Curious to what the reaction was among fans during this time. Haven't been a Marquette fan long enough to know what happened with the hiring.
There was a little excitement because he was actually going to be hired at Dayton but MU made him an offer just before he was to sign there and we got him instead. he had some good teams at Siena right before he came to MU.
It's too bad he didn't recruit better and made the unfortunate comment that NIT and occasional NCAAs were a realistic goal for Marquette. He was the best in-game coach since I've been watching Marquette (Majerus, Dukiet, O'Neill, Deane and Crean). Ultimately, Cords was proven right in making the change from Deane to Crean, but when MU did so they did take heat for firing a guy who took MU to two NCAAs and won over 100 games in 5 years.
By the way, my sister worked at the gym at the old YMCA building while he was coach and he used to infuriate her by calling her and other girls there "babe."
I can't remember but it was probably negative. Probably along the lines of we just hired another Bob Dukiet from a lesser program and we needed someone who could recruit like O'neill. I can tell you O'neill wasn't respected as a game coach.
It was a step down. People were not excited at all. The thing about Deane is that people genuinely liked him as a guy. He was down to earth and fun loving. He had some good teams with O'Neill's recruits and was a good game coach. He just didn't have the same view of Marquette basketball that most of us do.
He was hired over Easter weekend and the campus was empty.... I was there at the time on the golf team and the rumor that was going around was.. the University knew it would not be a popular choice so they wanted to bring him in when no one was around....
As far as a game coach... I think that legend has grown over the years.... the offense had no movement to it... however he did win a couple of games with Polo and Dickie Shaw so who knows...
Somebody seemed happy about it!
(http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee134/donnyballgame/McGuireDeane.jpg)
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Quote from: HarveysWallbangers on April 10, 2008, 10:31:44 AM
Somebody seemed happy about it!
(http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee134/donnyballgame/McGuireDeane.jpg)
Was this picture from the day of Deane's first press conference? Do we have any pictures of Al and the Piano Man?
Say what you want about Deane, but he was a great motivator and got the most out of his talent. Recruiting was bad, but anytime you can beat top 25 teams Like LVile and Cincy with Jarod Lovette, Mike Bargen and Polo playing major minutes, you must be doing something right.
Quote from: Warrior1969 on April 10, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Deane was an a**hole. I met him on more than one occasion and I enjoyed him every time but he was an obnoxious, sexist, heavy drinking a**hole. Not a great guy to represent a Jesuit institution.
It's funny that Crean gets bagged on for being an a**hole but the reality is, he just isn't your kind of a**hole.
I don't have an axe to grind with Deane but recruiting is one of a coaches most important tasks. Even if that means hiring the right coaches.
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 10:57:28 AM
Quote from: Warrior1969 on April 10, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Deane was an a**hole. I met him on more than one occasion and I enjoyed him every time but he was an obnoxious, sexist, heavy drinking a**hole. Not a great guy to represent a Jesuit institution.
It's funny that Crean gets bagged on for being an a**hole but the reality is, he just isn't your kind of a**hole.
Any man who refers to another man as a "sexist" has serious problems.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 10, 2008, 11:30:36 AM
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 10:57:28 AM
Quote from: Warrior1969 on April 10, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Deane was an a**hole. I met him on more than one occasion and I enjoyed him every time but he was an obnoxious, sexist, heavy drinking a**hole. Not a great guy to represent a Jesuit institution.
It's funny that Crean gets bagged on for being an a**hole but the reality is, he just isn't your kind of a**hole.
Any man who refers to another man as a "sexist" has serious problems.
Thanks for proving my point.
P.S. I'll put my manliness up against yours or anybody else's on this board any day. You have no idea who you are talking to. Luckily you have a computer and many miles to hide behind.
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 12:08:07 PM
I'll put my manliness up against yours or anybody else's on this board any day.
Best post ever.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 10, 2008, 11:30:36 AM
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 10:57:28 AM
Quote from: Warrior1969 on April 10, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Deane was an a**hole. I met him on more than one occasion and I enjoyed him every time but he was an obnoxious, sexist, heavy drinking a**hole. Not a great guy to represent a Jesuit institution.
It's funny that Crean gets bagged on for being an a**hole but the reality is, he just isn't your kind of a**hole.
Any man who refers to another man as a "sexist" has serious problems.
Did you ever consider wives, daughters, sister, mothers......?
This doesn't surprise me as you are the same guy who is hoping that Crean gets caught having a sexual relationship with one of his Indiana players. It seems you are strife with sexual insecurity.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 10, 2008, 12:11:54 PM
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 12:08:07 PM
I'll put my manliness up against yours or anybody else's on this board any day.
Best post ever.
Imagine that.... an internet tough guy....lol. Great post :-* :-*
Quote from: 77fan88warrior on April 10, 2008, 12:16:44 PM
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 10, 2008, 11:30:36 AM
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 10:57:28 AM
Quote from: Warrior1969 on April 10, 2008, 10:36:40 AM
If Deane would have hired a better AC to do better recruiting he may have lasted longer. he is a good guy.
Deane was an a**hole. I met him on more than one occasion and I enjoyed him every time but he was an obnoxious, sexist, heavy drinking a**hole. Not a great guy to represent a Jesuit institution.
It's funny that Crean gets bagged on for being an a**hole but the reality is, he just isn't your kind of a**hole.
Any man who refers to another man as a "sexist" has serious problems.
Did you ever consider wives, daughters, sister, mothers......?
This doesn't surprise me as you are the same guy who is hoping that Crean gets caught having a sexual relationship with one of his Indiana players. It seems you are strife with sexual insecurity.
You're right. That was a thoughtless and immature thing I said about Coach Crean.
I hope he's allowed to carry on his affairs with his Indiana players without fear of discovery.
That picture was either from the 77 reunion team or when we retired Al's number....I think the former.
It was a big party after the game, a great time. Al was in rare form. We wore the the throwback uniforms that game.
I really liked Mike, really enjoyed working with and for him. I think Mike's biggest weakness is that he wasn't a kiss ass guy....many would call that not a weakness but a strong point. I'd agree, though at times you have to play the game of politics. When Mike would call out Cords publicly about not having a new practice center, etc....that just wasn't smart. Deane may have been right to ask where his practice facility was, but you do that behind closed doors, not in public settings.
I thought he was a terrific coach, a throw back type coach. Could definitely beat a team or two he had no business of beating. However, at this level you have to have the horses because coaching will ultimately get you close, but not far enough.
When Billingsley backed out of his commitment, that was the beginning of the end in my opinion.
As far as his personality, yeah he rubbed some people wrong. As I've said consistently here, almost every coach (especially head coaches) I've ever met, worked with have a quirky personality. It's hard to be in a profession where you are constantly scrutinized, constantly looking over your shoulder, having to deal with 18-22 year old kids that aren't always with it, having to deal with glad handing alumni, etc. It causes you to either become a bit paranoid, develop a shell or a combination of insulating traits. It's a high stress job and they are often type A perfectionists operating in a glass bubble.
Not an easy gig by any means...in my opinion it often leads to philandering, drinking, egotistical and sometimes abusive behavior that a good many of these guys sometimes develop. Then again, there are plenty of high ranking corporate America types that fall into these same trappings.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 10, 2008, 12:11:54 PM
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 12:08:07 PM
I'll put my manliness up against yours or anybody else's on this board any day.
Best post ever.
Love when people get tough online....loser.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on April 10, 2008, 12:47:48 PM
That picture was either from the 77 reunion team or when we retired Al's number....I think the former.
It was a big party after the game, a great time. Al was in rare form. We wore the the throwback uniforms that game.
I really liked Mike, really enjoyed working with and for him. I think Mike's biggest weakness is that he wasn't a kiss ass guy....many would call that not a weakness but a strong point. I'd agree, though at times you have to play the game of politics. When Mike would call out Cords publicly about not having a new practice center, etc....that just wasn't smart. Deane may have been right to ask where his practice facility was, but you do that behind closed doors, not in public settings.
Mike could have been as little or as much of a kiss-ass guy as he pleased had he simply done his job better. Was Bob Knight a kiss ass guy? No, but he won so people tolerated him. The same would have been true of Deane. A winning coach who tips a few (or a few too many) with fans after a game is a lovable man of the people. A losing coach who does the same is an embarrassing lush who should be out on the recruiting trail.
The man was a good game coach, that's undeniable. But the best coach in the world isn't going to win consistently without the players, and Mike simply could not or would not do what it takes to bring enough quality players to Marquette. Frankly, I think he was a lazy recruiter, but regardless of why, he couldn't get it done and the program spiraled downward as a result.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on April 10, 2008, 12:47:48 PM
That picture was either from the 77 reunion team or when we retired Al's number....I think the former.
It was a big party after the game, a great time. Al was in rare form. We wore the the throwback uniforms that game.
I really liked Mike, really enjoyed working with and for him. I think Mike's biggest weakness is that he wasn't a kiss ass guy....many would call that not a weakness but a strong point. I'd agree, though at times you have to play the game of politics. When Mike would call out Cords publicly about not having a new practice center, etc....that just wasn't smart. Deane may have been right to ask where his practice facility was, but you do that behind closed doors, not in public settings.
I thought he was a terrific coach, a throw back type coach. Could definitely beat a team or two he had no business of beating. However, at this level you have to have the horses because coaching will ultimately get you close, but not far enough.
When Billingsley backed out of his commitment, that was the beginning of the end in my opinion.
As far as his personality, yeah he rubbed some people wrong. As I've said consistently here, almost every coach (especially head coaches) I've ever met, worked with have a quirky personality. It's hard to be in a profession where you are constantly scrutinized, constantly looking over your shoulder, having to deal with 18-22 year old kids that aren't always with it, having to deal with glad handing alumni, etc. It causes you to either become a bit paranoid, develop a shell or a combination of insulating traits. It's a high stress job and they are often type A perfectionists operating in a glass bubble.
Not an easy gig by any means...in my opinion it often leads to philandering, drinking, egotistical and sometimes abusive behavior that a good many of these guys sometimes develop. Then again, there are plenty of high ranking corporate America types that fall into these same trappings.
Good post.
I guess that is my point. As I said before, I enjoyed Coach Deane personally but I can see how his behavior would draw the ire of the administration. I just find it interesting that some people can rail against Crean and his fatal personality flaws and yet dismiss the glaring flaws of Deane simply because they like a guys guy that enjoys drinking, telling dirty jokes, and tossing out insults. That is fun at the bar but can get old in the office.
I have no problem with people dis-liking Crean. Hell, I don't really like him. The problem I have is when people translate personality differences into Deane = Good Guy/Good Coach and Crean = Bad Guy/Mediocre coach.
I didn't see Deane as that good of a game coach. He frequently called timeouts 1 or 2 minutes into the game to yell at his players. We played "stall ball" most of the time he was there, running out the shot clock then having to throw up a prayer. The defense was good, but the offense was not. I guess it did win games, but most of them were ugly to watch.
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:29:36 PM
I didn't see Deane as that good of a game coach. He frequently called timeouts 1 or 2 minutes into the game to yell at his players. We played "stall ball" most of the time he was there, running out the shot clock then having to throw up a prayer. The defense was good, but the offense was not. I guess it did win games, but most of them were ugly to watch.
ever watch a UW-Madison game?
Quote from: augoman on April 10, 2008, 01:33:04 PM
ever watch a UW-Madison game?
Yeah. And they showed this year how far that style of ball will get you in the tourney.
Yes, but those quick time outs were always for defensive lapses and didn't allow us to get buried in early runs against us.
Oddly, one of my complaints against Crean was that he always saved TOs for the end and let us get buried in runs that may have been blunted with a TO or two.
Quote from: augoman on April 10, 2008, 01:33:04 PM
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:29:36 PM
I didn't see Deane as that good of a game coach. He frequently called timeouts 1 or 2 minutes into the game to yell at his players. We played "stall ball" most of the time he was there, running out the shot clock then having to throw up a prayer. The defense was good, but the offense was not. I guess it did win games, but most of them were ugly to watch.
ever watch a UW-Madison game?
UW under Ryan looks like Memphis compared to the last couple years of Deane ball at MU.
I seem to remember that if somebody gave up a basket, particularly one of his unathletic bigs, that person came out of the game at the next TO. Of course, this did not apply to Crawford, Hutchins, or Wardle.
Quote from: MUSF on April 10, 2008, 01:21:19 PM
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on April 10, 2008, 12:47:48 PM
That picture was either from the 77 reunion team or when we retired Al's number....I think the former.
It was a big party after the game, a great time. Al was in rare form. We wore the the throwback uniforms that game.
I really liked Mike, really enjoyed working with and for him. I think Mike's biggest weakness is that he wasn't a kiss ass guy....many would call that not a weakness but a strong point. I'd agree, though at times you have to play the game of politics. When Mike would call out Cords publicly about not having a new practice center, etc....that just wasn't smart. Deane may have been right to ask where his practice facility was, but you do that behind closed doors, not in public settings.
I thought he was a terrific coach, a throw back type coach. Could definitely beat a team or two he had no business of beating. However, at this level you have to have the horses because coaching will ultimately get you close, but not far enough.
When Billingsley backed out of his commitment, that was the beginning of the end in my opinion.
As far as his personality, yeah he rubbed some people wrong. As I've said consistently here, almost every coach (especially head coaches) I've ever met, worked with have a quirky personality. It's hard to be in a profession where you are constantly scrutinized, constantly looking over your shoulder, having to deal with 18-22 year old kids that aren't always with it, having to deal with glad handing alumni, etc. It causes you to either become a bit paranoid, develop a shell or a combination of insulating traits. It's a high stress job and they are often type A perfectionists operating in a glass bubble.
Not an easy gig by any means...in my opinion it often leads to philandering, drinking, egotistical and sometimes abusive behavior that a good many of these guys sometimes develop. Then again, there are plenty of high ranking corporate America types that fall into these same trappings.
Good post.
I guess that is my point. As I said before, I enjoyed Coach Deane personally but I can see how his behavior would draw the ire of the administration. I just find it interesting that some people can rail against Crean and his fatal personality flaws and yet dismiss the glaring flaws of Deane simply because they like a guys guy that enjoys drinking, telling dirty jokes, and tossing out insults. That is fun at the bar but can get old in the office.
I have no problem with people dis-liking Crean. Hell, I don't really like him. The problem I have is when people translate personality differences into Deane = Good Guy/Good Coach and Crean = Bad Guy/Mediocre coach.
Well put, by both of you.
Mike is rough around the edges, and appeals to people who are similar.
Crean was more polished and therefor seen as less than genuine (I'm not arguing if he was, I'm just saying that's how people took it, i.e. "he's a used car salesman")
I don't think either was perfect... and we are being honest with ourselves, Al wasn't perfect either... but we loved him.
I think you have to look at a coach overall rather than focusing on the little details, otherwise you'll hate every coach MU ever has.
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:29:36 PM
I didn't see Deane as that good of a game coach. He frequently called timeouts 1 or 2 minutes into the game to yell at his players. We played "stall ball" most of the time he was there, running out the shot clock then having to throw up a prayer. The defense was good, but the offense was not. I guess it did win games, but most of them were ugly to watch.
It's the style Deane had to play because he didn't have the horses. We used to talk to him at times about the timeouts and it was simple. If those guys weren't executing the gameplan from the second that ball was tipped, he was going to set that point with them immediately. And in the next minute if they blew it again, he would set it again. I only recall maybe 1 or 2 games where we desperately needed timeouts late in a game that he blew early, but that was one of the drawbacks.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on April 10, 2008, 07:23:22 PM
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:29:36 PM
I didn't see Deane as that good of a game coach. He frequently called timeouts 1 or 2 minutes into the game to yell at his players. We played "stall ball" most of the time he was there, running out the shot clock then having to throw up a prayer. The defense was good, but the offense was not. I guess it did win games, but most of them were ugly to watch.
It's the style Deane had to play because he didn't have the horses. We used to talk to him at times about the timeouts and it was simple. If those guys weren't executing the gameplan from the second that ball was tipped, he was going to set that point with them immediately. And in the next minute if they blew it again, he would set it again. I only recall maybe 1 or 2 games where we desperately needed timeouts late in a game that he blew early, but that was one of the drawbacks.
No doubt Deane was/is a winner. His system and mediocre recruiting left little margin of error though. Once his teams started losing it was all over. Deane's style of play is boring when he is winning but when they started to lose, MU became almost un-watchable. It was awful. That, along with his personality and demeanor, killed him in the end. I am curious as to what the opinion inside the Athletic Department was.
come on - why would you want Crean to call a time out? What is he going to say? Come on guys, you are making me look bad on national TV.
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:35:52 PM
Quote from: augoman on April 10, 2008, 01:33:04 PM
ever watch a UW-Madison game?
Yeah. And they showed this year how far that style of ball will get you in the tourney.
I hate Madison, but I'm gonna play devil's advocate here...
It got them further than our game got us.
Quote from: chuncken on April 10, 2008, 09:46:45 PM
Quote from: MUinOH on April 10, 2008, 01:35:52 PM
Quote from: augoman on April 10, 2008, 01:33:04 PM
ever watch a UW-Madison game?
Yeah. And they showed this year how far that style of ball will get you in the tourney.
I hate Madison, but I'm gonna play devil's advocate here...
It got them further than our game got us.
It got them further because they played Cal State-Fullerton and Kansas State. If they had played Stanford in round two, they would have gotten just as far as MU did.