Stop and think about the difference between playing a team like St John's, versus playing a team like Wisconsin. Wisconsin of course will get a high seed, probably a 3 or 4, but that would be a 4 seed I would love to see us play.
St John's is an absolute load physically, athletically - they've got length, strength and skill.
Wisconsin? Nowhere near as physical or challenging to defend.
End of the day, if the refs allow a physical game, St. John's will go a LONG way in the NCAA.
If SJU could play every game at MSG, they would be national champs.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on March 14, 2025, 08:14:30 PMStop and think about the difference between playing a team like St John's, versus playing a team like Wisconsin. Wisconsin of course will get a high seed, probably a 3 or 4, but that would be a 4 seed I would love to see us play.
St John's is an absolute load physically, athletically - they've got length, strength and skill.
Wisconsin? Nowhere near as physical or challenging to defend.
End of the day, if the refs allow a physical game, St. John's will go a LONG way in the NCAA.
Shaka Slurper.
Ps...thanks for getting Wojo fired.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on March 14, 2025, 08:14:30 PMStop and think about the difference between playing a team like St John's, versus playing a team like Wisconsin. Wisconsin of course will get a high seed, probably a 3 or 4, but that would be a 4 seed I would love to see us play.
St John's is an absolute load physically, athletically - they've got length, strength and skill.
Wisconsin? Nowhere near as physical or challenging to defend.
End of the day, if the refs allow a physical game, St. John's will go a LONG way in the NCAA.
Pitino has the blue ribbon recipe. They'll be really good for as long as he's their HC. It's good for the BE, in my opinion. HOF coach. NYC. MSG. Media central. I think the conference is going to be very good over the next few years. DePaul might have a good coach, finally. Cooley will continue to improve GTown. McDermott, Hurley, Miller...they'll continue to be stout. Hopefully Shaka's approach around retention and culture pans out. I just feel that to match Pitino and Hurley, force in the paint and shooters are a requirement. MU finished 3-7 this season vs the top 4.
Need more data.
Let's see how we do next year.
Unless Shaka goes to the portal I think next year will be ugly. They are only
returning their 4th and 5th best players.
Gold cannot cut it at the BE level...
Beyond him and Ross, they have a bunch of completely unproven and unreliable very young players.
Meanwhile, UCONN and SJU and others will reload
Gold will be serviceable, but there won't be any BE teams losing any sleep about having to face him.
I can say that pretty confidently at this point, even if he goes off and hits 10 3s in the NCAAt to help Marquette get to the E8
Btw it was impressive to see Zuby step out and not allow him to get a shot off, and then guard Kam in space in the same possession, and then dominate everyone on Marquettes interior defense on the other end, and never really get gassed.
Ben was too passive today, he had the dribble drive available a few times because everyone on StJ steps out to the 3 to guard aggressively. He didn't look alive at all.
Zaide did. He failed some and he succeeded some, but he was alive to the drive
Quote from: Mu8891 on March 14, 2025, 09:45:46 PMUnless Shaka goes to the portal I think next year will be ugly. They are only
returning their 4th and 5th best players.
Gold cannot cut it at the BE level...
Beyond him and Ross, they have a bunch of completely unproven and unreliable very young players.
Meanwhile, UCONN and SJU and others will reload
Forgot my second point
Ben will be serviceable, Chase will be all BE team caliber, though not sure which of the 3 teams (I'd guess 3rd at this point)
Zaide will be very good, and so will Parham, assuming both return. Future star potential as a Sr and Jr respectively in the following year imo.
I think DO makes the leap to top 3 scorer on the team, just don't know how he finds his way, but I can see the star potential people saw in Ben much more in DO.
Next year will be VERY reliant on first year contributors though, much more than this year.
What I mentioned above is very weak sauce return talent compared to what we have in Kam/Stevie/Jop, who pretty much were guaranteed 27+ minutes falling out of bed, not to mention Chase.
Other than Chase there is no guaranteed 30 mins guy next year, so a lot more up for grabs than years past.
Even Ben, Parham, Zaide need to perform much better than this season to get that much run.
So, between Clark, Amadou, James, Miletic, Stevens, Phillips, and Tre/Caedin who I will lump in with the above as "new" options, 2-3 will really have to step up and play a huge role.
If Shaka doesn't see that, he will shop and some will drop and then the beat goes on.
It will be a transition year, undoubtedtly
Quote from: Mu8891 on March 14, 2025, 09:45:46 PMUnless Shaka goes to the portal I think next year will be ugly. They are only
returning their 4th and 5th best players.
Gold cannot cut it at the BE level...
Beyond him and Ross, they have a bunch of completely unproven and unreliable very young players.
Meanwhile, UCONN and SJU and others will reload
While Gold and Ross have experience, they've been who they are: average players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production. If Shaka believes they can be competitive without adding some talent, maybe (hopefully) he knows something we don't.
Quote from: Warrior of Law on March 15, 2025, 07:56:54 AMWhile Gold and Ross have experience, they've been who they are: average players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production. If Shaka believes they can be competitive without adding some talent, maybe (hopefully) he knows something we don't.
They're not? How do we know this?
I think we make the tourney next year. Top half of BE. Being a fairweather fan I don't think about it till November.
There are so many question marks about next that I don't think of us really know what to expect. It is likely to be a frustrating but entertaining season as young players try to step up to major college basketball. After watching Gold and Ross for three years, we pretty much know what they are. Parham can obviously play at a high level but will have to take on a lot more scoring and rebounding responsibility. Everything else is a crap shoot. Can Norman play a major role or does he decide to move on? Is Owens actually a real player or just a very athletic guy? Who will become the team leader? Can Sean Jones be effective in the BE as a starting pg? Etc, etc, etc.
Quote from: DoctorV on March 14, 2025, 10:02:12 PMForgot my second point
Ben will be serviceable, Chase will be all BE team caliber, though not sure which of the 3 teams (I'd guess 3rd at this point)
Zaide will be very good, and so will Parham, assuming both return. Future star potential as a Sr and Jr respectively in the following year imo.
I think DO makes the leap to top 3 scorer on the team, just don't know how he finds his way, but I can see the star potential people saw in Ben much more in DO.
Next year will be VERY reliant on first year contributors though, much more than this year.
What I mentioned above is very weak sauce return talent compared to what we have in Kam/Stevie/Jop, who pretty much were guaranteed 27+ minutes falling out of bed, not to mention Chase.
Other than Chase there is no guaranteed 30 mins guy next year, so a lot more up for grabs than years past.
Even Ben, Parham, Zaide need to perform much better than this season to get that much run.
So, between Clark, Amadou, James, Miletic, Stevens, Phillips, and Tre/Caedin who I will lump in with the above as "new" options, 2-3 will really have to step up and play a huge role.
If Shaka doesn't see that, he will shop and some will drop and then the beat goes on.
I wonder how Chase, Zaide and DO will find distinct and complementary roles next year, as they have similar sizes and skillsets. At this point, I don't quite see how all three of your bolded points will come to fruition.
If we don't bring in an impact transfer, I have a hard time seeing us in the top half of the BE next year. Ross and Gold are nice players, but not enough to keep us at the level we were at this year. Everyone else is pretty unproven. I'm most optimistic about Zaide as he made some nice strides this year and Parham also has potential. Owens, Norman and Hamilton could all turn out okay but currently make too many mistakes on both ends to stay on the floor for very long.
Quote from: rgoode57 on March 15, 2025, 08:27:30 AMThere are so many question marks about next that I don't think of us really know what to expect. It is likely to be a frustrating but entertaining season as young players try to step up to major college basketball. After watching Gold and Ross for three years, we pretty much know what they are. Parham can obviously play at a high level but will have to take on a lot more scoring and rebounding responsibility. Everything else is a crap shoot. Can Norman play a major role or does he decide to move on? Is Owens actually a real player or just a very athletic guy? Who will become the team leader? Can Sean Jones be effective in the BE as a starting pg? Etc, etc, etc.
Yes. As it has always been. Seniors and stars leave. Questions abound. Who will step up? Who will make the leap? This is the circle of life in college basketball. If every single player left and Shaka had to get 10 players out of the portal, the questions would be the same.
Quote from: tower912 on March 15, 2025, 09:01:46 AMYes. As it has always been. Seniors and stars leave. Questions abound. Who will step up? Who will make the leap? This is the circle of life in college basketball. If every single player left and Shaka had to get 10 players out of the portal, the questions would be the same.
I dont understand why scoopers don't understand this. Because DO didn't average 15 and 8 this year......doesn't mean he can't next year. Freshman watch. Sophs contribute. Juniors and Seniors play.
Quote from: Viper on March 14, 2025, 09:19:18 PMPitino has the blue ribbon recipe. They'll be really good for as long as he's their HC. It's good for the BE, in my opinion. HOF coach. NYC. MSG. Media central. I think the conference is going to be very good over the next few years. DePaul might have a good coach, finally. Cooley will continue to improve GTown. McDermott, Hurley, Miller...they'll continue to be stout. Hopefully Shaka's approach around retention and culture pans out. I just feel that to match Pitino and Hurley, force in the paint and shooters are a requirement. MU finished 3-7 this season vs the top 4.
You are absolutely correct. BEast keeps improving most of their teams, but which direction is MU going after this year. St. Johns getting way better is good for Beast, but Rick is still a sleazeball. When it comes to competing in BEeast, it feels like MU is fading after this years disappointment, and no bangers coming in. Questions l;ike these need to be considered.
Shaka seems way too competitive to take a gargantuan step back and finish below 5th in the conference. I think he will do what needs to be done to field a competitive team next year.
Quote from: Viper on March 14, 2025, 09:19:18 PMPitino has the blue ribbon recipe. They'll be really good for as long as he's their HC. It's good for the BE, in my opinion. HOF coach. NYC. MSG. Media central. I think the conference is going to be very good over the next few years. DePaul might have a good coach, finally. Cooley will continue to improve GTown. McDermott, Hurley, Miller...they'll continue to be stout. Hopefully Shaka's approach around retention and culture pans out. I just feel that to match Pitino and Hurley, force in the paint and shooters are a requirement. MU finished 3-7 this season vs the top 4.
You are absolutely correct. BEast keeps improving most of their teams, but which direction is MU going after this year. St. Johns getting way better is good for Beast, but Rick is still a sleazeball. When it comes to competing in BEeast, it feels like MU is fading after this years disappointment, and no bangers coming in. Questions l;ike these need to be considered.
Quote from: Mu8891 on March 14, 2025, 09:45:46 PMUnless Shaka goes to the portal I think next year will be ugly. They are only
returning their 4th and 5th best players.
Gold cannot cut it at the BE level...
Beyond him and Ross, they have a bunch of completely unproven and unreliable very young players.
Meanwhile, UCONN and SJU and others will reload
SJU doesnt need to reload they have 4 starters back. U Conn will do what they always do. Compete. Creighton also. Xavier keeps improving as does De Paul. Villanova wiil get better. How about us? Are we moving in that direction? Does not feel like it.
Top 5 in the Big East again next year for sure. Love the talent on the roster, its easy to project nice leaps for some of them. Its going to look a lot different not having this senior class anymore, but we've got a lot of nice pieces on this roster next year.
I also would not rule out Shaka using the portal for the right piece. His comments about the portal get headlines, but at the end of the day he's too competitive to not add someone if he thinks we have a need somewhere on the roster.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 15, 2025, 09:14:20 AMU Conn will do what they always do. Compete. Creighton also. Xavier keeps improving as does De Paul. Villanova wiil get better. How about us? Are we moving in that direction? Does not feel like it.
Ya, I just wish we would "compete" and "improve" like all these teams listed above.
Quote from: Warrior of Law on March 15, 2025, 07:56:54 AMWhile Gold and Ross have experience, they've been who they are: average players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production. If Shaka believes they can be competitive without adding some talent, maybe (hopefully) he knows something we don't.
I'm pretty confident that Shaka knows a whole lot that Scoop doesn't.
Quote from: NCMUFan on March 14, 2025, 09:22:38 PMNeed more data.
Let's see how we do next year.
Yes, there is always next year.
Quote from: Warrior of Law on March 15, 2025, 07:56:54 AMWhile Gold and Ross have experience, they've been who they are: average players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production. If Shaka believes they can be competitive without adding some talent, maybe (hopefully) he knows something we don't.
I think Ross is capable of making a jump, but I don't think Gold is capable of more than a slight step up, and his minutes since February have reflected that. He's more suited to the role he had last year.
Quote from: tower912 on March 15, 2025, 06:55:31 AMIt will be a transition year, undoubtedtly
Carefully worded ;)
Most years are.
Quote from: We R Final Four on March 15, 2025, 09:07:51 AMI dont understand why scoopers don't understand this. Because DO didn't average 15 and 8 this year......doesn't mean he can't next year. Freshman watch. Sophs contribute. Juniors and Seniors play.
Hmmm...iot is good to break a rule once in a while, and those rules deserve to be broken.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on March 15, 2025, 09:12:37 AMShaka seems way too competitive to take a gargantuan step back and finish below 5th in the conference. I think he will do what needs to be done to field a competitive team next year.
Web finished 5th in conference this year, so below 5th is not a gargantuan step back.
Quote from: IrwinFletcher on March 15, 2025, 09:39:26 AMYa, I just wish we would "compete" and "improve" like all these teams listed above.
we did not this year, did we?
Quote from: Warrior of Law on March 15, 2025, 07:56:54 AMaverage players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production.
After the 2021-22 season, what was your opinion of the likelihood that OMax, Oso, TK and Kam would become NBA draft picks?
Quote from: Small Orange Soda on March 15, 2025, 12:51:02 PMI think Ross is capable of making a jump, but I don't think Gold is capable of more than a slight step up, and his minutes since February have reflected that. He's more suited to the role he had last year.
I don't see Ross becoming a supreme ball handler, passer or 3 shooter.
He can likely improve his defense and slashing/driving.
Ross+Zaide+Damarius slashing/kicking/driving could be a nightmare for opponents if those 3 demonstrate good decision making
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 15, 2025, 04:57:26 PMI don't see Ross becoming a supreme ball handler, passer or 3 shooter.
He can likely improve his defense and slashing/driving.
Ross+Zaide+Damarius slashing/kicking/driving could be a nightmare for opponents if those 3 demonstrate good decision making
What do you classify as supreme 3 shooter? And do you think we need them to become supreme shooters?
Chase and Zaide are combine 58 for 156 from 3 at about 37%-38%. That's really good.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 05:02:08 PMWhat do you classify as supreme 3 shooter? And do you think we need them to become supreme shooters?
Chase and Zaide are combine 58 for 156 from 3 at about 37%-38%. That's really good.
With Kam and Jop gone, they will have much more focus. So, less wide open catch and shoot opportunities, I suspect.
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 15, 2025, 05:04:31 PMWith Kam and Jop gone, they will have much more focus. So, less wide open catch and shoot opportunities, I suspect.
They will have 2 legitimate Point Guards in the mix though. Kam is awesome but Sean and Nigel should also be fantastic at splitting defenses and creating great movement offensively.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 05:06:39 PMThey will have 2 legitimate Point Guards in the mix though. Kam is awesome but Sean and Nigel should also be fantastic at splitting defenses and creating great movement offensively.
Just to clarify, are you implying that Sean or Nigel will get the same defensive focus that Kam and Jop got?
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 15, 2025, 06:16:05 PMJust to clarify, are you implying that Sean or Nigel will get the same defensive focus that Kam and Jop got?
Not Kam. But I'm quite confident in their abilities to create shots for both themselves and others.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 06:37:22 PMNot Kam. But I'm quite confident in their abilities to create shots for both themselves and others.
We will have a freshman and a guy who has not played in almost two years competitively. It will be a challenge .....
Quote from: Daniel on March 15, 2025, 07:24:06 PMWe will have a freshman and a guy who has not played in almost two years competitively. It will be a challenge .....
Disagree. Speed Kills. They have that. Shaka has said Sean is still the fastest player he's seen. He's healthy and looks great. He will be 20 months removed from surgery next November. And we will always have Freshman. Not exactly sure what that means. We will not be lead by Freshman, but will have them, yes.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 07:31:20 PMDisagree. Speed Kills. They have that. Shaka has said Sean is still the fastest player he's seen. He's healthy and looks great. He will be 20 months removed from surgery next November. And we will always have Freshman. Not exactly sure what that means. We will not be lead by Freshman, but will have them, yes.
Excited to see what Sean can bring but he has to yet prove he can finish at the rim consistently, develop a floater, distribute effectively and hit the 3. He's a major question mark right now.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on March 15, 2025, 07:43:10 PMExcited to see what Sean can bring but he has to yet prove he can finish at the rim consistently, develop a floater, distribute effectively and hit the 3. He's a major question mark right now.
He is 54 for 106 on 2 points shots in his career ~51%.
That'll play.
But my main point is that we will have 2 legitimate PGs next year so it's not like we will just not be able to generate open looks anymore. We'll be fine. It will all come down to making shots. I'm excited to see this crew grow.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 07:55:04 PMHe is 54 for 106 on 2 points shots in his career ~51%.
That'll play.
But my main point is that we will have 2 legitimate PGs next year so it's not like we will just not be able to generate open looks anymore. We'll be fine. It will all come down to making shots. I'm excited to see this crew grow.
PG can certainly end up as a strength but to not believe there are major questions at that position right now doesn't make much sense to me.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on March 15, 2025, 07:56:31 PMPG can certainly end up as a strength but to not believe there are major questions at that position right now doesn't make much sense to me.
This is the correct take.
And that'll make things that much harder for 2-5 getting good/easy/open shots
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on March 15, 2025, 07:56:31 PMPG can certainly end up as a strength but to not believe there are major questions at that position right now doesn't make much sense to me.
Ya, idk, I'm just not remotely concerned about that position at all.
Quote from: Viper on March 14, 2025, 09:19:18 PMPitino has the blue ribbon recipe. They'll be really good for as long as he's their HC. It's good for the BE, in my opinion. HOF coach. NYC. MSG. Media central. I think the conference is going to be very good over the next few years. DePaul might have a good coach, finally. Cooley will continue to improve GTown. McDermott, Hurley, Miller...they'll continue to be stout. Hopefully Shaka's approach around retention and culture pans out. I just feel that to match Pitino and Hurley, force in the paint and shooters are a requirement. MU finished 3-7 this season vs the top 4.
6 of St. John's best players came from the portal. Hurley does the same thing. Unless we want to consider transfers, it will be a struggle. Last night St. John's transfer center had 33 points. Ben Gold had zero. Might have to adjust Shaka's approach to building a roster if we want to win consistently at the highest level.
Quote from: TheBlackJerryWest on March 15, 2025, 08:34:58 PM6 of St. John's best players came from the portal. Hurley does the same thing. Unless we want to consider transfers, it will be a struggle. Last night St. John's transfer center had 33 points. Ben Gold had zero. Might have to adjust Shaka's approach to building a roster if we want to win consistently at the highest level.
That's interesting considering Shaka has won consistently through his first 4 seasons.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on March 15, 2025, 08:41:43 PMThat's interesting considering Shaka has won consistently through his first 4 seasons.
Herm's just being Herm.
Quote from: The Sultan on March 15, 2025, 08:50:41 PMHerm's just being Herm.
Had no idea Herm had risen from the dead yet again but I guess Easter isn't too far away.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 15, 2025, 09:11:03 AMYou are absolutely correct. BEast keeps improving most of their teams, but which direction is MU going after this year. St. Johns getting way better is good for Beast, but Rick is still a sleazeball. When it comes to competing in BEeast, it feels like MU is fading after this years disappointment, and no bangers coming in. Questions l;ike these need to be considered.
I think Rick has worked hard and has clearly excelled at what you call sleazeball. A particularly disgusting sleazeball-ism play was a knee to Stevie's gut in the second half or how about numerous hooks, pushes and blocks that were never called. I have to say the one I liked the best is when Gold was hooked and he just stepped away and Zuby fell to the ground as he tripped over himself. Fortunately neither was hurt. Unfortunately violence has become a new art form for Ricky and some others. Is this the approach the BEast is using to increase viewership at the risk of serious player injuries? I hope not.
Quote from: Class71 on March 15, 2025, 09:17:36 PMI think Rick has worked hard and has clearly excelled at what you call sleazeball. A particularly disgusting sleazeball-ism play was a knee to Stevie's gut in the second half or how about numerous hooks, pushes and blocks that were never called. I have to say the one I liked the best is when Gold was hooked and he just stepped away and Zuby fell to the ground as he tripped over himself. Fortunately neither was hurt. Unfortunately violence has become a new art form for Ricky and some others. Is this the approach the BEast is using to increase viewership at the risk of serious player injuries? I hope not.
🙄🙄🙄
Quote from: The Sultan on March 15, 2025, 08:50:41 PMHerm's just being Herm.
He's back??
With yet another name?? I assume he's still trying to put behind him that he likes getting young women intentionally drunk for the purpose of having unprotected sex with them
Pitino asked 9-9-9 for program-building tips.
Quote from: Warrior of Law on March 15, 2025, 07:56:54 AMWhile Gold and Ross have experience, they've been who they are: average players that aren't poised to make a big jump in production. If Shaka believes they can be competitive without adding some talent, maybe (hopefully) he knows something we don't.
As head coach he knows a lot we don't have any knowledge regarding players.
Quote from: frozena pizza on March 15, 2025, 08:59:23 AMIf we don't bring in an impact transfer, I have a hard time seeing us in the top half of the BE next year. Ross and Gold are nice players, but not enough to keep us at the level we were at this year. Everyone else is pretty unproven. I'm most optimistic about Zaide as he made some nice strides this year and Parham also has potential. Owens, Norman and Hamilton could all turn out okay but currently make too many mistakes on both ends to stay on the floor for very long.
I like Owens future. Really hope we get to see it play out. A lot to learn but so tantalizing
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on March 15, 2025, 07:31:20 PMDisagree. Speed Kills. They have that. Shaka has said Sean is still the fastest player he's seen. He's healthy and looks great. He will be 20 months removed from surgery next November. And we will always have Freshman. Not exactly sure what that means. We will not be lead by Freshman, but will have them, yes.
Not so sure about some frosh not being a leader. If not, who will? Not Ben,who will continue to lose minutes as he has reached his ceiling. Maybe Ross or one of the sophs.
Quote from: TheBlackJerryWest on March 15, 2025, 08:34:58 PM6 of St. John's best players came from the portal. Hurley does the same thing. Unless we want to consider transfers, it will be a struggle. Last night St. John's transfer center had 33 points. Ben Gold had zero. Might have to adjust Shaka's approach to building a roster if we want to win consistently at the highest level.
How dare you say that. Shaka does not do such things.
OK, joyless willie, we get it. You think Marquette should fire Shaka after this disaster of a season because he won't build the team the way an anonymous interwebs guy who didn't go to MU wants him to.
Who should we hire next?
Quote from: MU82 on March 16, 2025, 11:45:44 AMOK, joyless willie, we get it. You think Marquette should fire Shaka after this disaster of a season because he won't build the team the way an anonymous interwebs guy who didn't go to MU wants him to.
Who should we hire next?
As long as it is a traditional, Willard will be happy
Quote from: frozena pizza on March 15, 2025, 08:59:23 AMIf we don't bring in an impact transfer, I have a hard time seeing us in the top half of the BE next year. Ross and Gold are nice players, but not enough to keep us at the level we were at this year. Everyone else is pretty unproven. I'm most optimistic about Zaide as he made some nice strides this year and Parham also has potential. Owens, Norman and Hamilton could all turn out okay but currently make too many mistakes on both ends to stay on the floor for very long.
Agree with this. And the level we were at this year was 5th place in BEast
Quote from: willie warrior on March 16, 2025, 03:09:55 PMAgree with this. And the level we were at this year was 5th place in BEast
We were 4th.
What's Willie going to do now that he found out we were the second highest seeded BE team? MU falling back, getting passed up. Creighton continues to get better every year. Etc.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on March 14, 2025, 08:14:30 PMStop and think about the difference between playing a team like St John's, versus playing a team like Wisconsin. Wisconsin of course will get a high seed, probably a 3 or 4, but that would be a 4 seed I would love to see us play.
St John's is an absolute load physically, athletically - they've got length, strength and skill.
Wisconsin? Nowhere near as physical or challenging to defend.
End of the day, if the refs allow a physical game, St. John's will go a LONG way in the NCAA.
you a Badger fan? All in for Gard? Why mention RED? Come on, do you not agree, Elon...BETTER DEAD, THAN RED?
Quote from: The Sultan on March 16, 2025, 03:11:27 PMWe were 4th.
we were 4th? But wasn't MU the 5th seed in the BE tournament?
Quote from: Viper on March 16, 2025, 07:58:56 PMwe were 4th? But wasn't MU the 5th seed in the BE tournament?
We tied for fourth but were the fifth seed due to tiebreakers. Those tiebreakers do not affect conference standings.
https://www.bigeast.com/standings.aspx?standings=1113
We also were one of the four teams standing in the Big East semifinals, having beaten Xavier head-to-head.
But that's not negative enough, so never mind.
Quote from: MU82 on March 16, 2025, 09:15:10 PMWe also were one of the four teams standing in the Big East semifinals, having beaten Xavier head-to-head.
But that's not negative enough, so never mind.
Didn't cover
Quote from: wadesworld on March 16, 2025, 06:59:36 PMWhat's Willie going to do now that he found out we were the second highest seeded BE team? MU falling back, getting passed up. Creighton continues to get better every year. Etc.
Happy we are in. Seeding not that important. If you can't fathom that this is MUs weakest team since year 1, well sorry for you. And you probably believe we are a FF team next year. I don't see that. Very low expectations next year.
Quote from: wadesworld on March 16, 2025, 06:59:36 PMWhat's Willie going to do now that he found out we were the second highest seeded BE team? MU falling back, getting passed up. Creighton continues to get better every year. Etc.
BTW, guess you missed that both Creighton and UConn finished higher in BEast than MU. How does that fit into your smart ass logic?
Quote from: wadesworld on March 16, 2025, 06:59:36 PMWhat's Willie going to do now that he found out we were the second highest seeded BE team? MU falling back, getting passed up. Creighton continues to get better every year. Etc.
BTW, guess you missed that both Creighton and UConn finished higher in BEast than MU. How does that fit into your smart ass logic?
Beating 4 tournament teams in the ooc boosted MU'S resume.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 17, 2025, 05:02:00 AMBTW, guess you missed that both Creighton and UConn finished higher in BEast than MU. How does that fit into your smart ass logic?
Marquette was better non-conference than both of them. Conference standings are irrelevant when it comes to tournament seeding.
UConn played poorly in Hawaii. MU beat Wiscy, Purdue, Maryland, and Georgia. Maryland on the road, Georgia at a neutral site. These things are given weight by the committee.
Next year looks a lot like Shaka's first year at MU. A lot of uncertainty. On paper, it does look like it could be a down year and possibly a significant down year. If the roster remains the same, we are going to need some surprises and a huge jump in development from the roster overall.
There is no Kam, Oso or Kolek that you can hang your hat on and say they are going to be our star player.
The hope is Ross turns into one and Gold becomes consistent.
We will need an X factor to make next year a good year. I see Zaide, Owens and Parham as those potential X factors. The ones that make that huge jump in development from one year to the next. Can a Zaide 2025-26 make the development jump that RJ Luis did for St. Johns this past year? One can hope.
Quote from: Big Papi on March 17, 2025, 09:29:13 AMNext year looks a lot like Shaka's first year at MU. A lot of uncertainty. On paper, it does look like it could be a down year and possibly a significant down year. If the roster remains the same, we are going to need some surprises and a huge jump in development from the roster overall.
There is no Kam, Oso or Kolek that you can hang your hat on and say they are going to be our star player.
The hope is Ross turns into one and Gold becomes consistent.
We will need an X factor to make next year a good year. I see Zaide, Owens and Parham as those potential X factors. The ones that make that huge jump in development from one year to the next. Can a Zaide 2025-26 make the development jump that RJ Luis did for St. Johns this past year? One can hope.
I understand the trepidation, but that's also part of the fun for me.
So far in the Shaka Era, we fortunate fans have gotten to witness significant improvement by numerous players - above and beyond what most of us logically expected. He already has helped develop four NBA draft picks (counting Kam).
Will Chase become the next Marquette star? Will 1 or 2 (or all 3) of Zaide, Royce and D.O. take the kind of major leap from Year 1 to Year 2 under Shaka that TK, OMax and Oso did? Will Sean Jones return 100% healthy and continue making big plays similar to those he did before he got hurt? Will 1 (or more) of the freshmen play so well that he'll force Shaka to play him?
I'm looking forward to seeing it. Or at least I will be looking forward to it after this season ends ... hopefully not for a couple/few weeks!
Quote from: MU82 on March 17, 2025, 10:00:38 AMI understand the trepidation, but that's also part of the fun for me.
So far in the Shaka Era, we fortunate fans have gotten to witness significant improvement by numerous players - above and beyond what most of us logically expected. He already has helped develop four NBA draft picks (counting Kam).
Will Chase become the next Marquette star? Will 1 or 2 (or all 3) of Zaide, Royce and D.O. take the kind of major leap from Year 1 to Year 2 under Shaka that TK, OMax and Oso did? Will Sean Jones return 100% healthy and continue making big plays similar to those he did before he got hurt? Will 1 (or more) of the freshmen play so well that he'll force Shaka to play him?
I'm looking forward to seeing it. Or at least I will be looking forward to it after this season ends ... hopefully not for a couple/few weeks!
This team has consistently exceeded my expectations since Shaka arrived. I hope they do it again next year. Shaka, his staff, and the players have more than earned the benefit of the doubt. But let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on March 17, 2025, 10:20:05 AMThis team has consistently exceeded my expectations since Shaka arrived. I hope they do it again next year. Shaka, his staff, and the players have more than earned the benefit of the doubt. But let's not get ahead of ourselves.
I don't get how, for so many Scoopers, Shaka has only earned all of the doubt and none of the benefit. I seriously don't get it.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on March 17, 2025, 10:20:05 AMThis team has consistently exceeded my expectations since Shaka arrived. I hope they do it again next year. Shaka, his staff, and the players have more than earned the benefit of the doubt. But let's not get ahead of ourselves.
What was your tournament seed expectation at the end of this seasons non-con?
Quote from: MU82 on March 17, 2025, 10:25:20 AMI don't get how, for so many Scoopers, Shaka has only earned all of the doubt and none of the benefit. I seriously don't get it.
You're reading a very different Scoop than I am. Other than a tiny minority of curmudgeons (willie, Viper, etc.) the vast majority of Scoopers are quite content with Shaka.
It seems that even the mildest of criticism is met with an avalanche of "Oh, so you want Wojo back???" nonsense.
I know, I know ... hyperbole.
Quote from: jesmu84 on March 17, 2025, 10:31:12 AMWhat was your tournament seed expectation at the end of this seasons non-con?
Absolutely a top four seed...probably a two or three.* But my expectation when Kolek and Oso graduated (and got drafted) wasn't particularly high. I never said that they've
always exceeded my expectations. They haven't. But they
have pretty consistently. I didn't expect a double Big East championship in 2022-23. I didn't expect a two-seed last season. I didn't expect a tournament birth in Shaka's first year.
Saying that the team consistently exceeds my expectations doesn't mean that I'm not disappointed by how this season played out as the conference schedule progressed. Of course I am.
*Edited to add that when I bought my tickets for Cleveland months ago, I honestly expected that MU would probably end up playing here as a protected seed. Over the last few weeks I've gone through disappointment that MU wouldn't be slotted in Cleveland as a top four seed to elation that they somehow ended up here as a 7.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on March 17, 2025, 10:39:48 AMAbsolutely a top four seed...probably a two or three.* But my expectation when Kolek and Oso graduated (and got drafted) wasn't particularly high. I never said that they've always exceeded my expectations. They haven't. But they have pretty consistently. I didn't expect a double Big East championship in 2022-23. I didn't expect a two-seed last season. I didn't expect a tournament birth in Shaka's first year.
Saying that the team consistently exceeds my expectations doesn't mean that I'm not disappointed by how this season played out as the conference schedule progressed. Of course I am.
*Edited to add that when I bought my tickets for Cleveland months ago, I honestly expected that MU would probably end up playing here as a protected seed. Over the last few weeks I've gone through disappointment that MU wouldn't be slotted in Cleveland as a top four seed to elation that they somehow ended up here as a 7.
I mirror this, it's been a roller coaster with this team. Before the season started I was HOPEFUL we'd be a 7-10 seed. At the end of non-con, my expectations were a 2-4 seed. So it's weird being back to where we started.
A successful tournament to me would be a victory over New Mexico and a single-digit loss to MSU. Losing to UNM or getting annihilated by MSU would both be disappointing considering the Jones/Jop/Stevie combo.
Let's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
This is satire, right?
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
This can't be real. Who from PC or SH are excited about their coaching situation right now?
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
If you believe this sheet, you are a Maroon!
I doubt you do.
I would expand, but you wouldn't comprehend!
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
Well done.
Quote from: Pakuni on March 17, 2025, 10:34:21 AMYou're reading a very different Scoop than I am. Other than a tiny minority of curmudgeons (willie, Viper, etc.) the vast majority of Scoopers are quite content with Shaka.
It seems that even the mildest of criticism is met with an avalanche of "Oh, so you want Wojo back???" nonsense.
I know, I know ... hyperbole.
Hmm. Maybe the tiny minority is just so loud that's mostly what I hear. I'll try to pay better attention and see if you're right.
Quote from: The Sultan on March 17, 2025, 12:16:44 PMWell done.
Yeah, I'm thinking that he's being "teally." He doesn't actually post on MU hoops very often, and one of his recent posts was a sarcastic play on mid-range jumpers, so I'll echo your "well done" here. I gotta admit that he had me for a second, though.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on March 17, 2025, 12:02:55 PMThis is satire, right?
Elite ball knowledge can take many forms. However at times it can be a lot like obscenity; difficult to define, but you know it when you see it.
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on March 17, 2025, 05:22:23 PMIs the Pope Catholic?
Kinda depends on which Catholic you ask these days.
I'm pretty sure that MU will be ok next season. I don't get the hand wringing and woo is me stuff. Gold, Parham, Ross, lowery and Jones is a more than solid starting 5. I'm also pretty comfortable with Hamilton and Owens as the next two off the bench. I'll admit it gets a bit sketchy after that but you only need to find two more guys or a combination of layers to equal two more guys to have a better than decent team. Big upside with Clark {no pun intended}
Quote from: hawk on March 18, 2025, 11:03:03 AMI'm pretty sure that MU will be ok next season. I don't get the hand wringing and woo is me stuff. Gold, Parham, Ross, lowery and Jones is a more than solid starting 5. I'm also pretty comfortable with Hamilton and Owens as the next two off the bench. I'll admit it gets a bit sketchy after that but you only need to find two more guys or a combination of layers to equal two more guys to have a better than decent team. Big upside with Clark {no pun intended}
What in the world gives you comfort as Hamilton a top 2 off the bench right now.
I like his size and attitude. playing a season is better to grow than practicing for a season. He wants to play
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
This guy gets it, imo. Well done
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 17, 2025, 11:56:44 AMLet's get some context to see where we stand compared to our conference rivals in the future.
St John's – BodyArmor CEO spends NIL money like it's going out of style. Pitino can rebuild a team in one offseason, probably best coach to have for NIL era. Finished above us this season with no sign of slowing down. Spike Lee is back in the fold. Arrow pointing WAY up.
UConn - Hurley has rings, they rebuild and reload and finish above us every year, with the gap GROWING. Beat us in standings in their worst season in years. Games against us not competitive on the court. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Villanova – With Neptune finished holding the program back, they will bring in a coaching hire who will undoubtedly return them to their previous glory. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Creighton – Key players leaving but McDermott always using portal to rebuild. Spends MILLIONS of DOLLARS per year in NIL. Tradition of banging bigs so will be able to bring in more. Arrow pointing up.
Providence – Kim English guiding his program through transition year. Very difficult for us to win in the Dunk. Arrow pointing up, slightly.
DePaul – Holtman has sleeping giant turned around and moving in right direction. Won the pre-conference season championship. Already won 5 conference games this year but was probably more like 7 since they went to OT a lot. Took us to OT in January and we never recovered. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Xavier – Losing key contributors but finished conference season on 7 game winning streak. Beat us for 4 star recruit Nyk Lewis, then beat us on our home court. Embarassing. Kids clearly want to play for Miller. Arrow pointing way up.
Georgetown – Have the right coach in place to turn program around. Attendance on upswing. Doubled their conference wins from year over year. If they do that again, watch out. Arrow pointing WAY up.
Seton Hall – Worst season in recent memory. Only one direction to go from here. Arrow pointing up.
Butler – They play in Indiana. Basketball is big time there, you might have heard about it. Arrow pointing up.
Marquette – Disappointing senior leadership leaving, will devastate roster for next year. Coach, set in his ways, cannot adapt. Questionable NIL approach cannot compete to bring in transfers. Will not use portal to bring in high impact banging bigs or shooters. Will not take ONE phone call from agents for players but takes EVERY phone call from rival schools looking to hire him away from here. Remaining roster cannot play at this level, should leave and transfer to mid-majors. Key PG contributor already in portal. Passed long ago by superior programs in league, losing recruiting battles to league rivals, gap growing larger. Rapidly loosing respect among basketball insiders. Is the bloom off the Shaka rose? Looking likely. Arrow pointing DOWN.
I love the objective stupidity of this post.
I'm unable to opine on Shaka at #muMbb until after next season.
#5YearsToJudge
Shame on Nova!
Quote from: Pakuni on March 17, 2025, 10:34:21 AMYou're reading a very different Scoop than I am. Other than a tiny minority of curmudgeons (willie, Viper, etc.) the vast majority of Scoopers are quite content with Shaka.
It seems that even the mildest of criticism is met with an avalanche of "Oh, so you want Wojo back???" nonsense.
I know, I know ... hyperbole.
so, I question the roster, or recruiting, and I'm a 'curmudgeon'? Then so be it. What's wrong with questioning Shaka's recruiting? What's wrong with the take that Marquette's ceiling is higher than a Sweet 16? Hell, Sultan had questioned...'can't a team take a step back?'. I'm like, so it's rebuild...already and again? I've posted it before and will once again...I'm happy with Shaka. Absolutely!! Definitely better results than Wojo. I do think Wojo was the better recruiter, but Shaka the better coach. However, I feel MU can go higher. Jay Wright-type success. That's actually optimism, not curmudgeon-ism, right? Hence, my thoughts and/or opinions are labeled as negativity. Interesting.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on March 19, 2025, 11:05:12 AMI love the objective stupidity of this post.
It was comedy.
Quote from: Pakuni on March 17, 2025, 10:34:21 AMYou're reading a very different Scoop than I am. Other than a tiny minority of curmudgeons (willie, Viper, etc.) the vast majority of Scoopers are quite content with Shaka.
It seems that even the mildest of criticism is met with an avalanche of "Oh, so you want Wojo back???" nonsense.
I know, I know ... hyperbole.
And it seems that even the mildest criticism of the the program is met with an avalanche of blind Shaka has no faulkts. If you recall, I was one of the first sounding the alarm on Wojo, while many defended him. Curmudgeon or prophet? Also I love the creative name calling from the people that do not see issues.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 19, 2025, 12:18:17 PMAnd it seems that even the mildest criticism of the the program is met with an avalanche of blind Shaka has no faulkts. If you recall, I was one of the first sounding the alarm on Wojo, while many defended him. Curmudgeon or prophet? Also I love the creative name calling from the people that do not see issues.
I cannot forecast to you the action of little willie. He's a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside of dung.
Quote from: Viper on March 19, 2025, 11:26:02 AMso, I question the roster, or recruiting, and I'm a 'curmudgeon'? Then so be it. What's wrong with questioning Shaka's recruiting? What's wrong with the take that Marquette's ceiling is higher than a Sweet 16? Hell, Sultan had questioned...'can't a team take a step back?'. I'm like, so it's rebuild...already and again? I've posted it before and will once again...I'm happy with Shaka. Absolutely!! Definitely better results than Wojo. I do think Wojo was the better recruiter, but Shaka the better coach. However, I feel MU can go higher. Jay Wright-type success. That's actually optimism, not curmudgeon-ism, right? Hence, my thoughts and/or opinions are labeled as negativity. Interesting.
You would have been demanding Jay Wright be fired after his first few years at Nova.
Quote from: Viper on March 19, 2025, 11:26:02 AMso, I question the roster, or recruiting, and I'm a 'curmudgeon'? Then so be it. What's wrong with questioning Shaka's recruiting? What's wrong with the take that Marquette's ceiling is higher than a Sweet 16? Hell, Sultan had questioned...'can't a team take a step back?'. I'm like, so it's rebuild...already and again? I've posted it before and will once again...I'm happy with Shaka. Absolutely!! Definitely better results than Wojo. I do think Wojo was the better recruiter, but Shaka the better coach. However, I feel MU can go higher. Jay Wright-type success. That's actually optimism, not curmudgeon-ism, right? Hence, my thoughts and/or opinions are labeled as negativity. Interesting.
My brother, if we're going on the premise that early results portend future success, I would argue rather strongly that we are on a better course for "Jay Wright-type success" than if we had Jay actual Wright coaching the team.
Jay Wright's first 4 years at Villanova
01-02 - 19-13 overall, 7-9 Big East, NIT
02-03 - 15-16 overall, 8-8 Big East, NIT
03-04 - 18-17 overall, 6-10 Big East, NIT
04-05 - 24-8 overall, 11-5 Big East, 5 Seed NCAAT, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #19
Shaka Smart's first 4 years at Marquette
21-22 - 19-13 overall, 11-8 Big East, 9 Seed, R64, Highest ranking #18
22-23 - 29-7 overall, 17-3 Big East, Big East Regular Season Champions, Big East Tournament Champions, 2 Seed, R32, Highest ranking #6
23-24 - Preaseason ranked #5, 27-10 overall, 14-6 Big East, 2 Seed, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #3
24-25 - Preseason ranked #18, 23-10 overall, 13-7 Big East, 7 Seed NCAAT, TBD, Highest ranking #5
Additionally, here is what a career's worth of Jay Wright success looks like.
NIT
NIT
NIT
5 Seed, S16
1 Seed, E8
9 Seed, R64
12 Seed, S16
3 Seed, F4
2 Seed, R32
9 Seed, R32
No postseason
9 Seed, R64
2 Seed, R32
1 Seed, R32
2 Seed,
NC1 Seed, R32
1 Seed,
NC6 Seed, R32
5 Seed, S16
2 Seed, F4
In the middle of Jay's career, he had a 6 year span where he only won 4 NCAA tournament games despite earning two #2 seeds and a #1 seed. He also missed the tournament once, sandwiched by two years of #9 seeds. I can only imagine you bemoaning their "final four ceiling" had you been a Villanova fan.
Over the next 3 seasons, they won two National Championships.
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 19, 2025, 01:34:52 PMMy brother, if we're going on the premise that early results portend future success, I would argue rather strongly that we are on a better course for "Jay Wright-type success" than if we had Jay actual Wright coaching the team.
Jay Wright's first 4 years at Villanova
01-02 - 19-13 overall, 7-9 Big East, NIT
02-03 - 15-16 overall, 8-8 Big East, NIT
03-04 - 18-17 overall, 6-10 Big East, NIT
04-05 - 24-8 overall, 11-5 Big East, 5 Seed NCAAT, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #19
Shaka Smart's first 4 years at Marquette
21-22 - 19-13 overall, 11-8 Big East, 9 Seed, R64, Highest ranking #18
22-23 - 29-7 overall, 17-3 Big East, Big East Regular Season Champions, Big East Tournament Champions, 2 Seed, R32, Highest ranking #6
23-24 - Preaseason ranked #5, 27-10 overall, 14-6 Big East, 2 Seed, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #3
24-25 - Preseason ranked #18, 23-10 overall, 13-7 Big East, 7 Seed NCAAT, TBD, Highest ranking #5
Additionally, here is what a career's worth of Jay Wright success looks like.
NIT
NIT
NIT
5 Seed, S16
1 Seed, E8
9 Seed, R64
12 Seed, S16
3 Seed, F4
2 Seed, R32
9 Seed, R32
No postseason
9 Seed, R64
2 Seed, R32
1 Seed, R32
2 Seed, NC
1 Seed, R32
1 Seed, NC
6 Seed, R32
5 Seed, S16
2 Seed, F4
In the middle of Jay's career, he had a 6 year span where he only won 4 NCAA tournament games despite earning two #2 seeds and a #1 seed. He also missed the tournament once, sandwiched by two years of #9 seeds. I can only imagine you bemoaning their "final four ceiling" had you been a Villanova fan.
Over the next 3 seasons, they won two National Championships.
could have saved you the time. You have a job? Geesch! everything you just listed, i'm well aware of, my friend. MU wasn't in great shape after Wojo's final season, for sure. However, would any of us have had the patience w/Shaka that Nova did with Jay those first few years of JW's reign? Probably not. Shaka got us going right away. Bravo. All good. What I'm saying is...let's strive higher. Let's shoot for what JW did his final 10 yrs or so. Maybe Shaka duplicates Jay. It seems, however, that many on Scoop are good with current levels. I'm not. I see no reason why we can't have a JW run if Shaka recruits at a higher level than it appears he is currently. HS or portal. Do any of you disagree? If I'm wrong and you Scopers want the same as yours truly, post it. Or, whisper it to MarquetteMike and he'll post it. Instead, I get snark, counterpoint, laughable arguments and the classic "I'm obsessed with Gard" (Gard does know ball, but I digress)
Quote from: Viper on March 19, 2025, 01:57:09 PMcould have saved you the time. You have a job? Geesch! everything you just listed, i'm well aware of, my friend. MU wasn't in great shape after Wojo's final season, for sure. However, would any of us have had the patience w/Shaka that Nova did with Jay those first few years of JW's reign? Probably not. Shaka got us going right away. Bravo. All good. What I'm saying is...let's strive higher. Let's shoot for what JW did his final 10 yrs or so. Maybe Shaka duplicates Jay. It seems, however, that many on Scoop are good with current levels. I'm not. I see no reason why we can't have a JW run if Shaka recruits at a higher level than it appears he is currently. HS or portal. Do any of you disagree? If I'm wrong and you Scopers want the same as yours truly, post it. Or, whisper it to MarquetteMike and he'll post it. Instead, I get snark, counterpoint, laughable arguments and the classic "I'm obsessed with Gard" (Gard does know ball, but I digress)
I think everyone wants us to shoot higher. But they just feel that more patience is in order.
Quote from: The Sultan on March 19, 2025, 01:59:27 PMI think everyone wants us to shoot higher. But they just feel that more patience is in order.
As well as understanding both that success is not linear, as well as the fact that Shaka is building the program his own way and he's not going to disregard that to appease some anonymous online message board posters.
I imagine every school's fan base wants to be doing their equivalence to a March down Wisconsin Avenue.
Quote from: Viper on March 19, 2025, 01:57:09 PMcould have saved you the time. You have a job? Geesch! everything you just listed, i'm well aware of, my friend. MU wasn't in great shape after Wojo's final season, for sure. However, would any of us have had the patience w/Shaka that Nova did with Jay those first few years of JW's reign? Probably not. Shaka got us going right away. Bravo. All good. What I'm saying is...let's strive higher. Let's shoot for what JW did his final 10 yrs or so. Maybe Shaka duplicates Jay. It seems, however, that many on Scoop are good with current levels. I'm not. I see no reason why we can't have a JW run if Shaka recruits at a higher level than it appears he is currently. HS or portal. Do any of you disagree? If I'm wrong and you Scopers want the same as yours truly, post it. Or, whisper it to MarquetteMike and he'll post it. Instead, I get snark, counterpoint, laughable arguments and the classic "I'm obsessed with Gard" (Gard does know ball, but I digress)
Who says we - including Shaka - aren't "striving higher"?
Quote from: MU82 on March 19, 2025, 02:46:15 PMWho says we - including Shaka - aren't "striving higher"?
Yep, the ones that whine and cry about not winning chips assumes that no one else wants to win chips because no one else is whining and crying about it. Some want all of the successes that a Wright had, without any of the struggles he had to go through to get said success, and it just doesn't work that way.
Quote from: Its DJOver on March 19, 2025, 03:08:36 PMYep, the ones that whine and cry about not winning chips assumes that no one else wants to win chips because no one else is whining and crying about it. Some want all of the successes that a Wright had, without any of the struggles he had to go through to get said success, and it just doesn't work that way.
Yep. Let's say we throw away Wright's first several years when he was just building the program and learning how to coach at the major level.
From Year 4 thru Year 8, it looked like he really had figured it all out, making steady progress that included two S16s, an E8 and a FF appearance in that 5-year stretch.
I think most of us would be pretty happy about similar results at Marquette, regardless of the coach.
But then, look what happened over the next 6 years:
2 Seed, R32
9 Seed, R32
No postseason
9 Seed, R64
2 Seed, R32
1 Seed, R32
I'm sure a segment of Scoop would handle a similar trend at Marquette really well.
I can already hear the demands for an aircraft carrier!
Never mind that when Wright did win championships, he did so without a dominant big man.
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 19, 2025, 01:34:52 PMMy brother, if we're going on the premise that early results portend future success, I would argue rather strongly that we are on a better course for "Jay Wright-type success" than if we had Jay actual Wright coaching the team.
Jay Wright's first 4 years at Villanova
01-02 - 19-13 overall, 7-9 Big East, NIT
02-03 - 15-16 overall, 8-8 Big East, NIT
03-04 - 18-17 overall, 6-10 Big East, NIT
04-05 - 24-8 overall, 11-5 Big East, 5 Seed NCAAT, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #19
Shaka Smart's first 4 years at Marquette
21-22 - 19-13 overall, 11-8 Big East, 9 Seed, R64, Highest ranking #18
22-23 - 29-7 overall, 17-3 Big East, Big East Regular Season Champions, Big East Tournament Champions, 2 Seed, R32, Highest ranking #6
23-24 - Preaseason ranked #5, 27-10 overall, 14-6 Big East, 2 Seed, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #3
24-25 - Preseason ranked #18, 23-10 overall, 13-7 Big East, 7 Seed NCAAT, TBD, Highest ranking #5
Additionally, here is what a career's worth of Jay Wright success looks like.
NIT
NIT
NIT
5 Seed, S16
1 Seed, E8
9 Seed, R64
12 Seed, S16
3 Seed, F4
2 Seed, R32
9 Seed, R32
No postseason
9 Seed, R64
2 Seed, R32
1 Seed, R32
2 Seed, NC
1 Seed, R32
1 Seed, NC
6 Seed, R32
5 Seed, S16
2 Seed, F4
In the middle of Jay's career, he had a 6 year span where he only won 4 NCAA tournament games despite earning two #2 seeds and a #1 seed. He also missed the tournament once, sandwiched by two years of #9 seeds. I can only imagine you bemoaning their "final four ceiling" had you been a Villanova fan.
Over the next 3 seasons, they won two National Championships.
Would love to hear how Jay/Nova trended throughout his time there from Willie (after his politics ban) and Viper with that list above. Nova shouldn't have accepted Jay's downward trends. Only coaches who partake in roster malpractice have downward trends, and Jay had them.
Quote from: wadesworld on March 19, 2025, 03:51:18 PMWould love to hear how Jay/Nova trended throughout his time there from Willie (after his politics ban) and Viper with that list above. Nova shouldn't have accepted Jay's downward trends. Only coaches who partake in roster malpractice have downward trends, and Jay had them.
Look how Jay left the Villanova roster. Let that be a warning about something. Fill in as you see fit
Quote from: MDMU04 on March 19, 2025, 01:34:52 PMMy brother, if we're going on the premise that early results portend future success, I would argue rather strongly that we are on a better course for "Jay Wright-type success" than if we had Jay actual Wright coaching the team.
Jay Wright's first 4 years at Villanova
01-02 - 19-13 overall, 7-9 Big East, NIT
02-03 - 15-16 overall, 8-8 Big East, NIT
03-04 - 18-17 overall, 6-10 Big East, NIT
04-05 - 24-8 overall, 11-5 Big East, 5 Seed NCAAT, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #19
Shaka Smart's first 4 years at Marquette
21-22 - 19-13 overall, 11-8 Big East, 9 Seed, R64, Highest ranking #18
22-23 - 29-7 overall, 17-3 Big East, Big East Regular Season Champions, Big East Tournament Champions, 2 Seed, R32, Highest ranking #6
23-24 - Preaseason ranked #5, 27-10 overall, 14-6 Big East, 2 Seed, Sweet 16, Highest ranking #3
24-25 - Preseason ranked #18, 23-10 overall, 13-7 Big East, 7 Seed NCAAT, TBD, Highest ranking #5
Additionally, here is what a career's worth of Jay Wright success looks like.
NIT
NIT
NIT
5 Seed, S16
1 Seed, E8
9 Seed, R64
12 Seed, S16
3 Seed, F4
2 Seed, R32
9 Seed, R32
No postseason
9 Seed, R64
2 Seed, R32
1 Seed, R32
2 Seed, NC
1 Seed, R32
1 Seed, NC
6 Seed, R32
5 Seed, S16
2 Seed, F4
In the middle of Jay's career, he had a 6 year span where he only won 4 NCAA tournament games despite earning two #2 seeds and a #1 seed. He also missed the tournament once, sandwiched by two years of #9 seeds. I can only imagine you bemoaning their "final four ceiling" had you been a Villanova fan.
Over the next 3 seasons, they won two National Championships.
...and that is how Jay will be remembered. Also the college basketball landscape is so different today when Jay was coach: mega conferences, NIL, transfer rule.
When Shaka wins two titles for Marquette nothing else will matter.
Who predicted after losing the 3 amigos and lazar in two years that we were about to go on our best multi year run outside of the Al years?
We spent 5 years building up to that, you have to walk before you can run. Yes it'd be awesome to finally be one of those dream runs, but barring that I'll take the high floor with incremental progress.
Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 19, 2025, 04:23:34 PM...and that is how Jay will be remembered. Also the college basketball landscape is so different today when Jay was coach: mega conferences, NIL, transfer rule.
When Shaka wins two titles for Marquette nothing else will matter.
No, he will trend down afterwards, sad
Quote from: wadesworld on March 19, 2025, 03:51:18 PMWould love to hear how Jay/Nova trended throughout his time there from Willie (after his politics ban) and Viper with that list above. Nova shouldn't have accepted Jay's downward trends. Only coaches who partake in roster malpractice have downward trends, and Jay had them.
Wow. Comparing Shaka to Jay Wright based on first 4 years. I am impressed and sold. Jay Wright success coming to MU
I will never again question Shakas MO and deeply apologize to all those scoopers who have been offended by questioning progress of Shaka. To all of us who know that brilliance and infallability of Shaka need not be questioned but trust in his divine process is the order of the day, I deeply apologize. I just did not see the mirror image of Jay Wrights progression and Shakas. We will always be full speeding ahead under Shaka.
Thank you.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 20, 2025, 07:00:08 AMWow. Comparing Shaka to Jay Wright based on first 4 years. I am impressed and sold. Jay Wright success coming to MU
I will never again question Shakas MO and deeply apologize to all those scoopers who have been offended by questioning progress of Shaka. To all of us who know that brilliance and infallability of Shaka need not be questioned but trust in his divine process is the order of the day, I deeply apologize. I just did not see the mirror image of Jay Wrights progression and Shakas. We will always be full speeding ahead under Shaka.
Thank you.
No one is offended by anything you say because no one takes you seriously.
Quote from: The Sultan on March 20, 2025, 07:24:52 AMNo one is offended by anything you say because no one takes you seriously.
He's like a 15 year old who thinks every idea that pops into his head is original and clever.
Quote from: The Sultan on March 19, 2025, 01:59:27 PMI think everyone wants us to shoot higher. But they just feel that more patience is in order.
This. Shaka's career and Marquette win percentage is all we need to know. He will get it done (final four level) if MU continues to give him the resources he needs.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on March 20, 2025, 08:53:23 AMThis. Shaka's career and Marquette win percentage is all we need to know. He will get it done (final four level) if MU continues to give him the resources he needs.
Agreed. Who determines the resources he needs? Does he have the resources he needs right now or is there more he needs?
Quote from: willie warrior on March 20, 2025, 10:07:54 AMAgreed. Who determines the resources he needs? Does he have the resources he needs right now or is there more he needs?
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