate comparison. There's been 1121 deaths in the 21st century from mass shootings. That's 21 of your 30 year time frame. With about 50% of those coming from 5 years.
Theres plenty wrong with city shootings around the country, it a completely different problem than those who shoot up malls, schools, theaters etc.
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Why are we so hyper focused on the mass shootings and not the overall issue?
Mass shootings get more "focus" for a variety of reasons:
++ They can (and do) happen anywhere. Many (most?) folks think shootings in inner cities don't affect them and are avoidable. "Don't want to get shot by gangs? Well then I'll just avoid going to the South Side." But mass shootings happen in schools, at concerts, in movie theaters, in churches, in restaurants, wherever. It's scary when the place you go to worship or where your kids go to be educated can be shot up.
++ They often victimize whites, suburbanites, kids and/or well-to-do people. Again, for many people, inner-city violence is out of sight, out of mind. When the rich white suburb next door has a school shot up, it suddenly "matters."
++ They often target specific groups of people (Jews, Blacks, Christians, kids, Asians, women, etc). When Dylann Roof killed those Black folks at a South Carolina church, it resonated with tens of millions of Americans.
++ Finding ways to make it more difficult for potential perpetrators of mass shootings to acquire the weapons they need seems doable. Yes, one can kill with a knife or a machete but it's not likely the Vegas shooter could have killed dozens of people in a matter of minutes with a knife. Even a gun that doesn't fire multiple rounds every few seconds is less likely to be used to do a mass shooting.
Yes, I said "seems" doable. Maybe enacting the kind of legislation that 60-90% (depending on the proposal) of Americans want won't solve a darn thing. But what we've been doing all these years sure as hell hasn't solved anything. If requiring universal background checks, enacting waiting periods and closing loopholes will save 100 or 25 or 2 lives a year, aren't they worth a try?
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You would still be wrong. So let me just give you the data before you keep moving the goal posts till you can finally make an accurate comparison. There's been 1121 deaths in the 21st century from mass shootings. That's 21 of your 30 year time frame. With about 50% of those coming from 5 years.
Theres plenty wrong with city shootings around the country, it a completely different problem than those who shoot up malls, schools, theaters etc.
Relax yourself. I was wrong on a random fact on the internet. No need to burn the building down.
But once again, even 1121 is such an incredibly small map on the blimp.
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Chauvin's trial starts today. Hopefully, justice will be served.
Justice will be served, by definition of a jury trial hearing evidence and rendering their verdict.
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Justice will be served, by definition of a jury trial hearing evidence and rendering their verdict.
It's the best we got, but I wouldn't say the jury system is batting 1.000 when it comes to dispensing justice.
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Relax yourself. I was wrong on a random fact on the internet. No need to burn the building down.
But once again, even 1121 is such an incredibly small map on the blimp.
It's not a fact it's a BS right wing talking point that's also having negative effects on the tourism industry in Chicago.
Edit: Deleted the rest of my post. Because there's no point.
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But once again, even 1121 is such an incredibly small map on the blimp.
I do not think it means what you think it means.
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It's not a fact it's a BS right wing talking point that's also having negative effects on the tourism industry in Chicago.
Edit: Deleted the rest of my post. Because there's no point.
Hurting tourism? That's what you're worried about?
When the Trib has a "heat map" https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html (https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html) and it shows shootings all over the city, it's more than a tourism problem.
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Hurting tourism? That's what you're worried about?
When the Trib has a "heat map" https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html (https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html) and it shows shootings all over the city, it's more than a tourism problem.
You pay for the tribune? Don't you live in Madison?
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Hurting tourism? That's what you're worried about?
When the Trib has a "heat map" https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html (https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html) and it shows shootings all over the city, it's more than a tourism problem.
Just my opinion, gangs and racial inequality have been occurring for centuries. There is no quick fix. Mass shootings are a relatively new phenomenon and may have a quicker fix, so it grabs the headlines. And in my opinion, the far right who want to equate the two seem to yell the loudest when lefts/moderates try to enact plans to lessen the inequalities that drive some people into gangs.
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You pay for the tribune? Don't you live in Madison?
I grew up in the suburbs, & my dad, uncle and grandpa all worked for the trib.
I don't pay for it, saw this reporting somewhere.
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I grew up in the suburbs, & my dad, uncle and grandpa all worked for the trib.
I don't pay for it, saw this reporting somewhere.
Gotcha. Well two things
1. I don't need a lecture on shootings in Chicago. Hell I'm living just outside the city now and have had three in the past month literally down the street, one next door to the bar I was at. I'd still call my area safe overall with increasing property value, and a ton of rehabs/new construction.
2. I find this map not being a heat map gives more context to the actual disparity of where they are. Seems pretty clear to me that my tip of "avoid these two spots, is dead on. Outside of that Chicago's extremely safe for the size remaining. It's still a city and there will be violence but it's actually pretty astonishing how low the shootings around once you get out of the west side and a few south neighborhoods.
https://heyjackass.com/
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I do not think it means what you think it means.
Its a rickyism ;D
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It's not a fact it's a BS right wing talking point that's also having negative effects on the tourism industry in Chicago.
Edit: Deleted the rest of my post. Because there's no point.
You literally said yourself "avoid parts of the west and most of the south and youll be fine". I have a very select few places I would feel unsafe in Milwaukee. You're telling me to avoid entire parts of a city and then on another thread saying how its a right wing plot. What?
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You literally said yourself "avoid parts of the west and most of the south and youll be fine". I have a very select few places I would feel unsafe in Milwaukee. You're telling me to avoid entire parts of a city and then on another thread saying how its a right wing plot. What?
Going to make this simple:
The right wing talking point: Chicago's a war zone, it's more dangerous than Afghanistan.
The reality: avoid unsafe neighborhoods.
It's plain and simple. Then you're trying to compare gang violence to mass shootings? I mean it comes off callus but if a GD kills a LK or VL or visa versa then good. one less gang member out there. I'll focus on improving the neighborhood adjacent to those, hoping that brings new business and opportunity to the area so new would be recruits dont join to replace the lost ones. But compare that shooting to a mentally disturbed person shooting up a high school, or a black church, or a movie theatre? That's not a fair comparison.
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Chicago ranks 73rd in violent crimes per capita.
Milwaukee ranks 23rd.
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/blog/top100dangerous
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Shoot guess I could have said 2020. Where there was 769. Again mass shootings are such a small portion of gun violence that you all do a disservice. If you want to solve the overall problem, look at the overall problem.
Good luck selling the "overall problem". It's all economic related.
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"Criminals don't follow laws and will end up getting guns anyway, so how are legal restrictions going to solve anything?"
"Ok then, then let's decriminalize drugs so we can dismantle organized crime and drug trafficking."
"..." >:(
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And another ...
https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/mass-shooting-orange-business-office-complex-california/2563778/?utm_term=OZY&utm_campaign=pdb&utm_content=Thursday_04.01.21&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email
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Pedophiles are just going to look at kiddie porn anyway, so why make it illegal?
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https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/3/13/22328797/chicago-weekend-shootings-march-12-15-gun-violence-crime
Only difference is that they died one at a time.
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https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/3/13/22328797/chicago-weekend-shootings-march-12-15-gun-violence-crime
Only difference is that they died one at a time.
Outstanding goalpost-shifting.
Don't worry. We'll never have the kind of meaningful, common-sense gun regulations that even a majority of NRA members say they want.
This is 'Murica, dammit! We need MORE guns!!
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https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/3/13/22328797/chicago-weekend-shootings-march-12-15-gun-violence-crime
Only difference is that they died one at a time.
Which is why gun control makes sense for reducing both mass shootings and individual shootings, don't you agree?
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Pedophiles are just going to look at kiddie porn anyway, so why make it illegal?
If you impose drunk driving laws, only outlaws will drive drunk.
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Though not a mass killing, this is terrible ...
Gunfire erupted yesterday at the U.S. Capitol after a man rammed a car into police officers, killing one before being fatally shot. William “Billy” Evans was fatally struck at a checkpoint, becoming the fourth Capitol Police officer to die since the Jan. 6 Capitol riot began. Police said the driver of the car tried to attack them with a knife before they killed him. While the motive isn’t clear, Facebook posts by the reported attacker, Noah Green, 25, from Indiana, support Louis Farrakhan’s Black separatist Nation of Islam, and said he was unemployed and warned of the “last days of our world.”
I feel terrible for the slain officer's family. Thank goodness the insane killer did not have a gun that could fire off 100 rounds in seconds, or else it would have been a bloodbath.
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Yeah, why aren't we hearing more about the Louis Farrakhan following ass hole who rammed his car into police officers at the Capitol? Virtually nothing from the media. Like I said, when you're chit, you're chit, aina?
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Yeah, why aren't we hearing more about the Louis Farrakhan following ass hole who rammed his car into police officers at the Capitol? Virtually nothing from the media. Like I said, when you're chit, you're chit, aina?
Almost nothing from the mainstream media on the killer's background nor was there anything about the disgusting Uber driver murder in DC last week. That's the way it works with the far-left when they can't manipulate a narrative and play identity politics. We see it time and time again.
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Yeah, why aren't we hearing more about the Louis Farrakhan following ass hole who rammed his car into police officers at the Capitol? Virtually nothing from the media. Like I said, when you're chit, you're chit, aina?
https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/02/politics/us-capitol-incident/index.html
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/live/2021/04/02/us/us-capitol-police-attack.amp.html
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1262917
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Almost nothing from the mainstream media on the killer's background nor was there anything about the disgusting Uber driver murder in DC last week. That's the way it works with the far-left when they can't manipulate a narrative and play identity politics. We see it time and time again.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/us-capitol-police-officer-killed-attack-car-ramming-barricade/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/politics/story/2021-04-02/us-capitol-security-threat-officer%3f_amp=true
All of these stories have background details of the suspect
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/us-capitol-police-officer-killed-attack-car-ramming-barricade/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/politics/story/2021-04-02/us-capitol-security-threat-officer%3f_amp=true
All of these stories have background details of the suspect
That's not the point. Imagine the coverage if the dynamics were the opposite.
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That's not the point. Imagine the coverage if the dynamics were the opposite.
Are you saying the coverage was unfair when a mob stormed the Capitol and a police office died? Is that the problem here?
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That's not the point. Imagine the coverage if the dynamics were the opposite.
It's literally the top story on the front page of the Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, Newsday, NY Daily News, NY Post, Chicago Tribune, Los Angeles Times, Milwaukee J-S, St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Dallas Morning News, Houston Chronicle, Boston Globe, and dozens of other newspapers across the country, and it's on P1 everywhere (yes, including the evil New York Times).
https://www.freedomforum.org/todaysfrontpages/?tfp_display=gallery&tfp_region=USA&tfp_sort_by=state&tfp_show=all
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It's literally the top story on the front page of the Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, Newsday, NY Daily News, NY Post, Chicago Tribune, Los Angeles Times, Milwaukee J-S, St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Dallas Morning News, Houston Chronicle, Boston Globe, and dozens of other newspapers across the country, and it's on P1 everywhere (yes, including the evil New York Times).
https://www.freedomforum.org/todaysfrontpages/?tfp_display=gallery&tfp_region=USA&tfp_sort_by=state&tfp_show=all
Again, it's not about literally covering the story. It's the narrative that would have been played if the dynamics were different.
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Almost nothing from the mainstream media on the killer's background nor was there anything about the disgusting Uber driver murder in DC last week. That's the way it works with the far-left when they can't manipulate a narrative and play identity politics. We see it time and time again.
You continue to lie over and over on this subject. You get called out and then the next time, you spew your lies again about the MSM not covering a subject.
If you want the truth about this kind of thing. check out how often Fox reported on Matt Gaetz. ZERO mentions of the biggest political story on Thursday.
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Again, it's not about literally covering the story. It's the narrative that would have been played if the dynamics were different.
You continue to embarrass yourself.
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Again, it's not about literally covering the story. It's the narrative that would have been played if the dynamics were different.
So you're whining about something that didn't happen?
The victimhood is strong with this one.
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Again, it's not about literally covering the story. It's the narrative that would have been played if the dynamics were different.
Muggsy, first you say there is no coverage in the “msm”. Someone posts multiple links showing that there is coverage. Then, despite what you wrote, all of a sudden “that is not the point.”
Just take the L in this one.
Regroup. Come back to fight another day.
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If the dynamics were different the coverage would be 24/7 and probably mass protests and you all know this. I shouldn't have written barely covered but more incessant coverage with the goal of polarizing society and creating division.
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If the dynamics were different the coverage would be 24/7 and probably mass protests and you all know this. I shouldn't have written barely covered but more incessant coverage with the goal of polarizing society and creating division.
You seem to be the one sewing division over an apparent suicide by cop. Sorry the guy didn't have a political motive I guess?
Stop watching cable news and your life will improve
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You seem to be the one sewing division over an apparent suicide by cop. Sorry the guy didn't have a political motive I guess?
Stop watching cable news and your life will improve
All of it. CNN, Fox, etc
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If the dynamics were different the coverage would be 24/7 and probably mass protests and you all know this. I shouldn't have written barely covered but more incessant coverage with the goal of polarizing society and creating division.
It did happen and it was a story for like a week. Remember the MAGA obsessed pipe bomber who sent IEDs to HRC, Cory Booker, Joe Biden...
But of course the motives of the pipe bomber was to literally kill political opponents of DTJ, opponents Trump routinely excoriated in speeches and on Twitter, but yeah whatever...
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Yeah, why aren't we hearing more about the Louis Farrakhan following ass hole who rammed his car into police officers at the Capitol? Virtually nothing from the media. Like I said, when you're chit, you're chit, aina?
I posted it, and I'm no right-winger, as you know. And where do you think I got it? From the effen mainstream media, as others have pointed out. Virtually ALL of them ran long articles about it, some with analysis sidebars. When you have to lie to make a point, Doc, you don't have much of a point.
Anyway ... again ... thank goodness this "Louis Farrakhan following ass hole" didn't have a gun -- which is what this thread is about. Dozens probably would have died.
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Yeah but, this insurrection didn't get traction, like the other, hey?
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Yeah but, this insurrection didn't get traction, like the other, hey?
Can we have a 1 man insurrection? Do you just declare yourself to be having an insurrection, or what's the protocol there?
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Yeah but, this insurrection didn't get traction, like the other, hey?
First, you lied. Now you're being ridiculous to cover your lie. Keep bending the knee, Doc, your Mad King appreciates it.
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Can we have a 1 man insurrection? Do you just declare yourself to be having an insurrection, or what's the protocol there?
Kinda like Micheal Scott?
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Yeah but, this insurrection didn't get traction, like the other, hey?
The President didn’t incite this one
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Orr da udder won ether, hey?
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Orr da udder won ether, hey?
No, the guy that got humiliated in the election by a senile, old man refused to concede and kept lying to the public, insisting he won despite zero evidence to the contrary.
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
Y’all, don’t feed the troll.
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
Yeah, all the courts are part of the Deep State election coverup, as well. Even the SCOTUS justices and all the other conservative judges your Mad King appointed. They’re all in on it!
Tell me, does Q have a secret handshake, too?
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
That’s called all of the absentee and mail in ballots, since in WI poll workers weren’t allowed to count those until polls closed. Same in MI. Meanwhile, in Ohio, Biden had a big lead when the polls closed but Trump chipped away and won because they could count mail in and absentee ballots earlier.
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
It’s frightening to me that you are allowed to be free in society.
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That’s called all of the absentee and mail in ballots, since in WI poll workers weren’t allowed to count those until polls closed. Same in MI. Meanwhile, in Ohio, Biden had a big lead when the polls closed but Trump chipped away and won because they could count mail in and absentee ballots earlier.
Yep. In a few of these states that counted ballots late, those were in accordance with laws enacted by Republican state legislatures.
But anyway, back to gun violence ...
Yeah, why aren't we hearing more about the Louis Farrakhan following ass hole who rammed his car into police officers at the Capitol? Virtually nothing from the media. Like I said, when you're chit, you're chit, aina?
As it turns out, this guy was mentally disturbed and suffered from "delusions, paranoia and suicidal thoughts."
In other words, even "Louis Farrakhan following ass holes" can be mentally ill - which is exactly what the gun-lovers say about every white supremacist terrorist who shoots people. "It's not guns, it's mental illness."
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Op-ed in today's Charlotte Observer, written by the mother of a UNC-Charlotte student who was killed while heroically trying to save fellow students from a gunman two years ago:
+++
Riley, my first child, died the way he lived – looking out for others. From an early age, it was clear he was one you could count on to have your back. He learned sign language when he was three years old, so he could talk to his deaf uncle. And when he and his friends went backpacking, he’d always volunteer to carry the heaviest pack, with the pots and pans digging into his back, to cook them a memorable meal at the day’s end. And when a shooter stormed into his UNC-Charlotte classroom on April 30, 2019 and started firing, he charged into danger to protect his classmates. He charged into danger – a decision and sacrifice he should have never had to make.
Riley was shot and killed that day, as he tackled the gunman. One other student was murdered, and four others were wounded. My life, our family, the victims’ families, and the whole UNC-Charlotte community will never be the same.
Change the setting, repeat. Change the motive, repeat. Change the people targeted, repeat. This crisis is the reality we are living in – gun violence happening anywhere, any time – with America leading the world among well-off countries in its own people being killed by fellow citizens armed with guns. To address this crisis, comprehensive gun violence prevention strategy is vital, and at the foundation of that strategy are background checks. Right now, Sens. Richard Burr and Thom Tillis have the opportunity to honor the lives of all those impacted by gun violence across our state and country by taking action on creating better background checks – a common-sense, prevention-oriented policy supported by vast, bipartisan majorities of North Carolinians, gun owners included.
Before Riley was murdered, I was a teacher; I taught middle school for 20 years in western North Carolina. I couldn’t go back to teaching, not after what happened. All the time, I cycle through my memories of Riley. I am grateful for the grace, resilience, and loving stubbornness he showed me as I learned what it meant to be a parent and he grew into the unique individual he was. We shared such perfect moments in the kitchen together – the kitchen certainly didn’t look perfect afterwards, but I smile when I think about how excited he was, trying a new recipe and getting it spot on. I remember when we (not just me, but cousins, aunts, uncles too) met his longtime girlfriend, Lauren, for the first time – on their first date, no less. They both handled the unexpected barrage with much, much more composure than I could ever imagine.
Riley lived his far-too-short life – he got to experience love, he was surrounded by beauty in nature and in his close friends whom he held dear, he gave and received steadfast companionship from the many beloved dogs in his life, he worked hard and played hard, and he knew the value of family. But like more than 100 people every day in the United States, his life was cut short by gun violence. And each of those people has left behind a whole universe. There’s a constellation of people in this country who have suffered this violent, abrupt trauma, not unlike the bullets that took our loved ones from us – a trauma that enters you, tears you up, and changes you in every way, that results in permanent devastation and unrelenting grief. And just over the past few days and weeks, that constellation – a constellation no one wants to be a part of – has grown in shocking, public fashion.
Like so many others before me, I’ve taken my trauma and turned it to advocacy. And right now, Sens. Burr and Tillis, and their colleagues in the U.S. Senate can protect lives and communities across our nation and honor those killed and wounded by gun violence by acting on strengthening our background checks laws to ensure that people who shouldn’t have guns can’t buy them at a gun show, from someone they meet on the internet, or from a total stranger with no background check and no questions asked. It’s a common-sense, constitutional policy that’s supported by 93% of Americans, including 89% of Republicans and 89% of gun owners. While there is no one law that can diminish or wipe out gun violence on its own, the collective effect of stronger gun laws can change what is happening in households, schools, and communities all over our country.
I share our story because no one else should have to live it. No more parents should have to say goodbye to their children forever. No more siblings should have to grow up without their brother, sister, mother, or father. No more.
In the moment when Riley knew that he was facing his last breaths, he chose to act to save lives. Our elected leaders, by working together and securing federal action on background checks to safeguard the well-being of our families and communities, can save lives as well. This isn’t about politics. It’s about protecting people. It’s about tightening the loopholes in our laws. It’s about our individual and collective safety. It’s about our elected officials owing us lifesaving action. It’s about creating an America free from gun violence.
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Again, it's not about literally covering the story. It's the narrative that would have been played if the dynamics were different.
I'm trying to get my head around this one. You're mad that IF some hypothetical--that didn't actually happen--HAD happened, then the coverage of this non-occurring hypothetical would have hypothetically been different??
That's some Class A pre-emptive outrage.
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Yeah because nobody remembers the Boston marathon bombings...
They were Muslim immigrants and it was during one of the most high profile sporting events in the US.
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It’s frightening to me that you are allowed to be free in society.
Wow dude, don't pop a hemorrhoid. Pretty sure you will benefit from getting a therapy dog and taking goat yoga classes, aina?
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Sure, you talking 'bout the election where 87% of eligible Milwaukeeans cast a vote, truckloads of ballots for Biden were suddenly found at 3:30 am, and pipes burst in ATL? Everything was on the up and up and kosher, hey?
Hey doQ, here's the guy you worship:
Supporters of Donald Trump who thought they were sending a single donation were charged over and over by his campaign operation.
The charges were part of an intentional scheme to boost revenue to Trump’s struggling presidential campaign. Recurring online donations were set up by default, and a fine-print disclaimer and opt-out language became increasingly hard to find.
Demands for refunds spiked, and complaints to banks and credit card companies soared. The magnitude of the money involved is staggering for politics: All told, the Trump campaign and the Republican Party raised $1.2 billion with WinRed, a for-profit donation processing service, and refunded roughly 10 percent of it.
In effect, the overcharges were an interest-free loan — eventually paid off with some of the tens of millions of dollars Trump raised after the election under the guise of pursuing his unfounded claims of election fraud.
Ever the con man. He doesn't care if you hate him or you love him. He'd scam his best friend if he thought it would help buy another gold toilet for one of his palaces.
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They were Muslim immigrants and it was during one of the most high profile sporting events in the US.
1) two weeks to reply to a post?
2) You missed the intentional sarcasm in my post where I point out that people do in fact remember non white conservative terrorists.
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1) two weeks to reply to a post?
2) You missed the intentional sarcasm in my post where I point out that people do in fact remember non white conservative terrorists.
What's 9/11? Never heard of it. Was it in the papers?
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1) two weeks to reply to a post?
2) You missed the intentional sarcasm in my post where I point out that people do in fact remember non white conservative terrorists.
I hadn't even look at this thread in weeks nor did I look at the date of the original post. And no, I was not looking for sarcasm. That said, those two dudes would be considered "white" or "white adjacent" by many of those with agenda, like the killer in Boulder has been labeled.
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I hadn't even look at this thread in weeks nor did I look at the date of the original post. And no, I was not looking for sarcasm. That said, those two dudes would be considered "white" or "white adjacent" by many of those with agenda, like the killer in Boulder has been labeled.
Wut?
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those with agenda
Like those screaming that the media ignored murder by a Farrakhan follower even though the media literally covered the hell out of it? That kind of agenda?
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8 dead in shooting at FedEx facility in Indianapolis
https://apnews.com/article/fedex-indianapolis-mass-shooting-e92ad3117c56357b3b2c71a2903e68a8
INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — A gunman killed eight people and wounded several others before killing himself in a late-night shooting at a FedEx facility near the Indianapolis airport, police said, in the latest in a spate of mass shootings after a relative lull during the pandemic.
Five people were hospitalized after the Thursday night shooting, according to police. One of them had critical injuries, police spokesperson Genae Cook said. Another two people were treated and released at the scene. FedEx said people who worked for the company were among the dead.
A witness said that he was working inside the building when he heard several gunshots in rapid succession.
“I see a man come out with a rifle in his hand and he starts firing and he starts yellin’ stuff that I could not understand,” Levi Miller told WTHR-TV. “What I ended up doing was ducking down to make sure he did not see me because I thought he would see me and he would shoot me.”
Police have not identified the shooter or said whether he was an employee at the facility.
“We’re still trying to ascertain the exact reason and cause for this incident,” Cook said.
It was the latest in a recent string of mass shootings across the U.S. Last month, eight people were fatally shot at massage businesses across the Atlanta area, and 10 died in gunfire at a supermarket in Boulder, Colorado.
It was at least the third mass shooting this year in Indianapolis alone. Five people, including a pregnant woman, were shot and killed in January, and a man was accused of killing three adults and a child before abducting his daughter during at argument at a home in March.
Let's not change a thing because what we're doing now is working spectacularly. Thoughts and prayers.
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People want to know a viable step we can take to perhaps prevent some of these? How about “red flag” laws with teeth?
+++
Brandon Hole, the 19-year-old who the police say fatally shot eight people at a FedEx facility on Thursday night, legally purchased two semiautomatic rifles he used in the attack more than six months earlier, according to the chief of the Indianapolis Metropolitan Police Department.
In March of 2020, the police had seized a shotgun from Mr. Hole after his mother raised concerns about his mental state, records show. But, Chief Randal Taylor said, the fact that Mr. Hole was legally able to make the more recent gun purchases indicates that, despite his mother’s warning and the police seizure of a gun, the authorities had not deemed him subject to Indiana’s so-called “red flag” law, which bars people who are found by a judge to present dangerous risk from possessing a firearm.
Under the state’s longstanding red flag law, the authorities have two weeks after taking someone’s weapon to argue before a judge that the person is unstable and should be barred from possessing a gun for a period of time. But Chief Taylor was unsure whether a hearing like that ever took place — even though the police never returned the shotgun they had seized last year.
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Kenosha: 3 dead, 2 injured after mass shooting at bar
https://abc7chicago.com/bar-kenosha-shooting-mass/10524839/
My daughter-in-law knows the owner of the bar. He was not among the victims.
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Kenosha: 3 dead, 2 injured after mass shooting at bar
https://abc7chicago.com/bar-kenosha-shooting-mass/10524839/
My daughter-in-law knows the owner of the bar. He was not among the victims.
I’ve been in there a few times.
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And now 3 dead (so far) with an active shooter in Austin.
But hey, there is nothing that we can possibly do about these things, so lay back and enjoy it I guess.
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Maybe folks have been doing it wrong and should go with "Prayers and thoughts" instead of vice versa.
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We need to find out what is so terrible about the US that makes us the only country in the world with mental illness.
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Coming faster than transfers on 4/14.
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A good guy with a gun will be along any moment now, so I've been told.
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Nature is healing
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And now 3 dead (so far) with an active shooter in Austin.
But hey, there is nothing that we can possibly do about these things, so lay back and enjoy it I guess.
I hear we need to keep pumping more guns onto the streets, so all the “good guys” will have them to prevent all the “bad guys” from killing innocent people.
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I hear we need to keep pumping more guns onto the streets, so all the “good guys” will have them to prevent all the “bad guys” from killing innocent people.
It worked so well in the wild west, the very model of a peaceful society, why wouldn't we want to repeat that?
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(https://refuge-cdn.nolayingup.dev/original/3X/b/3/b3ba03979abe74f2893a973b0c56e660bb30f097.jpeg)
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Guy just shot up an Ashwaubenon casino. 2 victims dead, another seriously injured. Shooter also dead.
Clip I just watched on YouTube led with police spokesman saying, “Thoughts and prayers go out.”
Of course.
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We can't make any new laws to stop this. Criminals will just break the laws anyway. That's just common sense.
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We can't make any new laws to stop this. Criminals will just break the laws anyway. That's just common sense.
Totally agree. Indeed, I've emailed all of my state and national representatives and urged them to get rid of all laws because people will just find ways to break them.
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We can't make any new laws to stop this. Criminals will just break the laws anyway. That's just common sense.
Saw a sobering statistic yesterday. In Baltimore, for every $1 that goes to police budgets, only $0.55 goes to public schools, and $0.01 to programs to prevent youth violence. And most major crimes are leading to arrests at something like 30% of cases.
If criminals are just going to break laws anyways...?
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Saw a sobering statistic yesterday. In Baltimore, for every $1 that goes to police budgets, only $0.55 goes to public schools, and $0.01 to programs to prevent youth violence. And most major crimes are leading to arrests at something like 30% of cases.
If criminals are just going to break laws anyways...?
Redirect the $0.01 to purchase and distribute guns to all youths. The only thing that will stop a bad 4th grader with a gun is a good 4th grader with a gun.
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Saw a sobering statistic yesterday. In Baltimore, for every $1 that goes to police budgets, only $0.55 goes to public schools, and $0.01 to programs to prevent youth violence. And most major crimes are leading to arrests at something like 30% of cases.
If criminals are just going to break laws anyways...?
Your point remains, but I think your numbers are off. Baltimore City Public Schools has a 2021 Budget of nearly 1.4 billion https://www.baltimorecityschools.org/budget (https://www.baltimorecityschools.org/budget). Baltimore Police has a budget of 555 million https://www.baltimoresun.com/politics/bs-md-pol-baltimore-taxpayer-night-20210422-3cdlxup4rnbnhizl7bc6i45gny-story.html (https://www.baltimoresun.com/politics/bs-md-pol-baltimore-taxpayer-night-20210422-3cdlxup4rnbnhizl7bc6i45gny-story.html).
What gets me , is that the article states that only 4.7 million is spent on mental health services.
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Redirect the $0.01 to purchase and distribute guns to all youths. The only thing that will stop a bad 4th grader with a gun is a good 4th grader with a gun.
There are dozens and dozens of accidents every year in the U.S. involving toddlers getting into their parents' guns and firing away. If we just armed everybody 1 and up, and taught those precocious lads and lasses how to shoot, imagine how many fewer accidents there would be!
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There are dozens and dozens of accidents every year in the U.S. involving toddlers getting into their parents' guns and firing away. If we just armed everybody 1 and up, and taught those precocious lads and lasses how to shoot, imagine how many fewer accidents there would be!
Could you imagine how many Scoopers would have been shot in the last 15 months, accidentally or in self defense?
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Your point remains, but I think your numbers are off. Baltimore City Public Schools has a 2021 Budget of nearly 1.4 billion https://www.baltimorecityschools.org/budget (https://www.baltimorecityschools.org/budget). Baltimore Police has a budget of 555 million https://www.baltimoresun.com/politics/bs-md-pol-baltimore-taxpayer-night-20210422-3cdlxup4rnbnhizl7bc6i45gny-story.html (https://www.baltimoresun.com/politics/bs-md-pol-baltimore-taxpayer-night-20210422-3cdlxup4rnbnhizl7bc6i45gny-story.html).
What gets me , is that the article states that only 4.7 million is spent on mental health services.
Thanks for the update. The numbers I cited I pulled from a special on CNN by Kamau Bell, I just happened to see it in the background while working.
I had to go look for the clip, because I was trying to figure out if I misunderstood it, or Kamau Bell mis-stated the dollar amounts. Not surprisingly, I didn't fully understand what he was saying. His numbers are specifically for the municipal budget. I'm guessing the full funding for schools comes out of multiple additional coffers.
My apologies for misunderstanding what I saw. The fact remains, that with your numbers, it is still absurd how the money is allocated.
https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2021/05/01/united-shades-policing-the-police-101-animation.cnn/video/playlists/united-shades-of-america-season-4/
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I'm guessing the full funding for schools comes out of multiple additional coffers.
My apologies for misunderstanding what I saw. The fact remains, that with your numbers, it is still absurd how the money is allocated.
No apology needed. The CNN video you linked to was preposterously misleading.
But your last sentence doesn't make sense. "with your numbers, it's still absurd how the money is allocated."
I don't understand. $1.4b to schools, .5b to police. Spending 3x on schools than police seems reasonable. I mean, it'd be great if it was 10x, but 3x seems in the ballpark.
Looks like MKE is about 4x .. although each city has their own set of issues and characteristics, taxation policies, poverty and crime levels, education needs, union power, etc.
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We clearly need more guns, because the only way to stop a bad 6th-grade girl with a gun is a good 6th-grade girl with a gun!
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/three-injured-eastern-idaho-school-shooting-student-custody-local-media-2021-05-06/?utm_term=OZY&utm_campaign=pdb&utm_content=Friday_05.07.21&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email
A sixth-grade girl pulled a handgun from a backpack at her eastern Idaho school on Thursday and opened fire, hitting two fellow students and a member of school staff and inflicting non-life-threatening injuries on them, officials said.
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There are dozens and dozens of accidents every year in the U.S. involving toddlers getting into their parents' guns and firing away. If we just armed everybody 1 and up, and taught those precocious lads and lasses how to shoot, imagine how many fewer accidents there would be!
before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
You're a caricature.
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
Does that include the parents of Anissa weier and Morgan Geyser?
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
thanks, archie bunker of 704 howser street!
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
Isn’t this what the “Defund Police” movement is trying to accomplish? Try to improve the communities so crime isn’t what people resort to. Terrible name I agree, but the thought behind it seems sound.
It doesn’t seem like “throw them in jail” is the answer to our problems. Unless we are going to build jails at the rate of apartments.
It’s better to try and solve some of the root causes of the issues, which is where money previously allocated for the police department would go to. It won’t solve everything, but maybe some community programs geared at mental health or teaching job skills would help. It seems to for some places.
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
Do you have kids? If so, can you have them contact me? Thanks
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We clearly need more guns, because the only way to stop a bad 6th-grade girl with a gun is a good 6th-grade girl with a gun!
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/three-injured-eastern-idaho-school-shooting-student-custody-local-media-2021-05-06/?utm_term=OZY&utm_campaign=pdb&utm_content=Friday_05.07.21&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email
A sixth-grade girl pulled a handgun from a backpack at her eastern Idaho school on Thursday and opened fire, hitting two fellow students and a member of school staff and inflicting non-life-threatening injuries on them, officials said.
You're way too wussy on guns, 82. This 6th grader could have walked to a kindergarten class and opened fire. The good 4-5 years olds need to be carrying as well.
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You're way too wussy on guns, 82. This 6th grader could have walked to a kindergarten class and opened fire. The good 4-5 years olds need to be carrying as well.
Maybe they were and that why she didn't go in there
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Maybe they were and that why she didn't go in there
Man, you outsmarted me again, Galway. :D
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before you get all excited about taking guns away from law abiding citizens, take a look at all the bad people with rap sheets as long as these pages of scoop. felons being let out of prison, crimes not being prosecuted, etc etc bad people with bad behavior do not belong on our streets. regarding kids who behave badly, depending on their ages, the parents need to be held responsible just as bad dog owners be held responsible for their dogs. i'm sure if we take a closer look at these parents, many of them shouldn't be parents and possibly be in jail themselves as well
Why yes, we can't have sensible guns laws because there are people with rap sheets. That makes perfect sense. And also children that are like bad dogs. Thank you for bringing these important points to light.
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Why yes, we can't have sensible guns laws because there are people with rap sheets. That makes perfect sense. And also children that are like bad dogs. Thank you for bringing these important points to light.
we do have "sensible laws" on the books. enforcing them would be a wonderful thing
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we do have "sensible laws" on the books. enforcing them would be a wonderful thing
Yes, locking more people up is the answer!
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we do have "sensible laws" on the books. enforcing them would be a wonderful thing
exactly. glad you finally realize we don't need a bunch of states making it more difficult for people to vote, as there already have been sensible voting laws on the books for decades (or even centuries).
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Meanwhile ... Happy Effen Mother's Day ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/05/09/colorado-springs-shooting-birthday/?utm_campaign=pdb&utm_content=Monday_05.10.21&utm_source=Campaigner&utm_medium=email
Six people are dead after a gunman entered a birthday party and began shooting inside a mobile home in Colorado Springs before killing himself during the early-morning hours of Mother’s Day, police announced Sunday.
The mass shooting unfolded around midnight Sunday at the Canterbury Mobile Home Park, about eight miles outside downtown Colorado Springs, police said. The gunman, who authorities said was the boyfriend of one of the female victims, has not been publicly identified.
The Colorado Springs Police Department said in a news release that the man “drove to the residence, walked inside and began shooting people at the party before taking his own life.” The shooter’s motive is still being investigated, police said, and the type of firearm used was not specified.
Like rocket, I blame the media. When I'm not giving thoughts and prayers, that is.
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https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2021/05/10/chicago-weekend-violence-shootings-violent-crime-may-2021/
Every effing weekend in Chicago.
Actually, probably a fairly quiet weekend by Chicago standards.
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“It was Colorado’s worst mass shooting since a gunman killed 10 people at a Boulder supermarket March 22.”
A sentence that actually appeared in an AP report on today's unfortunate exercise of Second Amendment freedoms.
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Where's Chicago's mayor condemning black on black violence? So much for BLM, hey?
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https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2021/05/10/chicago-weekend-violence-shootings-violent-crime-may-2021/
Every effing weekend in Chicago.
Actually, probably a fairly quiet weekend by Chicago standards.
Where's Chicago's mayor condemning black on black violence? So much for BLM, hey?
And EVERYONE admits, acknowledges and concedes there is a HUGE problem. Every day programs are being rolled out to attack it. They are led by politicians, athletes, business community etc. Some are helping, some aren't. But no one is denying there is a problem.
But when it comes to mass shootings, there is a sizeable part of our country that just says:
1) Now is not the time to politicize this, we need to grieve
2) It's a mental health issue (and then never addresses the mental health issue)
3) What about Chicago?
Mayor Lightfoot doesn't deny that Englewood is a sh!t show and just say: WHAT ABOUT IDAHO?
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And EVERYONE admits, acknowledges and concedes there is a HUGE problem. Every day programs are being rolled out to attack it. They are led by politicians, athletes, business community etc. Some are helping, some aren't. But no one is denying there is a problem.
But when it comes to mass shootings, there is a sizeable part of our country that just says:
1) Now is not the time to politicize this, we need to grieve
2) It's a mental health issue (and then never addresses the mental health issue)
3) What about Chicago?
Mayor Lightfoot doesn't deny that Englewood is a sh!t show and just say: WHAT ABOUT IDAHO?
100%.
People who respond with 1,2,&3 should just be intellectually honest and say "I don't care about mass shootings and gun violence".
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Mayor Lightfoot doesn't deny that Englewood is a sh!t show and just say: WHAT ABOUT IDAHO?
I love Chicago, lived there most of my life.
I’m encouraged that Mayor Lightfoot acknowledges that Englewood is a sh!t show. It’s been ignored for far too long. What programs have been put in place and has there been any progress/rays of hope?
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https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2021/05/10/chicago-weekend-violence-shootings-violent-crime-may-2021/
Every effing weekend in Chicago.
Actually, probably a fairly quiet weekend by Chicago standards.
Agree, we should drastically reduce the easy availability to guns in this country.
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And EVERYONE admits, acknowledges and concedes there is a HUGE problem. Every day programs are being rolled out to attack it. They are led by politicians, athletes, business community etc. Some are helping, some aren't. But no one is denying there is a problem.
But when it comes to mass shootings, there is a sizeable part of our country that just says:
1) Now is not the time to politicize this, we need to grieve
2) It's a mental health issue (and then never addresses the mental health issue)
3) What about Chicago?
Mayor Lightfoot doesn't deny that Englewood is a sh!t show and just say: WHAT ABOUT IDAHO?
It is a gun proliferation problem. It is not a mental health issue.
If you can find evidence that the US has more mental problems than EVERY other country in the world, then we can have that discussion.
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I love Chicago, lived there most of my life.
I’m encouraged that Mayor Lightfoot acknowledges that Englewood is a sh!t show. It’s been ignored for far too long. What programs have been put in place and has there been any progress/rays of hope?
Here's one from March:
https://www.chicago.gov/city/en/depts/mayor/press_room/press_releases/2021/march/INVESTSouthWestWinningProposals.html (https://www.chicago.gov/city/en/depts/mayor/press_room/press_releases/2021/march/INVESTSouthWestWinningProposals.html)
There's no magic potion for either issue but I we should be able to agree that people are trying to curb gang violence in Chicago. Are their efforts effective? That's debatable. But is anyone trying to stop mass shooting? Are we acknowledging there's an issue?
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I love Chicago, lived there most of my life.
I’m encouraged that Mayor Lightfoot acknowledges that Englewood is a sh!t show. It’s been ignored for far too long. What programs have been put in place and has there been any progress/rays of hope?
It's astonishing the fixation on Englewood. It's actually not the most violent area in the city. It's the poorest, but Austin has the most active gang issues, and more violent crime. I mean neither is a spot to be but for some reason Englewood has been given a target on its back by everyone around the country.
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It's astonishing the fixation on Englewood. It's actually not the most violent area in the city. It's the poorest, but Austin has the most active gang issues, and more violent crime. I mean neither is a spot to be but for some reason Englewood has been given a target on its back by everyone around the country.
Austin is a lot bigger, so I dont know if its as extreme per capita. Englewood was just absurdly poor, extremely violent, and had a couple very notable people like D Rose and Jennifer Hudson come out when it was at its lowest that kind of brought shine on it, to counter the horrific stuff. Other areas have ebbed and flowed with crime, but that was just the name that everyone associated with "Chiraq" for 10-15 years.
And not shocking that Lightfoot would focus on that, when other areas are worse like you mentioned, cause she'd much rather focus on buzz and making a show than actually being effective, cause she's terrible.
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And not shocking that Lightfoot would focus on that, when other areas are worse like you mentioned, cause she'd much rather focus on buzz and making a show than actually being effective, cause she's terrible.
I was the one who focused on Englewood, not Lightfoot. This is the headline from the article I linked:
Mayor Lightfoot Announces Winning INVEST South/West Proposals for Austin, Englewood, and Auburn Gresham Development Sites
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It is a gun proliferation problem. It is not a mental health issue.
If you can find evidence that the US has more mental problems than EVERY other country in the world, then we can have that discussion.
It's most likely a combination of many things (outdated/unenforced ref flag laws, too easy to get a permit, etc) but to state it is not a mental health issue is just plain wrong.
Here's a study of the mental health crisis, not sure of ALL countries, but higher than the countries compared to.
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries (https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries)
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It's most likely a combination of many things (outdated/unenforced ref flag laws, too easy to get a permit, etc) but to state it is not a mental health issue is just plain wrong.
Here's a study of the mental health crisis, not sure of ALL countries, but higher than the countries compared to.
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries (https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries)
Thanks, Lawdog. I wasn't minimizing the mental health problems in the US. They are a very real problem.
I was speaking only in relationship to gun violence. Almost no other nations have to deal with the gun violence issues to the same extent as we do. That is why the ready availability of guns to everyone is the issue. People are shooting people because they have the means to do it.
It's no different than well-off people eating better, healthier food than poor people. They do so only because they have the means to do it and poor people don't..
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I can't believe the solution is right there in front of our faces and we're avoiding the obvious:
Clearly, what we need are more guns and fewer laws. Duh!
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I can't believe the solution is right there in front of our faces and we're avoiding the obvious:
Clearly, what we need are more guns and fewer laws. Duh!
We heard the joke the first 5 times Mike, stop trying to bait people and further derail a discussion that’s actually been productive for a hot minute 8-)
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We heard the joke the first 5 times Mike, stop trying to bait people and further derail a discussion that’s actually been productive for a hot minute 8-)
I get your point Wags, but how do you know he was joking? More guns is literally the republican policy.
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Gun free New Zealand just had a mass stabbing.
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Gun free New Zealand just had a mass stabbing.
and heroic by standards who weren't armed were able to subdue him. Compare that to shootings where no unarmed by standards have a shot at defense and many many more than 4 people are injured.
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This past weekend the US had 10 mass shootings that injured as many people as the New Zealand stabbing.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/10/us/us-weekend-mass-shootings/index.html (https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/10/us/us-weekend-mass-shootings/index.html)
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Gun free New Zealand just had a mass stabbing.
Four victims. All survived.
Now imagine the outcome if the same guy rampages through the same supermarket with an AR-15.
Actually, we don't have to imagine.
See: Boulder (10 dead, 2 injured)
See: El Paso (23 dead, 23 injured)
You've made an excellent argument for gun control.
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Yes, locking more people up is the answer!
just one example of many-
https://www.foxnews.com/us/suspected-times-square-shooter-is-career-criminal-with-a-lengthy-rap-sheet
if the anti gun people are so worried about the number of guns on the street, they should be more than outraged this dude was even walking the streets. just the fact that he committed ONE crime with a gun followed by at least 2 more? and the st louis da wants to lock up a husband-wife for just badging a couple of guns protecting their property?? they didn't even fire them, much less shoot anyone. if they would have fired off a couple rounds and injured a child?? death penalty right?
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just one example of many-
https://www.foxnews.com/us/suspected-times-square-shooter-is-career-criminal-with-a-lengthy-rap-sheet
if the anti gun people are so worried about the number of guns on the street, they should be more than outraged this dude was even walking the streets. just the fact that he committed ONE crime with a gun followed by at least 2 more? and the st louis da wants to lock up a husband-wife for just badging a couple of guns protecting their property?? they didn't even fire them, much less shoot anyone. if they would have fired off a couple rounds and injured a child?? death penalty right?
You didn't actually read the story, did you?
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We heard the joke the first 5 times Mike, stop trying to bait people and further derail a discussion that’s actually been productive for a hot minute 8-)
Wags, yes, I was being facetious ... but you're right, I probably shouldn't have been.
Because, in fact, an upsettingly large swath of Americans want more people to have more guns. They want to arm teachers, clergy, moviegoers, bar patrons, etc, etc, etc.
More, more, more. Need more guns.
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if the anti gun people are so worried about the number of guns on the street, they should be more than outraged this dude was even walking the streets.
This statement makes not even an iota of sense. (Why should I be surprised?)
That aside, you are once again claiming that we can't enact stronger gun laws because "people have rap sheets." Sigh.
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just one example of many-
https://www.foxnews.com/us/suspected-times-square-shooter-is-career-criminal-with-a-lengthy-rap-sheet
if the anti gun people are so worried about the number of guns on the street, they should be more than outraged this dude was even walking the streets. just the fact that he committed ONE crime with a gun followed by at least 2 more? and the st louis da wants to lock up a husband-wife for just badging a couple of guns protecting their property?? they didn't even fire them, much less shoot anyone. if they would have fired off a couple rounds and injured a child?? death penalty right?
Death penalty is barbaric and should be outlawed. The real question to ask here, rocket, is why this guy is committing crimes in the first place. I doubt he does these things because it's fun. He is a product of the system that you want to perpetuate. Lock em all up, throw away the key, and forget about their abandoned families. And when he gets out in a few years, he'll just go back because that is was over 60% of former inmates do. Their incarceration doesn't end when they leave prison. Their crimes follow them for the rest of their lives. Forgive and forget? Guess not in America.
I have no idea why you're trying to tie the psychopaths from St. Louis (they weren't defending their property from anything, they were menacing protestors because they're racist psychos) to this guy. Awfully weird, huh? Wonder why you'd do something like that... hmmm....
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just one example of many-
https://www.foxnews.com/us/suspected-times-square-shooter-is-career-criminal-with-a-lengthy-rap-sheet
if the anti gun people are so worried about the number of guns on the street, they should be more than outraged this dude was even walking the streets. just the fact that he committed ONE crime with a gun followed by at least 2 more? and the st louis da wants to lock up a husband-wife for just badging a couple of guns protecting their property?? they didn't even fire them, much less shoot anyone. if they would have fired off a couple rounds and injured a child?? death penalty right?
So we should ignore prosecuting two individuals who committed textbook armed (with guns) assault and intimidation? That's your solution?
You state that the fact that he committed ONE crime with a gun should be sufficient to lock him up and get him off the street. If that is the case, then the husband-wife should be locked up to get them off the street.
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White folks use guns to protect themselves. Black folks use guns to commit crimes.
I mean, that’s just rocket science!
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I have no idea why you're trying to tie the psychopaths from St. Louis (they weren't defending their property from anything, they were menacing protestors because they're racist psychos) to this guy. Awfully weird, huh? Wonder why you'd do something like that... hmmm....
Admit it, Hards. You do know why.
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Just lock this dumpster fire already
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Another in the series of seemingly infinite cases where if there weren't overwhelmingly easy access to firearms perhaps this mass shooter would have cooled down instead of murdering 7 people, including himself.
Colorado Springs mass shooter opened fire because he wasn’t invited to birthday
https://www.denverpost.com/2021/05/11/teodoro-macias-colorado-springs-shooting-suspect/
COLORADO SPRINGS — Police on Tuesday identified the man who shot and killed six people and himself at a family’s birthday party as Teodoro Macias, the 28-year-old boyfriend of an attendee, and said he opened fire because he was upset he wasn’t invited to the celebration.
Colorado Springs police believe Macias walked into a mobile home in the 2800 block of Preakness Way shortly after midnight Sunday and shot his girlfriend, Sandra Ibarra, and five members of her extended family. He then killed himself, according to police.
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Another in the series of seemingly infinite cases where if there weren't overwhelmingly easy access to firearms perhaps this mass shooter would have cooled down instead of murdering 7 people, including himself.
Some mass shooters and suicide victims will find a way to complete the act no matter what.
Others (and I strongly suspect it is a much larger group than the first one) would cool down before gaining access to a gun if they weren't so readily available.
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Some mass shooters and suicide victims will find a way to complete the act no matter what.
Others (and I strongly suspect it is a much larger group than the first one) would cool down before gaining access to a gun if they weren't so readily available.
Yes, it's just like locking one's house.
Sure, somebody who really wants to break in will. But we still lock the house, hoping that will deter a criminal at least a little bit.
Let's make it less difficult, not more, to get a gun.
The Second Amendment about a "well regulated" militia.
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Nm
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/witness-man-angered-texas-deputies-230415529.html
'Murca
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/witness-man-angered-texas-deputies-230415529.html
'Murca
Guns are worthless if you can't use them. :-\
Very sad story.
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/witness-man-angered-texas-deputies-230415529.html
'Murca
I'd be willing to wager that this guy's beliefs overlap a lot with your average blue lives matter person.
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Good thing these people had guns for self-protection.
A man allegedly shot his sister-in-law in the head Sunday morning at a North Portland house after arguing with his brother over laundry, according to court documents released Monday.
https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2021/05/argument-about-laundry-leads-man-to-kill-sister-in-law-at-north-portland-home-court-documents-allege.html
A search was underway for a gunman after a double shooting on Birmingham’s Southside that left a man dead and woman dead.
The suspect was later killed in an exchange of gunfire with Birmingham police.
The shooting happened at 6:30 a.m. Sunday near Brother Bryan Park at 10th Avenue South and Richard Arrington Jr. Boulevard. Birmingham police Sgt. Rod Mauldin said investigators have received information that an argument took place moments before the shooting. The dispute, he said, was reportedly over a dog.
https://www.al.com/news/birmingham/2021/05/1-dead-1-seriously-injured-in-shooting-near-birminghams-brother-bryan-park.html
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Good thing these people had guns for self-protection.
A man allegedly shot his sister-in-law in the head Sunday morning at a North Portland house after arguing with his brother over laundry, according to court documents released Monday.
https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2021/05/argument-about-laundry-leads-man-to-kill-sister-in-law-at-north-portland-home-court-documents-allege.html
A search was underway for a gunman after a double shooting on Birmingham’s Southside that left a man dead and woman dead.
The suspect was later killed in an exchange of gunfire with Birmingham police.
The shooting happened at 6:30 a.m. Sunday near Brother Bryan Park at 10th Avenue South and Richard Arrington Jr. Boulevard. Birmingham police Sgt. Rod Mauldin said investigators have received information that an argument took place moments before the shooting. The dispute, he said, was reportedly over a dog.
https://www.al.com/news/birmingham/2021/05/1-dead-1-seriously-injured-in-shooting-near-birminghams-brother-bryan-park.html
Not to mention the dozens and dozens of shootings by -- not of, but by -- toddlers the last couple of years.
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Cold blooded massacre of Andree Brown OK with the DA. With the regular murders of black men in America, of course he is going to try to run when murder happy cops armed to the teeth rush at him.
Simple solution? Shoot him in the back of the head.
What is going on in this country with these murderous thugs shooting black men in the back?
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You didn't actually read the story, did you?
yes i did, but no use arguing with you people. i can see where this has gone and will go. have fun with your anti gun friends
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Cold blooded massacre of Andree Brown OK with the DA. With the regular murders of black men in America, of course he is going to try to run when murder happy cops armed to the teeth rush at him.
Simple solution? Shoot him in the back of the head.
What is going on in this country with these murderous thugs shooting black men in the back?
you're one of the many reasons why cities burn
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you're one of the many reasons why cities burn
No, it’s centuries of America failing to come to terms with its original sin.
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you're one of the many reasons why cities burn
Right, it's the people that talk about the murder of black men that cause civil unrest, not the actual murder itself.
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you're one of the many reasons why cities burn
And you are one of the many reasons systemic racism is never dealt with, which is why we are continuing to have these issues to deal with.
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Some interesting stats on mass shootings:
Which guns were obtained legally/illegally https://www.statista.com/statistics/476461/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-legality-of-shooters-weapons/ (https://www.statista.com/statistics/476461/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-legality-of-shooters-weapons/)
83 of the mass shootings in the United States between 1982 and April 2021 involved weapons which were obtained legally; a clear majority. Only 16 incidents involved guns that were obtained illegally.
Types of guns https://www.statista.com/statistics/476409/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-weapon-types-used/ (https://www.statista.com/statistics/476409/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-weapon-types-used/)
Handguns are the most common weapon type used in mass shootings in the United States, with a total of 144 different handguns being used in 96 incidents between 1982 and April 2021. These figures are calculated from a total of 123 reported cases over this period, meaning handguns are involved in about 78 percent of mass shootings.
https://www.cga.ct.gov/2013/rpt/2013-r-0057.htm (https://www.cga.ct.gov/2013/rpt/2013-r-0057.htm)
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,Murica!!!
Texas set to allow unlicensed handgun carry despite outcry
https://apnews.com/article/texas-gun-politics-shootings-government-and-politics-28ef6e5ea8dd48a57114b67e5a885fad
AUSTIN, Texas (AP) — Texas is poised to remove one of its last major gun restrictions after lawmakers approved allowing people to carry handguns without a license, and the background check and training that go with it.
The Republican-dominated Legislature approved the measure Monday, sending it to Gov. Greg Abbott, who has said he will sign it despite the objections of law enforcement groups who say it would endanger the public and police.
So let's get this straight: The "law and order" party is saying Eff U to the police they purport to love, and they're gonna let anybody who wants to carry a handgun -- licensed or not, trained or not, ready or not -- carry 'em in public.
I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
What next? A mandate? "All Texans at least 6 years old MUST carry a handgun." Sure! Why not?!?!
Seriously, folks here have asked what kind of measures can we enact to help quell some of the gun violence, and there have been a lot of suggestions, and debate over those suggestions. I like to think most of us agree that we probably DON'T need are even more lax rules that turn America even more into the Wild Wild West.
Or maybe we don't agree. More guns, baby! That's what makes 'Murica great!
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Multiple people killed in San Jose shooting
https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/05/26/active-shooter-response-underway-near-san-jose-vta-light-rail-yard/
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,Murica!!!
Texas set to allow unlicensed handgun carry despite outcry
https://apnews.com/article/texas-gun-politics-shootings-government-and-politics-28ef6e5ea8dd48a57114b67e5a885fad
AUSTIN, Texas (AP) — Texas is poised to remove one of its last major gun restrictions after lawmakers approved allowing people to carry handguns without a license, and the background check and training that go with it.
The Republican-dominated Legislature approved the measure Monday, sending it to Gov. Greg Abbott, who has said he will sign it despite the objections of law enforcement groups who say it would endanger the public and police.
So let's get this straight: The "law and order" party is saying Eff U to the police they purport to love, and they're gonna let anybody who wants to carry a handgun -- licensed or not, trained or not, ready or not -- carry 'em in public.
I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
What next? A mandate? "All Texans at least 6 years old MUST carry a handgun." Sure! Why not?!?!
Seriously, folks here have asked what kind of measures can we enact to help quell some of the gun violence, and there have been a lot of suggestions, and debate over those suggestions. I like to think most of us agree that we probably DON'T need are even more lax rules that turn America even more into the Wild Wild West.
Or maybe we don't agree. More guns, baby! That's what makes 'Murica great!
To be fair, Texas ranks a mere 26th in firearm mortality rate, and they won't stand for playing second fiddle to the likes of Oklahoma and Mississippi.
Looking at this list, it's almost as if the states in the top half mostly have something in common, as do the states closer to the bottom. Can't quite put my finger on what this is, though.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm
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It is a model that worked so well in the 1880's and 1890's, it's about time they reinstated it. Heehaw!
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I didn't realize that 60% of all firearm deaths are suicide
https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html (https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html)
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Multiple people killed in San Jose shooting
https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/05/26/active-shooter-response-underway-near-san-jose-vta-light-rail-yard/
It's the fault of...vaccinations!
https://twitter.com/justinbaragona/status/1397582489980395522
"This seems like a weird takeaway from the San Jose mass shooting.
Retired NYPD detective Pat Brosnan on Fox News: "Once covid starts to lift, these cowardly shooters will come out exactly in tandem with the number of vaccinations. You can be sure they probably got vaccinated."
This is what people like rocket hear hour-after-hour, day-after-day.
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I didn't realize that 60% of all firearm deaths are suicide
https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html (https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html)
"I was stunned to learn that a firearm in the home is many times more likely to be used to harm someone who lives there than to protect someone who lives there," said nobody who's paying attention.
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"I was stunned to learn that a firearm in the home is many times more likely to be used to harm someone who lives there than to protect someone who lives there," said nobody who's paying attention.
That's not at all what I was saying. I actually figured there would be more spousal homicide than suicide, couple that with the mass shootings, and gang violence, and it shows me that there is huge mental health issue. At the bare minimum, Red Flag laws need to be stronger, and enforced..
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Multiple people killed in San Jose shooting
https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/05/26/active-shooter-response-underway-near-san-jose-vta-light-rail-yard/
You know what this means ... now is not the time to talk about common-sense gun laws that 80-90% of Americans want.
Nope, now's the time for brats and pears.
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That's not at all what I was saying. I actually figured there would be more spousal homicide than suicide, couple that with the mass shootings, and gang violence, and it shows me that there is huge mental health issue. At the bare minimum, Red Flag laws need to be stronger, and enforced..
Don't you think there is also a, you know, gun issue?
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That's not at all what I was saying. I actually figured there would be more spousal homicide than suicide, couple that with the mass shootings, and gang violence, and it shows me that there is huge mental health issue. At the bare minimum, Red Flag laws need to be stronger, and enforced..
Are mental health issues more prevalent in the US than other first world nations?
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Are mental health issues more prevalent in the US than other first world nations?
yes, treatment is horrible as well, especially for the underserved.
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries (https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries)
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yes, treatment is horrible as well, especially for the underserved.
https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries (https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2020/may/mental-health-conditions-substance-use-comparing-us-other-countries)
So we are different than others because of mental health and increased access to guns while also have lack of support.
But we, as a society, refuse to seriously address any of the issues.
Sweet
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That's not at all what I was saying. I actually figured there would be more spousal homicide than suicide, couple that with the mass shootings, and gang violence, and it shows me that there is huge mental health issue. At the bare minimum, Red Flag laws need to be stronger, and enforced..
Sorry, didn't mean to suggest you were saying that.
I was just pointing out the facts about what most often happens when guns are kept in the home "for protection."
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So we are different than others because of mental health and increased access to guns while also have lack of support.
But we, as a society, refuse to seriously address any of the issues.
Sweet
Yep, we're on the same page. It's a perfect storm.
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Sorry, didn't mean to suggest you were saying that.
I was just pointing out the facts about what most often happens when guns are kept in the home "for protection."
No worries, I agree with you. I have never owned a gun.
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No, it’s centuries of America failing to come to terms with its original sin.
i'm sure you already knew this, but just for a little refresher-centuries of "america failing to come to terms?? we righted a very terrible wrong and outlawed it by enacting the 13th amendment. but a nasty little secret? it's going on in china full blast as we speak while nothing is being done. unfortunately dwade and a number of other african american players don't seem to mind...shame on these guys. oh, you knew that too?
https://www.intellectualtakeout.org/article/native-americans-who-owned-slaves/
"While many Native American nations allowed white slaves to earn their freedom through intermarriage, the tribes also had strict laws forbidding any intermarriage between a Native and a black slave, often punishing those who married their slaves with banishment from the tribe.
The Native slaveowners could also be horrifyingly brutal towards their black slaves"
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You know what this means ... now is not the time to talk about common-sense gun laws that 80-90% of Americans want.
I doubt this is true. I don't think you could get 80-90% of Americans to agree the sun rises in the east and sets in the west.
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Flags are at half-staff for the 6th time since Biden took office in January .. for 5 mass casualty events.
Brutal.
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i'm sure you already knew this, but just for a little refresher-centuries of "america failing to come to terms?? we righted a very terrible wrong and outlawed it by enacting the 13th amendment. but a nasty little secret? it's going on in china full blast as we speak while nothing is being done. unfortunately dwade and a number of other african american players don't seem to mind...shame on these guys. oh, you knew that too?
https://www.intellectualtakeout.org/article/native-americans-who-owned-slaves/
"While many Native American nations allowed white slaves to earn their freedom through intermarriage, the tribes also had strict laws forbidding any intermarriage between a Native and a black slave, often punishing those who married their slaves with banishment from the tribe.
The Native slaveowners could also be horrifyingly brutal towards their black slaves"
were you born a white victim, or have you just dedicated your life to white victimhood?
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San Jose shooter: another angry, middle-aged, white d-bag with easy access to guns.
https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2021/05/27/samuel-cassidy-gunman-vta-rail-yard-san-jose/
Which of course means it's time to try to steer the conversation to Black-on-Black violence in Chicago.
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were you born a white victim, or have you just dedicated your life to white victimhood?
there's nothing here about me. if anyone is the victim it's rio, but he needs to know the unfortunate commonality of slavery and the history of all men and societies. the difference between us and the rest is that we saw slavery and human rights abuses were wrong and outlawed them some people and other countries have not. we are not the bad people in this equation. were we perfect? not in the least, but we are constantly evolving to do the right thing. how about if we continue to denounce slavery in all of it's forms everywhere. if we do not denounce it, we advocate for it
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there's nothing here about me. if anyone is the victim it's rio, but he needs to know the unfortunate commonality of slavery and the history of all men and societies.
No other society had anything to the level of the Atlantic Triangular Slave trade.
the difference between us and the rest is that we saw slavery and human rights abuses were wrong and outlawed them some people and other countries have not.
We were one of the last major countries to outlaw it. And one of (the only?) to have legalized segregation of Whites and Blacks after outlawing it
how about if we continue to denounce slavery in all of it's forms everywhere. if we do not denounce it, we advocate for it
Agreed. Now I trust you've stopped buying all products made in China and have divested from all companies that do business in China, right? I also trust that you don't watch porn anymore as the industry is massively supported by sexual slavery?
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We were one of the last major countries to outlaw it. And one of (the only?) to have legalized segregation of Whites and Blacks after outlawing it
And I am pretty sure that we are the only country that had a significant portion of its citizenry take up an armed insurrection that killed hundreds of thousands of people in an attempt to save it.
The idea that the US was some sort of "moral leader" in fighting slavery shows a complete ignorance of history. We were fighting it for decades, and then still institutionalized racist laws and policies afterwards.
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there's nothing here about me. if anyone is the victim it's rio, but he needs to know the unfortunate commonality of slavery and the history of all men and societies. the difference between us and the rest is that we saw slavery and human rights abuses were wrong and outlawed them some people and other countries have not. we are not the bad people in this equation. were we perfect? not in the least, but we are constantly evolving to do the right thing. how about if we continue to denounce slavery in all of it's forms everywhere. if we do not denounce it, we advocate for it
See TAMU's and Sultan's comments. We all get that you simply don't get it. Your new screen name proves it, too.
Your commenting history shows you are a privileged, aggrieved, victimized white man. Maybe you can contribute to Central Park Karen's lawsuit, because she's right up your alley!
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/white-woman-who-called-911-black-man-last-year-central-n1268679
Anyhoo ... back to mass shootings. Is your solution to create a federal law matching Texas' new "Everybody Gets An Unlicensed Gun!" policy?
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We were one of the last major countries to outlaw it. And one of (the only?) to have legalized segregation of Whites and Blacks after outlawing it
South Africa
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nm
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South Africa
Fair, I think they qualify as a major country now though not at the time of the US abolishing slavery
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My town, a stretch of highway I'm on several times a week ...
An irate driver fired a bullet, shattering glass in another driver’s vehicle on I-485, Matthews police said.
The victim told police that the other driver shot out his windows on the I-485 Outer Loop between Providence Road and East John Street just before noon Tuesday, according to a police news release.
The bullet missed the victim, but the driver suffered minor injuries from the shattered glass, police said.
“The preliminary investigation of this case indicates that this stemmed from an incident of road rage,” according to the release.
The victim described the shooter as a 30- to 40-year-old, clean-shaven white man with “reddish hair.”
Police were searching for a vehicle believed to have been involved in the encounter — a white or silver 1996-2002 model Toyota 4Runner SUV with a North Carolina registration plate.
If only the victim had a gun, he could have shot back. What fun that would have been!
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SAN JOSE, Calif. (AP) -- The gunman who killed nine of his co-workers at a California rail yard had stockpiled weapons and ammunition at his home before setting the house on fire to coincide with the bloodshed at the workplace he seethed about for years, authorities said Friday.
Investigators found 12 guns and 25,000 rounds of ammunition at Samuel James Cassidy’s house, the Santa Clara County sheriff’s office said in a news release. They also turned up multiple cans of gasoline and suspected Molotov cocktails.
The cache at the home Cassidy burned using a timer or slow-burn device was on top of the three 9mm handguns he brought Wednesday to the Santa Clara Valley Transportation Authority in San Jose, authorities said. He also had 32 high-capacity magazines, some with 12 rounds.
The guns he used to open fire on his co-workers appear to be legal, officials said. They have not said how he obtained them.
Well of course they were legal! Just about any American can buy any number of guns and any amount of ammunition anytime he or she wants to. Because this is exactly what our founding fathers intended. Freedom!
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Guns are available to all because republicans want them available to all. That is not a partisan statement. It is a true statement.
Don’t ever believe the polls that show Rs want background checks, etc. it is not true.
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Guns are available to all because republicans want them available to all. That is not a partisan statement. It is a true statement.
Don’t ever believe the polls that show Rs want background checks, etc. it is not true.
So polls, that show Rs believing things you think are reprehensible, are legitimate, cause the numbers are what they are. But if they don’t, the polls aren’t true. Got it.
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So polls, that show Rs believing things you think are reprehensible, are legitimate, cause the numbers are what they are. But if they don’t, the polls aren’t true. Got it.
Yes. Rs vote vote for the proliferation of guns. They say they are against what they vote for. I don’t believe them. Actions are way stronger than words.
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A gun-loving judge appointed by George W. Bush just struck down California's ban on assault rifles, likening them to "Swiss Army knives."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/06/05/california-assault-weapons-ban-overturned/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F333b2b6%2F60bb98e69d2fdae302709c17%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F15%2F70%2F60bb98e69d2fdae302709c17
Perfect. I mean, who will ever forget the Columbine, Charleston, Vegas and Newton killers doing their handiwork with Swiss Army knives? I think they used either the spoon or corkscrew attachments.
What we really need in America is more and more and MORE guns, just as Archie Bunker said almost 50 years ago!
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A police officer shot his wife in the arm, so the state took his gun away.
Nine months later, the state gives his gun back.
You'll never guess what happened next.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/state-alabama-took-his-gun-away-when-authorities-gave-it-n1269234
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A police officer shot his wife in the arm, so the state took his gun away.
Nine months later, the state gives his gun back.
You'll never guess what happened next.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/state-alabama-took-his-gun-away-when-authorities-gave-it-n1269234
I guessed right.
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A police officer shot his wife in the arm, so the state took his gun away.
Nine months later, the state gives his gun back.
You'll never guess what happened next.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/state-alabama-took-his-gun-away-when-authorities-gave-it-n1269234
Women whose abusive partners own a gun are 5x more likely to be shot than women whose abusive partners don't own a gun, per the Department of Justice. I thought that people who wanted to commit crimes would find a way to commit them no matter what?
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Women whose abusive partners own a gun are 5x more likely to be shot than women whose abusive partners don't own a gun, per the Department of Justice. I thought that people who wanted to commit crimes would find a way to commit them no matter what?
I'm pretty sure domestic abuse is a crime, whether or not a gun is used.
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A police officer shot his wife in the arm, so the state took his gun away.
Nine months later, the state gives his gun back.
You'll never guess what happened next.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/state-alabama-took-his-gun-away-when-authorities-gave-it-n1269234
He was a “good” guy with a gun. He just had to get rid of a “bad” woman.
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I'm pretty sure domestic abuse is a crime, whether or not a gun is used.
Sigh...
Women whose abusive partners own a gun are 5x more likely to be shot than women whose abusive partners don't own a gun, per the Department of Justice. I thought that people who wanted to shoot people with a gun would find a way to get a gun and shoot them no matter what?
Better?
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I'm pretty sure domestic abuse is a crime, whether or not a gun is used.
I think we should all be grateful this man wasn't given a Swiss army knife instead of a firearm. We could have had yet another mass corkscrewing on our hands.
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Sigh...
Women whose abusive partners own a gun are 5x more likely to be shot than women whose abusive partners don't own a gun, per the Department of Justice. I thought that people who wanted to shoot people with a gun would find a way to get a gun and shoot them no matter what?
Better?
Well, in this case, there was a restraining order, so he was not legally entitled to possess a firearm. The way he found a way to get a gun illegally, was to ask for his back. The law is in place, just the incompetence of the courts and ALEA allowed this to happen.
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Well, in this case, there was a restraining order, so he was not legally entitled to possess a firearm. The way he found a way to get a gun illegally, was to ask for his back. The law is in place, just the incompetence of the courts and ALEA allowed this to happen.
I wasn't just talking about this case.
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Well, in this case, there was a restraining order, so he was not legally entitled to possess a firearm. The way he found a way to get a gun illegally, was to ask for his back. The law is in place, just the incompetence of the courts and ALEA allowed this to happen.
Not incompetence. Indifference.
Incompetence implies a failed effort to enforce the law. It appears there was no effort at all here.
So it goes in a country where we fetishsize guns and make firearm ownership sacrosanct even above life.
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2020 was the deadliest gun violence year in decades. So far, 2021 is worse.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/06/14/2021-gun-violence/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F339b774%2F60c784c29d2fdae3027dfe47%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F10%2F76%2F60c784c29d2fdae3027dfe47
The shootings have come at a relentless pace. Gun violence this year has cut through celebrations and funerals, places of work and houses of worship. It has taken lives at a grocery store and in a fast-food drive-through lane.
And most of all, it has unfolded on city streets and in family homes, away from the cameras and far from the national spotlight.
By almost every measure, 2021 has already been a terrible year for gun violence. Many fear it will get worse. Last weekend alone, more than 120 people died in shootings, according to the Gun Violence Archive, with three especially dangerous incidents in Austin, Chicago and Savannah, Ga., killing two and injuring at least 30.
Through the first five months of 2021, gunfire killed more than 8,100 people in the United States, about 54 lives lost per day, according to a Washington Post analysis of data from the Gun Violence Archive, a nonprofit research organization. That’s 14 more deaths per day than the average toll during the same period of the previous six years.
This year, the number of casualties, along with the overall number of shootings that have killed or injured at least one person, exceeds those of the first five months of 2020, which finished as the deadliest year of gun violence in at least two decades.
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How could dat bee, hey?
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More from the article:
Shootings have also increased in cities from Los Angeles to Chicago to Columbus, Ohio. In Philadelphia, officials are preparing for what could be the deadliest year in the city’s history. The mayor is holding regular updates on gun violence, reminiscent of weekly coronavirus briefings.
But the rise in gun violence is not just a big-city phenomenon. The number of gunfire deaths has also increased in suburban and rural areas, though the overall numbers are lower because of smaller populations.
Areas across the country saw an increase in gun deaths in 2020. High-population urban areas were the most affected, but residents in suburban and rural areas also experienced more gun violence.
Researchers note a number of factors they say are driving the upswing, including the unprecedented surge in gun sales. In 2020, a year of pandemic, protests and elections, people purchased more than 23 million guns, a 66 percent increase over 2019 sales, according to a Post analysis of federal data on gun background checks.
In January and February of 2021, people bought more guns than they did during either month of any previous year in which such purchases were recorded. In January alone, about 2.5 million guns were sold, the third-highest one-month total, behind only June and July of 2020.
Before 2020, gun-sales spikes coincided with elections and mass shootings, such as the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in late 2012. Last year, the numbers climbed during pandemic-induced shutdowns and again in the summer, with millions protesting a Minneapolis police officer’s murder of George Floyd.
Controlling for population, the analysis found the higher the jump in gun sales between 2019 and 2020, the higher the jump in gun violence that resulted in at least one death.
Michigan and Nevada were among the states with the largest per capita increase in gun sales and gun-related deaths, while Washington and Oklahoma saw their rates of gun violence stay relatively flat.
A large body of research shows gun availability increases the relative risk of fatal shootings, and Buggs co-authored a study last year that found an association between firearm purchases that spring and a statistically significant increase in firearm violence.
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How could dat bee, hey?
More guns usually equals more gun deaths.
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RGR and SWBI have been on a upward rip since the fall. Lot of people in the market for "protection" it seems
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How could dat bee, hey?
I'll give you 393,437,000 guesses
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RGR and SWBI have been on a upward rip since the fall. Lot of people in the market for "protection" it seems
I actually took a good long look at RGR when it was at 65 only a couple months ago. I couldn't ... um ... pull the trigger! Wish I had, it closed at 79 today.
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And I am pretty sure that we are the only country that had a significant portion of its citizenry take up an armed insurrection that killed hundreds of thousands of people in an attempt to save it.
The idea that the US was some sort of "moral leader" in fighting slavery shows a complete ignorance of history. We were fighting it for decades, and then still institutionalized racist laws and policies afterwards.
Fluffy, Hundreds of thousands sacrificed life and limb to end slavery . Less than 1% of America owned slaves, including thousands of Black and Native American slaveowners who fought for the Confederacy. Incidentally, the first recorded slave owner in America was a Black man in the 1600's. Slavery was ubiquitous in the world.
The Barbary pirates ,for example, captured more than a million europeans during the 17th and 18th Centuries and sold them into slavery including a famous raid on an Irish town where every denizen young and old were sold at the slave markets in Istanbul. It took Jefferson to send in the Marines and defeat Tripoli to leave ships alone and end that scourge. History has several sides to every tale.
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Silly me, I thought we were going to have a kinder, gentler country starting January 20, aina?
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4Ever we will be fine once we defund the police. The criminals will stop shooting beating and robbing people.
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my wife's decision to get one emanated from being physically assaulted by a homeless individual and the further proliferation of homeless camps springing up around the city which are not only tolerated but encouraged. It's sad that the best directions I can give someone to our condo, depending on the direction from which they are coming, is to "turn right after the homeless camp" or, "turn left and you'll pass the homeless camp on the left side of the street." I didn't discourage her from getting one.
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More guns usually equals more gun deaths.
False
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Fluffy, Hundreds of thousands sacrificed life and limb to end slavery . Less than 1% of America owned slaves, including thousands of Black and Native American slaveowners who fought for the Confederacy. Incidentally, the first recorded slave owner in America was a Black man in the 1600's. Slavery was ubiquitous in the world.
The Barbary pirates ,for example, captured more than a million europeans during the 17th and 18th Centuries and sold them into slavery including a famous raid on an Irish town where every denizen young and old were sold at the slave markets in Istanbul. It took Jefferson to send in the Marines and defeat Tripoli to leave ships alone and end that scourge. History has several sides to every tale.
Holy sh*t. Never thought I'd see the day when someone came to Scoop to "both sides" slavery. Well done.
Unfortunately, much of your post is nonsense.
"Less than 1% owned slaves" is an entirely false meme. To reach anything close to that number, one must count children, people who lived in states in which slavery was outlawed and slaves. So, yeah, slaves didn't own slaves. Great point you make there!
Now, when counting only the people who actually had the option to own slaves ...
Using Census data to research his book, Glatthaar calculated that 4.9 percent of people in the slaveholding states owned slaves, that 19.9 percent of family units in those states owned slaves, and that 24.9 percent of households owned slaves. (Households are a broader category than families.)
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2017/aug/24/viral-image/viral-post-gets-it-wrong-extent-slavery-1860/
"thousands of Black and Native American slaveowners who fought for the Confederacy."
Another falsehood. Blacks weren't even allowed to serve in combat units in the Confederacy, and there is zero evidence that more than a handful - much less "thousands" took up arms in defense of slavery.
"Some black Southerners aided the Confederacy. Most of these were forced to accompany their masters or were forced to toil behind the lines. Black men were not legally allowed to serve as combat soldiers in the Confederate Army--they were cooks, teamsters, and manual laborers. There were no black Confederate combat units in service during the war and no documentation whatsoever exists for any black man being paid or pensioned as a Confederate soldier, although some did receive pensions for their work as laborers."
"Whatever black combat service might have occurred during the war, it was not sanctioned by the Confederate government. Even beyond the Official Records, there is no known letter, diary entry, or any other primary source in which a Confederate mentions serving with black soldiers."
https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/black-confederates-truth-and-legend
But yeah, the Barbary Pirates .... ::)
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Fluffy, Hundreds of thousands sacrificed life and limb to end slavery . Less than 1% of America owned slaves, including thousands of Black and Native American slaveowners who fought for the Confederacy. Incidentally, the first recorded slave owner in America was a Black man in the 1600's. Slavery was ubiquitous in the world.
The Barbary pirates ,for example, captured more than a million europeans during the 17th and 18th Centuries and sold them into slavery including a famous raid on an Irish town where every denizen young and old were sold at the slave markets in Istanbul. It took Jefferson to send in the Marines and defeat Tripoli to leave ships alone and end that scourge. History has several sides to every tale.
None of this addressed my point. And are you actually trying to minimize…slavery???
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False
True.
Results. Gun ownership was a significant predictor of firearm homicide rates (incidence rate ratio = 1.009; 95% confidence interval = 1.004, 1.014). This model indicated that for each percentage point increase in gun ownership, the firearm homicide rate increased by 0.9%.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3828709/
"Among the 27 developed countries, there was a significant positive correlation between guns percapita per country and the rate of firearm-related deaths"
https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(13)00444-0/pdf
Researchers have established a strong link between gun ownership and gun deaths. The connection is clearest with suicide, but studies also say ownership rates play a statistically significant role in gun homicides.
https://projects.oregonlive.com/ucc-shooting/gun-ownership/
I'll provide more proof if you wish.
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Silly me, I thought we were going to have a kinder, gentler country starting January 20, aina?
It's been 159 days since a deadly insurrection on any capitol buildings.
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True.
Results. Gun ownership was a significant predictor of firearm homicide rates (incidence rate ratio = 1.009; 95% confidence interval = 1.004, 1.014). This model indicated that for each percentage point increase in gun ownership, the firearm homicide rate increased by 0.9%.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3828709/
"Among the 27 developed countries, there was a significant positive correlation between guns percapita per country and the rate of firearm-related deaths"
https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(13)00444-0/pdf
Researchers have established a strong link between gun ownership and gun deaths. The connection is clearest with suicide, but studies also say ownership rates play a statistically significant role in gun homicides.
https://projects.oregonlive.com/ucc-shooting/gun-ownership/
I'll provide more proof if you wish.
Duh.
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None of this addressed my point. And are you actually trying to minimize…slavery???
From the dude that has constantly posted racist things? Not surprising.
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False
Riiiiiiiight.
(https://images2.imgbox.com/97/14/y9xd8zHZ_o.jpg) (https://imgbox.com/y9xd8zHZ)
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Not a mass shooting, but a mask shooting ...
Cashier fatally shot after argument over face masks at Georgia supermarket, authorities say
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/06/14/face-mask-argument-georgia-supermaket-shooting-victims-suspect/7696567002/?utm_term=OZY&utm_campaign=pdb&utm_content=Wednesday_06.16.21&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email
DECATUR, Ga. – A grocery store cashier in the Atlanta area was killed and three other people were wounded Monday in a shooting that followed an argument over wearing face masks in the supermarket, authorities said.
DeKalb County Sheriff Melody Maddox said the shooting occurred inside the Big Bear Supermarket in Decatur while several people were inside the business. She said a female cashier was killed when a man opened fire.
“There was some confrontation, argument – I’m not sure exactly what – in reference to the wearing of masks, at which time the subject pulled out a weapon and shot the cashier,” Maddox said at a news conference. Maddox said she did not know the details of the argument.
The customer was identified as Victor Lee Tucker Jr., 30, of Palmetto, Georgia, according to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. The agency said preliminary information indicates that Tucker got into an argument with the cashier and left the store without making his purchase, but he immediately returned inside.
“Tucker walked directly back to the cashier, pulled out a handgun and shot her,” the Georgia Bureau of Investigation wrote in the news release.
According to other articles, Tucker had numerous prior arrests, including a 2018 case of battery, cruelty to children and obstruction of law enforcement.
But thank goodness his 2nd Amendment rights weren't infringed upon!
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Was the gun legal?
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The more I think about it the more I realize the whole "it's a persons fault not the gun" argument is pretty much iron clad, illogical, but iron clad. Literally everybody with a gun is good until they do something bad so if I take it away from someone based purely on potential I'm the A$$ but if they do something bad then conservatives can say it was just another rotten egg.
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The more I think about it the more I realize the whole "it's a persons fault not the gun" argument is pretty much iron clad, illogical, but iron clad. Literally everybody with a gun is good until they do something bad so if I take it away from someone based purely on potential I'm the A$$ but if they do something bad then conservatives can say it was just another rotten egg.
Right. It doesn't require any critical thinking at all. It's just black and white.
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Was the gun legal?
No account of the article that I've read so far has included that information.
It obviously was very available, though.
If only we had more guns!
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Was the gun legal?
Could be. Along with 393M+ others.
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No account of the article that I've read so far has included that information.
It obviously was very available, though.
If only we had more guns!
If it wasn't legal, how do you propose to get it out of his hands before this travesty happened?
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Could be. Along with 393M+ others.
Talking about this case specifically. Try to keep up.
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If it wasn't legal, how do you propose to get it out of his hands before this travesty happened?
Not gonna go into hypotheticals before we have all the facts.
But clearly, if only every man, woman and child had dozens of guns, there would never be any shootings!
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Not gonna go into hypotheticals before we have all the facts.
But clearly, if only every man, woman and child had dozens of guns, there would never be any shootings!
That's a great way to have a discussion. Is this how you act around people in real life?
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Talking about this case specifically. Try to keep up.
Me too
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Me too
He owned 393M guns?
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Not gonna go into hypotheticals before we have all the facts.
But clearly, if only every man, woman and child had dozens of guns, there would never be any shootings!
Nice work not going into hypotheticals.
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The more I think about it the more I realize the whole "it's a persons fault not the gun" argument is pretty much iron clad, illogical, but iron clad. Literally everybody with a gun is good until they do something bad so if I take it away from someone based purely on potential I'm the A$$ but if they do something bad then conservatives can say it was just another rotten egg.
Galway , maybe we should take peoples cars away because some drive drunk.
Lost in the rhetoric are the numerous cases where someone has protected themselves or property because they had a gun to defend themselves. Some studies suggest that may happen thousands of times per year.
It has been correctly stated above that suicide is the number one cause of gun death followed by gang violence. But i believe fists and clubs actually dwarf those numbers.
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None of this addressed my point. And are you actually trying to minimize…slavery???
Hardly minimizing the terrors of slavery just trying to mention that slavery wasn't invented by Europeans and
it was practiced far before America saw its ugliness.
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He owned 393M guns?
At least one of them.
I mean, let's stop the dance. Either you think the proliferation of guns in the U.S. is not a problem and/or you believe there is nothing that can be done about it, or you believe the opposite of those two things.
Every data point available indicates that reducing the number of firearms reduces the number of firearm deaths. There are dozens of suggestions on how to reduce the number of firearms in the country, many on this site, as well as how to make society safer both for gun owners and the general populace. But instead of focusing on that, you want to narrow the discussion to a single case in order, it would appear, to argue that it is a bridge too far to enact reasonable gun legislation. In the meantime, another 40 people are going to be murdered with firearms today.
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Galway , maybe we should take peoples cars away because some drive drunk.
Lost in the rhetoric are the numerous cases where someone has protected themselves or property because they had a gun to defend themselves. Some studies suggest that may happen thousands of times per year.
It has been correctly stated above that suicide is the number one cause of gun death followed by gang violence. But i believe fists and clubs actually dwarf those numbers.
We have more stringent requirements for cars than guns. Im all for mandatory training, supervised hours at a range, age restrictions, consistently having to update your gun license, liability insurance for the owner, take tests occasionally etc.
Also you believe more people die from fists and clubs than guns? :o i must have missed the great Las Vegas punch out where one guy punched 411 people and killed 60 with his fists. Hell I have two Golden gloves to my name and couldn't kill someone with my fists let alone have some type of breakdown where I went on a punching spree and took down a Crowd. Doubt even prime Tyson could (though he'd add his teeth)
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Galway , maybe we should take peoples cars away because some drive drunk.
This is such a silly analogy, yet people make it over and over again.
Cars exist to provide the mobility needed in modern American life. That some people choose to drive cars drunk, and that sometimes harms others, is an unfortunate side effect of cars' existence, not the reason they exist.
Non-sporting firearms - handguns and assault rifles in particular - exist for the purpose of killing other people. When someone takes an AR-15 into a grocery store and guns down a bunch of shoppers, that weapon is being used as was intended - to kill people.
It's a pretty simple to make the case that vehicles serve the greater good of society, despite the rare negative consequences of their existence. But how does allowing private citizens to own military-grade weaponry benefit society, especially in light of the consequences?
It has been correctly stated above that suicide is the number one cause of gun death followed by gang violence. But i believe fists and clubs actually dwarf those numbers.
You believe wrong. Very, very wrong.
In 2019, for example, more than 9,500 homicides in the U.S. were committed with firearms.
That same year, 600 people died as a result of beating with hands/fists/feet and 397 died from beatngs with blunt objects.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/195325/murder-victims-in-the-us-by-weapon-used/
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Hardly minimizing the terrors of slavery just trying to mention that slavery wasn't invented by Europeans and
it was practiced far before America saw its ugliness.
Again, didn't address my point in the least.
Rocket said: "the difference between us and the rest is that we saw slavery and human rights abuses were wrong and outlawed them."
My point is that the United States was actually late in the game when it came to outlawing slavery, AND we had to undertake a war that killed hundreds of thousands of American citizens to accomplish it. Of the countries of Europe and their former colonies, I believe Brazil was the only country to abolish slavery after the United States. And almost everywhere else it was done peacefully.
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At least one of them.
I mean, let's stop the dance. Either you think the proliferation of guns in the U.S. is not a problem and/or you believe there is nothing that can be done about it, or you believe the opposite of those two things.
Every data point available indicates that reducing the number of firearms reduces the number of firearm deaths. There are dozens of suggestions on how to reduce the number of firearms in the country, many on this site, as well as how to make society safer both for gun owners and the general populace. But instead of focusing on that, you want to narrow the discussion to a single case in order, it would appear, to argue that it is a bridge too far to enact reasonable gun legislation. In the meantime, another 40 people are going to be murdered with firearms today.
No, you are misinterpreting what I am saying. I believe the proliferation of guns is a serious problem, and there should be a solution. I was trying to focus on this case to see what happened here. Either he used an illegal gun or the laws are broken in Georgia that prohibits violent offenders from owning a gun. Heck, I would go as far as anything more than a speeding ticket=no gun.ownership, and your PO with the police and your attorney can do random checks of your home for guns.Spend time doing tjat instead of writing speeding tickets.
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Nice work not going into hypotheticals.
What? We clearly need more guns in America ... although I did learn today that we can all kill each other more efficiently with our fists!
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No, you are misinterpreting what I am saying. I believe the proliferation of guns is a serious problem, and there should be a solution. I was trying to focus on this case to see what happened here. Either he used an illegal gun or the laws are broken in Georgia that prohibits violent offenders from owning a gun. Heck, I would go as far as anything more than a speeding ticket=no gun.ownership, and your PO with the police and your attorney can do random checks of your home for guns.Spend time doing tjat instead of writing speeding tickets.
Fair enough then, I apologize for misinterpreting where you were going.
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Guns are just good clean fun. It’s especially charming how high speed bullets from assault rifles tear apart organs when they enter the body.
And, please, regarding earlier posts, let’s not pretend violent felons don’t have easy access to guns.
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Good thing we can keep every thread on topic and it doesn’t dissolve into partisan screeching, hyperbole, and posts that add nothing to the discussion. But I know I know “just don’t read”
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Guns are just good clean fun. It’s especially charming how high speed bullets from assault rifles tear apart organs when they enter the body.
And, please, regarding earlier posts, let’s not pretend violent felons don’t have easy access to guns.
I don't think anyone has claimed they don't. That's part of the problem, I believe. Either individuals who should be felons, and therefore not allowed to buy guns legally, are given a lesser offense to expedite the courts, or there are too many legal guns (mass purchased at gun shows with no background check) being sold to felons.
If we were to try to have a serious discussion here, every gun needs to be registered. If you are convicted of certain level of crime, the courts can come into your home and take away your guns. Bullets cannot be bought without showing proof of a registered handgun. No need to have any type of assault rifles. Mandatory life sentences for committing a crime with a gun.
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I don't think anyone has claimed they don't. That's part of the problem, I believe. Either individuals who should be felons, and therefore not allowed to buy guns legally, are given a lesser offense to expedite the courts, or there are too many legal guns (mass purchased at gun shows with no background check) being sold to felons.
If we were to try to have a serious discussion here, every gun needs to be registered. If you are convicted of certain level of crime, the courts can come into your home and take away your guns. Bullets cannot be bought without showing proof of a registered handgun. No need to have any type of assault rifles. Mandatory life sentences for committing a crime with a gun.
I think we agree other than the last point. Although there should be a minimum mandatory sentence that gets added onto the sentence for the crime.
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Fair enough then, I apologize for misinterpreting where you were going.
No worries. I misinterpret stuff all the time, and I am not always the most clear on my points.
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I don't think anyone has claimed they don't. That's part of the problem, I believe. Either individuals who should be felons, and therefore not allowed to buy guns legally, are given a lesser offense to expedite the courts, or there are too many legal guns (mass purchased at gun shows with no background check) being sold to felons.
If we were to try to have a serious discussion here, every gun needs to be registered. If you are convicted of certain level of crime, the courts can come into your home and take away your guns. Bullets cannot be bought without showing proof of a registered handgun. No need to have any type of assault rifles. Mandatory life sentences for committing a crime with a gun.
I'm going to add one more layer: liability if your gun is found to have been used in the commission of a crime or confiscated from someone other than you.
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I'm going to add one more layer: liability if your gun is found to have been used in the commission of a crime or confiscated from someone other than you.
What if your gun was stolen? And what kind of liability? Civil? Criminal? Would I be charged with a crime if a criminal steals my gun and gets arrested holding up a liquor store two hours later?
At the end of the day, we can propose all the reasonable restrictions we want, but as long as the vastly oversized influence of the NRA exists in American politics, nothing is going to change.
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Since Walt Disney World reopened from its Covid closure, 14 people have been caught trying to enter with guns.
Cuz nuthin says “Happiest Place On Earth” better than a loaded Glock!
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What if your gun was stolen? And what kind of liability? Civil? Criminal? Would I be charged with a crime if a criminal steals my gun and gets arrested holding up a liquor store two hours later?
I think a critical element of responsible gun ownership would be knowing where your gun/guns were at all times and reporting them lost or stolen ASAP. If you don’t, and something happens with your gun, tough
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What if your gun was stolen? And what kind of liability? Civil? Criminal? Would I be charged with a crime if a criminal steals my gun and gets arrested holding up a liquor store two hours later?
At the end of the day, we can propose all the reasonable restrictions we want, but as long as the vastly oversized influence of the NRA exists in American politics, nothing is going to change.
I've always been told the NRA was a GOP thing. Now's the time to test that theory.
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What if your gun was stolen? And what kind of liability? Civil? Criminal? Would I be charged with a crime if a criminal steals my gun and gets arrested holding up a liquor store two hours later?
At the end of the day, we can propose all the reasonable restrictions we want, but as long as the vastly oversized influence of the NRA exists in American politics, nothing is going to change.
definitely something to think about. That's where proper storage comes into effect. If it's stolen, report it. Of course, one could falsely report a gun stolen.
I got thinking about this after reading that 95% of guns confiscated in Chicago are not registered to the individual to whom it was registered or sold to. That would crackdown on strawman buyers.
It's not perfect but a start.
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I think a critical element of responsible gun ownership would be knowing where your gun/guns were at all times and reporting them lost or stolen ASAP. If you don’t, and something happens with your gun, tough
Hmmm. I just don't think it's feasible, at least not criminally. A civil suit alleging negligence, sure, but that already can be done. Most criminal law - especially if alleging culpability for the behavior of another - requires some knowledge of criminal intent.
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Hmmm. I just don't think it's feasible, at least not criminally. A civil suit alleging negligence, sure, but that already can be done. Most criminal law - especially if alleging culpability for the behavior of another - requires some knowledge of criminal intent.
What’s the consequences or procedure if the same happens with a car that is not reported stolen?
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Locks on every new gun sold. Make it like unlocking your phone. It takes a swipe and 6 numbers before you can fire. As many hours of training and classes as are required to drive a car. Serial numbers on every bullet. Raise the taxes on it like they did on tobacco products. Make it an obscenely expensive obsession. Quit selling guns at retail stores. Only through state run outlets, like they do alcohol in some states. Have no product on site. So the processes have to be observed in order to get a very expensive mechanism of death in 7-10 days. And the guns come from heavily guarded vaults to cut down on break-ins.
You can still belong to the gun cult, errrrr, get to enjoy your second amendment rights. But you pay a lot of money to participate and you have to observe all of the rules.
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What’s the consequences or procedure if the same happens with a car that is not reported stolen?
None. There's no legal obligation to report your car stolen, or to do anything to prevent its theft.
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Locks on every new gun sold. Make it like unlocking your phone. It takes a swipe and 6 numbers before you can fire. As many hours of training and classes as are required to drive a car. Serial numbers on every bullet. Raise the taxes on it like they did on tobacco products. Make it an obscenely expensive obsession. Quit selling guns at retail stores. Only through state run outlets, like they do alcohol in some states. Have no product on site. So the processes have to be observed in order to get a very expensive mechanism of death in 7-10 days. And the guns come from heavily guarded vaults to cut down on break-ins.
You can still belong to the gun cult, errrrr, get to enjoy your second amendment rights. But you pay a lot of money to participate and you have to observe all of the rules.
The latest trend in getting your drivers license is to either have the driver training school sign off on your license or have the parent just sign off that the kid is ready to drive. Just sayin.
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That's dumb, too.
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The latest trend in getting your drivers license is to either have the driver training school sign off on your license or have the parent just sign off that the kid is ready to drive. Just sayin.
Wasn't that a Covid thing, Zig? I think that's how they framed it in NC, anyway.
And as tower said ... dumb.
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The latest trend in getting your drivers license is to either have the driver training school sign off on your license or have the parent just sign off that the kid is ready to drive. Just sayin.
There's been parents skirting the rules on that stuff for years. My best friend maybe did 10hours overall. I wouldn't say it's the trend so much as there's always holes people will find.
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Locks on every new gun sold. Make it like unlocking your phone. It takes a swipe and 6 numbers before you can fire. As many hours of training and classes as are required to drive a car. Serial numbers on every bullet. Raise the taxes on it like they did on tobacco products. Make it an obscenely expensive obsession. Quit selling guns at retail stores. Only through state run outlets, like they do alcohol in some states. Have no product on site. So the processes have to be observed in order to get a very expensive mechanism of death in 7-10 days. And the guns come from heavily guarded vaults to cut down on break-ins.
You can still belong to the gun cult, errrrr, get to enjoy your second amendment rights. But you pay a lot of money to participate and you have to observe all of the rules.
you're from MI, right? And you went to college in WI, correct? Are hunters who use shotguns a cult?
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Make them go through training, heavily tax guns and ammo. And locks for their long guns. Just like everybody else.
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Wasn't that a Covid thing, Zig? I think that's how they framed it in NC, anyway.
And as tower said ... dumb.
Started out that way. But states are passing laws making that permanent.
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Started out that way. But states are passing laws making that permanent.
Thanks.
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I think we agree other than the last point. Although there should be a minimum mandatory sentence that gets added onto the sentence for the crime.
Many states already have laws like this, especially for convicted felons committing a crime with a gun. However, those are usually the first changes that get dropped. Laws are only as good as how diligently they're prosecuted... except those which restrict law abiding citizens (since by definition they follow the law).
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The clown of a judge who likened AR-15s to "Swiss Army knives" thankfully had his recent ruling about the constitutionality of California's assault rifle ban overturned by an appeals court.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/06/22/california-assault-weapons-ban-blocked/?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most&carta-url=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F33f4cc2%2F60d20a139d2fdae3028a41b2%2F5f8d147cae7e8a56e5b732a4%2F22%2F74%2F60d20a139d2fdae3028a41b2
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Make them go through training, heavily tax guns and ammo. And locks for their long guns. Just like everybody else.
this is includes everyone? tax stamps for all ammo maybe? what do you propose for penalties? more "gun free zones" ?
gang bangers loving all of this...
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this is includes everyone? tax stamps for all ammo maybe? what do you propose for penalties? more "gun free zones" ?
gang bangers loving all of this...
gang bangers … you’re really something.
you forgot antifa and blm.
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gang bangers … you’re really something.
you forgot antifa and blm.
Insurrectionists would love it, too, as we’ve seen.
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Insurrectionists would love it, too, as we’ve seen.
Now be fair, Unk. To our knowledge, most of the seditionists who attacked the U.S. Capitol at the behest of their god did so without guns. Some in the violent cult even used flagpoles carrying the American flag to beat cops senseless -- very creative! Others set up nooses to "Hang Mike Pence! Hang Mike Pence!"
Law and order, don'tcha know.
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Now be fair, Unk. To our knowledge, most of the seditionists who attacked the U.S. Capitol at the behest of their god did so without guns. Some in the violent cult even used flagpoles carrying the American flag to beat cops senseless -- very creative! Others set up nooses to "Hang Mike Pence! Hang Mike Pence!"
Law and order, don'tcha know.
""to your knowledge"?? i'm still waiting for the 10,000 hours of video and the name of the cop who killed the lone innocent person. the only good thing was she was white or BLM and anitfa would have burned the capital down like the police precincts in other cities. careful of what you've heard so far because there's oh so much more to this "incident" than you are making it up to be. usually "journalists" try to gather as much factual info as they can before wetting their collective skirts. as long as the (mis)information fits a narrative and an agenda, it's put out there as "fact" this one incident cannot hole a candle to the hundreds of "peaceful protests" held around the country for over a year-many more deaths and dollars worth of destruction, people's businesses trashed, lives ruined, classic not letting a crisis go to waste here at the expense of "journalism"
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""to your knowledge"?? i'm still waiting for the 10,000 hours of video and the name of the cop who killed the lone innocent person. the only good thing was she was white or BLM and anitfa would have burned the capital down like the police precincts in other cities. careful of what you've heard so far because there's oh so much more to this "incident" than you are making it up to be. usually "journalists" try to gather as much factual info as they can before wetting their collective skirts. as long as the (mis)information fits a narrative and an agenda, it's put out there as "fact" this one incident cannot hole a candle to the hundreds of "peaceful protests" held around the country for over a year-many more deaths and dollars worth of destruction, people's businesses trashed, lives ruined, classic not letting a crisis go to waste here at the expense of "journalism"
That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever read on scoop.
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That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever read on scoop.
It’s also the scariest. People actually believe that nonsense.
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""to your knowledge"?? i'm still waiting for the 10,000 hours of video and the name of the cop who killed the lone innocent person. the only good thing was she was white or BLM and anitfa would have burned the capital down like the police precincts in other cities. careful of what you've heard so far because there's oh so much more to this "incident" than you are making it up to be. usually "journalists" try to gather as much factual info as they can before wetting their collective skirts. as long as the (mis)information fits a narrative and an agenda, it's put out there as "fact" this one incident cannot hole a candle to the hundreds of "peaceful protests" held around the country for over a year-many more deaths and dollars worth of destruction, people's businesses trashed, lives ruined, classic not letting a crisis go to waste here at the expense of "journalism"
perfect. the only thing you left out was that the deadly insurrection at the capitol actually was perpetrated by antifa, dressed up like your god's cultists.
doQter rocQet, you're a lost cause.
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That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever read on scoop.
You only need wait until his next post
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perfect. the only thing you left out was that the deadly insurrection at the capitol actually was perpetrated by antifa, dressed up like your god's cultists.
doQter rocQet, you're a lost cause.
I kinda think it is awesome that a violent attempt to overthrow the U.S. Government and hang the Vice President (of the same party as the insurrectionists no less!) is dismissed by these benighted, willingly brainwashed fools as "one incident".
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Back to guns ...
Biden is at least trying to address the horrors that the Wild Wild West gun culture have unleashed on our great democratic republic.
https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-health-coronavirus-pandemic-laws-crime-6e67362305041e7c889d8fd160e091e3?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=June24_MorningWire&utm_term=Morning%20Wire%20Subscribers
Will any of them "work"? If the only way to measure it working is by having all gun violence cease, then no. But if it saves a few lives, gets a few dirty gun dealers in trouble, keeps a few guns out of a few mentally unstable people's hands, and moves forward important conversations on this topic, it will have "worked," even if only incrementally.
And BTW, not only doesn't it "defund the police," it adds funding for local police forces -- in part to help them pay for ways to avoid needlessly violent confrontations with the public.
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That’s the stupidest thing I’ve ever read on scoop.
Apparently you are not familiar with rocketbrain. Your statement would be appropriate for at least half of his posts.
It is good to know, though, who amongst us supports the overthrow of the U.S. government.
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this one incident cannot hole a candle to the hundreds of "peaceful protests" held around the country for over a year-many more deaths and dollars worth of destruction, people's businesses trashed, lives ruined, classic not letting a crisis go to waste here at the expense of "journalism"
The difference of course being the one was an attempt to overthrow our democracy and the other is a reaction to hundreds of years of oppression. Both actions are wrong and the scale of the second is larger than the first, but the first is much more concerning. I can both condemn and empathize with the rioters. I can only condemn the insurrectionists.
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Some Scoopers promised that there would be no protests, riots, or violence if Sleepy Joe won, only if Our Lord and Savior Donald Trump won because snowflake liberals cannot accept things not going their way. So of course they're going to ignore the insurrection. It wasn't going to happen. Conservatives were going to just tip their cap to a hard fought campaign and congratulate Sleepy Joe on his well earned victory.
Or something like that.
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I haven't been keeping up here, but this seems to be off the rails and clearly political at this point.