MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: 4everwarriors on May 29, 2017, 10:37:03 AM
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DUI...not good, hey?
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Most dominant athlete of a generation to a complete downward spiral. Really, really sad.
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http://www.tmz.com
Locked up about a mile from my house.
Was headed home from the Thirsty Turtle Bar in Juno Beach.
Didn't even know he drank and maybe he should have had he assistant drive him. Idiot.....
Arrest photo will become a classic for celeb arrests.
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Datz a chit-faced look if der ever wuz won, ai na?
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Was there a waitress in his ride when arrested?
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Most dominant athlete of a generation to a complete downward spiral. Really, really sad.
actually, this seems to be the first trouble he's been in since his "ex" took a 3-wood to his windshield. so unless i'm missing something, he's been behaving himself. "buzzed driving" is never cool, but i wouldn't write him off as going in to a "downward spiral" just yet. again, unless i'm missing something else.
btw, wouldn't ya think the guy could afford uber or something?? chit, he could've ordered a helicopter ride
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Datz a chit-faced look if der ever wuz won, ai na?
looks like he needs a hug, heyheyheyn'a? ;)
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My buddy was in the cell with him... the tiger cried a little... he says his sh.ts smelled glorious. He tried to scoop it out and bronze it for memoriam.
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From green jacket ta green in da gills, ai na?
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they're saying he's going to lose some more of his $70 million/year or so sponsors(rolex, nike, indian motorcycle, kowo pharm...), but i don't think you will see him doing walmart anytime soon. net worth around $800mil
da heck is indian moto and a japanese drug company want from a golfer? unless the pharm. co. has vee-agray and winsterol? i could see indian trying to get rickie fowler however
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i could see indian trying to get rickie fowler however
Because he's part Native American?
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Neva cease ta bee amazed how doze dat have da world bye da curly cues, seem ta fook up properity, hey?
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Because he's part Native American?
rickie was big into motocross but was persuaded to give it up, i'm assuming, so he wouldn't have to join the special olympics pga
http://racerxonline.com/2011/04/07/former-racer-turned-pga-golfer-rickie-fowler-on-tv-this-weekend
even though, i believe, indian is better known for it's road bikes as opposed to off road, but just sayin
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Tiger says he had no booze, hey?
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Tiger says he had no booze, hey?
then he should have blown into the booze whistle and it would have come out smelling like a bean burrito or something, eyn'er?
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Tiger says he had no booze, hey?
Maybe it wuz a steroid reaction at 3 am? Da idiot wood be better off shuttin' up, bendin' over, and takin' his medicine ratter den tryin' ta continue playin' everyone for a fool, ai na?
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PD report comes out tomorrow and from local news here, he told officer he wasn't taking breath test and officer described him as being a jerk. No alcohol, why not take a breath test.......... Media is attempting, with great interest, to obtain any footage from dash-cam or officer cam/recorders.
If anything interesting come out from local news here, I'll post.
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mistake
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Tiger says he had no booze, hey?
Then he should have blown into the Breathalyzer.
Not buying it....
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Or he could've been high on a PGA banned substance and not wanted to have been tested for that so knowing he was going to fail his field sobriety test he might've just said screw it I'll take the legal punishment but be able to deny I had anything in my body that would get me suspended.
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today it is reported that he had 0.0000 alcohol in his system. must be some pretty good pain meds going. like this was the first time he took pain meds given his history of surgeries? that is pain mis-management and he obviously should not have been driving. it will be interesting how his attorney$ will be handling this for him
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#FreeTiger
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http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/crime--law/update-tiger-woods-asleep-wheel-dui-arrest-police-say/MlL0LPoV7rL6uNtOBh87xI/
Guess he took breath, zero. Meds knocked him out probably. Changes perception bit, but still shouldn't have been behind wheel.
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http://southpark.cc.com/clips/267344/pre-nup-power-up
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Look at all you jabronis now.
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next comes the public apology tour and...rehab
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Then he should have blown into the Breathalyzer.
Not buying it....
Prescription drugs including Vicodin to relieve back pain.
Buy it.
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http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/05/30/tiger-woods-ex-mistress-on-dui-arrest-its-kind-sad.html
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Prescription drugs including Vicodin to relieve back pain.
Buy it.
Sources say he got 'em from Rush "All Drug Users Should Go To Prison" Limbaugh.
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Sources say he got 'em from Rush "All Drug Users Should Go To Prison" Limbaugh.
I believe you just got political.
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http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/05/30/tiger-woods-ex-mistress-on-dui-arrest-its-kind-sad.html
I don't want to give them the clicks; can you just plagiarize it Heisey style? This would be justified, though
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Sources say he got 'em from Rush "All Drug Users Should Go To Prison" Limbaugh.
Your weakness again? Please stop with the politics. Again.
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Sources say he got 'em from Rush "All Drug Users Should Go To Prison" Limbaugh.
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/3o7TKKLJavDVEg6fKg/giphy.gif)
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Vicodin and Xanax. That will do it. I'm buying it.
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Vicodin and Xanax. That will do it. I'm buying it.
[/quote
Don't do it, man. Ya gonna throw yo life away, hey?
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Well played. I have never been a fan of Tiger's, but this story makes sense.
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Yes, makes perfect sense. But, still shows him as a very flawed, pathetic character, ai na?
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It shows him as just another soul who, after back surgery, took addictive pain killers. Similar stories are the root of the current opioid problem. It actually humanizes him.
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It shows him as just another soul who, after back surgery, took addictive pain killers. Similar stories are the root of the current opioid problem. It actually humanizes him.
this and all the others...it all started with fill in the blank surgery and...i can understand it's caused a number of people to get addicted, but it has become most everyone's "excuse". i'm sorry but, i think many of these people just got lazy and it started feeling pretty damn good and hey! i can walk around a little buzzed and not even smell like bad russian vodka. when i had surgery requiring some pain meds, i wrote down exactly what time i took each dose so as not to abuse or run the risk of getting addicted if you will. when i took 1 or 2 every 4-6 hours(the usual and customary dosages), it took the pain away, no buzz and after a few days, i didn't need them anymore. ok, not all people were properly educated on how to take them and the docs and/or pharmacies were letting this go some, but far too many use the knee, back, wrist, shoulder, car accident...excuse. most of it is weak people with addictive behaviors getting sloppy and figured they could do this and not get called out on it until they started robbing houses and injecting
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One more thing-xanax ain't a pain reliever
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Xanax is an anti depressant. So, Favre was just another weakling? FWIW, I agree with your notion of being careful and proactive. For similar reasons, I have always refused the prescription painkillers offered to me post surgery, getting by on ibuprofen and baptized. I truly believe that prescription painkillers are way over prescribed. But saying that you are tired of hearing about it doesn't make it less true.
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Xanax is an anti depressant. So, Favre was just another weakling? FWIW, I agree with your notion of being careful and proactive. For similar reasons, I have always refused the prescription painkillers offered to me post surgery, getting by on ibuprofen and baptized. I truly believe that prescription painkillers are way over prescribed. But saying that you are tired of hearing about it doesn't make it less true.
Xanax isn't an antidepressant; it's an anti-anxiety drug.
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Xanax isn't an antidepressant; it's an anti-anxiety drug.
Sure is, very necessary drug for people as well. Mental illness is no joke.
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Xanax isn't an antidepressant; it's an anti-anxiety drug.
You are correct and I know better. My fingers and brain were not properly in sync. Mea culpa.
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You are correct and I know better. My fingers and brain were not properly in sync. Mea culpa.
Fahrenheit 451, ya maybe oughta take a field sobriety test and pleze don't text and drive, hey?
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"So, Favre was just another weakling?"
"most of it is weak people with addictive behaviors getting sloppy"
note i said most.
brett favre got very sloppy. whether or not he is/was weak? maybe. once addiction sets in, it's like boiling the frog-addicted person doesn't realize it until the consequences begin to outweigh the pleasure. and sometimes that doesn't matter either.
the "pain clinics" were nasty. they'd treat the pain with narcotics without addressing the root cause. prescribing hundreds at a time. if i prescribe 25-30 after a nasty extraction(s), that's it. the addition of prescription drug monitoring programs have helped immensely
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The only person I ever got on for abusing painkillers: Rush Effen Limbaugh.
Not long after saying all drug abusers should do hard time, he gets caught abusing drugs. Plus, a guy who spends hours and hours screaming about Medicaid fraud and welfare fraud - "They should go to jail!" - committed fraud for years in acquiring his drugs. Funny how Rush didn't insist he do hard time ... and how his sheeple have totally given him a pass.
Tiger's situation sounds nothing like this (if we are getting all the info accurately). Favre's was closer, but not to Limbaugh's extreme.
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The only person I ever got on for abusing painkillers: Rush Effen Limbaugh.
Not long after saying all drug abusers should do hard time, he gets caught abusing drugs. Plus, a guy who spends hours and hours screaming about Medicaid fraud and welfare fraud - "They should go to jail!" - committed fraud for years in acquiring his drugs. Funny how Rush didn't insist he do hard time ... and how his sheeple have totally given him a pass.
Tiger's situation sounds nothing like this (if we are getting all the info accurately). Favre's was closer, but not to Limbaugh's extreme.
sounds like you need a xanax, errr something
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sounds like you need a xanax, errr something
Nope. I just need Limbaugh to insist that he go to jail because he surely doesn't want to be a hypocrite.
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Regardless of whether it was alcohol or prescription meds, he should have known better. Drugs like Vicodin and Xanax come with clear warnings not to drive or operate heavy machinery until you know how they affect you. If he was just starting to take them - not knowing how he would respond - it was irresponsible to drive...and probably illegal.
So OK - now I buy that it was prescription pain meds. But that still is no excuse.
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Regardless of whether it was alcohol or prescription meds, he should have known better. Drugs like Vicodin and Xanax come with clear warnings not to drive or operate heavy machinery until you know how they affect you. If he was just starting to take them - not knowing how he would respond - it was irresponsible to drive...and probably illegal.
So OK - now I buy that it was prescription pain meds. But that still is no excuse.
Agreed. If he had killed somebody, that somebody would have been no less dead just because Tiger had taken Xanax instead of a 12-pack of Guinness.
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Agreed. If he had killed somebody, that somebody would have been no less dead just because Tiger had taken Xanax instead of a 12-pack of Guinness.
But it's classier to be strung on prescription meds than beer or street drugs.
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He's checking into rehab so there goes that excuse that he just didn't know the drugs he took would affect him that way.
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But it's classier to be strung on prescription meds than beer or street drugs.
Yep. That's why Rush believes a poor black guy caught with $50 of crack should do 20 years while a rich white guy guilty of fraud and opioid abuse should get a $50 million broadcasting contract.
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Yep. That's why Rush believes a poor black guy caught with $50 of crack should do 20 years while a rich white guy guilty of fraud and opioid abuse should get a $50 million broadcasting contract.
You are just another failed journalistic hack that is jealous of Rush's success.
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You are just another failed journalistic hack that is jealous of Rush's success.
Character>Financial Success
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Waitin' on da chit hittin' da sham now baby, hey?
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You are just another failed journalistic hack that is jealous of Rush's success.
Hilarious.
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You are just another failed journalistic hack that is jealous of Rush's success.
(http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Boy-That-Escalated-Quickly-Anchorman.gif)
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Wonder if the Bernie Sanders guy who shot a bunch of people today was on pills, booze, or something else, ainnner?
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Nah, just had a severe case of da terminal crazies, hey?
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Stupid knows no political boundaries.
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Wonder if the Bernie Sanders guy who shot a bunch of people today was on pills, booze, or something else, ainnner?
The problem was the guy was not on pills. No doubt he suffered from mental illness, a disease that has so much stigma associated with it that people are afraid to admit they have problems.
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The problem was the guy was not on pills. No doubt he suffered from mental illness, a disease that has so much stigma associated with it that people are afraid to admit they have problems.
"no doubt" ?? i realize there are hippa laws and doctor-patient confidentiality issues, but i didn't know he was a patient of yours. the big tip-off that he MAY have suffered from this mental illness you speak of however, one has to look no further than his own party affiliation ;)now there's the problem right there-heyheyheyn'er?
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Huh, I thought it was only 82 that brought politics anymore.
But hey, thoughts and prayers are at an all-time high, that'll solve the problem.
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Huh, I thought it was only 82 that brought politics anymore.
You gotta know the rules, reinko. As long as you end your post with "I'm really a badger fan" or "heyheyheyn'er," it serves as a cloaking device for previously expressed political thought.
Here's an example:
Lock him up, heyheyheyn'er! ::)
And throw in an emoji, and it's like making believe politics was never discussed!
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You gotta know the rules, reinko. As long as you end your post with "I'm really a badger fan" or "heyheyheyn'er," it serves as a cloaking device for previously expressed political thought.
Here's an example:
Lock him up, heyheyheyn'er! ::)
And throw in an emoji, and it's like making believe politics was never discussed!
Or...Diss eazy 2 spit politics here on diz Superbar board if type like diss. See?
How bout dat Hillary broad n how she gonna ruin dis country, aiana, amiright?
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Bigger problem:
I wrote "a-i-n-'a" (without the hyphens) and it was changed to "I'm really a Badger fan."
Is this new?
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Bigger problem:
I wrote "a-i-n-'a" (without the hyphens) and it was changed to "I'm really a Badger fan."
Is this new?
Nope, been that way for a few years. One of scoops better features
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Nope, been that way for a few years. One of scoops better features
Not to brag, but it was my idea. 8-)
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/xTiTnwqSVOmAL9nKOQ/200.webp#13-grid1)
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Hoo wooda taught, hey?
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Not to brag, but it was my idea. 8-)
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/xTiTnwqSVOmAL9nKOQ/200.webp#13-grid1)
I like it, Khaleesi!
This was the first time I ever tried to use the "word" and, appropriately, it was to make fun of people who use it. So this won't affect me (or most of us) in the future.
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The problem was the guy was not on pills. No doubt he suffered from mental illness, a disease that has so much stigma associated with it that people are afraid to admit they have problems.
Interesting diagnosis, Dr Forgetful, but unless you consider being unable to accept the results of the 2016 election a mental illness I haven't heard that this guy had any history in that regard.
Dismissing an attempted mass political assassination with a "the guy didn't take his pills" given the tone of the discourse in our country today is myopic and dangerous.
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You gotta know the rules, reinko. As long as you end your post with "I'm really a badger fan" or "heyheyheyn'er," it serves as a cloaking device for previously expressed political thought.
Here's an example:
Lock him up, heyheyheyn'er! ::)
And throw in an emoji, and it's like making believe politics was never discussed!
Also, don't forget just a sprinkle of thinly veiled misogyny, that usually gets you off scot-free as well.
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Interesting diagnosis, Dr Forgetful, but unless you consider being unable to accept the results of the 2016 election a mental illness I haven't heard that this guy had any history in that regard.
Dismissing an attempted mass political assassination with a "the guy didn't take his pills" given the tone of the discourse in our country today is myopic and dangerous.
You miss the point entirely. The point is that mental illness in this country is viewed with immense stigma, to the point that most that suffer from mental illnesses refuse to get help, and even refuse to realize they have a problem.
A person that leaves his wife and business and drives off the DC to live in his car with no plan, no aims, is not mentally stable. A person who commits mass shootings is not mentally stable.
A person who calls for violence against his opponents is not mentally stable. We have problems in this nation, and one of the biggest ones is not recognizing and taking care of mental illnesses.
Oh yeah, and Forgetful is fine...I've never been big on using titles and let anyone call me by my first name...otherwise I might forget it.
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You miss the point entirely. The point is that mental illness in this country is viewed with immense stigma, to the point that most that suffer from mental illnesses refuse to get help, and even refuse to realize they have a problem.
A person that leaves his wife and business and drives off the DC to live in his car with no plan, no aims, is not mentally stable. A person who commits mass shootings is not mentally stable.
A person who calls for violence against his opponents is not mentally stable. We have problems in this nation, and one of the biggest ones is not recognizing and taking care of mental illnesses.
Oh yeah, and Forgetful is fine...I've never been big on using titles and let anyone call me by my first name...otherwise I might forget it.
I'm actually on the Board of a not for profit whose mission is to reduce stigma towards and promote healing for people who suffer from mental illness - so to say I'm sympathetic to the problem is an understatement.
However, I'm not a psychiatrist and even if I was one I wouldn't be comfortable making a diagnosis from an anecdote or a Facebook post. One thing we do know, though. Mentally ill or not, he had managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents. Aren't you even a little concerned about the possibility that the viciousness of our present political discourse might have set this guy on a course towards attempted mass assassination?
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Aren't you even a little concerned about the possibility that the viciousness of our present political discourse might have set this guy on a course towards attempted mass assassination?
I've been concerned about the viciousness of political discourse for 24 years. It has steadily worsened.
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I'm actually on the Board of a not for profit whose mission is to reduce stigma towards and promote healing for people who suffer from mental illness - so to say I'm sympathetic to the problem is an understatement.
However, I'm not a psychiatrist and even if I was one I wouldn't be comfortable making a diagnosis from an anecdote or a Facebook post. One thing we do know, though. Mentally ill or not, he had managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents. Aren't you even a little concerned about the possibility that the viciousness of our present political discourse might have set this guy on a course towards attempted mass assassination?
Of course I'm concerned, because in order to make progress people need to work together. But, as Tower mentioned that has been a problem forever. We are not going to fix that overnight.
But, all acts of violence have some sort of trigger, we will never be able to remedy every trigger, but we can work on the underlying factors that allow it to get to that point to begin with. One of the largest underlying and continuing factors is mental health. People don't commit acts like this if they are stable and mentally healthy.
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I've been concerned about the viciousness of political discourse for 24 years. It has steadily worsened.
I've been worried longer than that. At least 37 years, maybe longer. But I've never seen anything even close to this, and before it's over I fear these hateful morons (on both sides) will have lots and lots of blood on their hands.
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I'm actually on the Board of a not for profit whose mission is to reduce stigma towards and promote healing for people who suffer from mental illness - so to say I'm sympathetic to the problem is an understatement.
However, I'm not a psychiatrist and even if I was one I wouldn't be comfortable making a diagnosis from an anecdote or a Facebook post. One thing we do know, though. Mentally ill or not, he had managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents. Aren't you even a little concerned about the possibility that the viciousness of our present political discourse might have set this guy on a course towards attempted mass assassination?
Lennys, your thought process and analysis on this subject is completely reasonable and fair.
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I've been worried longer than that. At least 37 years, maybe longer. But I've never seen anything even close to this, and before it's over I fear these hateful morons (on both sides) will have lots and lots of blood on their hands.
If I may, I would like like to ask why you chose 37 years. What happened then that made you pick that amount of time?
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Of course I'm concerned, because in order to make progress people need to work together. But, as Tower mentioned that has been a problem forever. We are not going to fix that overnight.
But, all acts of violence have some sort of trigger, we will never be able to remedy every trigger, but we can work on the underlying factors that allow it to get to that point to begin with. One of the largest underlying and continuing factors is mental health. People don't commit acts like this if they are stable and mentally healthy
" No doubt he suffered from mental illness, "
in my opinion, and i'm not a psychiatrist or anything, mental "stability" and mental illness are 2 different things. one can be mentally "unstable" and still function within the parameters society has set short of inflicting mass murder on those you disagree with. mental instability can be demonstrated in many benign forms all the way to whatever you see as "weird" and/or cause you to not want to associate with said person. the degree of "mental-ness" really comes down to the point if they realize their actions were right or wrong.
i believe our media and those in charge of making and enforcing our laws need to be a little more responsible for what they are saying in public. these are the people we put in charge or hold a position from which they carry a "big megaphone" and thereby, hold a lot of power. when they continue to "spew" out "irresponsible", "hate-filled" statements, they are potentially putting many people in harms way.
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I've been concerned about the viciousness of political discourse for 24 years. It has steadily worsened.
What should anyone expect? The voting public in this country is perfectly content with voting "against the other person" rather than a candidate who actually represents who they are.
When elections are less about your own ideals, and more about how bad the other person's are, you're going to breed hatred, resentment, anger and vitriol amongst the masses.
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What should anyone expect? The voting public in this country is perfectly content with voting "against the other person" rather than a candidate who actually represents who they are.
When elections are less about your own ideals, and more about how bad the other person's are, you're going to breed hatred, resentment, anger and vitriol amongst the masses.
What really disappoints me as that the hatred is now seeping into every subject of discussion.
Want to talk about the Cosby trial? "Well, even if he gets convicted, that Cheetoh-faced pu$$Y-grabber Trump will probably pardon him!"
Compliment someone on their new winter coat? "Well, if you listen to the Libtards, I won't need it for much longer because of global warming!"
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What should anyone expect? The voting public in this country is perfectly content with voting "against the other person" rather than a candidate who actually represents who they are.
When elections are less about your own ideals, and more about how bad the other person's are, you're going to breed hatred, resentment, anger and vitriol amongst the masses.
Sadly, Benny, far too many people who voted for the Orange Menace did so because they believe he represents who they are. While plenty voted against the other candidate, yes, Making America White Again was exactly what most of his supporters wanted IMHO.
Newt couldn't wait to blame the extreme left for the rancor taking place now, which is hilarious given that his chosen candidate promoted violence against peaceful protesters at his rallies.
There's been much fuss about Kathy Griffin and the NY Caesar play portraying violence perpetrated on Trump lookalikes. And probably correctly so; while I like giving "artists" a lot of leeway, it's over the top to promote such gruesome images. But I don't remember similar right-wing outrage when Ted Nugent threatened to put a gun in Obama's mouth and pull the trigger. Indeed, Mike Huckabee not only didn't criticize Nugent; he had Nugent on his Fox News show and the two played "Cat Scratch Fever" together. If not so sad, that would have been hilarious - an effen preacher playing the guitar while his guest sang about primal sex. And the current so-called president has had Nugent to the WH - that's far less surprising, as the two have P-grabbing in common.
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What should anyone expect? The voting public in this country is perfectly content with voting "against the other person" rather than a candidate who actually represents who they are.
When elections are less about your own ideals, and more about how bad the other person's are, you're going to breed hatred, resentment, anger and vitriol amongst the masses.
National elections are (by necessity) about "coalition building". And both parties have, within their coalition, elements that make those who traditionally identify with those parties uncomfortable. So people swallow hard, and vote against the other guy because he's even worse than their guy. Maybe if we had more parties who then formed coalitions AFTER elections it would be better, but I fear our divisions are so great we may be past the point of no return.
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National elections are (by necessity) about "coalition building". And both parties have, within their coalition, elements that make those who traditionally identify with those parties uncomfortable. So people swallow hard, and vote against the other guy because he's even worse than their guy. Maybe if we had more parties who then formed coalitions AFTER elections it would be better, but I fear our divisions are so great we may be past the point of no return.
No, that doesn't work either. Just look at what's happening in the UK after the last general election. May gambled and lost big time now she is forced to try to form a coalition with the Alt Right DUP, who only have 10 seats out of over 600 possible.
Not only has she pissed off the opposition, but her own party hates her for trying to form a coalition. The Scottish Conservatives have already said they wont support her, depending on the deal they make with the DUP leaving the government in a complete cluster f**k.
In 2010, the Liberal Democrats formed a coalition with the Torries and proceeded to almost become an extinct party in 2015 because it backfired on them so much.
I understand what you're saying but that doesn't work in modern politics. One option that has worked really well (so far) is Macron in France starting up his own political party from scratch. He is pretty well liked around France, but im sure that will change as well. Merkel as well, shes already been in charge since 2005 now.
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If I may, I would like like to ask why you chose 37 years. What happened then that made you pick that amount of time?
Ronald Reagan, to the chagrin of the elites in the Washington establishment (including the Washington/New York elite media) was elected president.
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Sadly, Benny, far too many people who voted for the Orange Menace did so because they believe he represents who they are. While plenty voted against the other candidate, yes, Making America White Again was exactly what most of his supporters wanted IMHO.
Newt couldn't wait to blame the extreme left for the rancor taking place now, which is hilarious given that his chosen candidate promoted violence against peaceful protesters at his rallies.
There's been much fuss about Kathy Griffin and the NY Caesar play portraying violence perpetrated on Trump lookalikes. And probably correctly so; while I like giving "artists" a lot of leeway, it's over the top to promote such gruesome images. But I don't remember similar right-wing outrage when Ted Nugent threatened to put a gun in Obama's mouth and pull the trigger. Indeed, Mike Huckabee not only didn't criticize Nugent; he had Nugent on his Fox News show and the two played "Cat Scratch Fever" together. If not so sad, that would have been hilarious - an effen preacher playing the guitar while his guest sang about primal sex. And the current so-called president has had Nugent to the WH - that's far less surprising, as the two have P-grabbing in common.
I hate to say it, Mike, but this post, with some truths, some half truths, some lies and an overall tone of confrontation and hatred is a perfect example of what's wrong with our country. And for every reason you can come up with to despise, belittle and mock your fellow citizens who don't see all things your way, they'll come back at you with a laundry list "proving" how awful you and your minions are. How do you think it's working out so far?
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I hate to say it, Mike, but this post, with some truths, some half truths, some lies and an overall tone of confrontation and hatred is a perfect example of what's wrong with our country. And for every reason you can come up with to despise, belittle and mock your fellow citizens who don't see all things your way, they'll come back at you with a laundry list "proving" how awful you and your minions are. How do you think it's working out so far?
Not working out well at all, I admit that.
Obviously, this has gotten far too political and I had promised to try to avoid that. So here in this thread, I'll let you have the last word.
However, I would welcome a PM in which you offer conclusive proof as to anything I said in my previous post that was a "lie." I do not like to lie, and I don't think I did there. I would view it as constructive criticism. And we could have a dialogue that isn't on this thread. I promise to not be confrontational.
Having said that, I understand if you'd rather not. Discussing this stuff, even non-confrontationally, is often unpleasant.
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Not working out well at all, I admit that.
Obviously, this has gotten far too political and I had promised to try to avoid that. So here in this thread, I'll let you have the last word.
However, I would welcome a PM in which you offer conclusive proof as to anything I said in my previous post that was a "lie." I do not like to lie, and I don't think I did there. I would view it as constructive criticism. And we could have a dialogue that isn't on this thread. I promise to not be confrontational.
Having said that, I understand if you'd rather not. Discussing this stuff, even non-confrontationally, is often unpleasant.
Mike - I would love to have a dialogue with you "off campus". Hopefully this weekend I'll send you a PM.
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Lennys, your thought process and analysis on this subject is completely reasonable and fair.
Thanks, Jay Bee.
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Ronald Reagan, to the chagrin of the elites in the Washington establishment (including the Washington/New York elite media) was elected president.
Do you think the viciousness of this era was simply down to the election of Reagan or down to some distasteful events that occurred under his two terms in office?
Viciousness is a pathology. I don't find single events to be the cause but rather it's a degradation in the fairness equilibrium within influential people that creates a sense of ever-growing and acceptable forms of viciousness.
In essence, each person is responsible for their adherence to what they perceive as an allowed form of discourse but when the information environment is segmented as deeply as it has become in 2017 (with multiple decades worth of foundation being laid) there's a perverse incentive to ratchet up viciousness.
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Sadly, Benny, far too many people who voted for the Orange Menace did so because they believe he represents who they are. While plenty voted against the other candidate, yes, Making America White Again was exactly what most of his supporters wanted IMHO.
Conceptually, there's nothing sad about voting for someone who you believe represents who you are. Yet for every person who voted for Trump believing that he was representative of them, there was probably 2 or 3 more people who were simply voting against HRC. The ratio was probably even higher for people who voted "against" Trump rather than "for" HRC.
Listen... I have no problem with someone who uses their vote as a protest against another, but what I do have a problem is how the opinion-shapers who disguise protest in hatred... that's not good for anyone, regardless of what your political belief is.
We either hang together or we all hang separately. Doesn't mean we have to hold the same beliefs. But the hate-mongering needs to stop because it's leading to exactly what we witnessed in DC this week. What's most disgusting about the whole thing is not just how both sides are using the incident to advance their own agenda, it's how polarized Americans have become to the point where we simply allow our politicians to act this way because we'd rather have power than unity.
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Conceptually, there's nothing sad about voting for someone who you believe represents who you are. Yet for every person who voted for Trump believing that he was representative of them, there was probably 2 or 3 more people who were simply voting against HRC. The ratio was probably even higher for people who voted "against" Trump rather than "for" HRC.
Listen... I have no problem with someone who uses their vote as a protest against another, but what I do have a problem is how the opinion-shapers who disguise protest in hatred... that's not good for anyone, regardless of what your political belief is.
We either hang together or we all hang separately. Doesn't mean we have to hold the same beliefs. But the hate-mongering needs to stop because it's leading to exactly what we witnessed in DC this week. What's most disgusting about the whole thing is not just how both sides are using the incident to advance their own agenda, it's how polarized Americans have become to the point where we simply allow our politicians to act this way because we'd rather have power than unity.
Just to tie this thread all together...Any informed voter who was a strong supporter of either Trump or Hillary likely suffers from some sort of mental illness.
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Ronald Reagan, to the chagrin of the elites in the Washington establishment (including the Washington/New York elite media) was elected president.
I would contend that the major item leading to this public viciousness occurred 4 years later when "Oxy" Limbaugh went on the air.
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I'm actually on the Board of a not for profit whose mission is to reduce stigma towards and promote healing for people who suffer from mental illness - so to say I'm sympathetic to the problem is an understatement.
However, I'm not a psychiatrist and even if I was one I wouldn't be comfortable making a diagnosis from an anecdote or a Facebook post. One thing we do know, though. Mentally ill or not, he had managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents. Aren't you even a little concerned about the possibility that the viciousness of our present political discourse might have set this guy on a course towards attempted mass assassination?
I already address the last point, but wanted to revisit this for two reasons.
First, thank you for your work in addressing the problem of mental health.
Second, your statements in the next paragraph contribute to the overall problem and stigma associated with mental illness, and peoples reluctance to get help. You state that "mentally ill or not, he managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents."
It suggests that those suffering from mental illness could not "manage to function." That couldn't be further from the truth, many with mental illness function just fine without treatment but are still suffering internally. That is why so often when tragedy strikes (suicide,...violence), we so often hear, I can't believe it, "they seemed so normal and fine." These ideas stop people from seeking help, as "they function fine." We need to be vocal that mental illness of all types all degrees exist and it is not a weakness.
Now as for "minor incidents." That also isn't true, and again ignores signs that someone may need to seek help. For over a decade he has had several incidences of frightening violence and domestic abuse, including beating a man and firing a shotgun at him. During court hearings he was known to violently scream at people during the trial. He has a lengthy history of violence.
One of his foster daughters, doused herself with gasoline and set herself on fire. That would be traumatic for anyone.
During all of that he was never advised, or sought treatment...likely because he "functioned fine." In his mind, and as his friends say, "everyone gets in fights."
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I already address the last point, but wanted to revisit this for two reasons.
First, thank you for your work in addressing the problem of mental health.
Second, your statements in the next paragraph contribute to the overall problem and stigma associated with mental illness, and peoples reluctance to get help. You state that "mentally ill or not, he managed to function for 64 years with only minor incidents."
It suggests that those suffering from mental illness could not "manage to function." That couldn't be further from the truth, many with mental illness function just fine without treatment but are still suffering internally. That is why so often when tragedy strikes (suicide,...violence), we so often hear, I can't believe it, "they seemed so normal and fine." These ideas stop people from seeking help, as "they function fine." We need to be vocal that mental illness of all types all degrees exist and it is not a weakness.
Now as for "minor incidents." That also isn't true, and again ignores signs that someone may need to seek help. For over a decade he has had several incidences of frightening violence and domestic abuse, including beating a man and firing a shotgun at him. During court hearings he was known to violently scream at people during the trial. He has a lengthy history of violence.
One of his foster daughters, doused herself with gasoline and set herself on fire. That would be traumatic for anyone.
During all of that he was never advised, or sought treatment...likely because he "functioned fine." In his mind, and as his friends say, "everyone gets in fights."
Well said.
I would like to add one more point, also.
There are myriads of mental illnesses, just as there are physical illnesses. We can't make the mistake of bundling all mental illnesses as being the same. With many, the symptoms come and go depending on lifestyle, medication, etc. Some are always there - even if under the surface. Others are triggered by events.
When someone has cancer, we don't say they have a physical illness; we say they have cancer. But for mental illness, we put everyone under the same umbrella.
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Do you think the viciousness of this era was simply down to the election of Reagan or down to some distasteful events that occurred under his two terms in office?
Viciousness is a pathology. I don't find single events to be the cause but rather it's a degradation in the fairness equilibrium within influential people that creates a sense of ever-growing and acceptable forms of viciousness.
In essence, each person is responsible for their adherence to what they perceive as an allowed form of discourse but when the information environment is segmented as deeply as it has become in 2017 (with multiple decades worth of foundation being laid) there's a perverse incentive to ratchet up viciousness.
Coupled with the fact that there is no electoral incentive for any particular member of Congress to work with the other side to get legislation passed. It is a sign of weakness for you to do so. Gerrymandering is a problem.
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Gerrymandering is a problem.
It is the biggest problem in many, many states.
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I would contend that the major item leading to this public viciousness occurred 4 years later when "Oxy" Limbaugh went on the air.
Certainly Limbaugh is a big part of the problem. We used to have people like William F Buckley Jr and Daniel Patrick Moynihan on public TV debating political philosophy. Now it's Sean Hannity and Lawrence O'Donnell name calling and spewing hatred.
It's the Hatfields and the McCoys, and both sides point fingers insisting the other guy started it. We're on the brink, and anyone willing to be reasonable is in short supply.
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Certainly Limbaugh is a big part of the problem. We used to have people like William F Buckley Jr and Daniel Patrick Moynihan on public TV debating political philosophy. Now it's Sean Hannity and Lawrence O'Donnell name calling and spewing hatred.
It's the Hatfields and the McCoys, and both sides point fingers insisting the other guy started it. We're on the brink, and anyone willing to be reasonable is in short supply.
There is no market for "reasonable." Remember the McLaughlin Group? That seems so quaint now.
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Conceptually, there's nothing sad about voting for someone who you believe represents who you are. Yet for every person who voted for Trump believing that he was representative of them, there was probably 2 or 3 more people who were simply voting against HRC. The ratio was probably even higher for people who voted "against" Trump rather than "for" HRC.
Listen... I have no problem with someone who uses their vote as a protest against another, but what I do have a problem is how the opinion-shapers who disguise protest in hatred... that's not good for anyone, regardless of what your political belief is.
We either hang together or we all hang separately. Doesn't mean we have to hold the same beliefs. But the hate-mongering needs to stop because it's leading to exactly what we witnessed in DC this week. What's most disgusting about the whole thing is not just how both sides are using the incident to advance their own agenda, it's how polarized Americans have become to the point where we simply allow our politicians to act this way because we'd rather have power than unity.
I largely agree with this analysis.
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There is no market for "reasonable." Remember the McLaughlin Group? That seems so quaint now.
+1000.
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I remember the first time I listened to Limbaugh. I laughed, thinking he was doing satire, never believing he was serious or that there were people who would actually take him seriously. Oops. IMO, the accelerating decline of modern political discourse can be traced to Rush and to Newt Gingrich. In the 1994 election cycle, his Contract with America involved having Republicans call Democrats insane, deranged, dangerous etc. Again, I thought that no one would take him seriously, that the American electorate would react negatively to such tactics. It just shows my naivete. I remember the LaRouche supporters back in the 80's, when the vast majority of society treated them as whack-jobs. No more. I remember the first true political scandal I was old enough to understand, Iran-Contra. I marveled that anybody involved with that could actually stay out of jail. Instead, they became heroes and returned to be in charge in future administrations.
My political instincts are liberal. My religious instincts are liberal. I believe that greed is a sin. That I am my brother's keeper. That we are called to be steward's of this planet and try to leave it better than we found it. That health care is a right, not a privilege. I don't like the person I become when I allow myself to be drawn into demonizing opposing viewpoints. The kind of violence we saw this week is abhorrent to me. And yet, there are those who will use it as an opportunity. There are those, even on this board, who will take my beliefs and conclude that I kill babies for fun and hate America.
We have met the enemy, and it is us.
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I remember the first time I listened to Limbaugh. I laughed, thinking he was doing satire, never believing he was serious or that there were people who would actually take him seriously. Oops. IMO, the accelerating decline of modern political discourse can be traced to Rush and to Newt Gingrich. In the 1994 election cycle, his Contract with America involved having Republicans call Democrats insane, deranged, dangerous etc. Again, I thought that no one would take him seriously, that the American electorate would react negatively to such tactics. It just shows my naivete. I remember the LaRouche supporters back in the 80's, when the vast majority of society treated them as whack-jobs. No more. I remember the first true political scandal I was old enough to understand, Iran-Contra. I marveled that anybody involved with that could actually stay out of jail. Instead, they became heroes and returned to be in charge in future administrations.
My political instincts are liberal. My religious instincts are liberal. I believe that greed is a sin. That I am my brother's keeper. That we are called to be steward's of this planet and try to leave it better than we found it. That health care is a right, not a privilege. I don't like the person I become when I allow myself to be drawn into demonizing opposing viewpoints. The kind of violence we saw this week is abhorrent to me. And yet, there are those who will use it as an opportunity. There are those who will take my beliefs and conclude that I kill babies for fun and hate America.
We have met the enemy, and it is us.
One could make the same points about far left political commentators. Neither side is specifically to blame (though each side likes to blame the other). This is something that has been built over a long period of time and the media perpetuates it because it has made news organizations and political commentators a lot of money and, unfortunately, it will continue to do so.
A sports reporter's job is much easier when the team they cover is struggling. It's no different for news reporters.
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Conceptually, there's nothing sad about voting for someone who you believe represents who you are. Yet for every person who voted for Trump believing that he was representative of them, there was probably 2 or 3 more people who were simply voting against HRC. The ratio was probably even higher for people who voted "against" Trump rather than "for" HRC.
Listen... I have no problem with someone who uses their vote as a protest against another, but what I do have a problem is how the opinion-shapers who disguise protest in hatred... that's not good for anyone, regardless of what your political belief is.
We either hang together or we all hang separately. Doesn't mean we have to hold the same beliefs. But the hate-mongering needs to stop because it's leading to exactly what we witnessed in DC this week. What's most disgusting about the whole thing is not just how both sides are using the incident to advance their own agenda, it's how polarized Americans have become to the point where we simply allow our politicians to act this way because we'd rather have power than unity.
I largely agree with this also, but there was an interesting article on google analytics recently, where they were able to correlate search histories in certain areas with voting tendencies for those districts. The bottom line, was that the reasons people publicly say they voted for someone, or against someone are inconsistent with their search tendencies.
The takeaway message was that when it comes to sensitive issues, assume the person is lying to you and coloring their real beliefs with what they think is socially acceptable.
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Certainly Limbaugh is a big part of the problem. We used to have people like William F Buckley Jr and Daniel Patrick Moynihan on public TV debating political philosophy. Now it's Sean Hannity and Lawrence O'Donnell name calling and spewing hatred.
I used to watch Buckley all the time even though I mostly disagreed with him. It was a way to know what conservatives wanted.
I would shoot myself in the head with pleasure before I would ever watch a second of a creep like Hannity.
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One could make the same points about far left political commentators.
I've spun the radio dial and can't find any.
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I've spun the radio dial and can't find any.
Teal, right? Oh yeah, no one wanted to listen to air America, but surely you can find NPR somewhere
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Teal, right? Oh yeah, no one wanted to listen to air America, but surely you can find NPR somewhere
I understand that NPR is liberal. I also don't listen very often. Usually only on long car rides with my mom. But I can't think of a time where anyone on NPR attacked conservatives with the same kind of language that Tower described in his post about Rush Limbaugh.
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I understand that NPR is liberal. I also don't listen very often. Usually only on long car rides with my mom. But I can't think of a time where anyone on NPR attacked conservatives with the same kind of language that Tower described in his post about Rush Limbaugh.
[/quote
You must have missed Nina totenbergs shows and "fresh air with terry gross" not exactly wishing well on some from the other side, including judge Clarence Thomas and general jerry Boykin oh yeah, and did I say this is tax payer subsidized?
I better just hang up and listen as this ain't leading to good things, eyn'al?
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I understand that NPR is liberal. I also don't listen very often. Usually only on long car rides with my mom. But I can't think of a time where anyone on NPR attacked conservatives with the same kind of language that Tower described in his post about Rush Limbaugh.
You must have missed Nina totenbergs shows and "fresh air with terry gross" not exactly wishing well on some from the other side, including judge Clarence Thomas and general jerry Boykin oh yeah, and did I say this is tax payer subsidized?
I better just hang up and listen as this ain't leading to good things, eyn'al?
I don't think you can include Nina Totenbergs or Terry Gross in the same categories as Rush Limbaugh. Both of the two women you reference are insanely respected, award winning and ground breaking journalists.
Terry Gross is widely regarded as one of the best interviewers period. She was roundly criticized for going to hard at Hillary Clinton in a 2014 interview.
Nina Totenbergs has said some stupid things on a rare occasion and is definitely partisan. The big difference is, when she has said stupid things (and hateful), she has publicly apologized for it and in regards to the most well known instance says she will regret it the rest of her life.
Rush is in the category of Howard Stern and Don Imus. Shock jocks. I'm not saying they don't exist, but I can't think of any widely popular left-wing shock jocks (well, Rachel Maddow would count...but she is just the left wing Hannity).
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You must have missed Nina totenbergs shows and "fresh air with terry gross" not exactly wishing well on some from the other side, including judge Clarence Thomas and general jerry Boykin oh yeah, and did I say this is tax payer subsidized?
I better just hang up and listen as this ain't leading to good things, eyn'al?
I wasn't of NPR listening age when Totenberg reported on Anita Hill's allegations against Judge Thomas. I also have never heard nothing but praise for Terry Gross. But again, fully admit to not listening to them often. You'll need to give me examples of times where they called conservatives deranged, insane, dangerous and nazis. I added that last term because Rush is famous for his calling feminists "feminazis"
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I know this thread has turned decidedly political and I admit I had a role in that. Apologies because I know that is against the rules. But reading the comments here from people on the left, on the right and in the center buoys my spirit. Honest, reasonable commentary from all. Makes me proud to be a Scooper - and we can all use a little pride about now. Thanks to all!
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One could make the same points about far left political commentators. Neither side is specifically to blame (though each side likes to blame the other). This is something that has been built over a long period of time and the media perpetuates it because it has made news organizations and political commentators a lot of money and, unfortunately, it will continue to do so.
A sports reporter's job is much easier when the team they cover is struggling. It's no different for news reporters.
The left wasn't as aggressively negative and still struggles to do so. Very few really have the knack for being that kind of attack dog. They try and it sounds forced, like they feel like they have to act that way in response, even though it doesn't come naturally.
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As our streets are flooded with protesters in Minnesota, #BanHammer
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I remember the first time I listened to Limbaugh. I laughed, thinking he was doing satire, never believing he was serious or that there were people who would actually take him seriously. Oops. IMO, the accelerating decline of modern political discourse can be traced to Rush and to Newt Gingrich. In the 1994 election cycle, his Contract with America involved having Republicans call Democrats insane, deranged, dangerous etc. Again, I thought that no one would take him seriously, that the American electorate would react negatively to such tactics. It just shows my naivete. I remember the LaRouche supporters back in the 80's, when the vast majority of society treated them as whack-jobs. No more. I remember the first true political scandal I was old enough to understand, Iran-Contra. I marveled that anybody involved with that could actually stay out of jail. Instead, they became heroes and returned to be in charge in future administrations.
My political instincts are liberal. My religious instincts are liberal. I believe that greed is a sin. That I am my brother's keeper. That we are called to be steward's of this planet and try to leave it better than we found it. That health care is a right, not a privilege. I don't like the person I become when I allow myself to be drawn into demonizing opposing viewpoints. The kind of violence we saw this week is abhorrent to me. And yet, there are those who will use it as an opportunity. There are those, even on this board, who will take my beliefs and conclude that I kill babies for fun and hate America.
We have met the enemy, and it is us.
While you are sitting there in Grand Rapids being sanctimonious about life and sucking off the societal teet, I will be here in New York working my azz off to keep 1,000 families with a paycheck and paying 9 figures in corporate taxes for the privilege. And, oh by the way ,we provide the best health care going and don't need no stinkin Obama Care.
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Thank you. For proving my point and making me laugh.
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As our streets are flooded with protesters in Minnesota, #BanHammer
thank you
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Everyone should try a month or two swapping twitter and facebook feeds with someone from the other ideological persuasion.
Won't change many minds, but maybe would lessen the echo chamber we tend to feel more comfortable with.
Also, I hate to bring this thread back to the original topic, but sauced tiger is delicious with balsamic asparagus and oven roasted potatoes.
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(well, Rachel Maddow would count...but she is just the left wing Hannity).
A horrendously misinformed statement.
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As our streets are flooded with protesters in Minnesota, #BanHammer
Apparently you support murder.
Most don't.
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how 'bout those packers, ey?
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Just to tie this thread all together...Any informed voter who was a strong supporter of voted for either Trump or Hillary likely suffers from some sort of mental illness.
FIFY. Resigning yourself to having to vote for the lesser of two evils in this country at the very least shows loss of foresight. Or a sociopathological disregard for others.
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how 'bout those packers, ey?
Favre was a drug addict, and an pretty boy.
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May still bee an ass hole, ai na?
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May still bee an ass hole, ai na?
From what I've heard is he's at least improved. Oh, the stories I know. He was a terrible human being.
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While you are sitting there in Grand Rapids being sanctimonious about life and sucking off the societal teet, I will be here in New York working my azz off to keep 1,000 families with a paycheck and paying 9 figures in corporate taxes for the privilege. And, oh by the way ,we provide the best health care going and don't need no stinkin Obama Care.
Methinks this is like a typical Chicas post before the breakdown - telling us how rich and important he was.
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So...Tiger Woods, eh?
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The left wasn't as aggressively negative and still struggles to do so. Very few really have the knack for being that kind of attack dog. They try and it sounds forced, like they feel like they have to act that way in response, even though it doesn't come naturally.
(https://m.popkey.co/d243e5/v7xX_f-maxage-0.gif)