MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: buckchuckler on December 07, 2014, 05:04:01 PM
-
Anyone have any big theories? Takes on what has happened so far this offseason?
I'd look for the Dodgers to be active, they have what, 5-6 outfielders, I personally hope the White Sox are in on Kemp. Not sure what they'd have to give up, and if they'd have the stomach for it. That conversation may start with Quintana, or Alexei. Not really sure. Crawford may be a good fit too to platoon with Viciedo, but I wouldn't give up too much for him and the Dodgers would have to eat a huge chunk of his salary.
The Sox are also rumored to be looking at a big move on the pitching front. Either Scherzer or Shields will be big expenses, but the Sox are pretty low on payroll, so it may be within reason. They have also been linked to Samardzija. They have a big need for a RH starter.
The Sox also need a bullpen arm or two, I would really expect some help to arrive there. Not sure it will be Robertson or anyone that high profile.
Any takes on what the Brewers, Cubs (other than Lester) or Cards (or whoever else) will be doing?
Big moves by Boston already (Panda and Hanley), neither without their flaws, but both will help.
Boston also seems likely to trade Cespedes.
Yanks replaced Jeter with Gregorious.
Should be a fun week! Or a complete let down, only time will tell!
-
Tigers trade Price for a high caliber corner outfielder and re-sign Scherzer.
-
Tigers trade Price for a high caliber corner outfielder and re-sign Scherzer.
Interesting. Which one would you rather have? Price is actually younger, left handed, and actually a little more consistent. Price has 1 more year before free agency, both will command huge contracts. It is an interesting comparison.
Personally I think I'd rather hold on to Price.
Any chance they trade Verlander and keep both? Or do you think they can't afford to sell so low on him? He sure has a lot of money (140 million) coming to him over the next 5 years. That may almost make him untrade-able.
-
Given Verlander's drop in velocity and effectiveness I wouldn't take Him off the Tiger's hands unless they payed a bunch of his salary, let alone trade something for him.
-
Verlander isn't going anywhere. He is healthy this offseason as opposed to last. The last half of '13 he was struggling with an ab weakness, though the tear didn't occur until the offseason. Then he spent last year recovering. I look for his velocity to be back and for him to win 18 games. I would trade Price because he didn't seem comfortable as a Tiger. Scherzer has always had good chemistry with the rest of the team. But this is all theoretical. More likely, Scherzer moves on and the Tigers grab a corner outfielder at the meetings for a couple of minor leaguers.
-
Don't think Kate figures Verlander has lost any off his fastball, hey?
-
Brewers are probably done unless they add a utility man or reliever. But nothing big.
They have talked with Boston about Allen Craig, but unless the BoSox want to dump him for nothing, it won't happen.
The Yankees, Red Sox and Angels will be the main players for the big starters out there. Business as usual.
-
Interesting. Which one would you rather have? Price is actually younger, left handed, and actually a little more consistent. Price has 1 more year before free agency, both will command huge contracts. It is an interesting comparison.
Personally I think I'd rather hold on to Price.
Any chance they trade Verlander and keep both? Or do you think they can't afford to sell so low on him? He sure has a lot of money (140 million) coming to him over the next 5 years. That may almost make him untrade-able.
I would take Price over Scherzer because of his consistent ability to go deep into games. However I think tower is correct that shipping Price and re-signing Max is the more likely outcome with Illitch and Dave Dombrowski running the show.
-
White sox ink Josh Robertson to a four year/$46 million contract, as well as reportedly about to trade Semien, Bassitt, and a third player for Jeff Samardzija.
http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/12002705/chicago-white-sox-acquire-jeff-samardzija-david-robertson
I gotta say the White Sox have done exceptionally well in addressing the pitching issues already, they look like they'll be able to contend in the AL central again finally.
-
White sox ink Josh Robertson to a four year/$46 million contract, as well as reportedly about to trade Semien, Bassitt, and a third player for Jeff Samardzija.
http://espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/story/_/id/12002705/chicago-white-sox-acquire-jeff-samardzija-david-robertson
I gotta say the White Sox have done exceptionally well in addressing the pitching issues already, they look like they'll be able to contend in the AL central again finally.
Dave Robertson
-
Dave Robertson
ah good call. I guess I think josh robertson sounds better
-
ah good call. I guess I think josh robertson sounds better
I'm sorry to see him leaving the Yankees but CWS made him a significantly bigger offer.
-
Both good acquisitions for the Sox, but I think that's a big price for Robertson. I've never been high on any long terms deals with closers that aren't Mariano Rivera though.
Samardzija is a good pick up and will help this year, but I'd think twice about giving him the big contract he wants after this season. He's about to turn 30 next month.
Cubs resigned Hammel. If he can stay healthy it will be an okay signing. He already helped them nab Addison Russell, so maybe he can pitch well enough to lead to another prospect in two years.
-
He will be turning 30, but has thrown significantly less pitches than the other options out there. This is from Buster Olney on twitter:
Pitches thrown in reg. season: Samardzija 12,567; Lester 26,321; Scherzer 20,944; Cueto 19,518; Hamels 27,886; Price 19,336; Shields 29,461
-
He will be turning 30, but has thrown significantly less pitches than the other options out there. This is from Buster Olney on twitter:
Pitches thrown in reg. season: Samardzija 12,567; Lester 26,321; Scherzer 20,944; Cueto 19,518; Hamels 27,886; Price 19,336; Shields 29,461
Interesting point as he was a reliever early on. However, he wasn't a full-time MLBer until he was 26. Are his minor league numbers included in there?
-
He's definitely thrown less pitches, which hopefully for the Sox is meaningful, but sometimes the body does what the body does when these guys get older.
Samardzija started pitching in the minors in 2006. Remember he was a wide receiver out of Notre Dame.
Don Cooper was interviewed about the trade, saying he was excited about the trade. He then had to make a plea for fans to support them. Sad that he has to do that. The fact is, nobody wants to go out the Cell.
-
He's definitely thrown less pitches, which hopefully for the Sox is meaningful, but sometimes the body does what the body does when these guys get older.
Samardzija started pitching in the minors in 2006. Remember he was a wide receiver out of Notre Dame.
Don Cooper was interviewed about the trade, saying he was excited about the trade. He then had to make a plea for fans to support them. Sad that he has to do that. The fact is, nobody wants to go out the Cell.
Blah Blah Blah
-
Cubs win the Lester sweepstakes. For less years and money than the Giants were offering I believe. Things starting to take shape a bit on the North Side.
-
Cubs win the Lester sweepstakes. For less years and money than the Giants were offering I believe. Things starting to take shape a bit on the North Side.
Now all they need is a 2B, 2 outfielders and 4-5 more quality pitchers and they'll be a contender!
-
Now all they need is a 2B, 2 outfielders and 4-5 more quality pitchers and they'll be a contender!
Not taking the bait.
-
Now all they need is a 2B, 2 outfielders and 4-5 more quality pitchers and they'll be a contender!
Hahahahaha, this makes me happy.
-
Cubs win the Lester sweepstakes. For less years and money than the Giants were offering I believe.
Woohoo! The largest contract (6 years, 23.8 million per) ever for a pitcher not named Clayton Kershaw. For a very good, but not great, 30 year old pitcher. What a bargain!
-
Cubs win the Lester sweepstakes. For less years and money than the Giants were offering I believe. Things starting to take shape a bit on the North Side.
This is open to some interpretation. Now being reported there is a vesting option for a 7th year that would put the Cubs higher than the Giants offer.
Lester is a great weapon to have in your rotation, but man that is a lot of money. The price to play just seems crazy high sometimes. 2nd highest annual value (for a pitcher) behind only Kershaw, that is, until Scherzer signs.
And, just to tweak the Cub fans... That is a lot to pay for a guy that is more similar to Jose Quintana than he is to Chris Sale...(go ahead, look at the numbers)
Maybe Chicago baseball will be fun again this year.
-
Meanwhile back on the southside, quietly doing things like they always do in relation to the Cubs. With Duke, Robertson and the kids in the pen, it should be much improved. Finally have a right handed arm to counter Sale and Quintana. Laroche and Abreu for power.
If I were the Sox though, I would sell high on Alexi right now. His value isnt getting any better and hes already 33.
-
Meanwhile back on the southside, quietly doing things like they always do in relation to the Cubs. With Duke, Robertson and the kids in the pen, it should be much improved. Finally have a right handed arm to counter Sale and Quintana. Laroche and Abreu for power.
If I were the Sox though, I would sell high on Alexi right now. His value isnt getting any better and hes already 33.
I disagree on Alexei, the Sox are obviously trying to contend this season. Trading Alexei undoes a lot of what you have accomplished this offseason. While you may be right about his value, he also has pretty high value for the Sox. There aren't many (if any) better all around SSs in the AL. Trading Alexei would also leave void up the middle, that would make the Sox pretty thin with Sanchez and Johnson to man SS and 2nd. Hard to contend with 2 rookies up the middle. Better to let them fight it out for 2nd.
-
I disagree on Alexei, the Sox are obviously trying to contend this season. Trading Alexei undoes a lot of what you have accomplished this offseason. While you may be right about his value, he also has pretty high value for the Sox. There aren't many (if any) better all around SSs in the AL. Trading Alexei would also leave void up the middle, that would make the Sox pretty thin with Sanchez and Johnson to man SS and 2nd. Hard to contend with 2 rookies up the middle. Better to let them fight it out for 2nd.
Depending on what they can get for him, they might make out well trading Ramirez. FA Jed Lowrie wouldn't be a major step down and would come cheaper, though likely on a 2-3 year deal. He can also play 2B or 3B. Keeps SS warm until Tim Anderson is ready, assuming he stays at short.
-
All comments in typical White Sox fan fashion.
-
Now all they need is a 2B, 2 outfielders and 4-5 more quality pitchers and they'll be a contender!
It would be very funny if they ended up in last place again
-
There aren't many (if any) better all around SSs in the AL.
Alcides Escobar is in KC, so he's not in the best all-around SS in his division. I'd also rather have JJ Hardy and with Hanley Ramirez in Boston, Alexi Ramirez is probably 4th.
-
Just replacing E. Jackson with Lester is worth some wins!
Remember Arrieta finished with a 2.6 ERA Kyle Hendricks with a 2.4 (in a limited role). Add Lester into that mix, you could potentially have 3 guys with ERA's that hover around the 3 area (assuming they don't all pitch lights out). That will win you a few ball games even if the cubs continue their high strike out rate.
-
Alcides Escobar is in KC, so he's not in the best all-around SS in his division. I'd also rather have JJ Hardy and with Hanley Ramirez in Boston, Alexi Ramirez is probably 4th.
You can make cases for those guys, but you can make a case for Alexei over them as well. Escobar has no pop at all, Alexei averages 11 more HR, 5 more 2B, and 24 more RBI, and for more advanced metrics, Alexei averages about 3 WAR per season and Escobar is just over 1. Even over the last 3 years, Escobar averages just 1.9.
Hanley, well, Hanley is certainly better offensively. But he is pretty lacking defensively. His offense may well balance it out. It depends on the year I guess. His numbers have pretty significant variances. Overall he averages higher WAR, 3.6 to 3.
I must admit, I didn't factor Hanley in at all because, well he hasn't played a game in the AL since 2005.
Hardy is the best bet. Elite defender, good hitter. Averages about 2.7 WAR (again, Alexei is at 3). Hardly and Alexei are about the same in OBP (minuscule advantage to Alexei), and pretty close in SLG (slight advantage Hardy). Alexei will steal about 20 bags per season, Hardy, about 1. Again, cases can be made for either.
Personally I am a little bitter on Hardy because his complete fall off season last year killed my fantasy team.
Also, the Brewers have lost some quality SS in the last few years.
-
All comments in typical White Sox fan fashion.
Exactly....and these comments coming from fans of a team that finished worse than the Cubs in 2013 and with the same record as the Cubs in 2014 all while the Cubs were in the largest teardown and rebuild in franchise history. Sorry, but the Cubs are in a 100x better spot than the White Sox regardless of record this coming season.
-
Exactly....and these comments coming from fans of a team that finished worse than the Cubs in 2013 and with the same record as the Cubs in 2014 all while the Cubs were in the largest teardown and rebuild in franchise history. Sorry, but the Cubs are in a 100x better spot than the White Sox regardless of record this coming season.
Where do you get that from. The Cubs are so unproven you have no idea how the kids will be until they're under the lights. Sox have a good balance if vets and young guys. Wish they could have kept Simeian but still have a decent farm.
-
Exactly....and these comments coming from fans of a team that finished worse than the Cubs in 2013 and with the same record as the Cubs in 2014 all while the Cubs were in the largest teardown and rebuild in franchise history. Sorry, but the Cubs are in a 100x better spot than the White Sox regardless of record this coming season.
Very funny. The worst team in the history of baseball and they will always be the worst team in the history of baseball.
-
Where do you get that from. The Cubs are so unproven you have no idea how the kids will be until they're under the lights. Sox have a good balance if vets and young guys. Wish they could have kept Simeian but still have a decent farm.
Agreed they are unproven, but they are so stacked with young talent that at least some of it has to pan out. Additionally, their pockets are deep to spend big moving forward. I mean long term I feel the Cubs are in a better position.
-
I hate that the Red Sox didn't re-sign Jon Lester, particularly when they could have had him at 5 years/$100M if offered in the spring. But 6 years and $155M is a lot for a guy whose last four ERAs are 2.46, 3.75, 4.82 and 3.47. Seems to me you're more likely to be getting the 3.50+ ERA guy than the 2.50- ERA guy of last year. That's a lot of money for that kind of pitcher. He's got a lot of pitches on his odometer, too, though he's always been durable and is has been at his best in the biggest games.
He's one of those guys I will always wish well even though he's abandoned my favorite team.
-
I hate that the Red Sox didn't re-sign Jon Lester, particularly when they could have had him at 5 years/$100M if offered in the spring. But 6 years and $155M is a lot for a guy whose last four ERAs are 2.46, 3.75, 4.82 and 3.47. Seems to me you're more likely to be getting the 3.50+ ERA guy than the 2.50- ERA guy of last year. That's a lot of money for that kind of pitcher. He's got a lot of pitches on his odometer, too, though he's always been durable and is has been at his best in the biggest games.
He's one of those guys I will always wish well even though he's abandoned my favorite team.
I think you have to partially factor in that he is moving from the AL to the NL. Many pitchers who make that switch have a nice improvement in their stats.
-
Just replacing E. Jackson with Lester is worth some wins!
Remember Arrieta finished with a 2.6 ERA Kyle Hendricks with a 2.4 (in a limited role). Add Lester into that mix, you could potentially have 3 guys with ERA's that hover around the 3 area (assuming they don't all pitch lights out). That will win you a few ball games even if the cubs continue their high strike out rate.
If Hendricks finishes with an ERA under 4, I'd be happy...and very surprised.
-
Where do you get that from. The Cubs are so unproven you have no idea how the kids will be until they're under the lights. Sox have a good balance if vets and young guys. Wish they could have kept Simeian but still have a decent farm.
Decent farm?
(http://pp.e3.pe//ima/0/0/0/0/2/2502.gif)
-
I'm a Cubs fan and I know everybody hates us. We hate ourselves too.
But the biggest acquisition of the offseason for us happened weeks ago. Joe Maddon. If there is any case at all for eventual contention, it's Maddon.
-
Exactly....and these comments coming from fans of a team that finished worse than the Cubs in 2013 and with the same record as the Cubs in 2014 all while the Cubs were in the largest teardown and rebuild in franchise history. Sorry, but the Cubs are in a 100x better spot than the White Sox regardless of record this coming season.
This is why people can't take Cub fans seriously. "Dude we are so 100 times better than you"
Cmon really?
-
This is why people can't take Cub fans seriously. "Dude we are so 100 times better than you"
Cmon really?
Why did you use quotes when that wasn't his actual quote?
-
This is why people can't take Cub fans seriously. "Dude we are so 100 times better than you"
Cmon really?
Read the comment, I am not saying we are 100x better than you. The Sox very well will have a better record and be a better team than the Cubs next year. I am saying Cubs are in a better spot than White Sox at this juncture and in the near future. They have the best farm system in all of baseball, again I understand its unproven, but some of them will pan out. They are ripe with cash to spend moving forward. You have arguably the most unique stadium and setting for a ballpark in all of baseball with an owner who is investing $500+ million of his own $ to improve all of that. It is going to do wonders to the allure of Wrigley and the neighborhood in the coming years.
I am not trashing the White Sox and saying Cubs are 100x better, I am just saying I think the Cubs are in a better position as an entire franchise, that is all.
-
Decent farm?
(http://pp.e3.pe//ima/0/0/0/0/2/2502.gif)
Well, the Sox don't have the farm system of the Cubs to be certain, but when you've had top 10 draft picks, what 6 years in a row, you should have some high level prospects.
The Sox have some good prospects. Rodon, Tim Anderson, Micah Johnson, Frank Montas, Tyler Danish, Spencer Adams. They don't have the depth the Cubs have, but they should have guys that can contribute.
More importantly, the Sox have young talent that is contributing at the Major League level.
-
Woohoo! The largest contract (6 years, 23.8 million per) ever for a pitcher not named Clayton Kershaw. For a very good, but not great, 30 year old pitcher. What a bargain!
And that will last until Scherzer signs his contract and then Scherzer's contract will probably get passed when Price signs next year and maybe when Zimmerman signs.
Given the lack of pitching in the Cubs system and on their current roster they can either sign a top tier FA pitcher for the going rate or dish out top tier prospects. Maybe they do both, but they can't turn the corner in the rebuilding without beefing up their rotation. The Cubs hardly have any money committed to their future payroll, so they can definitely take the risk and "overspend".
-
Read the comment, I am not saying we are 100x better than you. The Sox very well will have a better record and be a better team than the Cubs next year. I am saying Cubs are in a better spot than White Sox at this juncture and in the near future. They have the best farm system in all of baseball, again I understand its unproven, but some of them will pan out. They are ripe with cash to spend moving forward. You have arguably the most unique stadium and setting for a ballpark in all of baseball with an owner who is investing $500+ million of his own $ to improve all of that. It is going to do wonders to the allure of Wrigley and the neighborhood in the coming years.
I am not trashing the White Sox and saying Cubs are 100x better, I am just saying I think the Cubs are in a better position as an entire franchise, that is all.
Even if they are in a better position, it isn't by that much. The Sox have some of the best contracts in baseball. They have great talent signed long term for very team friendly rates. Sale, Quintana, and Abreu together will make less than Lester next season. Also the are also all signed at least through 2019. They also have Avi Garcia and Adam Eaton under control until at least 2019.
With one of the best pitching prospects in baseball knocking on the door.
-
Well, the Sox don't have the farm system of the Cubs to be certain, but when you've had top 10 draft picks, what 6 years in a row, you should have some high level prospects.
The Sox have some good prospects. Rodon, Tim Anderson, Micah Johnson, Frank Montas, Tyler Danish, Spencer Adams. They don't have the depth the Cubs have, but they should have guys that can contribute.
More importantly, the Sox have young talent that is contributing at the Major League level.
If a consensus bottom third farm system is 'decent', sure. They've got nice pieces, and they're not as bad as the Brewers, but keep it realistic.
-
If a consensus bottom third farm system is 'decent', sure. They've got nice pieces, and they're not as bad as the Brewers, but keep it realistic.
Hahaha, a Cub fan saying be realistic. How droll. Please tell me what I said that wasn't realistic.
-
Hahaha, a Cub fan saying be realistic. How droll. Please tell me what I said that wasn't realistic.
I was referring back to the 'decent' farm system comment.
-
Even if they are in a better position, it isn't by that much. The Sox have some of the best contracts in baseball. They have great talent signed long term for very team friendly rates. Sale, Quintana, and Abreu together will make less than Lester next season. Also the are also all signed at least through 2019. They also have Avi Garcia and Adam Eaton under control until at least 2019.
With one of the best pitching prospects in baseball knocking on the door.
Rizzo and Castro will make less than Robertson next year.
-
I was referring back to the 'decent' farm system comment.
Well, I didn't say that. But Baseball Prospectus had the Sox 21 before last season. So not bottom 3 as you said. And that was in Feb of last season. I would say the Sox have certainly only improved since then. Frank Montas exploded, they added Spencer Adams and most notably Carlos Rodon. Probably putting them somewhere in the middle of the pack.
-
It's MLB. Money means nothing.
-
It's MLB. Money means nothing.
Really? Then why did the Red Sox offer 20 million less than the Cubs? They must think that money means something. There is no salary cap, but teams still operate within the constraints of a budget.
-
Even if they are in a better position, it isn't by that much. The Sox have some of the best contracts in baseball. They have great talent signed long term for very team friendly rates. Sale, Quintana, and Abreu together will make less than Lester next season. Also the are also all signed at least through 2019. They also have Avi Garcia and Adam Eaton under control until at least 2019.
With one of the best pitching prospects in baseball knocking on the door.
Even if the Sox are in a better position, it isn't by that much. They have great talent signed long term for very team friendly rates. Arrieta, Rizzo and Castro together will make less than John Danks. Also they are also all signed at least through 2018. They also have Soler, Baez and Arismendy til 2020. Kris Bryant and Addison Russell to come.
You can do this with any team.
I don't understand why White Sox fans have this issue, they cannot enjoy Chicago baseball.
-
Really? Then why did the Red Sox offer 20 million less than the Cubs? They must think that money means something. There is no salary cap, but teams still operate within the constraints of a budget.
Why did the Giants offer more than the Cubs?
Unless you're small market, it really doesn't matter.
-
And that will last until Scherzer signs his contract and then Scherzer's contract will probably get passed when Price signs next year and maybe when Zimmerman signs.
Given the lack of pitching in the Cubs system and on their current roster they can either sign a top tier FA pitcher for the going rate or dish out top tier prospects. Maybe they do both, but they can't turn the corner in the rebuilding without beefing up their rotation. The Cubs hardly have any money committed to their future payroll, so they can definitely take the risk and "overspend".
This is true. The Cubs are among a handful of teams who can afford to overspend. The Sox don't have that luxury.
I would say that both side of town should be ecstatic with the off season. For now, they're the two biggest winners in MLB.
-
This is true. The Cubs are among a handful of teams who can afford to overspend. The Sox don't have that luxury.
I would say that both side of town should be ecstatic with the off season. For now, they're the two biggest winners in MLB.
+1
I'm jacked about baseball season, both sides of town.
-
This is true. The Cubs are among a handful of teams who can afford to overspend. The Sox don't have that luxury.
I would say that both side of town should be ecstatic with the off season. For now, they're the two biggest winners in MLB.
Gammons was on MLB network the other night talking about the summer in Chicago when both sides are competitive and it made me all warm and fuzzy.
-
Even if the Sox are in a better position, it isn't by that much. They have great talent signed long term for very team friendly rates. Arrieta, Rizzo and Castro together will make less than John Danks. Also they are also all signed at least through 2018. They also have Soler, Baez and Arismendy til 2020. Kris Bryant and Addison Russell to come.
You can do this with any team.
I don't understand why White Sox fans have this issue, they cannot enjoy Chicago baseball.
OK well, I never said the Sox were in a better position. And I definitely never said anything completely silly like they are in a position 100x better. That is really the big difference.
And Arrieta (really great young talent? He is gonna be 29 with one good year to his credit.) Rizzo and Castro will make about 15 million (depending on where Arrieta ends in arb) and that is actually more than Danks (minimally, but none the less, and only 2 more seasons of that contract)
And while you can do that with any team, you can't say it referring to a Cy Young caliber pitcher and an MVP calibler hitter.
And really? This is an issue with White Sox fans? Yeah, the Cub fans here have done nothing to belittle the Sox.
-
Gammons was on MLB network the other night talking about the summer in Chicago when both sides are competitive and it made me all warm and fuzzy.
I agree, like I said, it will be great to have a fun baseball season in Chicago.
-
Nevermind...
-
OK well, I never said the Sox were in a better position. And I definitely never said anything completely silly like they are in a position 100x better. And Arrieta (really great young talent? He is gonna be 29 with one good year to his credit.) Rizzo and Castro will make about 15 million (depending on where Arrieta ends in arb) and that is actually more than Danks.
And while you can do that with any team, you can't say it referring to a Cy Young caliber pitcher and an MVP calibler hitter.
And really? This is an issue with White Sox fans? Yeah, the Cub fans here have done nothing to belittle the Sox.
I'm saying you can do it with *almost* any team, that's what is great about baseball. Sorry Brewers.
Rizzo makes $5 million and Castro makes $6 million. That leaves $3.25 million for Arrieta before eclipsing Danks. Arrieta finished 9th in CY voting. Rizzo and Abreu had remarkably similar seasons. Rizzo is just younger and has a better contract.
This whole thread was Sox fans belittling Cubs, so not sure where you're getting that from.
-
Exactly....and these comments coming from fans of a team that finished worse than the Cubs in 2013 and with the same record as the Cubs in 2014 all while the Cubs were in the largest teardown and rebuild in franchise history. Sorry, but the Cubs are in a 100x better spot than the White Sox regardless of record this coming season.
Decent farm?
(http://pp.e3.pe//ima/0/0/0/0/2/2502.gif)
Really? All Sox fans belittling? Well then, wow did I misinterpret this statement.
-
Serious question for Sox fans that I've been tossing around.
Will Samardzija get signed long term? We know he wants $20m+, does Hahn get him that money?
If Rodon comes out, Samardzija is the third starter.
I just don't see him getting that money from anywhere, maybe I'm crazy though. Maybe he'll change his tune about free agency.
-
Really? All Sox fans belittling? Well then, wow did I misinterpret this statement.
I really wouldn't take offense to that.
-
Serious question for Sox fans that I've been tossing around.
Will Samardzija get signed long term? We know he wants $20m+, does Hahn get him that money?
If Rodon comes out, Samardzija is the third starter.
I just don't see him getting that money from anywhere, maybe I'm crazy though. Maybe he'll change his tune about free agency.
Yeah, that is a tough question. He certainly doesn't seem like 20M per year would be worth it. The odd thing is that the Sox need him because he is RH. Sale, Quintana and Rodon are all lefties.
It seems like the price of a really good starting pitcher (a 1B,2A type) is going to that 20 million range. I guess I'd try to get him at an annual value around 18-19 million, which seems crazy, but like I said earlier, the price to play is getting seriously ridiculous.
If he has a year this year like last year, he will probably command a deal similar to what Lester just got. I have a hard time seeing the Sox go 5 years (or more) with a pitcher, that hasn't been their MO, and when they do, they typically regret it, like with Danks.
-
I really wouldn't take offense to that.
I didn't. Just felt the need to point out how completely ridiculous it was. And really, what was the point of that statement if not to belittle where the Sox are?
-
I'm saying you can do it with *almost* any team, that's what is great about baseball. Sorry Brewers.
Rizzo makes $5 million and Castro makes $6 million. That leaves $3.25 million for Arrieta before eclipsing Danks. Arrieta finished 9th in CY voting. Rizzo and Abreu had remarkably similar seasons. Rizzo is just younger and has a better contract.
This whole thread was Sox fans belittling Cubs, so not sure where you're getting that from.
Arrieta is being predicted to make about 4.1 in arb. And I didn't say a thing about Rizzo. Not sure why you felt the need to defend him.
He is definitely an elite 1B. Possibly the best in the NL. But his season wasn't "remarkably close" to Abreu's. Abreu was better in just about every category. With significant advantages in 2B, RBI, BA, OBP, and SLG.
-
Read the comment, I am not saying we are 100x better than you. The Sox very well will have a better record and be a better team than the Cubs next year. I am saying Cubs are in a better spot than White Sox at this juncture and in the near future. They have the best farm system in all of baseball, again I understand its unproven, but some of them will pan out. They are ripe with cash to spend moving forward. You have arguably the most unique stadium and setting for a ballpark in all of baseball with an owner who is investing $500+ million of his own $ to improve all of that. It is going to do wonders to the allure of Wrigley and the neighborhood in the coming years.
I am not trashing the White Sox and saying Cubs are 100x better, I am just saying I think the Cubs are in a better position as an entire franchise, that is all.
Quite the contrary. What the Ricketts are doing to Wrigley is ruining the uniqueness of it. They're basically spending $500M to make Wrigley just like every other ballpark, except for the unstable concourses which are being ignored in favor of a ridiculous Jumbotron and oh-so-precious revenue streams.
-
Arrieta is being predicted to make about 4.1 in arb. And I didn't say a thing about Rizzo. Not sure why you felt the need to defend him.
He is definitely an elite 1B. Possibly the best in the NL. But his season wasn't "remarkably close" to Abreu's. Abreu was better in just about every category. With significant advantages in 2B, RBI, BA, OBP, and SLG.
I'm not defending Rizzo, just comparing him to 'MVP-caliber' Abreu. Let's compare apples to apples, Fangraphs has Rizzo 0.3 WAR better last season than Abreu. Baseball Reference has Abreu at a 0.4 WAR better than Rizzo.
It's extremely close.
Samninja won't get Lester money, but he's been so greedy with his quotes he probably thinks he can.
-
Quite the contrary. What the Ricketts are doing to Wrigley is ruining the uniqueness of it. They're basically spending $500M to make Wrigley just like every other ballpark, except for the unstable concourses which are being ignored in favor of a ridiculous Jumbotron and oh-so-precious revenue streams.
What?
-
Quite the contrary. What the Ricketts are doing to Wrigley is ruining the uniqueness of it. They're basically spending $500M to make Wrigley just like every other ballpark, except for the unstable concourses which are being ignored in favor of a ridiculous Jumbotron and oh-so-precious revenue streams.
Something tells me that most Cub fans wouldn't care one bit about the former uniqueness of Wrigley Field if it meant winning a World Series.
-
Something tells me that most Cub fans wouldn't care one bit about the former uniqueness of Wrigley Field if it meant winning a World Series.
Careful, there's a lot of mouthbreathing Cubs fans out there.
Regardless, the Wrigley renovation is quite the transformation which retains much of the uniqueness. I was skeptical at first and preferred a new park, but having seen details, I'm quite impressed.
-
I'm not defending Rizzo, just comparing him to 'MVP-caliber' Abreu. Let's compare apples to apples, Fangraphs has Rizzo 0.3 WAR better last season than Abreu. Baseball Reference has Abreu at a 0.4 WAR better than Rizzo.
It's extremely close.
Samninja won't get Lester money, but he's been so greedy with his quotes he probably thinks he can.
I know they are close. As I said, Rizzo is likely the best 1B in the NL. And Abreu finished 4th in MVP voting. So I don't know why you feel the need to be snotty about it.
And WAR is not the only metric that should be looked at. It isn't the end all be all. It is part of the equation. But that is a conversation for another day.
-
Careful, there's a lot of mouthbreathing Cubs fans out there.
Regardless, the Wrigley renovation is quite the transformation which retains much of the uniqueness. I was skeptical at first and preferred a new park, but having seen details, I'm quite impressed.
Have you seen the renderings? Remodeled Soldier Field looks better.
If they were going to ruin what made Wrigley so unique then they should have just built a new stadium. I'd much rather have that than have the half-Wrigley/half-Wisconsin Dells that they're creating.
-
I know they are close. As I said, Rizzo is likely the best 1B in the NL. And Abreu finished 4th in MVP voting. So I don't know why you feel the need to be snotty about it.
And WAR is not the only metric that should be looked at. It isn't the end all be all. It is part of the equation. But that is a conversation for another day.
Rizzo is my favorite player on the Cubs but I'm not ready to say that he's better than Paul Goldschmidt, Adrian Gonzalez or Joey Votto.
-
Have you seen the renderings? Remodeled Soldier Field looks better.
If they were going to ruin what made Wrigley so unique then they should have just built a new stadium. I'd much rather have that than have the half-Wrigley/half-Wisconsin Dells that they're creating.
Yes, I have. I've also seen actual sets of plans. The entire concourse you mentioned in your first post is being entirely restored.
What in particular do you feel is ruining Wrigley's uniqueness?
-
Really? Then why did the Red Sox offer 20 million less than the Cubs? They must think that money means something. There is no salary cap, but teams still operate within the constraints of a budget.
Okay, you're right, it doesn't mean "nothing", but certainly relatively when compared to other pro sports. Also, it's only going to get more pronounced. The Cubs TV contract is coming up and it's going to be unreal, especially if they have a competitive team to sell in negotiations for that. They can basically print their own money if they go the route that NY did. Add the new ballpark additions and the revenue and you've got even more.
As for the ballpark, as a lifelong Cubs fan I have always appreciated seeing a game at Wrigley, but I honestly don't care what they do to the park if it means winning. What are they protecting? What tradition? The tradition of losing so much that your name is associated with losing. Wipe it clean and start over.
-
I know they are close. As I said, Rizzo is likely the best 1B in the NL. And Abreu finished 4th in MVP voting. So I don't know why you feel the need to be snotty about it.
And WAR is not the only metric that should be looked at. It isn't the end all be all. It is part of the equation. But that is a conversation for another day.
Agreed, I wasn't being snotty though. I love Abreu.
-
Rizzo is my favorite player on the Cubs but I'm not ready to say that he's better than Paul Goldschmidt, Adrian Gonzalez or Joey Votto.
Goldschmidt I get but if you don't think Rizzo is better, especially moving forward, than Gonzalez and Votto you're crazy, IMO.
Abreu was amazing last year but all things considered, including age, defense, and contract, I take Rizzo. People are really overlooking how phenomenal he was this season.
And please don't use stats like RBIs or average when you are comparing them. It's like using wins to compare the quality of a pitcher.
-
Have you seen the renderings? Remodeled Soldier Field looks better.
If they were going to ruin what made Wrigley so unique then they should have just built a new stadium. I'd much rather have that than have the half-Wrigley/half-Wisconsin Dells that they're creating.
The renderings look fantastic. I wouldn't make that judgment until everything is complete.
-
Rizzo is my favorite player on the Cubs but I'm not ready to say that he's better than Paul Goldschmidt, Adrian Gonzalez or Joey Votto.
Might want to add Freddie Freeman to that list. Had a bit of down year in 2014, but his career numbers are more impressive than Rizzo's.
-
Rizzo is my favorite player on the Cubs but I'm not ready to say that he's better than Paul Goldschmidt, Adrian Gonzalez or Joey Votto.
Goldschmidt is certainly better, that is true. Against Gonzalez and Votto, I think you could certainly make arguments for Rizzo.
-
I agree on Goldy, one of my favorite players in all of baseball.
Votto was primed to dominate, but still really good. Unfortunately, he was injured last year. He'll be back to 2013 numbers in 2015.
Freeman's a bit behind these guys though.
Goldy
Rizzo/Votto/Adrian
Freeman/Duda
Morneau/Alonso/Fat Adams
-
Goldschmidt I get but if you don't think Rizzo is better, especially moving forward, than Gonzalez and Votto you're crazy, IMO.
Abreu was amazing last year but all things considered, including age, defense, and contract, I take Rizzo. People are really overlooking how phenomenal he was this season.
And please don't use stats like RBIs or average when you are comparing them. It's like using wins to compare the quality of a pitcher.
Please. Again, BA and RBI aren't the end all be all, but they are part of the equation. BA needs to be factored in, OBP isn't the same. Because, no matter what your little league coach told you, a walk is not as good as a hit. Runs don't score from second on a walk. Walks don't move guys 1st to 3rd.
Some guys choke with runners on, others thrive. It should be part of the conversation.
What is more silly is comparing defensive metrics for a 1B. It is the least valuable position defensively. All they are asked to do is catch the ball. Having an elite defender can make a difference, but there isn't much difference between a slightly better than average 1B and a slightly below avg 1B. Certainly not the impact of SS,2B,3B, CF, or C.
-
I agree on Goldy, one of my favorite players in all of baseball.
Votto was primed to dominate, but still really good. Unfortunately, he was injured last year. He'll be back to 2013 numbers in 2015.
Freeman's a bit behind these guys though.
Goldy
Rizzo/Votto/Adrian
Freeman/Duda
Morneau/Alonso/Fat Adams
I think Votto is a perfect example of how BB can be a detriment. He has great K zone judgement. Great hitter, but I think sometimes, he needs to be more aggressive. He needs to swing the bat more, drive it into gaps, or over the wall and be more dangerous. His best years are when he walks 90-110 times. At 135 BB, he is losing to many ABs, that team needs him to hit. Obviously not saying he needs to swing at crap just to swing, but if I were his coach I would want him to be a little more aggressive in some situations.
-
Please. Again, BA and RBI aren't the end all be all, but they are part of the equation. BA needs to be factored in, OBP isn't the same. Because, no matter what your little league coach told you, a walk is not as good as a hit. Runs don't score from second on a walk. Walks don't move guys 1st to 3rd.
Some guys choke with runners on, others thrive. It should be part of the conversation.
What is more silly is comparing defensive metrics for a 1B. It is the least valuable position defensively. All they are asked to do is catch the ball. Having an elite defender can make a difference, but there isn't much difference between a slightly better than average 1B and a slightly below avg 1B. Certainly not the impact of SS,2B,3B, CF, or C.
Thanks for the lesson but I understand that batting average has an impact on OBP. However, evaluating and/or comparing players on batting average in a vacuum is meaningless.
I also didn't bring up any specific defensive metrics and clearly defense at some of the positions you mentioned is much more valuable but to say it doesn't factor in to a player's value at 1B is not true.
Abreu had the better offensive year (but not by much) and being that Rizzo is two years younger, left-handed and signed for two years longer (assuming the options are picked up)at a very reasonable contract he would be my preference. Relevant arguments can be made on both sides but let's not act like Abreu is so much better and use MVP voting as an argument.
-
Thanks for the lesson but I understand that batting average has an impact on OBP. However, evaluating and/or comparing players on batting average in a vacuum is meaningless.
I also didn't bring up any specific defensive metrics and clearly defense at some of the positions you mentioned is much more valuable but to say it doesn't factor in to a player's value at 1B is not true.
Abreu had the better offensive year (but not by much) and being that Rizzo is two years younger, left-handed and signed for two years longer (assuming the options are picked up)at a very reasonable contract he would be my preference. Relevant arguments can be made on both sides but let's not act like Abreu is so much better and use MVP voting as an argument.
I didn't do or say any of that. And I never said anything against you preferring Rizzo, as it is, as you mentioned, completely reasonable.
I also never used MVP voting as an argument as to which was better. I made that reference to put into perspective how great Abreu was last season. He was one of the top hitters in the AL.
And I wasn't comparing BA in a vacuum. It was part of a comp of their entire body of work from last season.
-
Jimmy Rollins to the Dodgers for what looks like 2 low level pitchers.
-
Pirates acquire Antonio Bastardo. Philly starting their full on fire sale.
-
And, the Dodgers just traded Dee Gordon to Miami for Andrew Heaney.
-
And, the Dodgers just traded Dee Gordon to Miami for Andrew Heaney.
So does that mean Weeks gets $10 mil from LA ;D
-
I thought people went to Arizona to die, now they get acquired by the Dodgers.
-
Crazy day for the Dodgers, they spin Heaney to the Angels for Howie Kendrick.
-
And Kemp to the Padres
-
And now sign Brandon McCarthy who I thought the Yankees were bound to resign.
-
Cespedes to the Tigers for Porcello
-
And now sign Brandon McCarthy who I thought the Yankees were bound to resign.
As a Cubs fan the Dodgers' financial might scared me but I always had the hope they would tie themselves to old, unproductive players on huge deals like the Yankees have because of Coletti. Now that they have Friedman running things it is kind of scary.
-
Cespedes to the Tigers for Porcello
Red Sox trying to corner the market on number 3/4 starters
-
Miami is apparently close to getting mat latos
This year's winter meetings certainly haven't been short on action.
-
Red Sox trying to corner the market on number 3/4 starters
.....& to buy more time for Rodriguez, Owens, Johnson, Ranaudo, Barnes, Escobar, Stankiewicz & Ball.
I'll take it under the circumstances - grab a host of ground ball pitchers (two in contract years) with competitive FIP projections who eat innings, and see if the offense can keep the team competitive to the trade deadline. More to come I'm sure, but a reasonable approach to the starting rotation. As an added bonus the OF logjam was cleared somewhat.
-
Dombrowski was busy today. Overall, traded an established major league starter, a minor league utility infielder and a class A pitcher for a major league corner outfielder, two minor league pitchers and a 4-5 starter. Dombrowski isn't timid.
-
White Sox pick up left reliever Dan Jennings from the Marlins for almost nothing.
Another solid move by Rick Hahn. After being suck a train wreck last year, the Sox bullpen is looking promising for 2015.
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20141211/sports/141219641/
-
Crazy day for the Dodgers, they spin Heaney to the Angels for Howie Kendrick.
Basically trade Dee Gordon for Howie Kendrick.
I likes.
Love the Dodger moves thus far.
-
Basically trade Dee Gordon for Howie Kendrick.
I likes.
Love the Dodger moves thus far.
So does FanGraphs http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-matt-kemp-trade-feels-like-the-vernon-wells-trade/ (http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-matt-kemp-trade-feels-like-the-vernon-wells-trade/)
-
White Sox pick up left reliever Dan Jennings from the Marlins for almost nothing.
Another solid move by Rick Hahn. After being suck a train wreck last year, the Sox bullpen is looking promising for 2015.
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20141211/sports/141219641/
Yeah, really like the over haul to the pen. Now it seems like everyone can be a better role. Also this seems to say that Rodon will have a legit chance at the rotation.
-
What has the Brew Crew done?
-
What has the Brew Crew done?
With $110M in payroll next year, nothing.
-
Cespedes to the Tigers for Porcello
Risky move by the Tigers, they obviously have a stacked lineup but if Scherzer ends up leaving (who knows at this point) they're gonna have a real shaky rotation; Verlander definitely isn't getting any younger
Being a White Sox fan I certainly don't mind seeing that rotation get gutted though
-
Verlander, Price, Sanchez, Greene, Simon. Greene had a solid if unspectacular year with the Yankees. Simon was prone to the home run ball in Cinci, it will be interesting to see if that holds at Comerica Park. Dombrowski, and the entire Tiger organization, are desperate to get a WS trophy for Mr. Ilitch. Every move DD makes is with a 2 year window in mind. And if it doesn't happen this year, I think the team enters rebuild mode.
-
Verlander, Price, Sanchez, Greene, Simon. Greene had a solid if unspectacular year with the Yankees. Simon was prone to the home run ball in Cinci, it will be interesting to see if that holds at Comerica Park. Dombrowski, and the entire Tiger organization, are desperate to get a WS trophy for Mr. Ilitch. Every move DD makes is with a 2 year window in mind. And if it doesn't happen this year, I think the team enters rebuild mode.
I'd have a hard time putting too much faith in Simon. He will be 34 and has had 1 good year as a starter, he has clearly figured some things out judging by his last couple years, but still. And to make matters even worse, his baseball reference page doesn't even show his numbers from last year!!!! IT CAN"T BE! Say it aint so Baseballreference.com!
Edit: Upon further review, with that lineup and in that park, well I think I could probably be an effective 5th starter for the Tigers. Simon will probably be just fine.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/simonal01.shtml
-
I don't have a ton of faith in Simon. But, at worst, he is a back of the rotation guy. If the Tigers were to sign a different 4-5 starter and move Simon back to the bullpen, it would not surprise me. Porcello clearly has more upside, but the Tigers wanted another bat.
-
I don't have a ton of faith in Simon. But, at worst, he is a back of the rotation guy. If the Tigers were to sign a different 4-5 starter and move Simon back to the bullpen, it would not surprise me. Porcello clearly has more upside, but the Tigers wanted another bat.
Haha, yeah, because you know, Cabrera, Martinez, Kinsler etc just aren't potent enough
-
They weren't last year. The best thing about Cespedes is that it is a contract year. Detroit desperately needs dirtbags, hustle players, grinders. Cespedes isn't one. But, in a contract year, he may fake it for a year.
-
White sox sign melky cabrera
Apparently about 3/45. Too much for him in my estimation. By quite a bit.
-
White sox sign melky cabrera
Apparently about 3/45. Too much for him in my estimation. By quite a bit.
Maybe so. But I'd rather have a 150 game player at $15m/yr than a 32 game player at $30m/yr
-
What has the Brew Crew done?
When you've committed a huge percentage of your payroll to a cheating, lying sack of $hit, you don't have much financial freedom to buy free agents.
-
Maybe so. But I'd rather have a 150 game player at $15m/yr than a 32 game player at $30m/yr
True, and I guess if they now trade viciedo the net is even less. Deal is being reported as 3/42, and Viciedo was expected to make about 4.5. This also puts the mariners in more of a position where they need viciedo even more as they were the ones expected to sign cabrera
-
When you've committed a huge percentage of your payroll to a cheating, lying sack of $hit, you don't have much financial freedom to buy free agents.
Ain't it the truth. Braun bf'd The Crew for years to come knowin' full well he's got the bread when he eventually gets caught. Absolutely brilliant move on Ryan's part.
-
I don't know if you guys have seen the new Pete Rose commercial but it's pretty hilarious.
-
With $110M in payroll next year, nothing.
Brewers only have $77M committed right now with Ramirez and Gallardo exercised, and only two players eligible for arbitration (Kintzler & Maldonado). Otherwise, everyone else is at/near the league minimum... without any FA signings, Brewers' opening day payroll will be right around $87-88M.
-
Padres get Wil Myers.
With adding Kemp and Myers and hanging on to Ross, Cashner and Kennedy, the Padres may be able to make some noise.
-
Brewers only have $77M committed right now with Ramirez and Gallardo exercised, and only two players eligible for arbitration (Kintzler & Maldonado). Otherwise, everyone else is at/near the league minimum... without any FA signings, Brewers' opening day payroll will be right around $87-88M.
Actually, they are close to $100 mil right now.
5 starters 37.5
4 infielders 22.5
4 OFs 27
Closer 9
That's 96 mil for 14 players - even if all 11 others were at 500k - which they aren't - they will be over $100 mil
-
Actually, they are close to $100 mil right now.
5 starters 37.5
4 infielders 22.5
4 OFs 27
Closer 9
That's 96 mil for 14 players - even if all 11 others were at 500k - which they aren't - they will be over $100 mil
Mean culpa... you're right; apparently the guy who updates the spreadsheets on Cot's site did so this afternoon.
-
And now the Padres have acquired Derek Norris and Justin Upton. Quite the remodel for their team.
-
And now the Padres have acquired Derek Norris and Justin Upton. Quite the remodel for their team.
With the additions of Norris, Upton, Kemp and Meyers, the Padres could win or lose 95 games next year.
-
With the additions of Norris, Upton, Kemp and Meyers, the Padres could win or lose 95 games next year.
They have also apparently traded for Wil Middlebrooks.
-
Brewers on the verge of trading Gallardo to the Rangers...
-
Adios, mf'er
-
Maybe we'll get Mike Maddux back.
-
Scherzer has signed with the Nats. Terms not known yet. Likely 7 years. Seems odd to me that they wouldn't pony up to extend Zimmerman, but who doesn't like a shiny new toy I guess.
-
7 years, $180 mil.
-
Cubs get Fowler, nice piece.
Nats looking to trade Strasburg.
-
7 years, $180 mil.
$210 mil with $105 mil deferred to 2022-2028.
-
That is some big cheese.
-
That is some big cheese.
Take that bobby Bonilla!
-
Detroit could not afford that. Not with the contracts that Verlander, Sanchez, and Cabrera have. $105 mil deferred? Wow.
-
Talk about a retirement plan...
Take that bobby Bonilla!
Bonilla is getting paid through 2035, so he's still the big winner.
-
$210 mil with $105 mil deferred to 2022-2028.
Jeezus ... that's almost double what I expect to make during that time frame!!!
-
Gallardo for a ss, and two rhp.
http://m.brewers.mlb.com/news/article/106840940/milwaukee-brewers-get-3-players-from-rangers-for-yovani-gallardo (http://m.brewers.mlb.com/news/article/106840940/milwaukee-brewers-get-3-players-from-rangers-for-yovani-gallardo)
-
I personally think it is a good move. At $13MM, his price tag was too high for his typical 5+ innings. Teams like Milwaukee have to strike with younger players before their contracts balloon.
-
It's a move. Three C level prospects, hope one makes the roster in the future.
-
Just spare parts. Typical Brewers move.
-
I personally think it is a good move. At $13MM, his price tag was too high for his typical 5+ innings. Teams like Milwaukee have to strike with younger players before their contracts balloon.
Gallardo's pitch counts have been way too high over the past two years. He's nibbling but even with Lucroy's uber framing prowess, Gallardo just isn't putting the ball into the strike zone. If his velocity falls off in 2015, the Brewers would have been looking at another Suppan. That alone is reason to dump Yo's salary.
-
FanGraph's Dave Cameron crunched some numbers, and estimates that Scherzer's new contract—$210 million spread out over 14 years—is about as valuable as a seven-year, $170 million contract when adjusted for inflation.
http://deadspin.com/max-scherzers-contract-isnt-quite-as-impressive-as-it-s-1680429105
-
Brewers are apparently in serious talks about papelbon
-
Just spare parts. Typical Brewers move.
No, young prospects more correctly.
For Milwaukee to be competitive they must generate talent (especially pitching) from within and then strike with a key trade or free agent when the time is right. This deal includes two pitchers who have a real shot to make a solid contribution in the majors (one a few years away) and a switch hitting middle infielder who will likely take Weeks spot on the roster this year. In return they gave up a guy who naturally had his salary balloon while his performance deteriorated in each of the last two years paving the way for a move or two prior to the opening of camp.
Many folks like to criticize Doug Melvin. The fact that he's put the Crew in the post season more than once I believe speaks to his skill. Milwaukee can't contend every year. The ground simply isn't level enough to support that. But we're well past the days of a decade of consistent losing. I'm looking forward to Spring.
-
No, young prospects more correctly.
For Milwaukee to be competitive they must generate talent (especially pitching) from within and then strike with a key trade or free agent when the time is right. This deal includes two pitchers who have a real shot to make a solid contribution in the majors (one a few years away) and a switch hitting middle infielder who will likely take Weeks spot on the roster this year. In return they gave up a guy who naturally had his salary balloon while his performance deteriorated in each of the last two years paving the way for a move or two prior to the opening of camp.
Many folks like to criticize Doug Melvin. The fact that he's put the Crew in the post season more than once I believe speaks to his skill. Milwaukee can't contend every year. The ground simply isn't level enough to support that. But we're well past the days of a decade of consistent losing. I'm looking forward to Spring.
I'm really not trying to throw any hate here, but neither pitcher is projected above a C-level.
Knebel's is a bullpen arm.
Diplan could break into the rotation, big fastball guy, but likely a bullpen arm as well.
I think Melvin could have done better trading Gallardo at the deadline.
-
I think Melvin is by and large a decent general manager. My only real criticism is that he is a guy who loves the 90s style power hitter who strikes out a lot (Mark Reynolds last year for example), but then he hired a guy as manager who seems more like a station to station kind of manager.
I also think he hasn't done terribly well at drafting pitchers, but I might be setting the bar too high on that one.
-
Way too early predictions:
AL Central: Indians
AL West: Angels
AL East: Red Sox
WC1: Mariners
MC2: White Sox (Admittedly a smidge bias)
NL Central: Cardinals
NL West: Dodgers
NL East: Nationals
WC1: Pirates
WC2: Padres/Giants (I know its a copout but its honestly a tossup for me)
ALCS: Angels vs. Red Sox
NLCS: Nationals vs. Cardinals
WS: Nationals over Angels
-
I'm really not trying to throw any hate here, but neither pitcher is projected above a C-level.
Knebel's is a bullpen arm.
Diplan could break into the rotation, big fastball guy, but likely a bullpen arm as well.
I think Melvin could have done better trading Gallardo at the deadline.
I don't think he could have... I'm sure the guys who are paid to watch baseball saw exactly what some of us saw with Gallardo: declining K/9, increasing BB/9, high pitch counts/decreasing quality starts, etc. Not a lot of teams are going to want to pay $8figures for a guy like that, which is why MKE had to send some cash in return. But the prospects are the risk that is commensurate with the risk Tejas is taking with Yovani. DM is hoping that one of these three turns into something just like Jon Jon is hoping that Gallardo's 2015 season will turn into something.
-
I don't think he could have... I'm sure the guys who are paid to watch baseball saw exactly what some of us saw with Gallardo: declining K/9, increasing BB/9, high pitch counts/decreasing quality starts, etc. Not a lot of teams are going to want to pay $8figures for a guy like that, which is why MKE had to send some cash in return. But the prospects are the risk that is commensurate with the risk Tejas is taking with Yovani. DM is hoping that one of these three turns into something just like Jon Jon is hoping that Gallardo's 2015 season will turn into something.
I just keep looking at what Billy Beane paid for Samardzija at the deadline and then what BB took from Rick Hahn....I just shake my head and fist pump for both sides of Chicago.
All said and done:
A's get Marcus Siemen, Chris Bassitt, Josh Phegley and Rangel Ravelo - Rangel being the best potential of the bunch.
White Sox get Jeff Samardzija
Cubs get Addison Russel, Billy McKinney, and 1/2 of Dexter Fowler. Russel and McKinney both in the Cubs top 10 of prospects.
-
I just keep looking at what Billy Beane paid for Samardzija at the deadline and then what BB took from Rick Hahn....I just shake my head and fist pump for both sides of Chicago.
All said and done:
A's get Marcus Siemen, Chris Bassitt, Josh Phegley and Rangel Ravelo - Rangel being the best potential of the bunch.
White Sox get Jeff Samardzija
Cubs get Addison Russel, Billy McKinney, and 1/2 of Dexter Fowler. Russel and McKinney both in the Cubs top 10 of prospects.
We gonna see a lot of this in 2015?
(http://files.shroomery.org/files/08-18/984957867-cubs_sweep.gif)
-
I just keep looking at what Billy Beane paid for Samardzija at the deadline and then what BB took from Rick Hahn....I just shake my head and fist pump for both sides of Chicago.
All said and done:
A's get Marcus Siemen, Chris Bassitt, Josh Phegley and Rangel Ravelo - Rangel being the best potential of the bunch.
White Sox get Jeff Samardzija
Cubs get Addison Russel, Billy McKinney, and 1/2 of Dexter Fowler. Russel and McKinney both in the Cubs top 10 of prospects.
The one thing I will say is that I love the potential of Siemian. Wish the Sox didn't have to give him up but also realize they had the give the As something.
-
I just keep looking at what Billy Beane paid for Samardzija at the deadline and then what BB took from Rick Hahn....I just shake my head and fist pump for both sides of Chicago.
All said and done:
A's get Marcus Siemen, Chris Bassitt, Josh Phegley and Rangel Ravelo - Rangel being the best potential of the bunch.
White Sox get Jeff Samardzija
Cubs get Addison Russel, Billy McKinney, and 1/2 of Dexter Fowler. Russel and McKinney both in the Cubs top 10 of prospects.
To be fair, Samardzjia and Gallardo are completely different pitchers on opposite trajectories... in the past 5 years, YoGa's K/9 went from 9.7 to 6.8. Samardzjia, 4.2 to 8.3. Samardzjia is trending in a direction that GM's will pay for; Gallardo seems to have one foot on the scrap heap.
-
To be fair, Samardzjia and Gallardo are completely different pitchers on opposite trajectories... in the past 5 years, YoGa's K/9 went from 9.7 to 6.8. Samardzjia, 4.2 to 8.3. Samardzjia is trending in a direction that GM's will pay for; Gallardo seems to have one foot on the scrap heap.
Samardizja also had another year of team control.
-
Beckham is back on the south side! Dont know how it happened but he was my favorite player for the Sox when he was here.
-
Beckham is back on the south side! Dont know how it happened but he was my favorite player for the Sox when he was here.
I think you are more excited about this than the rest of the White Sox fan base combined.
-
I think you are more excited about this than the rest of the White Sox fan base combined.
Probably, but in theory it gives a veteran presense that can play 3B and 2B. But yea, im pretty thrilled, I get to break out the Beckham jersey again.
-
I think you are more excited about this than the rest of the White Sox fan base combined.
Yeah, I kind of groaned, then thought, I sure as hell hope they aren't planning on playing him every day. At least we will soon know the fate of Viciedo.
-
Yeah, I kind of groaned, then thought, I sure as hell hope they aren't planning on playing him every day. At least we will soon know the fate of Viciedo.
He gone.
-
We gonna see a lot of this in 2015?
(http://files.shroomery.org/files/08-18/984957867-cubs_sweep.gif)
Yes, I'm thinking 80-83 times.
-
Yes, I'm thinking 80-83 times.
Is that per win?
-
Is that per win?
Ask and ye shall receive.
-
The Cubs are still 4or 5 decades away.
-
Beckham is back on the south side! Dont know how it happened but he was my favorite player for the Sox when he was here.
Were you only watching in 2009?
-
Were you only watching in 2009?
Everybody has that one player they fall in love with because of a great rookie season but can never put it together and no matter what you want them to be good. Thats like me with Beckham, great guy and the only Sox player I have a jersey for.
-
Everybody has that one player they fall in love with because of a great rookie season but can never put it together and no matter what you want them to be good. Thats like me with Beckham, great guy and the only Sox player I have a jersey for.
I'm still waiting for Corey Patterson to come around. I think this is the year!
-
I'm still waiting for Corey Patterson to come around. I think this is the year!
Corey Patterson, hell, I'm still on the Dwight Smith bandwagon.
-
I'm still waiting for Corey Patterson to come around. I think this is the year!
(http://www.littlecubsfield.com/images/Hill_Rich500.jpg)
-
Everybody has that one player they fall in love with because of a great rookie season but can never put it together and no matter what you want them to be good.
Sam Horn was my guy like that for the Red Sox. That guy could crush a baseball. He was a second half call-up in 1987 and was awesome. I saw him hit a line drive that the first baseman jumped for and it left the park for an HR. I always wanted that guy to be a star, but he just had too many holes in his swing.
-
(http://www.littlecubsfield.com/images/Hill_Rich500.jpg)
First guy I thought of too. Hill had that magical 2007 where he was actually able to throw the 12-6 for a strike, ran into some injury troubles the next year and has done nothing at the big league level since. I had high hopes. Eight years later and he's still getting a shot to contribute at the big league level. The beauty of being left-handed with a pulse.
Hill kind of reminds of Randy Wells, who had a very good rookie campaign, a mediocre second year, and then he completely lost the ability to get major league hitters out. Even looking at more advanced stats, his FIP was a solid 3.88 and 3.93 his first two years before it ballooned to over 5. Interesting fun fact: Wells was drafted as a catcher.
-
With football season over and spring training approaching, I saw this article that I thought was pretty good for discussion.
The Yankees on everyone's list?
http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/108219880/mlb-rivalries-dodgers-cardinals-giants-yasiel-puig?partnerId=ed-8933872-658620023
Every MLB Team's Top 3 Rivals
Last week, Dodgers outfielder Yasiel Puig -- who is slowly revealing himself to be nearly as entertaining in the offseason as he is in the regular season -- made waves by noting that he felt the Cardinals were the Dodgers' "truest adversary." This led to the obvious protestations from Giants fans, who sort of remember about 80 years of back-and-forth between to two franchises, on one side of the country or another.
It's difficult to blame Puig for thinking the Cardinals are the Dodgers' main rival, though: He has been in the league two seasons, and both of those seasons have ended in playoff losses to the Cardinals. Heck, if you just walked into the room, you might think the Giants' biggest rival are the Royals. You have to have been paying attention a lot longer than Puig has to truly know everyone's rivals.
And no one knows that better than fans, the ones who make up these rivalries anyway. I tend to believe players just sort of humor us on this, enjoying the extra buzz when two rivals face off, but not storing any of the extra vitriol we fans feed off. After Johnny Damon not only signed with the Yankees but publicly cut his hair for the privilege, I gave up any idea that players cared about inter-franchise hatred.
So, for all those players like Puig who aren't sure who their teams' actual historical rivals are, here's a helpful guide. It requires your input, though: If I've got your team's rival wrong, or in the wrong order, or I'm just overlooking one, let me know at leitch@sportsonearth.com. I can do a general overview, but no one knows where the bile rises more than a team's truest fans.
Atlanta Braves
1. New York Mets
2. Washington Nationals
3. St. Louis Cardinals
The Nationals-Braves rivalry was catching up, but now that the Braves have gutted their team, they seem back in the Mets' range. Don't sleep on the Cardinals, though: They've caused the Braves plenty of postseason pain -- and the Braves know postseason pain -- and they just swiped Jason Heyward, a local kid and one of the Braves' most beloved players.
Arizona Diamondbacks
1. Los Angeles Dodgers
2. Chicago Cubs
3. Colorado Rockies
You might remember a little bit of an incident with a pool.
Baltimore Orioles
1. New York Yankees
2. Washington Nationals
3. Boston Red Sox
It's probably still the Yankees -- the Mike Mussina signing might have secured that, and there's always some Buck Showalter anger there too -- but don't count out the Nationals. The better both those teams are, the more heated that gets.
Boston Red Sox
1. New York Yankees
2. Tampa Bay Rays
3. Baltimore Orioles
Obviously, the Yankees are the big one here, and no one else is close. They do love to get in fights with the Rays a lot, though.
Chicago Cubs
1. St. Louis Cardinals
2. Chicago White Sox
3. Milwaukee Brewers
I'm Midwestern, so I believe the Cardinals-Cubs rivalry is in fact the best in all of baseball … it only needs a postseason series to truly secure the title. One might be coming.
Chicago White Sox
1. Chicago Cubs
2. Minnesota Twins
3. Cleveland Indians
Back in 2012, a lawsuit filed by a White Sox fan claimed that the Indians are the White Sox's main rival, and the judge ruled that it is, in fact, the Indians. The plaintiff and judge are both wrong. I also might argue the Tigers belong here ahead of the Tribe.
Cincinnati Reds
1. St. Louis Cardinals
2. Cleveland Indians
3. Pittsburgh Pirates
The Cards-Reds feud -- a spotlight most bright and intense on Yadier Molina, Johnny Cueto and Brandon Phillips -- has lost a little luster since Tony LaRussa and Dusty Baker left town … but just a little. The Reds might be trending the wrong direction, though.
Cleveland Indians
1. Detroit Tigers
2. New York Yankees
3. Cincinnati Reds
The Browns have a lot more fierce rivalries than the Indians do, it seems. You can maybe make a case for the Red Sox and the White Sox here too.
Colorado Rockies
1. Los Angeles Dodgers
2. Arizona Diamondbacks
3. San Francisco Giants
Just sort of default division picks here, really. Develop more anger, Coloradans!
Detroit Tigers
1. Cleveland Indians
2. Chicago White Sox
3. New York Yankees
I find it of note that more AL Central teams seems to hate the Yankees than they do the Twins', an intra-division rival. Though everyone in the AL Central is generally rather agreeable.
Houston Astros
1. Texas Rangers
2. Oakland A's
3. St. Louis Cardinals
It's difficult to sustain rivalries when you move leagues -- the Cardinals are a remnant of a decade ago -- but it does help when you've got a division rival in your state. Though fights help too.
Kansas City Royals
1. St. Louis Cardinals
2. Detroit Tigers
3. Oakland A's
The '70s were terrific for the Yankees, but 1985 and I-70 (along with the Cardinals swiping Albert Pujols out from under their noses) secured Royals' animus for the Cardinals forever. If the Royals can sustain what they did last year, this could be fun for a while.
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
1. Los Angeles Dodgers
2. Oakland A's
3. Texas Rangers
The Angels might have missed their window to win their battle for Southern California, but that won't stop them from trying.
Los Angeles Dodgers
1. San Francisco Giants
2. Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
3. St. Louis Cardinals
Because of all the postseason history, we'll grant Yaisel the Cardinals at third. But that's as far as we're willing to go, and probably ever will be willing to go.
Miami Marlins
1. Atlanta Braves
2. New York Mets
3. Tampa Bay Rays
Even Marlins fans aren't sure what to think on this one.
Milwaukee Brewers
1. Chicago Cubs
2. St. Louis Cardinals
3. Minnesota Twins
The first two tower over the third here. The Cardinals nearly passed the Cubs in this decade, but geographic proximity ultimately rules.
Minnesota Twins
1. New York Yankees
2. Chicago White Sox
3. Detroit Tigers
There have been some arguments even for the Brewers here, but the Yankees have to top the list if just because the playoff wipeouts. This one is a tough call, though.
New York Mets
1. New York Yankees
2. Philadelphia Phillies
3. Atlanta Braves
For a team that hasn't been good in nearly a decade, the Mets still have plenty of rivals. And don't sleep on a fun potential Nationals rivalry coming up in the next few years. Still: Mets fans have been hating the Yankees since birth. Probably before.
New York Yankees
1. Boston Red Sox
2. New York Mets
3. Tampa Bay Rays
If there has been one downside to the relative parity of recent years, the Yankees-Red Sox games just aren't quite as electric as they used to be. Still, though: Tough to find much else in baseball that comes close.
Oakland A's
1. San Francisco Giants
2. Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
3. Texas Rangers
The Royals are probably just below -- the WIld Card game loss rekindled some old '70s anger -- but the Giants-A's battle will never end.
Philadelphia Phillies
1. New York Mets
2. Atlanta Braves
3. Washington Nationals
The Pirates might have been here three decades ago, but not anymore. Though Phillies' fans most hated rival, from my personal experience, tends to be "the Phillies."
Pittsburgh Pirates
1. St. Louis Cardinals
2. Philadelphia Phillies
3. Cincinnati Reds
The Pirates haven't been good enough for two decades to have a rival, but it's clearly the Cardinals now, particularly after the Cardinals eliminated them from the playoffs during their dream season in 2013. Considering the young talent on both teams, the Cubs could be moving up this list too.
St. Louis Cardinals
1. Chicago Cubs
2. Cincinnati Reds
3. Los Angeles Dodgers
All told, this Cardinals fan would love to put Boston and San Francisco on here, since they've been the postseason phantasms for the Cards … but this feels like the real top three.
San Diego Padres
1. Los Angeles Dodgers
2. Arizona Diamondbacks
3. Colorado Rockies
I'm pretty sure none of these teams hate the Padres back.
San Francisco Giants
1. Los Angeles Dodgers
2. Oakland A's
3. Arizona Diamondbacks
The real Giants' rival, of course, is "odd-numbered years."
Seattle Mariners
1. Oakland A's
2. Texas Rangers
3. San Diego Padres
The Yankees almost made this one too, and it's possible that I'm letting scheduling get to me on that Padres business. But until Portland gets a team, there's no natural rival for Seattle.
Tampa Bay Rays
1. New York Yankees
2. Boston Red Sox
3. Miami Marlins
This is closer than you might think -- remember all those Red Sox-Rays fights -- but the fact that the Yankees make their spring training home in the Tampa area probably pushes it over the edge. It must still gall to see March games in Tampa where everyone's cheering for the Yankees. (To be fair, that sometimes happens in August too.)
Texas Rangers
1. Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim
2. Houston Astros
3. Oakland A's
It should be the Astros, and it probably will be in the next few years, but for now … the Astros probably need to win a few more games for that to click. It will, soon.
Toronto Blue Jays
1. New York Yankees
2. Boston Red Sox
3. Baltimore Orioles
As tough as any team in the sport to find a rival for: You end up just falling back on the division teams. With as rowdy as Jays fans can be, you'd think they could work up some more. It would help if the Blue Jays made the playoffs more often, which is when rivalries are often forged.
Washington Nationals
1. Baltimore Orioles
2. Atlanta Braves
3. St. Louis Cardinals
That Orioles rivalry still feels mostly media-created, but it's still there. (Isn't everything in Washington media-created?) Don't count out that Cardinals anger too: There's no team Nats fans would rather take out in the playoffs, preferably while Pete Kozma weeps nearby.
* * *
Email me at leitch@sportsonearth.com; follow me @williamfleitch; or just shout out your window real loud, I'll hear you. Point is, let's talk.
-
I'd say the Brewers #1 is the Cards more than the Cubs. I still get depressed about the '82 series.
-
Put me down for the Twinkies and the Tigers over the Cubs.
-
All bets are off on the Tigers. Victor Martinez needs knee surgery. It appears right now that it is only the meniscus, but it is the same knee that he had major surgery on in 2012. Right now, there is a chance that Detroit plays April without Cabrera or Martinez. At best, with the two of them still rehabbing. Detroit's pennant hopes could be destroyed by May 1.