MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Pakuni on May 01, 2017, 01:42:38 PM
-
Hmmm. Savvy recruiting move, I suppose.
FWIW, he is a Chicago-area guy. Went to Marian Central in Woodstock.
-
Squirmy
-
The La Lumiere coach must think he can walk on water ... because it will probably take that type of miracle to get one of their stud recruits to follow him to Depaul.
-
It's desperation..they can't get recruits the old fashioned way..so bring in a coach that so happens to have coached Brian Bowen and Tyger Campbell. Whatever makes you feel better about yourselves DePaul.
-
It's desperation..they can't get recruits the old fashioned way..so bring in a coach that so happens to have coached Brian Bowen and Tyger Campbell. Whatever makes you feel better about yourselves DePaul.
Worked with Garrett!
-
It's desperation..they can't get recruits the old fashioned way..so bring in a coach that so happens to have coached Brian Bowen and Tyger Campbell. Whatever makes you feel better about yourselves DePaul.
How is hiring Heirman fundamentally different than Wojo hiring Stan Johnson?
-
Character revealed
-
Not to go all chico's and name drop on everyone, but I've met Shane a couple of times through a mutual friend. Nice guy, really young still, only 28. Was very complimentary of Wojo and Marquette's program. Think it's a good hire for Depaul, he brought in a lot of talent to a prep school in the middle of nowhere Indiana.
-
Not to go all chico's and name drop on everyone, but I've met Shane a couple of times through a mutual friend. Nice guy, really young still, only 28. Was very complimentary of Wojo and Marquette's program. Think it's a good hire for Depaul, he brought in a lot of talent to a prep school in the middle of nowhere Indiana.
Shane was a Marquette student for one semester before transferring to Tulsa where I think he walked-on to the program. McHenry, IL native.
-
Just wait until Bowen's other coach is hired. McD can't compete with that.
-
I will laugh my ass off if they hired Heirman, and will hire Bowen's AAU Coach and he still goes someplace else. ;D
-
How is hiring Heirman fundamentally different than Wojo hiring Stan Johnson?
C'mon man...you are smarter than this...Heriman just so happens to Coach Tyger Cambell and Brian Bowen, two recruits DePaul is targeting..It was done for that reason and that reason alone...to try to land those two. Stan was never a HS Coach or AAU Coach of a recruit MU was trying to land. I hate this practice by ANY school...you can't land a guy(s) on your own, so bring in their HS coaches to make it happen. It's the same thing Missou did with Michael Porter Sr., same thing Memphis did with Old man Lawson. Same thing other schools do to land top talent. It's a practice non blue bloods partake in frequently..and I wouldn't like it one bit if MU did it, and I'm pretty leniant with most things as far as bringing in talent(like bringing in someone better, forcing a transfer of lessor player). I want MU to become elite on their own merits, not some shady way like this.
-
C'mon man...you are smarter than this...Heriman just so happens to Coach Tyger Cambell and Brian Bowen, two recruits DePaul is targeting..It was done for that reason and that reason alone...to try to land those two. Stan was never a HS Coach or AAU Coach of a recruit MU was trying to land. I hate this practice by ANY school...you can't land a guy(s) on your own, so bring in their HS coaches to make it happen. It's the same thing Missou did with Michael Porter Sr., same thing Memphis did with Old man Lawson. Same thing other schools do to land top talent. It's a practice non blue bloods partake in frequently..and I wouldn't like it one bit if MU did it, and I'm pretty leniant with most things as far as bringing in talent(like bringing in someone better, forcing a transfer of lessor player). I want MU to become elite on their own merits, not some shady way like this.
No, but Stan was a close family friend of Markus Howard when Wojo hired him.
Look, DePaul did nothing wrong here. Even without the connections to Bowen, the guy has built a very impressive resume at a young age. He's easily qualified for the gig.
-
Don't blame DePaul one bit.
-
No, but Stan was a close family friend of Markus Howard when Wojo hired him.
Look, DePaul did nothing wrong here. Even without the connections to Bowen, the guy has built a very impressive resume at a young age. He's easily qualified for the gig.
You could even make the case that what Marquette did was worse because Stan built a relationship with Markus and Brendan Bailey while he was emplyed by a competitor of Marquette's, Arizona State.
Also, there is no guarantee that Bowen goes to DePaul, I'll be kind of surprised, if he does. What DePaul will get is a young coach from the area who has shown a recruiting touch when going after great HS players.
I think that DePaul is thinking longer term with Heirman then they were with Billy's Garrett's dad. Personally, I'm glad to see DePaul making a solid effort to become competitive in the Big East which I think is good for everyone in the league. (No need to reargue whether a strong DePaul is good for Marquette or not, but if you've got nothing else going on today.....)
-
Shane was a Marquette student for one semester before transferring to Tulsa where I think he walked-on to the program. McHenry, IL native.
Wojo successor?
-
If DePaul can come up with consecutive years of good recruiting classes they may be able to move out of the Big East cellar. If hiring this young man is going to help them do that then it i is a good hire.
-
Heriman just so happens to Coach Tyger Cambell and Brian Bowen, two recruits DePaul is targeting.
http://247sports.com/Player/Tyger-Campbell-75700
Michigan State Warm
Alabama Cool
Creighton Cool
DePaul Cool
Illinois Cool
http://247sports.com/Player/Brian-Bowen-37000
Arizona Warmer
Creighton Warmer
Michigan State Warmer
N.C. State Warm
Texas Warm
If Heriman is using Cambell and Bowen to help him move to the next step, why the dumpster fire that is Depaul? If these players are getting offers from the likes of Michigan State, AZ and Creighton seems like "better programs" would consider Heriman.
To be clear, I'm not suggesting Heriman get hired by MSU, AZ or CU, just that he could do better than Depaul.
Is he bullish on Depaul's new stadium by McCormick Place?
-
It's a practice non blue bloods partake in frequently.
Like when that non blue blood Kansas, led by no-name Larry Brown, hired Ed Manning?
-
Like when that non blue blood Kansas, led by no-name Larry Brown, hired Ed Manning?
34 years ago ... nothing new under the sun
WANTED: COACH AND SON
Published: September 30, 1983
http://www.nytimes.com/1983/09/30/sports/wanted-coach-and-son.html
Brown said he discussed the son's basketball prowess with Ed Manning when he offered the job. ''I was up front and honest with him right from the start,'' said Brown. ''I'm not embarrassed by what I've done in the least.''
Brown pointed out that it is not unusual for colleges to hire high school coaches in order to land top players. Kansas has a tradition of such conduct. Under Brown's predecessor, Ted Owens, the high school coaches of recruits Darnell Valentine and Norm Cook were given jobs.
-
Candid Coaches: It's OK to hire a prospect's father if it will help land a recruit
Four out of five college coaches believe hiring a person to get a player is no longer frowned upon
Gary Parrish
@GaryParrishCBS
Aug 12, 2016
http://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/candid-coaches-its-ok-to-hire-a-prospects-father-if-it-will-help-land-a-recruit/
Larry Brown once hired Danny Manning's father, which was widely frowned upon but incredibly successful. And John Calipari hired Dajuan Wagner's dad. And, later, Tyreke Evans' trainer. And, yes, Bill Self used to employ Ronnie Chalmers, whose son hit this shot in the championship game of the 2008 NCAA Tournament ... In other words, package deals have been happening forever. Some of the biggest names in college basketball have participated. And they were brought back into the national headlines this summer when Washington's Lorenzo Romar added Michael Porter Sr. to his staff in a move that ensured a subsequent commitment from a consensus top-five prospect from the Class of 2017 -- his son, Michael Porter Jr.
Is this type of thing still frowned upon in the profession?
To find out, we asked more than 100 coaches the following question:
Do you have an issue with coaches doing package deals?
Yes 16 percent
No 84 percent
-
http://247sports.com/Player/Tyger-Campbell-75700
Michigan State Warm
Alabama Cool
Creighton Cool
DePaul Cool
Illinois Cool
http://247sports.com/Player/Brian-Bowen-37000
Arizona Warmer
Creighton Warmer
Michigan State Warmer
N.C. State Warm
Texas Warm
If Heriman is using Cambell and Bowen to help him move to the next step, why the dumpster fire that is Depaul? If these players are getting offers from the likes of Michigan State, AZ and Creighton seems like "better programs" would consider Heriman.
To be clear, I'm not suggesting Heriman get hired by MSU, AZ or CU, just that he could do better than Depaul.
Is he bullish on Depaul's new stadium by McCormick Place?
He is a young guy. Getting paid good money and living in Lincoln Park has to be very attractive. Also there is no downside given DePauls present dumpster fire status . If anything even marginally positive happens it is enough to help propel him.
-
He is a young guy. Getting paid good money and living in Lincoln Park has to be very attractive. Also there is no downside given DePauls Dumpster present dumpster fire status . If anything even marginally positive happens it is enough to help propel him.
I get this and you're probably correct.
So, it is wrong of me to think ... another slacker millennial that does not want to work too hard, live in a hip area with cool bars, Wrigley Field, and hot girls. It sounds like he values having a good time more than success in his career/job. So, he is perfect for the dumpster fire that is Depaul.
You also wrote this, which again is probably true ...
no downside given DePauls Dumpster present dumpster fire status. If anything even marginally positive happens it is enough to help propel him.
So he does not really believe in his abilities/skills and has to "game" the system.
If he really believed in himself, why doesn't he "kick in the door" of a Izzo, Archie Miller (now IU) or some program of that stature and tell them that he was able to get Bowen and Campbell to come to the middle of nowhere Indiana, help them progress as a player, so he can help you do the same. (FYI - I've been to La Lumiere many times and it truly is in the middle of nowhere)
If he has that much confidence, couldn't he find a better place to start than the dumpster fire that is Depaul?
-
What leads you to believe he doesn't want to work hard? On the contrary, he seems to have worked very hard to get where he is now.
-
What leads you to believe he doesn't want to work hard? On the contrary, he seems to have worked very hard to get where he is now.
Until Depaul changes, it seems like a place that careers go to die. Don't understand why one thinks it a place to start.
-
Until Depaul changes, it seems like a place that careers go to die. Don't understand why one thinks it a place to start.
How many coaches go straight from high school to assistant coach of a high major program? Seems like a pretty impressive jump to me.
-
I get this and you're probably correct.
So, it is wrong of me to think ... another slacker millennial that does not want to work too hard, live in a hip area with cool bars, Wrigley Field, and hot girls. It sounds like he values having a good time more than success in his career/job. So, he is perfect for the dumpster fire that is Depaul.
You also wrote this, which again is probably true ...
no downside given DePauls Dumpster present dumpster fire status. If anything even marginally positive happens it is enough to help propel him.
So he does not really believe in his abilities/skills and has to "game" the system.
If he really believed in himself, why doesn't he "kick in the door" of a Izzo, Archie Miller (now IU) or some program of that stature and tell them that he was able to get Bowen and Campbell to come to the middle of nowhere Indiana, help them progress as a player, so he can help you do the same. (FYI - I've been to La Lumiere many times and it truly is in the middle of nowhere)
If he has that much confidence, couldn't he find a better place to start than the dumpster fire that is Depaul?
As much as I want to apply the slacker millenial label whenever I can, it does not apply in this case. I think it is more straightforward as I put it. A young ambitious guy just got his first college coaching job at a Big East University. The young man just skipped through years of coaching at double directionals with a hope of making it to Bradley or Drake. He did really well for himself .
-
As much as I want to apply the slacker millenial label whenever I can, it does not apply in this case. I think it is more straightforward as I put it. A young ambitious guy just got his first college coaching job at a Big East University. The young man just skipped through years of coaching at double directionals with a hope of making it to Bradley or Drake. He did really well for himself .
We are all assuming that Dave Leitao job is safe? Even if Heriman brings Campbell and Bowen with him to Depaul. Leitao is 9 -22 and 9 - 23 the last two years. Another 9 win season and he could be out, along with Heriman .
I understand everyone argument but Depaul is arguably the biggest mess in D1. Dicey place to start.
-
We are all assuming that Dave Leitao job is safe? Even if Heriman brings Campbell and Bowen with him to Depaul. Leitao is 9 -22 and 9 - 23 the last two years. Another 9 win season and he could be out, along with Heriman .
I understand everyone argument but Depaul is arguably the biggest mess in D1. Dicey place to start.
Eh. It's a mess. But I'm not even sure its the biggest mess in the Big East. I also think Letaio has a lot of leash left. Depaul will likely need to double down after hiring back a coach that already left them for a better job.
-
We are all assuming that Dave Leitao job is safe? Even if Heriman brings Campbell and Bowen with him to Depaul. Leitao is 9 -22 and 9 - 23 the last two years. Another 9 win season and he could be out, along with Heriman .
I understand everyone argument but Depaul is arguably the biggest mess in D1. Dicey place to start.
Maybe someone who works hard and has confidence in his abilities sees DePaul as an opportunity. Maybe those passing up DePaul as an opportunity to prove themselves because its too great a challenge are the true slackers.
-
It's desperation..they can't get recruits the old fashioned way..so bring in a coach that so happens to have coached Brian Bowen and Tyger Campbell. Whatever makes you feel better about yourselves DePaul.
Hard to throw stones when we recruit a transfer - the brother of a 5 star - then don't renew his scholarship after the brother leaves early. Let's worry about our own program and not pick apart the ethics of another.
-
I get this and you're probably correct.
So, it is wrong of me to think ... another slacker millennial that does not want to work too hard, live in a hip area with cool bars, Wrigley Field, and hot girls. It sounds like he values having a good time more than success in his career/job. So, he is perfect for the dumpster fire that is Depaul.
You also wrote this, which again is probably true ...
no downside given DePauls Dumpster present dumpster fire status. If anything even marginally positive happens it is enough to help propel him.
So he does not really believe in his abilities/skills and has to "game" the system.
If he really believed in himself, why doesn't he "kick in the door" of a Izzo, Archie Miller (now IU) or some program of that stature and tell them that he was able to get Bowen and Campbell to come to the middle of nowhere Indiana, help them progress as a player, so he can help you do the same. (FYI - I've been to La Lumiere many times and it truly is in the middle of nowhere)
If he has that much confidence, couldn't he find a better place to start than the dumpster fire that is Depaul?
Dont think the likes of MSU have had any difficulties getting top rated recruits, so why would they need to go after a prep school coach? Depaul is trying to get an advantage that the bigs dont need. So they are taking a chance and swinging big, its worth a chance for depaul but not a chance most blue bloods need to take.
-
Hard to throw stones when we recruit a transfer - the brother of a 5 star - then don't renew his scholarship after the brother leaves early. Let's worry about our own program and not pick apart the ethics of another.
My memory is dim on this, was the scholarship not renewed, or did Wally not accept it because he was informed he would be the last man on the bench.
-
My memory is dim on this, was the scholarship not renewed, or did Wally not accept it because he was informed he would be the last man on the bench.
He was Pole-Axed, but there was a bit more to the story than Charlotte Warrior implies.
-
My memory is dim on this, was the scholarship not renewed, or did Wally not accept it because he was informed he would be the last man on the bench.
Smoke and mirrors.
-
Thanks.
-
Dont think the likes of MSU have had any difficulties getting top rated recruits, so why would they need to go after a prep school coach? Depaul is trying to get an advantage that the bigs dont need. So they are taking a chance and swinging big, its worth a chance for depaul but not a chance most blue bloods need to take.
Agree about MSU, but Depaul is flat out dysfunctional. I would rather go to a Horizon League, Missouri Valley or A-10 school over Depaul.
I remember the famous line from Warren Buffett ... when a manager with a great reputation is hired by a company with a bad reputation, the companies reputation wins out.
Going to a bad organization more often than not taints YOU with that reputation. Hard to emerge unscathed.
-
Agree about MSU, but Depaul is flat out dysfunctional. I would rather go to a Horizon League, Missouri Valley or A-10 school over Depaul.
I remember the famous line from Warren Buffett ... when a manager with a great reputation is hired by a company with a bad reputation, the companies reputation wins out.
Going to a bad organization more often than not taints YOU with that reputation. Hard to emerge unscathed.
So, no one should ever work for DePaul basketball? That'll keep 'em in the cellar.
-
So, no one should ever work for DePaul basketball? That'll keep 'em in the cellar.
When they get a new AD and new head coach, then they can change. Until then a 28 year-old assistant from a prep school is going to be tainted by their repuation.
-
Interesting.
Family is well known area here, kids were total loads, supported by a over-vocal, apparent asshat father who would get in screaming matches with other parents at away games.
The oldest son was still younger than my high school days, but I remember hearing about them.
-
You can't tell me that if it was his goal to get to a college program that he couldn't have done any better than DePaul?? If he is so highly regarded for his ability to recruit, schools should have been lined up to offer this guy a job. Again, it's total desperation by DePaul to try to make themselves look somewhat relevant again. Given the accolades this guy gets Nationally and the fact that if other schools knew it could/would deliver 5 star recruits, he'd have had his choice of jobs I'd think. Something about this one doesn't pass the smell test..
-
The Marquette academic building has its own coach?
-
You can't tell me that if it was his goal to get to a college program that he couldn't have done any better than DePaul?? If he is so highly regarded for his ability to recruit, schools should have been lined up to offer this guy a job. Again, it's total desperation by DePaul to try to make themselves look somewhat relevant again. Given the accolades this guy gets Nationally and the fact that if other schools knew it could/would deliver 5 star recruits, he'd have had his choice of jobs I'd think. Something about this one doesn't pass the smell test..
It is smart for DePaul and a good move for the young man. Their is upside for both parties and very little downside. There is a pecking order in assistant coach jobs and this young fellow was able to skip the low major and mid major level and start at the high major level. If he is successful in helping DePaul attract even one quality recruit, it will be worth it for both parties. DePaul needs to get 4 good players a year for a couple of years to be competitive again. They have to start by getting the first one.
-
He is a young guy. Getting paid good money and living in Lincoln Park has to be very attractive.
If he is actually going to live in Lincoln Park, that "good money" isn't going to go very far. A decent 1-bedroom apartment with a parking spot is going to run 2 grand a month.
-
If he is actually going to live in Lincoln Park, that "good money" isn't going to go very far. A decent 1-bedroom apartment with a parking spot is going to run 2 grand a month.
No worries, JLP sweetened the deal by giving him his own double at Corcoran Residence Hall.
-
Agree about MSU, but Depaul is flat out dysfunctional. I would rather go to a Horizon League, Missouri Valley or A-10 school over Depaul.
I remember the famous line from Warren Buffett ... when a manager with a great reputation is hired by a company with a bad reputation, the companies reputation wins out.
Going to a bad organization more often than not taints YOU with that reputation. Hard to emerge unscathed.
Sort of like when leitao parlayed his first experince at depaul into the virginia job?
-
Sort of like when leitao parlayed his first experince at depaul into the virginia job?
This was Leiteo's two seasons at Depaul before he left for Virginia
2003–04 DePaul 22–10 12–4 1st NCAA Second Round
2004–05 DePaul 20–11 10–6 T–4th NIT Second Round
Depaul, like MU was still in CUSA. He had a good record deserving of the Virginia job.
Depaul became dysfunctional once they got the Big East. They simply cannot compete at the level of the Big East and now they are hopelessly lost.
Not a good place to break into D1 basketball.
-
Sort of like when leitao parlayed his first experince at depaul into the virginia job?
I think he means like when Jerry Wainwright parlayed his experience at DePaul into a job at Marquette.
Maybe worth noting that Tracy Webster went from DePaul assistant and briefly interim head coach to assistant gigs at Tennessee and Cal.
-
I think he means like when Jerry Wainwright parlayed his experience at DePaul into a job at Marquette.
Maybe worth noting that Tracy Webster went from DePaul assistant and briefly interim head coach to assistant gigs at Tennessee and Cal.
Webster worked as an assistant coach at Kentucky, Illinois, Purdue, Ball State, DePaul, Nebraska, and Tennessee and Cal (and is now leaving Cal and looking for work again).
He was the interim head coach at DePaul from January 11, 2010 until April 7, 2010, amassing a 1–14 regular season record and a 0–1 record in the Big East Tournament.
Depaul was his fifth stop, not his first. He broke in with Kentucky, which will NEVER be confused with Depaul.
-
Wonder if he found out DePaul going to school Leitao soon and hed be given the job?
Far fetched I know but still would be an intriguing set up.
-
Webster worked as an assistant coach at Kentucky, Illinois, Purdue, Ball State, DePaul, Nebraska, and Tennessee and Cal (and is now leaving Cal and looking for work again).
He was the interim head coach at DePaul from January 11, 2010 until April 7, 2010, amassing a 1–14 regular season record and a 0–1 record in the Big East Tournament.
Depaul was his fifth stop, not his first. He broke in with Kentucky, which will NEVER be confused with Depaul.
Right, but you said DePaul is where careers go to die (or words to that effect). Webster is just one of several examples of coaches whose careers didn't die as a result of working at DePaul.
Others:
Kevin Nickleberry - now head coach at Howard
Brian Kennedy - now head coach at NJIT
David Booth - now New Orleans Pelicans director of player personnel
Ramon Williams - now an assistant for some guy at Virginia Tech
Gene Cross - went on to be head coach at Toledo and now coaches in the D-League
Josh Oppenheimer - was an assistant coach for the Bucks, now an assistant for the Houston Rockets.
Bottom line, working at DePaul is not a career killer, and especially not for a 28-year-old in his first college job.
-
next thing ya know, colleges will be courting the brothers and sisters of recruits they really really want ;)
-
Right, but you said DePaul is where careers go to die (or words to that effect). Webster is just one of several examples of coaches whose careers didn't die as a result of working at DePaul.
Others:
Kevin Nickleberry - now head coach at Howard
Brian Kennedy - now head coach at NJIT
David Booth - now New Orleans Pelicans director of player personnel
Ramon Williams - now an assistant for some guy at Virginia Tech
Gene Cross - went on to be head coach at Toledo and now coaches in the D-League
Josh Oppenheimer - was an assistant coach for the Bucks, now an assistant for the Houston Rockets.
Bottom line, working at DePaul is not a career killer, and especially not for a 28-year-old in his first college job.
Not quite ... I said it is a bad place to start a career, considering they are coming off consecutive 9 win seasons and average about 1,000 paying fans/game last season.
-
If he is actually going to live in Lincoln Park, that "good money" isn't going to go very far. A decent 1-bedroom apartment with a parking spot is going to run 2 grand a month.
I remember my salad days living in a high rise condo on Lincoln Park West , great views of city and lake , swimming pool, shacking up with auburn haired beauty. Cost $440 a month with parking space. Life was great back then.
-
I remember my salad days living in a high rise condo on Lincoln Park West , great views of city and lake , swimming pool, shacking up with auburn haired beauty. Cost $440 a month with parking space. Life was great back then.
Sounds great though once you factor in the inflation 440 a month in say the 80s (just guessing here) is actually about 1,023 given inflation rates then you add the whole being right next to Cabrini Green when it was quite possibly the worst few blocks in civilized society suddenly it doesn't exactly seem as appealing as you make it out to be.
-
Not quite ... I said it is a bad place to start a career, considering they are coming off consecutive 9 win seasons and average about 1,000 paying fans/game last season.
Your direct quote:
"Until Depaul changes, it seems like a place that careers go to die."
-
Not quite ... I said it is a bad place to start a career, considering they are coming off consecutive 9 win seasons and average about 1,000 paying fans/game last season.
Name a person who started their career as an assistant coach for Depaul who ended up flaming out.
I don't think you will find one because most people don't start their careers as an assistant coach for a high major. That's an impressive feat.
-
Name a person who started their career as an assistant coach for Depaul who ended up flaming out.
I don't think you will find one because most people don't start their careers as an assistant coach for a high major. That's an impressive feat.
Joey Meyer. That's all I got.
-
Joey Meyer. That's all I got.
Well, he was given the reins to a top 10 program and and ran it for the next 13 seasons.
So, working as an assistant at DePaul didn't turn out all bad for Joey.
-
Well, he was given the reins to a top 10 program and and ran it for the next 13 seasons.
So, working as an assistant at DePaul didn't turn out all bad for Joey.
Amazing, what Posters know and don't know about Joey.
-
Name a person who started their career as an assistant coach for Depaul who ended up flaming out.
I don't think you will find one because most people don't start their careers as an assistant coach for a high major. That's an impressive feat.
i've got 2 quick and recent ones-greg gard and buzz williams
-
i've got 2 quick and recent ones-greg gard and buzz williams
Neither of those guys started their careers at high majors.
Gard started at UW-Platteville. Buzz started at Texas-Arlington.
-
Neither of those guys started their careers at high majors.
Gard started at UW-Platteville. Buzz started at Texas-Arlington.
Was about to post the same. Buzz was head coach @ New Orleans prior to MU
-
Neither of those guys started their careers at high majors.
Gard started at UW-Platteville. Buzz started at Texas-Arlington.
uw-platteville is far from a "high major" nawlins considered a high major? there are some mid-majors i would consider to be a higher level program than new orleans
-
uw-platteville is far from a "high major" nawlins considered a high major? there are some mid-majors i would consider to be a higher level program than new orleans
The question was name a guy who started his career as an assistant coach for a high major program whose career died because of it.
You named two coaches who started at low majors and then did very well
-
Is Depaul a high major team that has hit a rough patch the last few years and will inevitably pull out it?
If you believe this, then starting one's career here is fine.
Or, is Depaul a uniquely dysfunctional team that is going through more than a just a rough patch?
If you believe this, then be careful starting your career here.
I think it is the latter.
Depaul will permanently be this way until they have a change at the top and a new commitment.
Restated, the popular line around here "they will be fine" does not apply at Depaul until something changes.
-
The question was name a guy who started his career as an assistant coach for a high major program whose career died because of it.
You named two coaches who started at low majors and then did very well
i am not tring to be obtuse, but here was the supposition-
"because most people don't start their careers as an assistant coach for a high major"
and then i named 2, but you are probably right as MOST do not start their careers....i missed the "whose career died because of it" part though
i just named 2 that came to mind, but i missed the "whose career died because of it" part though because gard and buzz are still doing pretty well. am i still not getting it? if so, no big deal-carry on
-
i am not tring to be obtuse, but here was the supposition-
"because most people don't start their careers as an assistant coach for a high major"
I think you're misreading it.
Neither Buzz or Gard started their careers as assistant coaches for a high major. Both spent considerable time at smaller schools before landing jobs at high major programs.
-
I think you're misreading it.
Neither Buzz or Gard started their careers as assistant coaches for a high major. Both spent considerable time at smaller schools before landing jobs at high major programs.
evidently i did-thanks
-
Count me as one that believes DePaul starts to do well in the next 5 years. Middle of the pack. Their arena will be a big boost for them.
-
They got an unofficial
https://twitter.com/jonrothstein/status/860552005374287872
-
http://www.scout.com/college/basketball/recruiting/story/1776230-tyger-campbell-depaul-will-reclassify (http://www.scout.com/college/basketball/recruiting/story/1776230-tyger-campbell-depaul-will-reclassify)
This f'n blows...DePaul was just fine where they were...at the bottom of the Big east.
-
http://www.scout.com/college/basketball/recruiting/story/1776230-tyger-campbell-depaul-will-reclassify (http://www.scout.com/college/basketball/recruiting/story/1776230-tyger-campbell-depaul-will-reclassify)
This f'n blows...DePaul was just fine where they were...at the bottom of the Big east.
It is good for the Big East , so as much as we don't like DePaul, it is still good for us to see them get good recruits.
-
Looks like the hiring paid off. But now can they get Brian Bowen?
-
Looks like they are front runners for Bowen. Holy crap, this could actually be the resurgence of Depaul basketball. Now just gotta fire JLP and they might actually have a chance.
-
Looks like the hiring paid off. But now can they get Brian Bowen?
Bowen is looking for a program that will allow himself to showcase his game. I think part of the reason he has not yet committed is that some of the places he is looking at such as Michigan State and Arizona won't let him do that and have plenty of other good players. DePaul may be willing to say the things Bowen wants to hear.
-
Bowen is looking for a program that will allow himself to showcase his game. I think part of the reason he has not yet committed is that some of the places he is looking at such as Michigan State and Arizona won't let him do that and have plenty of other good players. DePaul may be willing to say the things Bowen wants to hear.
"We beat Robert Morris", Leitao whispers seductively.
-
they got him, good for them.....and the BEast.... Now get Bowen
-
Huh. This could be the first step in some big changes to the big east. Would be fun to have a meaningful rivalry with DePaul again.
-
Huh. This could be the first step in some big changes to the big east. Would be fun to have a meaningful rivalry with DePaul again.
As I said last week, count me in as DePaul will make a resurgence. New arena helps. DL is not a bad coach, and it really only takes one or two dominoes to fall for other kids to take notice and snowball in recruiting.
-
Bowen won't play with Campbell. Barring a catastrophic injury, he's in college for only 33 games.
-
Bowen won't play with Campbell. Barring a catastrophic injury, he's in college for only 33 games.
I don't think anyone said they would. But I think this gets said about every 5 star and borderline 5 star. Yet every year about half of them stay another year.
That being said, what I have heard about Bowen is that he wants to get to the pros as quick as possible
-
As I said last week, count me in as DePaul will make a resurgence. New arena helps. DL is not a bad coach, and it really only takes one or two dominoes to fall for other kids to take notice and snowball in recruiting.
One additional thing that no one has considered is that DePauls new arena may end up serving as an entertainment vehicle for various conventions at McCormick Place. They may be able to get the place more than half filled which could give the game environment some dynamism. All it takes is a couple good recruiting years to get something to happen positive.
-
Bowen won't play with Campbell. Barring a catastrophic injury, he's in college for only 33 games.
Bowen definitely see's himself as one and done but if you watch his game, he definitely needs to get stronger. Doesn't really have any great qualities that would cement him as a 1st round pick. If you look at some 2018 mock drafts, he's no where to be found. My guess is that he is a two year player.
-
One additional thing that no one has considered is that DePauls new arena may end up serving as an entertainment vehicle for various conventions at McCormick Place. They may be able to get the place more than half filled which could give the game environment some dynamism. All it takes is a couple good recruiting years to get something to happen positive.
Some MU fans think they will be bad forever. Not going to happen. A lot of positive things for them right now. They will be a decent club within a few years and some momentum with the arena. Signing a 5 star kid can lead to other recruits wanting to join the club and the challenge of bringing a program back.
-
Some MU fans think they will be bad forever. Not going to happen. A lot of positive things for them right now. They will be a decent club within a few years and some momentum with the arena. Signing a 5-star kid can lead to other recruits wanting to join the club and the challenge of bringing a program back.
So if they are getting better, who will they be better than in the Big East ... that is, consistently better.
I came up with one name ... the new Georgetown under Ewing.
Am I wrong for thinking this? If so, what Big East team can you point to is on track to be regularly finishing below Depaul?
-
So if they are getting better, who will they be better than in the Big East ... that is, consistently better.
I came up with one name ... the new Georgetown under Ewing.
Am I wrong for thinking this? If so, what Big East team can you point to is on track to be regularly finishing below Depaul?
I'm not sold on SJU yet under Mullin and I don't follow them close enough but I have to imagine that once this class that Willard sold his soul for graduates this year that they'll return to being an average at best team.
-
A lot of people here are talking like the new arena is going to be DePaul's salvation. Unless they put a better product on the floor, any bump from the new facility is going to last two years, tops. And recruits aren't going to be swayed by a better arena unless their other team choices are on the same plane of suckiness (or worse). Allstate was never a "nice" venue, but that didn't stop them from packing the place when DePaul was good.
No one is going to go to see a crap team just because the facilities are nice. But if they were good, they would go to watch them in an Catholic elementary school gym.
-
I'm not sold on SJU yet under Mullin and I don't follow them close enough but I have to imagine that once this class that Willard sold his soul for graduates this year that they'll return to being an average at best team.
Agreed. My bet is in 2018-2019 the two teams on bottom will be Seton Hall and Georgetown. Depual probably 7th. The other 6 could be fighting for high seeds. BE recruiting is going up for everybody but Georgetown and Seton Hall right now.
-
A lot of people here are talking like the new arena is going to be DePaul's salvation. Unless they put a better product on the floor, any bump from the new facility is going to last two years, tops. And recruits aren't going to be swayed by a better arena unless their other team choices are on the same plane of suckiness (or worse). Allstate was never a "nice" venue, but that didn't stop them from packing the place when DePaul was good.
No one is going to go to see a crap team just because the facilities are nice. But if they were good, they would go to watch them in an Catholic elementary school gym.
I agree with this and would add that anyone that believes that Depaul is going to turn around because of an inconvenient to get to from campus, not a basketball only new arena at McCormick place ... then MU is winning the national championship when they move into the top state of the art NBA arena!
Point is, after Depaul moves, what Big East time plays in a crappy arena? I count none of them. So it's not a positive for Depaul, it is a reduction of a negative.
-
Is the Allstate Arena a "crappy arena?" Or is it a crappy location. The Dunkin Donuts Center in Providence is older and smaller and about the same distance away from campus as MU is to the BC. You put the Allstate Arena within walking distance of the DePaul campus, and it's more than compatible.
-
Is the Allstate Arena a "crappy arena?" Or is it a crappy location. The Dunkin Donuts Center in Providence is older and smaller and about the same distance away from campus as MU is to the BC. You put the Allstate Arena within walking distance of the DePaul campus, and it's more than compatible.
Disagree ... The Dunkin Donuts arena is 2 miles off campus in downtown Providence. It's a 10-minute bus ride. Similar to Georgetown and Verizon and really not much further than the BC from the western most part of MU's campus.
All-state is 16 miles off-campus and can take an hour to get to on a weekday night game (going to during rush -hour). And while Dunkin and Verizon (and the BC) are in desirable areas (meaning bars, restaurants, and shops), All-state is next to a strip mall and an airport.
No comparsion
-
Is the Allstate Arena a "crappy arena?" Or is it a crappy location. The Dunkin Donuts Center in Providence is older and smaller and about the same distance away from campus as MU is to the BC. You put the Allstate Arena within walking distance of the DePaul campus, and it's more than compatible.
DePaul was averaging 9500-10000 fans when Pat Kennedy had the check book. Sure their student section was small but fans were coming. The issue is not the location (unless you care solely about students support). The issue is the team has just sucked. The arena has been a great thing for JLP to hide behind. A bad arena doesn't make a team suck, a team that sucks makes an arena bad.
-
Is the Allstate Arena a "crappy arena?"
It's crappy in the sense that it is a 37-year-old basic facility that has had no upgrades since the day it opened. Apparently the $10 million Allstate paid for the naming rights was earmarked for improvements, but I can't tell what they are.
It's old-looking and it is bare-bones in terms of amenities. Your food choices are basically limited to hot dogs and pizza. Their scoreboard looks like an antique. The sound system is terrible.
-
Disagree ... The Dunkin Donuts arena is 2 miles off campus in downtown Providence. It's a 10-minute bus ride. Similar to Georgetown and Verizon and really not much further than the BC from the western most part of MU's campus.
All-state is 16 miles off-campus and can take an hour to get to on a weekday night game (going to during rush -hour). And while Dunkin and Verizon (and the BC) are in desirable areas (meaning bars, restaurants, and shops), All-state is next to a strip mall and an airport.
No comparsion
I don't think you understood what I meant. IF the Allstate were somehow 2 miles from DePaul, it would be sufficient and there would be no need for a new arena.
-
Is the Allstate Arena a "crappy arena?" Or is it a crappy location. The Dunkin Donuts Center in Providence is older and smaller and about the same distance away from campus as MU is to the BC. You put the Allstate Arena within walking distance of the DePaul campus, and it's more than compatible.
Good point. The Allstate isn't fancy in any way, shape, or form, but it has a decent layout and is the right size for a college team. The location is horrendous unless you live in Park Ridge.
-
And while Dunkin and Verizon (and the BC) are in desirable areas (meaning bars, restaurants, and shops), All-state is next to a strip mall and an airport.
What are you talking about? There is a Target NEXT DOOR!!!!!
-
Good point. The Allstate isn't fancy in any way, shape, or form, but it has a decent layout and is the right size for a college team. The location is horrendous unless you live in Park Ridge.
If you are looking at the entire Chicagoland area as your market, you can't get a more convenient location than the intersection of I-294 and I-90.
-
Agreed. My bet is in 2018-2019 the two teams on bottom will be Seton Hall and Georgetown. Depual probably 7th. The other 6 could be fighting for high seeds. BE recruiting is going up for everybody but Georgetown and Seton Hall right now.
Not to hijack, but this speaks to a major reason why I didn't like the Ewing hire. There is kind of a recruiting tide that ebbs and flows for a team where at least a not-insignificant element of their recruiting fortunes are dependent upon the recruiting of their conference and other schools they are commonly compared to, for geographic reasons. I feel like Gtown is strangely outside of that Big East slipstream right now, which is a bad thing given the success of the other teams. I feel like Ewing's inexperience with that environment provides far less reason for optimism than the savvy of someone like Amaker, even if he would have made for a less sexy hire.
-
It's crappy in the sense that it is a 37-year-old basic facility that has had no upgrades since the day it opened. Apparently the $10 million Allstate paid for the naming rights was earmarked for improvements, but I can't tell what they are.
It's old-looking and it is bare-bones in terms of amenities. Your food choices are basically limited to hot dogs and pizza. Their scoreboard looks like an antique. The sound system is terrible.
The worst thing about the Allstate, by far, is the ungodly size of its rows. If you're somehow stuck in the middle of the row, you've got 15-20 people to get by to make it to an aisle.
Overall, the Allstate is fine. It's dated, the concessions are subpar (if that matters ... I don't think the deciding factor for many people is the dining experience) and the suites are far from luxurious, but there's not really anything wrong with it. The layout, location, sound system, concessions, etc., haven't prevented it from consistently being one of the most successful concert and family show venues in the country. And it's far, far, far down the list of what's prevented DePaul from being a more successful program for the past couple decades.
-
The worst thing about the Allstate, by far, is the ungodly size of its rows. If you're somehow stuck in the middle of the row, you've got 15-20 people to get by to make it to an aisle.
Overall, the Allstate is fine. It's dated, the concessions are subpar (if that matters ... I don't think the deciding factor for many people is the dining experience) and the suites are far from luxurious, but there's not really anything wrong with it. The layout, location, sound system, concessions, etc., haven't prevented it from consistently being one of the most successful concert and family show venues in the country. And it's far, far, far down the list of what's prevented DePaul from being a more successful program for the past couple decades.
Don't forget the Wolff's Sunday flea markets...
-
If you are looking at the entire Chicagoland area as your market, you can't get a more convenient location than the intersection of I-294 and I-90.
Not true, cannot more convenient than downtown.
-
The worst thing about the Allstate, by far, is the ungodly size of its rows. If you're somehow stuck in the middle of the row, you've got 15-20 people to get by to make it to an aisle.
Why does DePaul make all of their fans sit in the same row?
-
Why does DePaul make all of their fans sit in the same row?
Easier to gather everyone for the race where you balance an egg on a spoon.
-
Not true, cannot more convenient than downtown.
As a suburbanite, I can tell you that you cannot be more wrong. People who live in the city can take the El/bus to the Allstate. Not everyone in the suburbs has convenient public transportation to Downtown.
Other than for work, I go Downtown fewer than 5 times a year, usually because we have out-of-town guests. I am far from alone. It's not worth the hassle. And to have to actually go all the way through Downtown on my way to McCormick Place (which 80% of the folks even remotely interested in DePaul basketball will have to do) is even more of a hassle.
-
As a suburbanite, I can tell you that you cannot be more wrong. People who live in the city can take the El/bus to the Allstate. Not everyone in the suburbs has convenient public transportation to Downtown.
Other than for work, I go Downtown fewer than 5 times a year, usually because we have out-of-town guests. I am far from alone. It's not worth the hassle.
Does that really make suburban venues a good or profitable idea, though? People from the NW burbs also talk about going to the burbs north of the city like its the oregon trail, so I'm not sure you capture more of the suburban crowd by placing stadiums or venues out there. At least downtown, you have bars and restaurants and can make it more of an event (not to mention that its just more shiny for recruits).
-
Does that really make suburban venues a good or profitable idea, though? People from the NW burbs also talk about going to the burbs north of the city like its the oregon trail, so I'm not sure you capture more of the suburban crowd by placing stadiums or venues out there. At least downtown, you have bars and restaurants and can make it more of an event (not to mention that its just more shiny for recruits).
How do most people get to the United Center?
-
As a suburbanite, I can tell you that you cannot be more wrong. People who live in the city can take the El/bus to the Allstate. Not everyone in the suburbs has convenient public transportation to Downtown.
Other than for work, I go Downtown fewer than 5 times a year, usually because we have out-of-town guests. I am far from alone. It's not worth the hassle. And to have to actually go all the way through Downtown on my way to McCormick Place (which 80% of the folks even remotely interested in DePaul basketball will have to do) is even more of a hassle.
The commute is the same as a Bears game, if not easier. A one hour car commute. If you want to imbibe, take the Metra to OTR and grab an Uber for the five-ten minute drive to McCormick. Since you have a monthly Metra pass, the $5 Uber fare split two ways is cheaper and easier than walking to the CTA line.
-
As a suburbanite, I can tell you that you cannot be more wrong. People who live in the city can take the El/bus to the Allstate. Not everyone in the suburbs has convenient public transportation to Downtown.
Other than for work, I go Downtown fewer than 5 times a year, usually because we have out-of-town guests. I am far from alone. It's not worth the hassle. And to have to actually go all the way through Downtown on my way to McCormick Place (which 80% of the folks even remotely interested in DePaul basketball will have to do) is even more of a hassle.
And suburbanites at MU used to wonder why city folk got offended when they'd say they were from Chicago.
Anyways, the issue is that Lincoln Park priced a lot of DePaul students out of the neighborhood so the vast majority live all over the city. I've met them as west west as Galewood, as far north as rogers park and even some that come in from Beverly. It's become a giant commuter school so no matter what the location is, they're losing out on a big portion of their fan base. At least by being downtown they can count on young alums and current students coming (if they're good) and can try to market it as a desireable location for any out of towners from opposing teams.
-
The commute is the same as a Bears game, if not easier. A one hour car commute. If you want to imbibe, take the Metra to OTR and grab an Uber for the five-ten minute drive to McCormick. Since you have a monthly Metra pass, the $5 Uber fare split two ways is cheaper and easier than walking to the CTA line.
DePaul is not the Bears.
-
DePaul is not the Bears.
Well.....
-
DePaul is not the Bears.
You sure?
Also MU is not the Packers...
-
And suburbanites at MU used to wonder why city folk got offended when they'd say they were from Chicago.
Anyways, the issue is that Lincoln Park priced a lot of DePaul students out of the neighborhood so the vast majority live all over the city. I've met them as west west as Galewood, as far north as rogers park and even some that come in from Beverly. It's become a giant commuter school so no matter what the location is, they're losing out on a big portion of their fan base. At least by being downtown they can count on young alums and current students coming (if they're good) and can try to market it as a desireable location for any out of towners from opposing teams.
This is all true, but that doesn't mean it is more convenient for their potential fanbase as a whole than where the Allstate is.
-
You sure?
Also MU is not the Packers...
The Bears only play in Soldier Field 8 times a year, it is an all-day event, and while they suck, they are not nearly as crappy as DePaul Men's basketball.
The Tennessee Titans play Downtown, in a half-full stadium.
-
This is all true, but that doesn't mean it is more convenient for their potential fanbase as a whole than where the Allstate is.
It will be interesting to see what happens when NU plays there next year in Rosemont. NU makes a killing in attendance as other B1G schools' fans prefer to visit Chicago versus the other cow or corn towns, stay downtown, and take the el to Evanston.
-
The commute is the same as a Bears game, if not easier. A one hour car commute. If you want to imbibe, take the Metra to OTR and grab an Uber for the five-ten minute drive to McCormick. Since you have a monthly Metra pass, the $5 Uber fare split two ways is cheaper and easier than walking to the CTA line.
Where do you live in the suburbs that you can get to Soldier Field in an hour (at least anytime between 7 a.m. and midnight)? It takes me longer than that just to get from O'Hare to downtown.
-
I-294/I-90 is the most ideal spot for a sports venue for the vast majority of Chicagoans. I think eventually that is where the White Sox will play (that may be 20 years out still).
-
How do most people get to the United Center?
Uber ... 10 to 15 minutes
-
This thread is reminding me why I chose not to return to Chicagoland after school.
-
Where do you live in the suburbs that you can get to Soldier Field in an hour (at least anytime between 7 a.m. and midnight)? It takes me longer than that just to get from O'Hare to downtown.
Google maps at noon today with traffic from the Western burbs to the Arena. If it is a weeknight game, Metra it or CTA it to the Wintrust, which will be immensely easier for the thousands of students and alums who live and work in the city.
Also, the Bears play at least ten games at home and DePaul played 16 in Rosemont. They also played games at McGrath. The Glows and myself spend 3-4 hours commuting to MU weeknight games.
If DU is good, fans will come. If not, it will be a ghost town like Allstate. And, Rosemont is no treat to commute to either, and Allstate parking is all choke points.
-
I live in the SW suburbs of Chicago and I would definitely say the McCormick Place venue is more convenient for people from my area than anything north of I-290/I-88.
The rebuilt Dan Ryan makes it a good deal easier to get to downtown from the Orland Park/Tinley Park area than it is to get to Rosemont. The door to door trip from my house to McCormick Place will typically take 35 minutes, its generally at least 15 minutes longer to get to Allstate Arena.
-
I live in the SW suburbs of Chicago and I would definitely say the McCormick Place venue is more convenient for people from my area than anything north of I-290/I-88.
The rebuilt Dan Ryan makes it a good deal easier to get to downtown from the Orland Park/Tinley Park area than it is to get to Rosemont. The door to door trip from my house to McCormick Place will typically take 35 minutes, its generally at least 15 minutes longer to get to Allstate Arena.
35min from Orland downtown? You must leave at 6am and go home at 8pm... right now it's 4:15 and says an hour fifteen
-
Bowen tweeted out today he is going to Louisville
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19529194/five-star-prospect-brian-bowen-commits-louisville
-
Bowen tweeted out today he is going to Louisville
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19529194/five-star-prospect-brian-bowen-commits-louisville
Weird recruitment. All over the place. Smelled like a lot conversations were being had behind the scenes.
-
Georgetown once played its games in the suburbs at Capital Centre, a soulless building in the woods of Maryland where there wasn't a restaurant, convenience store, or bus stop within three miles of the place. Moving downtown was the best decision Georgetown could have made given that Capital Centre was so inaccessible to students, who are not allowed to have cars and had to ride rented school buses to the games.
Granted, it's going to be a hike for many in the northwest suburbs, but the Rosemont Horizon was never going to get better.
-
35min from Orland downtown? You must leave at 6am and go home at 8pm... right now it's 4:15 and says an hour fifteen
I didn't say downtown, I said McCormick Place. That's a big difference. When you can get off the Ryan at 31st or Cermak instead of having to take LSD or the Kennedy farther north to, say the Loop, the trip is significantly shorter.
I'm also not afraid to admit when I'm wrong. At 5:45 pm today the trip is only 34 minutes.
-
DePaul hired the coach of LaLumiere where all the foreign language classes are at Marquette? Didn't know they had a coach there.