Clearly individual players are having monumental issues, but this team lacks any identity known to man. It doesn't look like they have the slightest clue what to do in their offensive sets. It's way, way, way, way, more than roster construction or overall talent probs. I'm seriously lost as to what we're attempting to do vs a set defense other than NJ hard right or Chase hard left.
Luckily there's GPS on our phones now
Quote from: Shaka Shart on December 02, 2025, 09:42:49 PMLuckily there's GPS on our phones now
Some of these guys could use it on the defensive end.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 02, 2025, 09:39:44 PMClearly individual players are having monumental issues, but this team lacks any identity known to man. It doesn't look like they have the slightest clue what to do in their offensive sets. It's way, way, way, way, more than roster construction or overall talent probs. I'm seriously lost as to what we're attempting to do vs a set defense other than NJ hard right or Chase hard left.
It must be in your DNA or something, but you start a similar thread after each game with identical thoughts....
Nothing going to change and with Sean Jones coming back is not going to make a single difference with Wisky and Purdue and the BE. This was an 18 point Valpo underdog on MU's home court, playing without their best player for last 10 minutes and point guard in OT. Yet, they almost won. I don't know, but are any of their recruits Top 300
I presume MU is going to get smoked in both away games and no clue for BE wins, but probably minimal. For you and your term, "this is concerning" maybe the best will be at end of season.
Hope that three players leave for portal and not James, Stevens, Parham (I still have faith) and the two red shirts. Everyone else up for grabs. Then based upon who leaves, you up the ante and get the three new portal transfers in, per positions to round out the team. Current players have this year for experience, etc, along with the new ones.
Don't know if it happens with Shaka and is philosophy, but by the end of the season, he'll find out. Meantime, just watch and root for them as best you can, deficiencies and all.
Hard to take anything positive out of this tremendous victory. Don't want to mention specific players with an elevated blood alcohol, but some have to go. If they don't, Shaka's on his own.
Tim Maymon might finally get his wish:
Marquette might lose every game from here on out.
Valpo has at least two dudes that would not be at the end of the rotation on our squad
Has any coach in recent memory torpedoed their goodwill this quickly? Two years ago we were a top 5 team, playing to be #1. A year ago we were a top 5 team beating Wisco with throwback yellow unis. Now we're scratching and clawing to beat a bad Valpo team at home and set up for an even worse 2026-2027. The literal worst win a Marquette team has had in almost 20 years.
But it's ok, because he can just shout "RELATIONSHIPS. GROWTH. VICTORY." bullcrap at us like a used car salesman and some on this board will go out and buy the quarter-zips as soon as they can.
I would take Pettigrew through the portal. Best player on the floor tonight before his lower leg issue. Nice size and good post scoring.
Junior and Sophomore class tonight: A combined 10 points on 2-19 shooting.
The Athletic Director needs to sit down with Shaka and tell him he can't run those two classes back again. Half of them are bench players, the other half don't belong at this level.
Word is on Valpo scoop they aren't happy about losing to a soft mid major like this.
Pitchforks are out and word is Homer Drew is calling his son out of church and prayer to come rescue the program.
I'm hearing from my sources "we would be lucky to be St. Thomas" has been uttered. Delusional
Quote from: onepost on December 02, 2025, 10:51:42 PMBut it's ok, because he can just shout "RELATIONSHIPS. GROWTH. VICTORY." bullcrap at us like a used car salesman and some on this board will go out and buy the quarter-zips as soon as they can.
There are currently 61 RGV items on the spirit shop website. I sure as heck ain't buying any, I think some here need to pick up that slack.
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on December 02, 2025, 10:05:09 PMHard to take anything positive out of this tremendous victory. Don't want to mention specific players with an elevated blood alcohol, but some have to go. If they don't, Shaka's on his own.
Where is 👮 Jay Bee, grammar cop, when we need him?
I'm like, "oh no, now we have to worry about drunken players?"
Quote from: GoFastAndWin on December 02, 2025, 11:40:50 PMWhere is 👮 Jay Bee, grammar cop, when we need him?
I'm like, "oh no, now we have to worry about drunken players?"
Drunken players is about all that could explain this. Or a drunken coach. Or maybe that would help - might as well try.
Sounds like I missed a classic nailbiter.
Literally lost in the fight
Quote from: Small Orange Soda on December 02, 2025, 10:59:32 PMJunior and Sophomore class tonight: A combined 10 points on 2-19 shooting.
The Athletic Director needs to sit down with Shaka and tell him he can't run those two classes back again. Half of them are bench players, the other half don't belong at this level.
That would mean the AD would have to publicly refute what he and the President of the university have been out promoting and praising. He's bought in too.
Quote from: Small Orange Soda on December 02, 2025, 10:59:32 PMThe Athletic Director needs to sit down with Shaka and tell him he can't run those two classes back again. Half of them are bench players, the other half don't belong at this level.
Some of these takes are something....
There is zero chance the athletic director is going to tell the head coach how to build his roster. That doesn't happen anywhere.
Quote from: Big Papi on December 02, 2025, 10:52:50 PMI would take Pettigrew through the portal. Best player on the floor tonight before his lower leg issue. Nice size and good post scoring.
We lose this game if Pettigrew didn't get hurt. Hard to wrap my head around this debacle.
Quote from: The Sultan on December 03, 2025, 07:37:30 AMSome of these takes are something....
There is zero chance the athletic director is going to tell the head coach how to build his roster. That doesn't happen anywhere.
Then I guess we're more f*cked than I thought.
Quote from: Small Orange Soda on December 03, 2025, 07:49:23 AMThen I guess we're more f*cked than I thought.
The athletic director knows very little about building a basketball roster. He knows this. His job is to judge Shaka on the results - which is very easy to do. Despite what Shaka says about victories, he actually has to win basketball games.
Quote from: The Sultan on December 03, 2025, 07:37:30 AMSome of these takes are something....
There is zero chance the athletic director is going to tell the head coach how to build his roster. That doesn't happen anywhere.
Buzz wasn't leaned on?
Quote from: The Sultan on December 03, 2025, 07:54:20 AMThe athletic director knows very little about building a basketball roster. He knows this. His job is to judge Shaka on the results - which is very easy to do. Despite what Shaka says about victories, he actually has to win basketball games.
Well I assume he's not an idiot and can tell that next year's upperclassmen are a huge problem. It's clear to us dopes on a message board, so it should be obvious to the AD. If nothing changes that'll be two bad years in a row and then that's the hot seat. I'd hope my boss would let me know the situation before it got that dire.
Quote from: GoFastAndWin on December 02, 2025, 11:40:50 PMWhere is 👮 Jay Bee, grammar cop, when we need him?
I'm like, "oh no, now we have to worry about drunken players?"
No grammar issues seen. Seemed possible a couple of our guys had as many beers as I did last night.
Quote from: The Sultan on December 03, 2025, 07:54:20 AMThe athletic director knows very little about building a basketball roster. He knows this. His job is to judge Shaka on the results - which is very easy to do. Despite what Shaka says about victories, he actually has to win basketball games.
Some AD's, Barry Alvarez comes to mind, built off Richter and had RED basketball at it's highest level, ever. Hopefully our AD will at least suggest an adjustment in roster construction philosophy be considered. MarquetteMike might have had a whispered conversation with Broeker and can add some insight here.
I am beyond lost about Zaide Lowery. We have literally no chance if he plays like he did yesterday and misses consistently at the rim. He does not appear to know how to draw contact or focus on the shot itself. It's a total mystery to me, but we need him to figure it out. We have seen a few flashes but mostly it has been an unmitigated, catastrophic, disaster. It seems both mental and physical. Plus the effort has been spotty. Anyway, we can't compete if he doesn't show up at all.
Quote from: panda on December 03, 2025, 07:25:55 AMLiterally lost in the fight
Other than NJ, it looked like just about everyone lost the will to fight.
Quote from: Viper on December 03, 2025, 08:13:13 AMSome AD's, Barry Alvarez comes to mind, built off Richter and had RED basketball at it's highest level, ever. Hopefully our AD will at least suggest an adjustment in roster construction philosophy be considered. MarquetteMike might have had a whispered conversation with Broeker and can add some insight here.
Neither Pat Richter nor Barry Alvarez told Stu Jackson, Dick Bennett or Bo Ryan how to build a team. Their job was to provide the resources and judge the results. That is exactly what Broeker should do as well.
Quote from: Viper on December 03, 2025, 07:59:48 AMBuzz wasn't leaned on?
By an incompetant athletic director who was soon fired.
Quote from: onepost on December 02, 2025, 10:51:42 PMHas any coach in recent memory torpedoed their goodwill this quickly? Two years ago we were a top 5 team, playing to be #1. A year ago we were a top 5 team beating Wisco with throwback yellow unis. Now we're scratching and clawing to beat a bad Valpo team at home and set up for an even worse 2026-2027. The literal worst win a Marquette team has had in almost 20 years.
But it's ok, because he can just shout "RELATIONSHIPS. GROWTH. VICTORY." bullcrap at us like a used car salesman and some on this board will go out and buy the quarter-zips as soon as they can.
James Franklin, might think of another later
Shaka is pulling a James Franklin ..
But, I hope no one here thinks Broeker or
Big KIMO will say a damn thing. They are all tripled down in the RGV BS.
It was funny to hear Shaka basically celebrating the " gutty " victory ::)
It was a total embarrassment of a game, and just missed being the worst home loss in 30 years. But he was " proud " of his guys
Quote from: Mu8891 on December 03, 2025, 09:42:57 AMIt was funny to hear Shaka basically celebrating the " gutty " victory ::)
It was a total embarrassment of a game, and just missed being the worst home loss in 30 years. But he was " proud " of his guys
Yeah what was he thinking? He should have used this opportunity to berate his players and apologize to the fans.
Quote from: The Sultan on December 03, 2025, 09:46:19 AMYeah what was he thinking? He should have used this opportunity to berate his players and apologize to the fans.
There's plenty to criticize Shaka for right now, but reacting to last night's game the same way 95% of other college coaches would react to it isn't one of them.
I hope Shaka is having tough talks with his players behind closed doors, but there's no reason to air that out in public.
I think at this point Shaka doesn't want to lose the team to total despair.
Was it Packer's Holmgren that after each game he first met with the coaches to see how they individually could improve?
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 03, 2025, 08:24:39 AMOther than NJ, it looked like just about everyone lost the will to fight.
Adrien looked great in his minutes. It is rather concerning that our Freshman are much better than our Sophomores and Juniors.
Quote from: MUbiz on December 02, 2025, 11:17:32 PMThere are currently 61 RGV items on the spirit shop website. I sure as heck ain't buying any, I think some here need to pick up that slack.
61? Who is doing the math?
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on December 03, 2025, 02:01:29 PMAdrien looked great in his minutes. It is rather concerning that our Freshman are much better than our Sophomores and Juniors.
And exciting. I have to think the first couple classes were needed to prove to more talented guys that they want to come to MU.
It's certainly not as bad as many are making it. But it's certainly not seashells and balloons. Just a lot of hyperbole right now because we're used to success like the past 4 years.
I was pretty hard on Hamilton and still think hes a year away from the role hes playing right now. Id rather swap Royce for him in the starting lineup and honestly explore more minutes for Josh.
Chase in the 2nd half and OT played how I expected him to. NJ is a beast but needs to keep eyes up for open players (I get that we arent shooting well) but there were some dishes he made that were good and he needs to look for those when hes running into 2-3 guys.
Parham is pressing. Hell, all of them are. Hopefully this is something they can build on.
Quote from: willie warrior on December 03, 2025, 02:13:16 PM61? Who is doing the math?
You must be an older Marquette fan...
Quote from: 1SE on December 03, 2025, 12:24:34 AMDrunken players is about all that could explain this. Or a drunken coach. Or maybe that would help - might as well try.
If not drunk at least not so uptight. Chill out guys, have fun, don't worry about making mistakes. Don't think so much, just play basketball.
A shooter might help, is it against NCAA rules?
Relax think seashells and balloons. Don't worry about your hairdos. The BOT, board of trustees, or your assignments. Use your intuition,react don't think so much. And forget about being cheerleaders, we have a cheerleading squad. Your job is to play the game and win.
Quote from: GoFastAndWin on December 02, 2025, 11:40:50 PMWhere is 👮 Jay Bee, grammar cop, when we need him?
I'm like, "oh no, now we have to worry about drunken players?"
GFAW, you made me laugh. I'll blame the blood alcohol level for any lapses.
It is probably in the program's interest that are best players leave through the portal because then there will be a coach's portal that Shaka can enter
Why is Owens not playing? He is very talented and was a big recruit. With Owens and Parham, I thought we had the forward position locked down for 4 years. Play a significant role their sophomore years and start by their Junior year at the latest like Chase.
Quote from: The_Blaze on December 03, 2025, 06:16:58 PMWhy is Owens not playing? Did I miss something? He is very talented and was a big recruit. We need him now and if he is unhappy he will leave. With Owens and Parham, I thought we had the forward position locked down for 4 years. Play a significant role their sophomore years and start by their Junior year at the latest like Chase.
Completely lost on defense, has more turnovers than made baskets on the season. To this point, he's pretty much unplayable.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 03, 2025, 06:35:21 PMCompletely lost on defense, has more turnovers than made baskets on the season. To this point, he's pretty much unplayable.
Something more may be going on. Owens is playing but only a few minutes a game so he is not hurt which held him back last season - or at least I have not heard Shaka say he has a nagging injury that is holding back his minutes now. He has averaged 3 minutes a game the past 4 games and he did not play at all against OK and we needed his athleticism that game.
Owen's ceiling is huge. I didn't expect him to hit it this season but I did expect him to be in the primary rotation once the Big East games started - not just because of his potential and hype coming out of high school but also because his distinct skills, athleticism and size is something MU needs help with now on the court.
Quote from: The_Blaze on December 03, 2025, 08:21:03 PMSomething more may be going on. Owens is playing but only a few minutes a game so he is not hurt which held him back last season - or at least I have not heard Shaka say he has a nagging injury that is holding back his minutes now. He has averaged 3 minutes a game the past 4 games and he did not play at all against OK and we needed his athleticism that game.
Owen's ceiling is huge. I didn't expect him to hit it this season but I did expect him to be in the primary rotation once the Big East games started - not just because of his potential and hype coming out of high school but also because his distinct skills, athleticism and size is something MU needs help with now on the court.
What "more" that's "going on" are you suggesting?
Quote from: The_Blaze on December 03, 2025, 08:21:03 PMSomething more may be going on. Owens is playing but only a few minutes a game so he is not hurt which held him back last season - or at least I have not heard Shaka say he has a nagging injury that is holding back his minutes now. He has averaged 3 minutes a game the past 4 games and he did not play at all against OK and we needed his athleticism that game.
Owen's ceiling is huge. I didn't expect him to hit it this season but I did expect him to be in the primary rotation once the Big East games started - not just because of his potential and hype coming out of high school but also because his distinct skills, athleticism and size is something MU needs help with now on the court.
You completely ignored the response to you in regard to his defense and turnovers.
Quote from: The_Blaze on December 03, 2025, 06:16:58 PMWhy is Owens not playing? Did I miss something? He is very talented and was a big recruit. We need him now and if he is unhappy he will leave. With Owens and Parham, I thought we had the forward position locked down for 4 years. Play a significant role their sophomore years and start by their Junior year at the latest like Chase.
Talented at what? Beer pong?
Quote from: The_Blaze on December 03, 2025, 08:21:03 PMSomething more may be going on. Owens is playing but only a few minutes a game so he is not hurt which held him back last season - or at least I have not heard Shaka say he has a nagging injury that is holding back his minutes now. He has averaged 3 minutes a game the past 4 games and he did not play at all against OK and we needed his athleticism that game.
Owen's ceiling is huge. I didn't expect him to hit it this season but I did expect him to be in the primary rotation once the Big East games started - not just because of his potential and hype coming out of high school but also because his distinct skills, athleticism and size is something MU needs help with now on the court.
The only thing "going on" is that he isn't playing basketball very well when he is on the floor.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on December 03, 2025, 02:01:29 PMAdrien looked great in his minutes. It is rather concerning that our Freshman are much better than our Sophomores and Juniors.
That is it in a nutshell. Al use to say the best thing about freshmen is they become sophomores. There has been very little, if any, improvement with the sophomores and juniors. That is very concerning. Early indicators are several of the players are looking like big recruiting misses. Hope I am wrong.
I don't think this season is over or a dumpster fire or anything like that. I also dont't strongly disagree with much of what has been said. I'm not sure what the biggest gripe is. Is it not using the portal or misjudging talent or inept coaching? As the team sits this year, I agree that the junior class is more than a disappointment. Norman has been a whipping boy on this board since he showed up and Lowery has shown flashes but never really came around. Jones is too injured to make a judgement on. I think Parham and Hamilton still have a way to go but in the traditional "star" system that Smart sems to favor it is on the upper classmen to lead. Ross got the memo but Gold didn't and I think that is the begining of the issues for this team. I also think Smart is missing the boat with Hamilton. He needs to come down, do his work early in the blocks and set up for his hook shot or drive to the rim. Smart has no business having him handle the the ball at the top of the key. I think Jones becomes important later in the season to support James who will certainly tire as the minutes stack up. I think minutes need to go to Stevens,Philips and Clark so that they are ready next season to play before Norman,Lowery and Owens if they remain on the team. Next season's freshmen look to be at least as good as this years and so I have hope for the future whetheer Smart goes to the portal or not. I wil say at this point The relationips I am most interested in is the one with Victory
Quote from: hawk on December 04, 2025, 11:35:14 AMI don't think this season is over or a dumpster fire or anything like that. I also dont't strongly disagree with much of what has been said. I'm not sure what the biggest gripe is. Is it not using the portal or misjudging talent or inept coaching?
Wow, that's a big block of text.
The season isn't over, but unless we beat Wisconsin and Purdue on the road or win the Big East Tournament, our hopes of playing in the 2026 NCAA Tournament are over. There just isn't a realistic path to an at-large bid that doesn't involve winning those two games.
I think the gripes are threefold:
1. The talent isn't good enough at this level. We don't have players that can score the basketball given the looks they get and they cannot defend adequately in the system we want to play.
2. The staff misevaluated the talent. If they truly believed Sean was the heir apparent to TK/Kam, they grossly misjudged him. If they truly believed we had a Big East level front court, they grossly misjudged the team. And if they believed we had enough wing scoring, this current crop simply didn't grow enough to make that a reality.
3. Lack of portal use. Right now we are getting very little from our junior and sophomore classes, which should make up a good percentage of starter and front-line bench minutes. In terms of hit or miss, the closest thing to a hit would be Zaide, who would be fine as our fifth starter but is needed to be much more and hasn't demonstrated that yet. Being able to fill in with experienced players that have longer track records could paper over some of these recruiting misses.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 04, 2025, 12:50:30 PMWow, that's a big block of text.
The season isn't over, but unless we beat Wisconsin and Purdue on the road or win the Big East Tournament, our hopes of playing in the 2026 NCAA Tournament are over. There just isn't a realistic path to an at-large bid that doesn't involve winning those two games.
I think the gripes are threefold:
1. The talent isn't good enough at this level. We don't have players that can score the basketball given the looks they get and they cannot defend adequately in the system we want to play.
2. The staff misevaluated the talent. If they truly believed Sean was the heir apparent to TK/Kam, they grossly misjudged him. If they truly believed we had a Big East level front court, they grossly misjudged the team. And if they believed we had enough wing scoring, this current crop simply didn't grow enough to make that a reality.
3. Lack of portal use. Right now we are getting very little from our junior and sophomore classes, which should make up a good percentage of starter and front-line bench minutes. In terms of hit or miss, the closest thing to a hit would be Zaide, who would be fine as our fifth starter but is needed to be much more and hasn't demonstrated that yet. Being able to fill in with experienced players that have longer track records could paper over some of these recruiting misses.
The fact that we are lined up to potentially see Caedin Hamilton be a 3 year starter is just so so so defeating. It actually hurts to think about.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 04, 2025, 12:50:30 PMIn terms of hit or miss, the closest thing to a hit would be Zaide, who would be fine as our fifth starter but is needed to be much more and hasn't demonstrated that yet.
Generous. Like is he better than Royce or a Greg Elliot?
Talent identification and evaluation have been the huge issues. We're getting next to nothing from the junior and sophomore classes. The good news is we have two good freshman guards and you can definitely see how Phillips could contribute next year. The system seems fine. It's generating open threes and open to mildly contested layups. We just can't put the ball in the hoop.
Royce had a few good moments of bully ball on Tuesday hat I'd like to see him capitalize on. Play more like that and less as a drifter around the arc. Start giving him postups and see what happens.
Quote from: jfp61 on December 04, 2025, 01:09:36 PMGenerous. Like is he better than Royce or a Greg Elliot?
It does feel generous. In terms of high-level impact, those two classes have been very disappointing in the past month.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 03, 2025, 08:24:44 PMWhat "more" that's "going on" are you suggesting?
No implications. Just hoping we don't loose the highest ranked recruit Shaka has brought into MU at the end of this season and was wondering if I missed something on why he rarely plays.
Was hoping to see a similar progression as Joplin and Chase if not better as those two players had to wait their turn behind several great players. Justin Lewis, Morsell, Omax, Oso, Tyler, Kam, Stevie