MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: ChicosBailBonds on February 10, 2016, 08:43:22 PM
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Discuss...
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The future is bright. The present is inexperienced.
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We all expected to win this game, right? I sure as hell did
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The future is bright. The present is inexperienced.
+1
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Henry has improved a lot since start of season. Going to be hard to replace him.
Traci will be fun to watch at PG
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The future is bright. The present is inexperienced.
I'd say the future is moderately well-lit. Obviously, HE stays and the light brightens considerably.
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A lot of season left. Go Marquette!!!!!
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It's a shame Henry is likely gone. Could be a special team next year if he stayed.
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The future is bright. The present is inexperienced.
Maybe. If we don't replace Henry we will be middle of the pack again next year.
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Henry is really good. Future will be dimmer when he leaves. Although, Duane, Luke and Sandy had subpar nights and MU still won. Chatham good and getting better. I'm warming on Traci. He's tough minded. Opposite of Sandy right now, he wants the ball.
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Clearly we're domed as Woj doesn't read efficiency statistics correctly.
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We need a guy like BBentil, and relearn the defense on the back cuts,many times we got burned.
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Another teachable moment....how to use the clock at the end.
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Another teachable moment....how to use the clock at the end.
Yeah no need to shoot if ahead by 6 with like 24 seconds left
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8 conference wins would be a nice accomplishment.
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What was the final tally on TOs?
Seems like we were under our average tonight
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Not finishing out DePaul is all that stands between us and a tie for sixth place.
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Xavier. 2 halves vs Nova. 2 Providence games.
Depaul. Seton Hall x2.
This team is good. This team is inconsistent.
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beat providence at home....most years that hasn't mean much but this year it does....not sure if that is positive or negative for the 'state of the program'.
I hope we keep looking better each week
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Big win and will take what we can get but tried to give this game away at the end to a struggling Providence team.
Is it inexperience or lack of basketball IQ?
Haanif taking a shot at the end when you wait to get fouled. Leaving Bentil wide open on 3s when he was the only offense when Dunn fouled out.
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The optimist in me says this team's play is on the upswing and they could be poised to make a deep run in the BEast tourney.
The pessimist in me says I hope they can beat DePaul on the road.
It's just one of those years.
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What was the final tally on TOs?
Seems like we were under our average tonight
13, and what's most impressive is 7 of those were in the first half. We gave away the lead with first half turnovers, but only turned it over 6 times in the last 30 minutes.
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I can't see Henry going pro. He's a liability on defense (pointed out repeatedly by recent announcers), he's not showing the outside game as advertised, and he disappears an awful lot. Wade had 3 years in college, Butler 4, etc. Henry can be a top 5 pick, but if he waits 1 more year he'll have a lot more polish, play much more, contribute more, and have more fun. Plus he'll get another year of playing with Wally.
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I can't see Henry going pro. He's a liability on defense (pointed out repeatedly by recent announcers), he's not showing the outside game as advertised, and he disappears an awful lot. Wade had 3 years in college, Butler 4, etc. Henry can be a top 5 pick, but if he waits 1 more year he'll have a lot more polish, play much more, contribute more, and have more fun. Plus he'll get another year of playing with Wally.
You're going to be real disappointed when he's drafted in the top 8.
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As far as state of the program, no different than it was four hours ago. We're a young, transitioning team. The jury will be out on how good the team and coach is until they collectively grow up. We have some nice wins and some inexplicable losses. Both fun and frustrating to watch.
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Optimistic. We won with 3 freshmen on the court for the bulk of both overtimes. The entire team seems to be developing (yes, there are exceptions at times) and buying into Wojo.
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As far as state of the program, no different than it was four hours ago. We're a young, transitioning team. The jury will be out on how good the team and coach is until they collectively grow up. We have some nice wins and some inexplicable losses. Both fun and frustrating to watch.
This
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I can't see Henry going pro. He's a liability on defense (pointed out repeatedly by recent announcers), he's not showing the outside game as advertised, and he disappears an awful lot. Wade had 3 years in college, Butler 4, etc. Henry can be a top 5 pick, but if he waits 1 more year he'll have a lot more polish, play much more, contribute more, and have more fun. Plus he'll get another year of playing with Wally.
Let's put it this way. You get offered your dream job out of college. You could delay graduating, intern for another year and take that job after your fifth year. There would be no increase in pay and you will still lose a year in your promotion schedule (rookie scale). You are telling me you would stay back another year when basically every major recruiter is telling you will be fine if you go right away?
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I dont get why people think Henry will stay. It would be stupid to stay. We gotta come to terms with that....
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Henry goes without saying. But I think I'm most excited about Cheatham. How good is he going to be as a Senior? Whew.
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As far as state of the program, no different than it was four hours ago. We're a young, transitioning team. The jury will be out on how good the team and coach is until they collectively grow up. We have some nice wins and some inexplicable losses. Both fun and frustrating to watch.
Strongly agree.
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I can't see Henry going pro. He's a liability on defense (pointed out repeatedly by recent announcers), he's not showing the outside game as advertised, and he disappears an awful lot. Wade had 3 years in college, Butler 4, etc. Henry can be a top 5 pick, but if he waits 1 more year he'll have a lot more polish, play much more, contribute more, and have more fun. Plus he'll get another year of playing with Wally.
Does he want to play/develop in the NBA? Does he want to risk injury in college? Does he want to get paid millions? Does he want the best year-round training, coaching? Does he want to have to balance time between work/school?
Truth is, very few people know Henry's answer to any of those questions.
However it's absolutely ignorant at this point to disbelieve that Henry WILL be a lottery pick if he declares after this season.
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Remember when we lost to DePaul and weren't going to win another game this season?
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13, and what's most impressive is 7 of those were in the first half. We gave away the lead with first half turnovers, but only turned it over 6 times in the last 30 minutes.
I welcome any improvement over our season average of 15 a game, especially in a double-overtime contest.
What stood out to me was Traci. When he first came into the game, he committed 2 turnovers within 30 seconds and was pulled immediately. The rest of the game: 0. Probably 20+ minutes without a single turnover. Played a huge role in earning the win.
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I'd say the future is moderately well-lit. Obviously, HE stays and the light brightens considerably.
We will better next season, even if Henry leaves
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That Philly kid can play for me any day.
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That Philly kid can play for me any day.
Same. He's going to be real good.
Has a good handle so he's able to get around defenders and then he's always looking to dish off. Good player and he'll only get better.
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Wojo has proven to me he has a vision and a plan - if we execute it we will again reach the pinnacle
MU rahhhhhhhhh!
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Same. He's going to be real good.
Has a good handle so he's able to get around defenders and then he's always looking to dish off. Good player and he'll only get better.
Once the game slows down for him, he'll be a very solid PG here. He was awesome down the stretch after a shaky first half. Showed some real toughness.
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My two cents (I've had a few glasses of wine, long day....long long day).....I caught only the last 5 minutes of regulation and both OTs.
From what I saw, we certainly pissed away more than a few opportunities, could have been choking dogs and peed down our leg....but we didn't. But we didn't. But...we....did...not.
Not sure what Hanif was doing there, but we've seen that in other years with other teams....guys get their minds lost in the game. What made it ok for me...he knew very soon after that what he did was a huge mistake. He didn't hang his head.
All in all, progress. Nice win. Yes, we are better than last year. If Henry goes to the NBA, yes we will miss him next year. Worry about that later. Keep improving. Keep learning. Keep maturing.
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Remember when we lost to DePaul and weren't going to win another game this season?
I remember...I remember
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Not sure what Hanif was doing there, but we've seen that in other years with other teams....guys get their minds lost in the game. What made it ok for me...he knew very soon after that what he did was a huge mistake. He didn't hang his head.
Wojo addressed this in his press conference. Obviously a mental lapse. But praised Haanif and the team for their toughness, maturity and decision-making. Specifically called out Jajuan for "making really good decisions" and said he's becoming a leader. Haanif has "no fear driving to the basket...can't go wrong when he's in attack mode." Felt good "with the ball in Traci's hands."
"Our guys have shown character...we've been in tough positions with our back up against the wall and come out swinging. They don't always know what to do on the court, but they have the desire. I have to put them in better positions."
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Not good compared to MU standards. This team without Ellenson next year will not be better.
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Not good compared to MU standards. This team without Ellenson next year will not be better.
Beating a top 20 team isn't good to mu standards? Hot damn we have some high standards!
We beat a good team people. Try to act like you enjoyed it
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Wojo addressed this in his press conference. Obviously a mental lapse. But praised Haanif and the team for their toughness, maturity and decision-making. Specifically called out Jajuan for "making really good decisions" and said he's becoming a leader. Haanif has "no fear driving to the basket...can't go wrong when he's in attack mode." Felt good "with the ball in Traci's hands."
"Our guys have shown character...we've been in tough positions with our back up against the wall and come out swinging. They don't always know what to do on the court, but they have the desire. I have to put them in better positions."
Lots of cliches there, but lots of passion and positive vibes, too. I like how he held everybody accountable, including himself. I still have high hopes for our coach and our program.
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Beating a top 20 team isn't good to mu standards? Hot damn we have some high standards!
We beat a good team people. Try to act like you enjoyed it
Providence will not finish the season ranked. They may not even be ranked next week. Besides that we are a bad match up for them.
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Wojo even joked, "We felt like we had to win the game 3 times. We're going to petition the Big East to see if we can get 3 wins for 1."
He's got a pretty dry sense of humor, but he does have one. I remember in a previous post-game press conference him talking about the team being "possessed" (think it was after the Stetson game, referring to the night-and-day difference between our play the two halves).
Think he believes in his team, and they believe in him and each other. Might be the most important thing young players need as they struggle to learn what success in the Big East is all about.
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Providence will not finish the season ranked. They may not even be ranked next week. Besides that we are a bad match up for them.
If they beat us two times instead of us beating them, they'd be ranked.
Don't hold our victories against us!
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Providence will not finish the season ranked. They may not even be ranked next week. Besides that we are a bad match up for them.
Bilsu, what happened to you man? I don't remember you being this much of a downer in past seasons. We beat a team that is ranked higher above us by every ranking system out there. That is cause for celebration not grumbling.
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Hope someone else beats Nova in the big east tournament and we have a chance.
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Not good compared to MU standards. This team without Ellenson next year will not be better.
You've already made a few predictions this year that are wrong....so why should we believe this one? I'm just asking. A few weeks ago you opined we would only win one more game if I recall. We have three since that prediction.
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We cracked the top 100 RPI!!
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/Vc5x1pG5RFH3O/giphy.gif)
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You've already made a few predictions this year that are wrong....so why should we believe this one? I'm just asking. A few weeks ago you opined we would only win one more game if I recall. We have three since that prediction.
Being negative is so easy for some folks.
If they're right, they can get even more negative and say how they knew we'd suck. If they're wrong they can say, "I'm glad I was wrong!"
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Went from 110 rpi to 95! Wooo
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You've already made a few predictions this year that are wrong....so why should we believe this one? I'm just asking. A few weeks ago you opined we would only win one more game if I recall. We have three since that prediction.
You are going to get some predictions wrong. I predicted MU would win this game in a reply to someone posting the Big east might get 7 bids. My prediction was that Providence will be done after they are swept by MU and Georgetown will be done after Seton Hall sweeps them. I also predicted it will really suck when UW makes the tournament and MU does not make the NIT. UW has not lost since that prediction. After the Xavier game, I posted that Xavier fans should be worried, since they are not playing well. Xavier than lost to Creighton. My current prediction is that Providence losses their next three games. Three opportunities to be wrong on that one. I do not look at rankings, but on how the teams are playing. Butler stock is way up and Providence stock is way down. Basically, Providence is what Butler was in the first half of the conference season. I cannot predict MU vs Creighton. Creighton is a three point shooting team and that will determine the game. Creighton also has a lot of big white boys, so Mu does not have the size advantage. I will make one prediction on those games. Creighton will win, if they shoot 35% or better from three. No prediction other than that on those games.
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The future is bright. MU will end up with a better record than Indiana and Virginia Tech. Tom Crean will be working the booth with Chicos at Comic-Con. Pa Kettle will still be at Virginia Tech as no one with half a brain wants that stink bomb.
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If Henry goes pro it is very likely he gets drafted in the lottery and makes millions. However I feel it is also very likely he sits on the bench for his first 2+ seasons, gets labeled a bust, and who knows where he is in 3 years. Now if he was showing a nice 3 point game this year it would be a different story, but his 3 point attempts are all complete bricks
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Discuss...
Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
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You're going to be real disappointed when he's drafted in the top 8.
COSIGN!
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Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
Profound, as always.
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Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
Yes-ish. We've seen progress from many players. JJ, Luke, Haanif, Traci, Heldt All likely to return. Rowsey is a dead-eye shooter who is another switchable guard, albeit a small one. A competent graduate transfer PF and next year's team will be better even without Henry. Simply because everyone else will be back, a year wiser, a year stronger.
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If Henry goes pro it is very likely he gets drafted in the lottery and makes millions. However I feel it is also very likely he sits on the bench for his first 2+ seasons, gets labeled a bust, and who knows where he is in 3 years. Now if he was showing a nice 3 point game this year it would be a different story, but his 3 point attempts are all complete bricks
And they always will be bricks! Because no player in history ever improves at anything. Even if they receive the best coaching in the world as NBA players, they never, ever improve.
It's proven! It's science!
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I very much enjoyed the last two games and am happy that this team has been improving as season has moved on. First time in three years I actually look forward to the next game. That said, I had higher hopes for this team when season started and not overly optimistic for next year.
I am shocked at the critical comments made about HE. Bo Ellis was the best freshman contributor in MU history IMO and HE has blown Bo out of the water and that is saying a lot. The kid is the real deal in big time way and will be very, very tough to replace. I love a couple of the younger guys but a lot of holes to fill in moving forward.
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Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
No it won't. Even if Henry leaves this team will be better next season. The growth from the rest of the team (assuming all but Mache return) will far outweigh losing Henry. If we get a grad transfer or a Bruno Fernando or Kalif Young type, we'll be that much better.
People greatly underestimate how much players improve in the offseason, especially between their freshman and sophomore years. People also overestimate how much of our success is soley because of Henry.
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No it won't. Even if Henry leaves this team will be better next season. The growth from the rest of the team (assuming all but Mache return) will far outweigh losing Henry. If we get a grad transfer or a Bruno Fernando or Kalif Young type, we'll be that much better.
People greatly underestimate how much players improve in the offseason, especially between their freshman and sophomore years. People also overestimate how much of our success is soley because of Henry.
Kinda depends on who Henry's replacement at PF is. On our roster today the candidates are Sandy, Wally or Sacar. That team would be absolutely physically abused in the Big East. If we get a good,big body to replace Henry it's a different story.
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Kinda depends on who Henry's replacement at PF is. On our roster today the candidates are Sandy, Wally or Sacar. That team would be absolutely physically abused in the Big East. If we get a good,big body to replace Henry it's a different story.
I don't agree. I think a four guard run and gun lineup could play very well in the Big East. We won in the old Big East with much smaller teams.
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And they always will be bricks! Because no player in history ever improves at anything. Even if they receive the best coaching in the world as NBA players, they never, ever improve.
It's proven! It's science!
Someone set MU82's sarcasm meter to 11.
As the President of the Sarcasm Club ("Like we really need your opinion"), I approve.
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That Philly kid can play for me any day.
Carter drove on the last possession of the first OT and would have made a runner with the left hand were it not for a blatant hack. That's a freshman determined to win his team the game. His mentality is awesome. He's going to be good.
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You've already made a few predictions this year that are wrong....so why should we believe this one? I'm just asking. A few weeks ago you opined we would only win one more game if I recall. We have three since that prediction.
It really does not take a rocket scientist to think the void left by HE departing is a rather large one. That alone would give me pause to assume that the team will be better next year. Now, if Wojo manages to land another big then the pieces are there for a solid team. HE departing leaves rather large shoes to fill.
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I don't agree. I think a four guard run and gun lineup could play very well in the Big East. We won in the old Big East with much smaller teams.
Henry is the #1 rebounder in the conference and we're still a bad rebounding team. Who gets Henry's rebounds next year? How do we "run and gun" if we can't rebound the basketball?
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Henry is the #1 rebounder in the conference and we're still a bad rebounding team. Who gets Henry's rebounds next year? How do we "run and gun" if we can't rebound the basketball?
-- Henry has played 100+ more minutes then any other player on team
-- 100+ more shots then anyone
-- by far leader in FT attempts / makes
-- 2nd leading FT % at 75%
-- has 90 more rebounds then anyone
-- block leader
-- points leader by 100+
If we're better without Henry I will be pleasantly surprised. Will LSU be better without Simmons? To early for me to tell. I'll take a second year of HE though :)
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Henry is the #1 rebounder in the conference and we're still a bad rebounding team. Who gets Henry's rebounds next year? How do we "run and gun" if we can't rebound the basketball?
+ 1
We can be better next year if we can find a solid rebounding PF to replace Henry (assuming he leaves, which is a pretty safe assumption). If not, it will be very difficult to improve enough to be an NCAA team. His rebounding will be sorely missed.
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I'm excited for Andrew Rowsey next year. If he can be a reliable 3-point shooter, it will really help space things out on offense.
But, I agree 100%. We will need someone to replace Henry's production if/when he leaves. I have confidence that Wojo has backup plans in place (and/or at least knows which way Henry is currently leaning).
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I'm excited for Andrew Rowsey next year. If he can be a reliable 3-point shooter, it will really help space things out on offense.
But, I agree 100%. We will need someone to replace Henry's production if/when he leaves. I have confidence that Wojo has backup plans in place (and/or at least knows which way Henry is currently leaning).
I really think he is a forgotten guy right now. Coaches were really high on him and even Dawson's dad liked how he played.
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Someone set MU82's sarcasm meter to 11.
As the President of the Sarcasm Club ("Like we really need your opinion"), I approve.
I'll second that.
I love Sarcastic82 - using unrelenting sarcasm to carpet bomb ignorance and negativity across multiple threads is impressive. 82 I hope you have the ability to keep it up and it isn't just an alcohol fueled/short lived shtick.
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How anyone can believe the team can be better without HE is insanity. His numbers are off the charts and against great competition. He made Luke better and without HE I think Luke struggles again next season. I want to enjoy watching Henry the next few weeks and really afraid to think about next season.
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I'll take a second year of HE though :)
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Thank you,sir. May I have another?
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I will just point out that Rowsey was just a tad better 3 point shooter last year (38.2%) than Duane is this year (35.6%). And is is a worse overall shooter than Duane. (39.4% v. 43.0%) Rowsey was much more of a volume shooter than Duane was though.
I guess my point is that we shouldn't necessarily expect more from him than we do from guys we already have on the team. And remember Duane is a guy who some have labelled a disappointment. (I am not one of those guys.)
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Sarcasm? Moi?
I am totally in agreement with the knowledgeable Scoopers who think Wojo should already have been fired and who know for a fact that players never improve.
Oh, and that we won't win another game after the DePaul loss.
Such knowledge is hard to find on the interwebs, so we're blessed here on Scoop.
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How anyone can believe the team can be better without HE is insanity. His numbers are off the charts and against great competition. He made Luke better and without HE I think Luke struggles again next season. I want to enjoy watching Henry the next few weeks and really afraid to think about next season.
Disagree completely. While we'd certainly be better next year with Henry than without, we have 7 players that will be sophomores or juniors. That's a ton of room for improvement from other players. Henry is a big loss, but we can improve in numerous other ways to offset that loss.
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Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
Doubt it.
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How anyone can believe the team can be better without HE is insanity. His numbers are off the charts and against great competition. He made Luke better and without HE I think Luke struggles again next season. I want to enjoy watching Henry the next few weeks and really afraid to think about next season.
How did a team that lost Jimmy Butler get better? How did a team that lost DJO and Jae Crowder basically stay the same?
Guys improve. Guys get older. It's pretty common throughout the country.
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That DePaul loss is killing me right now. Would love to be going into Saturday's game at 6-6 instead of 5-7.
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How did a team that lost Jimmy Butler get better? How did a team that lost DJO and Jae Crowder basically stay the same?
DJO was the leading scorer JFB final season & he returned with a cast of others, fwiw.
When Jae & DJO left; buzz played 5 players over 25 minutes who were all JR/SR (Jamil, Lockett, Vander, Junior, Gardner)
Henry is clear & away the leader in statistics. & return a ton of young kids
I think Mu will continue to make strides and be competitive as hell. Who knows if they will be better without HE around. Too early to tell
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I very much enjoyed the last two games and am happy that this team has been improving as season has moved on. First time in three years I actually look forward to the next game. That said, I had higher hopes for this team when season started and not overly optimistic for next year.
I am shocked at the critical comments made about HE. Bo Ellis was the best freshman contributor in MU history IMO and HE has blown Bo out of the water and that is saying a lot. The kid is the real deal in big time way and will be very, very tough to replace. I love a couple of the younger guys but a lot of holes to fill in moving forward.
Seriously, I like Henry a lot, but to compare him to Bo in any way is pure Blasphemy. I worship at the alter of Bo Ellis.
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One player does not make a team.
Rowsey, Hauser, and improvement from Duane, Fischer, Sandy, Haanie, Traci, JJJ, Wally, Sacar, and Heldt > Henry's production this season.
Honestly, to think otherwise seems absurd to me. Henry is not a basketball God. He is a great player but is replaceable. Even if we take a hit on rebounding, our defense, shooting, turnovers, depth, strength, and experience will all increase. And more than make up for the hit on rebounding.
Keep in mind, players improve at rebounding too. All our returning players' improvement on the boards will help offset the potential loss of Henry.
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Team will take giant step back when Henry leaves
To put a face on what you say. We are 16-9 now. With this giant step back, what record do we have at this time next year?
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One player does not make a team.
Tell that to the 2003-2004 team who lost Dwade and returned Diener, Novak.
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Kinda depends on who Henry's replacement at PF is. On our roster today the candidates are Sandy, Wally or Sacar. That team would be absolutely physically abused in the Big East. If we get a good,big body to replace Henry it's a different story.
I don't think that's Lost on Wojo.
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I seriously question if I know one thing about basketball when I read some of these posts. HE has been SOG 7 times and the other nine times he could have been or should have been. The "Engine" got one because everyone was excited he played a decent game. Replacing a double double machine is awfully hard to do. His presence has made everyone better and I think the void of his leaving is going to be very hard to overcome.
I actually think some people downplay HE skill set because they know he is one and done. I have family members that watched the Butler game and said he played OK and know idea what his numbers were in the game.
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Tell that to the 2003-2004 team who lost Dwade and returned Diener, Novak.
1. D wade is greater than Henry. Not even close.
2. That team also lost Robert Jackson who as a senior was better than Henry though close
Comparing apples and oranges my friend
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Tell that to the 2003-2004 team who lost Dwade and returned Diener, Novak.
But that team had Crean coaching it. His value add was always 3-4 losses a year. (sorry, chicos, you earned this one last night)
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I seriously question if I know one thing about basketball when I read some of these posts. HE has been SOG 7 times and the other nine times he could have been or should have been. The "Engine" got one because everyone was excited he played a decent game. Replacing a double double machine is awfully hard to do. His presence has made everyone better and I think the void of his leaving is going to be very hard to overcome.
I actually think some people downplay HE skill set because they know he is one and done. I have family members that watched the Butler game and said he played OK and know idea what his numbers were in the game.
I agree that Henry gets unfairly downplayed. I am one of those people who call out others for downplaying Henry. Henry will be very hard to replace. It's a lot easier to replace him when he's the only one leaving.
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TAMU
You know the game well but think you are missing one point on HE. He flat out makes it easier for everyone on the court. He has made Luke better, opened lanes for HC and everyone else. Aside from HE, IMO only HC, DW, JJJ and Luke are mid to upper level D 1 players. This is not a stacked team with HE and might struggle big time without him.
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How anyone can believe the team can be better without HE is insanity. His numbers are off the charts and against great competition. He made Luke better and without HE I think Luke struggles again next season. I want to enjoy watching Henry the next few weeks and really afraid to think about next season.
Depends. We all know examples of star players leaving teams and the team does just fine if not better. We also have seen where the team craters. So I wouldn't call it insanity.
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It really does not take a rocket scientist to think the void left by HE departing is a rather large one. That alone would give me pause to assume that the team will be better next year. Now, if Wojo manages to land another big then the pieces are there for a solid team. HE departing leaves rather large shoes to fill.
No question it does (big shoes to fill), but I want to see if he leaves (very likely), and how the team responds, how the new guys play, so on and so forth. I expect other guys to make strides. I just don't accept it as a done deal that we are going backwards. Too many examples out there that blow that up, of course many times it goes as you state.
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Tell that to the 2003-2004 team who lost Dwade and returned Diener, Novak.
That team lost Robert Jackson and others as well, not just Wade.
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But that team had Crean coaching it. His value add was always 3-4 losses a year. (sorry, chicos, you earned this one last night)
Defending your boy
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TAMU
You know the game well but think you are missing one point on HE. He flat out makes it easier for everyone on the court. He has made Luke better, opened lanes for HC and everyone else. Aside from HE, IMO only HC, DW, JJJ and Luke are mid to upper level D 1 players. This is not a stacked team with HE and might struggle big time without him.
I think you are vastly underestimating the rest of the team. They are inconsistent but all of them have shown that they can not only contribute but be very good at this level. What they lack is consistency and experience.
Haanif would be a front-runner for be roy if it weren't for Henry. Duane is maddeningly inconsistent but is fearless and has shown the ability to take over a game. JJJ is finally showing us why he was so highly rated. Luke is the best true center in the BEast.
I noticed you left off Sandy and Traci. Sandy has struggled in BEast party but he has shown his athleticism and shooting touch. If he puts it together, he will be very dangerous. I know you don't like Traci but he is going to be our best PG since Diener by the time all is said and done. He can do things with the ball that we haven't seen a of do in years. Hes inconsistent but ifs going to be very good.
Heldt, Anim, and Wally havent shown as much but each have the making of at least being a solid contributor off the bench in the future. Heldt looks just like those project bigs that Bo was always getting and developing into stars.
Henry is very very good. Best player on the team. You are right, he makes everyone else better. But he is replaceable. His absence is not greater than the growth we will see from the rest of team and the addition of Rowsey and Hauser. We'd be much much better with him but we will still be good without him.
I get the argument that we will be so bad at rebounding that it will negate our growth in other areas. I don't agree with it, I think we will compensate. But I don't understand the argument that one player outweighs the value that every other player will bring.
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How anyone can believe the team can be better without HE is insanity. His numbers are off the charts and against great competition. He made Luke better and without HE I think Luke struggles again next season. I want to enjoy watching Henry the next few weeks and really afraid to think about next season.
I agree with you. We will have to have some guys improve dramatically (sandy Cohen for example) for this team to be better.
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Interesting question about the state of the program. I'd argue this:
1) We're in transition. The transition started with Buzz's last year, when he basically mailed it in and when Vander elected to bolt for the D-Leagues. We're still deep in it, though there is beginning to appear light at the end of the tunnel.
2) Wojo is an incredible recruiter. I've been impressed. Now, can he coach? There are times when I feel like he really is Coach K Jr., and there are times when I wonder whether he is Mike Deane II. Fortunately, we have seen more of the Coach K legacy as of late. Games like Providence tell me he's getting there. Games like Xavier tell me that if he had sophomores or juniors instead of freshmen, we'd be Top 20!
3) The effect of Henry is an interesting debate. We all know he is good. In fact, he's better when he's part of a team effort and not trying to do it all himself or prove he belongs in the NBA. Even Michael Jordan was better and did more when he got the most from his teammates!
4) If Henry leaves, it may not be Hiroshima. In some ways, there is a tendency to "Let Henry do It" on this team. When it doubt, find Henry and let him go at it. When Henry leaves, whether it be in 2016 or 2017, or 2018 for that matter (I can hope!), the question will be "who will step up?"
5) The closest parallel I can imagine to where we are with Henry was the Jim Chones situation in 1972. Chones was an All-American and probably the second best center in the nation (to Bill Walton). Our team was explosive with Chones and lost without him. We made the NCAA but lost in the second round to the Bigot at the University of Kentucky. The interlude was only about two years as the recruitment of Maurice Lucas and Bo Ellis got Marquette into the National Championship in 1974 (and, yes, we made the tournament in 1973, losing to Bobby Knight's first team at Indiana in Nashville). What we don't know if that if Henry leaves, what's the short-term and intermediate-term card Coach Wojo has up his sleeve. He's a bright guy and I'm sure he has something cooking.
All in all, the state of our program is improving. With a little luck and a little more Henry, we'll be where we think we ought to be. With a lot more Henry, we might be VERY, VERY good! Yeah, I know, I can hope.
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Interesting question about the state of the program. I'd argue this:
1) We're in transition. The transition started with Buzz's last year, when he basically mailed it in and when Vander elected to bolt for the D-Leagues. We're still deep in it, though there is beginning to appear light at the end of the tunnel.
2) Wojo is an incredible recruiter. I've been impressed. Now, can he coach? There are times when I feel like he really is Coach K Jr., and there are times when I wonder whether he is Mike Deane II. Fortunately, we have seen more of the Coach K legacy as of late. Games like Providence tell me he's getting there. Games like Xavier tell me that if he had sophomores or juniors instead of freshmen, we'd be Top 20!
You can say a lot about Mike Deane - kind of a lazy recruiter, set a low bar for MU, etc. but that guy was a damn good game coach. Crazy, but damn good. If Wojo can approach Mike's ability on the bench I will be very happy.
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You can say a lot about Mike Deane - kind of a lazy recruiter, set a low bar for MU, etc. but that guy was a damn good game coach. Crazy, but damn good. If Wojo can approach Mike's ability on the bench I will be very happy.
In the short term that may be a tall order. I think if Wojo can make the progression that O'Neill did as a first-time coach that would be very good. KO by 1995 had turned into pretty decent game/strategy coach.
Deane was a seasoned wily, veteran coach. Would love to have someone like him as an assistant for Wojo.
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Someone set MU82's sarcasm meter to 11. As the President of the Sarcasm Club ("Like we really need your opinion"), I approve.
He's on a roll. Enjoyed every single one.
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No question it does (big shoes to fill), but I want to see if he leaves (very likely), and how the team responds, how the new guys play, so on and so forth.
Uh-oh, Chicos ... you were solidly in the "he'll play a second season camp" for months and months and months. Not sure when you changed to the "very likely gone" camp.
My gut was that he would stay a second season as long as Wally also returns. I don't feel as strongly about that now, either, because he has played so well. But hell ... I'll stick with it.
Henry's coming back!
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Uh-oh, Chicos ... you were solidly in the "he'll play a second season camp" for months and months and months. Not sure when you changed to the "very likely gone" camp.
My gut was that he would stay a second season as long as Wally also returns. I don't feel as strongly about that now, either, because he has played so well. But hell ... I'll stick with it.
Henry's coming back!
Did I say that, or did I say he SHOULD come back? I think another year would do wonders for him, like Smart, etc. His outside shot is brutal, but you can't teach size. He's savvy, good ball handler, nice mid-J, not much on the hops.
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Did I say that, or did I say he SHOULD come back? I think another year would do wonders for him, like Smart, etc. His outside shot is brutal, but you can't teach size. He's savvy, good ball handler, nice mid-J, not much on the hops.
As I've said in similar situations over the years, I am far too lazy to look up what you said. I know lots of you get off on doing that, but I don't.
All I'll say is that I think I remember because you and I actually were in agreement on the subject. We both "just had a feeling" that Hankster would be here two years, if I recall correctly.
But I've been wrong before (I think it happened in 1997) and I'm guessing I'll be wrong again once before I die.
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Seriously, I like Henry a lot, but to compare him to Bo in any way is pure Blasphemy. I worship at the alter of Bo Ellis.
The people who did not see Bo play have no idea how good he was. Ellenson will tie Ellis for the fresmen leading rebounder the next game if he can pull down 12 rebounds. Ellenson will certainly pass him in the next two games. The big differnce is that Maurice Lucas was the center and a very strong rebounder at 10.6 rebounds a game. Ellis was a very good defensive player and very quick for a 6'9" player. He anchored the back end of the press. There was no way you were going to try to throw a long pass to beat the press with Ellis playing back. Ellis made 53.5% of his shots as a freshmen.
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As I've said in similar situations over the years, I am far too lazy to look up what you said. I know lots of you get off on doing that, but I don't.
All I'll say is that I think I remember because you and I actually were in agreement on the subject. We both "just had a feeling" that Hankster would be here two years, if I recall correctly.
But I've been wrong before (I think it happened in 1997) and I'm guessing I'll be wrong again once before I die.
Sorry, I wasn't saying it to be combative. I really don't remember...it was truly a question on my part. I'm exhausted, been a long week. Going to bed in a few minutes and the sun just set. Peace
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Uh-oh, Chicos ... you were solidly in the "he'll play a second season camp" for months and months and months. Not sure when you changed to the "very likely gone" camp.
My gut was that he would stay a second season as long as Wally also returns. I don't feel as strongly about that now, either, because he has played so well. But hell ... I'll stick with it.
Henry's coming back!
Crap/careful what you ask for! now i can't tell if it's sarcasm
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I would expect Carter and Haanif to be much more consistant next year and make less mistakes. JJJ took a good step up this year, so while he will be better I would not expect it to be a big step up. We have Duane, Carter, JJJ, Haanif, Cohen returning at the 1 through 3 spots. So it is hard to predict how much Rowsey and Hauser will impact those positions. Hauser may end up starting at the 4. We only have two bigmen and Fischer will have to learn not to get the types of fouls he gets now. While I am sure Wojo knows we need a four, that does not mean he will be successful in recruiting one. However, I have a feeling that if Ellenson goes Bailey will not go on a Mormon mission (maybe that is just wishful thinking). Other teams will also have big losses and I suspect the Big East as a whole will not be as good next year.
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Bo Ellis Fans
Did not mean to disrespect Bo. Bo was the SMARTEST freshmen ever, most poised and overall package MU has ever seen in a freshman. That said, HE is playing in a different era and with a watered down supporting cast. Bo had the luxury of a great coach and experienced, great guys around him. IMO what HE is doing this year is extremely incredible and I have a great deal of appreciation for what he has done this season.
In looking back at Bo the thing I loved best was how smart he was. He seldom made a stupid play, played excellent D, great mid range shooter and used the glass and great rebounder. With all of those strengths I am not sure BO would be getting the numbers HE gets with this team around him.
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Bo Ellis Fans
Bo had the luxury of a great coach and experienced, great guys around him. IMO what HE is doing this year is extremely incredible and I have a great deal of appreciation for what he has done this season.
Henry is no Bo. Bo was an outstanding basketball player. And he did have the advantage of a very talented, experienced team that made the NCAA National Championship game his freshman year. One can only imagine how good Henry would look playing alongside Maurice Lucas!
Bo was no Henry. he was smart and tough as nails, but Henry is far more solidly built for a freshman. He actually looks more like Maurice Lucas. Bo's biggest downside was he was soooo thin! That said, one of my favorite Warriors of all time and a very class act today!
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Crap/careful what you ask for! now i can't tell if it's sarcasm
Yes, the unrelenting negativity of some Scoopers -- even when something positive happens -- does gets the uber-sarcasm in me going.
So when I settle down a little, it's sometimes hard to switch back to "normal mode."
As for Henry ... it's obvious why NBA scouts and GMs are high on him. I'm coming to grips with the lure of The Association simply being too much for him to resist, even if he's loving his time at MU with Wally.
That being said, I still have yet to see anybody here who really "knows" anything regarding Henry. We're all just speculating about what he's thinking. In recent years, even better players than Henry have decided to stay in college for a second season.
Blah blah blah. I'm even getting tired of seeing me write versions of that last paragraph.
Go Warriors!
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dgies9156
Agreed completely on Bo. I recently had my two young nephews, who lost their Dad a year ago, at a game and they were given the red carpet treatment by the athletic department. The boys had a chance to meet all the current players and a number of former greats and Bo was fantastic with the boys. While the little guys do not know of Bo's greatness as a player, they were able to see the goodness of the man.
For the record, Bo is not my all time favorite Warrior, but he is definitely high on my list. He was cool from day one and a big time winner. I still remember Johnny Owens giving his career winning % on Sr. night. Numbers that will never be seen again.
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No question it does (big shoes to fill), but I want to see if he leaves (very likely)
Previously you've opined Henry is staying. Now it's "very likely" he's leaving. And when he stays or goes you'll be the first to remind everyone how right you were. Unreal.
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8th place in a 10 team league, so not so hot. Hopefully getting better though. Love to see us in the tourney again soon.
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Bo vs Henry. They are definitely different types of players. There are a lot of differences between Bo's time and now. Bo's weigh(by memory) was around 190 as a freshmen. The big difference is that was before teams were into weight lifting. Most coaches believe that adding muscle decreased mobility back then. Even Lucas who was considered a power player weight a lot less than Ellenson. There was no shot clock. While MU was not the type of team that stalled there was no reason to take a hurried up shot, because the shot clock was expiring. There also was no three point line. Three point line and shot clock have added to Henry's scoring average.
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Too many pages of dribble again. It's really quite simple. Wojo will need to sign a credible replacement for HE. Won't have to be great right out of the box but will need to be a legitimate 25 minute starter. Accomplish that and we'll be better. Fail to accomplish that and unless he cooks up a helluva 4-1, we'll regress.
Wojo will get it done. At this time last year we had exactly zero point guards for '15-'16.
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dgies9156
Agreed completely on Bo. I recently had my two young nephews, who lost their Dad a year ago, at a game and they were given the red carpet treatment by the athletic department. The boys had a chance to meet all the current players and a number of former greats and Bo was fantastic with the boys. While the little guys do not know of Bo's greatness as a player, they were able to see the goodness of the man.
For the record, Bo is not my all time favorite Warrior, but he is definitely high on my list. He was cool from day one and a big time winner. I still remember Johnny Owens giving his career winning % on Sr. night. Numbers that will never be seen again.
I was able to work with Bo for 4 years in the athletic department. Gem of a person. His daughter, who has since passed, also worked in the department with us.
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I think you are vastly underestimating the rest of the team. They are inconsistent but all of them have shown that they can not only contribute but be very good at this level. What they lack is consistency and experience.
Haanif would be a front-runner for be roy if it weren't for Henry. Duane is maddeningly inconsistent but is fearless and has shown the ability to take over a game. JJJ is finally showing us why he was so highly rated. Luke is the best true center in the BEast.
I noticed you left off Sandy and Traci. Sandy has struggled in BEast party but he has shown his athleticism and shooting touch. If he puts it together, he will be very dangerous. I know you don't like Traci but he is going to be our best PG since Diener by the time all is said and done. He can do things with the ball that we haven't seen a of do in years. Hes inconsistent but ifs going to be very good.
Heldt, Anim, and Wally havent shown as much but each have the making of at least being a solid contributor off the bench in the future. Heldt looks just like those project bigs that Bo was always getting and developing into stars.
Henry is very very good. Best player on the team. You are right, he makes everyone else better. But he is replaceable. His absence is not greater than the growth we will see from the rest of team and the addition of Rowsey and Hauser. We'd be much much better with him but we will still be good without him.
I get the argument that we will be so bad at rebounding that it will negate our growth in other areas. I don't agree with it, I think we will compensate. But I don't understand the argument that one player outweighs the value that every other player will bring.
I agree with this analysis .
Also Wojo and staff will have one more year of experience under their belts and that will help our cause as well .
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Too many pages of dribble again. It's really quite simple. Wojo will need to sign a credible replacement for HE. Won't have to be great right out of the box but will need to be a legitimate 25 minute starter. Accomplish that and we'll be better. Fail to accomplish that and unless he cooks up a helluva 4-1, we'll regress.
Wojo will get it done. At this time last year we had exactly zero point guards for '15-'16.
Wojo is a great recruiter and motivator so I have no doubts he will get players who can step in if HE leaves.
The lure of the NBA might be too much for HE but he could very easily come back for his soph year. I think Wojo can talk HE into coming back for a year. One more year with Wally. A chance to be Big East player of the year, NCAA All-American and make the NCAA tourney with a chance to make a deep run. No inside information but I do feel confident that HE will stay an extra year. I wish I could say the same about Wojo's coaching ability.
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Wojo is a great recruiter and motivator so I have no doubts he will get players who can step in if HE leaves.
The lure of the NBA might be too much for HE but he could very easily come back for his soph year. I think Wojo can talk HE into coming back for a year. One more year with Wally. A chance to be Big East player of the year, NCAA All-American and make the NCAA tourney with a chance to make a deep run. No inside information but I do feel confident that HE will stay an extra year. I wish I could say the same about Wojo's coaching ability.
If Henry looks like a sure-fire top-10 pick, I hope he doesn't. Part of a coach's job is to prepare these young men for their future. Yes, education is great and all, but if Henry's best career option is to go to the NBA, I sincerely hope Wojo doesn't try to hold him back from that. Not taking anything away from all of those lures, but if NCAA glory, playing with his brother, and collegiate accolades are what Henry wants, that should be his decision and his family's. If he looks like a lottery player, Wojo should push him in that direction. All it takes is one bad step to lose that dream forever.
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Wojo's dealt with one-and-done types many times. He knows how to handle it, and I think brew is right. He won't try to "re-recruit" Henry back for a second year.
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As of today, 2-13, ESPN saying HE is #4..
"While his 3-point shot continues to be a bit erratic, there's little question he has the tools to be a lethal stretch-4 with time. It may become a very tough choice for scouts between Ellenson and Bender."
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If Henry looks like a sure-fire top-10 pick, I hope he doesn't. Part of a coach's job is to prepare these young men for their future. Yes, education is great and all, but if Henry's best career option is to go to the NBA, I sincerely hope Wojo doesn't try to hold him back from that. Not taking anything away from all of those lures, but if NCAA glory, playing with his brother, and collegiate accolades are what Henry wants, that should be his decision and his family's. If he looks like a lottery player, Wojo should push him in that direction. All it takes is one bad step to lose that dream forever.
Henry is a sure fire top 10 pick that is really not ready for the NBA. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and will make the appropriate choice for him but he has a long way to go before he is a productive NBA player.
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Henry is a sure fire top 10 pick that is really not ready for the NBA. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and will make the appropriate choice for him but he has a long way to go before he is a productive NBA player.
I don't think he has as much of a way to go as you think.
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I don't think he has as much of a way to go as you think.
He's stuck on a court, as a freshman, with 4 nobodies in the one of the top conferences in America and averaging a double double. Imagine when he gets competent teammates next year. Nearly every NBA player can knock down a 17 foot jumper if left alone. Henry's not getting doubled every time down the court next season.
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He's stuck on a court, as a freshman, with 4 nobodies in the one of the top conferences in America and averaging a double double. Imagine when he gets competent teammates next year. Nearly every NBA player can knock down a 17 foot jumper if left alone. Henry's not getting doubled every time down the court next season.
And he's really highly skilled offensively for a guy his size. His range is going to increase as well. He will have to be hidden defensively to start, but the guy is going to contribute because of his offense.
When you look at one and dones, they almost always have holes in their games. NBA coaches know how to hide those and fix them over time.
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He is a top five pick next year. In addition, he is more ready than most one and done guys. His upside in NBA is off the charts.
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He is a top five pick next year. In addition, he is more ready than most one and done guys. His upside in NBA is off the charts.
I agree with all this except his upside being off the charts. I think Henry is a safe pick and will have a long, successful career, but to me, off the charts is reserved for perennial all-star, MVP candidates. The generational talent types. He's good, but not that good.
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Brew
Agreed. By off the charts I am talking about making $250m + in his career. He is going to very big checks for a decade and half or longer. Wish my upside was similar to his.
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I would agree that's definitely possible. My mindset in that regard is Dwyane Wade, and as good as Henry is, he's no Dwyane Wade.
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State of Duane Wilson.... Another missed layup. Jesus Christ
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He is a top five pick next year. In addition, he is more ready than most one and done guys. His upside in NBA is off the charts.
Seriously you make him sound like the second coming of Bob Pettit.
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Seriously you make him sound like the second coming of Bob Pettit.
Bob Pettit? Jesus can you find a better reference than a guy who last played an NBA game more than 50 years ago???
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Marquette Fan in NY
You probably are in the Carter being a future stud camp. I actually laugh my ass off reading praise for lower to mid level guys and the highest likely draft pick in MU history gets ripped.
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2 more wins and we have a winning season!
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2 more wins and we have a winning season!
1 more. 16-10. Max 6 more losses. 16-16 is the worst we could finish.
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1 more. 16-10. Max 6 more losses. 16-16 is the worst we could finish.
Unless we accept a CBI bid at 16-16.
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Unless we accept a CBI bid at 16-16.
Which won't happen. Marquette does NOT accept CBI bids. I am proud of them for that at least.
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Unless we accept a CBI bid at 16-16.
Marquette does NOT accept CBI bids. At least I'm proud of them for that. Also, anyone happy with the NIT this year is a loser.
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Marquette Fan in NY
You probably are in the Carter being a future stud camp. I actually laugh my ass off reading praise for lower to mid level guys and the highest likely draft pick in MU history gets ripped.
I am in the Carter is going to be ok camp.
I think Henry is a very good college player, and eventually will find his way into the NBA. I agree that NBA drafts on promise and at some point he will be a high draft choice, once Henry gets into the NBA he will have to produce though. Too many holes in his game for him to be dominant at the next level. Henry is not close to the player Ty Hansbrough was in college and we saw how well Hansbrough has done at the next level. Guys like Adreian Payne were first round picks played a few games in the league and then go to the D League.
This is not meant to rip Henry, rather just being realistic.
I would be ecstatic if his NBA career was a good as Don Kojis.
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Marquette does NOT accept CBI bids. At least I'm proud of them for that. Also, anyone happy with the NIT this year is a loser.
A loser? Come on. Those of you who thought this was a NCAA team with this youth and these point guards...LOL.
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He is a top five pick next year. In addition, he is more ready than most one and done guys. His upside in NBA is off the charts.
I will take this bet in a heartbeat. He is not a top 5 pick. If he is, wow is the NBA draft weak.
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Marquette does NOT accept CBI bids. At least I'm proud of them for that. Also, anyone happy with the NIT this year is a loser.
Very few people outside of the MU program will know if they won the CBI or lost the first game of the CBI. You go to the CBI to get your players experience in a tournament. MU's excuse this year is a lack of experience and to turn done a bid that gives them more experience would just be plain stupid.
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Henry is a sure fire top 10 pick that is really not ready for the NBA. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and will make the appropriate choice for him but he has a long way to go before he is a productive NBA player.
I went and looked at NBA rookie stats. Through the all-star break there are only 6 rookies averaging double figures in scoring. There are another 17 rookies averaging between 5 and 10 points. The idea that Ellenson is not ready does not matter, because most rookies do not contribute much their first year.
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1 more. 16-10. Max 6 more losses. 16-16 is the worst we could finish.
No because we could lose in the CBI tournament. So it is two wins to clinch a winning season.
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I am in the Carter is going to be ok camp.
I think Henry is a very good college player, and eventually will find his way into the NBA. I agree that NBA drafts on promise and at some point he will be a high draft choice, once Henry gets into the NBA he will have to produce though. Too many holes in his game for him to be dominant at the next level. Henry is not close to the player Ty Hansbrough was in college and we saw how well Hansbrough has done at the next level. Guys like Adreian Payne were first round picks played a few games in the league and then go to the D League.
This is not meant to rip Henry, rather just being realistic.
I would be ecstatic if his NBA career was a good as Don Kojis.
You do realize that MU has never had a CBI bid to accept.
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On a game by game basis, there are ups and downs. But overall things are disappointing. We have a McDonald's AA and we're a bubble NIT team. It's a bummer.
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Marquette does NOT accept CBI bids. At least I'm proud of them for that. Also, anyone happy with the NIT this year is a loser.
Then paint me a loser. Or maybe paint me a realist. Because unless we win four games at MSG, we are not going to the NCAAs. That's not chicken little, woe-is-me, reactionary talk, that's cold, hard, reality. Sorry, I just don't see 24-11 (9-9) with a 64 RPI and 72 SOS being enough, and that's what we're looking at if we win out and beat DePaul, Villanova, and Seton Hall before losing to Xavier.
But at the end of the day, I still love Marquette basketball. I want to see more Marquette basketball. I would rather go to the NIT, or Las Vegas Invitational, or CBI, or the freaking Derek Zoolander Tournament for Teams Who Don't Play Real Good Enough And Other Stuff Tournament if it extends the season because I enjoy cheering for this team and enjoy watching my guys play. I'd rather watch us in a lesser tournament and have something to cheer for than have the season end. Anything that lessens the time between the official end of the Marquette season and November 11th is a good thing.
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Then paint me a loser. Or maybe paint me a realist. Because unless we win four games at MSG, we are not going to the NCAAs. That's not chicken little, woe-is-me, reactionary talk, that's cold, hard, reality. Sorry, I just don't see 24-11 (9-9) with a 64 RPI and 72 SOS being enough, and that's what we're looking at if we win out and beat DePaul, Villanova, and Seton Hall before losing to Xavier.
But at the end of the day, I still love Marquette basketball. I want to see more Marquette basketball. I would rather go to the NIT, or Las Vegas Invitational, or CBI, or the freaking Derek Zoolander Tournament for Teams Who Don't Play Real Good Enough And Other Stuff Tournament if it extends the season because I enjoy cheering for this team and enjoy watching my guys play. I'd rather watch us in a lesser tournament and have something to cheer for than have the season end. Anything that lessens the time between the official end of the Marquette season and November 11th is a good thing.
Amen brother. That, and postseason experience is never a bad thing. We saved money on our buy games this year, why not spend it on the CBI?
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I would rather go to the NIT, or Las Vegas Invitational, or CBI, or the freaking Derek Zoolander Tournament for Teams Who Don't Play Real Good Enough And Other Stuff Tournament
Say no more. I'm in
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Amen brother. That, and postseason experience is never a bad thing. We saved money on our buy games this year, why not spend it on the CBI?
The trip to Italy was supposed to strengthen the team and help us come out of the gate strong. Playing a couple of mediocre teams in a meaningless tournament is supposed to help us be better next year.
Signing Markus Howard would make us better next year. Hiring an experienced, competent bench coach to help Wojo manage games would make us better next year. This other stuff? Meh.
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The trip to Italy was supposed to strengthen the team and help us come out of the gate strong. Playing a couple of mediocre teams in a meaningless tournament is supposed to help us be better next year.
Signing Markus Howard would make us better next year. Hiring an experienced, competent bench coach to help Wojo manage games would make us better next year. This other stuff? Meh.
Frankly, I don't care if it helps next year. But a longer season is always a win in my book.
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The trip to Italy was supposed to strengthen the team and help us come out of the gate strong. Playing a couple of mediocre teams in a meaningless tournament is supposed to help us be better next year.
Signing Markus Howard would make us better next year. Hiring an experienced, competent bench coach to help Wojo manage games would make us better next year. This other stuff? Meh.
I think the Italy trip did help us come out of the gate strong. I think we would have been worse without it. We just aren't very good.
Playing in the CBI might help us or it might not. But I think there is very little chance it hurts us. Why not play a few more games?
Plus, what Brew said.
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Frankly, I don't care if it helps next year. But a longer season is always a win in my book.
I don't know about "always". This year, I would like to see the lads play a few more games. Two years ago, I was happy to see the season end.
So I guess that is progress :)
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I don't know about "always". This year, I would like to see the lads play a few more games. Two years ago, I was happy to see the season end.
So I guess that is progress :)
17-15 team may not of won a game in any tournament, but I wanted to keep our streak of 20 game win seasons going. That team certainly had the talent to win three more games in one of the unknown tournaments. UNC a few years ago was 16-16 when they accepted an NIT bid and ended up winning 20 games. To me there is value in saying you won 20 games several years in a row or gone to at least some tournament several years in a row. You always want to go to NCAA, but it is hard to go there year after year. Maybe a CBI bid ends up with another frustrating loss or maybe it is the start of a new 20 game win season streak. I would never turn down a bid to any tournament.
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I don't know about "always". This year, I would like to see the lads play a few more games. Two years ago, I was happy to see the season end.
Yessir.
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I don't know about "always". This year, I would like to see the lads play a few more games. Two years ago, I was happy to see the season end.
So I guess that is progress :)
I'd stick with always. I would have loved a few more games of Gardner and Jamil. I would've even watched the CBI for more Carlino, Derrick, and Juan. If people want to tune out for a lesser tournament, that's their prerogative, but college careers are short enough as is. I'll always take a few game extension and more Marquette basketball. Always.