MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: real chili 83 on October 22, 2016, 10:00:22 PM
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For Ernie
For Don
For Glen
For Jooody
For Ron
For Randy
For......
CUBS WIN CUBS WIN CUBS WIN
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For my wife....
GO Tribe!
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Cheer for the Cubs? Or cheer for a franchise that has had some of the most racists logos in all of sports?
Even as much of SJW as I am....I find myself cheering for Cleveland.
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Cheer for the Cubs? Or cheer for a franchise that currently has had some of the most racists the best logos in all of sports?
Even as much of SJW as I am....I find myself cheering for Cleveland.
FIFY.
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What a great story line.
Two of the longest suffering franchises in history make the WS in the same year. The Cavs already broke Beleiveland's drought so...I guess it would be nice for the Cubs to end theirs.
Cleveland and Chicago both are by the lakes...is the weather holding off or will it be cold?
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FIFY.
You are such an enormous turd.
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You are such an enormous turd.
Oh.
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My grandfather died the same night of the Bartman game. Very emotional last night.
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This St. Louis Cardinals fan is cheering for a quick end to the World Series, a Cleveland Indians sweep and hope that the Cardinals get their act together this winter so that the Cubs resume their rightful post season place in front of their television sets.
The baseball post-season and Aaron Rodgers offensive woes is making me long more than ever for Marquette season to start!
At least Ohio State lost last night and Notre Dame sucks this year!
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This St. Louis Cardinals fan is cheering for a quick end to the World Series, a Cleveland Indians sweep and hope that the Cardinals get their act together this winter so that the Cubs resume their rightful post season place in front of their television sets.
The baseball post-season and Aaron Rodgers offensive woes is making me long more than ever for Marquette season to start!
At least Ohio State lost last night and Notre Dame sucks this year!
So you want to keep your streak going when Marquette begins their season? Please, route for some other college basketball team.
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FIFY.
Yuck.
We can argue all day about Warriors and its imagery. Or even cases such as Seminoles and Sioux.
But "Indians" and Cheif Wahoo are clearly, clearly racist. Anyone who considers that "one of the best logos in all of sports" has a warped thinking process. (And in this case, says sh*t just to get attention.)
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This St. Louis Cardinals fan is cheering for a quick end to the World Series, a Cleveland Indians sweep and hope that the Cardinals get their act together this winter so that the Cubs resume their rightful post season place in front of their television sets.
The baseball post-season and Aaron Rodgers offensive woes is making me long more than ever for Marquette season to start!
At least Ohio State lost last night and Notre Dame sucks this year!
A Packers AND Cardinals fan? Gross.
A piece of advice - I'd prepare yourself to see the Cubs playing into October fairly consistently in the coming years. :D
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FIFY.
C'mon Wades. The Warriors have a solid case. There is nothing appropriate about Chief Wahoo.
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Yuck.
We can argue all day about Warriors and its imagery. Or even cases such as Seminoles and Sioux.
But "Indians" and Cheif Wahoo are clearly, clearly racist. Anyone who considers that "one of the best logos in all of sports" has a warped thinking process. (And in this case, says sh*t just to get attention.)
At least they play on "Progressive Field".
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C'mon Wades. The Warriors have a solid case. There is nothing appropriate about Chief Wahoo.
I guess I don't get why people get offended by these things. Nobody is saying that every single Indian looks like the Cleveland Indians Chief Wahoo logo. They don't have some mascot doing some fake pow wow dance. They don't make fun of Native Americans. It's a nickname and a logo.
I'm Irish and would never consider that Notre Dame using the "Fighting Irish" and actually having a live mascot is offensive to me or any Irish. I don't get caught up thinking, "Holy cow how can a school think that all Irish people dress in green suits and a top hat and have red hair and a handle bar beard?"
I'd argue Warriors was, and is, far worse than the Indians. Using the Native American imagery for our Warrior nickname, especially with Willie Wampum, etc., is far worse than Chief Wahoo for the Indians. But people here (including myself, because again I don't buy into this notion that using a logo for a sports team means you think all of the group of people/animals/whatever that logo is looks just like that logo) won't move past the horrendous move the school made to change away from what they apparently consider racist (Warriors nickname with all the Native American imagery) but then get all up in arms over this. If it makes me a racist because I'm not all upset about a non-offensive nickname then I guess I'm a racist. But it's not like I sit here and think to myself, "My gosh! Cleveland's baseball team nickname is the Indians so all Indians must look like Chief Wahoo!"
If sports teams use nicknames that are actually derogatory I might start taking issue with it. But labeling Native Americans as "Warriors" was far worse than the Indians using Indian imagery. The faux outrage here over Chief Wahoo is funny to me coming from some people who won't move past the Warrior nickname.
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I guess I don't get why people get offended by these things. Nobody is saying that every single Indian looks like the Cleveland Indians Chief Wahoo logo. They don't have some mascot doing some fake pow wow dance. They don't make fun of Native Americans. It's a nickname and a logo.
I'm Irish and would never consider that Notre Dame using the "Fighting Irish" and actually having a live mascot is offensive to me or any Irish. I don't get caught up thinking, "Holy cow how can a school think that all Irish people dress in green suits and a top hat and have red hair and a handle bar beard?"
I'd argue Warriors was, and is, far worse than the Indians. Using the Native American imagery for our Warrior nickname, especially with Willie Wampum, etc., is far worse than Chief Wahoo for the Indians. But people here (including myself, because again I don't buy into this notion that using a logo for a sports team means you think all of the group of people/animals/whatever that logo is looks just like that logo) won't move past the horrendous move the school made to change away from what they apparently consider racist (Warriors nickname with all the Native American imagery) but then get all up in arms over this. If it makes me a racist because I'm not all upset about a non-offensive nickname then I guess I'm a racist. But it's not like I sit here and think to myself, "My gosh! Cleveland's baseball team nickname is the Indians so all Indians must look like Chief Wahoo!"
If sports teams use nicknames that are actually derogatory I might start taking issue with it. But labeling Native Americans as "Warriors" was far worse than the Indians using Indian imagery. The faux outrage here over Chief Wahoo is funny to me coming from some people who won't move past the Warrior nickname.
Out of respect for celebrating Cubs fans, I will not turn this into another native american mascot thread. You can look up the old Redskins thread and see all my viewpoints there. I think address every point you make except for the "it's ok if its racist because its not like a believe all native Americans look like that." That is a new one.
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Out of respect for celebrating Cubs fans, I will not turn this into another native american mascot thread. You can look up the old Redskins thread and see all my viewpoints there. I think address every point you make except for the "it's ok if its racist because its not like a believe all native Americans look like that." That is a new one.
I think many here are confusing racism and stereotyping. Big difference between the 2.
Would you refuse to take part if you were asked to draw different groups of people in a class because narrowing down entire groups of people down to one drawing is "racist" or "sexist?" If you're in a sociology class and your professor asks your class to draw a male and a female are you going to cry foul when a classmate draws 2 stick figures, one with long hair and the other with short hair, because they're being "sexist?"
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I think many here are confusing racism and stereotyping. Big difference between the 2.
Would you refuse to take part if you were asked to draw different groups of people in a class because narrowing down entire groups of people down to one drawing is "racist" or "sexist?" If you're in a sociology class and your professor asks your class to draw a male and a female are you going to cry foul when a classmate draws 2 stick figures, one with long hair and the other with short hair, because they're being "sexist?"
Stereotype:
(http://convertimage.me/gal/20130701-213252-ruzhn.jpg)
Racist:
(http://www.logodesignlove.com/images/sports/chief-wahoo-logo-02.jpg)
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I think Racist is the most overused term in the English lexicon to the point that it is becoming impotent
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I think Racist is the most overused term in the English lexicon to the point that it is becoming impotent
I agree. The Indians' logo is racist though.
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I think Racist is the most overused term in the English lexicon to the point that it is becoming impotent
I think the problem is actually that people don't recognize that there are levels of racism. Racism is a spectrum, not a definitive term. You can measure anything on the spectrum, the Indians' logo, a stick figure with long hair, or a sofa. They'll all fall on different points of the spectrum from Blatantly Racist (the KKK) to Overly Inclusive (Safe spaces where contrary opinions are punished). A lot of the little things that get labeled as racist do fall on the racist side of the spectrum. All in all, they are not that big of a deal, everyone does them. The actual harm they can do is very limited. They still aren't good.
A lot of these issues boil down to the language we use. Most us agree on what the issues are (though their importance might differ) but we get into fights about the words we use to describe those issues.
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This is a really good World Series thread.
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This is a really good World Series thread.
There are like 5 of them.
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There are like 5 of them.
...and this is the first thread we've ever discussed Native American imagery in sports.
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Stereotype:
(http://convertimage.me/gal/20130701-213252-ruzhn.jpg)
Racist:
(http://www.logodesignlove.com/images/sports/chief-wahoo-logo-02.jpg)
Nailed it.
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Back on track.....
GO CUBS GO
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A piece of advice - I'd prepare yourself to see the Cubs playing into October fairly consistently in the coming years. :D
I'm afraid you might be right. Only antidote is for the rest of the division to get better!
Especially the Cardinals!
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I'm afraid you might be right. Only antidote is for the rest of the division to get better!
Especially the Cardinals!
I'm optimistic about the brewers farm system. I think they will back up there in the next few years
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I'm afraid you might be right. Only antidote is for the rest of the division to get better!
Especially the Cardinals! Brewers!
FIFY
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Is this then racist?
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-r6dKet5g-b4/T7q3slH-tVI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/SDmHl-LZz_c/s1600/logo-notre-dame.gif)
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I'm optimistic about the brewers farm system. I think they will back up there in the next few years
I hope so. I'm pretty pessimistic when it comes to the Brewers.
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Is this then racist?
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-r6dKet5g-b4/T7q3slH-tVI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/SDmHl-LZz_c/s1600/logo-notre-dame.gif)
No. A leprechaun isn't a real thing.
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No. A leprechaun isn't a real thing.
Their nickname is the Fighting Irish. Irish are a real thing.
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No kidding. You asked about the logo though. The nickname is fine.
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I'm really glad this is the World Serious Thread. I chuckled when I saw it, and clearly the thread couldn't be any further from serious at this point.
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Their nickname is the Fighting Irish. Irish are a real thing.
Please take this to a different thread so we can actually talk about baseball.
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Agreed^^^^^^
ND sucks.
Cardinals suck
BACK TO THE CUBS!!!!!
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Agreed^^^^^^
ND sucks.
Cardinals suck
BACK TO THE CUBS!!!!!
I suppose the Cardinals may be the only franchise in baseball that considers an 86 win season and one game out of the playoffs an abject failure. The Minnesota Twins, for example, would kill for an 86 win season no matter where they stood in the standings.
As Cardinal fans, we don't wait until next year. We rebuild with the expectation of excellence.
One final thought. Give the Cubs their due. If past performance is indicative of future success, the presence of the Cubs in the World Series means we won't see them again until 2087. Think about that. My wife and I will be celebrating our 107th wedding anniversary that year! The United States will be 310 years old. Coach Wojo will have won four NCAA Championships and our floor will be renamed the Wojo-Al Floor!
Based on 108 years between World Championships, if the Cubs win this year, we'll see World Champion Chicago Cubs flying again in 2124.
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I suppose the Cardinals may be the only franchise in baseball that considers an 86 win season and one game out of the playoffs an abject failure. The Minnesota Twins, for example, would kill for an 86 win season no matter where they stood in the standings.
As Cardinal fans, we don't wait until next year. We rebuild with the expectation of excellence.
One final thought. Give the Cubs their due. If past performance is indicative of future success, the presence of the Cubs in the World Series means we won't see them again until 2087. Think about that. My wife and I will be celebrating our 107th wedding anniversary that year! The United States will be 310 years old. Coach Wojo will have won four NCAA Championships and our floor will be renamed the Wojo-Al Floor!
Based on 108 years between World Championships, if the Cubs win this year, we'll see World Champion Chicago Cubs flying again in 2124.
Ah the insufferability of Cardinals fans...
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Ah the insufferability of Cardinals fans...
Check out Baseball's Best Fans (@BestFansStLouis): https://twitter.com/BestFansStLouis?s=09
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I'm not even sure it's satire.
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I'm not even sure it's satire.
It's just St. Louis. Cleveland without a lake, football or basketball. They're simple people.
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I'm not even sure it's satire.
That account retweets real Cardinals fans. It makes me feel better about my dislike of the Cardinals.
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That account retweets real Cardinals fans. It makes me feel better about my dislike of the Cardinals.
Can't speak for all Cardinals fans. We just expect excellence.
No lovable losers here.
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Can't speak for all Cardinals fans. We just expect excellence.
No lovable losers here.
Lol, this is perfect.
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The Sandberg game.
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Can't speak for all Cardinals fans. We just expect excellence.
No lovable losers here.
This is the essence.
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The Sandberg game.
I was at the Sandberg game back in 1984. Disappointing, yes, but they play 162 games for a reason.
Like 2016, that was a down season. But the next year, under Whitey Herzog's leadership, the Cardinals were back in the World Series.
And the Cubs... let's just say they were not much of a factor in 1985.
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I do believe the Cubs hold the all time series lead, going back as far as the late 1800's.
For all those years, it's very close. If I recall correctly, it's about a 30ish game Cub lead, played over 2900 times. That's what makes the rivalry fun!
One of Harry's greatest calls was during a Cubs-Cardinals game. It was August of 1990, and Harry was going on about how Whitey was complaining so much during the season about the Umps not calling Balks. Well, the Cubs had the bases loaded and the Cardinal's pitcher balked, allowing the go ahead run to score. Harry's call was..."Whitey, he who lives by the sword, dies by the sword"! Pure gold.
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If the Cardinals hold excellence in anything in major league baseball, it's DUI/DWI.
(http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/msti/images/c/cd/LaRusss_DUI.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20130924012002)
(http://global.fncstatic.com/static/managed/img/fn-latino/sports/taveras%20main%20pic%202.jpg)
(http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Video/070429/n_hancock_car_070429.standard.jpg)
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Can't speak for all Cardinals fans. We just expect excellence.
No lovable losers here.
(http://15130-presscdn-0-89.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/get-a-brain-morans.jpg)
I get the feeling your expectations are going to be strongly tested in the upcoming years.
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(http://15130-presscdn-0-89.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/get-a-brain-morans.jpg)
I get the feeling your expectations are going to be strongly tested in the upcoming years.
The Cardinals have an excellent talent base in their minor league system now. It's particularly strong with pitching.
There are two needs that separate the Cardinals from the Cubs. The first is a lead-off .300 hitter with speed who can play outfield and manufacture a run. The second is a middle infielder who can be the second coming of Ozzie. The biggest problem the Cardinals had last year was erratic infield play, which must be addressed in 2017.
Finally, they have to build a team that can win at Busch Stadium. If the Cardinals had the same record at home as they did away from Busch, the Cardinals and Cubs would have been locked in a season-long battle for the Division lead. The team may not be suited for the playing environment (heavy air, pitching focused, manufactured run games) that prevails at Busch. That's on management to fix.
We shall see, but the Cardinal record during the last 25 years speaks for itself!
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Finally, they have to build a team that can win at Busch Stadium. If the Cardinals had the same record at home as they did away from Busch, the Cardinals and Cubs would have been locked in a season-long battle for the Division lead.
This is the most absurd thing I have read all day! They finished 17.5 games behind the Cubs. I might have given this to you if you were 8 games behind, but that wasn't the case.
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The Cardinals have an excellent talent base in their minor league system now. It's particularly strong with pitching.
There are two needs that separate the Cardinals from the Cubs. The first is a lead-off .300 hitter with speed who can play outfield and manufacture a run. The second is a middle infielder who can be the second coming of Ozzie. The biggest problem the Cardinals had last year was erratic infield play, which must be addressed in 2017.
Finally, they have to build a team that can win at Busch Stadium. If the Cardinals had the same record at home as they did away from Busch, the Cardinals and Cubs would have been locked in a season-long battle for the Division lead. The team may not be suited for the playing environment (heavy air, pitching focused, manufactured run games) that prevails at Busch. That's on management to fix.
We shall see, but the Cardinal record during the last 25 years speaks for itself!
We can agree to disagree that there are two needs that separate the teams. And the Cardinals do appear to have some nice young pitching.
In terms of the lineup I see a lot of pieces that just don't fit and/or are declining. The Cardinals have had an excellent run but that really doesn't mean anything.
17.5 games. That's all.
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The Minnesota Twins, for example, would kill for an 86 win season no matter where they stood in the standings.
The Twins have won 86 games in 7 of the past 14 seasons. That's a lot of killing.
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Just send the Championship trophy to the Bronx. We all know the Yankees are the best team in baseball.
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Check out Baseball's Best Fans (@BestFansStLouis): https://twitter.com/BestFansStLouis?s=09
http://nypost.com/2016/10/23/f-king-classy-cubs-fans-threw-beer-at-dodgers-families-pitcher/
Everyfan base has idiots. The Cubs are no exception. Nor are the Cards. Nor are the White Sox. The Cubs just have far more bandwagoners that make actual fans look worse.
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This should be a great series. I love how the teams arrived. One anointed from Spring Training, the other clawing through the season.
The Indians have dealt with Boston (7 .300 hitters, best offense in baseball), Toronto (great offense) and now the Cubs (best offense in NL). Throw in the fact that their 2 of their best 3 starting pitchers are on the shelf and not to mention their best hitter played, 11 games, wow. Just a great job. What a testament to the importance of a manager. Plenty of people want to discount the importance of good managers, but it is no accident that this is Tito's 3rd WS and Maddon's 2nd.
Now the Cubs have to deal with a multifaceted offense that was 2nd in the AL in runs. Should be interesting. I know I am curious to see if Cleveland actually takes advantage of Lester's yips. I'm not certain, but I think the Tribe led the AL in stolen bags.
Then there is the added Francona v Theo, and the Miller v Chapman angle as well.
Should be fun. I'd be surprised if it didn't go at least 6.
Go Tribe. Obviously.
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Just send the Championship trophy to the Bronx. We all know the Yankees are the best team in baseball.
Why is this in teal? Over any span of time that is completely, obviously and objectively true. By pretty much any measure you want to use.
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This should be a great series. I love how the teams arrived. One anointed from Spring Training, the other clawing through the season.
The Indians have dealt with Boston (7 .300 hitters, best offense in baseball), Toronto (great offense) and now the Cubs (best offense in NL). Throw in the fact that their 2 of their best 3 starting pitchers are on the shelf and not to mention their best hitter played, 11 games, wow. Just a great job. What a testament to the importance of a manager. Plenty of people want to discount the importance of good managers, but it is no accident that this is Tito's 3rd WS and Maddon's 2nd.
Now the Cubs have to deal with a multifaceted offense that was 2nd in the AL in runs. Should be interesting. I know I am curious to see if Cleveland actually takes advantage of Lester's yips. I'm not certain, but I think the Tribe led the AL in stolen bags.
Then there is the added Francona v Theo, and the Miller v Chapman angle as well.
Should be fun. I'd be surprised if it didn't go at least 6.
Go Tribe. Obviously.
This cracks me up. Thought you would enjoy it.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvlT-uwUAAAvWJ2.jpg)
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This is the most absurd thing I have read all day! They finished 17.5 games behind the Cubs. I might have given this to you if you were 8 games behind, but that wasn't the case.
I had forgotten how hot the Cubs got at the end. Nonetheless, the Cardinals were 48-33 on the road, which was the best road record in baseball. Teams generally are a few games better at home than on the road, so 50-31 would get them within hailing range of the Chicago Cubs. By contrast the Cardinals were 38-43 at home, which is the reason they were not in the playoffs this year. Plus, some of those home losses were to the Cubs, so it is not totally absurd to think as I do that a comparable home and road record would make them competitive for the Division Title.
The disparity was so big that it could have made a HUGE difference from a statistical standpoint and you never know.
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This St. Louis Cardinals fan is cheering for a quick end to the World Series, a Cleveland Indians sweep and hope that the Cardinals get their act together this winter so that the Cubs resume their rightful post season place in front of their television sets.
The baseball post-season and Aaron Rodgers offensive woes is making me long more than ever for Marquette season to start!
At least Ohio State lost last night and Notre Dame sucks this year!
This Cardinals fan is rooting for the Northsiders in Blue. It is time. If you are a sports fan, how can you not root for a team trying to end a 108 year drought? Think of all the old timers who have lived their whole life waiting for this.
I want to see a real rivalry a la Red Sox and Yankees. This could be the best rivalry in sports if they both are good.
I don't also subscribe to the logic that if you love team X you must hate team Y.
And finally, there is no need to defend our team, so why bother? The 11 World Series rings speak for themselves.
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This cracks me up. Thought you would enjoy it.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvlT-uwUAAAvWJ2.jpg)
Just perfect. There has been quite a bit of that going on. And people wonder why sox fans hate the cubs. The Sox have been to the WS twice since the Cubs were last there. I have heard that completely disregarded like 20 times in the last 3 days.
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I had forgotten how hot the Cubs got at the end. Nonetheless, the Cardinals were 48-33 on the road, which was the best road record in baseball. Teams generally are a few games better at home than on the road, so 50-31 would get them within hailing range of the Chicago Cubs. By contrast the Cardinals were 38-43 at home, which is the reason they were not in the playoffs this year. Plus, some of those home losses were to the Cubs, so it is not totally absurd to think as I do that a comparable home and road record would make them competitive for the Division Title.
The disparity was so big that it could have made a HUGE difference from a statistical standpoint and you never know.
In other words, if the Cardinals were a better team, they would have been closer to the Cubs in the standings and more likely to make the postseason. Solid argument.
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Just perfect. There has been quite a bit of that going on. And people wonder why sox fans hate the cubs. The Sox have been to the WS twice since the Cubs were last there. I have heard that completely disregarded like 20 times in the last 3 days.
ESPN claims it didn't happen in 2005 so that must be true. Sorry.
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This Cardinals fan is rooting for the Northsiders in Blue. It is time. If you are a sports fan, how can you not root for a team trying to end a 108 year drought? Think of all the old timers who have lived their whole life waiting for this.
I want to see a real rivalry a la Red Sox and Yankees. This could be the best rivalry in sports if they both are good.
I don't also subscribe to the logic that if you love team X you must hate team Y.
And finally, there is no need to defend our team, so why bother? The 11 World Series rings speak for themselves.
I don't hate the Cubs. I'm almost as loyal to my Cardinals as I am to my Warriors.
We already have the best rivalry in baseball with the Cubs. Always has been, Always will be. Biggest difference between the Cardinal/Cub and Red Sox/Yankees is we don't have the national media covering all 18 games we play with the first team announcers who think each game is more important than the World Series.
And, unlike Yankee/Red Sox, where the lines are pretty demarcated (New England versus New York Metro), once you get south of Interstate 80 in Illinois, we live together! Same for much of Eastern Iowa. South of Interstate 80, more red. North of Interstate 80, more blue.
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I don't hate the Cubs. I'm almost as loyal to my Cardinals as I am to my Warriors.
We already have the best rivalry in baseball with the Cubs. Always has been, Always will be. Biggest difference between the Cardinal/Cub and Red Sox/Yankees is we don't have the national media covering all 18 games we play with the first team announcers who think each game is more important than the World Series.
And, unlike Yankee/Red Sox, where the lines are pretty demarcated (New England versus New York Metro), once you get south of Interstate 80 in Illinois, we live together! Same for much of Eastern Iowa. South of Interstate 80, more red. North of Interstate 80, more blue.
That's like saying Louisville/Kentucky is as good of a rivalry as Duke/North Carolina.
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I don't hate the Cubs. I'm almost as loyal to my Cardinals as I am to my Warriors.
We already have the best rivalry in baseball with the Cubs. Always has been, Always will be. Biggest difference between the Cardinal/Cub and Red Sox/Yankees is we don't have the national media covering all 18 games we play with the first team announcers who think each game is more important than the World Series.
And, unlike Yankee/Red Sox, where the lines are pretty demarcated (New England versus New York Metro), once you get south of Interstate 80 in Illinois, we live together! Same for much of Eastern Iowa. South of Interstate 80, more red. North of Interstate 80, more blue.
It has the potential to be the best rivalry in sports. Right now, its not. Both teams need to be competitive year in and year out. I'd love to see both teams be really good most years, with the Cardinals obviously winning more often than not.
But if we're not in it this year, might as well hope the Cubs finally get one.
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It has the potential to be the best rivalry in sports. Right now, its not. Both teams need to be competitive year in and year out. I'd love to see both teams be really good most years, with the Cardinals obviously winning more often than not.
But if we're not in it this year, might as well hope the Cubs finally get one.
The best rivalry in baseball is no longer though some on the west coast may disagree; it was by far the New York Giants vs. the Brooklyn Dodgers. When Jackie Robinson was traded to the Giants he retired from baseball rather than play for them giving up a 60k salary offer.
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The best rivalry in baseball is no longer though some on the west coast may disagree; it was by far the New York Giants vs. the Brooklyn Dodgers. When Jackie Robinson was traded to the Giants he retired from baseball rather than play for them giving up a 60k salary offer.
He had made the decision to retire before the trade.
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/2003372//
"In 1956, Robinson was traded to the archrival New York Giants. Though that event is often related as the impetus for the end of Robinson's career, it's only part of the story. At the time, Robinson had already agreed with William H. Black, the president of Chock Full o' Nuts, to quit for a top administrative position in the coffee company. The late Walter O'Malley gave him plenty of cover."
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He had made the decision to retire before the trade.
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/2003372//
"In 1956, Robinson was traded to the archrival New York Giants. Though that event is often related as the impetus for the end of Robinson's career, it's only part of the story. At the time, Robinson had already agreed with William H. Black, the president of Chock Full o' Nuts, to quit for a top administrative position in the coffee company. The late Walter O'Malley gave him plenty of cover."
And, his baseball skills had deteriorated substantially. It was too bad he did not get the retirement send-off he deserved.
The relationship between Messrs. Robinson and O'Malley was strained for years thereafter for a variety of reasons.
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That's like saying Louisville/Kentucky is as good of a rivalry as Duke/North Carolina.
I suspect in the State of Kentucky, they might think Louisville and Kentucky is a better rivalry than Duke and UNC. The biggest difference is that Louisville and Kentucky are in different conferences and it took an act of the Kentucky legislature to get them to play.
That said, the intensity of the rivalry in college basketball is a function of your ratings, your fan strength and whether two universities are recruiting the same players.
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Lol @ Contreras. 1) you're down 6-rip. 2) you didn't even hit it out of the park.
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I suspect in the State of Kentucky, they might think Louisville and Kentucky is a better rivalry than Duke and UNC.
And it would be yet another in a long string of things people in Kentucky are or have been wrong about.
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I suspect in the State of Kentucky, they might think Louisville and Kentucky is a better rivalry than Duke and UNC. The biggest difference is that Louisville and Kentucky are in different conferences and it took an act of the Kentucky legislature to get them to play.
That said, the intensity of the rivalry in college basketball is a function of your ratings, your fan strength and whether two universities are recruiting the same players.
People in Kentucky might think that, but nobody else in the country does, and rightfully so. Just like, apparently, St. Louis people (and maybe Chicago people) are the only people who think their rivalry with the Cubs is the best rivalry in baseball.
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People in Kentucky might think that, but nobody else in the country does, and rightfully so. Just like, apparently, St. Louis people (and maybe Chicago people) are the only people who think their rivalry with the Cubs is the best rivalry in baseball.
Depends on your definition of "best". If you are talking about the most competitive, most played, most historic, it's not Cubs/Cards or Yankees/Sox.
Looking at the numbers, Cubs/Cards is probably second best behind Dodgers/Giants. The Dodgers/Giants have played more times and is slightly closer.
Yankees/Red Sox gets the most media attention because it's on the East Coast, but it's really not all that close (certainly not compared to the other two), though it is likely amplified by three playoff series in recent memory. That said, the Dodgers/Giants series for me gets more credit because it spanned two coasts.
Other than those three, are there any even worth mentioning from a historic "all-time great" perspective?
1) Dodgers/Giants
2) Cubs/Cards
3) Yankees/Red Sox
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Depends on your definition of "best". If you are talking about the most competitive, most played, most historic, it's not Cubs/Cards or Yankees/Sox.
Looking at the numbers, Cubs/Cards is probably second best behind Dodgers/Giants. The Dodgers/Giants have played more times and is slightly closer.
Yankees/Red Sox gets the most media attention because it's on the East Coast, but it's really not all that close (certainly not compared to the other two), though it is likely amplified by three playoff series in recent memory. That said, the Dodgers/Giants series for me gets more credit because it spanned two coasts.
Other than those three, are there any even worth mentioning from a historic "all-time great" perspective?
1) Dodgers/Giants
2) Cubs/Cards
3) Yankees/Red Sox
I'd put the Yankees/Red Sox on top.
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I'd put the Yankees/Red Sox on top.
Agreed.
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Depends on your definition of "best". If you are talking about the most competitive, most played, most historic, it's not Cubs/Cards or Yankees/Sox.
Looking at the numbers, Cubs/Cards is probably second best behind Dodgers/Giants. The Dodgers/Giants have played more times and is slightly closer.
Yankees/Red Sox gets the most media attention because it's on the East Coast, but it's really not all that close (certainly not compared to the other two), though it is likely amplified by three playoff series in recent memory. That said, the Dodgers/Giants series for me gets more credit because it spanned two coasts.
Other than those three, are there any even worth mentioning from a historic "all-time great" perspective?
1) Dodgers/Giants
2) Cubs/Cards
3) Yankees/Red Sox
Dodgers / Giants goes back to pre Cali days in Brooklyn & Manhattan.
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People in Kentucky might think that, but nobody else in the country does, and rightfully so. Just like, apparently, St. Louis people (and maybe Chicago people) are the only people who think their rivalry with the Cubs is the best rivalry in baseball.
How do you know what anyone else in the country thinks? I'm curious.
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How do you know what anyone else in the country thinks? I'm curious.
Because I am part of the "anyone else in the country" category. There's one rivalry in baseball that is considered by far the best rivalry in baseball and then there's everyone else. Sure, we could just look at records and number of times played and conclude that whoever has the greatest combination of number of games played and competitive record against each other is the best rivalry, but there's more to a rivalry than just one team's record against another.
By your logic, I could claim the Brewers vs. the Rays is the best rivalry in baseball and anyone who questions it just doesn't know what anyone else in the country thinks.
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Because I am part of the "anyone else in the country" category. There's one rivalry in baseball that is considered by far the best rivalry in baseball and then there's everyone else. Sure, we could just look at records and number of times played and conclude that whoever has the greatest combination of number of games played and competitive record against each other is the best rivalry, but there's more to a rivalry than just one team's record against another.
By your logic, I could claim the Brewers vs. the Rays is the best rivalry in baseball and anyone who questions it just doesn't know what anyone else in the country thinks.
You're one person. What you happen to think is not representative of the rest of the country. Just an FYI.
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I think unless your team is involved in a big time rivalry, you use ESPN's opinion to judge. At least I do as someone in my 20s who hasn't lived through a lot of the iconic moments that make it great.
Thus Yankees/Red Sox and UNC/Duke are two of the biggest in my opinion. Largely because ESPN promotes the heck out of them.
I didn't really know Syracuse/Georgetown, Dodgers/Giants, and Louisville/Kentucky were in the neighborhood until watching ESPN whenever those games were on. I don't live in those areas. It's all subjective and ESPN is a big driver in my opinion.
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These types of things are fun for debates, but fundamentally it doesn't matter to me what "the biggest rivalry" is. Unless it involves my team, I don't really care.
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I think unless your team is involved in a big time rivalry, you use ESPN's opinion to judge. At least I do as someone in my 20s who hasn't lived through a lot of the iconic moments that make it great.
Thus Yankees/Red Sox and UNC/Duke are two of the biggest in my opinion. Largely because ESPN promotes the heck out of them.
I didn't really know Syracuse/Georgetown, Dodgers/Giants, and Louisville/Kentucky were in the neighborhood until watching ESPN whenever those games were on. I don't live in those areas. It's all subjective and ESPN is a big driver in my opinion.
Why else is every Yankees / Red Sox game end up in the dreaded Sunday evening 8:00 pm ESPN game.
In Ocean's 12 in the scene where they need to stage a fight on the train where one wears a Yankees hat and the other a Red Sox hat.
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You're one person. What you happen to think is not representative of the rest of the country. Just an FYI.
You asked how I knew what "anyone else thinks." I am "anyone else." I am neither a Cubs nor a Cardinals fan, so I fall into "anyone else."
Everyone else? I'm sure there's research out there. I don't really care enough to put in the time to look it up. I find it very doubtful that many people outside of Chicago and St. Louis think the Cardinals/Cubs is the best rivalry in baseball, but sure, I can't prove it. Just like I can't prove the Brewers/Rays isn't the best rivalry in baseball according to "everyone else," so it must be!
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You asked how I knew what "anyone else thinks." I am "anyone else." I am neither a Cubs nor a Cardinals fan, so I fall into "anyone else."
Everyone else? I'm sure there's research out there. I don't really care enough to put in the time to look it up. I find it very doubtful that many people outside of Chicago and St. Louis think the Cardinals/Cubs is the best rivalry in baseball, but sure, I can't prove it. Just like I can't prove the Brewers/Rays isn't the best rivalry in baseball according to "everyone else," so it must be!
Well, you could find media support that it isn't?
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/162607668/mlbs-hottest-rivalries-entering-2016-season/
Like Castrovince says, all rivalries are judged by the current temperature. Cubs/Cards is way hotter than Yanks/BoSox right now, but not historically in my opinion.
Just like Bears/Packers or Minny/Packers. Who's the biggest rival depends on the temperature.
Cubs/Cards is the best NL rivalry.
Yanks/BoSox is the best AL rivalry.
My opinion, if I lived on the west coast, I may think differently.
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Yea, I think Dodgers and Giants fans would have something to say on the matter.
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Because I am part of the "anyone else in the country" category. There's one rivalry in baseball that is considered by far the best rivalry in baseball and then there's everyone else. Sure, we could just look at records and number of times played and conclude that whoever has the greatest combination of number of games played and competitive record against each other is the best rivalry, but there's more to a rivalry than just one team's record against another.
By your logic, I could claim the Brewers vs. the Rays is the best rivalry in baseball and anyone who questions it just doesn't know what anyone else in the country thinks.
Yankees-Red Sox
Cubs-Cards
Giants-Dodgers
You can argue about the order, but the three listed are far and away the biggest rivalries in baseball. There's those three and then there's everyone else.
The Brewers are no ones rival. They have had almost no real success and no one cares about them.
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Yankees-Red Sox
Cubs-Cards
Giants-Dodgers
You can argue about the order, but the three listed are far and away the biggest rivalries in baseball. There's those three and then there's everyone else.
The Brewers are no ones rival. They have had almost no real success and no one cares about them.
According to who?
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According to who?
Just about every level-headed baseball fan.
What rivalries would you consider to be bigger/better/more intense than those three?
Sure, there are going to be the one-off, short-term rivalries like the Rangers and Blue Jays currently have or like the Cubs and Astros did in the late 90s-early 00s but, at the end of the day, the 3 mentioned above stand head and shoulders above the rest in terms of intensity and longevity.
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This cracks me up. Thought you would enjoy it.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvlT-uwUAAAvWJ2.jpg)
What, the White Sox don't count?
Edit: I didn't yet see all other people point this out when I posted.
MUFIC ad I live in the battleground area of the Red Sox-Yankees rivalry (which is roughly around New Haven). Hard for us to think any rivalry is bigger than Sox-Yanks. Truth be told, it isn't now what it was from 95-2009 or so.
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What, the White Sox don't count?
Edit: I didn't yet see all other people point this out when I posted.
MUFIC ad I live in the battleground area of the Red Sox-Yankees rivalry (which is roughly around New Haven). Hard for us to think any rivalry is bigger than Sox-Yanks. Truth be told, it isn't now what it was from 95-2009 or so.
No...Joe, say it ain't so.
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I'd put the Yankees/Red Sox on top.
Well we could argue about the order, but growing up in the 50s as a Yankee fan there was no rivalry that could ever match the Giant/Dodgers.
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Just about every level-headed baseball fan.
What rivalries would you consider to be bigger/better/more intense than those three?
Sure, there are going to be the one-off, short-term rivalries like the Rangers and Blue Jays currently have or like the Cubs and Astros did in the late 90s-early 00s but, at the end of the day, the 3 mentioned above stand head and shoulders above the rest in terms of intensity and longevity.
It was a joke.
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Tom Crean in the house?
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Cue the haters asking if he's gonna kiss his kid...
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Probably cheering that kid from Indiana. What's his name? Schwarber or something like that?
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I think putting Schwarber in the line up was a good idea.
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I think putting Schwarber in the line up was a good idea.
He already has more hits than Soler and Heyward combined.
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The Cubs-Cardinals are a great rivalry. The history and proximity are a big part of it. It's the football equivalent of Bears-Packers. Tons of history, proximity, etc.
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Is there a way to stream the Cubs radio broadcast? The WSCR ap does not seem to allow it.
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The Cubs-Cardinals are a great rivalry. The history and proximity are a big part of it. It's the football equivalent of Bears-Packers. Tons of history, proximity, etc.
A good example. And as a Packers fan, I don't consider the Bears-Packers rivalry to be the best in football.
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That's more like it. Step on their throats next time.
Mike Montgomery is going to be another very underrated trade (and I hope Vogelbach rakes in Seattle).
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Is there a way to stream the Cubs radio broadcast? The WSCR ap does not seem to allow it.
I paid $2.99 for the MLB app for one month. I've listened to the Cubs broadcast for the last 5-6 games using my phone and Bluetooth speaker.
Turned out to be essential for the last two because the local stations on TWC have been almost completely pixelated. When games were on FS1, the picture and sound were crystal clear. On Fox, nearly unwatchable.
It's ok. It isn't like I've been waiting for 41 years to see these games...I'm fine waiting until Friday evening for TWC to have someone come out and tell me there is nothing wrong on their end.
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I paid $2.99 for the MLB app for one month. I've listened to the Cubs broadcast for the last 5-6 games using my phone and Bluetooth speaker.
Turned out to be essential for the last two because the local stations on TWC have been almost completely pixelated. When games were on FS1, the picture and sound were crystal clear. On Fox, nearly unwatchable.
It's ok. It isn't like I've been waiting for 41 years to see these games...I'm fine waiting until Friday evening for TWC to have someone come out and tell me there is nothing wrong on their end.
Take your box into a TWC store. Had the same problem the past week, took the box in today, and they gave a brand new box and now the system seems to have been upgraded (guide screen and info screen look different). The quality is perfect now.
Also they're streaming the games on SI.com for free.
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What, the White Sox don't count?
Edit: I didn't yet see all other people point this out when I posted.
MUFIC ad I live in the battleground area of the Red Sox-Yankees rivalry (which is roughly around New Haven). Hard for us to think any rivalry is bigger than Sox-Yanks. Truth be told, it isn't now what it was from 95-2009 or so.
CT Warrior - I think the rivalry will have some juice next season. The Red Sox should be just as good and the young Yankees should be just as entertaining as the second half of this season. That September series when the Yankees were on a role and then headed to Boston only to be swept had me cursing at the Sox for the first time in awhile.
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A good example. And as a Packers fan, I don't consider the Bears-Packers rivalry to be the best in football.
But surely it is top 3. That's what has been said about Cubs-Cards.
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But surely it is top 3. That's what has been said about Cubs-Cards.
No argument there.
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Game time.
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Holy effin chit
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What next, Leon Durham?