MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: tower912 on February 11, 2016, 12:06:30 PM
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He has size, a decent jump shot, a tremendous ability to get to the rim, makes free throws, plays decent defense. He is playing somewhat out of position as a 1 this year. Where do you see him as a senior?
I think he challenges Jerel for the MU scoring record. If he works on his right hand and a pull up floater, a la Vander during his final season, he is going to be deadly. He needs to get stronger, and he needs to see his teammates better once he starts his drive. I think he will continue to get minutes at the 1, but I suspect he will get more time on the wing. Also, like Sandy, his release on his jumper needs to be quicker. If he masters the whole come-off-a-pick-catch-and-shoot thing as well as a pull up jumper sooner rather than later, he may not make it to his senior year. So far, he is the steal of Wojo's first recruiting class. Could not be happier with what he has done and am salivating at what he may be capable of.
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Haanif to NBA after this season
I could see it after next year or junior season. Kid can play
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Haanif to NBA after this season
I could see it after next year or junior season. Kid can play
Agreed. Think a lot of this "when he's a senior" talk is a bit wishful thinking.
Granted, that requires him to continue improving.
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Love, love, love Haanif. He's going to be a star.
As far as his release, yes, it's a little slow, but with the ability to drive, it's going to be hard for defenders to exploit that when they have to play off him.
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Agreed. Think a lot of this "when he's a senior" talk is a bit wishful thinking.
Granted, that requires him to continue improving.
Heard he's a lottery pick for 2019. Can we please just accept he's gone after his junior year.
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He has size, a decent jump shot, a tremendous ability to get to the rim, makes free throws, plays decent defense. He is playing somewhat out of position as a 1 this year. Where do you see him as a senior?
I think he challenges Jerel for the MU scoring record. If he works on his right hand and a pull up floater, a la Vander during his final season, he is going to be deadly. He needs to get stronger, and he needs to see his teammates better once he starts his drive. I think he will continue to get minutes at the 1, but I suspect he will get more time on the wing. Also, like Sandy, his release on his jumper needs to be quicker. If he masters the whole come-off-a-pick-catch-and-shoot thing as well as a pull up jumper sooner rather than later, he may not make it to his senior year. So far, he is the steal of Wojo's first recruiting class. Could not be happier with what he has done and am salivating at what he may be capable of.
Agreed that he will challenge Jerel. He has the tools. Seems coachable. Wojo will have him ready.
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I'm not sure I remember anyone as good as Haanif at finishing the under the basket, reverse layups. Seems he gets at least 6-8 points every game from that. And many of them, I think to myself that there is no way he can make it, yet he does.
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That reverse either at the end of regulation or in OT against Providence was touched by divinity.
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If he develops a consistent 3 point shot then the sky's the limit. NBA Wes comparison.
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Heard he's a lottery pick for 2019. Can we please just accept he's gone after his junior year.
Not saying it's a lock. But he isn't getting enough credit for his play imo. The guy is an absolute stud already.
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LOVE Haanif's game - the sky is the limit.
In most seasons, he would be the runaway highlight of our recruiting class.
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I'm not sure I remember anyone as good as Haanif at finishing the under the basket, reverse layups. Seems he gets at least 6-8 points every game from that. And many of them, I think to myself that there is no way he can make it, yet he does.
This is so spot on. He finishes like a seasoned veteran. Seriously amazing finishing ability
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Give him the ball with 9 seconds left and let him drive to the basket just like we did Vander Blue!
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I anticipate steady, impressive development for all four years at MU. I don't see him leaving early, as I don't see that he'll stand out enough physically or skills-wise to justify entering the draft early. Hence, I think Jerel's record could fall, and I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up with a solid, even spectacular, NBA career.
If I have to give a name to a ceiling, might I say Scottie Pippen? That sure would be something if he has the same career as Pippen.
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Reminds me of Jalen Rose.
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I'll be the wet blanket to pump the brakes a bit. Cheatham has talent, but a loose handle and no right hand. What he's doing, he's doing as the fourth option in the offense. No way to know if he can keep this up as he becomes more of the focus.
He has a long way to go before he deserves comparisons to McNeal or talk as an All American next year. A year ago, Duane was the heir apparent to the scoring title, now that's not such a sure thing. I'll wait to see how Cheatham does in a year or two before declaring him as the second coming.
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I'll be the wet blanket to pump the brakes a bit. Cheatham has talent, but a loose handle and no right hand. What he's doing, he's doing as the fourth option in the offense. No way to know if he can keep this up as he becomes more of the focus.
He has a long way to go before he deserves comparisons to McNeal or talk as an All American next year. A year ago, Duane was the heir apparent to the scoring title, now that's not such a sure thing. I'll wait to see how Cheatham does in a year or two before declaring him as the second coming.
This is all fair. To be more specific, we have seen Haanif stopped by teams that ran at his left hand when he set up to shoot and then sent shotblockers to meet him at the rim, knowing that once he put the ball on the floor he was committed. And his future growth will depend on him expanding his game. Still optimistic.
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I'll be the wet blanket to pump the brakes a bit. Cheatham has talent, but a loose handle and no right hand. What he's doing, he's doing as the fourth option in the offense. No way to know if he can keep this up as he becomes more of the focus.
He has a long way to go before he deserves comparisons to McNeal or talk as an All American next year. A year ago, Duane was the heir apparent to the scoring title, now that's not such a sure thing. I'll wait to see how Cheatham does in a year or two before declaring him as the second coming.
That's a fair counter to the trend of the thread. Then again, the question is "what is the ceiling?" as in the maximum. He has shown talent, potential and progress over the course of the season and so talking heads talk.
Fun to dream, but you remind us that reality may be different. Again, fair point.
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I'll be the wet blanket to pump the brakes a bit. Cheatham has talent, but a loose handle and no right hand. What he's doing, he's doing as the fourth option in the offense. No way to know if he can keep this up as he becomes more of the focus.
He has a long way to go before he deserves comparisons to McNeal or talk as an All American next year. A year ago, Duane was the heir apparent to the scoring title, now that's not such a sure thing. I'll wait to see how Cheatham does in a year or two before declaring him as the second coming.
Disagree, I think the sky is the limit with Haanif and I said so early. I called on twitter during the Belmont game that Haanif would be remembered more by MU faithful than Henry when it's all said and done.
He has some limits now but nothing that can't be updated or coached into him. You are right he has a tendency to over use his left and his shot is slow, but with all the scouting on this he still gets to the rim with regularity.
Barring injury or tragedy I think he's a first round draft pick at the end of his MU career
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He has a long way to go before he deserves comparisons to McNeal or talk as an All American next year. A year ago, Duane was the heir apparent to the scoring title, now that's not such a sure thing. I'll wait to see how Cheatham does in a year or two before declaring him as the second coming.
Based on our preseason expectations, yes, Duane has struggled a bit. Still, he's a lot closer to Jerel than you may think. Jerel finished his Sophomore season with 769 points. Duane currently has 683, but if he hits his season average of about 12 ppg for the last six regular season games and one game in the BET, he would have 767 points. And while you might mention that Jerel was injured at the end of his Sophomore season, he still had played 60 games. If we get only one game into the BET with the numbers above, Duane would have 62.
Like I said, awfully close.
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He certainly has "the look." Ceiling could be very high.
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Haanif looks like a Dukie to me, and I mean that in a good way. He looks like he would totally fit in playing for Coach K.
Other the Henry (of course) he appears to me to have the best chance of having an NBA career. As a Freshman he is already fearless and wants the ball in crunch time. Others have accurately pointed out some weaknesses in his present game, but I think he is also driven to improve. And, kid hates to lose. Quickly becoming my favorite player.
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Haanif is already on Draft Express top freshman list. Only 10 spots behind Sumner who Wojo said could be a lottery pick this year.
Can't wait to see what Cheatham looks like next year
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Based on our preseason expectations, yes, Duane has struggled a bit. Still, he's a lot closer to Jerel than you may think. Jerel finished his Sophomore season with 769 points. Duane currently has 683, but if he hits his season average of about 12 ppg for the last six regular season games and one game in the BET, he would have 767 points. And while you might mention that Jerel was injured at the end of his Sophomore season, he still had played 60 games. If we get only one game into the BET with the numbers above, Duane would have 62.
Like I said, awfully close.
And that's not counting a potential NIT run or a couple of extra BET games
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I'll say he finishes as Marquette's all-time leading scorer. NBA after 4 years.
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And don't get me wrong, I like Cheatham and think he has a ton of upside, but they coined the term "sophomore slump" for a reason. Right now, he's probably the fourth or fifth guy teams are preparing for. No one is thinking "you need to take Haanif away" to beat Marquette, they're thinking of taking away Henry, Luke, and Duane (and maybe Jajuan).
Next year, will he be a bigger part of the offense, or a smaller one? It's not inconceivable that Luke, Duane, JJ, and Rowsey as upperclassmen take the bulk of the shots, while the idea that we could land Howard would give us two PGs (Carter as well) that would be ahead of Haney.
My hope is that Cheatham is a kid who's ahead of the curve and grows into an even more influential player next year. The adage "freshmen want to play, sophomores want to start, juniors want to score, seniors want to win" is interesting when applied to Haanif because as a freshman, he's playing, starting and scoring. I'd love to see him in senior mindset next year with three years of ferocious, win-at-all-costs mentality. But will he get there? We'll see.
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Absolutely needs to learn how to finish with his right hand, I can't remember one instance this year where he hasn't come back to his left at the rim.
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ceiling would be wes mathews...will he ever get there? i doubt it...just because not many do. he reminds me of wes in many ways from his size, to how he uses his body, to his mature personality. i absolutely love the kid...and wojo has to love coaching him.
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haanif is really good and will probably get even better with experience, absolutely love his game, his demeanor... but let's face it, these guys are a dime a dozen, (well maybe half dozen) in the NBA. he needs and will develop something that separates himself some. he will be our leader. please please don't leave us too soon. holy schmit, i didn't realize he's listed as 6'5". ok, let's keep him thru at least junior year
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Absolutely needs to learn how to finish with his right hand, I can't remember one instance this year where he hasn't come back to his left at the rim.
I'm far less concerned about his ability to learn how to use his right hand more going forward than i am with him currently being a turnover machine. I get that he's a freshman, but he commits way to many what the hell are you doing turnovers.
Granted, the whole team is overly turnover prone, but Hannif is arguably the biggest culprit.
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Haanif is already on Draft Express top freshman list. Only 10 spots behind Sumner who Wojo said could be a lottery pick this year.
Can't wait to see what Cheatham looks like next year
That list is BS. No chance im hell there are 67 better freshman the Hannif.
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Haney is an excellent frosh,don't know what else we could hope for. He seems mature for his age
and I'm sure he knows what to work on next summer. I wish all the new guys carried themselves
like he has.
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For what it's worth...
Haanif is averaging 11.4/game (but has exceeded and even doubled that in all but 5 games since Presbyterian). He has 286 points so far on the season.
Jerel averaged 11.1 as a frosh for a total of 343.
Haanif needs 57 points to equal Jerel's freshman scoring total. He could do that as early as Creighton (road), and almost certainly will top it by the end of the BEast season, postseason notwithstanding.
If it comes down to simply pace, Haanif is on pace to eclipse Jerel's total. However, Haanif may not see the improvement that Jerel saw. Or, he may make the jump early.
In my mind, Haanif is the player Vander Blue was supposed to be as a freshman. Hopefully, Haanif does what Vander didn't and sticks around for four years. If he does, there's no way Haanif ISNT a top 5 all time scorer, if not #1.
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Granted, the whole team is overly turnover prone, but Hannif is arguably the biggest culprit.
Not saying he doesn't have room for improvement, but he's never been asked to play PG before.
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Haanif 35 - Hurricane Ditka 12
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I love Haanif. Do think he has a legit shot at the scoring title. He might break it after Duane does.
What I want to see him improve is strength and rebounding. We're likely going to be a small team next season. We need him crashing the boards the way Josh Hart does for Nova
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I said early that he would be the leading scorer by his junior year and also a possible All-American by his senior year.
But a comparison to Pippen? Not a chance. Ever. Not even in the same universe.
Jalen Rose? No way. He was a very, very good college and NBA player with a great offensive game.
Still too early to tell if HC is an NBA player. Looks like he has the athletic ability/quickness and the aptitude. If he broadens his offensive repertoire, he has an excellent chance.
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I'm far less concerned about his ability to learn how to use his right hand more going forward than i am with him currently being a turnover machine. I get that he's a freshman, but he commits way to many what the hell are you doing turnovers.
Granted, the whole team is overly turnover prone, but Hannif is arguably the biggest culprit.
Haanif is averaging 2.9 tpg.
Three kids named McNeal, James and Matthews averaged 3.8, 2.8 and 2.3 tpg as frosh.
And Haanif is playing PG for the first time ever. He will be fine.
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Give him the ball with 9 seconds left and let him drive to the basket just like we did Vander Blue!
Maybe you've forgotten but Vander finished that amazing play with his off hand. Not sure if Haanif has made a single basket with his right hand this season, let alone a basket of that magnitude.
I do think that, with work, the junior Haanif will be better than the junior Vander was.
And then I hope the junior Haanif gets better advice than the junior Vander did!
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I like his game a lot. He will grow as a player if he learns to pass the ball more. I am confident he gets stronger and gains more skills like using a right or a pull up jumper over the summer. My best guess is his upside is something close to Denzell Valentine.
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I've been trying to find a comparison for him all year, and have really struggled. Typically I can find a player (in the NBA) whose game resembles one of our players. But Haanif is a tough one to find.
Comparing left handed players is like comparing Black QB's. You always tend to limit yourself to those specific type of players. Jalen Rose was solid, but Jalen was a great distributor. And a few inches taller. Scottie Pippen was a terrible comparison in every aspect.
My comparison, is NOT meant to be in terms of talent level or ceiling. It's just simply a comparison of playing styles, or similar traits.
Manu Ginobli
- Slow release on three
- Great finisher around the rim
- 6-5, slight build
- Lefty, obviously. Never developed a right hand.
- Propensity for mind-numbing mistakes
Again - not comparing talent levels or celing. Just saying he has some Manu in his game.. Digging deep on this one, I know.
Ceiling is always tough to judge, since you can't tell what type of work ethic/heart the kid has.
Nevertheless - love the potential of this kid. He's been my favorite player to watch all season.
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I'm feeling the Manu comparison for multiple reasons
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I think Haanif is a 4 year player. He does not have elite athleticism that a Sumner has. Assuming Rowsey is good enough to start next year, I think Haanif plays the three. I think he will be our first 2000 point scorer. However, he has to have a more productive year than Wilson is having as a sophomore. 350/450/550/650=2000. Wilson had 378 as a freshmen and 303 so far this year. Haanif at 286 with at least 7 games to go.
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I've been trying to find a comparison for him all year, and have really struggled. Typically I can find a player (in the NBA) whose game resembles one of our players. But Haanif is a tough one to find.
Comparing left handed players is like comparing Black QB's. You always tend to limit yourself to those specific type of players. Jalen Rose was solid, but Jalen was a great distributor. And a few inches taller. Scottie Pippen was a terrible comparison in every aspect.
My comparison, is NOT meant to be in terms of talent level or ceiling. It's just simply a comparison of playing styles, or similar traits.
Manu Ginobli
- Slow release on three
- Great finisher around the rim
- 6-5, slight build
- Lefty, obviously. Never developed a right hand.
- Propensity for mind-numbing mistakes
Again - not comparing talent levels or celing. Just saying he has some Manu in his game.. Digging deep on this one, I know.
Ceiling is always tough to judge, since you can't tell what type of work ethic/heart the kid has.
Nevertheless - love the potential of this kid. He's been my favorite player to watch all season.
Manu works for me. Nicely done.
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John Cliff
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It's too bad Haanif will experience his ceiling at Iowa State or Liberty, where he'll be heading after he's sick of Wojo's mind games.
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It's too bad Haanif will experience his ceiling at Iowa State or Liberty, where he'll be heading after he's sick of Wojo's mind games.
Just in case you were serious, I do not think Wojo plays mind games with Haanif.
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Third team All American.
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Just in case you were serious, I do not think Wojo plays mind games with Haanif.
You aren't keeping up. MU82 is all about the sarcasm.
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You aren't keeping up. MU82 is all about the sarcasm.
I really do not pay attention to who said what, so you are right I am not keeping up.
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The best at getting to the hole as a Marquette player was Butch Lee. The guy was unstoppable. That is the platinum standard for Marquette.
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The best at getting to the hole as a Marquette player was Butch Lee. The guy was unstoppable. That is the platinum standard for Marquette.
I'd put George Thompson ahead of Butch even tho' he was a forward at 6'2"
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I really do not pay attention to who said what, so you are right I am not keeping up.
That's what she said.
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Keefe
Brute Force and Butch are the two best ever. I give the nod to George but a very narrow margin. Both had exceptional bodies and body control for going to the basket.
As for HC, I think he is going to be a really, really good college player. Way too early to know beyond that. Thing I like best about him is that he is a basketball player at the core. He is smarter on the court than most young guys.
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I like the Manu comp, but I'd reach back and (forgetting the left-handed-ness) say Sydney Moncrief. Big guard, slow shot, excellent at the rim, finds a way around, over or through guys.
Lefties have an advantage because defenders usually tend to shade to the offensive players right hand, so the left handed finish is often a surprise. Not saying he doesn't need to develop his right, but saying it's not as important for lefties with their natural advantage.
I think the ceiling is higher than anyone else here seems to think... I think the ceiling is Westbrook... but I'd be happy with Manu or even Wes type NBA performance.