MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: muwarrior69 on January 16, 2019, 07:09:11 AM
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Is he becoming the best big man in the big East? What a game last night.
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Putting himself in the conversation next couple of years.
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Still would like him to stop chasing shots he can't get and get in better defensive rebounding position, but he seems to get better every game. He is so much better with the ball and with post moves than last year. He was even better about fouls the last couple games. Was not a big fan of his last year but love his progression.
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I have to admit that he has made great strides this season. He has played a big role in several tight games and kudo's to him.
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I have to admit that he has made great strides this season. He has played a big role in several tight games and kudo's to him.
Maybe Wojo is a good big-man coach after all.
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Still would like him to stop chasing shots he can't get and get in better defensive rebounding position, but he seems to get better every game. He is so much better with the ball and with post moves than last year. He was even better about fouls the last couple games. Was not a big fan of his last year but love his progression.
He is a good shot fake away from leaping over people at points...but hey, the shot block is a "new" skill he is utilizing and he is excited. I expect he will settle down a bit overtime.
He has confidence now, which can be dangerous for the opponent!
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He is staying on the floor the last three games. In the first two BE games, got in foul trouble early and played only 15 mpg. Last three BE games, no real foul problems and is averaging close to 30mpg. He was prone to getting offensive fouls for setting screens and must have adjusted something because much better at it now. Need him to continue this trend, he has been playing very well.
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Loved his game last night. I thought it note worthy that after the dunks he did not go all psycho killer and acted very professional, like he had been there before, and expected to be there many times in the future.
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Best big man? No. Best rim defender? Possible.
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I love Theo’s game, especially his defense but sometimes he’s still a blackhole on offense...doesn’t even look to pass. If he can start his move and then kick it out to a shooter, or at least look to see if anyone is open I think that’d be huge for the team. Last night when he got called for his offensive foul there were wide open shooters waiting for the ball
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Maybe Wojo is a good big-man coach after all.
And a good defensive coach....
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Theo was only credited for one block last night. Of course, it was the big one. Only 6 rebounds in 30 minutes. The Hausers had 8 each. Passing out of the post is a non-issue because it doesn't happen. HOWEVER, he is only a sophomore and has made great strides. He almost single-handedly lays to rest the notion that Wojo and his staff can't develop players. So give him credit for the strides he has made. Be patient as he gets even better. Because he is still going to have 16 minute, 4 point, 5 rebound, 4 foul games.
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I love Theo’s game, especially his defense but sometimes he’s still a blackhole on offense...doesn’t even look to pass. If he can start his move and then kick it out to a shooter, or at least look to see if anyone is open I think that’d be huge for the team. Last night when he got called for his offensive foul there were wide open shooters waiting for the ball
I think it depends on his position when he gets the ball. If he gets it in a good deep post up, I have no problem with him only looking to score, but sometimes he tries too hard. Like most back to the basket players, he should have a three dribble max. If you can't get to your "spot" in three dribbles, the ball needs to get kicked back out.
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Quote from the Casual Hoya game thread:
"Theo John has Bitched our entire frontline!!!!"
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Loved that Kareem-like sky hook. If he can get that into his offensive repertoire reliably and regularly....
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One word of caution, I would recommend keeping Theo expectations at realistic level. I remember vividly folks wanting Matt H to play over Luke Fischer. I get it, Theo is becoming a fan favorite, and that is fine. If MU is going to have a long run in March, Theo is going to need to play a role in that. IMO, there is going to need to be 7 guys covering for each other over the upcoming weeks.
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Theo is a beast, and I think we're only seeing the surface. He could be an absolute monster as an upper classman. Quickly becoming a favorite of mine.
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One word of caution, I would recommend keeping Theo expectations at realistic level. I remember vividly folks wanting Matt H to play over Luke Fischer. I get it, Theo is becoming a fan favorite, and that is fine. If MU is going to have a long run in March, Theo is going to need to play a role in that. IMO, there is going to need to be 7 guys covering for each other over the upcoming weeks.
Not just your opinion, but the opinion of everyone who knows anything about college bball. Even Wojo: "The best part of our team is our team."
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Still would like him to stop chasing shots he can't get and get in better defensive rebounding position
Fundamentally, this is a good statement. But there is something about a rim-protector saying, "Don't bring that shyte in here because I am going after every single shot. I don't care if I goaltend. I don't care if I knock you on your arse. I don't care if you're an All-American. You're going to get that weak shyte swatted right back at you." I am NOT saying he is what Ewing was as a player, but that was Ewing's mindset.
I love Theo’s game, especially his defense but sometimes he’s still a blackhole on offense...doesn’t even look to pass. If he can start his move and then kick it out to a shooter, or at least look to see if anyone is open I think that’d be huge for the team.
He's still developing, and hopefully this will improve. I love that he actually has developed a few pretty reliable offensive moves. One step at a time.
Best big man? No. Best rim defender? Possible.
This, of course. I mean, if we could do so for right now, for the rest of this season, how many of us would not trade Theo for the GT big? Govan is a 20-10 guy who can dominate posting up and also step out and hit 3s. But we aren't getting Govan, and I'm diggin' Theo.
Maybe Wojo is a good big-man coach after all.
No maybe about it. He and his assistants have done a wonderful job with Theo. Pretty darn good job with Heldt, too.
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I love Theo’s game, especially his defense but sometimes he’s still a blackhole on offense...doesn’t even look to pass. If he can start his move and then kick it out to a shooter, or at least look to see if anyone is open I think that’d be huge for the team. Last night when he got called for his offensive foul there were wide open shooters waiting for the ball
This is true. Seems to me he still has to think a bit about the move he is going to make, so he's not observing what's around him so much. Have to think that comes with time as the moves become second nature. He has become pretty reliable though with both hands on his back to the basket moves.
I love having a guy like him (and Ed) on the team. For years, Xavier has had solid power forwards/centers (even pre-Big East, e.g. Tyrone Hill, Aaron Williams, Brian Grant, David West) that can push people around and athletic enough to block shots and intimidate inside. You don't need 7 footers in college hoops if you have 6'8-6'9" guys with a presence. There is no question Theo and Ed have created a presence inside that impacts many more shots than they get their hands on.
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I noticed at the Seton Hall game there were a couple times Theo seemed to realize he was about to make a silly foul and noticeably held back.
I think he gets some bad calls against him because the refs are accustomed to him making the silly foul now and then. If he can keep cutting the silly fouls out, hopefully those bad calls against him will decrease as well.
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Every time we watch Marquette, my husband says, wistfully, "Man, he would've looked good in a Gopher's uniform." Great get for Wojo.
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I don't really mind Theo committing a few fouls and getting called for goaltending once or twice a game. If you're playing aggressive defense, you won't always get the call. If you can't get the block, sometimes a foul is the right play. I wasn't even worried when he got his fourth foul last night. It wasn't a reckless play; it was good, tough defense.
It seems like Theo is starting to recognize when is the right time to go all-out. When he was defending Seton Hall's Nzei (a senior 6-8 forward), he simply played good positional D: Stand your ground, don't let him get deeper into the paint, make him hit a tough shot with a hand in his face (which Nzei did twice). But when he sees a chance to help on a smaller guard or block a layup on a fast-break, he goes for it.
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I noticed at the Seton Hall game there were a couple times Theo seemed to realize he was about to make a silly foul and noticeably held back.
Didn't see your post before I made my own. Agree 100%.
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Best big man? No. Best rim defender? Possible.
I agree, but I said becoming.
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When does the Fiserv start handing out the old timey maps with the lane labeled "Here there be monsters"?
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I agree, but I said becoming.
I know. I don't ever see him becoming the best big man in the Big East. Not versatile enough on offense. I do see him becoming the best rim protector in the Big East.
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I don't know if it's a perfect comparison, but I've always seen Theo as a slightly better defensively, but slightly worse offensively Tyler Wideman. A very important four year player with a ceiling at about 10 and 6, and that's all I think we need him to be.
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And a good defensive coach....
I continue to beat a dead horse and state that all we can do is judge wojo on wins/losses and how the team represents MU. That said...you have no clue if Wojo can coach defense or if it was an addition to the staff...change in roster...down year for college bball...etc. What we do know is Wojo is finding a way to lead this team to wins and everyone has to love that.
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Theo was only credited for one block last night. Of course, it was the big one. Only 6 rebounds in 30 minutes. The Hausers had 8 each. Passing out of the post is a non-issue because it doesn't happen. HOWEVER, he is only a sophomore and has made great strides. He almost single-handedly lays to rest the notion that Wojo and his staff can't develop players. So give him credit for the strides he has made. Be patient as he gets even better. Because he is still going to have 16 minute, 4 point, 5 rebound, 4 foul games.
Exactly right. No player has made greater progress in the last 12 months. I'm expecting Theo to continue to develop his game. He's going to terrorize the Big East as an upperclassman.
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I don't really mind Theo committing a few fouls and getting called for goaltending once or twice a game. If you're playing aggressive defense, you won't always get the call. If you can't get the block, sometimes a foul is the right play. I wasn't even worried when he got his fourth foul last night. It wasn't a reckless play; it was good, tough defense.
It seems like Theo is starting to recognize when is the right time to go all-out. When he was defending Seton Hall's Nzei (a senior 6-8 forward), he simply played good positional D: Stand your ground, don't let him get deeper into the paint, make him hit a tough shot with a hand in his face (which Nzei did twice). But when he sees a chance to help on a smaller guard or block a layup on a fast-break, he goes for it.
I agree with this. Theo generally plays pretty good straight up D when his man has the ball. But he is improving drastically at off-ball blocks.
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Rank Theo with the Following bigs HALFWAY THROUGH THEIR SOPHOMORE SEASON.
Here is a list of bigs back to 1980 (miss anyone?)
Outle
Gardner
Fisher
Heldt
Froling
Morrow
Taylor Jr.
Mbao
Grimm
Merritt
Kinsella
Mbakwe
Blackledge
Barro
Jackson
Mueller
Clausen
Lovette
Shaw
Polonowski
MacCaskill
Crawford
McIlvaine
Grosse
Copa
Muller
Downing
Davis
Lazzeratti
Moore
Marquardt
Nyenhuis
Who was better than Theo after 1 1/2 seasons?
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Mac, Davante and Fish probably.
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Mac, Davante and Fish probably.
I was gonna say Mac, Davante and RJax (the latter of course at Mississippi State).
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Damon Key
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Damon Key
Agree, but - despite his size - Key usually played further from the basket than the others listed.
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Every time we watch Marquette, my husband says, wistfully, "Man, he would've looked good in a Gopher's uniform." Great get for Wojo.
You know who looked good in a Gopher's uniform? Trevor Mbakwe. That cat made the uniform look better. 8-)
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Damon Key
I was gonna say Mac, Davante and RJax (the latter of course at Mississippi State).
Mac, Davante and Fish probably.
How about Crawford and MacCaskill?
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One word of caution, I would recommend keeping Theo expectations at realistic level. I remember vividly folks wanting Matt H to play over Luke Fischer. I get it, Theo is becoming a fan favorite, and that is fine. If MU is going to have a long run in March, Theo is going to need to play a role in that. IMO, there is going to need to be 7 guys covering for each other over the upcoming weeks.
After watching Fischer give a game away to DePaul, two years in a row. I was ready to have anyone from the student section play over him.
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How about Crawford and MacCaskill?
Not midway through their Soph seasons. Both were still backups, and became key players their last two seasons. Amal only averaged 11 mpg as a Soph.
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When I saw Theo last year, I thought of Maurice Lucas. Well, after watching him play it was obvious that he wasn't Lucas. But, watching his play improve this year, I think he can be a great Warrior. I think whenever he gets his hands on the ball within 8' of the rim, he can and should score. He can average 20 points per game if he controls the rim.
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When I saw Theo last year, I thought of Maurice Lucas. Well, after watching him play it was obvious that he wasn't Lucas. But, watching his play improve this year, I think he can be a great Warrior. I think whenever he gets his hands on the ball within 8' of the rim, he can and should score. He can average 20 points per game if he controls the rim.
He's never going to average 20 points a game........why do people do this?
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When I saw Theo last year, I thought of Maurice Lucas. Well, after watching him play it was obvious that he wasn't Lucas. But, watching his play improve this year, I think he can be a great Warrior. I think whenever he gets his hands on the ball within 8' of the rim, he can and should score. He can average 20 points per game if he controls the rim.
In todays game a center without an outside shot averaging that much would be a death sentence. Wisconsin is one dimensional like that with an all american center and they're pretty average
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How about Crawford and MacCaskill?
Crawford? Wasn't he a swing forward? Like Gardner, Theo won't come close to the offensive production, but will do much more in rim protection.
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In todays game a center without an outside shot averaging that much would be a death sentence. Wisconsin is one dimensional like that with an all american center and they're pretty average
Wisconsin pretty average? What? A center averaging 20 points a game in the paint is a huge advantage, not a death sentence. It opens up the defense a lot for outside shooters when a team has to figure out how to stop that kind of an inside threat.
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Rank Theo with the Following bigs HALFWAY THROUGH THEIR SOPHOMORE SEASON.
Here is a list of bigs back to 1980 (miss anyone?)
Outle
Gardner
Fisher
Heldt
Froling
Morrow
Taylor Jr.
Mbao
Grimm
Merritt
Kinsella
Mbakwe
Blackledge
Barro
Jackson
Mueller
Clausen
Lovette
Shaw
Polonowski
MacCaskill
Crawford
McIlvaine
Grosse
Copa
Muller
Downing
Davis
Lazzeratti
Moore
Marquardt
Nyenhuis
Who was better than Theo after 1 1/2 seasons?
IMHO, the three best seasons from a Marquette center during this time period (in no particular order) were McIlvaine's senior season, Jackson's senior season and Lovette as a junior. Damon Key has Marquette's starting center his freshman year was better than Theo is now. After that he moved to PF to make room for McIlvaine, otherwise he's be in the discussion for all four of his years.
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IMHO, the three best seasons from a Marquette center during this time period (in no particular order) were McIlvaine's senior season, Jackson's senior season and Lovette as a junior. Damon Key has Marquette's starting center his freshman year was better than Theo is now. After that he moved to PF to make room for McIlvaine, otherwise he's be in the discussion for all four of his years.
Interesting you mentioned Jarrod Lovette. IMHO, his development might have been the most impressive accomplishment in Mike Deane's tenure. When Lovette first got to MU, he looked completely lost and physically overmatched, and I feared he'd be a wasted scholarship. But by his junior and senior seasons, he was poised, consistent and a great compliment to guys like Hutch and Wardle.
It's a shame his career ended as it did, but I was glad to hear that he turned his life around.
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What happened with Lovette? I thought it was anxiety?
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What happened with Lovette? I thought it was anxiety?
Anxiety and depression, which he later revealed had caused him to attempt suicide early in his senior season. He later got into drugs and such, but eventually got back into hoops, became a personal trainer, and is now an assistant coach at Grace College in Indiana.
Here's his current bio and a story from the LaCrosse paper from a while back....
https://gclancers.com/coaches.aspx?rc=273
https://lacrossetribune.com/sports/jarrod-lovette-finds-peace-by-turning-life-over-to-god/article_8d81f93d-8d30-5200-844c-1e1d33e4d416.html
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Mac, Davante and Fish probably.
My distant memory is Mac was very stiff as a freshman. Missed a lot of easy shots. He got much better later. If my memory is correct, I would not put him ahead of Theo.
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Agree, but - despite his size - Key usually played further from the basket than the others listed.
I think he ended his career top ten in rebounds
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Be patient as he gets even better. Because he is still going to have 16 minute, 4 point, 5 rebound, 4 foul games.
OK, the above line would have been a vast improvement over today Yes, he was taken out of the game by some ticky-tack foul calls. I have little doubt that he will bounce back. I just don't expect him to average a double double going forward. Well, not yet. ;) He may have a couple more games like this. Hopefully, Ed and Matt can pick him and the team up.