MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: PGsHeroes32 on January 16, 2018, 09:00:40 PM
-
9 days off so figured this ok.
Is it realistic to expect we should be one of the top 3 teams in the BE next year?
Obviously there's a long way to go for rosters to change and I don't know much about any of the other teams recruiting classes
But it seems like most of these teams are losing a ton from graduation and if Nova has their studs leave early even they may be dethroneable.
Thoughts??
-
9 days off so figured this ok.
Is it realistic to expect we should be one of the top 3 teams in the BE next year?
Obviously there's a long way to go for rosters to change and I don't know much about any of the other teams recruiting classes
But it seems like most of these teams are losing a ton from graduation and if Nova has their studs leave early even they may be dethroneable.
Thoughts??
I believe we are going to be one of the top 3 teams this year.
-
Nova just reloads—they will be there.
-
I think we'll win the BEast next year if everyone stays and joins as planned
-
I've been thinking about next year.
We have the top three 3pt shooters in the BE right now (based on total makes).
Rowsey is a senior.
How is Joey's 3PG shot? Is it as good as Sam? Better? How about Bailey?
Can we still have the top three shooters in the league again next year?
-
Joey is a very good 3 point shooter. Sam is 1 of the best in the country so I wouldn't expect him to be quite that good.
-
Joey shoot 46% from 3pt, with 32% of his attempts being threes. Almost 90% from FT.
Bailey shot in the low 30% with about 40% of his shots from three. Just under 80% FT.
Sam was about 6-6 185 guard as a junior in high school. He's put on 40-50 pounds since then.
Joey was about 6-8 200 junior forward. A little bigger than Sam was at the same age. Will he also bulk up like Sam?
-
If we can play defense next year, we can do very well. That’s the ticket.
-
9 days off so figured this ok.
Is it realistic to expect we should be one of the top 3 teams in the BE next year?
Obviously there's a long way to go for rosters to change and I don't know much about any of the other teams recruiting classes
But it seems like most of these teams are losing a ton from graduation and if Nova has their studs leave early even they may be dethroneable.
Thoughts??
Sure it's realistic.
Big question is will you give everybody in this thread $100 if we finish ahead of Nova next season?
-
Yes. Just go down the Big East standings.
1. Villanova - Assuming Brunson, Bridges, and Spellman don't all go pro, they will be back at #1. (Should be better)
2. Xavier - Loses their two best players in Blueitt and Macura and 2/3 of their post players in Kanter and O'Mara. Bring in 3 3 star players and ivy league midseason transfer. (Should be worse)
3. Seton Hall - Loses their three best player and their 5th starter. Bring in two decent transfers and three low ranked three stars (should be worse)
4. Creighton - Lose on of their two stars in Foster. The other star Thomas could decide to go pro. Loses two bench players in Hegner and Suarez. Brings in a trio of players ranked between top 100-150 and a former top 100 comes off redshirt. (Better with Thomas, same or slightly worse without Thomas)
5. Marquette - Loses one of the big three in Rowsey and no one else. Brings in a top 50 player, a very good transfer, a former top 100 player coming off an LDS mission, and a three star coming off a redshirt. (should be better)
6. Providence - Loses three best players. Holt coming back is questionable. Brings in two top 50 recruits and two three star. (should be worse)
7. Butler - Loses best player and starting center. Brings in a solid midseason transfer and a low ranked 3 star (should be worse)
8-10 - Georgetown, DePaul, and SJU - too much ground to make up
Lot of time until the start of next season. Still a few recruitments to wrap up, grad transfer season, players transferring out/decomitting....but it looks like there could be a big power vacuum beneath Villanova. Us and Creighton are the two teams best positioned to step up and take that #2 spot.
-
If all of the'ifs' fall into place, MU could be competing for the top spot in the Big East next year.
If Wojo can find a PG ready to play immediately
If Wojo can figure out a rotation that keeps everybody happy.
If Joey recovers fully from his ankle injury.
If everyone continues to develop.
If the egos stay under control.
-
If all of the'ifs' fall into place, MU could be competing for the top spot in the Big East next year.
If Wojo can find a PG ready to play immediately
If Wojo can figure out a rotation that keeps everybody happy.
If Joey recovers fully from his ankle injury.
If everyone continues to develop.
If the egos stay under control.
If... defense.
-
If... defense.
Precisely
-
If... defense.
The defense will be better next year, Elliot will be starting and we will have only one bad on-ball defender to account for instead of two. We will be very long and will have a lot of tough interior players.
I expect us to have a top 75 defense per KenPom next year and a top 15 offense next year. We will be 1 or 2 in the Big East and in the top 10 nationally for the majority of the season.
-
yeah...defense. who the hell would have thought we'd be saying that about a wojo team when the dude was hired.
i hear a lot about how joey is better than sam, and for mu's sake, i hope that's true...but how many hs players each year do we say that about and they don't ever fully make the transition. sam is a REALLY good d1 basketball player. in my opinion he's earned the right to have that conversation flipped around to "can joey be as good as sam."
-
yeah...defense. who the hell would have thought we'd be saying that about a wojo team when the dude was hired.
i hear a lot about how joey is better than sam, and for mu's sake, i hope that's true...but how many hs players each year do we say that about and they don't ever fully make the transition. sam is a REALLY good d1 basketball player. in my opinion he's earned the right to have that conversation flipped around to "can joey be as good as sam."
I think with Joey having a year off his senior year we should pump the breaks on expectations, at least initially
-
I think with Joey having a year off his senior year we should pump the breaks on expectations, at least initially
It's fair, and we also don't need Joey Hauser to be super good next year, especially in non-conference. We can ease him in.
Besides we'll still have Matt Heldt, #1 most efficient play in the NCAA next year, we'll be fine.
-
Joey is 1-2 inches taller than Sam, more athletic, not quite as good of a shooter. I'd anticipate Joey being in the 35-39% area on 3s.
Joey also needs time in the weight room to add muscle. If Joey can get to 235 by his sophomore year, he'll be a stud. Joey should still be a nice contributor as a frosh but I think he'll need some time to become a star.
-
in my opinion he's earned the right to have that conversation flipped around to "can joey be as good as sam."
Yep, as good as joey is and as highly ranked as he is, Sam is on a trajectory to be a first team all conference player some day. Will be very difficult for Joey to outperform that. If I had to guess now, I’d say he won’t be as good as Sam. Not a shot at Joey but rather a statement of how good Sam is.
-
As for the rest of the roster, we need to see if Wojo adds a guard and whom. Plus, how do players develop? Froling and John might be a lot better by the end of the year, or they might not.
Cain either Cain or Elliot make a big leap? How good is Morrow: A solid role player or a very good starter?
Lots of questions, lots of fun possibilities. Will be interesting to see how it all works out.
-
The defense will be better next year, Elliot will be starting and we will have only one bad on-ball defender to account for instead of two. We will be very long and will have a lot of tough interior players.
I expect us to have a top 75 defense per KenPom next year and a top 15 offense next year. We will be 1 or 2 in the Big East and in the top 10 nationally for the majority of the season.
The brakes are on the left, bud. Might want to give em a tap.
We should be better next year than this year, but top 10 for most of the year? Let's manage our expectations a bit on that. I think we should be ranked, but there is a huge leap from 25 to 10. Plus, with so many new guys expected to be getting minutes, we may have issues with finding the right personnel and rotations. There's going to be a learning curve.
I also don't know if Greg ends up starting. We're most likely going to start 2 bigs - Morrow and Heldt/Theo/Harry - and then Sam and Markus. That only leaves one open spot. Assuming we don't get a PG grad transfer, I think there's a pretty strong chance that Markus gets tapped to shift to point. He needs to improve his handles to get there, but we're already comfortable with a shoot-first PG, so the transition from Rowsey to Howard would be pretty easy. In that case, Greg will have to compete with Jamal and Sacar, possibly even Joey and Bailey, for the last spot. If we get the grad transfer that scoop has been talking about, then I think it could be tough for Greg to crack the starting lineup.
Without the grad transfer, there's a decent chance that the 5th starter changes regularly based on matchups, and in that case, Greg may get some starts. But if I had to bet, I'm guessing he's coming off the bench in the majority of our games. I'd consider this one of those good problems to have.
-
Joey is 1-2 inches taller than Sam, more athletic, not quite as good of a shooter. I'd anticipate Joey being in the 35-39% area on 3s.
Joey also needs time in the weight room to add muscle. If Joey can get to 235 by his sophomore year, he'll be a stud. Joey should still be a nice contributor as a frosh but I think he'll need some time to become a star.
Given that Joey's not playing this year, I wonder if he's focusing his energy in the weight room, and building some of that necessary muscle now. Are trainers from the schools where a player has committed allowed to inform/guide them before they arrive on campus?
-
Yep, as good as joey is and as highly ranked as he is, Sam is on a trajectory to be a first team all conference player some day. Will be very difficult for Joey to outperform that. If I had to guess now, I’d say he won’t be as good as Sam. Not a shot at Joey but rather a statement of how good Sam is.
crap, Sam should be borderline first team all conference THIS season. Dude is just so good.
-
Joey isn't some scrawny kid. Joey is very solidly built. I'm not sure that he's more athletic than Sam, either.
I think Joey will be a big time contributor right away. No, not one of the top 3 players on the team (I think that goes to Sam, Markus, and Ed), but I wouldn't be shocked if he's our 4th best player next season.
-
Joey isn't some scrawny kid. Joey is very solidly built. I'm not sure that he's more athletic than Sam, either.
I think Joey will be a big time contributor right away. No, not one of the top 3 players on the team (I think that goes to Sam, Markus, and Ed), but I wouldn't be shocked if he's our 4th best player next season.
This is the impression I've had of Joey as well. With him sitting out his senior year due to injury, he may be on a different trajectory skill-wise and size-wise than he was when he signed his LOI.
Does anyone know what Joey's limitations are now with his injury? Is he still able to shoot and lift, or is he pretty limited physically? I'm hoping he can still spend time in the gym even if he's not able to play at game speed right now.
-
As of right now, I believe this is what the team will look like:
C: Theo, Froling and Heldt
SF: Sam (no brainer)
PF: Morrow (6ft 7, 235 pounds who averaged 8 rebounds pg in Big Ten)
G: Howard (no brainer)
G: Elliott
Reserves:
Center position is set with the three bigs. Froling comes in for Sam now, but that might change next year because of Morrow playing the PF.
SF: Cain/Bailey comes in for Sam
PF: Joey/Froling comes in for Morrow
G: Sacar comes in
The team is short in the guard position and they must get a grad transfer to fill that role. If they get a high level, experienced guard, MU will be a tough out in the BE. Howard and Elliott will work out fine, but apprehensive with Sacar handling the ball. That is only potential trouble spot for the team.
Hope Joey is what the analysts say every single game....."MU received commitment from Sam's brother Joey, who recruiting services say he might be even better than his brother".
-
crap, Sam should be borderline first team all conference THIS season. Dude is just so good.
I've got him as borderline second team this season. He's really good but their are some studs in this conference. Brunson, Bridges, Spellman Delgado, Rodriguez, Carrington, Blueitt, Foster, Thomas, Krampelj, Martin, Ponds, Govan, Cartwright, Bullock, Strus all have solid arguments to be All Big East players this season. Not to mention our big three.
-
The defense will be better next year, Elliot will be starting and we will have only one bad on-ball defender to account for instead of two. We will be very long and will have a lot of tough interior players.
I expect us to have a top 75 defense per KenPom next year and a top 15 offense next year. We will be 1 or 2 in the Big East and in the top 10 nationally for the majority of the season.
I love the optimism here, and obviously all of us here hope it plays out like this. You've always been a knowledgeable, pragmatic guy, so this sounds great to me.
However, although it isn't pie-in-the-sky unrealistic, as others have said there an awful lot of "ifs."
Always comes back to my most-used phrase in any kind of lookahead situation:
We'll see.
-
I've got him as borderline second team this season. He's really good but their are some studs in this conference. Brunson, Bridges, Spellman Delgado, Rodriguez, Carrington, Blueitt, Foster, Thomas, Krampelj, Martin, Ponds, Govan, Cartwright, Bullock, Strus all have solid arguments to be All Big East players this season. Not to mention our big three.
I was being a bit hyperbolic. Point is, kid is clearly a first team all big east player as and upperclassman, and a potential all american. He is that good. He's gotten more aggressive offensively lately, but I can only imagine how good he'll be next year and as a senior. Its exciting.
-
As of right now, I believe this is what the team will look like:
C: Theo, Froling and Heldt
SF: Sam (no brainer)
PF: Morrow (6ft 7, 235 pounds who averaged 8 rebounds pg in Big Ten)
G: Howard (no brainer)
G: Elliott
Reserves:
Center position is set with the three bigs. Froling comes in for Sam now, but that might change next year because of Morrow playing the PF.
SF: Cain/Bailey comes in for Sam
PF: Joey/Froling comes in for Morrow
G: Sacar comes in
The team is short in the guard position and they must get a grad transfer to fill that role. If they get a high level, experienced guard, MU will be a tough out in the BE. Howard and Elliott will work out fine, but apprehensive with Sacar handling the ball. That is only potential trouble spot for the team.
Hope Joey is what the analysts say every single game....."MU received commitment from Sam's brother Joey, who recruiting services say he might be even better than his brother".
Agree with most of this but will point out that Sam, Cain, and possibly Bailey could all potentially play the 2 in a big lineup so that gives them a little more flexibility at guard.
I think a lineup of
Howard
Cain
S Hauser
Morrow
Theo/Harry/Matt
could work very well IMHO. Size at every position except the point. Speed at just about every position except center. Three high level outside shooters combined with a solid rebounding center and an elite rebounding forward? Yes please.
-
Awesome post from JayBee re: Joey's advanced stats
http://latenighthoops.com/joey-hauser-advanced-stats-adidas-uprising/#.Wl97X66nGUk
Combine that with his raw measurables and relation to an outperformer like Sam, if he's fully healthy from the surgery I think a lot of you are drastically underestimating him.
-
Agree with most of this but will point out that Sam, Cain, and possibly Bailey could all potentially play the 2 in a big lineup so that gives them a little more flexibility at guard.
I think a lineup of
Howard
Cain
S Hauser
Morrow
Theo/Harry/Matt
could work very well IMHO. Size at every position except the point. Speed at just about every position except center. Three high level outside shooters combined with a solid rebounding center and an elite rebounding forward? Yes please.
Or even Sam at the 2 and Joey at the 3.
-
Awesome post from JayBee re: Joey's advanced stats
http://latenighthoops.com/joey-hauser-advanced-stats-adidas-uprising/#.Wl97X66nGUk
Combine that with his raw measurables and relation to an outperformer like Sam, if he's fully healthy from the surgery I think a lot of you are drastically underestimating him.
#ftsmatta
Driving up the ORtg was Joey’s ability to get to the free throw line. His impressive free throw rate of 56.8% was complemented by making more than 90% of his attempts.
-
All the posters worrying about whether Joey would be ready due to injury etc (which were valid concerns) can breath easier with him being enrolled at MU. He will be ready.
-
The brakes are on the left, bud. Might want to give em a tap.
We should be better next year than this year, but top 10 for most of the year? Let's manage our expectations a bit on that. I think we should be ranked, but there is a huge leap from 25 to 10. Plus, with so many new guys expected to be getting minutes, we may have issues with finding the right personnel and rotations. There's going to be a learning curve.
I also don't know if Greg ends up starting. We're most likely going to start 2 bigs - Morrow and Heldt/Theo/Harry - and then Sam and Markus. That only leaves one open spot. Assuming we don't get a PG grad transfer, I think there's a pretty strong chance that Markus gets tapped to shift to point. He needs to improve his handles to get there, but we're already comfortable with a shoot-first PG, so the transition from Rowsey to Howard would be pretty easy. In that case, Greg will have to compete with Jamal and Sacar, possibly even Joey and Bailey, for the last spot. If we get the grad transfer that scoop has been talking about, then I think it could be tough for Greg to crack the starting lineup.
Without the grad transfer, there's a decent chance that the 5th starter changes regularly based on matchups, and in that case, Greg may get some starts. But if I had to bet, I'm guessing he's coming off the bench in the majority of our games. I'd consider this one of those good problems to have.
First, this is what an internet message board is for. Second, Markus is definitely playing the point, and the 2 is going to be either Elliot or Sacar with Heldt/Morrow/Theo at the 5, Sam at the 3 and Froling at the 4. That is instantly a better defensive team than we have now.
Next year we will have a combination of talent and experience that not a lot of teams will have, not to mention there will be a lot of talent leaving for the big show after this season. We'll be a top 25 team at some point this season....no reason we can't turn that into a top 10 ranking next season assuming everyone stays, yada, yada, yada
-
First, this is what an internet message board is for. Second, Markus is definitely playing the point, and the 2 is going to be either Elliot or Sacar with Heldt/Morrow/Theo at the 5, Sam at the 3 and Froling at the 4. That is instantly a better defensive team than we have now.
Next year we will have a combination of talent and experience that not a lot of teams will have, not to mention there will be a lot of talent leaving for the big show after this season. We'll be a top 25 team at some point this season....no reason we can't turn that into a top 10 ranking next season assuming everyone stays, yada, yada, yada
Love the optimism.
-
Value add puts Hauser on BE 1st team. Howard and Rowsey 2nd team. Article on Dodds site.
-
No, Joey is not scrawny like Cain and Elliott but he isn't exactly Theo John either. I'm excited to see what Todd can do with Joey during the early enrollment period. That could make a big difference for Joey's frosh year.
-
I foresee a lot of matchup switching. I think you will see games when Morrow is playing as a versatile 5 in situations where we want to run and gun. It's going to be fun - esp in non-con - watching the pieces come together.
-
T-Rank has MU as the 15th best team in the last 10 games(8th offense/ 71st defense). Obviously a smaller sample but I think that's partially believable. This team has been much better since the freshmen have grown a bit.
http://www.barttorvik.com/team.php?team=Marquette
-
T-Rank has MU as the 15th best team in the last 10 games(8th offense/ 71st defense). Obviously a smaller sample but I think that's partially believable. This team has been much better since the freshmen have grown a bit.
http://www.barttorvik.com/team.php?team=Marquette
I love when you post. . . mostly because I love watching that highlight in your signature.
-
First, this is what an internet message board is for. Second, Markus is definitely playing the point, and the 2 is going to be either Elliot or Sacar with Heldt/Morrow/Theo at the 5, Sam at the 3 and Froling at the 4. That is instantly a better defensive team than we have now.
Next year we will have a combination of talent and experience that not a lot of teams will have, not to mention there will be a lot of talent leaving for the big show after this season. We'll be a top 25 team at some point this season....no reason we can't turn that into a top 10 ranking next season assuming everyone stays, yada, yada, yada
markus at the point has to happen for his own development i would think...that said, i'd be shocked if wojo didn't find a grad transfer that had good handles because markus has questionable handles at times and he's also susceptible to foul trouble. i wouldn't sleep well at night if i were wojo and i knew markus was my only option at point. perhaps GE can put some work in this summer...but i remember a former coach playing with one point guard and when TD went down it was ugly.
-
I love when you post. . . mostly because I love watching that highlight in your signature.
I sometimes watch it 10+ times after I post just because that game went from sadness to madness in mere seconds. Good memories
-
markus at the point has to happen for his own development i would think...that said, i'd be shocked if wojo didn't find a grad transfer that had good handles because markus has questionable handles at times and he's also susceptible to foul trouble. i wouldn't sleep well at night if i were wojo and i knew markus was my only option at point. perhaps GE can put some work in this summer...but i remember a former coach playing with one point guard and when TD went down it was ugly.
That team had Diener, Bell, and the immortal Niv Berkowitz- 3 PG. Diener and Bell both got hurt. Niv stunk and I think left before the season ended.
But your premise is correct.
-
I sometimes watch it 10+ times after I post just because that game went from sadness to madness in mere seconds. Good memories
I had thrown my phone at the wall about 90 seconds prior to that. Shattered the screen. DNGAF after the Vander and Jamal heroics.
-
In my memory, Berkowitz never even saw the court for Marquette. But apparently he did during the 2004-05 season:
7 G
34 MIN
0-3 2PT
1-3 3PT
5-8 FT
1 REB
5 AST
2 STL
6 TO
8 PTS
So that's 1.1 ppg and 0.7 apg. (He's still playing in the Israeli Premier League today.) Brandon Bell averaged 1.5 ppg and 0.4 apg as a freshman the previous season, but wasn't on the roster for 2004-05. At one point after Diener's injury, I remember Marcus Jackson bringing the ball up the court.
-
I had thrown my phone at the wall about 90 seconds prior to that. Shattered the screen. DNGAF after the Vander and Jamal heroics.
I also love that Davante was there protecting the rim just in case he missed
-
The defense will be better next year, Elliot will be starting and we will have only one bad on-ball defender to account for instead of two. We will be very long and will have a lot of tough interior players.
I expect us to have a top 75 defense per KenPom next year and a top 15 offense next year. We will be 1 or 2 in the Big East and in the top 10-20 nationally for the majority of the season.
I only disagree where noted.
-
Another team struggling to defend the high pick and roll. Jake Thomas standing in the corner being face guarded while Vander goes right behind the guy to the rim. Jamil flying in for the tip that never came. A well drawn up, well executed play that shows another way to defend the pick and roll and why no way is foolproof.
-
Another team struggling to defend the high pick and roll. Jake Thomas standing in the corner being face guarded while Vander goes right behind the guy to the rim. Jamil flying in for the tip that never came. A well drawn up, well executed play that shows another way to defend the pick and roll and why no way is foolproof.
Ran into Home Team at the bar in Lexington that night. We asked him what his call was on that play. He said he didn't remember, "But it was probably something like, 'They're guarding Jake Thomas in the corner while giving up a layup to Vander Blue?! Why do you even have a defender on that side of the court?!'"
-
A subtle move by Buzz, subbing Jake for Lockett. Davison fell for it. The other thing is why would you have your big trail Davante to the top of the key? Because of all the 18 ft jumpers he hit during his career? (Hint for the slow... not many). Sag and maybe force Blue to pull up.
-
That team had Diener, Bell, and the immortal Niv Berkowitz- 3 PG. Diener and Bell both got hurt. Niv stunk and I think left before the season ended.
But your premise is correct.
I forgot about those two...but to be fair...MU only had one pg that year. Was this the reason Crean promised to recruit a pg each year or am I remembering years/coaches?
-
Another team struggling to defend the high pick and roll. Jake Thomas standing in the corner being face guarded while Vander goes right behind the guy to the rim. Jamil flying in for the tip that never came. A well drawn up, well executed play that shows another way to defend the pick and roll and why no way is foolproof.
Holy moving screen on Davante
-
On a different note for next year, DI Council approves proposal moving up start of men's and women's basketball season to the Tuesday immediately before the second Friday in November.
-
Holy moving screen on Davante
Very true, but the fact that Davidson switched and that it was the last play of a tournament game means it doesn't get called.
-
The actual screen wasn't bad. On the roll, he maintains contact with the defender.
-
An example of why playing to the scouting report isn't always the right thing for a player. No way Jake Thomas is taking a three from the corner in that situation but I'm sure the scouting report was "Thomas only shoots threes stay in his grill."
-
An example of why playing to the scouting report isn't always the right thing for a player. No way Jake Thomas is taking a three from the corner in that situation but I'm sure the scouting report was "Thomas only shoots threes stay in his grill."
Could you imagine if he actually made some of those threes? Most overrated "sharp shooter" ever
-
Could you imagine if he actually made some of those threes? Most overrated "sharp shooter" ever
He did shoot nearly 40% his senior year. But I agree...Thomas was a mid major level player.
-
I forgot about those two...but to be fair...MU only had one pg that year. Was this the reason Crean promised to recruit a pg each year or am I remembering years/coaches?
I might have my years confused. I'll have to go back and research the roster timeline.
-
I forgot about those two...but to be fair...MU only had one pg that year. Was this the reason Crean promised to recruit a pg each year or am I remembering years/coaches?
I think it was Buzz that wanted a PG each year. Maybe a center too.
-
Ok, I had forgotten Bell took his medical leave of absence and never played in 04-05. But he was supposed to be the backup PG.
-
Love watching that GIF, baby. It's still unbelievable that we won that effen game.
I hadn't realized until just now that Jamil really slammed on the brakes at the end there. Pretty hilarious to just watch that.
Jake ... swell kid, I'm sure, but part of one of the worst high-major starting backcourts in history.