Perhaps I am showing my age, but I have to ask. Have academic requirements for college athletes just completely disappeared? You never hear about a school not being able to accept a portal transfer because the player does meet their academic requirements. And, it has been years since I heard of a player being declared academically ineligible. And I recently heard Deion Sanders say publicly that he did not remember his son ever going to class at Colorado.
There are apparently a few athletes, like Oso and Stevie, who still take academics seriously, but I get the impression that players like that are a true rarity today.
Do schools now just enroll these kids only for the purpose of playing basketball or football? Is there now no pretense at all of educating them?
I think it's always been a rarity, but even more so nowadays. With all of the money being poured into sports programs through NIL, they're turning their backs to academics as the players seem to essentially be majoring in athletics now. Most programs will do whatever they can to make academics as easy as possible for their "student athletes"
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 31, 2025, 01:45:56 PMPerhaps I am showing my age, but I have to ask. Have academic requirements for college athletes just completely disappeared? You never hear about a school not being able to accept a portal transfer because the player does meet their academic requirements. And, it has been years since I heard of a player being declared academically ineligible. And I recently heard Deion Sanders say publicly that he did not remember his son ever going to class at Colorado.
There are apparently a few athletes, like Oso and Stevie, who still take academics seriously, but I get the impression that players like that are a true rarity today.
Do schools now just enroll these kids only for the purpose of playing basketball or football? Is there now no pretense at all of educating them?
Honestly they have just been getting lower and lower over time, and it makes sense as coaches limit athletes can to go into specific programs anyways.
Even in 2010ish. Ivy league schools only required like a 25-26 ACT for student athletes to get in to some programs at their universities.
Thats why it is so funny when programs say that athletes didn't qualify for their school academically. That just is never truely the case. It typically means something else happened.
Quote from: Markusquette on March 31, 2025, 01:53:50 PMI think it's always been a rarity, but even more so nowadays. With all of the money being poured into sports programs through NIL, they're turning their backs to academics as the players seem to essentially be majoring in athletics now. Most programs will do whatever they can to make academics as easy as possible for their "student athletes"
You're making assumptions here without any evidence. How is athletes making money through NIL correlated with schools "turning their backs to academics?"
The NCAA still has initial eligibility standards. I believe they still have progress toward degree requirements to transfer. Graduate transfers obviously have to obtain their undergraduate degree.
It's also up to the institutions as well.
Love and the pg from FAU didn't meet Michigan criteria
If any NCAA academic standards were being enforced, you would hear something about it. As I said, when was the last time any of us heard of a college athlete, in any sport, being declared academically ineligible? And you can't tell me all these players in the portal can just transfer to any school they want unless academic requirements are just being set aside. Any normal student transferring from, say Northern Arizona to Creighton, just to pick two schools, is going to have to go through an academic review process, etc, may lose some
credits in the process, and may even not be accepted. Never happens though with athletes. Schools that do not accept transfer students at all do so, however, for athletes. Sorry to be an old grump, but there is something terribly wrong about all of this.
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 31, 2025, 02:15:18 PMIf any NCAA academic standards were being enforced, you would hear something about it. As I said, when was the last time any of us heard of a college athlete, in any sport, being declared academically ineligible? And you can't tell me all these players in the portal can just transfer to any school they want unless academic requirements are just being set aside. Any normal student transferring from, say Northern Arizona to Creighton, just to pick two schools, is going to have to go through an academic review process, etc, may lose some
credits in the process, and may even not be accepted. Never happens though with athletes. Schools that do not accept transfer students at all do so, however, for athletes. Sorry to be an old grump, but there is something terribly wrong about all of this.
They have academic resources that make it very hard to drop below academic eligibility. How often did you hear about players being academically ineligible prior to NIL and the transfer portal? It has always been a huge story (Fab Melo) because it rarely ever happens. This isn't new.
Of course student athletes are looked at differently than your standard student in terms of admission into a school.
Again, this is something that has always happened. And why would you think a student athlete's credits all transfer over cleanly to the new school they're attending?
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 31, 2025, 02:15:18 PMIf any NCAA academic standards were being enforced, you would hear something about it. As I said, when was the last time any of us heard of a college athlete, in any sport, being declared academically ineligible? And you can't tell me all these players in the portal can just transfer to any school they want unless academic requirements are just being set aside. Any normal student transferring from, say Northern Arizona to Creighton, just to pick two schools, is going to have to go through an academic review process, etc, may lose some
credits in the process, and may even not be accepted. Never happens though with athletes. Schools that do not accept transfer students at all do so, however, for athletes. Sorry to be an old grump, but there is something terribly wrong about all of this.
Last fall. (https://villanova.com/news/2024/11/8/mens-basketball-hodge-denied-ncaa-initial-eligibility-waiver-villanova-to-appeal.aspx)
It would be discriminatory if standards were enforced on athletes when you consider what is expected of regular students. A college degree has become less valuable in the last
twenty years or so and for that reason many young people are choosing not to go to college. If all else fails, they're hiring teachers in NJ.
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 31, 2025, 02:15:18 PMIf any NCAA academic standards were being enforced, you would hear something about it. As I said, when was the last time any of us heard of a college athlete, in any sport, being declared academically ineligible? And you can't tell me all these players in the portal can just transfer to any school they want unless academic requirements are just being set aside. Any normal student transferring from, say Northern Arizona to Creighton, just to pick two schools, is going to have to go through an academic review process, etc, may lose some
credits in the process, and may even not be accepted. Never happens though with athletes. Schools that do not accept transfer students at all do so, however, for athletes. Sorry to be an old grump, but there is something terribly wrong about all of this.
This has happened each of the previous 2 seasons with Michigan declining to accept the transfers of Caleb Love and Johnell Davis.
Quote from: junglecat022 on March 31, 2025, 02:28:58 PMThis has happened each of the previous 2 seasons with Michigan declining to accept the transfers of Caleb Love and Johnell Davis.
Really? I'm sure you're right but I'm shocked that's the case for UM, as the school has virtually no academic standards for athletes.
I think Love at up at Arizona when Michigan would not admit him. Apparently, whatever he did at North Carolina was not good enough for Michigan.
My understanding is that this only happens when UW misses out on a recruit.
Crypto currency. That's something I don't understand.
Quote from: MU_B on March 31, 2025, 03:22:51 PMCrypto currency. That's something I don't understand.
🐑
Quote from: bilsu on March 31, 2025, 03:00:11 PMI think Love at up at Arizona when Michigan would not admit him. Apparently, whatever he did at North Carolina was not good enough for Michigan.
Both Love and Davis got caught up in a UM institutional rule where students have to earn 50% of their degree at UM in order to graduate (other schools have this rule too, Ohio State is one). So, even though both had enough credits to have met NCAA PTD standards else where the Michigan rule put them at 50% and under NCAA requirements. Goldin made it from FAU because he was a graduate transfer but Davis was a fifth year undergrad who had to be 80% completed with his undergrad degree at Michigan, which wasn't possible under their policies.
Colorado had that rule but scrapped it for Deion
Quote from: GB Warrior on March 31, 2025, 03:15:43 PMMy understanding is that this only happens when UW misses out on a recruit.
There is a NCAA standard
an Ivy League standard
and then The UW-Madison standard.
It's my understanding that Wisconsin will not even talk to a prospective athlete unless that have taken at least four AP courses in high school and have no less than a 32 on their ACT.
Quote from: GB Warrior on March 31, 2025, 03:15:43 PMMy understanding is that this only happens when UW misses out on a recruit.
true...but Gard always gets his guy, hey
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on March 31, 2025, 03:45:37 PMBoth Love and Davis got caught up in a UM institutional rule where students have to earn 50% of their degree at UM in order to graduate (other schools have this rule too, Ohio State is one). So, even though both had enough credits to have met NCAA PTD standards else where the Michigan rule put them at 50% and under NCAA requirements. Goldin made it from FAU because he was a graduate transfer but Davis was a fifth year undergrad who had to be 80% completed with his undergrad degree at Michigan, which wasn't possible under their policies.
Colorado had that rule but scrapped it for Deion
Wasn't there a similar thing with Crowder at MU, where Buzz recruited him even though his JUCO credits didn't transfer and he had no chance to graduate?
There are classes designed to be easily passable for athletes and that's been the case for decades.
As mentioned before, they have an expansive tutoring system that stops just short of giving them test answers a lot of the time.
Quote from: Biggie Clausen on March 31, 2025, 05:25:05 PMWasn't there a similar thing with Crowder at MU, where Buzz recruited him even though his JUCO credits didn't transfer and he had no chance to graduate?
Ok but once you saw Jae tweet it all made sense
Quote from: dpucane on March 31, 2025, 05:30:21 PMThere are classes designed to be easily passable for athletes and that's been the case for decades.
As mentioned before, they have an expansive tutoring system that stops just short of giving them test answers a lot of the time.
I think you have to make a distinction between football and men's basketball from other athletes. I would guess 95% or more, of those that participate in women's college sports, are legitimate student athletes. And they take real classes.
Quote from: WhiteTrash on March 31, 2025, 04:53:11 PMThere is a NCAA standard
an Ivy League standard
and then The UW-Madison standard.
Ivies have lower standards as well. Still higher standards than everyone else, but significantly lower standards to get in.
Quote from: dpucane on March 31, 2025, 05:30:21 PMThere are classes designed to be easily passable for athletes and that's been the case for decades.
As mentioned before, they have an expansive tutoring system that stops just short of giving them test answers a lot of the time.
I needed that, hey. Is it obvious? 🤣
Quote from: dpucane on March 31, 2025, 05:30:21 PMThere are classes designed to be easily passable for athletes and that's been the case for decades.
As mentioned before, they have an expansive tutoring system that stops just short of giving them test answers a lot of the time.
Schools are going to do everything they can to keep their moneymaking athletes eligible. Academics in University are virtually worthless for a lot of them. Some of the most laughable majors have been created for the sole purpose of keeping athletes eligible
Quote from: bilsu on March 31, 2025, 03:00:11 PMI think Love at up at Arizona when Michigan would not admit him. Apparently, whatever he did at North Carolina was not good enough for Michigan.
It's outrageous that Michigan didn't accept phantom credits from phantom classes taught by phantom instructors!
Quote from: dpucane on March 31, 2025, 05:30:21 PMThere are classes designed to be easily passable for athletes and that's been the case for decades.
As mentioned before, they have an expansive tutoring system that stops just short of giving them test answers a lot of the time.
You'd think more of them become dentists if that were the case
Quote from: Biggie Clausen on March 31, 2025, 05:25:05 PMWasn't there a similar thing with Crowder at MU, where Buzz recruited him even though his JUCO credits didn't transfer and he had no chance to graduate?
I don't know about his transfer in, but I know nearly the entire team had to take multiple summer classes just to get to their percentages for eligibility the following semester.
Quote from: GB Warrior on March 31, 2025, 08:13:00 PMYou'd think more of them become dentists if that were the case
Wrong type of shooting
Quote from: GB Warrior on March 31, 2025, 08:13:00 PMYou'd think more of them become dentists if that were the case
Yeah, great thought having some of those guys probing your teeth. Is it safe?
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 31, 2025, 02:15:18 PMIf Never happens though with athletes. Schools that do not accept transfer students at all do so, however, for athletes. Sorry to be an old grump, but there is something terribly wrong about all of this.
That is incorrect. There are many instances of athletes being evaluated and coaches being told they won't be eligible. It happens early in the process before coaches make an offer. Individuals outside of athletics do the evaluations and there must be an equivalent class at the institution for the credits to transfer. Then another outside entity (usually the Registar) does the degree audit and certifies the student-athlete for eligibility.
It is easy to get a freshman transfer eligible - all they had to do was pass 24 credits at their previous school. After the sophomore year it's a little more difficult but they only have to be at 40% of their degree completed. However, It isn't uncommon at schools like MU, Creighton, X, etc. that have strict core curriculum standards to not be able to get a transfer eligible (especially from a public school) after their junior year as they need to be at 60% of their degree completed as courses like Theology, Philosophy, and other requirements are often not offered. A kid may have completed 100 credits but many end up as "empty electives" that don't count towards a degree, leaving them short in terms of percentage. And there are situations like Michigan, Stanford, Ohio State and others where a minimum percentage of a degree must be completed at the school and no matter how many credits were completed previously they won't count towards PTD.
But also, schools are making it much easier for non-athletes to transfer in as well. You won't find as many of the "empty credits" as you used to at most schools because they see transfer students as a potential revenue source. Not only that but some of the limitations are pretty silly anyway. One of my kids transferred schools and the "receiving" school wouldn't allow his second semester writing class to transfer as a requirement. (He did get the credits for it though.) So he took it his junior year and aced it. It was a really ridiculous decision.
Quote from: The Sultan on April 01, 2025, 08:51:47 AMBut also, schools are making it much easier for non-athletes to transfer in as well. You won't find as many of the "empty credits" as you used to at most schools because they see transfer students as a potential revenue source. Not only that but some of the limitations are pretty silly anyway. One of my kids transferred schools and the "receiving" school wouldn't allow his second semester writing class to transfer as a requirement. (He did get the credits for it though.) So he took it his junior year and aced it. It was a really ridiculous decision.
The difference is there are no progress towards degree requirements for non-athletes. That's one area where schools haven't challenged NCAA requirements.
Caleb Love and Jonell Davis would have been allowed to transfer to Michigan if they weren't athletes, but since they were they had to meet NCAA PTD requirements and that's why they were rejected.