MUScoop

We're getting worse. Players have regressed. To fall this far, this fast, when this is the team you've spent the last 4 years recruiting... Couple that with the underperformance in the tourney since he's been here. Anything that would make you want to show Shaka the door at the end of THIS year?

The answer is no but without the hyperbole in your no option. He has had 4 straight top 25 teams. You don't fire the coach after one bad year. Now, if next year is a similar disaster and Shaka hasnt made real attempts to change things his seat gets hot real quick.

Anyone else in the world is willing to take this job.  As long as there is another candidate, I'm showing him the door. 

If he drops his pants and takes a dump on the Fiserv Foeum floor during a game, maybe.

Otherwise, no.

What happens more from here on out. Marquette wins or games where 1SE does NOT start a new poll after?

I'm perfectly fine giving Shaka a mulligan so long as he has the humility to acknowledge his team building philosophy needs a serious overhaul.

Quote from: 1SE on Today at 03:36:32 PMWe're getting worse. Players have regressed. To fall this far, this fast, when this is the team you've spent the last 4 years recruiting... Couple that with the underperformance in the tourney since he's been here. Anything that would make you want to show Shaka the door at the end of THIS year?

NCAAT underperformance is always conveniently ignored by the "But look at our two 2 and 7 seeds!" crowd here.

This team is an absolute abomination and there should be serious questions asked of the coaching staff and the direction of the program. Down seasons happen but this is so far beyond a bad season. We've been borderline competitive in two of our non buy games and looked horrible in our buy games/should've lost to valpo.

Absolutely pathetic and Shaka should be ashamed of himself thinking this roster could even come close to getting it done this season.

Quote from: Small Orange Soda on Today at 03:46:35 PMI'm perfectly fine giving Shaka a mulligan so long as he has the humility to acknowledge his team building philosophy needs a serious overhaul.

That...will..never happen

Quote from: Johnny B on Today at 03:42:23 PMThe answer is no but without the hyperbole in your no option. He has had 4 straight top 25 teams. You don't fire the coach after one bad year. Now, if next year is a similar disaster and Shaka hasnt made real attempts to change things his seat gets hot real quick.

If he publicly affirms that he's sticking with RGV and not going to the portal, or heck, even if the doesn't publicly affirm he WILL be going to the portal (and give back 500k of his salary next year to boost the pool ala Harbaugh or Venables - saving the "Rs") , there's no "if" about next year being a similar disaster.

This team is SO FAR below what any of us had expected 40 days ago - and it's a combination of players that can't play and a coach that can't coach. A bubble-team would have been disappointing but forgivable/understandable. Fighting for last place in a super weak BE (which I'd say feels more likely than not at this point) is unacceptable from a guy making 3 million a year. 

Quote from: wadesworld on Today at 03:46:20 PMWhat happens more from here on out. Marquette wins or games where 1SE does NOT start a new poll after?

Certainly polls.

Quote from: Small Orange Soda on Today at 03:46:35 PMI'm perfectly fine giving Shaka a mulligan so long as he has the humility to acknowledge his team building philosophy needs a serious overhaul.

Hahahaha that's good stuff. Color me skeptical.

If he doesn't dip into the portal and next year is the same, I think he should be fired. If he dips into the portal and we seem to have righted the ship, even if it's not a tournament, I'm good with it.

If he continues to resist the portal, he's not the right coach for this time.

I absolutely want to keep Shaka as our coach.  But ..

RGV was a theory and it's clearly been proven as untenable in today's NCAA world.

If Shaka refuses to start using the portal like all other teams, then MU would need to find a coach who will, or fold up the tents.

Uhh ... I thought Shaka makes more like
5 million to work on RGV.

Quote from: mu_hilltopper on Today at 03:56:32 PMI absolutely want to keep Shaka as our coach.  But ..

RGV was a theory and it's clearly been proven as untenable in today's NCAA world.

If Shaka refuses to start using the portal like all other teams, then MU would need to find a coach who will, or fold up the tents.

Exactly. If he fails to make the adjustments and triples down on RGV, I'd want him out. He won't get fired though, he'd end up quitting after another year or so.

The hyperbole in the no option is ridiculous it ignores the conference championship sweep, the fact that he's gone to four tournaments straight, including back to back of our highest seed ever, reached the highest we've been ranked since 1978, the immediate rebuild, the 2 all Americans, the 4 draft picks.

I mean come on, reducing his tenure to "a S16!" is ridiculous. Next year doubling down on RGV with a similar zero growth season washes away the two years that are keeping him here. Essentially I'm considering last year and his first year minimum expectations. 2023 & 2024 bought him a mulligan year. Next would have to be doubling down and it working or admitting it needs to be changed and then it working out.

Quote from: mu_hilltopper on Today at 03:56:32 PMI absolutely want to keep Shaka as our coach.  But ..

RGV was a theory and it's clearly been proven as untenable in today's NCAA world.

If Shaka refuses to start using the portal like all other teams, then MU would need to find a coach who will, or fold up the tents.

Yes, an experiment that would have been cool had it succeeded but clearly hasn't.

But might as well fess up to that publicly now - maybe you get a few guys to transfer out which opens up some roster slots to bring 2 or 3 guys in.

Quote from: Galway Eagle on Today at 04:06:29 PMThe hyperbole in the no option is ridiculous it ignores the conference championship sweep, the fact that he's gone to four tournaments straight, including back to back of our highest seed ever, reached the highest we've been ranked since 1978, the immediate rebuild, the 2 all Americans, the 4 draft picks.

I mean come on, reducing his tenure to "a S16!" is ridiculous. Next year doubling down on RGV with a similar zero growth season washes away the two years that are keeping him here. Essentially I'm considering last year and his first year minimum expectations. 2023 & 2024 bought him a mulligan year. Next would have to be doubling down and it working or admitting it needs to be changed and then it working out.

2025 was his mulligan year.

Nothing

Refusing to fix this

Not cleaning house of about 3-5 guys currently on this team that do not and will not ever be able to help the team win.

He gets this offseason to fix this.  If next year is still a problem, he's gone after next year.

It is not happening this year.  The only way there is a change this offseason is if Shaka leaves on his own.

Quote from: JTJ3 on Today at 04:24:30 PMThe only way there is a change this offseason is if Shaka leaves on his own.

This wouldn't be all that surprising to me. Several prominent coaches have stepped down due to not wanting to deal with the current climate of the game.

The fact that this is his 5th year team and could shape it any way he wanted is really perplexing.

Quote from: 1SE on Today at 04:12:05 PM2025 was his mulligan year.

So for everything I mentioned, after graduating a 2x All American and second team all conference player, your "mulligan" is making the tournament as a single digit seed? Last year his coaching was great, his two main beyond the arc players suddenly forgot how to shoot but they still got plenty of open looks.

That's not a mulligan to me but different strokes.

Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on Today at 04:18:46 PMNot cleaning house of about 3-5 guys currently on this team that do not and will not ever be able to help the team win.

Absolutely! It has been mentioned in previous posts that if you're really going to have a good relationship with players then you're going to have to be honest about where they could really succeed. I am sorry to say it but there are guys I want gone, not from personal animosity but from concern that they will never be able to contribute meaningfully to an MU team.

The Shaka recruiting shtick that "We won't recruit over you" needs to be amended to "We won't recruit over you IF you develop and progress according to reasonable expectations." You cannot succeed with recruiting misses/lack of development. The coach is being paid a pantload of money and is going to have to field a competitive team or be gone. He is going to have to admit that if a prospect doesn't really have a chance to become a productive BE player, then
he needs to be honest with said prospect and let him go to where he can do better. He is also
going to have to look at the broader picture and look at teams improving by using the portal.

Quote from: 1SE on Today at 04:08:44 PMmaybe you get a few guys to transfer out which opens up some roster slots to bring 2 or 3 guys in.

This isn't your father's NCAA.  You don't "get" a few guys to transfer out. 

Players are jumping to the portal on their whim, no reason not to fire kids who aren't good enough.  It goes both ways now.

It's always been a business.  Now it's just more brazen.

Quote from: 1SE on Today at 04:12:05 PM2025 was his mulligan year.

That's nuts. 

Quote from: mileskishnish72 on Today at 04:41:30 PMAbsolutely! It has been mentioned in previous posts that if you're really going to have a good relationship with players then you're going to have to be honest about where they could really succeed. I am sorry to say it but there are guys I want gone, not from personal animosity but from concern that they will never be able to contribute meaningfully to an MU team.

The Shaka recruiting shtick that "We won't recruit over you" needs to be amended to "We won't recruit over you IF you develop and progress according to reasonable expectations." You cannot succeed with recruiting misses/lack of development. The coach is being paid a pantload of money and is going to have to field a competitive team or be gone. He is going to have to admit that if a prospect doesn't really have a chance to become a productive BE player, then
he needs to be honest with said prospect and let him go to where he can do better. He is also
going to have to look at the broader picture and look at teams improving by using the portal.

I don't recall Shaka ever saying "I won't recruit over you". 

Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on Today at 04:47:14 PMI don't recall Shaka ever saying "I won't recruit over you". 

In a Marquette Today interview, Smart reiterated: "We have made a decision and a commitment to the guys in our program. Yes, we could have gone in the transfer portal and recruited some other guys, but we feel like it would have stunted their growth."

I'm worried for him.

Think there is a chance he gets canned after the year if he's not willing to change his portal stance. This season is going to be one we never want to think about ever again after it is over...and we are lined up for much of the same next year.

He needs to add Seniors after this season through the portal or he's a goner and we will be back to starting over.

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 04:59:05 PMI'm worried for him.

Think there is a chance he gets canned after the year if he's not willing to change his portal stance. This season is going to be one we never want to think about ever again after it is over...and we are lined up for much of the same next year.

He needs to add Seniors after this season through the portal or he's a goner and we will be back to starting over.

He's not getting axed after this season.  But if 2026-27 isn't monumentally better, meaning a tourney team, I think he'll be shown the door.  And if we don't use the portal at all, I think making the tournament next season will likely not happen. 

I was ok with this being a rebuilding year and not making the tournament, but there is zero reason for a program with these resources and support to be on trajectory to lose 20 games (possibly more).  The eye test shows that and the advanced data supports that (on pace for a 20-loss season).

If Smart and staff thought this was a BE-caliber team, that is a glaring concern with their roster development and talent assessment. If they did not think that, and ignored opportunities to improve roster when they could have, that too is a glaring concern.  In either case, this year (as it develops) is a big red flag moving beyond this year. 

If the bottom falls out this season, all options should be on table (especially since other programs will be after our young players and if they bolt, there'd be little reason to not start new).

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 04:59:05 PMI'm worried for him.

Think there is a chance he gets canned after the year if he's not willing to change his portal stance. This season is going to be one we never want to think about ever again after it is over...and we are lined up for much of the same next year.

He needs to add Seniors after this season through the portal or he's a goner and we will be back to starting over.

I just don't see them firing him, regardless how bad this season goes.  I'm not advocating he should keep his job, but the leadership at MU seems to love Shaka and they can easily call this a rebuilding year after some very successful seasons.  They know that's an overly simplistic position, but they'll go with it for public consumption anyway.

Quote from: HutchwasClutch on Today at 05:06:55 PMI just don't see them firing him, regardless how bad this season goes.  I'm not advocating he should keep his job, but the leadership at MU seems to love Shaka and they can easily call this a rebuilding year after some very successful seasons.  They know that's an overly simplistic position, but they'll go with it for public consumption anyway.

I didn't think they would either...but this is his 5th season and it is going to be the first time in what? 30 years they had a sub .500 non con. They are going to win maybe 10 to 12 games. That's fireable. Not sure they will either, but if they did, it is warranted.

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 05:13:55 PMI didn't think they would either...but this is his 5th season and it is going to be the first time in what? 30 years they had a sub .500 non con. They are going to win maybe 10 to 12 games. That's fireable. Not sure they will either, but if they did, it is warranted.

Agree

You think about a year ago......pretty shocking what this has come to

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 05:13:55 PMI didn't think they would either...but this is his 5th season and it is going to be the first time in what? 30 years they had a sub .500 non con. They are going to win maybe 10 to 12 games. That's fireable. Not sure they will either, but if they did, it is warranted.

The BEast isn't very good.  Right now we're probably 10/11 but it's not inconceivable we could pick up more wins than people think.  I'm not saying this changes anything.  Just throwing it out there. 

Quote from: MuggsyB on Today at 05:19:35 PMThe BEast isn't very good.  Right now we're probably 10/11 but it's not inconceivable we could pick up more wins than people think.  I'm not saying this changes anything.  Just throwing it out there.

We are so much worse than everyone in the Big East aside from maybe DePaul. Xavier looks better. Seton Hall is actually good.

It's going to be very very bad.

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 05:20:50 PMWe are so much worse than everyone in the Big East aside from maybe DePaul. Xavier looks better. Seton Hall is actually good.

It's going to be very very bad.

Are you predicting 4-16?

Quote from: HutchwasClutch on Today at 05:06:55 PMI just don't see them firing him, regardless how bad this season goes.  I'm not advocating he should keep his job, but the leadership at MU seems to love Shaka and they can easily call this a rebuilding year after some very successful seasons.  They know that's an overly simplistic position, but they'll go with it for public consumption anyway.

I think the administration overestimates the fanbase's love of the RGV model. I don't think most fans are in the "I'm happy we don't take transfers" boat.

Quote from: MUbiz on Today at 04:56:34 PMIn a Marquette Today interview, Smart reiterated: "We have made a decision and a commitment to the guys in our program. Yes, we could have gone in the transfer portal and recruited some other guys, but we feel like it would have stunted their growth."

I guess I should have been more clear - I meant recruiting over someone out of high school. 

Quote from: Small Orange Soda on Today at 05:23:58 PMI think the administration overestimates the fanbase's love of the RGV model. I don't think most fans are in the "I'm happy we don't take transfers" boat.

I agree how fans generally feel, but I don't think leadership sees that or maybe better put, doesn't want to see/hear that. 

Maybe if attendance tanks, I don't know.

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 04:59:05 PMThink there is a chance he gets canned after the year if he's not willing to change his portal stance.

He's really got to, if he wants to keep coaching college ball.

Zero of the top ~50 programs would hire a new coach who refuses to use the portal in 2025.

It's .. unamusing that in the wikipedia page about college basketball, there'll be a section devoted to RGV and how Shaka Smart of Marquette disproved it as a winning strategy. 

Quote from: Small Orange Soda on Today at 05:23:58 PMI think the administration overestimates the fanbase's love of the RGV model. I don't think most fans are in the "I'm happy we don't take transfers" boat.

Fans are vehemently unhappy right now SOS.  And I think somewhat in shock with how bad we are. Again, this is a team somewhere in the vicinity of #300 in the nation.

Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on Today at 05:13:55 PMI didn't think they would either...but this is his 5th season and it is going to be the first time in what? 30 years they had a sub .500 non con. They are going to win maybe 10 to 12 games. That's fireable. Not sure they will either, but if they did, it is warranted.

i posted this during halftime of the game thread but more appropriate here...

(I know nothing about Marquette's new Prez. Does he understand the importance of men's basketball to this school? Not just the history, the pedigree, but its importance in funding the overall athletic program? Or, how applications increase in correlation to basketball success? The AD, Broeker. I'll assume he does understand these things. But, how aggressive is Broeker? A yes man, or does he have a spine? Yeah, Shaka is back next year. But if it's more RGV, more of this garbage, we'll officially be in DePaul's neighborhood. Never ever thought we'd decline like this.)