MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on January 27, 2020, 01:19:41 PM
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I was thinking about this the other day with regards to the last MU coaching search. What has been the moment as a sports fan that has caused you to get excited about the future, only to turn out to not come close to meeting expectations?
For instance, mine was when the Packers hired Forrest Gregg as head coach. Former Packer who lead the Bengals to the Super Bowl - I thought for sure the Packers were going to turn around under his leadership. That did not happen.
Also when the Bucks won the draft lottery for Glenn Robinson. I was confident he was going to be their next great player. I pictured him doing Giannis things before I knew what Giannis things were. He ended up being a decent player but nope...
Conversely, I was very excited when I heard that former Giants HC Bill Parcells had turned down the coaching gig in Tampa and was the leading candidate to work for newly hired Packer GM Ron Wolf. Only to be disappointed when Wolf hired Mike Holmgren instead. That turned out well.
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Pretty much anything the Bucks did from 1992-2018, outside of drafting Giannis.
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I expected the signing of Charles Woodson to be a terrible decision. I am happy to eat crow on that one.
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Easy. Trevor Mbakwe.
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Mark Prior.
After the 2003 season, he looked destine to be the Cubs ace for the next decade. At that time, it would have been extremely difficult to believe that his career would be over just three years later.
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Jabari Parker. I thought he needed to be Batman for the Bucks to turn into a real title contender. Oops!
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After winning the '05 Series, the White Sox went out and added a couple of all-stars (Jim Thome and Javier Vasquez), re-signed Paul Konerko to a long-term deal and looked to be set up to contend for the next 3-5 years.
They've won one playoff game since.
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After winning the '05 Series, the White Sox went out and added a couple of all-stars (Jim Thome and Javier Vasquez), re-signed Paul Konerko to a long-term deal and looked to be set up to contend for the next 3-5 years.
They've won one playoff game since.
You're right. That is bad.
i thought Lou Piniella would bring the Cubs a WS.
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The Bucks signing Anthony Mason was going to put them over the hump. It did not.
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Those are all really good Fluff. I've got to think on some times I was clearly wrong. They're so darn numerous it's hard to come up with the best. But I remember being 'right' twice. I thought both Drew Brees and Russell Wilson would be stars and couldn't believe GMs didn't pick 'em early. I have decided that I'm a QB guru as a result. I didn't need teal, did I?
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The jury is still out but for many wearing Blue it is one word: Harbaugh
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Rex Grossman, Rashaan Salaam, Curtis Enis, Curtis Conway, Cade McNown, David Terrell, Cedric Benson, Kevin White...
Marc Trestman
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I got it. I got it. I remember exactly where I was and being very excited when Vanilla Soft Serve announced his verbal commitment.
Shame.
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The jury is still out but for many wearing Blue it is one word: Harbaugh
How do alums view this? Poor record vs OSU. Haven't won the conference. Haven't made the playoff.
Has he been that much more successful than his predecessors or others who were targeted in the same hiring season?
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The jury is still out but for many wearing Blue it is one word: Harbaugh
Good God the irony on this is so rich.
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Good God the irony on this is so rich.
Jury is too busy on Wojo ;D ;D ;D
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Rex Grossman, Rashaan Salaam, Curtis Enis, Curtis Conway, Cade McNown, David Terrell, Cedric Benson, Kevin White...
Marc Trestman
Curtis Conway does not belong on that list. He had a very solid NFL career.
As for the rest, yes. Replace Conway with Mitch.
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The Lions hiring Bobby Ross and Steve Mariucci.
The Lions drafting Joey Harrington.
The Tigers in the 2006 World Series.
Dameon Mason.
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How do alums view this? Poor record vs OSU. Haven't won the conference. Haven't made the playoff.
Has he been that much more successful than his predecessors or others who were targeted in the same hiring season?
Honestly? I think its humbled even the proudest of Michigan Men^TM. Everyone's getting restless, but to what end? If Harbaugh can't do it, whats the next move? I think its starting to reset expectations. And that's fine! Michigan has still been very good!
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How do alums view this? Poor record vs OSU. Haven't won the conference. Haven't made the playoff.
Has he been that much more successful than his predecessors or others who were targeted in the same hiring season?
The candidates that year were Jim Harbaugh, Jim Harbaugh, and Jim Harbaugh.
Based on RichRod and Hoke, he has been more successful. He's beaten Michigan State and gone to Jan 1 bowl games. But, he still hasn't been to a Big Ten title game or the playoff, whereas OSU and MSU have. Definitely, the Wolvies set themselves up for disappointment as many (the ones who the only time they've ever set foot on a college campus is for a football game) though Harbaugh would never lose a game. Others still had outsized expectations but couldn't foresee OSU being at the ridiculously high level they have reached. At least he's beaten MSU.
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Honestly? I think its humbled even the proudest of Michigan Men^TM. Everyone's getting restless, but to what end? If Harbaugh can't do it, whats the next move? I think its starting to reset expectations. And that's fine! Michigan has still been very good!
I'd love to sit down and listen to any cross-over Michigan football+Marquette basketball fans discuss those respective sports/head coaches/recent success.
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The candidates that year were Jim Harbaugh, Jim Harbaugh, and Jim Harbaugh.
Based on RichRod and Hoke, he has been more successful. He's beaten Michigan State and gone to Jan 1 bowl games. But, he still hasn't been to a Big Ten title game or the playoff, whereas OSU and MSU have. Definitely, the Wolvies set themselves up for disappointment as many (the ones who the only time they've ever set foot on a college campus is for a football game) though Harbaugh would never lose a game. Others still had outsized expectations but couldn't foresee OSU being at the ridiculously high level they have reached. At least he's beaten MSU.
I'm not a Michigan fan and don't have much of an opinion on Harbaugh either way, but I think he's gotten a mostly unfair rap, partially because he was viewed as the second coming and a savior. He took over a program that had went 20-18 the previous 3 seasons and made them competitive again right away. No he hasn't beat OSU, but nobody really has. When he took over Michigan in that abysmal state, OSU was coming off a National Championship, ahead of schedule, and was lead by one of the top 5, if not top 3, CFB coaches of all time. There is not a coach in the country that is going to be consistently successful against that outside of Dabo and Saban right now.
Especially if Michigan wants to play old school rough and tumble football against the modern lightning attack of OSU, they are gonna struggle, just like UW and others.
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I'm not a Michigan fan and don't have much of an opinion on Harbaugh either way, but I think he's gotten a mostly unfair rap, partially because he was viewed as the second coming and a savior. He took over a program that had went 20-18 the previous 3 seasons and made them competitive again right away. No he hasn't beat OSU, but nobody really has. When he took over Michigan in that abysmal state, OSU was coming off a National Championship, ahead of schedule, and was lead by one of the top 5, if not top 3, CFB coaches of all time. There is not a coach in the country that is going to be consistently successful against that outside of Dabo and Saban right now.
Especially if Michigan wants to play old school rough and tumble football against the modern lightning attack of OSU, they are gonna struggle, just like UW and others.
This. He's righted the ship, and Michigan wins when they are favorites and loses when they are underdogs. I think it'd be nice if they keep climbing a bit and are consistent favorites against the other non-tOSU big ten. And I think that tOSU will slowly start to come back to Earth, too. They are on an unreal run, but odds are that they will regress at least a little post-Urban.
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Big 3 in Minnesota.. KG, Spree, Sam Cassell.. great regular season, MVP, Western Conf finals.. I'm at the Target Center watching the Lakers against us.. and thinking.. 'yeah, finally we've made it'..
Since then, it's shocking how absolutely awful the franchise has been.
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Angels with Pujols. Got the best record within a few years, but ran into the Royals in the post season. The window closed.
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This. He's righted the ship, and Michigan wins when they are favorites and loses when they are underdogs. I think it'd be nice if they keep climbing a bit and are consistent favorites against the other non-tOSU big ten. And I think that tOSU will slowly start to come back to Earth, too. They are on an unreal run, but odds are that they will regress at least a little post-Urban.
He's got to find and develop a QB. He's pretty much started all transfers. The only starters he's had who committed to Michigan out of HS were Speight (benched and transferred) and Peters (transferred).
Shea Patterson would be one of those "expectation v. reality" guys for UM fans, especially after he got the immediate eligibility waiver.
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Rex Grossman, Rashaan Salaam, Curtis Enis, Curtis Conway, Cade McNown, David Terrell, Cedric Benson, Kevin White...
Marc Trestman
Slight take on this: That the Bears would have a franchise QB outside of Sid Luckman.
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How do alums view this? Poor record vs OSU. Haven't won the conference. Haven't made the playoff.
Has he been that much more successful than his predecessors or others who were targeted in the same hiring season?
Similar to Green Bay fans vis-à-vis the Bears, a U of M season is good when we beat Ohio. The single biggest disappointment for Michigan alums has been our inability to be consistently competitive against them.
The expectations for Harbaugh were unrealistically high and while he has returned the program to be able to win at the highest level the lack of Big Ten titles or BCS participation is problematic for him.
But here's the bottom line: Harbaugh will remain the Michigan coach for the next decade and beyond. He wins, runs a clean program, his athletes are graduated from a top university, and he has a goofy charm that resonates with exuberantly enthusiastic alumni. More important is that he's a Michigan Man (hell, he went to Pioneer High School which is across the street from The Big House.)
Contrast that with Ohio: the last two coaches have resigned under questionable circumstances, their football team sits at the very bottom of Big Ten graduation rates at an average university but they play for national championships.
Frankly, what happens in Columbus would never be tolerated in Ann Arbor. Nor should they be.
People expected Harbaugh to make Michigan the next Alabama or LSU. Thank God the administration would never pay the price of admission for SEC-style "success."
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I'd love to sit down and listen to any cross-over Michigan football+Marquette basketball fans discuss those respective sports/head coaches/recent success.
Comparing Wojo to Harbaugh is specious. And it isn't fair to Wojo.
Harbaugh built programs everywhere he has been: USD, Stanford, Niners.
And he took over a program that, under Rich Rod and Hoke, continued to attract elite talent but couldn't win. In fact, Michigan football was not merely lacking direction but was losing its mystique.
With Harbaugh, Michigan wins. Both on and off the field. They are competitive on any given Saturday, merchandise sales are better than ever, Wolverines continue to go to the NFL, and enthusiasm remains high.
Harbaugh arrived with bona fides. Wojo has not yet established his as a head coach.
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Mayo gaelic football the past decade. Probably the greatest squad to never win a title. And arguably one of the all time greatest squads but came on when the all time best was put together lost 4 times in the championship and 4 more semi final losses.
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I thought Doc Rivers would lead Marquette back to the promised land (or something close to it).
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I thought Doc Rivers would lead Marquette back to the promised land (or something close to it).
Lenny
Lucky Lloyd had Luke, Bo, Tatum, and Marcus then Tatum, Butch, Bo, and Whitehead.
Jimmy Boylan had Butch, Bo, Jerome, and Toone.
Glenn had Schlundt, Marotta, Lazzeretti, Smolinski, and Lloyd Moore.
How you say...sow's ear / silk purse??
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Mark Prior.
After the 2003 season, he looked destine to be the Cubs ace for the next decade. At that time, it would have been extremely difficult to believe that his career would be over just three years later.
That's a good one. I remember old-timey baseball types waxing poetic about his "perfect throwing motion" that would keep him injury-free for a decade or more. Oops.
I thought Doc Rivers would lead Marquette back to the promised land (or something close to it).
Excellent choice. I was SOOO excited when Rick landed Glenn. Whether he was a little overhyped, wasn't surrounded by enough talent, was poorly coached or, most likely, a combination of those, it just didn't happen for us with him.
Related: Majerus. I was beyond thrilled when Hank stepped down and Rick took over. I thought for sure he'd sign one great recruit after another and lead us back to the promised land.
And Dan Marino. I was a big Dolphins fan growing up because, like many kids, I gravitated to the best team. I still can name the entire starting lineup (and most reserves) for the 1972-73 Dolphins. When Marino fell into their laps in the 1983 draft, I was ecstatic. He took the Dolphins to the Super Bowl in his record-setting second season, and there was no more exciting show in football. The Dolphins lost, but I was sure "we" would get back numerous times and win at least a couple of them. Never got there again. Marino obviously went on to have a great career, but had very little postseason success.
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Lenny
Love Doc, but overall big disappointment to me at MU. One shot made it a bit less of a disappointment.
Crash
You are right to some degree, but I thought Doc did not come close to expectations. I am with Lenny on this one.
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Red Sox post 1975. They had in or entering their prime Carlton Fisk, Cecil Cooper, Rick Burleson, Jim Rice, Fred Lynn, Dwight Evans, plus still very good Carl Yastrzemski, Luis Tiant, Rick Wise, Bill Lee, Dick Drago and promising young pitchers in Roger Moret and Bill Willoughby. That's three Hall of Famers, a few border line Hall of Famers and several other multi-time All Stars. And management mucked it up and they never won anything together. Didn't make a postseason until 1986 when only Rice and Evans were left.
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Lenny
Love Doc, but overall big disappointment to me at MU. One shot made it a bit less of a disappointment.
Crash
You are right to some degree, but I thought Doc did not come close to expectations. I am with Lenny on this one.
Doc's final season was ruined because of the crap he was taking from teammates and on campus for dating a white woman (now his wife) who was also a former teammate's girlfriend. That's why he left early even though he wasn't graded out as a first round pick.
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Lenny
Love Doc, but overall big disappointment to me at MU. One shot made it a bit less of a disappointment.
Crash
You are right to some degree, but I thought Doc did not come close to expectations. I am with Lenny on this one.
Goose
In the storied annals of MU Hoops Glenn isn't in the inner circle of greats. The talent was most definitely there but he didn't have anything near the supporting cast enjoyed by Lloyd or Jimmy.
Imagine Glenn playing for MU 8 years earlier. His game would have been elevated immeasurably. Being able to dish to Bo, Luke, McNeill, Tatum, Butch, or even Rosie?
Fuggetaboutit
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Crash
No doubt about that. Doc was a great defender, great body and big time talent. He would have had different college career if playing with the studs.
Billy
Partially true.Difficult season for the program, no doubt. I think Doc was gone regardless, but the girl thing definitely caused big issues.
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Crash
No doubt about that. Doc was a great defender, great body and big time talent. He would have had different college career if playing with the studs.
Billy
Partially true.Difficult season for the program, no doubt. I think Doc was gone regardless, but the girl thing definitely caused big issues.
Goose
Re The Girl Thing: Still going strong after nearly 40 years of a very happy marriage
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Crash
No doubt the short term hassle was well worth it for Doc and Kris. Plus, Doc and Marc had a great relationship after some time to get over things. Everyone won, except MU ball😎
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Goose
Re The Girl Thing: Still going strong after nearly 40 years of a very happy marriage
I saw on TMZ Sports (I think that's what it's called) that Doc and Kristen are separated.
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Naughty Doc. Just read a little gossip on his new squeeze. New gal is awfully young.
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Naughty Doc. Just read a little gossip on his new squeeze. New gal is awfully young.
I saw that too. 34, isn't that younger than at least one of his kids?
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I saw that too. 34, isn't that younger than at least one of his kids?
Ageist
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Naughty Doc. Just read a little gossip on his new squeeze. New gal is awfully young.
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Naughty Doc. Just read a little gossip on his new squeeze. New gal is awfully young.
What the f#ck you sayin' there, Goose??
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Ageist
I'm an "ageist" by asking about the age of Doc's kids? Go Doc!
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What the f#ck you sayin' there, Goose??
Not much, OBLS. (Old balls, loose sack)
Pronounced Obliss.
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Brewers: Pat Listach and Geoff Jenkins
I seem to remember a lot of hype (separately) about these two players when they were in the farm system/rookies. Sadly, neither of them led the Brewers back to the promise land.
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Listach won rookie of the year (over Kenny Lofton), then injured his knee the next year.
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Darko Milicic instead of Dwyane Wade.
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Darko Milicic instead of Dwyane Wade.
The Bulls also could have had Wade but Paxson refused to throw Donyell Marshall into a trade package.
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The Bulls also could have had Wade but Paxson refused to throw Donyell Marshall into a trade package.
Paxson has been around that long? Jeez, he's been in the front office for 17 years?
Under his "management" the Bulls have won less playoff series than Jerry Krause did championships.
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I'm an "ageist" by asking about the age of Doc's kids? Go Doc!
That is what wiki is for. Scoop is for passively aggressively inferring bias via questions/statements.
While I am half joking, in many cultures this is perfectly acceptable... including the US during agricultural times where women would die in childbirth. If two adults are happy, who really cares? Demi and Ashton. Doc and his date? This country would be better off if we care less about what goes on in people's bedrooms other than their own.
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Paxson has been around that long? Jeez, he's been in the front office for 17 years?
Under his "management" the Bulls have won less playoff series than Jerry Krause did championships.
Yep. Reinsdorf unceremoniously dumped Krause the day of the 2003 NCAA title game; I was in New Orleans covering the game but had to write about Krause instead. (The Bulls' only statement was that Krause had retired for health reasons, but he was dumped.)
Later that month, Reinsdorf hired Paxson, about 2 months before the draft. Pax loved Wade, and he wanted to make a splash ... but apparently not badly enough. Toronto was willing to trade the No. 4 pick, which Pax wanted so he could move ahead of Riley, who also loved Wade. But the Raptors wanted Donyell Marshall.
The first of many wonderful calls by Paxson as an NBA executive.
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I'm not sure I was ever more excited for the future than after the 2007 U-20 World Cup. Freddy Adu and Jozy Altidore were the forward pairing of our dreams, Danny Szetela and Sal Zizzo were blazing wings, Michael Bradley was the young rock in the midfield, I was convinced they would join up with established stars like Landon Donovan and Clint Dempsey to lead us to glory in 2010, 2014, and beyond. We did okay, but never matched that hype, largely due to guys like Adu, Szetela, and Zizzo never coming close to recapturing that Summer 2007 form.
As a Bulls fan, I thought the Baby Bulls (Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler) were going to usher in a new, dominant frontcourt that would lead them back to the glory days sooner rather than later. Not so much.
Many Marquette fans probably hold this, but I was soooooo excited for the 2013-14 season, to the point that I was looking forward to it from the moment Jamil Wilson arrived. I had visions of Gardner, Wilson, and (once committed) McKay in the frontcourt. Blue and Mayo were there to anchor a solid backcourt. And we had a massive recruiting class coming in. That was the year I penciled in for the return to the Final Four, even before we won a Big East title and went to an Elite 8 in 2013. Then Vander left, McKay left, and it never came together.
As a Reading FC fan, it was this year. Club splashed tons of money in the transfer window, brought in a combination of proven players and promising young stars, had an exciting manager in Jose Gomes, and proceeded to tank right to the relegation zone. They have somehow recovered, but don't look like they have any real shot of the EPL promotion I was dreaming of a few months ago.
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I saw that too. 34, isn't that younger than at least one of his kids?
In violation of the half plus 7 rule!
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This country would be better off if we care less about what goes on in people's bedrooms other than their own.
[Insert joke about JayBee caring less than nothing.]
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Darko Milicic instead of Dwyane Wade.
it would have been Carmelo or Bosh. Rip was established at the 2.
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That is what wiki is for. Scoop is for passively aggressively inferring bias via questions/statements.
While I am half joking, in many cultures this is perfectly acceptable... including the US during agricultural times where women would die in childbirth. If two adults are happy, who really cares? Demi and Ashton. Doc and his date? This country would be better off if we care less about what goes on in people's bedrooms other than their own.
As long as they are legal age of consent, I agree.
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Not much, OBLS. (Old balls, loose sack)
Pronounced Obliss.
Swimmers gonna swim, Zig
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I'm going to be an old fart (get off my lawn) but my greatest expectation was for a second national championship in 1978.
Bo was gone but we had a dynamite, senior-laden team. Our coach was someone who had been with us throughout the Al era and understood what he had.
Reality came crashing down on a cold March afternoon in Indianapolis. Was at a wedding in Iowa with my girlfriend that day (has been Ms. Dgies since 1980) and thought the sportscaster read the score incorrectly.
Little did I realize that was the end of an era.
Wojo, get us back!!!!!
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I'm going to be an old fart (get off my lawn) but my greatest expectation was for a second national championship in 1978.
Bo was gone but we had a dynamite, senior-laden team. Our coach was someone who had been with us throughout the Al era and understood what he had.
Reality came crashing down on a cold March afternoon in Indianapolis. Was at a wedding in Iowa with my girlfriend that day (has been Ms. Dgies since 1980) and thought the sportscaster read the score incorrectly.
Little did I realize that was the end of an era.
Wojo, get us back!!!!!
Peter F#cking Pavia
Actually, I think that outcome telegraphed what we all feared: Hank was a bad choice.
Denny Crum and Digger were openly begging for the job.
Imagine if Crum got the job. The legacy of excellence would still be alive.