MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Tugg Speedman on January 17, 2015, 04:42:42 PM
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Wally Ellenson, a transfer from Minnesota who is ineligible to play basketball due to NCAA transfer rules, began his Marquette track and field career in record-setting fashion Saturday at the Wisconsin Open. A two-time NCAA first team All-American, he won the high jump by setting a new school and personal record of 7 feet, 5.75 inches. That jump meets the qualifying standard for world outdoors and is currently the No. 3 jump in the world this season. ...
http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/288930091.html
I understand the kid loves bball, but he might consider putting that aside for the 2016 Olympics.
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Agree high jump should be his focus but he likely will want to play with his brother. Anyone's guess what he will do.
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His jump today of 7' 5.75" feet is 2.28 meters
That would have also broken the U-Madison school record (2.22). He just missed the all-time camp Randall record of 2.30 meters (7' 6.5").
And given this was his first meet in January is all the more amazing.
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It is great to watch talent and dedication in any sport. I wish him success in whatever he decides. To reach his full potential it will require total commitment. I was fortunate to know a number of world class runners and there was complete focus toward one goal. To be the very best is very, very difficult and very, very special.
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Would love another MU Olympian. Sounds like he has the stuff to get there.
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http://www.usatf.org/statistics/topMarks/2014/Outdoor-Men.aspx
Looks like that jump would have been in the top 10 in 2014 for American men.
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http://www.usatf.org/statistics/topMarks/2014/Outdoor-Men.aspx
Looks like that jump would have been in the top 10 in 2014 for American men.
Actually he is already on the 2014 list. His best jump last year (2.25, 7'4.5", good for 2nd in NCAA outdoors) was 10th for all Americans. Today's jump would be 7th on this list.
He also might be the youngest jumper in the top 10 as well.
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I am looking at the 8 ft. ceiling in the room I'm in and having a really hard time comprehending how it is humanly possible to jump that high.
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I think he feels that basketball is a complimentary training for the high jump. I would hate to see him get injured in basketball though. Lets hope he can win the NCAA this year.
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I am looking at the 8 ft. ceiling in the room I'm in and having a really hard time comprehending how it is humanly possible to jump that high.
Here is the world record set back in 1993.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWde8sMxe1w
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I think he feels that basketball is a complimentary training for the high jump. I would hate to see him get injured in basketball though. Lets hope he can win the NCAA this year.
It is to a point and he has long crossed that point. See the pictures below, they are of the top jumpers in the world (the current crop might be the best ever).
The ideal body is 6' 5" to 6' 7" (which Wally has) and that long skinny lanky look shown below. To achieve this he has to stop working on upper body bulk and lose weight, a lot of weight.
Additionally he has to work in increasing his approach speed and explosive take off. None of these are workouts or goals that Wojo wants if he is going to be an effective bball player. ....
As noted in the post above, Cuba's Javier Sotomayor set the world record in 1993 clearing 2.45m (8' 0.5") Castro gave him an a/c and new fridge for his Havana apartment as a thank you!
(http://www.sporting-heroes.net/content/thumbnails/00101/09997-zoom.jpg)
Among the current crop of jumpers:
Ukraine's Bohdan Bondarenko cleared 2.42m (7' 11.25") in a meet last June in NYC
(http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Bohdan+Bondarenko+IAAF+World+Athletics+Championships+UdXfTwti2xxl.jpg)
Qatar's Mutaz Essa Barshim cleared the same height 2.42m (7' 11.25") at the same June meet in NYC
(http://www.lechorepublicain.fr/photoSRC/W1ZTJ1FdUTgIBhVOGwYSHgYNQDUVGFdfVV9FWkM-/le-sauteur-qatarien-mutaz-essa-barshim-franchit-la-barre-de-_1732793.jpeg)
Russia's Ivan Ukhov cleared 2.41 (7' 11") last May in Ad-Dawhah (but he is 29 and may be on the backside of his career.
(http://gfx.aftonbladet-cdn.se/image/18858131/800/normal/e00df0bf2b4c9/aATHLETICS-QAT-IAAF-DIAMON499069.jpg)
Canada's Derek Drouin ... 2012 Olympic Bronze medalist, 2013 Big 10 and NCAA champ IU (Wally finished second in the B1G and 8th in the NCAA to him that year) cleared 2.40 (7' 10.5") last year
(http://dailyrelay.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/RBAEKMGWOWIVCTV.20140426033126.jpg)
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Agree high jump should be his focus but he likely will want to play with his brother. Anyone's guess what he will do.
He has repeatedly said that he wants to play basketball. If he wanted to focus on high jump, he wouldn't have transferred to Marquette.
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He has repeatedly said that he wants to play basketball. If he wanted to focus on high jump, he wouldn't have transferred to Marquette.
Correct but he keeps getting better and better in jumping. It's is getting hard to ignore his extraordinary talent at it.
Yesterday jump hit the Olympic A standard, qualified him for this summer outdoor world championships and is currently number 3 in the world (this number will go down as the track season unfolds). Let me put this in prospective. MU has never produce a basketball player as good as Wally is in jumping. Not Wade, not Butch Lee, not Lucas.
Only about half-a-dozen jumpers in the US are capable of these levels. He might be the only "part-time" jumper hitting these standards.
At what point do re-consider your goals when you have a gift that only a handful of people on the planet have, but tens of millions would like?
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Maybe he'd rather play basketball.
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His jump height yesterday would have put him on the USA Olympic team in 2012 (3 make it) to put that in perspective, if not being the winner of the trials.
http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2012/U-S--Olympic-Team-Trials-TF/Results.aspx
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Correct but he keeps getting better and better in jumping. It's is getting hard to ignore his extraordinary talent at it.
Yesterday jump hit the Olympic A standard, qualified him for this summer outdoor world championships and is currently number 3 in the world (this number will go down as the track season unfolds). Let me put this in prospective. MU has never produce a basketball player as good as Wally is in jumping. Not Wade, not Butch Lee, not Lucas.
Only about half-a-dozen jumpers in the US are capable of these levels. He might be the only "part-time" jumper hitting these standards.
At what point do re-consider your goals when you have a gift that only a handful of people on the planet have, but tens of millions would like?
I don't dispute any of your points, but your question is something only Wally can answer. Transferring to MU seems to have been for the very reason that he still has the option to pursue both sports. Other schools might not have given him that choice, and told him to only focus on track, ultimately the school can do that because they hold all power with the scholarships.
MU has promised Wally he could play both. MU should and will honor that. Wally could be the #1 high jumper in the world, and at MU it will still be his choice as to whether or not he wants to play basketball. That is his choice. And I support him having the ability to choose. Should he reconsider and choose to only pursue track, MU should also support that choice. Whatever way he chooses, I wish him the best in both sports.
By the way, does anyone know when the qualifiers are for the 2016 Olympics?
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It'll be interesting to see what Wally decides to do. Perhaps he is talented enough to make the US Olympic team in 2016 being a two sport athlete but not talented (or unilaterally committed enough) to be a medal contender were he to choose Track & Field only. Only he can decide what he wants. All I can do is marvel at the kid's hops. Awesome.
Serious question. Is Wally the NCAA national championship favorite this year? Was our last national champion Ralph Metcalfe?
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By the way, does anyone know when the qualifiers are for the 2016 Olympics?
July 1-10, 2016 in Eugene (U of Oregon) Hayward field. It at this location almost every-time.
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Was our last national champion Ralph Metcalfe?
There was some team that won a national championship in 1977, but besides that yes ;)
(I know you meant in track...but I had to...)
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Here's the video:
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=909417659103403
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Just thought of something....
When I was at MU (2004-2008) there were some track guys living on my floor at McCormick. I thought it strange they were not housed with other athletes in Humphrey. I also remember them telling me MU only offered partial scholarships for track and field, not full rides. My freshman year RA was also on the track team, and was an RA to pay for his housing, which his scholarship did not cover.
I have no idea if this is still the case but could Wally possibly be playing basketball to stay on full scholarship and retain the other benefits of being on the basketball team?
That might not be the case, but if true, it would really be a shame that a potential Olympic track and field athlete had to play basketball in order to get a full ride to Marquette. Let's hope that's not the case and he is playing basketball simply because he wants to play.
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There was some team that won a national championship in 1977, but besides that yes ;)
(I know you meant in track...but I had to...)
Yeah, yeah. The difference Bleu is that I know exactly where I was and what I was watching that wonderful Monday night in 1977. Young pup. ;D
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Correct but he keeps getting better and better in jumping. It's is getting hard to ignore his extraordinary talent at it.
Yesterday jump hit the Olympic A standard, qualified him for this summer outdoor world championships and is currently number 3 in the world (this number will go down as the track season unfolds). Let me put this in prospective. MU has never produce a basketball player as good as Wally is in jumping. Not Wade, not Butch Lee, not Lucas.
Only about half-a-dozen jumpers in the US are capable of these levels. He might be the only "part-time" jumper hitting these standards.
At what point do re-consider your goals when you have a gift that only a handful of people on the planet have, but tens of millions would like?
Your point about the body type requires for high jump is a good one. One thing I have learned with multi sport kids is they have to do the sport they love. I think Wally focuses by season , but the stakes are very high in 2016 with the Olympics. Will be interesting to see what he opts to do.
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I honestly don't know the answer to this, but how old are the elite jumpers? Maybe Wally feels he can pursue high jump for the next 10-15 years but feels his window for basketball, especially with his brother, is only 2-3 years. If that's the case, I completely understand him wanting to pursue both.
Do what you love now, and if it costs him 2016, maybe he feels he can still compete in 2020, 2024, and beyond.
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I honestly don't know the answer to this, but how old are the elite jumpers? Maybe Wally feels he can pursue high jump for the next 10-15 years but feels his window for basketball, especially with his brother, is only 2-3 years. If that's the case, I completely understand him wanting to pursue both.
Do what you love now, and if it costs him 2016, maybe he feels he can still compete in 2020, 2024, and beyond.
Maybe he believes he can legitimately do both next year. Look, yesterday he had a world-class jump and a PB, despite the fact that his dedicated high jump practice in the last few months has been a fraction of what it would have been if he wasn't playing hoops.
If the Olympic trials are in July, he has a a good 3-4 months after the basketball season is over to focus on his jumping. It's a sport where conditioning isn't a huge factor (as opposed to being, for example, a 10,000 meter guy), so maybe he figures a few months is enough to properly prepare.
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To answer an earlier question, Marquette has had a number of national champions in track since Ralph Metcalfe. Ken Weisner won the high jump three times. Our most recent champion was Keith Hanson in 1986. Keith won the 10K at the NCAA meet hosted by Duke.
Sadly, those days are long gone. As someone noted above, MU no longer provides the scholarships or other support needed to compete at that level. Wally could have received a full ride from several schools to be full time jumper. No one at his talent level would go to MU to high jump. We don't have the scholarships, facilities or coaching for someone like Wally. His efforts for the track team are an incredible gift to the school.
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Correct but he keeps getting better and better in jumping. It's is getting hard to ignore his extraordinary talent at it.
Yesterday jump hit the Olympic A standard, qualified him for this summer outdoor world championships and is currently number 3 in the world (this number will go down as the track season unfolds). Let me put this in prospective. MU has never produce a basketball player as good as Wally is in jumping. Not Wade, not Butch Lee, not Lucas.
Only about half-a-dozen jumpers in the US are capable of these levels. He might be the only "part-time" jumper hitting these standards.
At what point do re-consider your goals when you have a gift that only a handful of people on the planet have, but tens of millions would like?
We think the same way but it is up to Wally. I hope he makes the right choice for him.
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Sadly, those days are long gone. As someone noted above, MU no longer provides the scholarships or other support needed to compete at that level. Wally could have received a full ride from several schools to be full time jumper. No one at his talent level would go to MU to high jump. We don't have the scholarships, facilities or coaching for someone like Wally. His efforts for the track team are an incredible gift to the school.
You can thank he drain of womens sports and Title IX.
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You can thank he drain of womens sports and Title IX.
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In English please
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In English please
Add a t in front of the he.
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You can thank he drain of womens sports and Title IX.
I really don't think Title IX has anything to do with it.
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Add a t in front of the he.
hanks.
;D
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If a women's sport was able to fund the other women's sports, I'd have no problem with it being an equal deal. Because they don't, I don't think it should be equal. Am I wrong? Probably, but is it equal that women's basketball under the NCAA have more scholarships to offer than men's programs?
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If a women's sport was able to fund the other women's sports, I'd have no problem with it being an equal deal. Because they don't, I don't think it should be equal. Am I wrong? Probably, but is it equal that women's basketball under the NCAA have more scholarships to offer than men's programs?
NCAA scholarship limitations aren't applicable. Title IX is applicable to schools and how they distribute scholarship money and other resources.
That and relatively few people truly care about Marquette's track and field program.
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NCAA scholarship limitations aren't applicable. Title IX is applicable to schools and how they distribute scholarship money and other resources.
That and relatively few people truly care about Marquette's track and field program.
Still reeling from the startup of the UW women's softball program after the competitive baseball program was shut down and then they build the new softball complex on the old baseball site. Ouch!!!
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If a women's sport was able to fund the other women's sports, I'd have no problem with it being an equal deal. Because they don't, I don't think it should be equal. Am I wrong? Probably, but is it equal that women's basketball under the NCAA have more scholarships to offer than men's programs?
Yes, you are wrong. That would be a stupid rule that the "profit" from men's sports should only fund other men's sports. What does gender have to do with it?
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Okay, want to clear up some misconceptions about Marquette track and NCAA track in general.
-Marquette does have a rich history in track, with several Olympians and national champions, with the last NCAA Champ being Keith Hanson in the 10,000 meters in 1986.
-Even in the 1990's and 2,000's, men's and women's cross country, indoor track and outdoor track were fairly competitive, with a combined 23 team championships in the Great Midwest and Conference-USA. and many individual champions, three all-Americans and a few conference MVP's.
-There are equivalency sports and head count sports. For example basketball and volleyball are head count sports, where the NCAA limits how many scholarships you can give (i.e. men's basketball has 13) and everyone gets a full ride. There are no partial scholarships in a head count sport; you are either a full ride or walk-on. Sports like track and soccer are equivalency sports where you get a certain amount of scholarship money and you can divide it up however you want. You could have someone getting as little as $100 scholarship all the way up to a full ride.
-The NCAA limit for men's cross country, indoor track and outdoor track is 12.6 scholarships. To have a full track team with at least a couple of athletes in each event, it takes a lot more than 12 or 13 guys, therefore there are very, very, very few full ride scholarships given in men's track at any school, including the power conferences. Someone at Wally's level could have gotten a full ride at some schools I am guessing because he is almost a sure NCAA champion or very high placer, but it is rare to get a full ride.
-Marquette gives about 8 scholarships for men's track/cross country, so it is even more unlikely to give someone a full ride at Marquette, when you are trying to stretch 8 scholarships out over 20 or more guys.
-Someone said there is less support for men's track/cross country than in 1986 when Keith Hanson won his national title, but that is far from the truth. Back then the scholarship amount was about 4 total scholarships and all trips were in crowded vans driving across the country. There was only one full time coach. The outdoor track was a crappy asphalt track 2 miles from campus at the old Marquette stadium and the indoor track was the one in the old gym with a banked balcony track that is about 14 1/2 laps to a mile.
-The current track team has quite a bit more to offer than back in the 1980's with more scholarships, charter buses to meets and the money to fly to some meets, a very good outdoor track at Valley fields, better locker room, better weight room and three full time coaches. The only thing that hasn't changed is there is still no indoor track except for at the old gym. Try to imagine having a tennis team without courts, a soccer team without a field, a basketball team without a court, etc. In this climate, having good indoor facilities is really important and Marquette is one of the few DI schools in the northern part of the country that doesn't have an indoor facility.
-The coaching staff is very knowledgeable and has the skills to work with an athlete like Wally. He jumped higher in his first meet for Marquette than he ever did at Minnesota so that tells you something right there. Yes I understand much of that is talent, but when you get that good, just getting another inch or two is very difficult and the Marquette coaches have already gotten that out of him. I for one was very, very impressed when I heard how high he jumped in his first meet.
-Despite only having the old gym as the indoor facility, they do have a high jump pit and have rubberized runways that they put on the gym floor and it is very conducive to getting actual practice in a pit. As mentioned, the outdoor facility is very good.
-Wally is Olympic caliber and it will be interesting to see what direction he chooses to go. My guess is if he can earn some playing time next year and has a chance to play with his brother for a year or two, that would be ideal for him as it seems like basketball is his first love. But it sure seems difficult to pass up the chance to be an Olympian and my hope is he can do both well, since that is what he seems like he wants to do.
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I'll ask the experts. Don't scholarships have to match the makeup of the student body, so if MU is made up of 55% of women, the athletic scholarships have to be broken out that way? I'm asking.
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I'll ask the experts. Don't scholarships have to match the makeup of the student body, so if MU is made up of 55% of women, the athletic scholarships have to be broken out that way? I'm asking.
Roughly yes.
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Okay, want to clear up some misconceptions about Marquette track and NCAA track in general.
-Marquette does have a rich history in track, with several Olympians and national champions, with the last NCAA Champ being Keith Hanson in the 10,000 meters in 1986.
-Even in the 1990's and 2,000's, men's and women's cross country, indoor track and outdoor track were fairly competitive, with a combined 23 team championships in the Great Midwest and Conference-USA. and many individual champions, three all-Americans and a few conference MVP's.
-There are equivalency sports and head count sports. For example basketball and volleyball are head count sports, where the NCAA limits how many scholarships you can give (i.e. men's basketball has 13) and everyone gets a full ride. There are no partial scholarships in a head count sport; you are either a full ride or walk-on. Sports like track and soccer are equivalency sports where you get a certain amount of scholarship money and you can divide it up however you want. You could have someone getting as little as $100 scholarship all the way up to a full ride.
-The NCAA limit for men's cross country, indoor track and outdoor track is 12.6 scholarships. To have a full track team with at least a couple of athletes in each event, it takes a lot more than 12 or 13 guys, therefore there are very, very, very few full ride scholarships given in men's track at any school, including the power conferences. Someone at Wally's level could have gotten a full ride at some schools I am guessing because he is almost a sure NCAA champion or very high placer, but it is rare to get a full ride.
-Marquette gives about 8 scholarships for men's track/cross country, so it is even more unlikely to give someone a full ride at Marquette, when you are trying to stretch 8 scholarships out over 20 or more guys.
-Someone said there is less support for men's track/cross country than in 1986 when Keith Hanson won his national title, but that is far from the truth. Back then the scholarship amount was about 4 total scholarships and all trips were in crowded vans driving across the country. There was only one full time coach. The outdoor track was a crappy asphalt track 2 miles from campus at the old Marquette stadium and the indoor track was the one in the old gym with a banked balcony track that is about 14 1/2 laps to a mile.
-The current track team has quite a bit more to offer than back in the 1980's with more scholarships, charter buses to meets and the money to fly to some meets, a very good outdoor track at Valley fields, better locker room, better weight room and three full time coaches. The only thing that hasn't changed is there is still no indoor track except for at the old gym. Try to imagine having a tennis team without courts, a soccer team without a field, a basketball team without a court, etc. In this climate, having good indoor facilities is really important and Marquette is one of the few DI schools in the northern part of the country that doesn't have an indoor facility.
-The coaching staff is very knowledgeable and has the skills to work with an athlete like Wally. He jumped higher in his first meet for Marquette than he ever did at Minnesota so that tells you something right there. Yes I understand much of that is talent, but when you get that good, just getting another inch or two is very difficult and the Marquette coaches have already gotten that out of him. I for one was very, very impressed when I heard how high he jumped in his first meet.
-Despite only having the old gym as the indoor facility, they do have a high jump pit and have rubberized runways that they put on the gym floor and it is very conducive to getting actual practice in a pit. As mentioned, the outdoor facility is very good.
-Wally is Olympic caliber and it will be interesting to see what direction he chooses to go. My guess is if he can earn some playing time next year and has a chance to play with his brother for a year or two, that would be ideal for him as it seems like basketball is his first love. But it sure seems difficult to pass up the chance to be an Olympian and my hope is he can do both well, since that is what he seems like he wants to do.
Thanks for the insight. Still weird though that MU only has 8 scholarships available when they are allowed 12.6 by the NCAA. That would be like only giving men's basketball 9 to work with.
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Still reeling from the startup of the UW women's softball program after the competitive baseball program was shut down and then they build the new softball complex on the old baseball site. Ouch!!!
You are reeling over UW baseball/softball?
Don't.
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Thanks for the insight. Still weird though that MU only has 8 scholarships available when they are allowed 12.6 by the NCAA. That would be like giving only giving men's basketball 9 to work with.
Only using nine this year ;D
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Thanks for the insight. Still weird though that MU only has 8 scholarships available when they are allowed 12.6 by the NCAA. That would be like only giving men's basketball 9 to work with.
It's not weird, it's $$$$. Not enough cash in the Blue and Gold Fund to finance 12.6.
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It's not weird, it's $$$$. Not enough cash in the Blue and Gold Fund to finance 12.6.
Correct!
The Blue/Gold fund smashed its all-time records this year by raising $600k. That funds 12 schollies! So to get the extra 4.5 schollies for track requires $250k EVERY YEAR!
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Very surprised our men's team has 8 scholies. I know in the old Big East we had the poorest funded team. The 8 scholies must be spread over CC, indoor and outdoor track. Coach Allen would have won the national title with funding like that in the 80's.
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Men's basketball revenue and the Blue and Gold fund basically fund the entire athletic department, so it is understandable that they can't fully fund all the sports. However, with the exception of Golf, Men's and women's cross country has had the least amount of funding in regards to percent of scholarships given compared to the NCAA maximum allowable, along with the smallest coaching staff in relation to the number of sports (men's and women's track/cross country accounts for 6 of the NCAA required minimum of 14 sports) and size of the team (approximately 80-100 athletes each year).
As someone said, nobody really cares about Marquette Track & Field (okay I know there are a few of us that do), but none of the sports besides men's basketball are bringing in money to the school or drawing thousands of fans, so if the majority of the sports are fully funded, there needs to be a push to have them all fully funded and on an equal playing field in the Competitive Big East.
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Very surprised our men's team has 8 scholies. I know in the old Big East we had the poorest funded team. The 8 scholies must be spread over CC, indoor and outdoor track. Coach Allen would have won the national title with funding like that in the 80's.
Men's track/cross country has had around 7-8 scholarships for the past 10-15 years, but yes they were one of the poorest funded teams in the old big East. Yes the 8 scholarships are for both cross country and track, so the distance runners are really getting a track scholarship, but also running cross country. I am not sure Coach Allen could have won a national title with a few more scholarships, but he was a very good coach and definitely made excellent use of the ones he had.
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Very surprised our men's team has 8 scholies. I know in the old Big East we had the poorest funded team. The 8 scholies must be spread over CC, indoor and outdoor track. Coach Allen would have won the national title with funding like that in the 80's.
Okay, really sorry to hijack this thread talking about track on a basketball message board, but one thing to keep in mind is that the coach can decide what type of athletes the scholarships go to. Since Coach Allen had such few scholarships, he put most of the money into distance runners. Even the great sprinter in the late 70's, early 80's, John Rydeski, started out as a walk-on. Since there was no conference back then, having a well-rounded program with athletes in all the events wasn't that important since there was no conference meet to try and score as many points as possible. Since joining a conference in the late 1980's, the coaches have tried to develop a more well-rounded program, giving scholarships to not only distance runners, but also throwers, sprinters and jumpers. If you look at the Big East indoor and outdoor results last year, many points were scored by non-distance runners and I believe they even took 1st and 2nd in the high jump at the indoor meet. I think Wally might have a chance to win this year. :)
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Interesting discussion. I've enjoyed both volleyball and soccer in person so I guess that makes me well rounded. Blue and Gold is working hard to close the gap. Perhaps Wall's success will prompt folks to appreciate the need. Does anyone know how the addition of lacrosse has impacted the budget?
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Okay, really sorry to hijack this thread talking about track on a basketball message board, but one thing to keep in mind is that the coach can decide what type of athletes the scholarships go to. Since Coach Allen had such few scholarships, he put most of the money into distance runners. Even the great sprinter in the late 70's, early 80's, John Rydeski, started out as a walk-on. Since there was no conference back then, having a well-rounded program with athletes in all the events wasn't that important since there was no conference meet to try and score as many points as possible. Since joining a conference in the late 1980's, the coaches have tried to develop a more well-rounded program, giving scholarships to not only distance runners, but also throwers, sprinters and jumpers. If you look at the Big East indoor and outdoor results last year, many points were scored by non-distance runners and I believe they even took 1st and 2nd in the high jump at the indoor meet. I think Wally might have a chance to win this year. :)
No worries about hijacking, this is very interesting, and relevant to Wally, who is relevant to MU basketball, so close enough. Thanks for your insights.
It really is a shame though if Wally has to play basketball in order to keep his full ride. If he wants to play, that is great, but I wish MU was able to give a full ride to an Olympic caliber track athlete just on the merits of his track abilities.
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Very surprised our men's team has 8 scholies. I know in the old Big East we had the poorest funded team. The 8 scholies must be spread over CC, indoor and outdoor track. Coach Allen would have won the national title with funding like that in the 80's.
Speaking of Coach Allen. Sorry to see he passed last month. In the 90's we would bump into him from time to time at Valley Fields when working soccer games, or hosting the CUSA Championships. Did not know him, but seemed like a nice man.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/goldeneagles/ex-mu-coach-jim-allen-dies-b99408317z1-285730191.html
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Interesting discussion. I've enjoyed both volleyball and soccer in person so I guess that makes me well rounded. Blue and Gold is working hard to close the gap. Perhaps Wall's success will prompt folks to appreciate the need. Does anyone know how the addition of lacrosse has impacted the budget?
According to the Blue & Gold fund website (http://www.gomarquette.com/bluegold-fund/about-bgf-goals.html), the $4.3 million raised last year allows MU to fund 99 of the 135 scholarships that the NCAA allows MU to offer.
Men's lacrosse is allowed 12.6 scholarships (http://www.scholarshipstats.com/ncaalimits.html), women's lacrosse is allowed 12. Even if lacrosse wasn't around, MU still wouldn't have enough money to fund all of the allowed scholarships.
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According to the Blue & Gold fund website (http://www.gomarquette.com/bluegold-fund/about-bgf-goals.html), the $4.3 million raised last year allows MU to fund 99 of the 135 scholarships that the NCAA allows MU to offer.
Men's lacrosse is allowed 12.6 scholarships (http://www.scholarshipstats.com/ncaalimits.html), women's lacrosse is allowed 12. Even if lacrosse wasn't around, MU still wouldn't have enough money to fund all of the allowed scholarships.
Sorry, the $600k I mention I heard Homer say during the X game. That was the challenge period over the holidays only.
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Speaking of Coach Allen. Sorry to see he passed last month. In the 90's we would bump into him from time to time at Valley Fields when working soccer games, or hosting the CUSA Championships. Did not know him, but seemed like a nice man.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/goldeneagles/ex-mu-coach-jim-allen-dies-b99408317z1-285730191.html
Coach Allen was a very good man and loved Marquette deeply. He and his brother Bob are the only two brothers in the Marquette hall of fame. He coached for 11 years and during that time he was also a full time NML agent. Coaching at the D1 level is a full time job, but somehow he managed to do both. Eventually though it was too tough trying to do two full time jobs and that is why his coaching career wasn't longer. After leaving coaching he still continued to support Marquette athletics and he worked extremely hard helping to raise money for valley fields, of which much of the money was donated by track alumni.
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One thing going unsaid here is that he must be practicing with the basketball team everyday too. For him to PR in the high jump while simultaneously practicing in another sport is pretty incredible.
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Somebody posted the video of his 7' 5 3/4" jump, but here is a video of all of his jumps from 6'9" all the way to his final height, plus a little more of his celebration after making the jump. The crowd was definitely in to it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFeVEswREQk
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I honestly don't know the answer to this, but how old are the elite jumpers? Maybe Wally feels he can pursue high jump for the next 10-15 years but feels his window for basketball, especially with his brother, is only 2-3 years. If that's the case, I completely understand him wanting to pursue both.
Do what you love now, and if it costs him 2016, maybe he feels he can still compete in 2020, 2024, and beyond.
His jump height yesterday would have put him on the USA Olympic team in 2012 (3 make it) to put that in perspective, if not being the winner of the trials.
http://www.usatf.org/Events---Calendar/2012/U-S--Olympic-Team-Trials-TF/Results.aspx
The above statements are true, but a little bit of additional color is in order (this applies only to Track)
A country can send three participants per event (four if one is the current world champion **). A country can decide how to pick them. Some are picked by committee (Kenya often, but not always, does this with its distance runners), others are decided in a competition (appropriately called the "Olympic Trials")
In the United States we have an Olympic Trials. So to make the Olympics you have to do three things:
1) Qualify for your Olympic trials ***
2) Finish in the top three. That means nothing else matters before ... you have to finish in the top three in the Trials to be held July 1 - 10 2016 in Eugene Oregon period.
3) Hit the Olympic "A" standard ***
Their is a tremendous amount of randomness and variability to make an Olympic team. You have to be preforming well in an Olympic year (to qualify), perform well at the trials, not be sick or injured, and maybe even hope one or two opponents are not performing well. So, if the opportunity arises, you don't say "their will always be fours years from now." You seize it.
*** = The world championship are every two years, the year before and after the Olympics. The next outdoor track championships are August 20-31, 2015 in Beijing. The winner of each event gets a bye into the Olympics provided they are chosen or qualify for their respective country's team. Some current world champions actually do not.
*** = The Olympic qualifying standards have net been set. The window is May 1, 2015 to July 31, 2016. You must hit this standard in this time window or you cannot go to the Olympics, even if you make your team via the trials (top three). While the standards are not set, they are often the same or very close the to the standards to qualify for the World outdoor championship. Wally's jump did qualify him for that, but he'll have to do it again after May 1 if the Olympics is a goal.
The standards are designed to keep wealthy guys looking for the ultimate adventure vacation ... give a poor country a boatload of cash and have them pick you for their Olympic team. Then you get to participate in the opening and closing ceremonies, live in the Olympic village for 17 days and, hopefully, get lucky with a Brazilian beach volleyball player.
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Somebody posted the video of his 7' 5 3/4" jump, but here is a video of all of his jumps from 6'9" all the way to his final height, plus a little more of his celebration after making the jump. The crowd was definitely in to it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFeVEswREQk
This is great, thanks for pointing it out.
I love the part when the cameraman says "are you freaking kidding me, this is his first meet?!?"
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The above statements are true, but a little bit of additional color is in order (this applies only to Track)
A country can send three participants per event (four if one is the current world champion **). A country can decide how to pick them. Some are picked by committee (Kenya often, but not always, does this with its distance runners), others are decided in a competition (appropriately called the "Olympic Trials")
In the United States we have an Olympic Trials. So to make the Olympics you have to do three things:
1) Qualify for your Olympic trials ***
2) Finish in the top three. That means nothing else matters before ... you have to finish in the top three in the Trials to be held July 1 - 10 2016 in Eugene Oregon period.
3) Hit the Olympic "A" standard ***
Their is a tremendous amount of randomness and variability to make an Olympic team. You have to be preforming well in an Olympic year (to qualify), perform well at the trials, not be sick or injured, and maybe even hope one or two opponents are not performing well. So, if the opportunity arises, you don't say "their will always be fours years from now." You seize it.
*** = The world championship are every two years, the year before and after the Olympics. The next outdoor track championships are August 20-31, 2015 in Beijing. The winner of each event gets a bye into the Olympics provided they are chosen or qualify for their respective country's team. Some current world champions actually do not.
*** = The Olympic qualifying standards have net been set. The window is May 1, 2015 to July 31, 2016. You must hit this standard in this time window or you cannot go to the Olympics, even if you make your team via the trials (top three). While the standards are not set, they are often the same or very close the to the standards to qualify for the World outdoor championship. Wally's jump did qualify him for that, but he'll have to do it again after May 1 if the Olympics is a goal.
The standards are designed to keep wealthy guys looking for the ultimate adventure vacation ... give a poor country a boatload of cash and have them pick you for their Olympic team. Then you get to participate in the opening and closing ceremonies, live in the Olympic village for 17 days and, hopefully, get lucky with a Brazilian beach volleyball player.
#brazillianvbplayersformubb #teamwally
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Wow!!
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Kid can jump....kid also averaged 1 PPG in two college basketball seasons.
Will be cool having the bros together, but Olympics trump playing DePaul & Creighton
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B7k-YWtIEAA5QyN.jpg)
@MUTFXC
Wally's mark of 2.28 / 7-5.75 meets the qualifying standard for world outdoors and is currently the #3 in the world!
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And he's standing on the "motion W" too!!!
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You can thank he drain of womens sports and Title IX.
I suppose you direct all of your athletic dept donations to the men's track team?
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sheesh he is smoove and in the groove; what a relaxed and perfectly repeated form
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Thanks for the insight, Heisenberg.
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I suppose you direct all of your athletic dept donations to the men's track team?
I don't give any money to Marquette or any other school and was blowing off steam after watching the Packers.
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Kid can jump....kid also averaged 1 PPG in two college basketball seasons.
Will be cool having the bros together, but Olympics trump playing DePaul & Creighton
I believe Wally is fully capable of deciding what trumps what, but I'm sure his mind is at ease knowing he has Scoopers available to tell him what he should do.
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(http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/marq/sports/c-track/auto_action/10704410.jpeg)
Ellenson Named BIG EAST Men's Field Athlete of the Week
Ellenson is the top-ranked high jumper in the NCAA and No. 3 in the world this season
http://www.gomarquette.com/sports/c-track/spec-rel/012015aaa.html
NEW YORK – Marquette University men’s high jumper Wally Ellenson was named the BIG EAST Conference Men’s Field Athlete of the Week on Tuesday after a record-setting performance on Saturday at the Camp Randall Memorial Sports Center in the Wisconsin Open.
Ellenson, who was competing in his first meet as a member of the Golden Eagles’ track and field squad, shattered the Marquette high jump record. On his third attempt, the Rice Lake, Wisconsin, native jumped 2.28 meters (7 feet, 5.75 inches) to blow away the competition away by over five inches.
His second attempt of 7 feet, 1 inch broke the all-time Marquette record and his next attempt solidified Ellenson as the highest jumper in MU history.
The junior’s mark, which is a personal best for the two-time NCAA First Team All-American, ranks No. 1 in the country and No. 3 in the world. By virtue of his height, Ellenson automatically qualifies for the 2015 IAAF World Outdoor Championships.
The Marquette University men’s and women’s track and field teams return to action on Friday, Jan. 23 at the Klotsche Center in the John Tierney Triangular at 5 p.m. The Golden Eagles will face the host Panthers and the University of Illinois-Chicago.
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Just so everyone knows, Wally will not be jumping at the track meet tonight at UW-Milwaukee. It looks like the only other indoor meets he will be competing in are the Big East and NCAA nationals.
I just didn't want anyone driving over to UW-M thinking he would be jumping. Outdoors he will be jumping in more meets since the basketball season will be over. Hopefully I will get a chance to see him jump sometime. Jumping almost 7'6" is very impressive and would be fun to see in person.
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Since we are on the subject of MU high jumping, let's give some love to MU's sophomore jumper Oumaru Abdulahi.
http://www.gomarquette.com/sports/c-track/mtt/oumaru_abdulahi_853486.html
He is from Mooseheart Il (and Sierra Leone). Last year cleared 6'10.75" to set a MU freshman record.
While Wally is the heavy favorite to win the Big East indoor track title, Abdulahi is the defending BE indoor champion. MU could go #1 and #2 in the high jump at the conference meet.
All of a sudden, as Buzz would say, MU is a really really good high jumping school. But I don't mean this in a negative way.
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Side story about Mooseheart ...
Judge's ruling allows Mooseheart players to compete, for now
Dec. 5, 2012 1:47 p.m. CST
http://www.kcchronicle.com/2012/12/04/judges-ruling-allows-mooseheart-players-to-compete-for-now/atdy1if/
GENEVA – A Kane County judge granted a restraining order Tuesday that allows three Mooseheart boys basketball players from South Sudan to continue competing until the Illinois High School Association's board of directors considers the matter Monday.
Judge David Akemann made his afternoon ruling after attorneys representing the IHSA and Mooseheart argued their cases at a morning hearing.
Mooseheart had three games scheduled between the ruling and Monday, including Tuesday's home game against Westminster Christian and today's game at Hinckley-Big Rock, a school that reacted to allegations Tuesday that it helped set the IHSA's eligibility investigation in motion.
IHSA executive director Marty Hickman declared the players ineligible Thursday after an investigation, contending Mooseheart inappropriately brought the students to campus for athletic reasons through the African Hoop Opportunities Providing an Education program.
"We are pleased with Judge Akemann's ruling today," Mooseheart executive director Scott Hart said in a statement after the ruling. " ... We greatly value our membership in the IHSA and look forward to our opportunity to present the IHSA Board of Directors with all the facts. Mooseheart has never brought any children to campus for athletic purposes."
Mooseheart originally was assured juniors Akim Nyang, Makur Puou and Mangisto Deng fulfilled their IHSA transfer eligibility requirements by sitting out last season, and the towering trio – Nyang stands 7-foot-1 tall, Puou is 6-10 and Deng is 6-7 – played in the Red Ramblers' first four games this season.
Mooseheart now must hope the IHSA's board of directors sees the trio's arrival in a different light than Hickman during an appea Monday at IHSA headquarters in Bloomington.
"We care about these boys and love them," Hart said. "We'd do that whether they're playing basketball or not, but it is an opportunity to get in front of the full board and tell our story. We'll lay it out on the table, and take what comes our way."
Attorney David Bressler argued at the hearing that the IHSA's investigation already has allowed for ample Mooseheart input.
"The IHSA followed its handbook and its rules, and we hope the judge does the same," Bressler said before the ruling.
Mooseheart, a residential campus that offers refuge to students from disadvantaged backgrounds, has "20 to 30 foreign-born students" on campus, Hart said, including students from Nigeria, the Republic of Congo, Sierra Leone, Ghana, Mexico and Canada. Hart said in 2011, A-HOPE reached out to Mooseheart about placing the students, not the other way around.
"If Mooseheart was an all-white school and suddenly four African boys showed up and created some type of dream team, I'd say something smells fishy there, but when you look at Mooseheart's population, we're a very diverse population," Hart said.
A fourth South Sudanese transfer student, Wal Khat, participated for the school's cross country team in the fall, winning a state medal that Hickman's ruling would negate.
Hart spoke passionately about the boys' war-torn background, saying their arrival spared them a life of being forced to be "child soldiers" and scrounging for food and water.
"To have the opportunity to come here to America, it's like they won the Powerball lottery, for them to be able to come over and get an education," Hart said.
Hinckley-Big Rock, a formidable Class 1A basketball program that could face a tougher postseason path if the transfers are allowed to keep playing, released a statement Tuesday that indicated H-BR athletic director and boys basketball coach Bill Sambrookes contacted the IHSA eight months before the season started to raise concerns about A-HOPE.
"It was never the intent of the Hinckley-Big Rock School District to attack the student athletes or Mooseheart," the school's statement read. "Our only intent was in gathering information about the A-HOPE program and the basis for participation in IHSA-sanctioned events and activities."
A-HOPE's website describes the organization as a nonprofit that provides "deserving student-athletes a seamless process of obtaining a student visa, transportation to the United States" and access to "an outstanding education."
The Mooseheart trio most recently played in last week's home opener against Leland-Earlville, a 60-45 Ramblers win after which coach Ron Ahrens raved about the way the South Sudanese players have acclimated at Mooseheart, on and off the court.
The boys have said they hope to use their basketball prowess as a way to bolster their chances to attend college in the United States.
“Them being on the floor is extremely important to them, and it’s extremely important for us to have them on the floor because that helps them develop a lot of things that we believe in, good sportsmanship, handling adversity, all that kind of stuff,” Ahrens said. “It’s been great. They’re easy to coach.”
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Sunday special
Boys track: Mooseheart's Oumaru Abdulahi puts past behind him, figures he might as well jump
May 12, 2012|By Colleen Kane | Chicago Tribune reporter
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-05-12/sports/ct-spt-0513-prep-b-track-spotlight-20120512_1_boys-track-gary-urwiler-jump
Perched in the bleachers, Oumaru Abdulahi gazed at the quaint football field and red track at Mooseheart's stadium. It was clear he had found his place within a better place.
"When I was younger I was that kid that people were like, 'Oh man, that kid is going to have troubles when he grows up,'" Abdulahi said. "But people here, they said, 'He can do well. I see a leader in him. I'm going to push him to be the leader he can be.' I appreciate that."
Ten years ago, before the success on the football field and a state high jump title, it wasn't so easy for the 8-year-old to grasp the realities that prompted Gassimu Abdulahi to send some of his children to live at the west suburban school for kids in need.
Gassimu was raising five children on his own after Oumaru's mother died of hepatitis when Oumaru was a little more than a year old. The father had moved his family from war in Sierra Leone to war in Liberia to a bad neighborhood in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, where it encountered new struggles.
"We were in the midst of drug selling, people being killed," Gassimu said. "We see sometimes them putting the crime scene tape around the houses. We came from war, and it was traumatizing for my kids to see these things. I wanted them to be good kids. I don't want them to be like kids around my neighborhood."
Gassimu learned of Mooseheart, a residential childcare facility for children of all ages. Oumaru followed his older brother, Karidu, to the school with the promise he would be able to play in a park with other children, a luxury considering he was used to spending his afternoons shut in his home while his father worked or went to school.
The outgoing Oumaru often found himself in trouble at his new school. Karidu, a former wrestler who is five years Oumaru's senior, began taking his younger brother to work out with him, and Oumaru channeled his energies into athletics.
Oumaru is a starting running back for the football team and a point guard for the basketball team, but his biggest talent lies in the high jump, an event his roommate encouraged him to try after noticing his jumping ability on the basketball court.
He cleared 6 feet, 2 inches in eighth grade and finished third in Class 1A as a freshman. Last season, as a sophomore, he jumped 6-8 to win the 1A state title, Mooseheart's first boys track state champion since 1958.
"It's an outlet for kids who struggle to find their niche or their place," said Gary Urwiler, Mooseheart's football coach and superintendent of education. "It works well when you're gifted like Oumaru. … Athletics have shaped him and given him additional opportunities that not a lot of us get to experience."
Oumaru suffered several shoulder injuries during the last few years, but they didn't keep him out for long.
Urwiler recalled waking up the morning after Oumaru went to the emergency room for a dislocated shoulder. He walked across the street to find Oumaru on his front porch, lifting weights.
"I'm like, 'Stop it man, just stop,' " Urwiler said with a smile. "So I don't know how much it set him back. He is just driven. Not a lot of things are going to hold him down. If he hurts his shoulder he'll say, 'I can still work my legs, let's go.'"
Oumaru had shoulder surgery after this football season. He missed basketball season, but the 5-8 junior was in good enough shape to clear 6-10 in his first meet this track season and is hoping for 7 feet during next week's sectional or at the state track meet.
He has plans to compete in track at the next level, but his real concern is focusing on his intended major of acting, a seemingly good fit for the enthusiastic young man who befriended and took photos with his competitors at the 2011 state meet, according to track coach Curt Schlinkmann. He is considering Indiana, UCLA, DePaul, Iowa and North Carolina for the next stop on a journey he is glad his father had the foresight to start for him.
Gassimu, now a nursing assistant living in Raleigh, N.C., said he's proud of the sports feats of his son, whom he sees on vacations from school.
"My dad always tells me, 'A fool falls down and stays down on the ground, but a wise man gets back up,' " Oumaru said. "I have made many mistakes. I'm not perfect. But to get back up and correct my mistakes, and to be self-motivated, that's the proudest thing I've done."
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Kid can jump....kid also averaged 1 PPG in two college basketball seasons.
Will be cool having the bros together, but Olympics trump playing DePaul & Creighton
If he can rebound I don't care how many points he scores.... and his basketball scholarship is allowing him to jump with athletes that have sponsors paying for their training.
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"to blow away the competition away by over five inches."
yep. thats pretty darn significant in high jumping.
talk about raising the bar for his competition.
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"to blow away the competition away by over five inches."
yep. thats pretty darn significant in high jumping.
talk about raising the bar for his competition.
Witnessing world-class athleticism in a "normal" setting is pretty humbling.
As, a youngster, I had an acquaintance who was the best female swimmer in the world while she was still in high school. Her freshman year, she broke the state high school record in the 500 freestyle by over a minute. She would be a household name now, but f*cking Jimmy Carter and his boycott of the 1980 Olympics....
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His second attempt of 7 feet, 1 inch broke the all-time Marquette record and his next attempt solidified Ellenson as the highest jumper in MU history.
Copy editing is fundamental.
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Witnessing world-class athleticism in a "normal" setting is pretty humbling.
As, a youngster, I had an acquaintance who was the best female swimmer in the world while she was still in high school. Her freshman year, she broke the state high school record in the 500 freestyle by over a minute. She would be a household name now, but f*cking Jimmy Carter and his boycott of the 1980 Olympics....
You knew Esther Williams?
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Witnessing world-class athleticism in a "normal" setting is pretty humbling.
As, a youngster, I had an acquaintance who was the best female swimmer in the world while she was still in high school. Her freshman year, she broke the state high school record in the 500 freestyle by over a minute. She would be a household name now, but f*cking Jimmy Carter and his boycott of the 1980 Olympics....
Cynthia Woodhead?
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Cynthia Woodhead?
Tracy Caulkins.
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Coach Allen was a very good man and loved Marquette deeply. He and his brother Bob are the only two brothers in the Marquette hall of fame. He coached for 11 years and during that time he was also a full time NML agent. Coaching at the D1 level is a full time job, but somehow he managed to do both. Eventually though it was too tough trying to do two full time jobs and that is why his coaching career wasn't longer. After leaving coaching he still continued to support Marquette athletics and he worked extremely hard helping to raise money for valley fields, of which much of the money was donated by track alumni.
Appreciate the background
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You knew Esther Williams?
She was awesome in Day of the Dolphin, Jaws and Free Willie.
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The new track and field rankings are out and Wally has some competition ...
http://www.ustfccca.org/assets/rankings/div1/2015-itf/DI_2015_indWk1_TF_NationalRankingsByEvent.pdf
(page 11)
1 Wally ELLENSON SO Marquette 2.28m 7-5¾ Jan 17
1 Jacorian DUFFIELD SR Texas Tech 2.28m 7-5¾ Jan 24
3 Christoff BRYAN FR Kansas State 2.25m 7-4½ Jan 17
4 Jonathan WELLS FR Illinois 2.20m 7-2½ Jan 17
4 Kyle LANDON SO Southern Illinois 2.20m 7-2½ Dec 6
6 NaTron GIPSON FR Kansas State 2.19m 7-2¼ Jan 17
7 Avion JONES JR East Carolina 2.18m 7-1¾ Dec 6
7 Bradley ADKINS JR Texas Tech 2.18m 7-1¾ Jan 24
7 Trey MCRAE SR Charlotte 2.18m 7-1¾ Jan 23
10 Deante KEMPER SR Northern Arizona 2.17m 7-1½ Jan 16
10 Taylor SMITH SO Air Force 2.17m 7-1½ Jan 22
The list shows the top 25 jumps so far this track season.
Top make the top 25 you have to have a jump of 2.15m (7' 0.5"). This past weekend MU sophomore jumper Oumaru Abdulahi cleared 2.10m (6' 10.75").
Note that Abdulahi is 5' 8" so he jumped 14 inches over his height. Wally jumped 12 inches over his height.
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Note that Abdulahi is 5' 8" so he jumped 14 inches over his height. Wally jumped 12 inches over his height.
So, back to basketball.... ;D
Is it a forgone conclusion that Wally will have the highest vertical reach on the team on the team next year? In other words, will he be taking the tipoff next year, or will there be another guy whose inferior jumping skill (compared to Wally's) is more than compensated by additional height?
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So, back to basketball.... ;D
Is it a forgone conclusion that Wally will have the highest vertical reach on the team on the team next year? In other words, will he be taking the tipoff next year, or will there be another guy whose inferior jumping skill (compared to Wally's) is more than compensated by additional height?
It might be that part of how he can leap so high in a high jump is technique that you can't use in some basketball scenarios. He's obviously a high-flyer, but he might only be world/Olympic-caliber if he can approach and leap in the manner of a high jump.
Anyone have experience as an actual high jumper that might be relevant to how directly transferable the leaping ability is across the two sports?
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Maybe let him take a running start for the tip? ;D
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Maybe let him take a running start for the tip? ;D
Check the rule book...does it say that it has two be one of the two guys in the center that has to tap the ball? Maybe Wally could get a running start ouside the circle, and Henry could slide over to one side at just the right moment..... ;D
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Maybe let him take a running start for the tip? ;D
As I understand it, the high jump has three parts
1) horizontal speed
2) Jump/explosive takeoff
3) technique
When you are of Wally's caliber, you are outstanding at all three. The question for tip-offs is how good is he at #2. I don't know the answer as I have not seen enough of him.
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The US Track & Field Coaches Association website had a nice write-up about Wally last week ...
http://www.ustfccca.org/2015/01/featured/didyouseethat-the-college-tf-weekends-best-moments
Marquette Basketball Player, Multiple-Time All-American High Jumper Ellenson Sets Collegiate Lead
The football/track & field dual-sport setup is a fairly common one [we’ll soon publish our week-by-week list of the top football players in college track by event], but the basketball/track & field double is far less common.
Marquette high jumper Wally Ellenson is a prime example of how it can work, though. When last we saw Ellenson, he was wearing a Minnesota uniform and leaping to an NCAA Outdoors runner-up finish in the high jump. The 6-6 guard – who cites basketball as his main sport – transferred to Marquette (in his home state of Wisconsin) this past year, and is currently sitting out the basketball season by NCAA rule.
That opens up much more time for him to compete on the indoor track circuit, at least this year. He made the most of his Marquette debut – just his third indoor track meet in three years – with a collegiate-leading and career-best leap of 7-5¾ (2.28m) on his first attempt at the Wisconsin Open. He missed his three attempts at 7-7 (2.31m).
Watch the clearance here:
http://youtu.be/6SdHc4gH_h4
How do his high-jumping abilities translate to the basketball court? Here’s a couple of examples:
http://youtu.be/VMpXmkhuXks
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So, back to basketball.... ;D
Is it a forgone conclusion that Wally will have the highest vertical reach on the team on the team next year? In other words, will he be taking the tipoff next year, or will there be another guy whose inferior jumping skill (compared to Wally's) is more than compensated by additional height?
It's a good question; I think he could dominate the tip if he worked at it a little bit.
The question will be whether Wojo feels winning the opening tip would be enough advantage to have him out there for the first few possessions. That assumes, of course, Wojo won't consider Wally one of his best five next year.
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It might be that part of how he can leap so high in a high jump is technique that you can't use in some basketball scenarios. He's obviously a high-flyer, but he might only be world/Olympic-caliber if he can approach and leap in the manner of a high jump.
Anyone have experience as an actual high jumper that might be relevant to how directly transferable the leaping ability is across the two sports?
My wife was a high jumper for Marquette, but her vertical is terrible. Passed it on to my daughter, who has the highest high jump in her grade at her school but can't jump vertically a lick.
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My wife was a high jumper for Marquette, but her vertical is terrible. Passed it on to my daughter, who has the highest high jump in her grade at her school but can't jump vertically a lick.
Can't make sick dunks like this if you have no vertical:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x-cA9cCZps&x-yt-ts=1421914688&x-yt-cl=84503534
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All about technique. I had a pretty good vertical from my volleyball days but couldnt high jump worth a damn just because I couldnt contort my body that way.
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Can't make sick dunks like this if you have no vertical:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x-cA9cCZps&x-yt-ts=1421914688&x-yt-cl=84503534
I keep wondering how he didn't hit his head on the backboard on that one...
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All about technique. I had a pretty good vertical from my volleyball days but couldnt high jump worth a damn just because I couldnt contort my body that way.
And that's what really gets some of the guys to ridiculous heights. As keefe and other aviators like to say, flying is a war against gravity and high jumping is no different. The reason those guys bend like a noodle over the bar is to keep their center of gravity low -- as your butt passes over the bar, your center of gravity is passing under it, because at that instant, your head and your feet may be a foot or two below the bar. So in the physics sense, the guy who "bends" less going over the bar has to do more work -- and expend more energy -- because his center of gravity has to be lifted higher in the air. That's also why most high jumpers are in the tall, svelte mold of Wally -- it helps when your center of gravity is already high off the ground.
But Heisenberg is right - explosiveness is huge. I'd love to see Wally's standing vert.
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Thinking out loud ....
It is similar to world class sprinters (100m/200m). You would not believe how "slow" their 40 times are ... Usain Bolt's 40 time is supposedly in the 4.3 to 4.4 range (I say supposedly because he rarely does this distance for time). Justin Galtin is supposedly around 4.5 (Galtin is the top US sprinter and the 2004 Olympic gold medalist).
While these times would get a WR or D-back to laugh at how slow they are, WR and D-back cannot comprehend how high these sprinters top end speed is. Bolt is approaching 28 MPH and his second hundred 100m in the 200m sprint is run around 8.8 seconds. His 40 equivalent at that top end speed is around 3.6 to 3.8. He is literally running at the limits of the human body and if you watch enough track (like I do) you can see some horrific crashes in the 200 when these guys exceed the limit of their body in the second 200.
Sprinting is not about explosive quick speed (like the 40) but about unbelievable top end speeds at the end of the race.
Likewise short jumpers (MU's 5' 8" Oumaru Abdulahi) and jumpers with average standing verticals can do extraordinarily well if they are good at the other aspects of high jumping (horizontal speed and technique).
This is a long winded way of saying Wally could be outstanding or very average at the tip-off ... and still be a world class high jumper either way.
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You knew Esther Williams?
This made me laugh.
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I am confused as to why Wally can compete in track, yet has to sit out for basketball? Are transfer rules different for track? If he is already competing in track, does that mean his last year here he would be playing basketball but could not be playing track since he has used up his eligibility?
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I am confused as to why Wally can compete in track, yet has to sit out for basketball? Are transfer rules different for track? If he is already competing in track, does that mean his last year here he would be playing basketball but could not be playing track since he has used up his eligibility?
In most of the sports, you can have a one time transfer exception and be eligible to compete right away if the school you transferred from gives you a release, which most schools do. Basketball and football you have to sit out a year no matter what.
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Im sure this has been investigated prior, but if MU could give Wally a full ride in Track (not sure if they can) couldn't he have walked on in basketball and played this year---essentially skating the transfer sit out rule? This obviously did not happen, so I think I know the answer.
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Im sure this has been investigated prior, but if MU could give Wally a full ride in Track (not sure if they can) couldn't he have walked on in basketball and played this year---essentially skating the transfer sit out rule? This obviously did not happen, so I think I know the answer.
He'd still have to sit out even with being a walk-on (Jake Thomas, Dave Singleton as examples).
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Im sure this has been investigated prior, but if MU could give Wally a full ride in Track (not sure if they can) couldn't he have walked on in basketball and played this year---essentially skating the transfer sit out rule? This obviously did not happen, so I think I know the answer.
Basketball and football players cannot receive athletic scholarships from other sports and walk-on to basketball/football so that schools can't stash players in track, soccer, tennis, etc. When Marcus West joined the Marquette basketball team, he had to give up his soccer scholarship to get a basketball scholarship and then walk-on to the soccer team.
I believe the hierarchy is 1) football, 2) basketball, 3) everything else. I don't know if there are differences between hockey, soccer, or any of the other sports but for sure Wally cannot get a track scholarship and walk-on to the basketball team. Otherwise Wojo could land 3 recruits and then offer "track" scholarships to some "walk-ons" and defraud the system by getting MU coaches and admin to go along with it.
Also, a football player can walk-on to the basketball team but a basketball player cannot walk-on for football. The player would need to get a football scholarship and could then walk-on to the basketball team. At least that is my understanding of how things work.
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Yeah, yeah. The difference Bleu is that I know exactly where I was and what I was watching that wonderful Monday night in 1977. Young pup. ;D
Glow, if you were on campus and remember that night, you were one of the few that did. Beer flowed even more freely than the rain that came that night right as the game ended.
Few remember a track meet decades later. Most of us who were on campus remember the last three weeks of March 1977. WE WANT IT BACK!!!!!!!!
I think with Wojo we have a fighting chance of getting there again.
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As I understand it, the high jump has three parts
1) horizontal speed
2) Jump/explosive takeoff
3) technique
When you are of Wally's caliber, you are outstanding at all three. The question for tip-offs is how good is he at #2. I don't know the answer as I have not seen enough of him.
There is quite a difference at times between high jumping ability in the track sense and a standing vertical jump (tip-off). It's pretty common for people to be far better jumping off one foot as opposed to two, or vice versa. Most of the dunks I've seen from Wally are one-footed jumps on the run, whereas a lot of basketball players jump stop and explode off two. I suspect Wally is far better than the average person still off two feet, but it doesn't necessarily translate that he is world-class off of two just because he is a great high jumper.
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Basketball and football players cannot receive athletic scholarships from other sports and walk-on to basketball/football so that schools can't stash players in track, soccer, tennis, etc. When Marcus West joined the Marquette basketball team, he had to give up his soccer scholarship to get a basketball scholarship and then walk-on to the soccer team.
I believe the hierarchy is 1) football, 2) basketball, 3) everything else. I don't know if there are differences between hockey, soccer, or any of the other sports but for sure Wally cannot get a track scholarship and walk-on to the basketball team. Otherwise Wojo could land 3 recruits and then offer "track" scholarships to some "walk-ons" and defraud the system by getting MU coaches and admin to go along with it.
Also, a football player can walk-on to the basketball team but a basketball player cannot walk-on for football. The player would need to get a football scholarship and could then walk-on to the basketball team. At least that is my understanding of how things work.
Ok--thanks for the info.
I thought I saw on ESPN 30 for 30--either the "U" or the "U2" where Miami gave some players track scholarships and they walked on to the football team, due to lack of scholarships. Don't know how they did that or if it was just cuz they are the U.
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Ok--thanks for the info.
I thought I saw on ESPN 30 for 30--either the "U" or the "U2" where Miami gave some players track scholarships and they walked on to the football team, due to lack of scholarships. Don't know how they did that or if it was just cuz they are the U.
That was a slightly different situation. The two Miami players Aaron Moser and Santana Moss arrived under track scholarships. They didn't play football (and wouldn't have been able to) until a football scholarship opened up. The track scholarships were simply to get them on campus for one open scholarship.
Apparently, Miami was holding one scholarship for the two of them, Moser wound up not getting the football scholarship, and Moss got the scholarship instead.
But he didn't play football under a track scholarship.
http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/1997-09-19/sports/9709190027_1_scholarship-aaron-moser-santana-moss
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Wally is scheduled to Jump Saturday afternoon (Feb 7) at Notre Dame's Meyo Invitational.
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nd/sports/c-track/auto_pdf/2014-15/depth_chart_event/depth_chart_20150205aaa.pdf
(see event #32 No. 18 on page 22)
This a one of the top NCAA indoor track meets and will be streamed live on Flotrack.org
http://www.flotrack.org/coverage/251950
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Wally is scheduled to Jump Saturday afternoon (Feb 7) at Notre Dame's Meyo Invitational.
http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nd/sports/c-track/auto_pdf/2014-15/depth_chart_event/depth_chart_20150205aaa.pdf
(see event #32 No. 18 on page 22)
This a one of the top NCAA indoor track meets and will be streamed live on Flotrack.org
http://www.flotrack.org/coverage/251950
Thanks Heisenberg. I had heard he would only be jumping at Big East and NCAA's, but your are correct and he is definitely jumping and I will be spectating at the meet so will get to see him jump in person.
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Give us updates!!
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So what were the announcers saying during the Villanova game about Wally trying to jump over MacIllvaine? I had the sound down at that point and only caught part of it.
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For midnight madness next October, Homer suggested that Wally high jump over Jim Mac (7' 1"). Rafferty was repeating the story. Rafferty also said he is friends with Homer and has known him forever.
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Onions in the face!!
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I believe the hierarchy is 1) football, 2) basketball, 3) everything else.
It goes a little deeper than that... don't know that it's ever relevant though...
Football, BBall, Men's ice hockey, women's volleyball, men's water polo and swimming [count swimming if both], others
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Wally won the Notre Dame Meyo Invitational this afternoon meet with a jump of 2.15m (7' 0.5"). Just enough to clear Jim Mac!
http://results.deltatiming.com/tf/2015-meyo-invitational/150206F032
While it was off his 2.28m (7' 5.75") world qualifying mark three weeks ago, let's remember that he WON one of the country's top meets. He beat some very good jumpers in the process.
A basketball analogy is you won the S16 game to make the E8 but it wasn't a pretty game. Hey, you won a S16 game!!
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Wally won the Notre Dame Meyo Invitational this afternoon meet with a jump of 2.15m (7' 0.5"). Just enough to clear Jim Mac!
http://results.deltatiming.com/tf/2015-meyo-invitational/150206F032
While it was off his 2.28m (7' 5.75") world qualifying mark three weeks ago, let's remember that he WON one of the country's top meets. He beat some very good jumpers in the process.
A basketball analogy is you won the S16 game to make the E8 but it wasn't a pretty game. Hey, you won a S16 game!!
While I didn't see his first meet in person, I did see the video from that meet and was at this meet in person. A few points to make:
1) He definitely did not look like he had the springs today that he did at Madison. Practicing for two different sports means he is going to be a bit tired at times and today he looked it.
2) He most likely would have made the next height of 7'1 3/4", but he passed at that height and went straight to 7'3" and missed all three of his attempts, although two of them were close.
3) The Notre Dame high jump pit is on their indoor practice football facility, with field turf. They put boards down with a rubberized surface for the approach to the high jump pit. This is definitely not an ideal approach compared to a regular track surface and that may have had something to do with him not jumping as high today.
4) From what I understand, he will jump in two more indoor meets, at Big East and NCAA's.
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4) From what I understand, he will jump in two more indoor meets, at Big East and NCAA's.
Are the Big East and NCAAs the two indoor meets or is it 2 indoor meets plus the Big East and NCAAs?
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Are the Big East and NCAAs the two indoor meets or is it 2 indoor meets plus the Big East and NCAAs?
The BE and NCAA indoor meets, plus likely the entire outdoor season (which begins in late March). MU has 11 outdoor meets, plus the BE outdoors, then the NCAAs. The outdoor stuff begins around the time of the Final Four, so MU hoops will likely be long done.
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Are the Big East and NCAAs the two indoor meets or is it 2 indoor meets plus the Big East and NCAAs?
Sorry, as I read what I wrote it could have been read either way, but as the above poster said it is just the Big East and NCAA's that he has left for indoors. I am guessing he won't jump in every outdoor meet since there will still be some basketball activities and I also don't think they want him jumping if the weather is bad and that can certainly be the case in the spring in the Midwest.
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This is for anyone that is interested in the high jump
Mutaz Essa Barshim of Quatar cleared 2.41m yesterday in Asia. (7' 11") and then had the bar raised to a new world indoor record of 2.44m (8' 0.6"). He was gunning for a world recrod that has held since 1989 and he narrowly missed. He's not done trying to set a new WR.
http://www.westmeathindependent.ie/news/roundup/articles/2015/02/19/4035882-what-gravity-mutaz-thrills-athlone/
Someone used Photoshop to put 2.41M (7' 11") jump into prospective.
(http://rack.1.mshcdn.com/media/ZgkyMDE0LzA5LzExL2E4L0J4UVNpV19JRUFFLjM2NTkyLmpwZwpwCXRodW1iCTEyMDB4OTYwMD4/65b508dd/04e/BxQSiW_IEAEOMIt.jpg)
(http://rack.1.mshcdn.com/media/ZgkyMDE0LzA5LzExL2FlL0J4TjBCeEhDRUFFLmMyYzU4LmpwZwpwCXRodW1iCTEyMDB4OTYwMD4/ae99f73b/2cd/BxN0BxHCEAEnAXg.jpg)
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This is for anyone that is interested in the high jump
Mutaz Essa Barshim of Quatar cleared 2.41m yesterday in Asia. (7' 11") and then had the bar raised to a new world indoor record of 2.44m (8' 0.6"). He was gunning for a world recrod that has held since 1989 and he narrowly missed. He's not done trying to set a new WR.
http://www.westmeathindependent.ie/news/roundup/articles/2015/02/19/4035882-what-gravity-mutaz-thrills-athlone/
Someone used Photoshop to put 2.41M (7' 11") jump into prospective.
(http://rack.1.mshcdn.com/media/ZgkyMDE0LzA5LzExL2E4L0J4UVNpV19JRUFFLjM2NTkyLmpwZwpwCXRodW1iCTEyMDB4OTYwMD4/65b508dd/04e/BxQSiW_IEAEOMIt.jpg)
(http://rack.1.mshcdn.com/media/ZgkyMDE0LzA5LzExL2FlL0J4TjBCeEhDRUFFLmMyYzU4LmpwZwpwCXRodW1iCTEyMDB4OTYwMD4/ae99f73b/2cd/BxN0BxHCEAEnAXg.jpg)
Those are cool pix, but since a basketball hoop is 10 feet high and that appears to be only a foot or so lower, it's not exactly accurate. Cool, though.
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No, the bar looks about 24 inches lower. But to clear that bar the top of his body was would just about touch the rim.
Oh ... lower the bar 6 inches and you have Wally 2.28 (7' 5.75") clearance.
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Marquette Athletics @muathletics 19m19 minutes ago
.@MUTFXC in action on Friday at UWM and NCAA's top high jumper Wally Ellenson will compete. Meet starts at 4 p.m.
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Marquette Athletics @muathletics 19m19 minutes ago
.@MUTFXC in action on Friday at UWM and NCAA's top high jumper Wally Ellenson will compete. Meet starts at 4 p.m.
I was just going to post that as well. Confirmed with the track coach and he is definitely jumping today.
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Glow, if you were on campus and remember that night, you were one of the few that did. Beer flowed even more freely than the rain that came that night right as the game ended.
Few remember a track meet decades later. Most of us who were on campus remember the last three weeks of March 1977. WE WANT IT BACK!!!!!!!!
I think with Wojo we have a fighting chance of getting there again.
Sorry. Hadn't seen this. Too young to be on campus. Used my one skip in drivers ed.to watch the game on TV with my alumni folks.
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The coach was guessing Wally won't be jumping until closer to 6 even though the meet starts at 4, if anyone is interested in watching a potential national champion right here in Milwaukee at the Klotsche center.
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As expected, Wally won the high jump last night, coming straight from basketball practice to the meet. He set the field house record at the Klotsche Center. Did anyone get a chance to go see him? Here is what was written about his winning jump from gomarquette.com:
"The highlight was Wally's big jump," Rogers added. "It was even more impressive as he came right over from hoops practice and then jumped so well."
Everyone had eyes on Wally Ellenson, who competed in the high jump for the first time in two weeks. The dual-sport athlete is a BIG EAST Championship hopeful in the even and he began his night by entering at 2.01 meters, clearing it with ease. He then cleared his next two heights on the first try before the bar was raised to 2.16 meters, which equated to slightly over 7 feet.
Ellenson watched as his two remaining competitors missed all three of their attempts at the height, while he needed just one try once again and broke the Klotsche Center record in the process. Having locked up the high jump title, the Rice Lake, Wisconsin native would attempt 7 feet, 3 inches (2.21 meters) and needed two attempts to clear the mark. He fell just shy of clearing 7 feet, 4.5 inches (2.26 meters), bumping the bar ever so slightly in each of his three attempts.
Ellenson remains tied for the national lead at 7 feet, 5.75 inches (2.28 meters), which he cleared at the Wisconsin Open back on Jan. 17, in Madison.
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Big East Champ, new conf record 7' 3.25"
MU also had runner up Max Kilpin
http://results.armorytrack.com/armory/2015/big-east/150228F039.htm
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Congrats Wally! Great day for MU athletics!
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Congrats Wally and also to MU jumper Max Kilpin for finishing second. Wally beat the next best non-MU jumper by 6.5 inches!
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Hope Wally can hoop, as well, to go along with his jumpin', ai na?
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Steve Wojciechowski @steve_wojo 2h2 hours ago
Congrats to Wally on his BIG EAST high jump title! Proud to have him with #mubb too. http://youtu.be/Di2lXS0aI1s
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Hope Wally can hoop, as well, to go along with his jumpin', ai na?
Wally never really had a shot at Minnesota. His freshman year he struggled with injuries and by the time he was healthy he was at the end of an experienced rotation that went to the NCAAs. His sophomore year he was written off by the new coach before he ever had a chance. I know they are old evaluations, but here's what was said about him 3 years ago as a high school recruit:
Strengths: Ellenson is a versatile lefty wing that has good size length and strength and is an excellent 3 point shooter that can get hot when spotting up on the break, coming off screens or spacing on the side of dribble penetration. Ellenson is athletic enough to finish above the rim on the break and competes and plays with toughness. Ellenson is a good perimeter offensive rebounder and is capable of defending both wing positions.
Weaknesses: Ellenson is a decent driver but must work to be more affective scorer off the dribble. He must also continue to build strength as well.
Bottom Line: Ellenson is a versatile wing that can knock down shots from beyond the arc. He has good size, strength and athletic ability and is a capable of defending both wing positions. Ellenson must continue to build his game off the dribble but has good upside.
Other pre-Minnesota articles:
http://www.gopherhole.com/news_article/show/99879?referrer_id=388419
https://www.facebook.com/notes/minnesota-mens-basketball/future-gopher-wally-ellenson-to-appear-in-high-school-slam-dunk-3-point-champion/10150759152637780
http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2011-08-15/wally-ellenson-commits-to-minnesota
http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/215193/Wally-Ellenson-Commits-To-Minnesota
Who knows how good he'll be. Obviously he never caught on at Minnesota, but if he can be a decent shooter, a good defender, and can help our offensive rebounding, it's entirely possible that Wally will help Marquette at more than just high jump. He could be another kid who excelled in HS and was overrated coming out, but I do think he has some legitimate potential and value.