I think Gold can be so much better. He needs to develop a nasty streak imo. I also think he would actually benefit from slowing down at times and concentrating on his footwork. Plant two feet in the lane and just rise up and score the ball. Tbe young man has a lot of skills
One other thing that I'd like to see overall with our young players is a bit more patience launching the three. Just because you can get the triple off, doesn't make it a good shot. We are much better drilling triples off of ball movement and catch and shoots than the walk-up full court or off the dribble. These next three games will be a challenge. Especially Wednesday. However the trifecta is absolutely doable if we play our game. I like having the best player on the floor.
lol
You are correct. You are nit picking. Trust the process.
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 04:33:54 PMI think Gold can be so much better. He needs to develop a nasty streak imo. I also think he would actually benefit from slowing down at times and concentrating on his footwork. Plant two feet in the lane and just rise up and score the ball. Tbe young man has a lot of skills
One other thing that I'd like to see overall with our young players is a bit more patience launching the three. Just because you can get the triple off, doesn't make it a good shot. We are much better drilling triples off of ball movement and catch and shoots than the walk-up full court or off the dribble. These next three games will be a challenge. Especially Wednesday. However the trifecta is absolutely doable if we play our game. I like having the best player on the floor.
You need to put your name up for an assistant position.
Quote from: tower912 on November 30, 2024, 04:35:29 PMYou are correct. You are nit picking. Trust the process.
How do we go from "the process" to natty contenders?
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 04:41:28 PMHow do we go from "the process" to natty contenders?
By not being whiny nitpickers.
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on November 30, 2024, 04:44:32 PMBy not being whiny nitpickers.
That's irrelevant to this discussion. Nitpicking isn't whining either. It's about going from a good team to a great team and maximizing the opportunity.
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 04:47:49 PMThat's irrelevant to this discussion. Nitpicking isn't whining either. It's about going from a good team to a great team and maximizing the opportunity.
I doubt the coaches are trying to make this team better, so good points, imo
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 04:41:28 PMHow do we go from "the process" to natty contenders?
'We' don't. The team does by getting better every day. Having the bench get better and become seamlessly integrated. Hitting 3s, staying g healthy.
And, after this start and the starts of others, MU is already in that bleeping conversation.
Quote from: tower912 on November 30, 2024, 04:56:41 PM'We' don't. The team does by getting better every day. Having the bench get better and become seamlessly integrated. Hitting 3s, staying g healthy.
And, after this start and the starts of others, MU is already in that bleeping conversation.
Okay, Tower. Ty. I'll admit I like immediate domination.
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 05:00:38 PMOkay, Tower. Ty. I'll admit I like immediate domination.
Ill be honest, never struck you as having a Dom kink
Quote from: MuggsyB on November 30, 2024, 04:33:54 PMI think Gold can be so much better. He needs to develop a nasty streak imo. I also think he would actually benefit from slowing down at times and concentrating on his footwork. Plant two feet in the lane and just rise up and score the ball. Tbe young man has a lot of skills
One other thing that I'd like to see overall with our young players is a bit more patience launching the three. Just because you can get the triple off, doesn't make it a good shot. We are much better drilling triples off of ball movement and catch and shoots than the walk-up full court or off the dribble. These next three games will be a challenge. Especially Wednesday. However the trifecta is absolutely doable if we play our game. I like having the best player on the floor.
Gold is a 21-year-old man who has been playing basketball a certain way for a long time. He is who he is. He has become a reliable defensive player and can help swing games when he makes 3s. He's never going to be Maurice Lucas.
I actually agree that there was a couple minute stretch in the second half where the 5 young guys on the court were just firing up 3s, and I was glad they got that out of their system (perhaps after a reminder from Shaka) and started playing basketball again.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on November 30, 2024, 04:52:21 PMI doubt the coaches are trying to make this team better, so good points, imo
Ha! I just spit out my bourbon.
Gold had 12, 4, and 4. With a block and steal.
I'll take that all day.
I still think he can finish off 2 feet at the rim more instead of chucking up a guard-like prayer at the rim. Get into the paint (which he does well) and finish like a big man (which he doesn't do well).
He's getting there.
Ben had 12, 4, 4, 1, and 1 in 21 minutes today. Not his best shooting night, but Id gladly sign up for that as his average statline.
Royce is the only young guy i think needs some reigning in. Hasn't learned the difference between an open shot and a great shot. Tends to shoot without getting his feet set. I love the lack of fear though
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on November 30, 2024, 05:04:35 PMGold had 12, 4, and 4. With a block and steal.
I'll take that all day.
I still think he can finish off 2 feet at the rim more instead of chucking up a guard-like prayer at the rim. Get into the paint (which he does well) and finish like a big man (which he doesn't do well).
He's getting there.
Agreed. I would also say that I'd like Caedin to throw down some two-handed dunks rather than lay the ball in.
But, aside from style points, I'll take what we got out of those two today any time.
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on November 30, 2024, 05:05:28 PMBen had 12, 4, 4, 1, and 1 in 21 minutes today. Not his best shooting night, but Id gladly sign up for that as his average statline.
Royce is the only young guy i think needs some reigning in. Hasn't learned the difference between an open shot and a great shot. Tends to shoot without getting his feet set. I love the lack of fear though
He can launch a bit. I still think Ben should get some buckets in the paint and react quicker protecting the rim.
We're just watching the development of Gold in a new role in real time. Shaka has said multiple times he'll be a lot better in January than he is now. I'm not worried about Ben at all and excited to see where he'll be by year's end.
Not worried on the quick threes either from the young guys (mainly Parham). In post game, Shaka laughed kind of laughed it off in a "he'll eventually learn" tone and said he reminds him a bit of Kam his freshman year. Parham should be a stud for us and these reps are invaluable now. As coach Mac says, I say "let it fly." Maybe I'm wrong and he'd rather play for Gard and get scolded and ironed to bench every time he shot.
Everybody can be better........including all of us scoop posters......
Relax....we're a top 10 team in the country as of now.....we will have ups and downs like every team.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on November 30, 2024, 05:02:23 PMIll be honest, never struck you as having a Dom kink
Why not? He loves Medieval weapons.
1) I'd love to see Ben put the ball on the floor and drive the paint. Especially off a pump fake 3. It's usually wide open for him.
2) I thiught the young guys didn't get enough paint touches with the ball. Not enough movement. Settled for 3s too early in the shot clock. Agreed that most of those were open shots, but not great. Regardless I'd rather have that than timid shooters.
Quote from: MUJunkie on November 30, 2024, 07:49:41 PM1) I'd love to see Ben put the ball on the floor and drive the paint. Especially off a pump fake 3. It's usually wide open for him.
2) I thiught the young guys didn't get enough paint touches with the ball. Not enough movement. Settled for 3s too early in the shot clock. Agreed that most of those were open shots, but not great. Regardless I'd rather have that than timid shooters.
2. Yes. To me, the young guys look like the first season under Shaka. One pass and a three, or a one-on-one move. In the second half, they actually ran the offense a couple of times. Give them time.
Quote from: GoldenEagles03 on November 30, 2024, 05:04:35 PMGold had 12, 4, and 4. With a block and steal.
I'll take that all day.
I still think he can finish off 2 feet at the rim more instead of chucking up a guard-like prayer at the rim. Get into the paint (which he does well) and finish like a big man (which he doesn't do well).
He's getting there.
Absolutely Gold needs to get in the paint more. Would make his overall game much better
Ben is a talented big man.
Maybe the plan is maximizing team play instead of maximizing individual play.
While Ben is a satisfactory 3-pt shooter, maybe having him at the 3-point line opens the offensive options that Shaka likes for the team on a whole.
Quote from: NCMUFan on December 01, 2024, 07:58:35 AMBen is a talented big man.
Maybe the plan is maximizing team play instead of maximizing individual play.
While Ben is a satisfactory 3-pt shooter, maybe having him at the 3-point line opens the offensive options that Shaka likes for the team on a whole.
Exactly. This offense isn't parking a big man in the post.
Quote from: NCMUFan on December 01, 2024, 07:58:35 AMWhile Ben is a satisfactory 3-pt shooter, maybe having him at the 3-point line opens the offensive options that Shaka likes for the team on a whole.
Yep. Many Scoopers seem to struggle with the bolded concept. Go figure,
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on December 01, 2024, 08:07:02 AMYep. Many Scoopers seem to struggle with the bolded concept. Go figure,
I'd like to see Ben mix in half-a-dozen skyhooks a game
I'd like to see Gold play inside a little more or atleast roll to the hoop to be available for drop offs from Kam and Stevie like Oso last year. That's the part of last year's offense I really miss and it would be invaluable if the 3s aren't dropping.
5-out motion. Designed to get open looks from 3 and lay ups. When you accept that this is the offense, what you see on the floor makes a lot more sense.
Quote from: tower912 on December 01, 2024, 08:26:16 AM5-out motion. Designed to get open looks from 3 and lay ups. When you accept that this is the offense, what you see on the floor makes a lot more sense.
Yep. The problem is people are tied to how things used to be done and can't see them differently.
And Ben is a euro-style big.
I am hearing a call for a return to the Wojo days when he would run post ups for Theo.
Quote from: Uncle Rico on December 01, 2024, 08:09:37 AMI'd like to see Ben mix in half-a-dozen skyhooks a game
The skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin. The fact is Ben should get a few rim runs and points in the paint regardless of our 5 out system.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on December 01, 2024, 08:31:20 AMYep. The problem is people are tied to how things used to be done and can't see them differently.
That's not the problem. The problem is people refuse to accept that mixing in occasional rim attacks at 7'0 is helpful. I'm not calling for Ben to be Shaq or Tim Duncan.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:07:49 AMThe skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin. The fact is Ben should get a few rim runs and points in tbe paint regardless of our 5 out system.
If he developed the skyhook like he should, we'd be unstoppable.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:07:49 AMThe skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin. The fact is Ben should get a few rim runs and points in the paint regardless of our 5 out system.
Cow tipping is still one of the more dominant traits for alphas but its frowned upon
Muggsy
Ben is showing a bit more almost every game over the past 4-5 games. He looks to be gaining some confidence, and we likely will see more from him as the season progresses. That said, he has looked pretty good of late.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 01, 2024, 09:21:37 AMCow tipping is still one of the more dominant traits for alphas but its frowned upon
We have a lot of unwarranted animal crulety and besmichment here. It's disgusting, uncalled for, and exemplifies very poor character among members of the human race.
Quote from: Goose on December 01, 2024, 09:57:10 AMMuggsy
Ben is showing a bit more almost every game over the past 4-5 games. He looks to be gaining some confidence, and we likely will see more from him as the season progresses. That said, he has looked pretty good of late.
I think he's the ultimate key to our team Goose. We're capable of making a another deep run if he puts it all together imo.
Muggsy
Like the previous years, making the three ball will be the deciding factor.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 10:01:53 AMWe have a lot of unwarranted animal crulety and besmichment here. It's disgusting, uncalled for, and exemplifies very poor character among members of the human race.
Don't be dramatic. You eat cow 3 times a week I'm guessing
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 01, 2024, 10:17:24 AMDon't be dramatic. You eat cow 3 times a week I'm guessing
Cows are delicious
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 01, 2024, 10:17:24 AMDon't be dramatic. You eat cow 3 times a week I'm guessing
That's not the point.
He should spend an offseason with Steven Adams
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 10:26:04 AMThat's not the point.
Muggsy don't take this as a slight, and nothing against retirees, but oftentimes your comments read like you're an elder statesman.
I think you've said you're a recent grad though?
You don't have to answer if you don't want to.
Regardless, you're obviously passionate about MUbb, how did that passion blossom?
Good teams can beat most anyone if the other team lets them run their offense.
Great teams can beat most anyone when they can run an offense that the opponent wants them to run.
Options. Always good to have options.
I think this whole thread is grossly unfair to the wildly misunderstood nit.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 10:26:04 AMThat's not the point.
The point is you have a blood lust for the same creatures you try and protect
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:07:49 AMThe skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin. The fact is Ben should get a few rim runs and points in the paint regardless of our 5 out system.
Kareem was the most dominant player in history. He developed the sky hook when dunking was banned. No other player has ever been proficient at it. It is not in Ben's toolbox, nor should it be. Ben's problem is that he doesn't leave bloody carcasses strewn across the court.
You really need to learn Shaka's concepts on offense.
Quote from: Jockey on December 01, 2024, 11:16:01 AMKareem was the most dominant player in history. He developed the sky hook when dunking was banned. No other player has ever been proficient at it. It is not in Ben's toolbox, nor should it be. Ben's problem is that he doesn't leave bloody carcasses strewn across the court.
You really need to learn Shaka's concepts on offense.
The game and the world itself, were better places when the dunk was banned
I didn't even know the dunk was banned.
Why would they do that, how long did it last?
Kam would thrive in that environment
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:12:05 AMThat's not the problem. The problem is people refuse to accept that mixing in occasional rim attacks at 7'0 is helpful. I'm not calling for Ben to be Shaq or Tim Duncan.
Where did I dispute that he should drive? Seriously maybe try reading for once.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:07:49 AMThe skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin.
lol. What?
Muggsy
I think you are missing the Ben has been going to the rim of late. Now, I hope he does more of it but he has scored in the paint of late. My guess, he would like to go to the rim more and is following instructions from the coaching staff.
The lane was widened because of Wilt. The dunk was banned because of Kareem.
I award Rico "Domino of the Thread." Absolute masterclass in steering the narrative.
Ben needs to get stronger by beefing up on manatee meat. Or at least by manateeing up on cow meat.
Quote from: MU82 on December 01, 2024, 01:34:10 PMBen needs to get stronger by beefing up on manatee meat. Or at least by manateeing up on cow meat.
Yes, he needs to get stronger. Do not project your issues on Manatees.
Id suggest eating some seals and maybe some blubbery whale as well
Thicken up. But hopefully dont adopt their lazy fat traits.
Quote from: DoctorV on December 01, 2024, 12:01:14 PMI didn't even know the dunk was banned.
Why would they do that, how long did it last?
Kam would thrive in that environment
Lew Alcindor was unstoppable. It was a misguided attempt to stop him.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 01, 2024, 01:40:58 PMId suggest eating some seals and maybe some blubbery whale as well
Thicken up. But hopefully dont adopt their lazy fat traits.
They are naturally heavy species. That's like telling a giraffe to stop being tall.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 02:04:55 PMThey are naturally heavy species. That's like telling a giraffe to stop being tall.
Or Ben Gold to be like Maurice Lucas.
Quote from: DoctorV on December 01, 2024, 10:37:38 AMMuggsy don't take this as a slight, and nothing against retirees, but oftentimes your comments read like you're an elder statesman.
I think you've said you're a recent grad though?
You don't have to answer if you don't want to.
Regardless, you're obviously passionate about MUbb, how did that passion blossom?
I graduated MU in '04. My Uncle also lived in Milwaukee and took me to MU games as a little tyke. My first MU game was in '89. I saw Tony Smith torching dudes and have been a fan ever since.
Quote from: MU82 on December 01, 2024, 03:05:50 PMOr Ben Gold to be like Maurice Lucas.
Which was never stated or intimated by me. It's not manatees fault that they're shaped like torpedo blimps at birth.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 05:01:31 PMWhich was never stated or intimated by me. It's not manatees fault that their shaped like torpedo blimps at birth.
Manatees are food, not friends
Doctor v
I wish I was young enough to not know the dunk was once banned.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 05:00:11 PMI graduated MU in '04. My Uncle also lived in Milwaukee and took me to MU games as a little tyke. My first MU game was in '89. I saw Tony Smith torching dudes and have been a fan ever since.
I also graduated in 04 and agree with the good doctor, I assumed muggs was in his 70s. That said, appreciate how his random thoughts can turn into 3+ pages.
Quote from: Hallmarq on December 01, 2024, 05:12:06 PMI also graduated in 04 and agree with the good doctor, I assumed muggs was in his 70s. That said, appreciate how his random thoughts can turn into 3+ pages.
Maybe you guys know each other 😂
Yea Muggsys got that old soul energy about him, entertaining for sure, once you realize that it's about to get medieval
Quote from: Goose on December 01, 2024, 05:07:44 PMDoctor v
I wish I was young enough to not know the dunk was once banned.
I get it, but you got to see some great Marquette ball and that's worth a lot.
If I'm lucky enough to be around in 40 years I hope I can talk about a Shaka Natty, or better yet a Shaka era dynasty
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 09:07:49 AMThe skyhhook is still the most dominant shot in history and by a wide margin. The fact is Ben should get a few rim runs and points in the paint regardless of our 5 out system.
Agree with this 100%.That is why I maintain that Kareem needs to be in the GOAT discussions with MJ and LBJ. Kareem was so dominant they decided to change the rules to make it fair. No one could stop his sky hook. He was great on both ends, too. Most dominant player in the Association for more than a decade on both ends of the floor.
Doctor
I hope you are talking about a Shaka led NC in 40 years.
Quote from: Gato78 on December 01, 2024, 07:01:20 PMAgree with this 100%.That is why I maintain that Kareem needs to be in the GOAT discussions with MJ and LBJ. Kareem was so dominant they decided to change the rules to make it fair. No one could stop his sky hook. He was great on both ends, too. Most dominant player in the Association for more than a decade on both ends of the floor.
Kareem was great.
But the idea that "the skyhook is the most dominant shot in history by a wide margin" is not really accurate. Honestly I am nitpicking the "wide margin" more than anything. The MJ step-back...Hakeem's Dream Shake...Tim Duncan's bank shot...the Steph pull-up three...are all examples of iconic shot making that won MVPs and NBA championships.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 05:01:31 PMWhich was never stated or intimated by me. It's not manatees fault that their shaped like torpedo blimps at birth.
Just had fried manatee for dinner. Delicious and feel so energetic, excellent protein.
Best thing that ever happened to Kareem was the NCAA banning the dunk while he was in college. It forced him to expand his game - and the rest is history.
Quote from: Gato78 on December 01, 2024, 07:01:20 PMAgree with this 100%.That is why I maintain that Kareem needs to be in the GOAT discussions with MJ and LBJ. Kareem was so dominant they decided to change the rules to make it fair. No one could stop his sky hook. He was great on both ends, too. Most dominant player in the Association for more than a decade on both ends of the floor.
I think they are absolutely the 3 GOATs. I'm comfortable with any of the 3 being #1.
The Athletic had a great article this week trying to quantify who was best using 15 different categories. LBJ was an easy winner followed by MJ and Kareem. 4th place was way back behind.
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 01, 2024, 05:00:11 PMI graduated MU in '04. My Uncle also lived in Milwaukee and took me to MU games as a little tyke. My first MU game was in '89. I saw Tony Smith torching dudes and have been a fan ever since.
Aren't you still a little tyke?