Not going to do a poll. The starters played the last 5 minutes against Maryland. No subs. That has been Shaka's MO. So, barring injuries or foul trouble, which non-starter will be the first to break through and get crunch time minutes?
I will say Zaide, as I think there will be a time Shaka wants 4 guards on the floor for defense.
Damarius
Owens.
I think it'll be Zaide. I think he's the furthest along defensively and that's clearly a priority during winning time.
Owens for me as well. Has the versatility to replace just about anybody.
If Stevie, Chase, or Jop struggle Owens can plug in for any of them. We might even see a small ball lineup at times with Gold on the bench and Jop at the 5.
Owens as he gets reps seems most likely
Zaide with his D is a contender too but right now his offense is absolutely horrific so hes got to get that back to a point where he can at least draw iron on a open corner 3. Or tough to have him out there in crunch time and play 4 on 5 offensively
Jop on offense, Zaide on D.
Royce. If Gold or Jop are fouling too much someone will have to be relied on, and right now Royce gives us offense and defense.
Parham. He's shown what he can do already. Not saying Owens will not be the guy in time, but the here and now? Parham.
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on November 18, 2024, 02:05:40 PMParham. He's shown what he can do already. Not saying Owens will not be the guy in time, but the here and now? Parham.
My thought too for his ability to be a post presence and rebound down the stretch of games.
cousins has been and still is my go to sub. either the special or double cheese steak on asiago cheese bread for my carb-fest day of the week
Probably depends on who is in foul trouble/fouled out during crunch time first. Since Ben Gold is the least experienced at playing with fouls he might be the logical pick. Shaka does seem to be platooning at that spot already so it would probably have to be a case when Ben picks up a few early ones, Royce gets extended minutes, and Shaka leaves him in with better feel for the game.
Royce might be able to give small ball 5 minutes but thats probably not at crunch time. Zaide could give you closing defense minutes if he proved anything at all offensively.
This exercise works best backwards for me.
Obviously this is barring injury or unforeseen circumstances, but Kam, Stewie, and Chase aren't coming off at crunch time.
So, either Jop or Ben would sit.
-Owens is versatile and can play the 4, but not likely the 5.
-Zaide can play the 4, but not the 5. As many have said he's the leading defensive candidate.
-Parham can play the 4 or the 5 and is the most advance offensively, at the moment.
-Caedin can play the 5, but not the 4. Would only get in if size and rebounding were needed at this point.
-This thread really makes me wish for Tre to have a big game that catapults his season.
So, I'll go with Parham.
FWIW I was with a buddy that's really in tune with NCAAb (especially the recruiting side) over the weekend (UNC fan) and he said he expected, or had read, that big money would come for Parham in the off season.
Caught me by surprise
The two true freshmen should be.
Quote from: DoctorV on November 18, 2024, 10:56:33 PMWhoops quoted myself on accident, must be time for bed, even though I love to hear myself speak.
Is there a way to delete a post on mobile? Couldn't find it
Quote from: rocket surgeon on November 18, 2024, 04:28:23 PMcousins has been and still is my go to sub. either the special or double cheese steak on asiago cheese bread for my carb-fest day of the week
lmao
FWIW I was with a buddy that's really in tune with NCAAb (especially the recruiting side) over the weekend (UNC fan) and he said he expected, or had read, that big money would come for Parham in the off season.
Caught me by surprise
Dr. V,
I would think that would be more expected (for anyone that has eyes) than read, unless there is a service sending power conference teams extremely up to date information based on a few games. I would not be surprised if that is the case though. It is such big business.
MU will deal with more of this as we become a product of our own success. Better recruits that are lured by Shaka's pitch initially will need increasingly higher amounts of money to stay even if they love MU and Shaka. $200,000 vs $1,000,000 is a big difference if that choice is available to them.
Need a few big donors to come through with a huge endowment fund so this is sustainable for the university. It honestly should be part of the marketing budget. Need a President who understands this. Big decisions ahead.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on November 19, 2024, 06:27:19 AMNeed a few big donors to come through with a huge endowment fund so this is sustainable for the university. It honestly should be part of the marketing budget. Need a President who understands this. Big decisions ahead.
Ummmm...
Quote from: Jay Bee on November 19, 2024, 07:25:46 AMUmmmm...
I know JB. But I hear the train a coming......
I love to see threads like this one vs. the endless, pointless ones criticizing Ben and Jop or the preachy, laughable lectures to Shaka and the team from a scooper who will advocate for various forms of mayhem in another thread.
It's great that Shaka has some options if he needs them. I was surprised by the number of minutes that he gave to the bench in the Maryland game. It's very possible that Shaka knows more than scoopers. :D
Thanks to Tower for starting this thread.
Quote from: Shooter McGavin on November 19, 2024, 06:27:19 AMFWIW I was with a buddy that's really in tune with NCAAb (especially the recruiting side) over the weekend (UNC fan) and he said he expected, or had read, that big money would come for Parham in the off season.
Caught me by surprise
Dr. V,
I would think that would be more expected (for anyone that has eyes) than read, unless there is a service sending power conference teams extremely up to date information based on a few games. I would not be surprised if that is the case though. It is such big business.
MU will deal with more of this as we become a product of our own success. Better recruits that are lured by Shaka's pitch initially will need increasingly higher amounts of money to stay even if they love MU and Shaka. $200,000 vs $1,000,000 is a big difference if that choice is available to them.
Need a few big donors to come through with a huge endowment fund so this is sustainable for the university. It honestly should be part of the marketing budget. Need a President who understands this. Big decisions ahead.
Need the dentists to man up put up the $$$
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on November 19, 2024, 07:49:38 AMI love to see threads like this one vs. the endless, pointless ones criticizing Ben and Jop or the preachy, laughable lectures to Shaka and the team from a scooper who will advocate for various forms of mayhem in another thread.
It's great that Shaka has some options if he needs them. I was surprised by the number of minutes that he gave to the bench in the Maryland game. It's very possible that Shaka knows more than scoopers. :D
Thanks to Tower for starting this thread.
De Nada.
Sean.
Quote from: Scoop Snoop on November 19, 2024, 10:34:48 AMI really like this answer!
you can just click the thumbs up!
Quote from: Hards Alumni on November 19, 2024, 10:37:46 AMyou can just click the thumbs up!
But there's no really like button!
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on November 19, 2024, 10:46:45 AMBut there's no really like button!
Exactly! I really like your post. ;D
My guess is Parham when both Ben and Jop are in foul trouble
Zaide became the first sub to play crunch time minutes. Subbed in for Ben as Butler had gone small.
Quote from: tower912 on December 19, 2024, 06:06:36 AMZaide became the first sub to play crunch time minutes. Subbed in for Ben as Butler had gone small.
Congratulations Zaide and we thank all the other contestants.
Scoop crypto will be doled out accordingly.
Tre was also in the game with under 5 mins remaining. At the time it caught my attention. Don't remember when he subbed out.
Tre was in mostly due to Jop's foul trouble and because Butler was playing small. He is a decent defender.
Shaka prioritizes defense. Whoever was going to crack the wining time rotation was going to do so because of their defense. Zaide is the furthest along on that end.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on December 19, 2024, 08:38:06 AMTre was in mostly due to Jop's foul trouble and because Butler was playing small. He is a decent defender.
Shaka was subbing Tre and Ben O for D a bit there are the end - Butler's game plan was clearly whoever Ben was guarding to take him off the dribble - and most of the time it worked. Ben's 3 was huge and timely last night, and he had a few good rebounds and hustles, but dude is a major liability on D - he gets beat like 70% of the time in 1v1s which either leads to a layup or everyone else getting out of position and a kick out to a wide open 3. He just cannot stay in front of his man in a 1v1 situation.
So much depends on what kind of game it is, like whether MU is slightly ahead or slightly behind, what the matchups are, etc.
Shaka showed last night that he won't hesitate to make offense/defense type substitutions in the final minutes if the situation calls for it, like he did with Lowrey and Gold last night.
Quote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 12:52:20 PMShaka was subbing Tre and Ben O for D a bit there are the end - Butler's game plan was clearly whoever Ben was guarding to take him off the dribble - and most of the time it worked. Ben's 3 was huge and timely last night, and he had a few good rebounds and hustles, but dude is a major liability on D - he gets beat like 70% of the time in 1v1s which either leads to a layup or everyone else getting out of position and a kick out to a wide open 3. He just cannot stay in front of his man in a 1v1 situation.
We watched different games, I think. Ben got beat off the dribble a couple times. But 70% of the time? Yeah, no. I saw more times that Ben played great defense and a player hit a prayer of a shot than I saw Ben get completely burned off the dribble. That's definitely the weakest part of his defense, but he's been a lot better than I expected.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33dMy3C-5uY
That video lends credence to the notion that Ben was not getting beat off the dribble and was actually right where he needed to be on defense.
Zaide was getting cooked off the bounce as much, if not more, than Ben did.
I mean typically when Ben gets beat off the dribble it is by a much smaller/quicker player.....the vast majority of 6'10 guys will have trouble in that situation from time to time.......not everyone is going to guard like Oso out there.
He also had a great help play late in the game when Kam was fronting a big in the post and they tried to throw it over the top.......it would have worked if Ben hadn't reacted quickly on the backside to knock it away.......Kam was pumped after Ben helped him on that play.
Also when Ben does get "beat" by a smaller guard he has the ability to still effect the shot from the side or behind with his length.
Quote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 12:52:20 PMShaka was subbing Tre and Ben O for D a bit there are the end - Butler's game plan was clearly whoever Ben was guarding to take him off the dribble - and most of the time it worked. Ben's 3 was huge and timely last night, and he had a few good rebounds and hustles, but dude is a major liability on D - he gets beat like 70% of the time in 1v1s which either leads to a layup or everyone else getting out of position and a kick out to a wide open 3. He just cannot stay in front of his man in a 1v1 situation.
This is a wildly bad take
Tough question since I think a starter would have to be in a funk. But perhap
A matchup thing. I see Jop being replaced if he can't hit a shot. Don't want to think about it
Dude is literally the worst defensive big in the league. He makes some nice plays here and there, but overall his D is not good.
Not sure why there are so many Ben slurpers here.
https://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/conferences/Big-East-Conference/59/stats/2025/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/All/Season/C/per/desc/1/
Quote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 10:42:06 PMDude is literally the worst defensive big in the league. He makes some nice plays here and there, but overall his D is not good.
Not sure why there are so many Ben slurpers here.
https://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/conferences/Big-East-Conference/59/stats/2025/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/All/Season/C/per/desc/1/
There are many stats that attempt to quantify a players overall defensive value. None of them are good. Drtg is the worst
Let me just make sure I understand all this correctly. We have "Literally the worst defensive big in the league" Gold, and "Will be addition by subtraction when he's gone" Joplin, both starting, combining for 56 mpg, and we're still 10-2 and ranked in the top 10. Either Shaka is the greatest coach in the history of the game, or there are some bad takes on the Scoop. I wonder which is more likely?
Both/and, not either/or.
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on December 19, 2024, 11:56:16 PMThere are many stats that attempt to quantify a players overall defensive value. None of them are good. Drtg is the worst
You mean none good except the "TAMU eyetest"?
Ben does some defensive things well - he plays well in a zone and provides decent help. If he's in position he can defend the rim/alter shots. But overall his defense is below average - precisely why Shaka was subbing him O for D late. This isn't a controversial take for those without blue and gold glasses on.
Quote from: Its DJOver on December 20, 2024, 07:09:02 AMLet me just make sure I understand all this correctly. We have "Literally the worst defensive big in the league" Gold, and "Will be addition by subtraction when he's gone" Joplin, both starting, combining for 56 mpg, and we're still 10-2 and ranked in the top 10. Either Shaka is the greatest coach in the history of the game, or there are some bad takes on the Scoop. I wonder which is more likely?
As I always say, fans are idiots
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 07:38:06 AMYou mean none good except the "TAMU eyetest"?
Ben does some defensive things well - he plays well in a zone and provides decent help. If he's in position he can defend the rim/alter shots. But overall his defense is below average - precisely why Shaka was subbing him O for D late. This isn't a controversial take for those without blue and gold glasses on.
He was subbing him out on defense mostly because Butler went five-out and spread the floor with shooters. Ben has been on the floor plenty in crunch time so far.
He looks bad when he gets isolated up top against a guard, like most bigs, and when he has to guard someone with bulk. He's fine...not great, but completely serviceable.
He subbed him because Butler had gone very small. Then, two made 3 pointers later, he was back in the game.
Quote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 10:42:06 PMDude is literally the worst defensive big in the league. He makes some nice plays here and there, but overall his D is not good.
Not sure why there are so many Ben slurpers here.
https://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/conferences/BigQuote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 10:42:06 PMDude is literally the worst defensive big in the league. He makes some nice plays here and there, but overall his D is not good.
Not sure why there are so many Ben slurpers here.
https://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/conferences/Big-East-Conference/59/stats/2025/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/All/Season/C/per/desc/1/
-East-Conference/59/stats/2025/Advanced_Stats/Qualified/All/Season/C/per/desc/1/
You must've missed Christ, man. He was the worst on that list
Quote from: Uncle Rico on December 20, 2024, 07:38:45 AMAs I always say, fans are idiots
What I don't understand is how, for the most part, Scoopers think that Shaka has done a good job, yet at the same time think all of his players are bad. The results literally speak for themselves, back to back 2 seeds, Beast Championship, Beast tourney Championship, top 10 team, "Shaka is so great", but "all of Shaka's players suck". I guess some people are truly only happy when they're complaining.
Quote from: Its DJOver on December 20, 2024, 08:09:53 AMWhat I don't understand is how, for the most part, Scoopers think that Shaka has done a good job, yet at the same time think all of his players are bad. The results literally speak for themselves, back to back 2 seeds, Beast Championship, Beast tourney Championship, top 10 team, "Shaka is so great", but "all of Shaka's players suck". I guess some people are truly only happy when they're complaining.
Great post. All I will add is that there is a fine line between commenting on players' performances, strengths and weaknesses, and fantasizing (consciously or unconsciously) about one's ability to coach the team. One scooper, whom I will leave anonymous, even writes what are basically fairly lengthy, detailed pregame talks for Shaka to deliver to the team.
Quote from: Its DJOver on December 20, 2024, 08:09:53 AMWhat I don't understand is how, for the most part, Scoopers think that Shaka has done a good job, yet at the same time think all of his players are bad. The results literally speak for themselves, back to back 2 seeds, Beast Championship, Beast tourney Championship, top 10 team, "Shaka is so great", but "all of Shaka's players suck". I guess some people are truly only happy when they're complaining.
Some fans would rather be right than happy
Quote from: Uncle Rico on December 20, 2024, 08:27:38 AMSome fans would rather be right than happy
Hold the phone. That is what one of my old chiefs said about me. That I would rather be right than promoted.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on December 20, 2024, 07:48:58 AMHe was subbing him out on defense mostly because Butler went five-out and spread the floor with shooters. Ben has been on the floor plenty in crunch time so far.
He looks bad when he gets isolated up top against a guard, like most bigs, and when he has to guard someone with bulk. He's fine...not great, but completely serviceable.
He's a below average big, it's ok to admit that. His defense is worse than his offense, but neither is great.
It's fine, we're not going to have an All-American at every position. He's what we have, he does some things well, and it's also fine to admit that the C is the weakest spot on our team and that with a better C we would probably be a national title favorite.
It's also reasonable to think that our ceiling is higher with our Frosh taking big in-season leaps than it is with Ben playing at the level he's shown over the past 3 years.
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 08:45:24 AMHe's a below average big, it's ok to admit that. His defense is worse than his offense, but neither is great.
It's fine, we're not going to have an All-American at every position. He's what we have, he does some things well, and it's also fine to admit that the C is the weakest spot on our team and that with a better C we would probably be a national title favorite.
It's also reasonable to think that our ceiling is higher with our Frosh taking big in-season leaps than it is with Ben playing at the level he's shown over the past 3 years.
It's too early in the day to be this drunk
Quote from: Uncle Rico on December 20, 2024, 09:06:23 AMIt's a dangerous/stupid/
It's too early in the day to be this drunk
Hey it's Christmas time...
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 08:45:24 AMHe's a below average big, it's ok to admit that. His defense is worse than his offense, but neither is great.
It's fine, we're not going to have an All-American at every position. He's what we have, he does some things well, and it's also fine to admit that the C is the weakest spot on our team and that with a better C we would probably be a national title favorite.
It's also reasonable to think that our ceiling is higher with our Frosh taking big in-season leaps than it is with Ben playing at the level he's shown over the past 3 years.
I don't that's reasonable.
I also think that if he is indeed below average, he isn't much below. That's not me wearing blue and gold glasses - that's years of fine-tuned basketball knowledge.
The Evan Miya site ranks Ben Gold as the 227th best player in the country, 26th in the BE.
But he's below average cuz "eye test."
I think it's reasonable to say that no starter for any top ten team is below average. That certainly seems less outrageous than suggesting that if we would be national title favorites with a better C. We had a better C last year, were we title favorites then?
Quote from: Its DJOver on December 20, 2024, 09:21:04 AMI think it's reasonable to say that no starter for any top ten team is below average. That certainly seems less outrageous than suggesting that if we would be national title favorites with a better C. We had a better C last year, were we title favorites then?
No because the two teams that ended up in the title had better Cs
What is a C in Shaka's system?
Quote from: Juan Anderson's Mixtape on December 20, 2024, 09:20:35 AMThe Evan Miya site ranks Ben Gold as the 227th best player in the country, 26th in the BE.
But he's below average cuz "eye test."
The site has him as a 4 rather than 5, and has him 12th in DBPR (again, it's no TAMU eye test...) in the BE amongst 4s and 5s - so just below average amongst starters at those positions in the BE - comparing him nationally is ridiculous- of course he's better than most centers in the MEAC.
It's alright guys, we have a mediocre high major big man - I'm not saying he's the worst, or even that hes not even servicable, I'm just saying he's the weakest link of our starting 5 - he (like many, but not all, big men) has trouble defending on ball on the perimeter, and the is most likely to get subbed out at crunch time -
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 11:57:54 AMThe site has him as a 4 rather than 5, and has him 12th in DBPR (again, it's no TAMU eye test...) in the BE amongst 4s and 5s - so just below average amongst starters at those positions in the BE - comparing him nationally is ridiculous- of course he's better than most centers in the MEAC.
It's alright guys, we have a mediocre high major big man - I'm not saying he's the worst, or even that hes not even servicable, I'm just saying he's the weakest link of our starting 5 - he (like many, but not all, big men) has trouble defending on ball on the perimeter, and the is most likely to get subbed out at crunch time -
So when you said he's the worst defensive 5 in the Big East, that means every 5 in the conference is better defensively than the best 4 is? Hmm...
He's gotten subbed out defensively in crunch time in 1 of 12 games so far this year. "Most likely" is a pretty big stretch there. Especially when most teams won't have a 6'7" forward as the biggest guy on the floor against us.
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 11:57:54 AMIt's alright guys, we have a mediocre high major big man - I'm not saying he's the worst, or even that hes not even servicable, I'm just saying he's the weakest link of our starting 5
Really? This is your argument now?
Because you did say he was the worst defensive big man in the league.
Quote from: 1SE on December 19, 2024, 10:42:06 PMDude is literally the worst defensive big in the league.
Then you claimed he does "some defensive things well."
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 07:38:06 AMBen does some defensive things well
Then you said he was "below average."
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 08:45:24 AMHe's a below average big
Now he's "mediocre" and "serviceable," and "not the worst"...even though he was the worst defensively as of last night... He's just the weakest link in the starting five. (Which to me is never really a good argument.)
Honestly I have no idea what you are trying to say.
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 07:38:06 AMYou mean none good except the "TAMU eyetest"?
Ben does some defensive things well - he plays well in a zone and provides decent help. If he's in position he can defend the rim/alter shots. But overall his defense is below average - precisely why Shaka was subbing him O for D late. This isn't a controversial take for those without blue and gold glasses on.
I mean I wouldn't call it the TAMU eyetest. But generally yeah eyetest is a lot more valuable on defense than it is on offense. There are some great stats that tell you specific things about a player's defensive ability. If you are going to use a stat to try to quantify a player's overall defensive impact over the course of a season, best IMHO is looking at defensive efficiency on/off stats. Ben is currently second on the team.
Shaka was subbing Ben because Butler went small for the majority of the last ten minutes. You seem to have an idea that being good/bad at defense boils down to how does a player handle being isolated on the perimeter against a smaller and faster defender. Almost all centers are going to struggle in that situation, Ben does better than most.
Quote from: The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole on December 20, 2024, 12:08:06 PMReally? This is your argument now?
Because you did say he was the worst defensive big man in the league.
Then you claimed he does "some defensive things well."
Then you said he was "below average."
Now he's "mediocre" and "serviceable," and "not the worst"...even though he was the worst defensively as of last night... He's just the weakest link in the starting five. (Which to me is never really a good argument.)
Honestly I have no idea what you are trying to say.
By the end of this thread he will be saying he's " good but not all conference level" 8-)
Quote from: MuMark on December 20, 2024, 02:13:58 PMBy the end of this thread he will be saying he's " good but not all conference level" 8-)
OT but till Kam last year who was the best player (in a season) to not get any accolades?
Torviks prpg( points above replacement player) has Ben as the 30th best player in the Big East so far this season.........3 of the players above him play for Marquette......
The bigs above him are 6th year player Eric Dixon.......5th year player Kalkbrenner.....5th year player Fremantle.......Reed Jr of Conn......Sorber of Georgetown and 5th year player Mccaffrey of Butler.
So......he is not one of the best bigs in the big east.......he is not a bad player......he is a decent starter on one of the best teams in the league.
So could you quit exaggerating about how terrible he is now? Nobody said he was a stud......he has improved every year and I'd expect that to continue.
https://barttorvik.com/playerstat.php?link=y&cvalue=BE&year=2025&start=20241101&end=20250501
I saw the title of this thread and fully expected it to be about sandwiches
Quote from: Carl on December 20, 2024, 06:13:31 PMI saw the title of this thread and fully expected it to be about sandwiches
Fck Cousins
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on December 20, 2024, 12:57:45 PMI mean I wouldn't call it the TAMU eyetest. But generally yeah eyetest is a lot more valuable on defense than it is on offense. There are some great stats that tell you specific things about a player's defensive ability. If you are going to use a stat to try to quantify a player's overall defensive impact over the course of a season, best IMHO is looking at defensive efficiency on/off stats. Ben is currently second on the team.
Shaka was subbing Ben because Butler went small for the majority of the last ten minutes. You seem to have an idea that being good/bad at defense boils down to how does a player handle being isolated on the perimeter against a smaller and faster defender. Almost all centers are going to struggle in that situation, Ben does better than most.
I think the refs need an eyetest.
Royce for either Ben or Joplin. Otherwise no one.
Quote from: jfp61 on December 20, 2024, 07:11:29 PMRoyce for either Ben or Joplin. Otherwise no one.
Intentionally?
Quote from: jfp61 on December 20, 2024, 07:17:44 PMnot yet maybe at the end of the year.
Yeah that's not happening.
Except, it is already settled. The answer is Zaide.
Quote from: tower912 on December 20, 2024, 07:23:11 PMExcept, it is already settled. The answer is Zaide.
kinda, expect he gets pulled every offensive possession because he is just used as a foul shield
Sean if he is healthy and effective.........he did it last year at times.
Ps I wonder how much longer without playing until Sean might just decides I'd rather have another full season? Assuming he wants to stay in school for a 5th year which isn't always a given.
That has always been the question. And Shaka has been pretty clear it is about when Sean feels ready.
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2024, 08:45:24 AMHe's a below average big, it's ok to admit that. His defense is worse than his offense, but neither is great.
It's fine, we're not going to have an All-American at every position. He's what we have, he does some things well, and it's also fine to admit that the C is the weakest spot on our team and that with a better C we would probably be a national title favorite.
It's also reasonable to think that our ceiling is higher with our Frosh taking big in-season leaps than it is with Ben playing at the level he's shown over the past 3 years.
A few comments on your views on Gold:
1) His defense is very improved, and will be better than Parham all year long - and I'm a big Royce fan. Yet Royce isn't likely to perform any better than Ben offensively by the end of the year.
2) While Ben may not be able to defend a 6' midget guard with great quickness, 99% of of 6'11" guys cannot, maybe Oso was the 1% that could.
3) Ben's ability to shoot from 3, has made this team more efficient offensively than last year's team. Kam's ability to get into the lane and be super efficient is only made possible by Ben being on the floor. If Oso were our starting 5, Kam's efficiency likely isn't as good.
If someone said before the season that this year's team minus Tyler Kolek would be more efficient offensively, and our defense minus Oso to be as good as last year's team - I suspect most Scoopers would have said unlikely to impossible.
Ben is at least a solid "B" player, with potential to get to AB. He's well above mediocre.