Poll
Question:
Would they be considered Crean's guys or Buzz's?
Option 1: Crean's, he wanted them to begin with
votes: 4
Option 2: Buzz's, they asked out but he still wanted them
votes: 32
Option 3: won't matter, they gone!
votes: 15
most people judge new coachs after a couple seasons once they get "their" players. Buzz has inherited all of Crean's guys, but would Taylor and Williams (heck, all the recruits 'coming' in this yr) still be considered Crean's players or are they the beginning of Head Coach Buzz Williams's recruits? Crean was the coach here when they were offered and signed their LOI. now, they did ask to be released from their LOI and it appears that Buzz is trying to get them to stay. does this make them offically his recruits since he's basically going through the process all over again to get them to MU or do they stay in the Crean camp since he was the one who wanted them here to begin with?
I think you need to clarify as the "They are Buzz' guys" could be taken both ways.
If Buzz loses them, are the people that vote for that saying that Buzz LOST those guys? Or, are they saying if Buzz gets them they are his guys.
It could be taken both ways and I don't know how you decipher the results.
You almost need two questions:
1) If Williams and Taylor come to MU, are they: Buzz' guys, Crean's guys
2) If Williams and Taylor do NOT come to MU, are they: Buzz' loss, Crean's loss, doesn't matter - they gone.
Unless there is big failure(No Tourney) or big success (Final Four, BET Champs, something like that), Buzz will get no credit for this next year, outside of recruiting.
IF they win 10+ BE games, he will put to rest the concerns he not a Xs and Os guy.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on April 10, 2008, 05:08:14 PM
IF they win 10+ BE games, he will put to rest the concerns he not a Xs and Os guy.
Agreed.
Quote from: Niv Berkowitz on April 10, 2008, 04:44:15 PM
I think you need to clarify as the "They are Buzz' guys" could be taken both ways.
If Buzz loses them, are the people that vote for that saying that Buzz LOST those guys? Or, are they saying if Buzz gets them they are his guys.
It could be taken both ways and I don't know how you decipher the results.
You almost need two questions:
1) If Williams and Taylor come to MU, are they: Buzz' guys, Crean's guys
2) If Williams and Taylor do NOT come to MU, are they: Buzz' loss, Crean's loss, doesn't matter - they gone.
good points, but the question i was going with was the thread title...
"If Taylor and Williams
stay"
i'm looking at this as they are in MU uniforms come midnight madness. will people view all the players on the team as Crean's who were inherited by Buzz, or will it be seen as the class of 2012 were Buzz's first players that he selected, not inherited.
if they decide not to come or they transfer after a year, i don't see it as Buzz lost them.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on April 10, 2008, 05:08:14 PM
IF they win 10+ BE games, he will put to rest the concerns he not a Xs and Os guy.
We've got 4 returning starters...
They could win 8 games without a coach...
Quote from: MUinCO on April 10, 2008, 05:10:19 PM
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on April 10, 2008, 05:08:14 PM
IF they win 10+ BE games, he will put to rest the concerns he not a Xs and Os guy.
Agreed.
i disagree. it'd be how they win the those 10+ games. people around here have said that Crean wasn't a good Xs & Os coach, but he managed to win 10+ games in the Big East. Buzz is inheriting a core group of great athletes who have experience.
every analyst, broadcaster, and basketball savvy person on this board has agreed MU doesn't win if it's a slow pace, half-court game; ala Stanford (and yes it was by the skin of their teeth, but MU was being dominated till Stanford sat both twins for 4+min toward the end of the game and we were able to run on them. disagree?? watch the game again and listen to Bilas repeatedly question why the Lopezs were still on the bench once MU began to rally because it changed the style of game).
his coaching ability, or lack there of, will begin to stop being called into question once MU is forced into a half-court offense and can keep games close (or win) unlike what happened against Louisville, UConn, Pitt, and West Virgina when we were forced out of
our style of game.
Unless I'm missing something, didn't Nick Williams say the other day he is not coming period, end of story, nada. He was a Bennie Seltzer recruit and will not becoming is what I had heard from his coach and reported on the news.
Buzz Williams recruited these guys to begin with... TT said so himself "I've got a better relationship with Buzz than I do with Crean"
Sure, Crean gave him the "okay go get those guys" But Buzz did the work.
But doesn't matter to speculate whose guys they are. All that matters is will they come and will they produce. I'm not going to like them any more or less on who recruited them. If they bring Ws then I will be happy.
Quote from: D-Ro on April 10, 2008, 06:24:29 PM
Buzz Williams recruited these guys to begin with... TT said so himself "I've got a better relationship with Buzz than I do with Crean"
Sure, Crean gave him the "okay go get those guys" But Buzz did the work.
But doesn't matter to speculate whose guys they are. All that matters is will they come and will they produce. I'm not going to like them any more or less on who recruited them. If they bring Ws then I will be happy.
Buzz recruited TT. Nick Williams was not his recruit, Williams had already committed to MU almost a year before Buzz got the assistants job. NW was a Seltzer recruit that some say Seltzer had been on before he even left Oklahoma.
As we thought, Williams is not staying