MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: tower912 on April 17, 2018, 11:55:26 AM
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Potentially. Spellman exploring his draft options. DD leaning that way but no official word yet. No agents yet. Smart moves by both. Bridges and Brunson hiring agents. Opportunity for MU to move up.
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Potentially. Spellman exploring his draft options. DD leaning that way but no official word yet. No agents yet. Smart moves by both. Bridges and Brunson hiring agents. Opportunity for MU to move up.
Both should go, Spellman has great potential and I am not sure it can be higher then right now, do not take the risk. DD is ready now. If both leave Villy still will
have some nice pieces, but freshman will have to take over right away. Saw Cole Swider play in an All-Star game, he will be a star at Villy. Add that 5 star guard as well,
they will be fine.
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Both absolutely should let the NBA kick their tires and see what their stock is.
I tend to agree that they both are trending up. I would think Spellman could play himself into a top-5 pick with another year of great coaching as the team's go-to guy. DD, I don't know what to think of him; his stock would seem to be so high now, but he was pretty inconsistent this season and he to likely would benefit as a player from returning.
But yeah, if either gets the vibe that he'll be a first-round pick, adios.
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Both absolutely should let the NBA kick their tires and see what their stock is.
I tend to agree that they both are trending up. I would think Spellman could play himself into a top-5 pick with another year of great coaching as the team's go-to guy. DD, I don't know what to think of him; his stock would seem to be so high now, but he was pretty inconsistent this season and he to likely would benefit as a player from returning.
But yeah, if either gets the vibe that he'll be a first-round pick, adios.
Bucks have the 17th pick this year, I would take either of them.
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What happens with the defending national champion's players has absolutely no baring on MU's future success.
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What happens with the defending national champion's players has absolutely no baring on MU's future success.
Except that we play them 2-3 times per year and 2-3 wins in the future is better than 0 wins...
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Except that we play them 2-3 times per year and 2-3 wins in the future is better than 0 wins...
This
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Nah man, MU is literally time zones away from Villanova's success. First gotta get you own house in order befour worrin' 'bout the competition. Beesides, Wright has already shown he isn't steppin' on his johnson like Crean did and will build on his success. VU will be just fine goin' forward, hey?
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Nah man, MU is literally time zones away from Villanova's success. First gotta get you own house in order befour worrin' 'bout the competition. Beesides, Wright has already shown he isn't steppin' on his johnson like Crean did and will on his success. VU will be just fine goin' forward, hey?
I don't think anyone is questioning the state of the Nova program, but if you lose 4 players from a team that only went 7 deep most of the time, I don't care who you're bringing in, you're gonna take a step back. Good thing is, a step back from national champions is still likely FF contender.
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Nah man, MU is literally time zones away from Villanova's success. First gotta get you own house in order befour worrin' 'bout the competition. Beesides, Wright has already shown he isn't steppin' on his johnson like Crean did and will build on his success. VU will be just fine goin' forward, hey?
Duh. But a virtually unbeatable team instead of a very good team gives MU a better chance to win 2-3 contests per year.
For example, if Nova was a top-20ish team instead of #1 by a mile, we likely beat them once or twice this year and make the tourney instead of NIT 2 seed.
Ergo, what happens to their players has some bearing on MU's future success.
This isn't that hard.
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I don't think anyone is questioning the state of the Nova program, but if you lose 4 players from a team that only went 7 deep most of the time, I don't care who you're bringing in, you're gonna take a step back. Good thing is, a step back from national champions is still likely FF contender.
Not sure about Villy being a contender for FF. Not sure Wright was truly ready to lose all 4. They will be good, but beatable as Paschall can not carry the load or
whomever is returning. Lose 4 and only 3 are coming in right now, big drop-off. MU probably has a chance to beat them again, at least at home.
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Not sure about Villy being a contender for FF. Not sure Wright was truly ready to lose all 4. They will be good, but beatable as Paschall can not carry the load or
whomever is returning. Lose 4 and only 3 are coming in right now, big drop-off. MU probably has a chance to beat them again, at least at home.
That depends on different people's opinion on how many FF contenders there are right now. Even if they lose all 4 (which I don't think will happen), just out of respect for the program, the coaching ability of Wright, and the incoming class, I would consider them a FF contender. TBH though, if I had to make a list right now, there would probably be about a dozen "FF contenders". (At least until FBI sanctions come out, whenever that will be)
Agree that we can beat them though, even if both OS and DD come back.
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Not sure about Villy being a contender for FF. Not sure Wright was truly ready to lose all 4. They will be good, but beatable as Paschall can not carry the load or
whomever is returning. Lose 4 and only 3 are coming in right now, big drop-off. MU probably has a chance to beat them again, at least at home.
+1
Paschall and Booth are great, but they aren't carrying Nova to a Big East title much less a Final Four.
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If I was a GM I would absolutely use a mid to late first round pick on Spellman. Kid is a stud and I think will only get better.
DD I am less sure about but it's had to imagine his stock being higher after showing out in the national championship.
Even if all four go, I think Nova still wins the Big East....but they go from nigh unbeatable to us having a good shot of beating them at least once next season.
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Potentially. Spellman exploring his draft options. DD leaning that way but no official word yet. No agents yet. Smart moves by both. Bridges and Brunson hiring agents. Opportunity for MU to move up.
I'll be kinda surprised if either goes to the NBA this year.
Every college player who aspires to the NBA should do what these guys did. Get that input from NBA scouts - it will help many of them achieve their goal.
I cannot believe Howard and Hauser haven't done this.
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For those with a mathematical bent, Auburn has provided the tools to figure this out in his BEast Nat'l Ratings thread's link to his Cracked Sidewalks article. In that article, he shows Nova ranked third next year with 55.6 points of Projected Value Add (PVA), he also provides the PVA for both DiVincenzo 7.84 and Spellman 4.96. If you subtract those from Nova's total, you get a 42.8 PVA which drops Nova to 17th. Marq is ranked 27th with a 39.02 PVA. Most systems credit home court advantage as worth approximately 4 points, so those two leaving makes the game at Marq a slight Marq advantage or a pick 'em game. So, yeah, losing those two guys with their combined 12.8 points of PVA makes any Marq Nova game much more winnable for Marq.
Now if those guys leave AND Marquette gets additional PVA from say Joseph Chartouny, maybe Marq even moves past Nova, and .....................
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I'll be kinda surprised if either goes to the NBA this year.
Every college player who aspires to the NBA should do what these guys did. Get that input from NBA scouts - it will help many of them achieve their goal.
I cannot believe Howard and Hauser haven't done this.
Can't you only do it once, so it would make sense to declare without hiring after your Junior year? I may be wrong, but that would explain why Markus hasn't declared yet, and Sam is in no physical shape to be working out for scouts since he was still on crutches last week at the awards ceremony.
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Can't you only do it once, so it would make sense to declare without hiring after your Junior year? I may be wrong, but that would explain why Markus hasn't declared yet, and Sam is in no physical shape to be working out for scouts since he was still on crutches last week at the awards ceremony.
You can do it twice. Howard also is going on that athletes trip to South America with Matt Heldt. Not sure he'll be around much.
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Nah man, MU is literally time zones away from Villanova's success. First gotta get you own house in order befour worrin' 'bout the competition. Beesides, Wright has already shown he isn't steppin' on his johnson like Crean did and will build on his success. VU will be just fine goin' forward, hey?
Agree. Getting "better" because a team who regularly thumps you gets worse isn't getting better - it's just having an easier schedule.
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You can do it twice. Howard also is going on that athletes trip to South America with Matt Heldt. Not sure he'll be around much.
And what position does he play in the pros? 2 guard, can he guard Kris Middleton? I think he needs a year or two to work on being a point.
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Lenny and 4ever
Agree completely.
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Not sure about Villy being a contender for FF. Not sure Wright was truly ready to lose all 4.
The man can't coach. Took him 15 years to get to the Final Four, 22 to win a title.
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For those with a mathematical bent, Auburn has provided the tools to figure this out in his BEast Nat'l Ratings thread's link to his Cracked Sidewalks article. In that article, he shows Nova ranked third next year with 55.6 points of Projected Value Add (PVA), he also provides the PVA for both DiVincenzo 7.84 and Spellman 4.96. If you subtract those from Nova's total, you get a 42.8 PVA which drops Nova to 17th. Marq is ranked 27th with a 39.02 PVA. Most systems credit home court advantage as worth approximately 4 points, so those two leaving makes the game at Marq a slight Marq advantage or a pick 'em game. So, yeah, losing those two guys with their combined 12.8 points of PVA makes any Marq Nova game much more winnable for Marq.
Now if those guys leave AND Marquette gets additional PVA from say Joseph Chartouny, maybe Marq even moves past Nova, and ..................... that's exactly why what happens to their players has bearing on MU's future success
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Nah man, MU is literally time zones away from Villanova's success. First gotta get you own house in order befour worrin' 'bout the competition. Beesides, Wright has already shown he isn't steppin' on his johnson like Crean did and will build on his success. VU will be just fine goin' forward, hey?
Speaking of stepping on johns, does this apply to Wojo at all?
Funny on all the glee here that Villanova players turning pro helps us to move up. Maybe a better idea is to get players and coaches equal to Villanova.
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And what position does he play in the pros? 2 guard, can he guard Kris Middleton? I think he needs a year or two to work on being a point.
Huh? I have no idea what your question has to do with my post.
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Some of you guys are complete morons. bias idiots that’s all I can say. This conference is NOT, I reapeat NOT established as an elite conference yet. it NEEDS good teams to be there every year. why ppl want everyone on nova to leave just so mu might move up a spot is beyond me. How about aspire to rise to their level, not hope they fall to ours. The conference will be very week next season. Bunch of teams loosing a lot. I’m worried. Hope DD Omari stock around so the big east has at least one top 15 team.
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Some of you guys are complete morons. bias idiots that’s all I can say. This conference is NOT, I reapeat NOT established as an elite conference yet. it NEEDS good teams to be there every year. why ppl want everyone on nova to leave just so mu might move up a spot is beyond me. How about aspire to rise to their level, not hope they fall to ours. The conference will be very week next season. Bunch of teams loosing a lot. I’m worried. Hope DD Omari stock around so the big east has at least one top 15 team.
Oh the irony.
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Oh the irony.
out of 145 people, 82 agree with you. 63 do not agree with you.
Johnny B: once again welcome to the minority who've assume a victory.
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Bucks have the 17th pick this year, I would take either of them.
NBA draft cardinal rule to live by: never draft an American born white guy. Hard pass on DD.
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Some of you guys are complete morons. bias idiots that’s all I can say. This conference is NOT, I reapeat NOT established as an elite conference yet. it NEEDS good teams to be there every year. why ppl want everyone on nova to leave just so mu might move up a spot is beyond me. How about aspire to rise to their level, not hope they fall to ours. The conference will be very week next season. Bunch of teams loosing a lot. I’m worried. Hope DD Omari stock around so the big east has at least one top 15 team.
Curious what you think it'll take for the conference to be elite? I think it's right up there with any in the country. Yes next year will be a down year as a whole, but there are 5-6 top 40 programs IMO, and as bad as DePaul is, they're not the worst cellar dweller in a P6 conference. The B10-14 just had a historically poor year outside of Michigan's fortunate run, and they're still firmly established as an elite conference.
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NBA draft cardinal rule to live by: never draft an American born white guy. Hard pass on DD.
Redick and Love are very good. Ryan Anderson and Chandler Parsons (when healthy) are pretty good.
Other than that, slim pickens
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Some of you guys are complete morons. bias idiots that’s all I can say. This conference is NOT, I reapeat NOT established as an elite conference yet. it NEEDS good teams to be there every year. why ppl want everyone on nova to leave just so mu might move up a spot is beyond me. How about aspire to rise to their level, not hope they fall to ours. The conference will be very week next season. Bunch of teams loosing a lot. I’m worried. Hope DD Omari stock around so the big east has at least one top 15 team.
The tone and personal insults I could do without, but I agree with the general theme. The New Big East hasn't been around long enough to establish itself as "elite". Villanova success in the NCAA tournament has been great for the conference and has softened the blow of mostly mediocre to less than mediocre NCAA tourneys by the group as a whole. To stay at or near the top we need Nova to maintain or a couple of teams to become "Xaviers" IMO.
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The tone and personal insults I could do without, but I agree with the general theme. The New Big East hasn't been around long enough to establish itself as "elite". Villanova success in the NCAA tournament has been great for the conference and has softened the blow of mostly mediocre to less than mediocre NCAA tourneys by the group as a whole. To stay at or near the top we need Nova to maintain or a couple of teams to become "Xaviers" IMO.
How would you rate the new B1G?
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The tone and personal insults I could do without, but I agree with the general theme. The New Big East hasn't been around long enough to establish itself as "elite". Villanova success in the NCAA tournament has been great for the conference and has softened the blow of mostly mediocre to less than mediocre NCAA tourneys by the group as a whole. To stay at or near the top we need Nova to maintain or a couple of teams to become "Xaviers" IMO.
Do you really think that 2 players declaring early for the draft will effect the stature of the conference as a whole? Even if they come back, Nova won't be as good next year, that's just what happens when you lose the player of the year and a lottery pick. However, the Nova program will continue to be strong, as will a number of other Beast programs that will take a step back next year.
Overall, since the realignment, I have been very impressed with the conference as a whole. We have once again proved that you don't need football to be an elite basketball conference, and I would say putting 60% of your conference in the tourney would qualify it as elite. Nova has proved to be one of the best programs in the country this decade. X is facing a question mark in an unproven head coach, but their history shows that they'll be back, I trust Cooley, McDermitt, Jordan and Wojo to keep their respective programs either trending up, or maintaining their success, even Georgetown is showing signs of becoming relevant in the near future.
What more do you think it'll take? Sure, other conference's are more top heavy, but very few have the quality of depth that the Beast has.
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How would you rate the new B1G?
In the short term we're fine. Villanova and Xavier are top notch. Butler is solid. Providence, Seton Hall and Creighton are performing better than they usually do (historically). I expect them to revert to the mean, which means MU, Georgetown and maybe St Johns will have to step it up some. I think that's likely.
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I'm not even slightly worried about the status and stature of the Big East.
It's been superb since MU joined -- both in its previous form, when it arguably was the best league ever ... to the current form, when it is underrated by some but appreciated by most who are in the know.
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Redick and Love are very good. Ryan Anderson and Chandler Parsons (when healthy) are pretty good.
Other than that, slim pickens
Gordon Hayward
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For those with a mathematical bent, Auburn has provided the tools to figure this out in his BEast Nat'l Ratings thread's link to his Cracked Sidewalks article. In that article, he shows Nova ranked third next year with 55.6 points of Projected Value Add (PVA), he also provides the PVA for both DiVincenzo 7.84 and Spellman 4.96. If you subtract those from Nova's total, you get a 42.8 PVA which drops Nova to 17th. Marq is ranked 27th with a 39.02 PVA. Most systems credit home court advantage as worth approximately 4 points, so those two leaving makes the game at Marq a slight Marq advantage or a pick 'em game. So, yeah, losing those two guys with their combined 12.8 points of PVA makes any Marq Nova game much more winnable for Marq.
Now if those guys leave AND Marquette gets additional PVA from say Joseph Chartouny, maybe Marq even moves past Nova, and .....................
Yeah, but that's just...like...your opinion, man. [Round of applause]
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In the short term we're fine. Villanova and Xavier are top notch. Butler is solid. Providence, Seton Hall and Creighton are performing better than they usually do (historically). I expect them to revert to the mean, which means MU, Georgetown and maybe St Johns will have to step it up some. I think that's likely.
I agree with you on Seton Hall which seems to be falling back since the effect of a great class of freshmen four years ago doesn't look like it will be maintained, but I think you are sleeping on Providence which I believe has made a sea change to a very respectable program under Cooley. Providence seems to me to be very consistent in their recruiting by getting at least a couple of noteworthy recruits each year. I believe that Creighton's recruiting will allow them to remain a factor in the Big East race, as well.
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I'm not even slightly worried about the status and stature of the Big East.
It's been superb since MU joined -- both in its previous form, when it arguably was the best league ever ... to the current form, when it is underrated by some but appreciated by most who are in the know.
+1
I was concerned at the time of realignment, but we've gotten past that. At this point, even the people at ESPN recognize BE hoops to be on par with the football 5.
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Gordon Hayward
Yep. Bad omission on my part.
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NBA draft cardinal rule to live by: never draft an American born white guy. Hard pass on DD.
Normally I would agree with you, and I don't know if DiVincenzo will amount to much in the NBA, but he has the quick-twitch athleticism that is usually the reason why you don't take American born white guys in the first round.
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In the short term we're fine. Villanova and Xavier are top notch. Butler is solid. Providence, Seton Hall and Creighton are performing better than they usually do (historically). I expect them to revert to the mean, which means MU, Georgetown and maybe St Johns will have to step it up some. I think that's likely.
Wrong conference reference.
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In the short term we're fine. Villanova and Xavier are top notch. Butler is solid. Providence, Seton Hall and Creighton are performing better than they usually do (historically). I expect them to revert to the mean, which means MU, Georgetown and maybe St Johns will have to step it up some. I think that's likely.
I always think it's funny people still include SJU in these revert to the mean or return to glory posts. They're slightly better than Depaul in the last 20yrs it's not like us or GTown where there's been a small hiccup
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I always think it's funny people still include SJU in these revert to the mean or return to glory posts. They're slightly better than Depaul in the last 20yrs it's not like us or GTown where there's been a small hiccup
I put a "maybe" in front of St John's but not in front of MU or GTown. That's a qualifier that makes the Johnies less likely/necessary to make a comeback.
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Normally I would agree with you, and I don't know if DiVincenzo will amount to much in the NBA, but he has the quick-twitch athleticism that is usually the reason why you don't take American born white guys in the first round.
i see a taller version of jj redick
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i see a taller version of jj redick
How are their games remotely similar? JJ has a much better stroke and probably 1/2 the athleticism as DD.
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How are their games remotely similar? JJ has a much better stroke and probably 1/2 the athleticism as DD.
I think he's more of a combo guard in the Jarrett Jack mold though probably will turn out to be a better shooter. Solid but not spectacular. Will do a lot of things right but not really excel at anything. Long NBA career though.
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How are their games remotely similar? JJ has a much better stroke and probably 1/2 the athleticism as DD.
Duh, they're both white!
I see him as a middle class man's Ray Allen. A shooter with sneaky explosive athleticism that can punish you on a close out and also D up.
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Duh, they're both white!
I see him as a middle class man's Ray Allen. A shooter with sneaky explosive athleticism that can punish you on a close out and also D up.
The thing is, no one before this year would have called him a shooter. So I'm not sure how much range the guy actually has. I guess we will see.
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Wrong conference reference.
Sorry, you were talking about the Big 10/14. I think they'll be strong at the top (MSU, Michigan, Ohio St and a resurgent Indiana). Purdue is solid and sometimes very good. I expect the same going forward for UW. Iowa is just OK, Northwestern, Minnesota and Illinois less than that. So the original 10 is "normal" - strong top, weak bottom, a few "middlers". What hurts is that the add ons (11-14) are sub par. Penn St has risen from awful to maybe low middle, Maryland has dipped from top tier to middle.Rutgers is awful and Nebraska is almost as bad.
Overall, well behind the ACC and Big 12 and level with the SEC and the Big East but with an arrow pointing downward.
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The thing is, no one before this year would have called him a shooter. So I'm not sure how much range the guy actually has. I guess we will see.
Exactly. His stroke looked great in the tournament and his range was unlimited but he struggles at the free throw line which is really rare (non existent?) for a truly pure shooter.
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DD declared with out agent
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Exactly. His stroke looked great in the tournament and his range was unlimited but he struggles at the free throw line which is really rare (non existent?) for a truly pure shooter.
He should finish up classes this summer and grad transfer to MU to work with Nelson
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Potentially. Spellman exploring his draft options. DD leaning that way but no official word yet. No agents yet. Smart moves by both. Bridges and Brunson hiring agents. Opportunity for MU to move up.
BUMP
BigEast - Bridges - Brunson
+Chartouney
=?
MU Jeffersons?
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A DEluxe apt in the skyyyyy?
Finally a piece of the real BigEast pie? And not just bogarted NCAA units?
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Was looking at Villanova's SB Nation site today and they seem so convinced that Spellman and Dante should come back if they're projected to go in the second round.
I'm not saying they're wrong, but all I can think is how eerily similar this is to the Vander situation and how even if players should probably come back, it's not always the case.
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Spellman looks like a first round pick to me. I can see the Vander/DD comparison though I think DD has a better shot at getting drafted. Both are coming off tournament runs where it seems unlikely that their draft stock could get any higher
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Spellman looks like a first round pick to me. I can see the Vander/DD comparison though I think DD has a better shot at getting drafted. Both are coming off tournament runs where it seems unlikely that their draft stock could get any higher
I agree about DD's stock. But I don't see why Spellman can't be a much higher draft pick a year from now after spending a season as Nova's go-to guy and getting another year of experience with a great coaching staff.
That is if the Spellman as a second-rounder talk this year is true. I actually like him better than some guys projected as top-10 picks, but I wonder if I'm guilty of familiarity bias because I've seen him so much.
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Spellman looks like a first round pick to me. I can see the Vander/DD comparison though I think DD has a better shot at getting drafted. Both are coming off tournament runs where it seems unlikely that their draft stock could get any higher
I actually think DD's stock could still go up. The kid is a legit athlete with range and impressive defense. He has NBA size for a guard and the frame to add more muscle. If he has a NPOY type season as the best player on Nova, I could see him going through a Mikel Bridges type rise where he rises to a solid late-lottery pick.
DD is a great player, but if I'm a NBA scout, I wouldn't have his stock up much from where it was before the NC because I think it's a mistake to jump a guy up because of one game, no matter the stakes. If he could do that for a full season (and I believe he could), he would solidify himself as a first-half of the first round guy.
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I actually think DD's stock could still go up. The kid is a legit athlete with range and impressive defense. He has NBA size for a guard and the frame to add more muscle. If he has a NPOY type season as the best player on Nova, I could see him going through a Mikel Bridges type rise where he rises to a solid late-lottery pick.
DD is a great player, but if I'm a NBA scout, I wouldn't have his stock up much from where it was before the NC because I think it's a mistake to jump a guy up because of one game, no matter the stakes. If he could do that for a full season (and I believe he could), he would solidify himself as a first-half of the first round guy.
Agree with you on Donte's stock. He has the ability, athleticism, coaching, and culture around him to jump into a possible lottery pick just like Bridges did by coming back for another year. The key is consistency for him. The leap he made from his RS Frosh to Soph year was huge, mostly due to maturity and poise on the court. Still makes a lot of bonehead mistakes and tends to get a little out of control with the ball but the talent and upside is certainly there. Another year would do him a lot of good and I think he and Spellman both return.
Don't forget Josh Hart and Kris Jenkins both tested NBA waters coming off a huge tournament after winning the 2016 Championship. Both returned. Very similar situation here. Jay knows when his guys need more development and when they should make the jump, which is why he explicitly told Brunson and Bridges they'd be crazy not to leave before they made their decisions. He hasn't been as outward about DiVincenzo and Spellman. They'll both come back with their sights on a 3rd championship in 4 years and improve their stocks for a weaker 2019 draft class.
As for MU, they can't place their hopes in competing at the top of the Big East on Nova's players coming back or not. We have to get to their level on our own accord. Starts with defense. We're very rarely going to match Nova's offensive efficiency so the defense has to be not laughable at the very least. If Wojo can't put a solid season or tourney run together this year he's gotta be out.
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If Wojo can't put a solid season or tourney run together this year he's gotta be out.
Interesting insight, Ners.
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In 2017 our offense was pretty close to Nova's......last year we were closer to the 2nd best offense in the country then the 2nd best offense in the country was to Nova.
As good a coach as Wright is I'm not expecting them to be that good every year. They had the 2nd best offense in the Ken Pom era last season...... ..2015 UW was the best.
In 2013 Nova's offense wasn't in the top 100. They have been top 25 every year since.
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Interesting insight, Ners.
Lol yup. He had everyone on Scoop fooled for...well, all of 0 posts. Good stuff.
I can't imagine a situation where I get banned from a website and keep making new name after new name. I think after the first one I might think to myself, what in the hell am I doing with my life that I'm getting banned from a website? And what am I doing with my life that I can't live it without going back to a website that has banned me over and over again.
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In 2017 our offense was pretty close to Nova's......last year we were closer to the 2nd best offense in the country then the 2nd best offense in the country was to Nova.
As good a coach as Wright is I'm not expecting them to be that good every year. They had the 2nd best offense in the Ken Pom era last season...... ..2015 UW was the best.
In 2013 Nova's offense wasn't in the top 100. They have been top 25 every year since.
You really aren't going to expect them to be a top 5 team every year? They've been the absolute best program in the nation over the last 5 years and any doubt for this to continue is pretty foolish as long as Jay is at the helm. 165-21 record, 2 national championships, 4 Big East regular season titles, 3 Big East Tournament titles, and no back-to-back losses in this span. If there are any signs of slowing down I'd like to hear them. If you really want to get into stats and Ken Pom, then look at the efficiency ratings this past season. Nova #1 offense, #11 defense vs. Marquette #12 offense, #182 defense. There's one very glaring number there and that simply can't be the case if we want to have a chance at competing with them, and isn't that the goal?
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Lol yup. He had everyone on Scoop fooled for...well, all of 0 posts. Good stuff.
I can't imagine a situation where I get banned from a website and keep making new name after new name. I think after the first one I might think to myself, what in the hell am I doing with my life that I'm getting banned from a website? And what am I doing with my life that I can't live it without going back to a website that has banned me over and over again.
Not sure who ners is, just an objective take from someone with both MU and Nova connections. Got the wrong guy fellas.
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Not sure who ners is, just an objective take from someone with both MU and Nova connections. Got the wrong guy fellas.
Wow. What coincidental timing that is! ::)
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Wow. What coincidental timing that is! ::)
Did Ners' latest iteration get banned?
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Not sure who ners is, just an objective take from someone with both MU and Nova connections. Got the wrong guy fellas.
MU is "we" and Nova is "them"? Well, OK. I'll play along for a little bit. I've misidentified banned posters adopting new identities before, and I'll do it again, I'm sure.
If you're not Ners, a million apologies. Nobody should be condemned in that fashion.
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As someone who just started following this board during the 2017-18 season can someone please explain who/what ners is? Thanks
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As someone who just started following this board during the 2017-18 season can someone please explain who/what ners is? Thanks
He is an old poster whom a handful of other guys feel the need to pile on and argue with incessantly to the point of ruining every thread. For as bad as Ners and his reincarnations are the guys that choose to argue his every post are even worse. See the recently locked thread, which was prolly the most pathetic string in the history of this board.
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Interesting insight, Ners.
Wow, this is like starting to play "Where's Waldo."
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Some of you guys are complete morons. bias idiots that’s all I can say. This conference is NOT, I reapeat NOT established as an elite conference yet. it NEEDS good teams to be there every year. why ppl want everyone on nova to leave just so mu might move up a spot is beyond me. How about aspire to rise to their level, not hope they fall to ours. The conference will be very week next season. Bunch of teams loosing a lot. I’m worried. Hope DD Omari stock around so the big east has at least one top 15 team.
I've gone around a few times with the morons and biased idiots, but I keep reading them because they make great statistical and analitical sense. On paper they make sense, in the real world it is a lot of wishful thinking and lots of what if's. I'd like to see the NBE win more games pre season against real competition and in tournament's.
Until then I'll enjoy the ride and hope the T.V. $$$ keep rolling in.
Back when the T.V. contract was being negotiated the M's and B.I's did some creditable analysis of why the NBE was going to be so wonderful.
In my opinion time is running out, the league needs to up it's game on all fronts.
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I've gone around a few times with the morons and biased idiots, but I keep reading them because they make great statistical and analitical sense. On paper they make sense, in the real world it is a lot of wishful thinking and lots of what if's. I'd like to see the NBE win more games pre season against real competition and in tournament's.
Until then I'll enjoy the ride and hope the T.V. $$$ keep rolling in.
Back when the T.V. contract was being negotiated the M's and B.I's did some creditable analysis of why the NBE was going to be so wonderful.
In my opinion time is running out, the league needs to up it's game on all fronts.
We just finished a season where two of our teams were #1 seeds in the NCAA Tournament and one of those teams won the National Title.
The rock you live under must be well appointed.
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I've gone around a few times with the morons and biased idiots, but I keep reading them because they make great statistical and analitical sense. On paper they make sense, in the real world it is a lot of wishful thinking and lots of what if's. I'd like to see the NBE win more games pre season against real competition and in tournament's.
Until then I'll enjoy the ride and hope the T.V. $$$ keep rolling in.
Back when the T.V. contract was being negotiated the M's and B.I's did some creditable analysis of why the NBE was going to be so wonderful.
In my opinion time is running out, the league needs to up it's game on all fronts.
Because Conference USA and the Great Midwest were so great...If you can't see the Big East as a top-5 league year in, year out then I don't really know what to tell you.
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As someone who just started following this board during the 2017-18 season can someone please explain who/what ners is? Thanks
Ners is a former high school basketball player who believes that makes him uniquely qualified to judge everything basketball-related. He is frequently wrong - as when he claimed that Rowsey would be no better than John "Magic" Dawson - but never admits it, confuses "fact" with "opinion" all the time, and often resorts to name-calling and other insults after he gets called out on his BS.
As a result, he has been banned multiple times - not just from this board but from other MU fan boards.
But he is addicted to the discourse, and he is desperate to show he is the smartest person in the room, so he keeps creating new accounts by using different names.
He doesn't like Wojo, so when a new name pops up and the comments are critical of Wojo, some of us theorize that Ners has been banned again and has created yet another new account.
And that's what I was guilty of doing a few posts ago.
I now see in another thread that Ners is still posting under Floorslapper, the name he is using as a derisive shot at Wojo. So I was wrong about Trust The Process being Ners. I already have apologized to him for the reference.
The kick to the whole thing is that sometimes Ners DOES offer some decent insight. But he can't help being Ners and he ruins most of his own posts.
And while I'm 'splainin' this ... might as well say the same is true of a former poster who went by chicos bail bonds. You'll see many references to "chicos" or "chico," who has been banned even more than Ners has. Heck, one of the times he resurfaced as Banny McBannerson!
Happy reading. We're all a bit nuts here - present company included - but some are nuttier than others.
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I dunno, though. TTP's post and avatar appear far too slick, and he's used a traditional Scoop meme for his username. Plus, he jumped right into the conversation with a detailed post. Seems suspicious that he's actually a first time poster. Doesn't sound like MUFINY - maybe some other poster is establishing a new identity in response to a banning or inevitable future banning. Heisy? We haven't heard from him in a while.
If you are a first time poster, welcome to the discussion. If you're one of those that recycle regularly, have at until you're sent away once again.
Edited to add: Shouldn't have assumed a male poster. And if you're a female poster, please hang around and help keep the guys classy, ai'na?
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MU82 forgot to mention Chicos name drops whenever possible.
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Ners is the chairman of the Derrick Wilson fan club.
Ps you were talking about Nova's offense......I said as good of a coach as Wright is I don't expact him to have an offense as good as he had last season year in and year out. It would be unprecedented .
Sorry I wasn't more clear.
I expect Nova to be a force to be dealt with as long as Wright is there. I don't expect them to be a top 5 team in the country every season. If you look at Pomeroy no school is top 5 every season. Not even Duke, NC or Kansas.
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I've gone around a few times with the morons and biased idiots, but I keep reading them because they make great statistical and analitical sense. On paper they make sense, in the real world it is a lot of wishful thinking and lots of what if's. I'd like to see the NBE win more games pre season against real competition and in tournament's.
Until then I'll enjoy the ride and hope the T.V. $$$ keep rolling in.
Back when the T.V. contract was being negotiated the M's and B.I's did some creditable analysis of why the NBE was going to be so wonderful.
In my opinion time is running out, the league needs to up it's game on all fronts.
I assume you mean non-conference play. Non-con play is what determines the bulk of conference rankings because it's the bulk of the time that leagues play against each other. So the best leagues in non-conference play are going to be the best rated leagues come the end of the season. Here are the Big East's season-by-season conference rankings:
2014
Pomeroy: 5
RPI: 4
2015
Pomeroy: 2
RPI: 2
2016
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 4
2017
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 3
2018
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 2
5-year Average
Pomeroy: 3.2
RPI: 3.0
The ACC and Big 12 are slightly ahead of us, but I think back in 2013 when we were kicking this off, anyone would have taken being solidly the 3rd best league in the country 5 years later. This is all based on the results of league vs league, so clearly we're doing pretty well when it comes to those preseason and tournament games.
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Ners is a former high school basketball player who could dunk and who believes that makes him uniquely qualified to judge everything basketball-related. He is frequently wrong - as when he claimed that Rowsey would be no better than John "Magic" Dawson - but never admits it, confuses "fact" with "opinion" all the time, and often resorts to name-calling and other insults after he gets called out on his BS.
As a result, he has been banned multiple times - not just from this board but from other MU fan boards.
But he is addicted to the discourse, and he is desperate to show he is the smartest person in the room, so he keeps creating new accounts by using different names.
He doesn't like Wojo, so when a new name pops up and the comments are critical of Wojo, some of us theorize that Ners has been banned again and has created yet another new account.
And that's what I was guilty of doing a few posts ago.
I now see in another thread that Ners is still posting under Floorslapper, the name he is using as a derisive shot at Wojo. So I was wrong about Trust The Process being Ners. I already have apologized to him for the reference.
The kick to the whole thing is that sometimes Ners DOES offer some decent insight. But he can't help being Ners and he ruins most of his own posts.
And while I'm 'splainin' this ... might as well say the same is true of a former poster who went by chicos bail bonds. You'll see many references to "chicos" or "chico," who has been banned even more than Ners has. Heck, one of the times he resurfaced as Banny McBannerson!
Happy reading. We're all a bit nuts here - present company included - but some are nuttier than others.
You forgot that very important bit of info.
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You forgot that very important bit of info.
Sorry Newsy. Won't let it happen again!
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I assume you mean non-conference play. Non-con play is what determines the bulk of conference rankings because it's the bulk of the time that leagues play against each other. So the best leagues in non-conference play are going to be the best rated leagues come the end of the season. Here are the Big East's season-by-season conference rankings:
2014
Pomeroy: 5
RPI: 4
2015
Pomeroy: 2
RPI: 2
2016
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 4
2017
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 3
2018
Pomeroy: 3
RPI: 2
5-year Average
Pomeroy: 3.2
RPI: 3.0
The ACC and Big 12 are slightly ahead of us, but I think back in 2013 when we were kicking this off, anyone would have taken being solidly the 3rd best league in the country 5 years later. This is all based on the results of league vs league, so clearly we're doing pretty well when it comes to those preseason and tournament games.
This exactly. And I almost like the current set up better now that we're five years in than the old BEast (which I also loved). 10 like-minded urban institutions, 5 in the midwest, 5 in the northeast, each with some sort of unique history, a lot of historical rivalries as well. The home & home setup is great too. Hope we can keep it as-is as long as possible.
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This exactly. And I almost like the current set up better now that we're five years in than the old BEast (which I also loved). 10 like-minded urban institutions, 5 in the midwest, 5 in the northeast, each with some sort of unique history, a lot of historical rivalries as well. The home & home setup is great too. Hope we can keep it as-is as long as possible.
Agreed. I think the Big 12 is also great, but other than that would take our league for entertainment value over anyone in the country. The ACC, SEC, Big 10, Pac-12 aren't even close. The double-round robin and geographical setup trumps anything they have. Yes, Creighton and Providence are a long way away, but the Midwest/Northeast split is ideal. The singular focus on basketball is ideal. And that we generally wipe the floor with most other leagues in non-con play also helps.
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We just finished a season where two of our teams were #1 seeds in the NCAA Tournament and one of those teams won the National Title.
The rock you live under must be well appointed.
Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
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Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
You're right, it's not like 70% of the teams in conference made the tournament a year ago. Wait...
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Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
Every major conference has one or two powers above the rest. The other teams ebb and flow.
Big 12 Kansas
Sec Kentucky
Big 10 Michigan St & maybe Michigan
Pac 12 Arizona & UCLA
ACC Duke & UNC
The Big East has done very well the last 5 years. But your anti-provincial bias can't see the forest for the trees.
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Every major conference has one or two powers above the rest. The other teams ebb and flow.
Big 12 Kansas
Sec Kentucky
Big 10 Michigan St & maybe Michigan
Pac 12 Arizona & UCLA
ACC Duke & UNC
The Big East has done very well the last 5 years. But your anti-provincial bias can't see the forest for the trees.
Big East henceforth: Villanova & Marquette
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Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
It's kind of interesting how you tout statistical analytics given that its been sucessfully used by others to show that you are wrong while you have used none yourself. ?-(
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Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
Who sent you from ESPN? Speak!
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Madison Ave. will decide, not West Wisconsin. Time will tell, I hope I'm around for the good news. Interesting how provincial thinking even goes for statistical analytics.
In other words, you can't build a league on one or two teams.
It just might be Mountain View, Menlo Park and Seattle who decide...
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Interesting stuff from Adam Zagoria. Wonder if this will lead to Spellman hiring an agent.
Omari Spellman of @NovaMBB
received an NBA Combine invite, per source.
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I'm pretty sure Spellman is gone. I think he ends up getting drafted just outside the lottery
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I'm pretty sure Spellman is gone. I think he ends up getting drafted just outside the lottery
I agree.
I've never been hired as an NBA general manager, believe it or not, but I think Spellman's game translates VERY well to the league and he could be a steal to a team drafting in that 15-25 range. I like his potential more than several bigs who will go earlier.
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Just stumbled onto this from Nova's version of Paint Touches:
Happy Friday Nova Nation! It’s been 53 days of “will they, won’t they?” with the NBA Draft decisions of Donte DiVincenzo and Omari Spellman, but there’s finally light at the end of the tunnel. This week we’ve seen a number of players, like Luke Maye of North Carolina and Sagaba Konate of West Virginia, announce that they’re withdrawing from the draft. With the NCAA’s deadline to remove their bids from the draft set for Wednesday, we could find out as soon as this weekend if the two Wildcat stars will return to the Main Line for another season.
The rumor mill for DiVincenzo seems to be leaning pretty hard towards staying in the draft and being picked in the first round. At yesterday’s workout with the Atlanta Hawks, the Big Ragu confirmed that he’ll wrap up his NBA workouts with the Warriors on Sunday, and make a decision on his draft status soon after. For those of you holding out hope that he could return, he was quoted saying, “I’m talking to coach Wright, gathering information where teams see me and where I’m projected. The mock drafts are different than what the GMs think.” Take that as you will.
Spellman, who has also been actively working out for a number of NBA teams, doesn’t have a clear timetable set out like his teammate. But I’d say it’s safe to assume that we’re looking at a similar time frame for his decision. While the rumor mill also has him leaning toward the NBA, it’s more of a 60/40 split than the “certainty” with which pundits are talking about DiVincenzo. The mock drafts that have some weight behind them have Spellman dropping into the early to mid second round, but as Donte said that doesn’t necessarily mean there isn’t a team out there willing to take him in the first.
Hard for me to believe that Spellman wouldn't be a first-round pick, but I am not a draftnik and I haven't analyzed everything out there. I definitely think he can play in the league. If DD really is a likely first-rounder, he gowne, obviously.
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I don't have the exact quote, but last week Spellman spoke to the effect that he would rather spend a year developing on a NBA bench than playing another year in college. I think him leaving is more certain than DD, and I think after the Combine, DD is gone.
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I would agree with you brew. Apparently Spellman didn’t distinguish himself in the combine, so the mock drafters are pushing him into the second round in recent drafts. Divincenzo, on the other hand, was brilliant enough that there’s a lot of talk of him in the first round right now. I think his stock is pretty high right now and he’ll stay. Sounds like Spellman would be happy with a G-league 2-way even, and I’m betting he’ll catch on somewhere.
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I don't have the exact quote, but last week Spellman spoke to the effect that he would rather spend a year developing on a NBA bench than playing another year in college. I think him leaving is more certain than DD, and I think after the Combine, DD is gone.
Also pretty sure Spellman himself is relatively old. Could be wrong
But he’s been in college for 2 years(with the 1 year sit out) and I think he might be old for his age.
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Also pretty sure Spellman himself is relatively old. Could be wrong
But he’s been in college for 2 years(with the 1 year sit out) and I think he might be old for his age.
You make Yogi proud with that one.
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Also pretty sure Spellman himself is relatively old. Could be wrong
But he’s been in college for 2 years(with the 1 year sit out) and I think he might be old for his age.
July 21, 1997.
Turns 21 in 2 months. Donovan Mitchell, the runaway choice for ROY, was the same age when drafted last year.
But yes, Spellman certainly might feel the clock is ticking.
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July 21, 1997.
Turns 21 in 2 months. Donovan Mitchell, the runaway choice for ROY, was the same age when drafted last year.
But yes, Spellman certainly might feel the clock is ticking.
Yup so he’s a older summer bday.
Getting drafted at 22 next year isn’t the end of the world.
But I think he’s best going now at 21 and trying to get his feet wet in the league.
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Spellman looks like an NBA player to me. I wonder if weight is a concern. He's fit now but he arrived on campus almost Davante size.
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Four of the top 33 players taken were from Nova.
I thought Spellman would be a first-rounder ... got in right at the buzzer in the "Jimmy spot."
Happy for Brunson that he got picked 33rd overall. I think he'll have a solid career.