MUScoop
MUScoop => The Superbar => Topic started by: jesmu84 on August 18, 2014, 12:11:23 PM
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Thoughts on Ferguson and militarization of police: http://youtu.be/KUdHIatS36A
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Thoughts on Ferguson and militarization of police: http://youtu.be/KUdHIatS36A
Outstanding segment.
Ferguson should not resemble Falujah!!
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His wife, who is gorgeous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gskZizjEak
Also, she is an Iraq War veteran who served as a US Army medic
[EDIT]Ack, didn't watch what the video was about prior to posting.
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Found Oliver's critique of how crapty payday loans are to be spot on
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Wife is a good lookin gal too
(http://www.tampabay.com/resources/images/blogs/juice/57874.jpg)
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Thoughts on Ferguson and militarization of police: http://youtu.be/KUdHIatS36A
Every 58 hours a cop is killed in this country in the line of duty. I'd like to see Oliver be a cop and see what kind of protection he would like in going out on the streets. Easy to be brave behind a camera.
This doesn't even get into assaults, that was merely deaths. 1,501 deaths to cops in 10 years, or 150 per year...about 1 every 58 hours. For assaults, 58,261 assaults on cops the last ten years. On average, 16 per day.
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Every 58 hours a cop is killed in this country in the line of duty. I'd like to see Oliver be a cop and see what kind of protection he would like in going out on the streets. Easy to be brave behind a camera.
This doesn't even get into assaults, that was merely deaths. 1,501 deaths to cops in 10 years, or 150 per year...about 1 every 58 hours. For assaults, 58,261 assaults on cops the last ten years. On average, 16 per day.
Poor logic.
There could be 10 million cops killed per day, and it wouldn't mean this shooting was justified. It's an individual event.
I know it's impossible, but everybody (including the protesters) needs to wait and see what a federal investigation reveals.
Let's engage our brains and apply logic, not emotion.
EDIT: And as far as the police militarization and reaction to the protestors, I honestly don't know how to feel. I understand people's frustration because they think the deck is stacked against them, but I also understand the Police's need to exercise some muscle in order to prevent further rioting and damage. It's a tough situation. I really don't have a good answer.
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Poor logic.
There could be 10 million cops killed per day, and it wouldn't mean this shooting was justified. It's an individual event.
I know it's impossible, but everybody (including the protesters) needs to wait and see what a federal investigation reveals.
Let's engage our brains and apply logic, not emotion.
It would mean more if communities got this upset about every unarmed kid that gets mowed down by gunfire on a daily basis. For some reason, it's only a big deal if a cop is involved.
A 15yr old kid got shot dead a block away from my office on the south side of Chicago last week. You'd think there would be outrage? Nope, just a few balloons, flowers and pics. It's mostly forgotten about already
When these shootings are all taken as seriously as the one in Ferguson, I can get on board with the outrage
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Poor logic.
There could be 10 million cops killed per day, and it wouldn't mean this shooting was justified. It's an individual event.
I know it's impossible, but everybody (including the protesters) needs to wait and see what a federal investigation reveals.
Let's engage our brains and apply logic, not emotion.
EDIT: And as far as the police militarization and reaction to the protestors, I honestly don't know how to feel. I understand people's frustration because they think the deck is stacked against them, but I also understand the Police's need to exercise some muscle in order to prevent further rioting and damage. It's a tough situation. I really don't have a good answer.
In approx. four decades of life, I have learned that getting to the bottom of the story - any story - is damn near impossible, even when you're an eye witness. That said, you can get a pretty good idea of the truth simply by taking the opinion/position of any of the following individuals/groups and assuming the opposite to be true:
1) Labor Unions
2) Al Sharpton & Jesse Jackson
3) "Conservative" talk radio
4) O.J. Simpson
5) Any blonde female that appears on Fox News
6) Hippies, especially those being interviewed from Burning Man
7) KCNA
8) Anyone who lists "activist" in their one-line bio.
9) Joan Rivers (hey... we need a center square, and Paul Lynde is dead)
Here... I'll take Al Sharpton for the block.
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It would mean more if communities got this upset about every unarmed kid that gets mowed down by gunfire on a daily basis. For some reason, it's only a big deal if a cop is involved.
"For some reason?"
The reason is that they are employees of the tax-payers, entrusted with keeping the public safe. I expect the standard to be much higher for someone like that than for a common criminal.
I know it's impossible, but everybody (including the protesters) needs to wait and see what a federal investigation reveals.
Good luck. My guess is that there is going to be something for either side to grab a hold on to justify their position. For instance, maybe he rushed the cop. But how far away was he? Were six bullets necessary?
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"For some reason?"
The reason is that they are employees of the tax-payers, entrusted with keeping the public safe. I expect the standard to be much higher for someone like that than for a common criminal.
So if the police aren't to your standards, who would be? The military?
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So if the police aren't to your standards, who would be? The military?
I am not understanding your question.
Most police are certainly up to "my standards." I was commenting on why these types of shootings get more coverage than local criminals shooting one another.
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EDIT: And as far as the police militarization and reaction to the protestors, I honestly don't know how to feel. I understand people's frustration because they think the deck is stacked against them, but I also understand the Police's need to exercise some muscle in order to prevent further rioting and damage. It's a tough situation. I really don't have a good answer.
That's the hardest part of being a leader, Canned - finding the least bad alternative in a sea of bad ones. No matter what you do you get pilloried - kind of like when your choice at point guard is between.....well, I guess I won't go there.
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Come on people, we all know where this is going. A discussion of Ferguson and race and police militarization? This will be productive and not at all political.
(http://i718.photobucket.com/albums/ww190/VR1/In-Before-the-Lock.gif)
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That's the hardest part of being a leader, Canned - finding the least bad alternative in a sea of bad ones. No matter what you do you get pilloried - kind of like when your choice at point guard is between.....well, I guess I won't go there.
Ya, I mean, honestly, I watched the news and I was arguing with myself.
I completely understand a community that is frustrated, reached a boiling point, and now is trying to stand up for itself (against a perceived injustice). I don't like the idea that protesters are facing cops in riot gear. Feels very Birmingham, doesn't it?
However, on the flip side, if you let that mob "protest" and take a hands off approach, it's likely to boil over and cause more damage that good. The riot gear may look bad, but cops in riot gear might have saved a lot of lives and damage.
Tough, tough spot.
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"For some reason?"
The reason is that they are employees of the tax-payers, entrusted with keeping the public safe. I expect the standard to be much higher for someone like that than for a common criminal.
Good luck. My guess is that there is going to be something for either side to grab a hold on to justify their position. For instance, maybe he rushed the cop. But how far away was he? Were six bullets necessary?
You're right, we'll never get 100% certainty, but that doesn't mean intelligent people shouldn't search for the truth. Too easy to jump on (insert side) and rant and rave. Engage your brains, people.
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I basically never agree with this author about anything, but this time he is spot on.
http://www.steynonline.com/6524/cigars-but-not-close
"So, when the police are dressed like combat troops, it's not a fashion faux pas, it's a fundamental misunderstanding of who they are. Forget the armored vehicles with the gun turrets, forget the faceless, helmeted, anonymous Robocops, and just listen to how these "policemen" talk. Look at the video as they're arresting the New York Times and Huffington Post reporters. Watch the St Louis County deputy ordering everyone to leave, and then adding: "This is not up for discussion."
Really? You're a constable. You may be carrying on like the military commander of an occupying army faced with a rabble of revolting natives, but in the end you're a constable. And the fact that you and your colleagues in that McDonald's are comfortable speaking to your fellow citizens like this is part of the problem. The most important of the "nine principles of good policing" (formulated by the first two commissioners of the Metropolitan Police in 1829 and thereafter issued to every officer joining the force) is a very simple one: The police are the public and the public are the police. Not in Ferguson. Long before the teargassing begins and the bullets start flying, the way these guys talk is the first indication of how the remorseless militarization has corroded the soul of American policing."
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So if the police aren't to your standards, who would be? The military?
Relevant.
Don't Call the Police "Militarized." The Military Is Better Than This.
http://gawker.com/dont-call-the-police-militarized-the-military-is-bet-1621523647
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I basically never agree with this author about anything, but this time he is spot on.
http://www.steynonline.com/6524/cigars-but-not-close
"So, when the police are dressed like combat troops, it's not a fashion faux pas, it's a fundamental misunderstanding of who they are. Forget the armored vehicles with the gun turrets, forget the faceless, helmeted, anonymous Robocops, and just listen to how these "policemen" talk. Look at the video as they're arresting the New York Times and Huffington Post reporters. Watch the St Louis County deputy ordering everyone to leave, and then adding: "This is not up for discussion."
Really? You're a constable. You may be carrying on like the military commander of an occupying army faced with a rabble of revolting natives, but in the end you're a constable. And the fact that you and your colleagues in that McDonald's are comfortable speaking to your fellow citizens like this is part of the problem. The most important of the "nine principles of good policing" (formulated by the first two commissioners of the Metropolitan Police in 1829 and thereafter issued to every officer joining the force) is a very simple one: The police are the public and the public are the police. Not in Ferguson. Long before the teargassing begins and the bullets start flying, the way these guys talk is the first indication of how the remorseless militarization has corroded the soul of American policing."
I agree with this, but it's still such a sticky situation.
In defense of the police, they act like the military in some ways out of necessity. I'm sure they aren't excited to wear riot gear and yell at people, but when people don't listen, they have to become more and more forceful. It's not a perfect approach, but let's be honest, when the crap hits the fan, these guys aren't existential thinkers.
It's a really complicated situation. That my only strong opinion. This crap is really complex, and I don't think there are any foolproof solutions.
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(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111134798/3480921-inbeforethelockij.gif)
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Let's not view this as an isolated incident.
Rather, it is just another in a series of "isolated incidents" that have gone on continuously for 250+ years.
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Poor logic.
There could be 10 million cops killed per day, and it wouldn't mean this shooting was justified. It's an individual event.
I know it's impossible, but everybody (including the protesters) needs to wait and see what a federal investigation reveals.
Let's engage our brains and apply logic, not emotion.
EDIT: And as far as the police militarization and reaction to the protestors, I honestly don't know how to feel. I understand people's frustration because they think the deck is stacked against them, but I also understand the Police's need to exercise some muscle in order to prevent further rioting and damage. It's a tough situation. I really don't have a good answer.
I didn't say a word about the shooting, you did.
Personally, I'm going to wait until ALL the facts come in. What I've seen so far, from people like Chris Hayes, Al, and others, is they can't wait to convict someone before ALL the facts come in.
Here's what I've seen so far during the electronic lynching:
Witnesses claim he was shot in the back, autopsy (two of them) show he wasn't. Oops. Narrative changing.
Narrative about what an angel this guy was....he was going to college afterall. Robbed a store minutes prior to getting killed, had a juvenile arrest record, illegal drugs in system. Ooops. Narrative keeps changing.
Media claims rubber bullets fired at demonstrators...."rubber bullets" turn out to be ear plugs. Sensational journalism.
Does this justify his death? Nope. I don't know what happened, YOU don't know what happened. You don't know if the shooting was justified any more than I do. Let the facts come out, instead a whole lot of people can't wait to bury this guy and convict him. Meanwhile, over the weekend another 9 African Americans shot and killed by African Americans in Chicago....crickets...crickets...crickets....
In the meantime, some good advice from a cop who teaches other cops. "Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me." Pretty simple. You bum rush a cop, you're going to get hurt. Respect the cops, do what they say to do., simple credo to live by. There are some bad cops out there, but most are not.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if-you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z2
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Ya, I mean, honestly, I watched the news and I was arguing with myself.
I completely understand a community that is frustrated, reached a boiling point, and now is trying to stand up for itself (against a perceived injustice). I don't like the idea that protesters are facing cops in riot gear. Feels very Birmingham, doesn't it?
Also great when a majority of the "protestors" causing trouble aren't from Ferguson, but bussed in. What would Nancy call this....astroturfing?
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You're right, we'll never get 100% certainty, but that doesn't mean intelligent people shouldn't search for the truth. Too easy to jump on (insert side) and rant and rave. Engage your brains, people.
I love Sultan's "six bullets necessary"....I read stuff like that and can only think this is a person that has NEVER shot a pistol in his life. Do you know how long it takes to squeeze off 6 rounds? About 2 seconds. When the blood is flowing, and if the guys is being bum rushed (I don't know if that is the case, IF), that 2 seconds will feel like 2 nanoseconds. Furthermore you are trained to stop the guy. If he is still moving toward you, you keep shooting and center mass.
I actually saw a few shows on MSNBC talking about how the cop should shoot for the legs. OMG. No police force in the USA EVER is taught to shoot for the legs. CENTER MASS, every time. These people have been watching too much television and don't deal in reality.
I'd recommend for Sultan and others to educate themselves a bit, on why 6 bullets are used. http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/19/opinion/haberfeld-why-six-bullets-fired/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_latest+%28RSS%3A+Most+Recent%29
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From a friend:
There will be no winners. The prosecutor is racist if he doesn't put up some kind of murder charge, the cop is a murderer forever, the kid will always be seen as a robbing/assaulting druggie that got shot for attacking a cop, the little police dept will be seen as racist and inept because they couldn't, overnight, handle thousands of protestors, thousands of media and the race industry dropping out of heaven into their back yard, the residents will be seen as savage criminals waiting to steal, loot and destroy for no good reason. Every white-black/left-right stereotype is being reinforced in this event and it will result in one big nothing. Lets hope supporters of the police don't show up on scene to counterbalance this fiasco, then it could turn into an all out free for all....and really good TV
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In the meantime, some good advice from a cop who teaches other cops. "Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me." Pretty simple. You bum rush a cop, you're going to get hurt. Respect the cops, do what they say to do., simple credo to live by. There are some bad cops out there, but most are not.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if-you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z2
This is why everyone hates cops.
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I'd recommend for Sultan and others to educate themselves a bit, on why 6 bullets are used. http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/19/opinion/haberfeld-why-six-bullets-fired/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_latest+%28RSS%3A+Most+Recent%29
Someone tell Chicos that the very article he quoted said the following things:
"Police officers receive between 70 and 120 hours of training in the use of deadly force from the technical angle -- that is, how to fire their guns accurately. But little in their training modules touches upon the psychological, physiological and social aspects of the use of deadly force. This is a mistake."
and
"Police also receive practically no training in stress management; if a department decides to offer such training, it is usually on an experimental basis and not incorporated long term. But without learning to manage stressful encounters, officers will find themselves again and again in situations in which human life -- that of the person the force is used against or the police officer who shoots -- is sacrificed because of an error of judgment."
and
"Researchers have shown that under the stress of a deadly force encounter, a series of physiological changes occur. Visual perception becomes seriously impaired: Up to 70% of the peripheral vision is affected. This visual impairment often creates an inability to assess how many shots are needed and if indeed the suspect has been incapacitated to the point of posing no more threat to the police officer or others."
So if he is coming to the defense of the police and how they handled this situation, THE VERY ARTICLE HE LINKED TO pointed out multiple deficiencies in how the police were trained to handle the situation.
Someone also tell Chicos that if he is going to put me on ignore, then ignore me. Really calling me out because he reads and responds to what I write only when other people quote me in posts is the equivalent of a little kid, who during a fight, just sits on the sidelines until he can sucker-punch someone. I guess it's not surprising really...
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From a friend:
There will be no winners. The prosecutor is racist if he doesn't put up some kind of murder charge, the cop is a murderer forever, the kid will always be seen as a robbing/assaulting druggie that got shot for attacking a cop, the little police dept will be seen as racist and inept because they couldn't, overnight, handle thousands of protestors, thousands of media and the race industry dropping out of heaven into their back yard, the residents will be seen as savage criminals waiting to steal, loot and destroy for no good reason. Every white-black/left-right stereotype is being reinforced in this event and it will result in one big nothing. Lets hope supporters of the police don't show up on scene to counterbalance this fiasco, then it could turn into an all out free for all....and really good TV
Sadly true. No one is going to wait for all the facts to come in. Too much of a chance to create a stir. Unfortunate.
Having said that, I think the over-militarization of police is a bit ridiculous is some situations.
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In the meantime, some good advice from a cop who teaches other cops. "Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me." Pretty simple. You bum rush a cop, you're going to get hurt. Respect the cops, do what they say to do., simple credo to live by. There are some bad cops out there, but most are not.
This may be the most disgusting commentary on police that I have ever read.
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This may be the most disgusting commentary on police that I have ever read.
Yeah and it really does point to the problem. Part of what police are supposed to do is diffuse a situation. The response to being called a name...a racist pig...etc. is to talk people down. Not to be indignant about it.
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Sadly true. No one is going to wait for all the facts to come in. Too much of a chance to create a stir. Unfortunate.
Having said that, I think the over-militarization of police is a bit ridiculous is some situations.
It is, but the blame lies with the Dept. of Homeland Security for funding this. The rich and powerful found just another way to intimidate US citizens.
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Yeah and it really does point to the problem. Part of what police are supposed to do is diffuse a situation. The response to being called a name...a racist pig...etc. is to talk people down. Not to be indignant about it.
You're right, of course. Their job is to deescalate the situation - not to rachet up the tension even more.
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It is, but the blame lies with the Dept. of Homeland Security for funding this. The rich and powerful found just another way to intimidate US citizens the poor and dangerous.
FIFY.
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This is why everyone hates cops.
Not EVERYONE hates cops. Not even the majority hate cops.
Good try
They have a tough job, most do a great job, some do not.
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Report: Cop had blown out orbital blowout fracture of the eye socket.
Narrative, keeps changing.
Howard Kurtz, former CNN reporter nails it. "Some liberal outlets [are] creating almost a lynch mob mentality around this, the Huffington Post today, screaming banner headline ‘Arrest Him.’ Now, the Huffington Post, nor you or I, knows exactly what happened” he said. And “when you cross that line into becoming an advocate and to demanding that somebody be prosecuted before the facts are in, while the investigation is going on, you’re grandstanding, you’re trying to keep the story alive and I really think it’s troubling.”
Kurtz also criticized CNN for showing the house of accused officer Darren Wilson, stating, “It defies my understanding how you could put his life or the life of his family in danger by even briefly showing the house or naming the street.”
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Report: Cop had blown out orbital blowout fracture of the eye socket.
so the officer's blown out orbital suffered a blowout fracture or his orbital blowout fracture was blown out?
<never took an anatomy class> ;D
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FIFY.
Good thing the criminal element out there (poor or rich) aren't intimidating law abiding citizens anywhere....that wasn't directed at you Benny, but I saw who you quoted and I refuse to unignore someone that calls a wife a liar without apologizing.
The reality is that in some cases the police are overarmed, they are buying up military surplus, etc. Coincidentally, since this has happened the deaths of cops has come down...that's not surprising and that result should have happened. What gets dangerous is if such arming makes them act in a way that is out of control, infringes on civil rights, etc while also providing them with the means to keep the peace, protect themselves, etc. A tough balancing act to be sure.
My little community has no such tactical force, just regular cop cars. They do have vests. Rest assured, if several of them died in the line of duty, there would be a public outcry here to arm up. Reactionary, but that's how life works in the U.S.
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As usual, Canned Goods 'n Ammo with by far the best, most thoughtful, reasoned posts in a thread like this.
That's all I got.
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Report: Cop had blown out orbital blowout fracture of the eye socket.
Narrative, keeps changing.
Yet he still managed to shoot Mike Brown in the head. Twice.
Interesting how you think that when the narrative changes it isn't suspicious at all. It's taken them more than a freaking week to come out with this! Oh and Gateway Pundit? Suuurreeeee.
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Good thing the criminal element out there (poor or rich) aren't intimidating law abiding citizens anywhere....that wasn't directed at you Benny, but I saw who you quoted and I refuse to unignore someone that calls a wife a liar without apologizing.
You have stated this on numerous occasions. I don't ever recall saying anything (good, bad, or indifferent) about your wife. Maybe you could enlighten me as to what I said.
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In the meantime, some good advice from a cop who teaches other cops. "Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me." Pretty simple. You bum rush a cop, you're going to get hurt. Respect the cops, do what they say to do., simple credo to live by. There are some bad cops out there, but most are not.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if-you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z2
So basically, "don't exercise your first amendment rights, and I won't shoot you."
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You have stated this on numerous occasions. I don't ever recall saying anything (good, bad, or indifferent) about your wife. Maybe you could enlighten me as to what I said.
He's talking about me.
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I like cops. They hang out at my fire station during their bathroom breaks, we visit, we insult each other, we drink pop and discuss our customers. But they are human and they do make mistakes. While on a medical call, I heard one of the cops, who I have always gotten along with well, say to the drunk/disorderly husband of the patient I was working on "I should have shot you when I had the chance."
I think the cop in Ferguson messed up. I think the riots in Ferguson have now taken on a life of their own.
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I think the riots in Ferguson have now taken on a life of their own.
I wonder if it would still be going on in the streets if it was -20 outside
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Yet he still managed to shoot Mike Brown in the head. Twice.
Interesting how you think that when the narrative changes it isn't suspicious at all. It's taken them more than a freaking week to come out with this! Oh and Gateway Pundit? Suuurreeeee.
You've clearly already tried and convicted the officer....irony.
This isn't an episode of CSI, things don't get wrapped up in a nice bow in 60 minutes. Investigations take place, witnesses are interviewed, video taken, witnesses REINTERVIEWED, ballistics done, etc. But that's ok, you already have the conspiracy well secured because it has taken too much time for the info to come out for you. LOL.
I've said I don't know what happened, yet you seem to....interesting. All I've said is there are other reports and the narrative changes. A few days ago, you would have screamed at the top of your lungs he was shot in the back because "witnesses said so"....then two pesky autopsy reports came out...damn those pesky things....no shots in the back.
I'll keep waiting for the facts and watch as the narrative changes (which I suspect it will change back and forth), you keep convicting....you've already made up your mind.
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The people doing the rioting and looting are just dumb. There is no reason to rob a convenience store because you're upset about police are handling a situation. Just dumb.
Can we just make it mandatory that cops have dash or vest cams now? 99% of all these incidences would be over quick with audio/video evidence one way or the other.
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Chicos much of what you're saying puts you in a light where you've never had a problem with cops. Perhaps because you're a wasc? (not as catchy as wasp but essentially the same) I've been repeatedly hauled off in cuffs for blood tests because officers are convinced my Tourette's is me driving on cocaine. Now that's a white college educated male's reason to dislike cops. Now let's imagine were an African American in a high crime area who's constantly getting stereotyped? I'm sorry but your constant going on of respect the cops and most are good etc. would be hard for me to follow I can't imagine how hard it would be for someone in say Brown's shoes.
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So basically, "don't exercise your first amendment rights, and I won't shoot you."
Nope, not basically....not at all. He didn't say anything about shooting anyone. Good try.
Pretty simple, words my dad taught me long ago. Cop tells you to do something, you do it. Yes sir, yes maam. If you disagree with them, then state so POLITELY. It isn't hard.
Oh, and don't bumrush a cop, not a good idea. Cops, by and large are there to protect and serve the public. They take a lot of crap from a lot of a$$holes, unfortunately.
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The people doing the rioting and looting are just dumb. There is no reason to rob a convenience store because you're upset about police are handling a situation. Just dumb.
Can we just make it mandatory that cops have dash or vest cams now? 99% of all these incidences would be over quick with audio/video evidence one way or the other.
It's people taking advantage of the situation, and police in tactical gear with mine-resistant vehicles along with the media coverage aren't making the late-night opportunity any less attractive to these people.
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You've clearly already tried and convicted the officer....irony.
This isn't an episode of CSI, things don't get wrapped up in a nice bow in 60 minutes. Investigations take place, witnesses are interviewed, video taken, witnesses REINTERVIEWED, ballistics done, etc. But that's ok, you already have the conspiracy well secured because it has taken too much time for the info to come out for you. LOL.
I've said I don't know what happened, yet you seem to....interesting. All I've said is there are other reports and the narrative changes. A few days ago, you would have screamed at the top of your lungs he was shot in the back because "witnesses said so"....then two pesky autopsy reports came out...damn those pesky things....no shots in the back.
I'll keep waiting for the facts and watch as the narrative changes (which I suspect it will change back and forth), you keep convicting....you've already made up your mind.
And it's just amazing that these "investigations" always end up clearing the officer of charges. He might have to take a leave of absence with pay, oh no!
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Nope, not basically....not at all. He didn't say anything about shooting anyone. Good try.
Actually he did. You just dishonestly snipped out that part of the quote, which I put in bold:
"Even though it might sound harsh and impolitic, here is the bottom line: if you don’t want to get shot, tased, pepper-sprayed, struck with a baton or thrown to the ground, just do what I tell you. Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me."
So in this guy's eyes, it's all up to the citizenry. "DON'T PROVOKE ME OR I MAY HAVE TO RESPOND!!!!" It's the Ray Rice defense of law enforcement.
And *this* is the guy who is teaching other cops??? F*cking scary.
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Chicos much of what you're saying puts you in a light where you've never had a problem with cops. Perhaps because you're a wasc? (not as catchy as wasp but essentially the same) I've been repeatedly hauled off in cuffs for blood tests because officers are convinced my Tourette's is me driving on cocaine. Now that's a white college educated male's reason to dislike cops. Now let's imagine were an African American in a high crime area who's constantly getting stereotyped? I'm sorry but your constant going on of respect the cops and most are good etc. would be hard for me to follow I can't imagine how hard it would be for someone in say Brown's shoes.
Oh, I get it just fine. But your commentary attempts to justify behavior. What's weird is the African Americans that are speaking out against the actions of some of the thuggish behavior of African Americans. I guess they aren't WASC....so they must simply be weird, or maybe they grew up in Beverly Hills or something...or maybe they didn't and they are just tired of the actions. Or, if you could riddle me why in departments dominated by African American officers have the same issues going on...are they stereotyping or policing? You do realize there is a difference, correct? When one polices in a high crime area, you tend to take proactive actions, which a lot of people don't like.
No one is saying that there isn't profiling that goes on and some folks have been victims of it. Let's not pretend that gives someone a right to be stupid, torch businesses, shoot at people, etc, either.
I'd love to hear your solution.
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And it's just amazing that these "investigations" always end up clearing the officer of charges. He might have to take a leave of absence with pay, oh no!
Always? Any other proverbial hyperbole you left out?
I'm sure there is a checklist you can get your hands on.
Face it, you've done EXACTLY what you lash out at others for....you have tried and convicted this guy based on NO EVIDENCE yet. He may be guilty as anything, but right now we don't know, but that didn't stop you at all.
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I like cops. They hang out at my fire station during their bathroom breaks, we visit, we insult each other, we drink pop and discuss our customers. But they are human and they do make mistakes. While on a medical call, I heard one of the cops, who I have always gotten along with well, say to the drunk/disorderly husband of the patient I was working on "I should have shot you when I had the chance."
I think the cop in Ferguson messed up. I think the riots in Ferguson have now taken on a life of their own.
Like everything else, it all comes stems from leadership.
I grew up in Kenosha and always respected the police there. Played ball with and against lots of the guys, never had any runins, blah, blah, blah.
Moved to Racine and it is the opposite. Have no use for them, don't want to talk to them, etc. Just a bunch of arrogant, macho jerks. Not to mention that they are terrible policemen.
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Actually he did. You just dishonestly snipped out that part of the quote, which I put in bold:
"Even though it might sound harsh and impolitic, here is the bottom line: if you don’t want to get shot, tased, pepper-sprayed, struck with a baton or thrown to the ground, just do what I tell you. Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me."
So in this guy's eyes, it's all up to the citizenry. "DON'T PROVOKE ME OR I MAY HAVE TO RESPOND!!!!" It's the Ray Rice defense of law enforcement.
And *this* is the guy who is teaching other cops??? F*cking scary.
Haha hilarious that it's from the article HE posted too. Clearly only the GIANT CLIPPED QUOTE ON THE MIDDLE OF THE PAGE was read by Chicos. I can tell this truncated quote will become some sort of rallying cry/meme for dittoheads across social media without a hint of what immediately preceded it.
This whole situation is royally effed.
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Oh, I get it just fine. But your commentary attempts to justify behavior. What's weird is the African Americans that are speaking out against the actions of some of the thuggish behavior of African Americans. I guess they aren't WASC....so they must simply be weird, or maybe they grew up in Beverly Hills or something...or maybe they didn't and they are just tired of the actions. Or, if you could riddle me why in departments dominated by African American officers have the same issues going on...are they stereotyping or policing? You do realize there is a difference, correct? When one polices in a high crime area, you tend to take proactive actions, which a lot of people don't like.
No one is saying that there isn't profiling that goes on and some folks have been victims of it. Let's not pretend that gives someone a right to be stupid, torch businesses, shoot at people, etc, either.
I'd love to hear your solution.
Woah dude you're putting many a word in my mouth. I never condoned rioting and torching a building looting etc is definitely not the answer. My commentary does not justify "thuggish behavior" if justifies the reason to disdain cops, to not trust cops, to not bend over whenever a cop tells you.
Regarding the police departments with majority African Americans I'm going to ignore that as factual till you put forth an actual example ti then it just appears like a baseless comment.
I am aware there is a difference between stereotyping and policing surprisingly I did actually graduate 6th grade when we covered those fun terms.
When one polices in a high crime area and uses those actions that the citizens don't like then it shouldn't come as any surprise that the citizens get annoyed and pushy at cops.
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Yet he still managed to shoot Mike Brown in the head. Twice.
Interesting how you think that when the narrative changes it isn't suspicious at all. It's taken them more than a freaking week to come out with this! Oh and Gateway Pundit? Suuurreeeee.
This first came out last Wednesday....hardly a week. He was treated at the hospital on August 13th, last Wednesday and it was reported that he was treated with a swollen face from being hit in the head.
News 4′s Laura Hettiger Wednesday morning, said the officer “was hit” and the “side of his face was swollen.”
They have not come out and said anything publicly about the level of the injuries, because that is a private medical matter. Of course, when they do release actual information, certain folks like yourself get all bent and start screaming character assassination when videos of the angel are out there robbing convenience stores. So the authorities are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Today a report (is it true, who knows) said two sources (District Attorney's office and Police sources) stated his orbital socket was broken. Whether it was or wasn't, it was reported 6 days ago that he sustained facial injuries without disclosure of how severe...must have been from him running backwards (explains why he wasn't shot in the back) while fleeing and not being anywhere close to the cop.
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Always? Any other proverbial hyperbole you left out?
I'm sure there is a checklist you can get your hands on.
Face it, you've done EXACTLY what you lash out at others for....you have tried and convicted this guy based on NO EVIDENCE yet. He may be guilty as anything, but right now we don't know, but that didn't stop you at all.
Based on NO evidence? How about a dead 17 year old? Numerous eye witnesses. But no, please trust the police report written by the friends of the murderer.
You know why people don't like cops? Because (generally) cops don't face the full repercussions of their actions and are protected by a system which only goes on to encourage more of this behavior because there are, again, no consequences to deter the action... and if there are, they are minor.
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Based on NO evidence? How about a dead 17 year old? Numerous eye witnesses. But no, please trust the police report written by the friends of the murderer.
You know why people don't like cops? Because (generally) cops don't face the full repercussions of their actions and are protected by a system which only goes on to encourage more of this behavior because there are, again, no consequences to deter the action... and if there are, they are minor.
Who is this 17 year old you speak of? Brown was 18, an adult. You continue to be short on the facts, but keep them coming...narrative changing. Of course, it's not surprising since the media (liberal ones at least), are stating he was a teenager despite the AP guidelines stating that anyone over the 18 should be discussed as a man or a woman. Then again, this is the same media that likes to trot out photos from age 12 to push their agenda. You're excused, just gullible in what you read. http://hotair.com/archives/2014/08/18/ap-violating-own-style-guidelines-to-refer-to-michael-brown-as-teenager/
Numerous witnesses???....a few, several of which said he was shot in the back....him...two autopsies said no entry wounds in the back. They sound like awesome witnesses. One said he (Brown) didn't attack the cop, I guess the busted up face came from the magic charms guy. There are also over a dozen witnesses that back the police version....for some reason you ignore those. Hmm. Interesting. You would make a great jurist with your wonderful ability to weigh ALL the facts, not just the ones that fill your biases.
I think you should rephrase your statement to be "some people don't like cops", even though the vast majority of people in this country support them and want MORE cops on the streets.
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This first came out last Wednesday....hardly a week. He was treated at the hospital on August 13th, last Wednesday and it was reported that he was treated with a swollen face from being hit in the head.
News 4′s Laura Hettiger Wednesday morning, said the officer “was hit” and the “side of his face was swollen.”
They have not come out and said anything publicly about the level of the injuries, because that is a private medical matter. Of course, when they do release actual information, certain folks like yourself get all bent and start screaming character assassination when videos of the angel are out there robbing convenience stores. So the authorities are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Today a report (is it true, who knows) said two sources (District Attorney's office and Police sources) stated his orbital socket was broken. Whether it was or wasn't, it was reported 6 days ago that he sustained facial injuries without disclosure of how severe...must have been from him running backwards (explains why he wasn't shot in the back) while fleeing and not being anywhere close to the cop.
Totes looks like he was worried about the orbital blowout fracture in his eye right after firing 6 shots into this kid. Literally just pacing around the kid and not once touches his eye. I guess it must
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbFROVARxuA#t=20
Why are you even remotely surprised by this? They've been trying to character assassinate the kid since day 1. He smoked weed, he stole some cigars - as if any of those things in any way justifies a murder.
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Who is this 17 year old you speak of? Brown was 18, an adult. You continue to be short on the facts, but keep them coming...narrative changing. Of course, it's not surprising since the media (liberal ones at least), are stating he was a teenager despite the AP guidelines stating that anyone over the 18 should be discussed as a man or a woman. Then again, this is the same media that likes to trot out photos from age 12 to push their agenda. You're excused, just gullible in what you read. http://hotair.com/archives/2014/08/18/ap-violating-own-style-guidelines-to-refer-to-michael-brown-as-teenager/
Numerous witnesses???....a few, several of which said he was shot in the back....him...two autopsies said no entry wounds in the back. They sound like awesome witnesses. One said he (Brown) didn't attack the cop, I guess the busted up face came from the magic charms guy. There are also over a dozen witnesses that back the police version....for some reason you ignore those. Hmm. Interesting. You would make a great jurist with your wonderful ability to weigh ALL the facts, not just the ones that fill your biases.
I think you should rephrase your statement to be "some people don't like cops", even though the vast majority of people in this country support them and want MORE cops on the streets.
Oh my god, if you keep getting your "information" from garbage sites like Gateway Pundit and Hot Air I'm just gonna keep laughing at you.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/18/michael-brown-autopsy-teenager-surrendering-ferguson
Also, please go on another paragraph long rant about how being 18 instead of 17 totally makes this shooting any different.
And what "beat face" are you talking about? Do you just keep pulling crap out of your ass. There's been no released photos of him. Your "evidence" that you've bought immediately still comes from one tweet from one reporter who got the information form "police sources."
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I think you should rephrase your statement to be "some people don't like cops", even though the vast majority of people in this country support them and want MORE cops on the streets.
I support more cops on the streets, but I want beat cops who know the neighborhoods, develop relationships and trust with citizens, work WITH communities to protect them and solve problems together. "Do what I say or I shoot you" is not the characterization of the kind of police I would support.
I don't want yet another branch of our bloated military.
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Woah dude you're putting many a word in my mouth. I never condoned rioting and torching a building looting etc is definitely not the answer. My commentary does not justify "thuggish behavior" if justifies the reason to disdain cops, to not trust cops, to not bend over whenever a cop tells you.
Regarding the police departments with majority African Americans I'm going to ignore that as factual till you put forth an actual example ti then it just appears like a baseless comment.
I am aware there is a difference between stereotyping and policing surprisingly I did actually graduate 6th grade when we covered those fun terms.
When one polices in a high crime area and uses those actions that the citizens don't like then it shouldn't come as any surprise that the citizens get annoyed and pushy at cops.
I'm sure it does bum them out, but the people of that city or jurisdiction elect their Sheriff, or Police captain. If they don't like how they are policed, then vote differently for your elected officials and change how it is done. Seems to me, the folks that are actually responsible and voting, want the thugs policed in that matter or it wouldn't continue.
In my view, what you said is that the distrust of the cops is why certain people act the way they do. You've given them a reason for their actions, a crutch. I view it as justification. You say that isn't the case....fair enough, but that's how I read your comments. Clearly, twice now, you have stated your concerns over cops. I have a differing view, one that the majority of Americans share. I've also said that some cops are bad, of course they are, but most are not. You seem to be overwhelmingly on the side of the opposite...most cops bad, some good. If I have read you wrong, please correct me but your words seem to imply that.
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In my view, what you said is that the distrust of the cops is why certain people act the way they do. You've given them a reason for their actions, a crutch. I view it as justification. You say that isn't the case....fair enough, but that's how I read your comments. Clearly, twice now, you have stated your concerns over cops. I have a differing view, one that the majority of white Americans share. I've also said that some cops are bad, of course they are, but most are not. You seem to be overwhelmingly on the side of the opposite...most cops bad, some good. If I have read you wrong, please correct me but your words seem to imply that.
FIFY
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I didn't say a word about the shooting, you did.
Personally, I'm going to wait until ALL the facts come in. What I've seen so far, from people like Chris Hayes, Al, and others, is they can't wait to convict someone before ALL the facts come in.
Here's what I've seen so far during the electronic lynching:
Witnesses claim he was shot in the back, autopsy (two of them) show he wasn't. Oops. Narrative changing.
Narrative about what an angel this guy was....he was going to college afterall. Robbed a store minutes prior to getting killed, had a juvenile arrest record, illegal drugs in system. Ooops. Narrative keeps changing.
Media claims rubber bullets fired at demonstrators...."rubber bullets" turn out to be ear plugs. Sensational journalism.
Does this justify his death? Nope. I don't know what happened, YOU don't know what happened. You don't know if the shooting was justified any more than I do. Let the facts come out, instead a whole lot of people can't wait to bury this guy and convict him. Meanwhile, over the weekend another 9 African Americans shot and killed by African Americans in Chicago....crickets...crickets...crickets....
In the meantime, some good advice from a cop who teaches other cops. "Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me." Pretty simple. You bum rush a cop, you're going to get hurt. Respect the cops, do what they say to do., simple credo to live by. There are some bad cops out there, but most are not.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if-you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z2
You say that you are going to wait for all the facts to come in, then immediately chastise the media reporting what information we have as undertaking a electronic lynching.
So basically, if they publish things that don't fit your agenda it is electronic lynching.
Also, you want to look at new information coming out (changing narrative) that support the cops version of the story (orbital blowout) as indicating that clearly the 18-yr old kid was lying as proof of an electronic lynching.
You, however, don't treat the cops story the same way. One of facts we do have from the autopsy is that there was no signs of an altercation on Brown. If (and I emphasize if), the officer suffered an orbital blowout, there would be bruising/contusions to Browns hand/fist. There were not.
So we very well may have mutually inconsistent facts, which raises even more questions about what occurred.
If you do really want to wait for all the facts (which I want to wait for), I would suggest just stepping away and not engaging in arguments. By default to engage in an environment requires taking one side, which means that one does not wait for all the facts.
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Oh my god, if you keep getting your "information" from garbage sites like Gateway Pundit and Hot Air I'm just gonna keep laughing at you.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/18/michael-brown-autopsy-teenager-surrendering-ferguson
Also, please go on another paragraph long rant about how being 18 instead of 17 totally makes this shooting any different.
And what "beat face" are you talking about? Do you just keep pulling crap out of your ass. There's been no released photos of him. Your "evidence" that you've bought immediately still comes from one tweet from one reporter who got the information form "police sources."
LOL....you were wrong. Just admit it. He was 18, not 17.
Yes, it's a big difference in our society and with the law, but pretend to make it not a big difference. The magical age of 18 is a huge difference. You were wrong, your facts were wrong and then you claim that I'm pulling something out. LOL.
HotAir did what others didn't....verbatim showed what the AP style guide says should be used and then shows what the media actually used. You don't like that they factually showed that clear difference. Not surprised.
No photos released of his face...oh noes. This isn't CSI, it will come out. There has been no photos released of Kevin Ward's broken spine, but I'm pretty sure there is an investigation and they put his body into the ground a few days ago. There were no released autopsy photos of JFK's head blown off officially, but you can find them if you look hard enough. I suppose JFK's top of his head wasn't blown off then, cuz no photos were released. Shall I continue?
Let me guess, if photos of the officer's face are released in the coming days, months, etc, will you say they are doctored, faked....if they come from MSNBC are they legitimate but if they come from FOX they are not? How about CNN? If they come out to be true, will you come back here with the "OMG" hilarity around HotAir and issue an apology? LOL
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LOL....you were wrong. Just admit it. He was 18, not 17.
Yes, it's a big difference in our society and with the law, but pretend to make it not a big difference. The magical age of 18 is a huge difference. You were wrong, your facts were wrong and then you claim that I'm pulling something out. LOL.
HotAir did what others didn't....verbatim showed what the AP style guide says should be used and then shows what the media actually used. You don't like that they factually showed that clear difference. Not surprised.
No photos released of his face...oh noes. This isn't CSI, it will come out. There has been no photos released of Kevin Ward's broken spine, but I'm pretty sure there is an investigation and they put his body into the ground a few days ago. There were no released autopsy photos of JFK's head blown off officially, but you can find them if you look hard enough. I suppose JFK's top of his head wasn't blown off then, cuz no photos were released. Shall I continue?
Let me guess, if photos of the officer's face are released in the coming days, months, etc, will you say they are doctored, faked....if they come from MSNBC are they legitimate but if they come from FOX they are not? How about CNN? If they come out to be true, will you come back here with the "OMG" hilarity around HotAir and issue an apology? LOL
Says the person who wants to "wait" for all the facts to come out.
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You say that you are going to wait for all the facts to come in, then immediately chastise the media reporting what information we have as undertaking a electronic lynching.
So basically, if they publish things that don't fit your agenda it is electronic lynching.
Also, you want to look at new information coming out (changing narrative) that support the cops version of the story (orbital blowout) as indicating that clearly the 18-yr old kid was lying as proof of an electronic lynching.
You, however, don't treat the cops story the same way. One of facts we do have from the autopsy is that there was no signs of an altercation on Brown. If (and I emphasize if), the officer suffered an orbital blowout, there would be bruising/contusions to Browns hand/fist. There were not.
So we very well may have mutually inconsistent facts, which raises even more questions about what occurred.
If you do really want to wait for all the facts (which I want to wait for), I would suggest just stepping away and not engaging in arguments. By default to engage in an environment requires taking one side, which means that one does not wait for all the facts.
Forgetful...
Interesting. Let's see, when a news agency says rubber bullets are fired into the crowd and the next day we learn they are ear plugs, that aspect of the report is DECIDED and FACTUAL. Is it not? That's settled?
I said all the facts around the case, but if the media is wrong and is proven to be wrong in the process, we can't comment on it?
As for new information, yup....classic media that rushes to judgment and I'm merely showing how the narrative can change....and it can change again. That hasn't stopped Al, Chris Hayes and others to dig in on only the facts they want to talk about....what wonderful journalistic integrity.
They can publish things all they want...if the cop is guilty of killing this kid without reason, then I hope he fries. My agenda, as you call it, is to get to the truth. You have a big part of the media that has already tried and convicted this guy, and with each passing day new information might change that. Question is, why is it when new information comes in there are certain outlets that don't care at all, but keep on pushing their agenda regardless? Shouldn't the new information at least be reported? They had no problem reporting a lot of other things that were "facts" that may not be. Lots of selective reporting going on.
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Says the person who wants to "wait" for all the facts to come out.
You're the one implying that there is a conspiracy going on because they have waited to release photos or haven't reported them yet.
Let me guess, you were damn pissed off when they released the video of him robbing a convenience store and having drugs in his system, too. Damned if they do, damned if they don't....but you'll decide what's important and have convicted already. Congratulations.
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My agenda, as you call it, is to get to the truth.
Lots of selective reporting going on.
I agree with you, which is why I'll withhold my outrage for the "out of control cops", and the "liberal media" until the facts get sifted through and the emotion is removed from this case.
People on both sides of this issue aren't very reasonable (yet). Let the investigators do their job. Hopefully we can eventually have some closure.
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Forgetful...
Interesting. Let's see, when a news agency says rubber bullets are fired into the crowd and the next day we learn they are ear plugs, that aspect of the report is DECIDED and FACTUAL. Is it not? That's settled?
I said all the facts around the case, but if the media is wrong and is proven to be wrong in the process, we can't comment on it?
As for new information, yup....classic media that rushes to judgment and I'm merely showing how the narrative can change....and it can change again. That hasn't stopped Al, Chris Hayes and others to dig in on only the facts they want to talk about....what wonderful journalistic integrity.
They can publish things all they want...if the cop is guilty of killing this kid without reason, then I hope he fries. My agenda, as you call it, is to get to the truth. You have a big part of the media that has already tried and convicted this guy, and with each passing day new information might change that. Question is, why is it when new information comes in there are certain outlets that don't care at all, but keep on pushing their agenda regardless? Shouldn't the new information at least be reported? They had no problem reporting a lot of other things that were "facts" that may not be. Lots of selective reporting going on.
Because they're paid to push that agenda?
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US Attorney, investigation could take months to complete. Disclosure of details could ruin investigation.
“While the lack of details surrounding the shooting may frustrate the media and breed suspicion among those already distrustful of the system, those closely guarded details give law enforcement the best yardsticks for measuring whether witnesses are truthful,” Callahan said. “Without those yardsticks, an investigation becomes more of a guessing game or popularity contest than a search for the truth.”
http://time.com/3144985/ferguson-michael-brown-darren-wilson-us-attorney/ (OMG, it's Time magazine....)
Aughanere and others not going to like it....CSI does it in one hour, damnit!!
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Because they're paid to push that agenda?
Ding ding, and that's the problem. The agenda push in today's media (on both sides) is sickening. It is why the media is held to their lowest levels on record in public polling.
Liberals still love the media, not surprising because it's like being in a room with like minded people and part of the club, but even there it is horribly low.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/171740/americans-confidence-news-media-remains-low.aspx
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/04zos2e2weyy0fzpqwevfq.png)
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/0rgkcfpjy0ivhg15t98pwq.png)
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Ding ding, and that's the problem. The agenda push in today's media (on both sides) is sickening. It is why the media is held to their lowest levels on record in public polling.
Liberals still love the media, not surprising because it's like being in a room with like minded people and part of the club, but even there it is horribly low.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/171740/americans-confidence-news-media-remains-low.aspx
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/04zos2e2weyy0fzpqwevfq.png)
(http://content.gallup.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/0rgkcfpjy0ivhg15t98pwq.png)
You are all over the place. Can we stick to one topic?
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Why start now?
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You're the one implying that there is a conspiracy going on because they have waited to release photos or haven't reported them yet.
Let me guess, you were damn pissed off when they released the video of him robbing a convenience store and having drugs in his system, too. Damned if they do, damned if they don't....but you'll decide what's important and have convicted already. Congratulations.
Do you mean "drugs" as in scurry marijuana? I was annoyed, but those didn't change a damn thing. Rob some convenience store = justifying a murder?
You're reaching, and it's telling. The cop shot him...6 times! S-I-X.
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I'm sure it does bum them out, but the people of that city or jurisdiction elect their Sheriff, or Police captain. If they don't like how they are policed, then vote differently for your elected officials and change how it is done. Seems to me, the folks that are actually responsible and voting, want the thugs policed in that matter or it wouldn't continue.
In my view, what you said is that the distrust of the cops is why certain people act the way they do. You've given them a reason for their actions, a crutch. I view it as justification. You say that isn't the case....fair enough, but that's how I read your comments. Clearly, twice now, you have stated your concerns over cops. I have a differing view, one that the majority of Americans share. I've also said that some cops are bad, of course they are, but most are not. You seem to be overwhelmingly on the side of the opposite...most cops bad, some good. If I have read you wrong, please correct me but your words seem to imply that.
I don't pretend to judge good or bad obviously there are either more cases of bad deeds or they're getting publicized more now than ever before. I have always had negative experiences with cops, I'd like to see just how much you like them after 3times in a week getting blood drawn because at 16yrs old they think you're on cocaine. Given your personality I don't think you'd be thrilled about police. But while my experience reflects my opinion of them it doesn't mean that I think the majority of police are bad it just means that I as an individual don't trust them and don't fault a race that is often harassed and stereotyped for doing the same.
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Not EVERYONE hates cops. Not even the majority hate cops.
Good try
They have a tough job, most do a great job, some do not.
It wasn't meant to be literal.
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I support more cops on the streets, but I want beat cops who know the neighborhoods, develop relationships and trust with citizens, work WITH communities to protect them and solve problems together. "Do what I say or I shoot you" is not the characterization of the kind of police I would support.
I don't want yet another branch of our bloated military.
Nor does anyone else. Show me where anyone supports a "do as I say or I shoot you" approach? However, that doesn't mean people get to take pot shots at them, bum rush them, spit on them call them racists or whatever. If you do, then they have the authority to arrest you and take you in....that is far different than shooting someone. Let's not keep going all hyperbole here.
What bloated military....it has been gutted the last 6 years.
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You are all over the place. Can we stick to one topic?
As a Marquette educated man, I expect you can weave interconnecting issues without much problem. The media is pushing this thing as hard as they can, many with an agenda which they are paid to push to appeal to their partisan viewers. Deny this if you wish, that is the reality. I have great confidence you can handle the intertwining of the topics because they are still part of the main topic.
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Nor does anyone else. Show me where anyone supports a "do as I say or I shoot you" approach? However, that doesn't mean people get to take pot shots at them, bum rush them, spit on them call them racists or whatever. If you do, then they have the authority to arrest you and take you in....that is far different than shooting someone. Let's not keep going all hyperbole here.
What bloated military....it has been gutted the last 6 years.
Wait calling a cop racist gives them the right to arrest you? Isn't there some amendment that's kinda a big deal that's supposed to protect us for saying stuff?
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Do you mean "drugs" as in scurry marijuana? I was annoyed, but those didn't change a damn thing. Rob some convenience store = justifying a murder?
You're reaching, and it's telling. The cop shot him...6 times! S-I-X.
Oh noes, 6 times...for a cop, that's about 1.6 seconds of shooting. If he was being bum rushed, you are trained to keep on shooting until he stops. That might be 10 times, that might be 3 times, that might be something else. This isn't CSI, this isn't some make believe television series where he shoots the guy in the big toe and he kneels down to grab his foot. Welcome to the real world.
I'm not reaching at all, just bringing some facts to the conversation. If I hear "6 times one more time" I'll vomit, clearly this is from people that have never handled a gun, have no idea how police are trained to deal with assaults on them....and it shows.
Yes, marijuana which in some cases for some people can lead to aggressive behavior or the inability to follow orders. Hmm.....but you're right, it doesn't change a damn thing. ::)
http://addictions.about.com/od/legalissues/tp/Five-Myths-About-Marijuana.htm
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As a Marquette educated man, I expect you can weave interconnecting issues without much problem. The media is pushing this thing as hard as they can, many with an agenda which they are paid to push to appeal to their partisan viewers. Deny this if you wish, that is the reality. I have great confidence you can handle the intertwining of the topics because they are still part of the main topic.
You're wrong.
As a guy who took logic, you should be able to deconstruct complex problems into their logical formulas and work from there.
Slow down. Use logic. Not political talking points. Not preconceived beliefs. Not gut reactions to people you don't agree with.
You sprint out to the same talking points over and over.
Stop. Engage your critical thinking.
EDIT: For the record, I'd say the same thing to Rev. Al, but he's not on MUSCOOP.
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Oh noes, 6 times...for a cop, that's about 1.6 seconds of shooting. If he was being bum rushed, you are trained to keep on shooting until he stops. That might be 10 times, that might be 3 times, that might be something else. This isn't CSI, this isn't some make believe television series where he shoots the guy in the big toe and he kneels down to grab his foot. Welcome to the real world.
I'm not reaching at all, just bringing some facts to the conversation. If I hear "6 times one more time" I'll vomit, clearly this is from people that have never handled a gun, have no idea how police are trained to deal with assaults on them....and it shows.
Yes, marijuana which in some cases for some people can lead to aggressive behavior or the inability to follow orders. Hmm.....but you're right, it doesn't change a damn thing. ::)
http://addictions.about.com/od/legalissues/tp/Five-Myths-About-Marijuana.htm
In all fairness you can say you've handled a gun a million times that won't matter about how many bullets it takes to stop someone till you've been shot (admittedly I haven't either) so just because you've shot a gun a few times doesn't mean you suddenly know how many bullets it'd take to stop someone. In not advocating shooting yourself in the leg to find out but I mean you seem to enjoy portraying yourself as the expert so...
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Wait calling a cop racist gives them the right to arrest you? Isn't there some amendment that's kinda a big deal that's supposed to protect us for saying stuff?
Depends on what is going on. If a cop has probable cause and orders you to do something and you start throwing racial comments at him, he's likely to arrest you. You can be arrested for lots of things, doesn't mean it is going to stick. Don't confuse arrest with conviction, which it sounds like you are trying to do when you bring in the big amendment analogy.
Let's also not forget that even with that amendment, that doesn't give someone carte blanche. You can't yell fire in a movie theatre, you can't slander someone without the possibilty of being sued in civil court.
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It wasn't meant to be literal.
Unfortunately, a lot of people LITERALLY think what you said. A bunch on the news right now.
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In all fairness you can say you've handled a gun a million times that won't matter about how many bullets it takes to stop someone till you've been shot (admittedly I haven't either) so just because you've shot a gun a few times doesn't mean you suddenly know how many bullets it'd take to stop someone. In not advocating shooting yourself in the leg to find out but I mean you seem to enjoy portraying yourself as the expert so...
Well, if Ners is the basketball expert because he played in high school, then ......
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In all fairness you can say you've handled a gun a million times that won't matter about how many bullets it takes to stop someone till you've been shot (admittedly I haven't either) so just because you've shot a gun a few times doesn't mean you suddenly know how many bullets it'd take to stop someone. In not advocating shooting yourself in the leg to find out but I mean you seem to enjoy portraying yourself as the expert so...
I'm not an expert in this matter, nor have I claimed to be. I'm quoting ACTUAL experts and linked an article earlier today from CNN about the 6 shots. I'd invite you to read it, you might learn something. For some people, it takes many shots to bring someone down. Too many people here, and especially in the news where one shot does the trick. That isn't the case. Depends on where the person is shot, the caliber, etc.
Stopping Power...I invite you to read about the stopping power of a bullet and how it works, especially on a 6'3 320lb person.
http://www.policemag.com/channel/weapons/articles/2013/01/stopping-power-myths-legends-and-realities.aspx
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Depends on what is going on. If a cop has probable cause and orders you to do something and you start throwing racial comments at him, he's likely to arrest you. You can be arrested for lots of things, doesn't mean it is going to stick. Don't confuse arrest with conviction, which it sounds like you are trying to do when you bring in the big amendment analogy.
Let's also not forget that even with that amendment, that doesn't give someone carte blanche. You can't yell fire in a movie theatre, you can't slander someone without the possibilty of being sued in civil court.
I'm aware however as the tea party, kkk, neo nazi groups, westburo baptist church etc have proven it's that you can certainly call people whatever name you'd like and it's protected under free speech. An arrest for calling a cop that would essentially set president that those other groups deserve preferential treatment.
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So glad that the no politics rule is working. I don't know what I'd do without being able to count on Scoop to be a one-stop shop for high volume link dumps of Chico's political views.
In more on-topic news - John Oliver has taken American Chicken off Tinder. The world got a little darker for Poultryfiles today.
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You're wrong.
As a guy who took logic, you should be able to deconstruct complex problems into their logical formulas and work from there.
Slow down. Use logic. Not political talking points. Not preconceived beliefs. Not gut reactions to people you don't agree with.
You sprint out to the same talking points over and over.
Stop. Engage your critical thinking.
EDIT: For the record, I'd say the same thing to Rev. Al, but he's not on MUSCOOP.
A bit ironic, since earlier today you spoke about emotions, etc. What do you think leads to those emotions? The stories that are being told, the "news" that is being reported. They all tie in together. To ignore that part of the story, is not bringing in all the variables. Illogical to ignore them and pretend this entire matter is happening in a vacuum and all the information is equal and all the information is processed by everyone the same way. It isn't, clearly.
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I'm not an expert in this matter, nor have I claimed to be. I'm quoting ACTUAL experts and linked an article earlier today from CNN about the 6 shots. I'd invite you to read it, you might learn something. For some people, it takes many shots to bring someone down. Too many people here, and especially in the news where one shot does the trick. That isn't the case. Depends on where the person is shot, the caliber, etc.
Stopping Power...I invite you to read about the stopping power of a bullet and how it works, especially on a 6'3 320lb person.
http://www.policemag.com/channel/weapons/articles/2013/01/stopping-power-myths-legends-and-realities.aspx
You're right one shot wouldn't do the trick however when you're saying how fast they'd fire off 6 rounds it wouldn't seem like stopping power was in their mind so much as killing the guy. If they say fire once wait a tic (as no matter what a bullets gonna slow you down) then fire again wait a tic, etc then you'd have an argument for them focusing on stopping power but instead you're saying that in under 2seconds he both rattled off 6 rounds while paying attention to how much each shot was slowing him down?
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I'm aware however as the tea party, kkk, neo nazi groups, westburo baptist church etc have proven it's that you can certainly call people whatever name you'd like and it's protected under free speech. An arrest for calling a cop that would essentially set president that those other groups deserve preferential treatment.
Weird group you used there, for some reason you left out Black Panthers, liberal nut jobs, enviornmental crackpots, race baiters, Wall Street Occupiers, 9/11 truthers, etc....I'm sure it slipped your mind.
You keep confusing arrests for something else. You can be arrested for racial remarks if they are deemed harassment. A New Jersey girl was just charged for a racist tweet not long ago on those grounds.
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A bit ironic, since earlier today you spoke about emotions, etc. What do you think leads to those emotions? The stories that are being told, the "news" that is being reported. They all tie in together. To ignore that part of the story, is not bringing in all the variables. Illogical to ignore them and pretend this entire matter is happening in a vacuum and all the information is equal and all the information is processed by everyone the same way. It isn't, clearly.
It's an emotional issue. We know the players. We can imagine how they feel. It's a tough, tough situation for everybody. The cops are now in a no-win situation, and the community doesn't feel like it can trust anybody.
I honestly empathize with the whole city. It's crappy for everybody.
BUUUUUUUTTTTT,
I'm not on the ground. I'm not in the city. I'm not on the picket lines. I'm not marching. I'm not carrying a riot shield. I'm not driving a tank.
The luxury I have is that it's okay for me to feel conflicted. I'm conflicted because I don't know all of the facts, yet.
The media can do whatever they want. They can send 100,000 cameras, they can interview every lunatic from the left and the right. Doesn't matter. It doesn't change a thing.
The issue is: Was this a clean shoot?
I hope we find out the truth.
I'm willing to wait.
Critically thinking. Logic.
It's okay to feel conflicted about complicated issues. We don't all need to sprint to our respective camps and then fire off rhetoric at one another.
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You're right one shot wouldn't do the trick however when you're saying how fast they'd fire off 6 rounds it wouldn't seem like stopping power was in their mind so much as killing the guy. If they say fire once wait a tic (as no matter what a bullets gonna slow you down) then fire again wait a tic, etc then you'd have an argument for them focusing on stopping power but instead you're saying that in under 2seconds he both rattled off 6 rounds while paying attention to how much each shot was slowing him down?
Please, for the love of Christ....read the article I posted earlier. 1.6 seconds to squeeze off 6 rounds. You are trained to bring the guy down. That's the deal. If you don't like it, then train cops differently, they are trained to stop the assault if they feel their life is in jeopardy. Don't rush at cops, and it doesn't happen. Not hard.
I just love it how many people here and elsewhere are the experts on how the cop should feel and react, when a 320lb 6'3" man bumrushes him (allegedly) and how much caution he is supposed to use. If, he had already had his eye socket broken (allegedly). It's awesome that behind the keyboard, watching the evening news, or having a glass of wine how many people are able to say what they would have done with ZERO training in that moment of panic, terror, etc. Classic.
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Please, for the love of Christ....read the article I posted earlier. 1.6 seconds to squeeze off 6 rounds. You are trained to bring the guy down. That's the deal. If you don't like it, then train cops differently, they are trained to stop the assault if they feel their life is in jeopardy. Don't rush at cops, and it doesn't happen. Not hard.
Someone tell Chicos that in this very same article, the author points out multiple ways in which police officers are *not* trained appropriately in these situations. He apparently doesn't read what he links to.
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So glad that the no politics rule is working. I don't know what I'd do without being able to count on Scoop to be a one-stop shop for high volume link dumps of Chico's political views.
In more on-topic news - John Oliver has taken American Chicken off Tinder. The world got a little darker for Poultryfiles today.
Use the "ignor" button
Funny how you ignore other views from other posters...tsk tsk
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It's an emotional issue. We know the players. We can imagine how they feel. It's a tough, tough situation for everybody. The cops are now in a no-win situation, and the community doesn't feel like it can trust anybody.
I honestly empathize with the whole city. It's crappy for everybody.
BUUUUUUUTTTTT,
I'm not on the ground. I'm not in the city. I'm not on the picket lines. I'm not marching. I'm not carrying a riot shield. I'm not driving a tank.
The luxury I have is that it's okay for me to feel conflicted. I'm conflicted because I don't know all of the facts, yet.
The media can do whatever they want. They can send 100,000 cameras, they can interview every lunatic from the left and the right. Doesn't matter. It doesn't change a thing.
The issue is: Was this a clean shoot?
I hope we find out the truth.
I'm willing to wait.
Critically thinking. Logic.
It's okay to feel conflicted about complicated issues. We don't all need to sprint to our respective camps and then fire off rhetoric at one another.
Really the only thing that makes a shred of sense at this juncture.
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Really the only thing that makes a shred of sense at this juncture.
What makes sense is growing back my mustache.
But, I look at least 3 years younger without it.
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It's an emotional issue. We know the players. We can imagine how they feel. It's a tough, tough situation for everybody. The cops are now in a no-win situation, and the community doesn't feel like it can trust anybody.
I honestly empathize with the whole city. It's crappy for everybody.
BUUUUUUUTTTTT,
I'm not on the ground. I'm not in the city. I'm not on the picket lines. I'm not marching. I'm not carrying a riot shield. I'm not driving a tank.
The luxury I have is that it's okay for me to feel conflicted. I'm conflicted because I don't know all of the facts, yet.
The media can do whatever they want. They can send 100,000 cameras, they can interview every lunatic from the left and the right. Doesn't matter. It doesn't change a thing.
The issue is: Was this a clean shoot?
I hope we find out the truth.
I'm willing to wait.
Critically thinking. Logic.
It's okay to feel conflicted about complicated issues. We don't all need to sprint to our respective camps and then fire off rhetoric at one another.
I hope we find out the truth as well, but I'm confident that one side will refuse to accept it anyway, thus we will continue down the path as is. Without absolute iron clad evidence, that's just the way it is going to be. We can see that from posters on this very thread that have already tried, convicted and lynched the cop. Any new evidence is immediately rejected, the source is called into question, etc. Their minds are made up....period...and nothing is going to change their minds. NOTHING.
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I hope we find out the truth as well, but I'm confident that one side will refuse to accept it anyway, thus we will continue down the path as is. Without absolute iron clad evidence, that's just the way it is going to be. We can see that from posters on this very thread that have already tried, convicted and lynched the cop. Any new evidence is immediately rejected, the source is called into question, etc. Their minds are made up....period...and nothing is going to change their minds. NOTHING.
Cut the crap!!! You just sound like an idealogue whose mind is already made up an any issue - even if it hasn't occurred yet.
Learning/thinking freely is a wonderful thing
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I hope we find out the truth as well, but I'm confident that one side will refuse to accept it anyway, thus we will continue down the path as is. Without absolute iron clad evidence, that's just the way it is going to be. We can see that from posters on this very thread that have already tried, convicted and lynched the cop. Any new evidence is immediately rejected, the source is called into question, etc. Their minds are made up....period...and nothing is going to change their minds. NOTHING.
Same for you, right?
You're already confident that "one side will refuse to accept it anyway"?
Your mind is already made up?
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Same for you, right?
You're already confident that "one side will refuse to accept it anyway"?
Your mind is already made up?
I said point blank, if the guy is guilty then let him fry. In the meantime, I'm just enjoying the narrative change because so many on one side want an outcome so badly, that any other facts that come to bear mean nothing. Absolutely nothing.
If this cop did something wrong and the investigation proves that out, great. My mind isn't made up yet, but I'm willing to accept new pieces of information that come forward, unlike a number of individuals in this thread who have done everything to dismiss them and say they are invalid....THEIR minds, truly are made up, sealed, settled, done. PERIOD.
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Please, for the love of Christ....read the article I posted earlier. 1.6 seconds to squeeze off 6 rounds. You are trained to bring the guy down. That's the deal. If you don't like it, then train cops differently, they are trained to stop the assault if they feel their life is in jeopardy. Don't rush at cops, and it doesn't happen. Not hard.
I just love it how many people here and elsewhere are the experts on how the cop should feel and react, when a 320lb 6'3" man bumrushes him (allegedly) and how much caution he is supposed to use. If, he had already had his eye socket broken (allegedly). It's awesome that behind the keyboard, watching the evening news, or having a glass of wine how many people are able to say what they would have done with ZERO training in that moment of panic, terror, etc. Classic.
I did read the article thank you very much. And I sided with everything sultan pointed out which I just realized you wouldn't have seen.
Please don't refer to me as having zero training in the moment of panic. I've done enough self defense training for 10 people. Just because it wasn't with a gun doesn't mean it's suddenly invalid.
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Weird group you used there, for some reason you left out Black Panthers, liberal nut jobs, enviornmental crackpots, race baiters, Wall Street Occupiers, 9/11 truthers, etc....I'm sure it slipped your mind.
You keep confusing arrests for something else. You can be arrested for racial remarks if they are deemed harassment. A New Jersey girl was just charged for a racist tweet not long ago on those grounds.
Yeah because the black panthers are totally as much of a racist group as a group credited to hundreds of lynchings throughout history. And Wall Street occupies? Dude a peaceful protest? That's what you're comparing to groups that go military funerals with signs saying "his death is due to f*gs" and "f*gs shall burn" etc? Did you maybe take some offense to the groups I credited and tried to fight back with considerably smaller less vocal groups? I think you did.
Ok then my question is why are say westburo or the Kkk not blatantly charged with harrasment? Their views are widely known as racist. Yet New Jersey girl gets charged?
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I said point blank, if the guy is guilty then let him fry. In the meantime, I'm just enjoying the narrative change because so many on one side want an outcome so badly, that any other facts that come to bear mean nothing. Absolutely nothing.
If this cop did something wrong and the investigation proves that out, great. My mind isn't made up yet, but I'm willing to accept new pieces of information that come forward, unlike a number of individuals in this thread who have done everything to dismiss them and say they are invalid....THEIR minds, truly are made up, sealed, settled, done. PERIOD.
If anyone ever wondered what "having your cake and eating it too" meant, this is a good example.
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Wall Street occupies were peaceful....sure about that Bags? Want to talk about the assaults and rapes reported during those peaceful proceedings?
New Jersey girl arrested for racist tweet. http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/NJ-Girl-Charged-Over-Racist-Tweet-189424821.html
Black Panthers....are you saying the NBP have not acted in racist ways....sure about that Bags?
No, I'm not comparing them to any of the groups you mentioned, just thought it interesting how many you forgot, but not surprised you forgot them either. I find some of the groups you mention abhorrent....I find the left's tactics of painting the tea party as one of those groups equally abhorrent, but race is part of the play book and has been for a long time....Uncle Saul Alinsky is very proud.
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I did read the article thank you very much. And I sided with everything sultan pointed out which I just realized you wouldn't have seen.
Please don't refer to me as having zero training in the moment of panic. I've done enough self defense training for 10 people. Just because it wasn't with a gun doesn't mean it's suddenly invalid.
I didn't accuse you of not having any training, I was using an example in general of people here and at home playing Monday Morning QB on 6 bullets, how to react, etc. Too many people that have not one second of training. I'm glad you do. Tell me, do you find it strange that in 6 years there is not one complaint against this officer...do you think that he just snapped and executed ( the lefts' words) this man, just for thrills of do you think something happened to cause the action? I wonder what caused him to just decide today is the day I execute someone I. Broad daylight while in my cop car.....or maybe it was something else, but "execute" is the word du jour I keep reading. Interesting.
You are right, I didn't see what Sultan or Brand stated nor do I much care, I'm not going to read anything from two people that aren't man enough to apologize for calling someone's wife a liar. Not happening. They want to apologize, they can PM me.
You can train cops so much, they aren't machines or robots. They are trained to shoot center mass and put down the threat. Not hard.
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Wall Street occupies were peaceful....sure about that Bags? Want to talk about the assaults and rapes reported during those peaceful proceedings?
New Jersey girl arrested for racist tweet. http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/NJ-Girl-Charged-Over-Racist-Tweet-189424821.html
Black Panthers....are you saying the NBP have not acted in racist ways....sure about that Bags?
No, I'm not comparing them to any of the groups you mentioned, just thought it interesting how many you forgot, but not surprised you forgot them either. I find some of the groups you mention abhorrent....I find the left's tactics of painting the tea party as one of those groups equally abhorrent, but race is part of the play book and has been for a long time....Uncle Saul Alinsky is very proud.
First things first I'm a bagpiper that's one bag. Unless you've been living under a rock every st Patricks day I'm guessing you know that.
Don't know what you're talking about with the occupy movement but the one I was at had nothing like that.
Secondly I don't mean to say the black panthers haven't acted as such however they also have even had white members in the 60s and 70s meanwhile try being a kkk member anytime... Me thinks it wouldn't go as well.
But your offense at the groups I chose seems to say something perhaps about you perhaps not.
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I just hope Chico didn't lose his new gig - remember, the one that would severely limit his postings here?
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I didn't accuse you of not having any training, I was using an example in general of people here and at home playing Monday Morning QB on 6 bullets, how to react, etc. Too many people that have not one second of training. I'm glad you do. Tell me, do you find it strange that in 6 years there is not one complaint against this officer...do you think that he just snapped and executed ( the lefts' words) this man, just for thrills of do you think something happened to cause the action? I wonder what caused him to just decide today is the day I execute someone I. Broad daylight while in my cop car.....or maybe it was something else, but "execute" is the word du jour I keep reading. Interesting.
You are right, I didn't see what Sultan or Brand stated nor do I much care, I'm not going to read anything from two people that aren't man enough to apologize for calling someone's wife a liar. Not happening. They want to apologize, they can PM me.
You can train cops so much, they aren't machines or robots. They are trained to shoot center mass and put down the threat. Not hard.
You never know it could be opportunity, it could be outside stress, it could be the wrong moment at the wrong time. I don't deny that brown seems like a bit of a hot head but the bottom line is he was an unarmed, very young, hot head who did not deserve to die for his crimes particularly in the manner of which he did (without the officer knowing he allegedly did anything). Regarding your stating "the lefts words" you really shouldn't say that stereotyping an entire party or else I'll start saying that the entire right believes in racism or that homosexuals deserve to go to therapy, or that women are inferior to men.
Regarding what your feud with sultan and brand is I don't know where that started I must have missed it. HOWEVER, it seems to be as heartless as say having no remorse for a mother and father who miscarried their child simply because they are prochoice. I don't know it would seem to me that you are just as much of an a$$ (hence the continuous political trolling and flagging of all your attempts to bate things into politics).
I know they are trained that way and if they'd shot in that area he may have lived but instead they shot two to the head.
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Interesting that Brand chose to begin his litany of evildoers with the Tea Party, none of whom belongs in the same sentence with the KKK, Nazis. etc. But it is Chicos that gets all the grief for being political. In conversations with people who have told me that they " hate " the Tea Party I find that they truly have no conception of what it is all about and absorb the anti propaganda without bothering to learn the facts. I didn't know much about the party myself until I stopped some and questioned them. Don't always agree with them but at least they were polite.
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Interesting that Brand chose to begin his litany of evildoers with the Tea Party, none of whom belongs in the same sentence with the KKK, Nazis. etc. But it is Chicos that gets all the grief for being political. In conversations with people who have told me that they " hate " the Tea Party I find that they truly have no conception of what it is all about and absorb the anti propaganda without bothering to learn the facts. I didn't know much about the party myself until I stopped some and questioned them. Don't always agree with them but at least they were polite.
Yes, it is very interesting!!
I don't believe I used the word "Tea" or the word "Party" or any combination thereof here in this thread.
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I said point blank, if the guy is guilty then let him fry. In the meantime, I'm just enjoying the narrative change because so many on one side want an outcome so badly, that any other facts that come to bear mean nothing. Absolutely nothing.
If this cop did something wrong and the investigation proves that out, great. My mind isn't made up yet, but I'm willing to accept new pieces of information that come forward, unlike a number of individuals in this thread who have done everything to dismiss them and say they are invalid....THEIR minds, truly are made up, sealed, settled, done. PERIOD.
So what? Why can't you just let them have their mind made up? Clearly a lot of the posts here and the corresponding posters have personal view points. And, just like every debate in the history of the world, discussion of the topics do nothing but ingrain people in their own viewpoint. I'm not saying we can't talk about topics, but at this point, this particular topic, is going nowhere but in circles with the sides clearly decided and no clarity will come from anyone.
Having said that...
Did anyone see the video of FIFA? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlJEt2KU33I
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Use the "ignor" button
Funny how you ignore other views from other posters...tsk tsk
Why do I have to ignore posts that are in clear violation of the site rules?
"In general, political threads are banned from this board unless pertinent to Marquette"
No one with half a brain could ready your posts and claim that A) They aren't political and B) They are somehow directly pertinent to Marquette.
You're behaving like an upset preteen Fox News host right now.
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I find it interesting that these cases which are pointed to as horrific cases of racism and abuse rarely turn out to be solid.
The Times does a nice job going through the facts today ..
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/20/us/shooting-accounts-differ-as-holder-schedules-visit.html
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While on a medical call, I heard one of the cops, who I have always gotten along with well, say to the drunk/disorderly husband of the patient I was working on "I should have shot you when I had the chance."
If this cop said that then he should be dismissed. The military holds itself to a very high standard because we are authorized the use of deadly force. This is a responsibility that is taken very seriously.
Anyone who makes a such a glib statement about carrying a weapon isn't emotionally equipped for that responsibility.
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I didn't accuse you of not having any training, I was using an example in general of people here and at home playing Monday Morning QB on 6 bullets, how to react, etc. Too many people that have not one second of training. I'm glad you do. Tell me, do you find it strange that in 6 years there is not one complaint against this officer...do you think that he just snapped and executed ( the lefts' words) this man, just for thrills of do you think something happened to cause the action? I wonder what caused him to just decide today is the day I execute someone I. Broad daylight while in my cop car.....or maybe it was something else, but "execute" is the word du jour I keep reading. Interesting.
You are right, I didn't see what Sultan or Brand stated nor do I much care, I'm not going to read anything from two people that aren't man enough to apologize for calling someone's wife a liar. Not happening. They want to apologize, they can PM me.
You can train cops so much, they aren't machines or robots. They are trained to shoot center mass and put down the threat. Not hard.
I have refrained but let me say this - six rounds from a sidearm is a lot of calculation. That cop wanted to destroy that kid. And I know what I am talking about.
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Why do I have to ignore posts that are in clear violation of the site rules?
"In general, political threads are banned from this board unless pertinent to Marquette"
No one with half a brain could ready your posts and claim that A) They aren't political and B) They are somehow directly pertinent to Marquette.
You're behaving like an upset preteen Fox News host right now.
seriously? You should read your posts before pushing the 'post' button.
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I have a question that I honestly have not heard asked and do not know that answer to: did the cop have a taser? If so, why was that not option #1 vs. an unarmed person?
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There are also over a dozen witnesses that back the police version....for some reason you ignore those. Hmm. Interesting. You would make a great jurist with your wonderful ability to weigh ALL the facts, not just the ones that fill your biases.
Haha that one reporter from that one outlet with that one tweet you cited as "facts" retracted her tweet. It also wasn''t even published because it didn't meet the Dispatch's standards for publication. And best of all... she's been on medical leave since March, and “is not involved in the Ferguson coverage while she is on leave.”
https://twitter.com/ChristineDByers/statuses/501788192727498752
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I have a question that I honestly have not heard asked and do not know that answer to: did the cop have a taser? If so, why was that not option #1 vs. an unarmed person?
I have absolutely no idea, but a guess would be distance maybe? How far does a taser shoot and how far was Brown from the officer?
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Yes, marijuana which in some cases for some people can lead to aggressive behavior or the inability to follow orders. Hmm.....but you're right, it doesn't change a damn thing. ::)
http://addictions.about.com/od/legalissues/tp/Five-Myths-About-Marijuana.htm
You're gonna really hate it when weed is legal in most states in 10 years.
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Thought this was gonna be 'bout Jamal and Acker.
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I have absolutely no idea, but a guess would be distance maybe? How far does a taser shoot and how far was Brown from the officer?
Right, but wouldn't you use it when the unarmed person was close enough to actually do you harm and/or in range of the taser?
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Again, I don't know what I'm talking about, but maybe he was too far and out of taser distance so he used his gun. That's why I asked how far does a taser shoot and how far apart were they?
Another reason might be because there was, allegedly, a shot fired in the car and so the gun could have already been drawn.
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The gun first discharged INSIDE the police cruiser.
One would correctly assume police are not trained to randomly shoot (nor even draw) while seated in their vehicle.
But of course, everyone will naturally draw the conclusion that fits their own set of beliefs, there is one likely reason that firearm was discharged inside the squad car.
Emerging from the car, the officer could have switched from the drawn gun to a taser is remotely possible, yet challenging, and certainly not an procedure the police are trained to perform.
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The gun first discharged INSIDE the police cruiser.
One would correctly assume police are not trained to randomly shoot (nor even draw) while seated in their vehicle.
But of course, everyone will naturally draw the conclusion that fits their own set of beliefs, there is one likely reason that firearm was discharged inside the squad car.
Emerging from the car, the officer could have switched from the drawn gun to a taser is remotely possible, yet challenging, and certainly not an procedure the police are trained to perform.
"According to the account of the St. Louis County police"
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Again, I don't know what I'm talking about, but maybe he was too far and out of taser distance so he used his gun. That's why I asked how far does a taser shoot and how far apart were they?
Another reason might be because there was, allegedly, a shot fired in the car and so the gun could have already been drawn.
I read that very few cops carry tazers on a day to day basis, and it is not standard issue for this section of St. Louis county.
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If this cop said that then he should be dismissed. The military holds itself to a very high standard because we are authorized the use of deadly force. This is a responsibility that is taken very seriously.
Anyone who makes a such a glib statement about carrying a weapon isn't emotionally equipped for that responsibility.
He said it. My crew all made eye contact immediately to see if anybody else heard it. When we got back to the station, I told my crew to put in writing exactly what they had heard. I did the same. Without looking at their reports, I put all 3 in a sealed envelope. I wasn't going to throw the guy under the bus, but if it ever came around, I was going to hand the IA officer the envelope.
Epilogue: The husband, who had gone to bed drunk a couple of hours earlier, awoke to find police officers, firefighters and paramedics in his house attending to his wife. He was rude to the officers, who retaliated with the above remark. The husband responded verbally, not physically, and found himself facedown and handcuffed on his dining room floor, before being removed to a cruiser and taken to the local lock-up.
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From former CBS correspondent, current HBO contributor,.... Bernard Goldberg
Young Black Men In The Crosshairs
I don’t know what happened in Ferguson, Mo., between the cop and the kid. And neither do you. When I covered hard news, I saw cops who crossed the line and I saw kids who started trouble. So let’s not jump to conclusions.
But what do you think the reaction in Ferguson would have been if the kid who got shot had been black and so was the cop? Or if the kid was white and the cop was black — or white? Do you think there would have been demonstrations and riots and an onslaught of national media?
In a column I recently wrote about the trouble in Gaza, I quoted Victor Davis Hanson (from a piece on NRO) on how the sophisticates in Europe and America wail when Israelis kill Arabs who wage war on them, but are silent when Arabs kill Arabs: “Apparently the West, in racist fashion, assumes that killing one another is what Arabs do best. But when Israelis kill those who wish to kill them, outrage follows.”
It’s pretty much the same when blacks kill blacks, isn’t it? It happens all the time in big cities such as Chicago. No one riots when a black kid kills a black kid. National news organizations don’t show up to do live shots day and night. It’s as if we’re saying: “Blacks killing one another is what blacks do best.” How’s that for racism? Not the old-fashioned KKK kind. No, this is elite-liberal racism, the supposedly softer variety.
And Al Sharpton doesn’t jump on a plane to show up when a black thug kills a white victim. He’s not in business to protest that kind of crime. Some people just can’t get past the bad old days. They need to feel that America is still a country simmering with racist sentiment. They need to feel that black kids are being hunted down like rabid dogs by modern-day Bull Connors. In a perverse way, it makes them feel good — maybe “relevant” is a better word — to think that nothing has changed in America since the March on Selma.
But they are partly right, those who think young black men are in the crosshairs. According to the Justice Department’s latest statistics (2005), although African Americans make up 13 percent of the population, they represent 49 percent of the nation’s homicide victims — and 93 percent of those black victims were killed by other blacks.
That doesn’t mean that all white cops are angels who don’t harbor any racial animus. But when it comes to crime, nasty white cops aren’t what’s plaguing black America.
I’m pretty sure that if George Zimmerman had been black, we’d never know the name Trayvon Martin. And if 18-year-old Michael Brown had been white, we probably wouldn’t know his name, either . . . and neither national news reporters nor the civil-rights establishment would even know what state Ferguson is in.
Members of the African-American elite, along with many white liberals, have said we don’t put enough value on the lives of young black men. They certainly don’t. Or they would have a lot more to say when a black kid gets shot in the street — by another kid who is black.
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"According to the account of the St. Louis County police"
Who shall not be trusted....especially with all of the blatant racist actions by Officer Wilson in his 6 year career (none).
Instead, we should trust the meme about the "gentle giant", he was going to college you know....didn't have an adult criminal record (he was an adult for all of a few weeks), etc
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First things first I'm a bagpiper that's one bag. Unless you've been living under a rock every st Patricks day I'm guessing you know that.
Don't know what you're talking about with the occupy movement but the one I was at had nothing like that.
Secondly I don't mean to say the black panthers haven't acted as such however they also have even had white members in the 60s and 70s meanwhile try being a kkk member anytime... Me thinks it wouldn't go as well.
But your offense at the groups I chose seems to say something perhaps about you perhaps not.
When you try to equivocate Tea Party folks with those groups you mentioned, it tells me all I need to know about you. The left has tried to hang that albatross around Tea Party folks for the last 6 years. It's obnoxious, stupid, and pitiful, but you guys keep doing it as a dog whisper siren song.
By the way, you weren't paying attention when I stated calling a cop a racist or hurling racial epithets at cops can lead to an arrest vs just calling some avg Joe....there is a difference. A cop can haul you in for it.
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I have refrained but let me say this - six rounds from a sidearm is a lot of calculation. That cop wanted to destroy that kid. And I know what I am talking about.
Yup, that's what he is trained to do, bring down the threat. How is that any different that what I have said? They are trained not to shoot a leg, or an arm, or wound them....they are trained to hit center mass and to bring down the assailant. If the assailant keeps coming, then you keep shooting.
Police 101. As it should be. I know a bunch of people here that live in fairy land with gumdrops, unicorns and perfume pillows wish it was like McGyver and the A-Team, lots of bullets and no one ever dies, but they're living in an altered reality.
Shoot to kill / Shoot to Stop http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/19/police-deadly-force_n_5693020.html
Shoot to kill / Shoot to Stop http://www.businessinsider.com/times-square-shooting-why-police-shoot-to-kill-2012-8
Wolf Blitzer....mayor of gumdrop land...."why don't police shoot to injure". Good Lord. This man is out to lunch. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/08/robert-farago/cnn-wolf-blitzer-dont-cops-shoot-wound/
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You're gonna really hate it when weed is legal in most states in 10 years.
I already hate it....it led to the murder of my sister's boyfriend. It was a gateway drug for them many years ago.
I find it ironic as hell that people are trying to get people to stop smoking (cigs) for health reasons, but we can't wait to get people on pot because it's so awesome for one's brain, heart, etc functions. But hypocrisy is bountiful here.
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"According to the account of the St. Louis County police"
Don't forget "murder", "execution style" and the other daily buzz words....you get extra points if you include them in your posts.
Aughenere, does this give you a rush...a little joy, maybe something to cheer about?
http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2014/08/20/time-to-kill-a-cop-ferguson-protesters-throw-urine-bottles-at-police/
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It makes sense that rich old white guys are so pro police. We get the good cops. Live in an "up and coming" neighborhood for a while and you'll end up with a different outlook.
The problem is the high-testosterone guys that really wanted to be in the military trying to bully everyone in the neighborhoods. It only takes a few people like that to turn everyone against the police.
I'm surprised what's happening in Ferguson doesn't happen more often, honestly.
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It makes sense that rich old white guys are so pro police. We get the good cops. Live in an "up and coming" neighborhood for a while and you'll end up with a different outlook.
The problem is the high-testosterone guys that really wanted to be in the military trying to bully everyone in the neighborhoods. It only takes a few people like that to turn everyone against the police.
I'm surprised what's happening in Ferguson doesn't happen more often, honestly.
Scoring system....I give you 9 points
Played race card...4 points
Played the class warfare card...3 points (because you get to define rich, and because people that have done well..by your definition...have never lived in poverty or struggled, they were born this way and they get the good cops)
Ripped on the military, because we all know people in the military like to bully people....2 points
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Let the rioting begin....oh wait...that doesn't happen in these situations
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2014/08/19/police-man-robbed-and-stabbed-by-group-of-teenagers-in-baltimore-city/
Amazing stats.... http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/aug/19/race-based-hate-crimes-spike-in-dc/
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Let the rioting begin....oh wait...that doesn't happen in these situations
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2014/08/19/police-man-robbed-and-stabbed-by-group-of-teenagers-in-baltimore-city/
Can you honestly not see the difference between that story and what happened in Ferguson?
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Don't forget "murder", "execution style" and the other daily buzz words....you get extra points if you include them in your posts.
Aughenere, does this give you a rush...a little joy, maybe something to cheer about?
http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2014/08/20/time-to-kill-a-cop-ferguson-protesters-throw-urine-bottles-at-police/
Sincere request...
instead of posting 6 consecutive posts can you consolidate them into one?
These threads are becoming needlessly long.
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Let the rioting begin....oh wait...that doesn't happen in these situations
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2014/08/19/police-man-robbed-and-stabbed-by-group-of-teenagers-in-baltimore-city/
Amazing stats.... http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/aug/19/race-based-hate-crimes-spike-in-dc/
Why isn't Dallas is flames?
http://www.redstate.com/diary/quill67/2014/08/18/unarmed-white-man-shot-dallas-police-august-11th/?utm_source=rsfbp&utm_medium=fbpage&utm_campaign=rsupdate
http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2014/08/dallas-police-investigating-officer-involved-shooting.html/
EDIT: Police officers shoot perceived threats who are rushing them.
As tragic as the events were in both Ferguson and Dallas, we are only talking about one over the other because a white cop shot a black adult. white cop shooting a white adult is a non-story
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Can you honestly not see the difference between that story and what happened in Ferguson?
I see stories of people killed all the time. The differences, yes plain as day. When a black man is killed by a black man, the race hustlers in this country are silent, there are no riots, no "peaceful demonstrations". When a black man (a cop, criminal, etc...doesn't matter) kills a white man, there are no riots, protests, no claims of race. When a black man dies at the hands of a white man....riots, immediate claim of racism, code words of murder \ execution \ etc.
Yes, I see a lot of differences....do you?
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Why isn't Dallas is flames?
http://www.redstate.com/diary/quill67/2014/08/18/unarmed-white-man-shot-dallas-police-august-11th/?utm_source=rsfbp&utm_medium=fbpage&utm_campaign=rsupdate
http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2014/08/dallas-police-investigating-officer-involved-shooting.html/
Sir....that isn't good for business. That's why.
The funny thing is that Washington Post columnist Eugene Robinson, who has been a hustler for years, demanded in a recent column for examples of unarmed white men shot to death by cops and implying it doesn't happen.
The responses have been great, with example after example after example. Eugene wanted dates and names, and he's been getting a ton of them, including two in the last 5 days alone, one in Salt Lake City. Now, will Eugene issue a follow-up column...of course not. But rest assured he'll keep beating the drum about execution, murder, etc to drum up business.
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(because you get to define rich, and because people that have done well..by your definition...have never lived in poverty or struggled, they were born this way and they get the good cops)
Yeah, you had a bad man come to your door once. Talk about a tough childhood. If you could overcome that, I don't blame you for not having any empathy for kids who grow up poor in a war zone.
What happened to that new job? The one that was going to turn you into an infrequent poster? Nice for the few days it lasted.
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Scoring system....I give you 9 points
Played race card...4 points
Played the class warfare card...3 points (because you get to define rich, and because people that have done well..by your definition...have never lived in poverty or struggled, they were born this way and they get the good cops)
Ripped on the military, because we all know people in the military like to bully people....2 points
What is the maximum number of points I could have scored? I feel like I have some work to do, I didn't even mention that people that feel the need to carry guns have small penises.
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What is the maximum number of points I could have scored? I feel like I have some work to do, I didn't even mention that people that feel the need to carry guns have small penises.
Maybe that's why the cop shot the kid... because the kid said the cop had a small penis.
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Haha that one reporter from that one outlet with that one tweet you cited as "facts" retracted her tweet. It also wasn''t even published because it didn't meet the Dispatch's standards for publication. And best of all... she's been on medical leave since March, and “is not involved in the Ferguson coverage while she is on leave.”
https://twitter.com/ChristineDByers/statuses/501788192727498752
Please show me where I ever used Christine Byers as a source here? Thanks
I'll be waiting.........
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When you try to equivocate Tea Party folks with those groups you mentioned, it tells me all I need to know about you. The left has tried to hang that albatross around Tea Party folks for the last 6 years. It's obnoxious, stupid, and pitiful, but you guys keep doing it as a dog whisper siren song.
By the way, you weren't paying attention when I stated calling a cop a racist or hurling racial epithets at cops can lead to an arrest vs just calling some avg Joe....there is a difference. A cop can haul you in for it.
Yeah go ahead and google tea party racism and click on images then you can tell me all about how it's not full of a bunch of racists. Some just happen to deny it stronger than others... Not saying you just some people.
You're right I wasn't paying attention. Your posts get hard to read after awhile.
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What is the maximum number of points I could have scored? I feel like I have some work to do, I didn't even mention that people that feel the need to carry guns have small penises.
You would have earned bonus points for that, similar to the red\white\blue ball in the 3 point shooting contest, or the powerball.
I agree, these women have small penis' http://www.thewellarmedwoman.com/women-and-guns/survival-stories
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Yeah go ahead and google tea party racism and click on images then you can tell me all about how it's not full of a bunch of racists. Some just happen to deny it stronger than others... Not saying you just some people.
You're right I wasn't paying attention. Your posts get hard to read after awhile.
Google Obama and racist. Google Eric Holder and racist. Must be true.
No, the reality is that the Tea Party, as the name suggests, is against high taxes, out of control spending, etc. The left doesn't like that, so they label them like they do everything they don't agree with....as racists. Now, if you are an African American Tea Party member, you get the special added treatment of being called an Uncle Tom.
That's how the left argues today. But hey, "google it"
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Yeah go ahead and google tea party racism and click on images then you can tell me all about how it's not full of a bunch of racists. Some just happen to deny it stronger than others... Not saying you just some people.
This is what i got
(http://standupforamerica.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/racism-poster-debate-it.png)
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Can you honestly not see the difference between that story and what happened in Ferguson?
He honestly cannot!
As long as white people (who have all the power and money) are persecuted, chicos will go out on a limb to defend them.
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Yeah, you had a bad man come to your door once. Talk about a tough childhood. If you could overcome that, I don't blame you for not having any empathy for kids who grow up poor in a war zone.
What happened to that new job? The one that was going to turn you into an infrequent poster? Nice for the few days it lasted.
How many times in your life or anyone on this board has a person come trying to murder his family with a machete? I'm going to say none.
You don't know my circumstances any more than anyone else on this board in terms of what they had, didn't have, etc. Some people are part of the lucky sperm club, some people worked their a$$ for it, others won the lottery, some got lucky, some are unlucky, some inherited it, etc. Welcome to life.
I'm home this week, protecting American jobs. Having some work done and I want to make sure the contractor is using American workers. I support LEGAL immigration, not illegal and unfortunately there are many contractors out this way that like cheap labor and deprive hard working Americans of work so they can profit from it. So I make sure when the crew comes, they are here legally and he isn't pushing illegal labor. I won't stand for it. Period. Anything else? How are you making a difference today?
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This is what i got
The best one is how many tea partiers support Ben Carson....but hey, they are racist according to Bags. LOL. You literally can't make this stuff up sometimes.
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How are you making a difference today?
I don't know about you, but I make a difference by posting on Internet message boards.
Damn the man!
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Google Obama and racist. Google Eric Holder and racist. Must be true.
No, the reality is that the Tea Party, as the name suggests, is against high taxes, out of control spending, etc. The left doesn't like that, so they label them like they do everything they don't agree with....as racists. Now, if you are an African American Tea Party member, you get the special added treatment of being called an Uncle Tom.
That's how the left argues today. But hey, "google it"
I did I got some pretty racist propaganda from none other than the tea party.
But I get what you're saying they pick and chose who they are racist towards. Because there's no denying you'll often see the supporters out there with plenty of signs writing about how he's Islamic, from Kenya, or have racial slurs on them. But hey according to you those racial slurs aren't racist as long as they support some other ethnic candidate.
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Why isn't Dallas is flames?
http://www.redstate.com/diary/quill67/2014/08/18/unarmed-white-man-shot-dallas-police-august-11th/?utm_source=rsfbp&utm_medium=fbpage&utm_campaign=rsupdate
http://crimeblog.dallasnews.com/2014/08/dallas-police-investigating-officer-involved-shooting.html/
EDIT: Police officers shoot perceived threats who are rushing them.
As tragic as the events were in both Ferguson and Dallas, we are only talking about one over the other because a white cop shot a black adult. white cop shooting a white adult is a non-story
Good post. It fully illustrates the problem.
There is a huge difference between random acts of violence and a systematic killing of people of a different race. The killing of blacks has been tolerated for 250 years in this country. Thankfully, that has changed changed over the last 50 years (albeit a little too slowly).
Like you, I long for the day when a criminal act is seen as just that and not part of a long-running effort to subjugate one race.
Things have improved and, yes, often when a black man is shot by a white policeman, race is injected when it is absolutely not a factor.
If you want to watch clips of police brutality, you will notice that almost all are against black males. Now, I am not talking about taking someone down and cuffing them. That must be done fast and hard - there is no other way if someone is resisting. Instead, I am talking about the beatings administered to blacks AFTER they are on the ground in restraints.
Chicos could drive through an affluent white neighborhood a thousand times and never once get stopped. Do any of us believe a young black male could do the same?
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I see stories of people killed all the time. The differences, yes plain as day. When a black man is killed by a black man, the race hustlers in this country are silent, there are no riots, no "peaceful demonstrations". When a black man (a cop, criminal, etc...doesn't matter) kills a white man, there are no riots, protests, no claims of race. When a black man dies at the hands of a white man....riots, immediate claim of racism, code words of murder \ execution \ etc.
Yes, I see a lot of differences....do you?
White excuses.
If you can't see the difference over random violence and a system where blacks have been subjugated, abused, and murdered for 250 years (with tacit gov't approval for the majority of that time, it is hopeless.
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I did I got some pretty racist propaganda from none other than the tea party.
But I get what you're saying they pick and chose who they are racist towards. Because there's no denying you'll often see the supporters out there with plenty of signs writing about how he's Islamic, from Kenya, or have racial slurs on them. But hey according to you those racial slurs aren't racist as long as they support some other ethnic candidate.
Saying someone is from Kenya is racist....hmm. I would classify it as stupid, but not racist. I guess the definition keeps changing, would love to see that new definition.
Pick and choose who they are racist toward? So they're part time racists? Hmm, again, that pesky definition of the word racism has changed a lot apparently.
While you are at it, I'm curious. If 90% of Caucasians votes for the Caucasian candidate would you think that is racist? Now, if 90% of African Americans voted for the African American candidate would you think the same way? Hmm. Funny how racism is twisted around in this country with sliding definitions. Imagine if a white person said, "I voted for him because he was white" Hell, you would be all over that....you might even say he\she was tea partier. Now, if an African American said "I voted for him because he was black"....oh nevermind, I don't want you to have to get into contortions of justification and using different standards to explain your hypocrisy. I'm sure you can figure it all out by yourself.
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I don't know about you, but I make a difference by posting on Internet message boards.
Damn the man!
I'm planning on capturing my urine in a jar today and giving it to Augunhere so he can throw it at cops. Multitasking.
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What is the maximum number of points I could have scored? I feel like I have some work to do, I didn't even mention that people that feel the need to carry guns have small penises.
Skat, I find it "funny" that the NRA is silent over this. Anytime there is a shooting where whites are dying, all we hear from them is the push for more guns and more guns. Why isn't the NRA demanding that blacks have more guns since everyone knows more guns = less crime.
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How are you making a difference today?
I'm trying to come up with a snarky response to a sanctimonious fan-board post.
Not having much success.
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Saying someone is from Kenya is racist....hmm. I would classify it as stupid, but not racist. I guess the definition keeps changing, would love to see that new definition.
Pick and choose who they are racist toward? So they're part time racists? Hmm, again, that pesky definition of the word racism has changed a lot apparently.
While you are at it, I'm curious. If 90% of Caucasians votes for the Caucasian candidate would you think that is racist? Now, if 90% of African Americans voted for the African American candidate would you think the same way? Hmm. Funny how racism is twisted around in this country with sliding definitions. Imagine if a white person said, "I voted for him because he was white" Hell, you would be all over that....you might even say he\she was tea partier. Now, if an African American said "I voted for him because he was black"....oh nevermind, I don't want you to have to get into contortions of justification and using different standards to explain your hypocrisy. I'm sure you can figure it all out by yourself.
Saying an intelligent black man could not have been born in this country is racist. Having signs depicting him like some African chief is racist.
It hasn't changed. In your mind you could call someone a n*gger and it wouldn't be racist as long as you are friends with a black person or voted for one etc. But the fact is one doesn't give impunity to the other. Thus those out their with racially offensive signs are racist. Maybe not clan members but they are engaging in a racist act.
No I don't think that at all. Voting should be about policy not race, sex, age, etc. If a person said that I'd damn well hope he/she had reviewed the policies or else no I wouldn't judge. But of course given your comment you aren't going to read my response as your mind is already made up and has made my response for me so why am I wasting my time with someone as stubborn as you? Its like talking to someone who thinks they're a genius or master lawyer but is really a far cry from it.
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Don't forget "murder", "execution style" and the other daily buzz words....you get extra points if you include them in your posts.
Aughenere, does this give you a rush...a little joy, maybe something to cheer about?
http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2014/08/20/time-to-kill-a-cop-ferguson-protesters-throw-urine-bottles-at-police/
Does this give you a chubby?
http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/cop-pointing-rifle-at-ferguson-protestors-i-will-unnatural carnal knowledge-1624463375/+robharvilla
Edit: apparently the link had "f***" in it so it messed up haha
http://bit.ly/1AyCQ54
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Yeah because the black panthers are totally as much of a racist group as a group credited to hundreds of lynchings throughout history. And Wall Street occupies? Dude a peaceful protest?
Peaceful protests....love that peace, or maybe they thought they were going to get a piece. http://thefeministwire.com/2011/11/occupy-rape-culture/
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I already hate it....it led to the murder of my sister's boyfriend. It was a gateway drug for them many years ago.
I find it ironic as hell that people are trying to get people to stop smoking (cigs) for health reasons, but we can't wait to get people on pot because it's so awesome for one's brain, heart, etc functions. But hypocrisy is bountiful here.
??? How in the hell did you take that slippery slope slide all the way to outlawing things because they're unhealthy? That is literally your argument. And it's a bad one. We try to get people to not smoke cigs, but we don't arrest them for it. Same with alcohol, but christ this is a whole different argument.
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Who shall not be trusted....especially with all of the blatant racist actions by Officer Wilson in his 6 year career (none).
Which conflicts with the eyewitnesses.
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RIP John Oliver topic.
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Does this give you a chubby?
http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/cop-pointing-rifle-at-ferguson-protestors-i-will-unnatural carnal knowledge-1624463375/+robharvilla
Chubber, no?
Of course I'd like to know what happened in the previous 10 minutes, like were bullets fired into the crowd like they were two nights ago by criminals, were molotov cocktails thrown as has been done the last 6 straight days, where people injured by other "peaceful" protestors? Context is usually key....sort of like wanting to know if prior to being killed if you robbed a convenient store, bumrushed a cop, broke a cop's eye socket, etc....context, state of mind...matter. I don't like his language, but I'd like to understand what else was going on. I suspect he will have a nice sensitivity training awaiting him, if not a suspension, but that all depends on the circumstances now doesn't it?
That cop, by the way, appears to be Ray Albers....in 2010 he saved a person's life by pulling them out of burning SUV. I hope some urine is thrown on him.
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Peaceful protests....love that peace, or maybe they thought they were going to get a piece. http://thefeministwire.com/2011/11/occupy-rape-culture/
There are ALWAYS examples of this. People take advantage of these things. Especially ones that simply "occupy" and stay around. They had a lot of problems with homeless in general because it was a big attraction for them.
So you're doing exactly what you complain what other people are doing to the Tea Party? Want me to find all the racist signs from Tea Party rallies? Cause that's easy.
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??? How in the hell did you take that slippery slope slide all the way to outlawing things because they're unhealthy? That is literally your argument. And it's a bad one. We try to get people to not smoke cigs, but we don't arrest them for it. Same with alcohol, but christ this is a whole different argument.
On one hand we penalize (tax) certain products (cigarettes) or try to outright ban them (large sodas...hello Mommy Bloomberg) due to health considerations, but we can't wait to introduce this one because we can't control spending and need more revenue. Awesome justification.
Not a slippery slope, just connect the dots.
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Chubber, no?
Of course I'd like to know what happened in the previous 10 minutes, like were bullets fired into the crowd like they were two nights ago by criminals, were molotov cocktails thrown as has been done the last 6 straight days, where people injured by other "peaceful" protestors? Context is usually key....sort of like wanting to know if prior to being killed if you robbed a convenient store, bumrushed a cop, broke a cop's eye socket, etc....context, state of mind...matter. I don't like his language, but I'd like to understand what else was going on. I suspect he will have a nice sensitivity training awaiting him, if not a suspension, but that all depends on the circumstances now doesn't it?
That cop, by the way, appears to be Ray Albers....in 2010 he saved a person's life by pulling them out of burning SUV. I hope some urine is thrown on him.
Oh my god, there is always an excuse for you! This is just bad copping. You don't run around pointing guns directly at people thinking that is going to deescalate a situation.
Thank god he saved that person's life so he got the freebie to kill another.
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Peaceful protests....love that peace, or maybe they thought they were going to get a piece. http://thefeministwire.com/2011/11/occupy-rape-culture/
Like I said i most certainly did not see that at occupy Chicago or lame attempt in MKE. I can only hope that a considerable amount of these were handled correctly. Tell me did you hands burn when you typed in feministwire?
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On one hand we penalize (tax) certain products (cigarettes) or try to outright ban them (large sodas...hello Mommy Bloomberg) due to health considerations, but we can't wait to introduce this one because we can't control spending and need more revenue. Awesome justification.
Not a slippery slope, just connect the dots.
Clears up the courts as well as prisons. Gives drug units more time to focus on much more harmful drugs. Takes away a huge cash cow for cartels and gangs. Not just about revenue. I am curious when you said it was a gateway drug did they smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol or caffeine before weed and whatever followed? Because if they did why would weed be considered the gateway and not nicotine alcohol or caffeine?
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On one hand we penalize (tax) certain products (cigarettes) or try to outright ban them (large sodas...hello Mommy Bloomberg) due to health considerations, but we can't wait to introduce this one because we can't control spending and need more revenue. Awesome justification.
Not a slippery slope, just connect the dots.
I think the justification is more "why are we treating pot as worse than alcohol and equal to heroin." It's a joke that people are sent to jail for smoking it. You basically are creating a powerful criminal market for something that really isn't that harmful.
Also, your ONE example is banning "large" sodas. Umm, so the actual soda isn't "banned". Just large ones. Not. The Same.
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There are ALWAYS examples of this. People take advantage of these things. Especially ones that simply "occupy" and stay around. They had a lot of problems with homeless in general because it was a big attraction for them.
So you're doing exactly what you complain what other people are doing to the Tea Party? Want me to find all the racist signs from Tea Party rallies? Cause that's easy.
I agree with you, there's always going to be a few....maybe now you're getting the f'ing point.
I would like to see some of the racist signs at Tea Party events that are actually created BY Tea Party folks and not infilitrators trying to be a-holes.
Like this guy http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/04/16/teacher-sought-demolish-tea-party-placed-leave-school/
There are literally hundreds of videos exposing people at these events....so how are you going to prove which ones are real and which ones are not? Cause that's easy....
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Oh my god, there is always an excuse for you! This is just bad copping. You don't run around pointing guns directly at people thinking that is going to deescalate a situation.
Thank god he saved that person's life so he got the freebie to kill another.
Did he kill another? Can you show me where he has? Was it execution style?
Sorry, context matters. The video you showed, I don't like it and I suspect he is punished for it. However, I would like to know what happened prior to it. Why did he say what he said, what just happened prior? Was he being a dick, or was he reacting to something. Sorry if I am one that wants information, I forgot you are the kind that has already tried and convicted someone and any additional information doesn't mean anything.
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You guys realize that by this point Chicos views himself being nailed to a cross right? He is getting more and more outrageous...cause you know..."hypocrisy"...but I think we all know what the real reason is.
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Clears up the courts as well as prisons. Gives drug units more time to focus on much more harmful drugs. Takes away a huge cash cow for cartels and gangs. Not just about revenue. I am curious when you said it was a gateway drug did they smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol or caffeine before weed and whatever followed? Because if they did why would weed be considered the gateway and not nicotine alcohol or caffeine?
Actually, it doesn't. Black market is booming in Colorado, despite the claims that this was going to bring it all above board and stop it....an argument that has always been a joke. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/19/colorado-cannabis-marijuana-black-market
For them it was a gateway drug. Yes, there are others, as well. In her opinion, that is what drove her to other uses. That is why I was careful to say FOR SOME.
In one Ivy League study on this, marijuana, alcohol, tobacco were tested for gateway patterns. If you used all three, then you had a 323 times more likely to use cocaine, to support your comments. However, those that just used marijuana, 85X more likely to use Cocaine. Those that just used alcohol, 50X. Just used tobacco, 19X.
Other studies have shown different results. Not everyone reacts the same way.
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I think the justification is more "why are we treating pot as worse than alcohol and equal to heroin." It's a joke that people are sent to jail for smoking it. You basically are creating a powerful criminal market for something that really isn't that harmful.
Also, your ONE example is banning "large" sodas. Umm, so the actual soda isn't "banned". Just large ones. Not. The Same.
You're missing the point, policies and laws designed to reduce usage (heavy taxation or removal\reduction of options) for some products that cause health concerns, while having no problem pushing this product which has health concerns. It's hypocritical at it's finest.
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Did he kill another? Can you show me where he has? Was it execution style?
I didn't say he did. I was just making light of that fact that you in-part justified his threat to murder a rando on the street by throwing in some story about him saving a person's life. I was joking on how they're not related.
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In one Ivy League study on this, marijuana, alcohol, tobacco were tested for gateway patterns. If you used all three, then you had a 323 times more likely to use cocaine, to support your comments. However, those that just used marijuana, 85X more likely to use Cocaine. Those that just used alcohol, 50X. Just used tobacco, 19X.
Think that might have anything to do with the fact that they're legal? It's a gateway drug because it forces the user to interact with people who sell drugs, instead of, ya know, just going to Safeway.
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You guys realize that by this point Chicos views himself being nailed to a cross right? He is getting more and more outrageous...cause you know..."hypocrisy"...but I think we all know what the real reason is.
I know. what am I doing?
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How many times in your life or anyone on this board has a person come trying to murder his family with a machete? I'm going to say none.
You don't know my circumstances any more than anyone else on this board in terms of what they had, didn't have, etc. Some people are part of the lucky sperm club, some people worked their a$$ for it, others won the lottery, some got lucky, some are unlucky, some inherited it, etc. Welcome to life.
I'm home this week, protecting American jobs. Having some work done and I want to make sure the contractor is using American workers. I support LEGAL immigration, not illegal and unfortunately there are many contractors out this way that like cheap labor and deprive hard working Americans of work so they can profit from it. So I make sure when the crew comes, they are here legally and he isn't pushing illegal labor. I won't stand for it. Period. Anything else? How are you making a difference today?
Wait, are you Edward Norton from American History X?
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I didn't say he did. I was just making light of that fact that you in-part justified his threat to murder a rando on the street by throwing in some story about him saving a person's life. I was joking on how they're not related.
Sorry, I don't see it that way at all. If a mother is pissed at her kid and says I'm going to kill you, did she threaten murder? Please. (insert...but but but mother didn't have a gun pointing at me). Doesn't matter, he can point a gun at you, he's law enforcement. He is issuing a LAWFUL command which you are supposed to be honoring. At times, he may have to take it up a notch. Where's the rest of the video <doing my best Aughenere impersonation>....clearly they cut out parts of it, grand conspiracy you know.
Was it a heat of the moment comment...context is key. He's there to control order, to get a-holes to stop shooting other people, stop throwing molotov cocktails, etc, etc. He has to protect people while also preventing a-holes from performing some of these stupid acts. A very difficult job, only made more difficult by a bunch of people that are there to do nothing buy cause trouble. That's why I would like to know if the previous 10 commands he gave were ignored and he had to take it up a notch to get people to take notice. Sorry, I live in the real world and sometimes that is required. Do I like his word choice? No. Does the context of the situation immediately prior or even the events of the day perhaps explain his word choice...maybe. Since we don't have access to that, we don't know.
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I know. what am I doing?
What would the mothers dropping off babies at school say, that's the real outrage.
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Sorry, I don't see it that way at all. If a mother is pissed at her kid and says I'm going to kill you, did she threaten murder? Please. (insert...but but but mother didn't have a gun pointing at me). Doesn't matter, he can point a gun at you, he's law enforcement. He is issuing a LAWFUL command which you are supposed to be honoring.
Just. Wow.
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Wait, are you Edward Norton from American History X?
Nice try. If you work on my property you're going to be bonded and you're going to be legal. Pretty simple. Too many Americans hurting out there and I'd rather support those companies and contractors that are putting Americans to work. I don't believe in encouraging contractors that hire illegal labor to line their pockets and hurt Americans in the process. If you want to immigrate to this country legally, I'm 100% for it and will support you every step of the way. I've even sponsored such activities and am damn proud of it. Nothing like going to a swearing in ceremony for new Americans. It is awesome.
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Just. Wow.
That's why context matters. Like I said, I don't like what he did, but I'd like to know the context. How many jars of urine you got so far?
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nm
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Which conflicts with the eyewitnesses.
Still waiting for you to show me where I sourced that reporter you claimed I sourced......
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Still waiting for you to show me where I sourced that reporter you claimed I sourced......
I'm confused. You said the police have 12 eyewitnesses a bunch of pages ago. That "report" only comes from one reporter, one tweet. And it's been retracted. I posted about this earlier.
http://www.mediaite.com/online/reporter-claims-dozen-witnesses-corroborate-ferguson-officers-account-slightly-backtracks/
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Saying an intelligent black man could not have been born in this country is racist. Having signs depicting him like some African chief is racist.
It hasn't changed. In your mind you could call someone a n*gger and it wouldn't be racist as long as you are friends with a black person or voted for one etc. But the fact is one doesn't give impunity to the other. Thus those out their with racially offensive signs are racist. Maybe not clan members but they are engaging in a racist act.
No I don't think that at all. Voting should be about policy not race, sex, age, etc. If a person said that I'd damn well hope he/she had reviewed the policies or else no I wouldn't judge. But of course given your comment you aren't going to read my response as your mind is already made up and has made my response for me so why am I wasting my time with someone as stubborn as you? Its like talking to someone who thinks they're a genius or master lawyer but is really a far cry from it.
Uhm, no. That has nothing to do with race at all. Intelligent black men are born in this country all the time. The whole Kenya nonsense is the birther movement on whether he is legally allowed to be President under the Constitutional requirements to be so. I find it to be a joke, some right wingers don't. Then again, a bunch of left wingers thought Bush allowed 9/11 to happen. There are crazy whack jobs everywhere, but Kenya sign has nothing to do with race.
The rest of your diatribe is just that, a diatribe. Your comment about the N word was great...not sure where you were going with it or what point only you know about you were trying to make, but give yourself a pat on the back.
On the last point, you do realize many people vote by race, right? I'm sure you also realize that certain folks get a pass for that, others are called racists for the exact same action. Interesting.
Ben Carson '16....hoping for the best. By the way, he was born in America...so uhm, I guess it's not racist then.
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I'm confused. You said the police have 12 eyewitnesses a bunch of pages ago. That "report" only comes from one reporter, one tweet. And it's been retracted. I posted about this earlier.
http://www.mediaite.com/online/reporter-claims-dozen-witnesses-corroborate-ferguson-officers-account-slightly-backtracks/
Really, only comes from one reporter...interesting. Why wouldn't I have sourced that reporter then? Much like your claim that he was a child, when he was 18...you are wrong...again. I never mentioned that reporter EVER here, had never heard of her...EVER....didn't source her...EVER. You assumed...you were wrong.
Now, I think it's grand that this reporter, whomever she is, has gotten in trouble. Makes me wish that other reporters (i.e. ones talking about executions, murder, rubber bullets) were also suspended until actual facts came out, but we all know that isn't going to happen.
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How many times in your life or anyone on this board has a person come trying to murder his family with a machete? I'm going to say none.
You don't know my circumstances any more than anyone else on this board in terms of what they had, didn't have, etc. Some people are part of the lucky sperm club, some people worked their a$$ for it, others won the lottery, some got lucky, some are unlucky, some inherited it, etc. Welcome to life.
I'm home this week, protecting American jobs. Having some work done and I want to make sure the contractor is using American workers. I support LEGAL immigration, not illegal and unfortunately there are many contractors out this way that like cheap labor and deprive hard working Americans of work so they can profit from it. So I make sure when the crew comes, they are here legally and he isn't pushing illegal labor. I won't stand for it. Period. Anything else? How are you making a difference today?
Ironically enough, today I accepted a position on the board of directors of a not for profit that deals with depression and all of the fallout generated from it. Not quite on the scale of taking a week off to the check green cards of my home laborers, mind you, but the day's not over yet. Are you making citizen's arrests? if any of those criminals bum rush you, shoot first and ask questions later. After all, they may be bad men trying to murder your family.
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Actually, it doesn't. Black market is booming in Colorado, despite the claims that this was going to bring it all above board and stop it....an argument that has always been a joke. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/19/colorado-cannabis-marijuana-black-market
Well of course the black market still exists. I would guess they even got the right reason in your article which admits IT WAS EXPECTED TO CONTINUE. There have been shortages of legal weed as the growers market has not had time to develop.
That the black market bustles in the emerging days of legalisation is not unexpected. By some reckonings, it will continue as long as residents of other states look to Colorado – and now Washington state – as the nation’s giant cannabis cookie jar. And, they add, as long as its legal retail competition keeps prices high and is taxed by state and local government at rates surpassing 30%.
Now pot is legalised and who benefits? Rich people with their money to invest and their clean criminal records. And here we are again: on the outskirts of opportunity. Ask someone who buys and sells in the underground market how it has responded to legalisation and the question is likely to be tossed back with defiance. “You mean, ‘Who’s been shut out of the legal market?’”
supply and demand
A July study of Colorado’s marijuana market and demand for the Colorado department of revenue estimates total adult demand, including out-of-state visitors, at about 130 tonnes in 2014. Of that, licensed retailers are expected to supply 77 tonnes, most of it from medical marijuana outlets. That leaves what the report calls a “sales gap” of about 53 tonnes of projected unmet demand
just remember
Seven months of legality is too early to tell anything, and what is now may not be in another seven months.
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Really, only comes from one reporter...interesting. Why wouldn't I have sourced that reporter then? Much like your claim that he was a child, when he was 18...you are wrong...again. I never mentioned that reporter EVER here, had never heard of her...EVER....didn't source her...EVER. You assumed...you were wrong.
Now, I think it's grand that this reporter, whomever she is, has gotten in trouble. Makes me wish that other reporters (i.e. ones talking about executions, murder, rubber bullets) were also suspended until actual facts came out, but we all know that isn't going to happen.
Because there is a tremendous double standard in this country and white males are consistently persecuted, neglected and marginalized by the liberal media that only seeks what is "right" and "just" without looking in the mirror at the actual tactics they are using the the hypocrisy of it all?
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Totes looks like he was worried about the orbital blowout fracture in his eye right after firing 6 shots into this kid. Literally just pacing around the kid and not once touches his eye. I guess it must
Why are you even remotely surprised by this? They've been trying to character assassinate the kid since day 1. He smoked weed, he stole some cigars - as if any of those things in any way justifies a murder.
So releasing factual evidence of him....robbing a store before this incident, being on drugs is character assassination....despite being truthful, it's merely character assassination?
His eye socket? Sorry, I once broke my arm in a high school game and didn't go to the hospital until about 6 hours later. When you're on adrenaline, you often don't know about injuries. This is hardly surprising, but I find it a bit shocking as a sports fan that you do not know this.
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I'm planning on capturing my urine in a jar today and giving it to Augunhere so he can throw it at cops. Multitasking.
It that before, durin', or after you fook yourself?
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Really, only comes from one reporter...interesting. Why wouldn't I have sourced that reporter then? Much like your claim that he was a child, when he was 18...you are wrong...again. I never mentioned that reporter EVER here, had never heard of her...EVER....didn't source her...EVER. You assumed...you were wrong.
Now, I think it's grand that this reporter, whomever she is, has gotten in trouble. Makes me wish that other reporters (i.e. ones talking about executions, murder, rubber bullets) were also suspended until actual facts came out, but we all know that isn't going to happen.
So then you just made it all up? Hahaha. I assumed you at least saw it somewhere instead of just your imagination.
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Because there is a tremendous double standard in this country and white males are consistently persecuted, neglected and marginalized by the liberal media that only seeks what is "right" and "just" without look in the mirror at the actual tactics they are using the the hypocrisy of it all?
Nice try.
There is a reporting double standard, absolutely correct. There is an outrage double standard, goes without saying....otherwise JJ and AS would be Chicago and Dallas right now, but they aren't....for a reason. Lots of people cheering for a specific outcome and verdict, some reporters actively admitting it. That's not reporting, that's activism. And that, is a tremendous disservice to the public trust. No wonder the media is held is such contempt.
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Why do I picture Chicos, sitting in his underwear and about five beers in, raving and typing like a madman...while occasionally pausing to check the work papers of every Hispanic-looking dude that enters his house?