MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MattVelazquezSays on May 28, 2015, 05:00:06 PM
-
Marquette's Haanif Cheatham won't wear No. 24
A day after the incoming Marquette freshman tweeted a photo of the No. 24 on his locker and the story took off, Marquette released a three-paragraph statement with the headline that Haanif Cheatham will wear No. 25.
Source: Marquette's Haanif Cheatham won't wear No. 24 (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/305385661.html)
-
Still amazed at the PR issues that MU bball brings upon itself. Just think, this entire episode could have been completely avoided. Completely. But then there wouldn't be a controversy. Nice job.
-
I feel better. For some strange reason, this was really bothering me today. I know it's not world peace or anything but...
-
Was there any truth to the rumor that in addition to wanting number 24, Cheatham wanted them to put "Thompson" across the back?
-
unless the kid's last name is thompson, let him wear 24. just my opinion
-
Was there any truth to the rumor that in addition to wanting number 24, Cheatham wanted them to put "Thompson" across the back?
You are misinformed. He wanted:
Thompson
Cheatham ;)
24
but NCAA uniform rules paragraph 6.4.c prohibits the use of emoticons.
I honestly understand the nostalgia that is driving the backlash but I don't think wearing the '24' goes against Wojo's culture of bridging the past with the present. I hope all the players look at the list of former players to wear their # and think "Holy s@*t i recognize some of those names and they were great" and not "well Teve transferred so i hope that doesn't happen to me"
-
Was there any truth to the rumor that in addition to wanting number 24, Cheatham wanted them to put "Thompson" across the back?
Maybe George will adopt him.
Still amazed at the PR issues that MU bball brings upon itself.
Pretty much a non-issue that it took a day to fix and he never actually wore the jersey. Just sad that they already made the same slip nine years ago and any alumni who pay attention to basketball know #24 is kind of a big deal.
-
Still amazed at the PR issues that MU bball brings upon itself. Just think, this entire episode could have been completely avoided. Completely. But then there wouldn't be a controversy. Nice job.
That is what happens when you have a complete turnover in coaching staff and AD. However, you would think MU would of been smart enough to red flag #24 after it happen the first time. Crean said 24 was in the list of available numbers given to the players to pick from. Essentially Crean was saying it was not his fault. You can believe that, if you want to. Some how Thompson's number got back on the list of available numbers. I sure Wojo did not know, but I think he should of known. How many recruits has he talked to about MU history. How many recruits did he point out the retired jerseys to that are both hanging in the Al and the US Cellular Arena. I am sure he has met George Thompson and should of known how he is revered by the older set of fans.
-
That is what happens when you have a complete turnover in coaching staff and AD. However, you would think MU would of been smart enough to red flag #24 after it happen the first time. Crean said 24 was in the list of available numbers given to the players to pick from. Essentially Crean was saying it was not his fault. You can believe that, if you want to. Some how Thompson's number got back on the list of available numbers. I sure Wojo did not know, but I think he should of known. How many recruits has he talked to about MU history. How many recruits did he point out the retired jerseys to that are both hanging in the Al and the US Cellular Arena. I am sure he has met George Thompson and should of known how he is revered by the older set of fans.
Is he recruiting for UWM too???
-
Why do they continue make poor PR decisions? First class organizations learn from past mistakes and I hope someday the MU athletic department does as well.
-
I thought Diener called Thompson and got the okay? Was that BS or did the MU admin over-rule Travis & George?
-
Why do they continue make poor PR decisions? First class organizations learn from past mistakes and I hope someday the MU athletic department does as well.
This is why we will never be a blue blood
-
Crean said 24 was in the list of available numbers given to the players to pick from. Essentially Crean was saying it was not his fault. You can believe that, if you want to.
Watch a Tom Crean press conference after every loss - essentially saying it's not his fault (team was well prepared, had the right game plan, etc.) is what he does.
-
Still amazed at the PR issues that MU bball brings upon itself. Just think, this entire episode could have been completely avoided. Completely. But then there wouldn't be a controversy. Nice job.
The only place this is a PR issue is on this board. 99% of the Marquette community has no idea the number was assigned, and nobody else will care by the time midnight madness rolls around with the exception of a few on the boards.
-
The only place this is a PR issue is on this board. 99% of the Marquette community has no idea the number was assigned, and nobody else will care by the time midnight madness rolls around with the exception of a few on the boards.
So 99% of the MU community does not read the JS? because it was a front page story the other day.
-
I still like the way UNC and Duke handle it.
If you are a national player of the year, you get your number retired, nobody wears it again. UNC has 8 such numbers.
If you are not a national player of the year, then you get your jersey honored and hung in the rafters, but the number goes back into circulation. UNC has 47 such examples.
That would provide for players like McNeal to be honored, but leave the 22 in the rotation.
-
I don't know George T, but he has to let this go in my opinion and should strongly consider allowing his number to be used. Maybe the policy should be to do so only if he talks to the player to wear the number and agrees to do so. There are only so many numbers.
The PR blunder is a minor one. And it shows what happens when the collective knowledge of an institution changes. The people in charge have no idea what happened 10 years ago and most likely assumed that the number wasn't retired. But, they at least quickly undid any potential damage.
Hopefully Wojo and George T can talk this out. I would think it would be an honor to have the right kind of player, with good character wear one's number, as long as they fulfill the character requirement.
-
Ziggy
More comments on JS article yesterday than almost any JS article on MU ball this year.
-
Ziggy
More comments on JS article yesterday than almost any JS article on MU ball this year.
And the radio guys (Belling/Sykes) used it to again mock the PR problems at Marquette.
-
The only place this is a PR issue is on this board. 99% of the Marquette community has no idea the number was assigned, and nobody else will care by the time midnight madness rolls around with the exception of a few on the boards.
I got more calls / texts / emails from my non MU fans yesterday about this than I have since Buzz quit. This hit nearly every sports talk show yesterday and was on top of JSOnline.
This a big deal and an incredibly stupid deal.
And for those of you who think George should get over it, well why shouldn't Wade or Doc. Let's hand out their numbers too.
MU slaps Al's name and image on every G'D thing they can. If you're going to do that, then you better show some respect to Al's favorite player, the one who proverbially "paved his driveway". This is unreal to me.
-
I don't get the "there are only so many numbers" argument.
They only need to use 15 at a time, which means at present the have 24 numbers to use without touching the retired ones. That would seem to be plenty.
-
The only place this is a PR issue is on this board. 99% of the Marquette community has no idea the number was assigned, and nobody else will care by the time midnight madness rolls around with the exception of a few on the boards.
The 1st thing I heard from my boss (UW grad) this morning was him laughing at this and then sending me an email with this which I had to google before I believed it:
MADISON - The University of Wisconsin produced the highest multiyear Academic Progress Rate (APR) of any FBS football team in the country according to an NCAA report released on Wednesday. UW’s APR was 998, coming in ahead of Northwestern (992), Duke (992), Michigan (990) and Stanford (987).
-
I got more calls / texts / emails from my non MU fans yesterday about this than I have since Buzz quit. This hit nearly every sports talk show yesterday and was on top of JSOnline.
It was a slow sports day yesterday. They had to fill the air/paper with something. This "PR Issue" will be properly forgotten as soon as there is another headline.
-
I think the number/jersey retirement argument is a joke. I really don't care what number a player wore during his career.
GT and those up in arms over this, need to get a life and get over it.
He was a great player and ambassador for Marquette. Awesome!! He was recognized for his achievements. Him. George Thompson, the player, the man, not some stupid number. Get over it.
If someone wants number 24 or 3 or 31 or whatever. Great. Give it to them. I don't see the big deal.
Imagine if some once in a generation recruit wanted to come to Marquette and his name was George Thompson. Would we tell him to go away because we once had a George Thompson at Marquette and he was the end all be all to all the George Thompsons of the world, at least Marquette world, so now change your name or just go away...shoo.
As usual, making a mountain out of a mole hill.
-
Still amazed at the PR issues that MU bball brings upon itself. Just think, this entire episode could have been completely avoided. Completely. But then there wouldn't be a controversy. Nice job.
I'm hear ya ... but other than about 7 people on this board, no one else cares. It will be forgotten by dinner.
-
I think the number/jersey retirement argument is a joke. I really don't care what number a player wore during his career.
GT and those up in arms over this, need to get a life and get over it.
He was a great player and ambassador for Marquette. Awesome!! He was recognized for his achievements. Him. George Thompson, the player, the man, not some stupid number. Get over it.
If someone wants number 24 or 3 or 31 or whatever. Great. Give it to them. I don't see the big deal.
Imagine if some once in a generation recruit wanted to come to Marquette and his name was George Thompson. Would we tell him to go away because we once had a George Thompson at Marquette and he was the end all be all to all the George Thompsons of the world, at least Marquette world, so now change your name or just go away...shoo.
As usual, making a mountain out of a mole hill.
THEN WHY IN THE WORLD DO WE RETIRE NUMBERS???????
-
I feel better. For some strange reason, this was really bothering me today. I know it's not world peace or anything but...
Dude, you need to have a word with Chick about her...wifely duties...
-
Maybe George will adopt him.
a la Tom Harmon!
-
First class organizations
Therein lies the rub, Goose...
-
Watch a Tom Crean press conference after every loss - essentially saying it's not his fault (team was well prepared, had the right game plan, etc.) is what he does.
My favorite was the presser where Tanned Tommy blamed the loss on Will Sheehey's subpar execution on his brilliant plan for an IU player to fake an elbow to the face...
-
And for those of you who think George should get over it, well why shouldn't Wade or Doc. Let's hand out their numbers too.
Agreed. All the numbers should be fair game.
-
And the radio guys (Belling/Sykes) used it to again mock the PR problems at Marquette.
Wow!!! They almost never mock anything.
I think we should hire them as consultants so we have access to their valuable opinions every day.
-
So did Diener really reach out to GT beforehand?
-
This was definitely a blunder. Not a major one, but it was most certainly preventable with some due diligence. What's kinda sad is how so many people think the school should either un-retire some numbers or change the way numbers are retired in the future. Considering the retiring of uniform numbers was a non-issue until a couple days ago, why does it need to change now? Because some putz in the athletic department didn't do their job?
As for "running out of available numbers," perhaps the NCAA will one day allow all numbers on uniforms instead of just 0 through 5.
-
Considering the retiring of uniform numbers was a non-issue until a couple days ago, why does it need to change now? Because some putz in the athletic department didn't do their job?
It was an even bigger deal in 2006 when Crean tried to give it to Lazar, and then made up the ridiculous explanation about retiring jerseys, not numbers. That's why this seems so absurd, we just went through the exact same thing 9 years ago, so why even open this can of worms again.
-
I don't know George T, but he has to let this go in my opinion and should strongly consider allowing his number to be used. Maybe the policy should be to do so only if he talks to the player to wear the number and agrees to do so. There are only so many numbers.
Can anyone share the back story to Doc Rivers getting #31 which was retired for Bo Ellis? Was Ellis consulted first or did they just give it to Doc and Ellis didn't care?
-
Can anyone share the back story to Doc Rivers getting #31 which was retired for Bo Ellis? Was Ellis consulted first or did they just give it to Doc and Ellis didn't care?
Don't recall for sure, but I thought Bo's number/jersey(?) was retired after Doc wore it.
Edit: Yep - this article indicates that Bo's jersey was retired in 1992. http://www.nabc.org/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/030502aaj.html
-
Can't believe some of y'all are down with givin' up retired numbers. This honor is earned, signifies excellence, and is a reward others, who follow, should strive to attain.
Sometimes the continual pussification of this country is beyond comprehension, ai na?
-
Wow!!! They almost never mock anything.
I think we should hire them as consultants so we have access to their valuable opinions every day.
Their shows have high ratings. They shape the opinions of many of their listeners. Don't make the mistake of assuming that everyone in their audience agrees with their viewpoint, but many certainly do.
-
Can't believe some of y'all are down with givin' up retired numbers. This honor is earned, signifies excellence, and is a reward others, who follow, should strive to attain.
Amen, brother.
-
It was an even bigger deal in 2006 when Crean tried to give gave it to Lazar, and then made up the ridiculous explanation about retiring jerseys, not numbers. That's why this seems so absurd, we just went through the exact same thing 9 years ago, so why even open this can of worms again.
Fixed. Hayward actually played a couple games wearing No. 24 at the beginning of the season.
Just looking back at the archives to confirm my memory, I found it interesting that in the box scores of those games Lazar is listed as No. 32 and there aren't any pictures of him in the photo galleries. But, in the recap articles for a couple of the games (Hillsdale and Idaho State) the picture is of Lazar wearing No. 24.
-
Can't believe some of y'all are down with givin' up retired numbers. This honor is earned, signifies excellence, and is a reward others, who follow, should strive to attain.
Sometimes the continual pussification of this country is beyond comprehension, ai na?
I recognize and respect George's accomplishments at MU, and would continue to do so regardless of whether someone else wore #24. Wouldn't you?
-
I recognize and respect George's accomplishments at MU, and would continue to do so regardless of whether someone else wore #24. Wouldn't you?
No, if someone else wears #24 then everything that Thompson did is permanently erased from history.
This is just old timers being old timers. Once you've finished alphabetizing your pantry, the only thing left to do is to be angry about something inane on the internet.
-
I recognize and respect George's accomplishments at MU, and would continue to do so regardless of whether someone else wore #24. Wouldn't you?
Then let him wear #3 as I respect Wade"s accomplishments as well.
-
They should only retire warrior numbers. They can retire Golden Eagle uniforms.
-
This is just old timers being old timers. Once you've finished alphabetizing your pantry, the only thing left to do is to be angry about something inane on the internet.
This is the type of comment that drives me nuts. Simply trying to diminish someone's argument by insulting them.
Look, I am not all that old. I never saw Thompson play. I just think that if you are going to honor that person through retiring their number, and market the fact that you retired the number, that you should....well...you know...keep the number retired.
Teams just need to be more judicious about whose numbers they retire in the future.
-
What they should do is---either keep the number retired or don't. Either way make a Frickin decision and stick by it. Why do I get the feeling that this topic will arise yet again in ten years or so?
I'm with 4ever and others---they retired #24. That means that no one wears #24 again. That is what retiring a number means--across the board. I also agree that you should be very selective of the number that you retire. You know why? Cuz no one will ever wear that jersey # again. Seems pretty simple.
-
This is the type of comment that drives me nuts. Simply trying to diminish someone's argument by insulting them.
Drives me nuts too. But not nearly as much as when the little bastards won't get off my lawn!
-
No, if someone else wears #24 then everything that Thompson did is permanently erased from history.
This is just old timers being old timers. Once you've finished alphabetizing your pantry, the only thing left to do is to be angry about something inane on the internet.
The University RETIRED his NUMBER what is so hard (old) about this?
-
Not old, never saw Thompson play and there's virtually no highlights of him. That doesn't mean I can't deduce his legendary status within MU ball. They retired his friggin number. That means no one wears it from now until the end of time. What the hell is there to debate?
-
Not old, never saw Thompson play and there's virtually no highlights of him. That doesn't mean I can't deduce his legendary status within MU ball. They retired his friggin number. That means no one wears it from now until the end of time. What the hell is there to debate?
George was THE MAN!
-
I think Wojo should give #3 or # 31 to five star recruits only. Four stars get other active NBA players. Three stars get Legends jerseys. Two stars get the JDaw treatment. 1 stars get the Niv special. Similar concept as how the Clintons sold the White House bedrooms to donors, a'nia?
-
In another tread I was almost willing to defer to tradition but now not all. What I see is a generational difference. For me the number 23 is Jordan, #34 is Walter Payton, #3 Wade you get the idea. As far as #24 in an MU jersey, for some folks no matter how good a kid is he will never measure up to George. That is the good news and the bad news just gives us all something to chat about....
-
Then let him wear #3 as I respect Wade"s accomplishments as well.
Exactly! #3, #24...they're just numbers.
-
Exactly! #3, #24...they're just numbers.
No! At Marquette they mean something special. They're about honoring our past and our commitment to people who have done something special for our university.
Everybody knows 3 is Dwyane Wade, 31 is Bo, 15 is Butch and 24 is George. I don't want to diminish these people's accomplishments by having others wear their number.
It's like saying let's let someone else wear 15 for the Green Bay Packers, 34 for the Bears, 23 for the Bulls or 33 for the Bucks. It is absurd.
-
You guys are still arguing? ::)
-
The University RETIRED his NUMBER what is so hard (old) about this?
The university retired his jersey. There's a reason that this page (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball/retired_jerseys) isn't called "retired numbers."
Remember to pick up a package of Ensure next time you're at the store.
Edit: I just checked and I have double the number of posts that you do, so I automatically win this argument. Board rules.
-
The university retired his jersey. There's a reason that this page (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball/retired_jerseys) isn't called "retired numbers."
Remember to pick up a package of Ensure next time you're at the store.
Edit: I just checked and I have double the number of posts that you do, so I automatically win this argument. Board rules.
Um, I was in (baby) diapers for the retirement but it was for his number. We've always retired numbers and apparently we unretire George's.
-
The university retired his jersey. There's a reason that this page (http://wiki.muscoop.com/doku.php/men_s_basketball/retired_jerseys) isn't called "retired numbers."
Remember to pick up a package of Ensure next time you're at the store.
Edit: I just checked and I have double the number of posts that you do, so I automatically win this argument. Board rules.
MU Athletics calls it "retired jersey numbers". Btw, I prefer Jack with my Ensure.
http://www.gomarquette.com/blog/2011/07/marquette-quiz-game-retired-jersey-numbers.html
-
Several questions.
First, is this just a George Thompson thing, or do the other players with retired numbers have a similar beef? What if Cheatham wanted to wear Don Kojis 44? Would this have been an issue?
Second, are all retired numbers/jerseys being treated the same? What about recent players who's ceremony and press releases clearly stated that the jersey was being retired. For example, in 2006 for Maurice Lucas, the press release clearly says his jersey is being retired--says nothing about the number:
http://www.gomarquette.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/021706aaa.html (http://www.gomarquette.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/021706aaa.html)
Wade and Rivers would fall into this category as well.
Third, what if this had been Dean Meminger's number? He's dead, so obviously he couldn't have objected. Or was this not Thompson but old-timer alums that would have raised a stink on his behalf?
Fourth, would MU be able to preempt future kerfuffles by issuing a general statement including the following points:
--There are a limited pool of numbers permitted by the NCAA
--There is an increasingly worthy pool of great players we want to recognize--including hopefully many players to come in future seasons.
--MU officials lacked the foresight forty+ years ago when they retired "numbers" rather than "jerseys"
--It is inherently unfair to the more recent honorees to limit them to having their "jersey" retired, while players from earlier era' have the "number" retired.
--Therefore, to clarify for any future situation that may occur, Marquette retires jerseys and not numbers.
--Because we were unclear for early honorees (Thomson, Kojis, Meminger, Lee, Apollo 11 were the only numbers retired before 1980), we will keep their numbers retired for 50 years after their last season at MU, at which point they will become eligible for incoming players to select. So 44 is available now.
--Apollo 11 will become available in 2019--the 50th anniversary of the moon landing.
-
Do you guys not remember this all happening 10-ish years ago?
http://www.scout.com/college/marquette/story/592205-the-george-thompson-controversy
Lazar went through the same saga and Crean answered the question back then. It's possible that University policy has changed since then, but:
Coach Crean later went on to define his view of Marquette's policy for retiring jerseys and numbers, saying, "In my opinion, we do what UCLA, North Carolina, Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, and Oklahoma State do. When honoring players of past, we are taking the numbers out of the situation, we are honoring the individual. We do not take the number out of the equation but rather the jersey itself is what is retired."
-
(http://preview.images.memegenerator.net/Instance/Preview?imageID=8831169&generatorTypeID=&panels=&text0=&text1=Why%20we%20still%20talking%20about%20this%3F&text2=&text3=)
-
Do you guys not remember this all happening 10-ish years ago?
http://www.scout.com/college/marquette/story/592205-the-george-thompson-controversy
Lazar went through the same saga and Crean answered the question back then. It's possible that University policy has changed since then, but:
First, Coach Crean's view of Marquette's policy isn't relevant here. Second, whether or not it is the number or jersey that has been retired, it is simply unfortunate that Marquette had to repeat this mistake with the same number just a few years later. They knew the clusterf*ck that resulted the first time.
-
Yo, this is not difficult to comprehend. Maybe some of y'all are confused seein' that Favre retired, then unretired and such, but, generally speakin', retired means retired, ai na?
-
And ai na means ai na. Ai na.
-
Check any media guide pre 2006. It will say jersey NUMBERS. Crean started this whole fiasco as a way of saying F U to George.