MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MUMonster03 on October 14, 2014, 09:30:29 AM
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Is there anyone else that we really want to get for 2015 since we will have an open scholarship with Gabe leaving? I'm not talking about pipe dreams here, I'm talking about people that the coaching staff are really after. I know some have mentioned just banking it since we have some evening out to do, but I am in the boat of go ahead and use it since we almost always have transfers and Henry will probably only be here for 2 years max.
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Davon Dillard and Melvin Frazier are the two names I've heard. There is also the possibility of a transfer pickup in the spring
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Henry is more than likely gonna be 1 and done, especially if he plays like the top 5 player in the country that he's been rated at and with the supporting cast of Deonte, JJJ, Duane, Nick, Hanif and Company we should win alot of games...... :'(
That one is gonna be a great year tho....
Is there anyone else that we really want to get for 2015 since we will have an open scholarship with Gabe leaving? I'm not talking about pipe dreams here, I'm talking about people that the coaching staff are really after. I know some have mentioned just banking it since we have some evening out to do, but I am in the boat of go ahead and use it since we almost always have transfers and Henry will probably only be here for 2 years max.
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Henry is more than likely gonna be 1 and done, especially if he plays like the top 5 player in the country that he's been rated at and with the supporting cast of Deonte, JJJ, Duane, Nick, Hanif and Company we should win alot of games...... :'(
That one is gonna be a great year tho....
Maybe, but I will be surprised if that happens. And I have read no NBA scouts talk about him as a one-and-done.
Also, I wouldn't consider him top 5 just because a service or two may have him at 4 or 5. My guess is that his average will be in the 10-12 range.
That, being said, I think he has a chance to be a solid NBA player - maybe in the Chandler Parsons mode. But I think he will be here two, or possibly three years.
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Maybe, but I will be surprised if that happens. And I have read no NBA scouts talk about him as a one-and-done.
Also, I wouldn't consider him top 5 just because a service or two may have him at 4 or 5. My guess is that his average will be in the 10-12 range.
That, being said, I think he has a chance to be a solid NBA player - maybe in the Chandler Parsons mode. But I think he will be here two, or possibly three years.
http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2016/
Maybe this has nothing to do with an NBA scout saying it, but this has him going lotto after his frosh year (caveat: I have no idea how reliable draftexpress is)
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http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft/2016/
Maybe this has nothing to do with an NBA scout saying it, but this has him going lotto after his frosh year (caveat: I have no idea how reliable draftexpress is)
Draft Express is pretty good but the move from high school to college is challenging enough particularly for a kid from Rice Lake, I do not see it. 2 years I see at most if he is that good. Remember Brian Butch, he was a big time Top 10 player, that had a nice 4 year career at UW. Lets see how Henry does against better competition everyday, in practice as well as games.
Long way to go before he is in the NBA.
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Draft Express is pretty good but the move from high school to college is challenging enough particularly for a kid from Rice Lake, I do not see it. 2 years I see at most if he is that good. Remember Brian Butch, he was a big time Top 10 player, that had a nice 4 year career at UW. Lets see how Henry does against better competition everyday, in practice as well as games.
Long way to go before he is in the NBA.
I'm all for letting him develop at his pace. One and done is still rare and it takes an elite talent. Just saying it's not exactly out of the realm of possibility. He's considered that good.
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I'm all for letting him develop at his pace. One and done is still rare and it takes an elite talent. Just saying it's not exactly out of the realm of possibility. He's considered that good.
Anything is possible, looking at Draft Express, the 2015 top white American is Sam Decker, 2016 top white player is Henry, now that in itself is amazing, two white kids from Wisconsin,
love it. But even Sam realized he needed 3 years so one and done, pretty hard to do, Sam could have come out last year but it sounds like he knew he needed more seasoning before
the NBA. I am hoping the same for Ellenson because when he is a soph, the team should be very talented with experienced players. Probably a Top 10 team,
Fisher, Ellenson, Burton, Duane and Cheatham or JJJ, back-ups will be good as well. Wojo only needs a back-up 4 in 2015 recruiting. The rest is back besides Taylor.
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I'm guessing draft Express is as accurate this far out from the draft as 2016 college recruiting lists. How many times have the bozos from draft express flown in to watch HE play? How about...zero. How many times have the same experts watched him play AAU? Probably zero.
Can u imagine a job in which your responsibility is to watch some AAU games and rank players based off of performance? Haha. Impossible. I read quotes on here that are from "recruiting experts" in which they state that they will have an updated list...or re-evaluate a certain player's standing in their top 100 list. It's like, "I'm going to fly out to Sioux Falls and watch "x" and then adjust the top 100 list." Yeah...ok. I'm sure P5 programs are waiting in anticipation.
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Draft Express is pretty good but the move from high school to college is challenging enough particularly for a kid from Rice Lake, I do not see it. 2 years I see at most if he is that good. Remember Brian Butch, he was a big time Top 10 player, that had a nice 4 year career at UW. Lets see how Henry does against better competition everyday, in practice as well as games.
Long way to go before he is in the NBA.
Can you really compare Butch to HE? Is it fair to compare across draft classes/years?
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I'm guessing draft Express is as accurate this far out from the draft as 2016 college recruiting lists. How many times have the bozos from draft express flown in to watch HE play? How about...zero. How many times have the same experts watched him play AAU? Probably zero.
Uh...HE did participate in several USA basketball functions. Draft Express has at least seen him once, if not more.
TWITTER TRACKER
[/b]
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Henry Ellenson's 36.4 PER was the best in @usabasketball U17 World Championship history, ahead of Michael Kidd-Gilchrist and Andre Drummond.
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Huge picked up for Marquette in Henry Ellenson. Averaged 29 pts, 17 rebs per-40 at U17s in Dubai. Looked great at Dev Camp this past weekend
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Here's an interview we did w/ Henry Ellenson at the U17 World Championship in Dubai. Had 3rd best PER at tournament. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Henry-Ellenson-7234/ …
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Uh...HE did participate in several USA basketball functions. Draft Express has at least seen him once, if not more.
TWITTER TRACKER
[/b]
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Henry Ellenson's 36.4 PER was the best in @usabasketball U17 World Championship history, ahead of Michael Kidd-Gilchrist and Andre Drummond.
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Huge picked up for Marquette in Henry Ellenson. Averaged 29 pts, 17 rebs per-40 at U17s in Dubai. Looked great at Dev Camp this past weekend
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Here's an interview we did w/ Henry Ellenson at the U17 World Championship in Dubai. Had 3rd best PER at tournament. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Henry-Ellenson-7234/ …
This....it's not just local HS hoops for guys of HE's caliber.
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Uh...HE did participate in several USA basketball functions. Draft Express has at least seen him once, if not more.
TWITTER TRACKER
[/b]
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Henry Ellenson's 36.4 PER was the best in @usabasketball U17 World Championship history, ahead of Michael Kidd-Gilchrist and Andre Drummond.
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Huge picked up for Marquette in Henry Ellenson. Averaged 29 pts, 17 rebs per-40 at U17s in Dubai. Looked great at Dev Camp this past weekend
Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress · Oct 9
Here's an interview we did w/ Henry Ellenson at the U17 World Championship in Dubai. Had 3rd best PER at tournament. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Henry-Ellenson-7234/ …
Oh...well...thank god they saw him outside of h.s. and AAU.
Quick question: if these guys are so damn good at evaluating talent, why haven't they gotten hired by an NBA franchise? No need to respond...I know the answer.
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Oh...well...thank god they saw him outside of h.s. and AAU.
Quick question: if these guys are so damn good at evaluating talent, why haven't they gotten hired by an NBA franchise? No need to respond...I know the answer.
They do get hired at times - but there are a limited number of jobs.
And, I don't think you understand the whole concept here. It is NOT an exact science. You aren't just looking at Player A and saying he is better than Player B. You are projecting one, two, three or more years ahead depending on what level you are scouting. You are projecting mental and physical growth as well as looking at current basketball skills.
It's not about who is the best shooter or best jumper, etc. Besides the obvious skills that you look for, they are watching what the player does when he has the ball, when he doesn't have the ball, when he is on defense, how hard of a worker the player on and off the court, etc. etc.
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NBA scouts don't have a monopoly on evaluatiing talent....they make mistakes all the time. It is an inexact science to say the least.
Also my understanding is that Draft Express does talk to NBA scouts as well as evaluate players on their own.
I am no scout yet I saw Demarcus Cousins play once at Mark Millers tournament when he was a junior in high school and told the people I was with that he would be a lottery pick.
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NBA scouts don't have a monopoly on evaluatiing talent....they make mistakes all the time. It is an inexact science to say the least.
Also my understanding is that Draft Express does talk to NBA scouts as well as evaluate players on their own.
I am no scout yet I saw Demarcus Cousins play once at Mark Millers tournament when he was a junior in high school and told the people I was with that he would be a lottery pick.
Draft Express has seemed pretty decent in the past on their pre-draft Mocks. It's awfully hard to predict a year or two ahead of time.
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They do get hired at times - but there are a limited number of jobs.
Who?
And, I don't think you understand the whole concept here. It is NOT an exact science.
Do you mean to tell me that the 55th ranked player isn't better than the 56th ranked player and slightly worse than the 54th ranked play in any given year? Crap!
You aren't just looking at Player A and saying he is better than Player B. You are projecting one, two, three or more years ahead depending on what level you are scouting. You are projecting mental and physical growth as well as looking at current basketball skills.
How do they project growth? Do they have access to medical records? Are they also doctors? Can they project growth themselves based on growth plates. You know...I could stick my head up a cows....nevermind.
It's not about who is the best shooter or best jumper, etc. Besides the obvious skills that you look for, they are watching what the player does when he has the ball, when he doesn't have the ball, when he is on defense, how hard of a worker the player on and off the court, etc. etc.
Oh my god, you mean to tell me that they watch players? Get outta town!
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Can you really compare Butch to HE? Is it fair to compare across draft classes/years?
Ellenson is much farther along physically at the same stage as Butch. Brian had a hard time staying on the floor for long spurts while Henry and Diamond Stone can play an entire high school game. That's the big reason Brian redshirted.
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So, TAMU or anyone... any idea if we are targeting anyone outside of Dillard? Is there a random darkhorse candidate that we aren't paying attention to that likely plays the 3?
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So, TAMU or anyone... any idea if we are targeting anyone outside of Dillard? Is there a random darkhorse candidate that we aren't paying attention to that likely plays the 3?
I think you should always keep 1 scholarship for spring with about 500 kids transferring every year, with 12 kids next year coming in, thats enough to try and keep them all happy? Unless
there is a top kid, why use it? And I am saying a 4-5 star.
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I think you should always keep 1 scholarship for spring with about 500 kids transferring every year, with 12 kids next year coming in, thats enough to try and keep them all happy? Unless
there is a top kid, why use it? And I am saying a 4-5 star.
Not to stereotype dukies but with Wojo having the Duke mentality bringing it to a school with the tradition of MU I think he'd agree with you it's either transfers that have proven they can ball or 4-5 stars out of HS
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So, TAMU or anyone... any idea if we are targeting anyone outside of Dillard? Is there a random darkhorse candidate that we aren't paying attention to that likely plays the 3?
Dillard and Frazier are the only names I've heard for sure.
Some other guys who are top 150 talent, that aren't already a heavy lean elsewhere, who I think could help us include:
Marcus LoVett: 6-0 170 PG from Chicago (only top 100 kid besides Dillard/Frazier I really think we could have a shot at)
Shawntrez Davis: 6-8 200 PF from Atlanta
Keith Stone: 6-7 240 SF from Florida (no relation to the Keystone Lite guy)
Andre Adams: 6-8 200 PF from Florida
Damontrae Jefferson: 5-7 150 PG from Milwaukee (Mo Acker Reduex!)
Isaiah Moss: 6-5 175 SF from Chicago (former Steve Taylor Jr. teammate)
Jordan Murphy: 6-7 215 SF from Texas (former Buzz target)
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Dillard and Frazier are the only names I've heard for sure.
Some other guys who are top 150 talent, that aren't already a heavy lean elsewhere, who I think could help us include:
Marcus LoVett: 6-0 170 PG from Chicago (only top 100 kid besides Dillard/Frazier I really think we could have a shot at)
Shawntrez Davis: 6-8 200 PF from Atlanta
Keith Stone: 6-7 240 SF from Florida (no relation to the Keystone Lite guy)
Andre Adams: 6-8 200 PF from Florida
Damontrae Jefferson: 5-7 150 PG from Milwaukee (Mo Acker Reduex!)
Isaiah Moss: 6-5 175 SF from Chicago (former Steve Taylor Jr. teammate)
Jordan Murphy: 6-7 215 SF from Texas (former Buzz target)
I think LoVett is the guy we may end up with if Dilliard picks Purdue.
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Dillard and Frazier are the only names I've heard for sure.
Some other guys who are top 150 talent, that aren't already a heavy lean elsewhere, who I think could help us include:
Marcus LoVett: 6-0 170 PG from Chicago (only top 100 kid besides Dillard/Frazier I really think we could have a shot at)
Shawntrez Davis: 6-8 200 PF from Atlanta
Keith Stone: 6-7 240 SF from Florida (no relation to the Keystone Lite guy)
Andre Adams: 6-8 200 PF from Florida
Damontrae Jefferson: 5-7 150 PG from Milwaukee (Mo Acker Reduex!)
Isaiah Moss: 6-5 175 SF from Chicago (former Steve Taylor Jr. teammate)
Jordan Murphy: 6-7 215 SF from Texas (former Buzz target)
Isaiah Moss never played with Steve Taylor at Simeon. He was at Lincoln Way East his freshman year. He blew up over the summer. When I played against him he wasn't aggressive and seemed to be hesitant to shoot.
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Recruits for 2015--- I know we have NN, but I think Marcus LoVett would be outstanding. If Dawson
doesn't have a good year or start, I think he leaves. Also a good rebounder and sky jumper like Shawntrez Davis at 6-8 would be a compliment to the front line off the bench. Heldt, who I think will be a solid player
at MU, will need a year or 2. Just a thought
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Recruits for 2015--- I know we have NN, but I think Marcus LoVett would be outstanding. If Dawson
doesn't have a good year or start, I think he leaves. Also a good rebounder and sky jumper like Shawntrez Davis at 6-8 would be a compliment to the front line off the bench. Heldt, who I think will be a solid player
at MU, will need a year or 2. Just a thought
I agree with you.
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Is MU in contact with LoVett? Or are you just guessing?
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Recruits for 2015--- I know we have NN, but I think Marcus LoVett would be outstanding. If Dawson
doesn't have a good year or start, I think he leaves. Also a good rebounder and sky jumper like Shawntrez Davis at 6-8 would be a compliment to the front line off the bench. Heldt, who I think will be a solid player
at MU, will need a year or 2. Just a thought
It is certainly possible, but I find it hard to believe that he thought he was going to get significant playing time when he signed with MU. He would not of played at all last year, if Duane did not get hurt.
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Is MU in contact with LoVett? Or are you just guessing?
We supposedly are, but I don't know to what extent.
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It worked before
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So it looks like Dillard is the target....hmm.
Also, Dillard's recent re-tweets indicate that he is interested in MU.
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It worked before
Is Dillard for Levin a good trade?
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Is Dillard for Levin a good trade?
Matter of opinion, but most I have talked to think Dillard is underrated because of off him and his former coach not getting along. He would be exactly what this class is lacking. Super athlete wing whose game is repeatedly described as "nasty" and "mean." In a good way of course.
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I get the impression that Levin wasn't a real good fit. I don't think he will be considered a big loss at all.
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Is Dillard for Levin a good trade?
Levin is a proven Division I player. Dillard hasn't shown anything at the college level, so he is unproven. Dillard is higher ranked out of HS because of his athleticism. So, Dillard is riskier with a greater potential for greatness or to bust while Levin would have almost certainly been a solid guy but with a much more limited upside.
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I get the impression that Levin wasn't a real good fit. I don't think he will be considered a big loss at all.
I wasn't thrilled when Levin identified playing on the perimeter as one of the reasons he wanted to transfer to MU.
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So it looks like Dillard is the target....hmm.
Also, Dillard's recent re-tweets indicate that he is interested in MU.
Wouldn't read too much into that. He has a Purdue retweet the same day as a couple of the Marquette ones, and Pitt and Iowa retweets in late September. Think the kid just enjoys the attention.
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So it looks like Dillard is the target....hmm.
Also, Dillard's recent re-tweets indicate that he is interested in MU.
Wouldn't read too much into that. He has a Purdue retweet the same day as a couple of the Marquette ones, and Pitt and Iowa retweets in late September. Think the kid just enjoys the attention.
I think that he was actually reading into Big Daddy's name update.
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Levin is a proven Division I player. Dillard hasn't shown anything at the college level, so he is unproven. Dillard is higher ranked out of HS because of his athleticism. So, Dillard is riskier with a greater potential for greatness or to bust while Levin would have almost certainly been a solid guy but with a much more limited upside.
I agree with your risk reward analysis of the two players. I think if we are filling Levins spot with a 2015 a guy like Dillard makes sense , if we are going to get a transfer I would like to see another proven player. The thing I liked about Levin was his rebounding credentials which is something we need.
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Damontrae Jefferson: 5-7 150 PG from Milwaukee (Mo Acker Reduex!)
So intrigued by Trae. Have been for years. Really looking forward to watch things unfold.. could go many ways. He is sensationally skilled. Just amazing. Could sell tickets for any program. He's also fearless with a little bit of crazy. Harness some of his attributes and cultivate the good and he's a gem. Don't know if it can be done. Dude's got a strong personality. Really interesting kid.
Hope he does well wherever he lands. I'll be watching. He rubs a lot of people the wrong way, but man...
Watching the interactions between him and Kevon, including this summer, I have hope.
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So intrigued by Trae. Have been for years. Really looking forward to watch things unfold.. could go many ways. He is sensationally skilled. Just amazing. Could sell tickets for any program. He's also fearless with a little bit of crazy. Harness some of his attributes and cultivate the good and he's a gem. Don't know if it can be done. Dude's got a strong personality. Really interesting kid.
Hope he does well wherever he lands. I'll be watching. He rubs a lot of people the wrong way, but man...
Watching the interactions between him and Kevon, including this summer, I have hope.
Says he plays in MKE. Where's he going to school?
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Says he plays in MKE. Where's he going to school?
Most Internet sites are full of bad info
He was in Fla two years ago for HS (Arlington Country Day), then to South Carolina (Believe Prep) last school year.
Has continued played w the MKE Runnin Rebels in summer though
Started HS w Kevon at Hamilton
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Most Internet sites are full of bad info
He was in Fla two years ago for HS (Arlington Country Day), then to South Carolina (Believe Prep) last school year.
Has continued played w the MKE Runnin Rebels in summer though
Started HS w Kevon at Hamilton
Sure looks fun to watch in his videos.
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Most Internet sites are full of bad info
He was in Fla two years ago for HS (Arlington Country Day), then to South Carolina (Believe Prep) last school year.
Has continued played w the MKE Runnin Rebels in summer though
Started HS w Kevon at Hamilton
Another kid with multiple high schools? Oh yeah, that always ends well. ::)
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Another kid with multiple high schools? Oh yeah, that always ends well. ::)
Yeah who would want guys like Deonte Burton, Lazar Hayward, and Junior Cadougan coming to Marquette? ::) is right.
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Will probably know soon if MU is going to go after another 2015 prospect this fall as next weekend is really the best recruiting weekend left before the signing period since they go to Virginia to scrimmage on November 1st and the next weekend is kind of the last ditch effort weekend. Starting to look like they could be holding it until spring?
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Will probably know soon if MU is going to go after another 2015 prospect this fall as next weekend is really the best recruiting weekend left before the signing period since they go to Virginia to scrimmage on November 1st and the next weekend is kind of the last ditch effort weekend. Starting to look like they could be holding it until spring?
Holding it until Spring might be a great idea unless someone special is available. Seems to me that Gardner was a Spring signing and we certainly know how his 4 year career at MU went. Not that Wojo would go this route but that also opens the door to a transfer or Juco.
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Holding it until Spring might be a great idea unless someone special is available. Seems to me that Gardner was a Spring signing and we certainly know how his 4 year career at MU went. Not that Wojo would go this route but that also opens the door to a transfer or Juco.
Pretty sure DJO, Gardner, Butler, and Crowder were all spring signings. Pretty crazy that we were able to pick up guys of that level that late in the game.
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Is MU in contact with LoVett? Or are you just guessing?
http://dimemag.com/2014/08/video-marcus-lovett-jr-jamal-crawford-show-sick-handles-seattle-pro/
It's few months old, but we are at the top of his list in August.
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http://dimemag.com/2014/08/video-marcus-lovett-jr-jamal-crawford-show-sick-handles-seattle-pro/
It's few months old, but we are at the top of his list in August.
IIRC, Buzz was in on Lovett early. The fact that Marquette is listed in an August article most likely indicates that Lovett was followed up on by Wojo when he arrived. i remember being surprised that Buzz felt he had a good enough shot at a SoCal guy to be involved as much as he seemed to be. Now that the Chicago connection has been revealed, it makes more sense.
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Unless we hear in the next day or two that there is an official visitor this weekend, I think Wojo may be done until the spring.
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Unless we hear in the next day or two that there is an official visitor this weekend, I think Wojo may be done until the spring.
This guy gets ONE consensus 5* stud PF and 3 other 4* recruits in his first class and he's already resting on his laurels???
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This guy gets ONE consensus 5* stud PF and 3 other 4* recruits in his first class and he's already resting on his laurels???
Sounds like he's already mailing it in. It's like he isn't even trying for another 5 star.
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Sounds like he's already mailing it in. It's like he isn't even trying for another 5 star.
Wojo to Duke.
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Sounds like he's already mailing it in. It's like he isn't even trying for another 5 star.
You guys are unbelievable! Not every five star will pass on Kentucky's Midnight Madness like Ellenson did. Now that that's over, they'll get serious and start parading through the Marquette campus. Can we please move onto a serious discussion like who's going to go pro early to make room for two more five star guys?
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Pretty sure DJO, Gardner, Butler, and Crowder were all spring signings. Pretty crazy that we were able to pick up guys of that level that late in the game.
Squirmy.