I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
And play who exactly? Chase is out. Sean is out. The freshmen have not looked good. Ben is looking like Harry Froling lately.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 10, 2024, 09:48:23 PM
I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
Not gonna happen. Ross out, Sean Jones out. Leaves NBA bound Gold and two freshmen who have not seen hardly any minutes on floor. Gonna get real ugly.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 10, 2024, 09:48:23 PM
I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
His perimeter defense kills me, but he's the only guy hitting threes at the moment. Not to mention the only guy besides our backup C who should be playing the 4 this season.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 10, 2024, 09:48:23 PM
I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
He did. And it made no difference.
Reduce Jop's minutes? And give them to....?
You can't reduce his minutes. You can change his role by starting Lowery and bringing him off the bench. Especially since Ben's struggling and Chase and Sean out with injuries. Getting a more proven scorer in that second wave might be valuable.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 10, 2024, 09:48:23 PM
I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
his role last season was perfect. Shaka probably over projected Jop as a starter, explaining why he (Shaka) banked on Jop to replace Omax. But, is what it is at this point and the rest of the season.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 11, 2024, 06:05:38 AM
You can't reduce his minutes. You can change his role by starting Lowery and bringing him off the bench. Especially since Ben's struggling and Chase and Sean out with injuries. Getting a more proven scorer in that second wave might be valuable.
I agree with this analysis, yet feel Shaka won't make the move. There were a few defensive possessions last night they let Zaide go double the ballhandler that looked reminiscent of O-Max doing that last year - one of which I'm pretty sure the pass went right between Zaide's hands and probably should have been a steal.
Zaide is the player that is most like O-Max, except I would say has better form on his jumper and is possibly even a little better overall athlete than O-Max (more fluid, and more burst).
Quote from: Elonsmusk on January 11, 2024, 09:07:08 AM
I agree with this analysis, yet feel Shaka won't make the move. There were a few defensive possessions last night they let Zaide go double the ballhandler that looked reminiscent of O-Max doing that last year - one of which I'm pretty sure the pass went right between Zaide's hands and probably should have been a steal.
Zaide is the player that is most like O-Max, except I would say has better form on his jumper and is possibly even a little better overall athlete than O-Max (more fluid, and more burst).
Next man up
Quote from: Viper on January 11, 2024, 06:06:03 AM
his role last season was perfect. Shaka probably over projected Jop as a starter, explaining why he (Shaka) banked on Jop to replace Omax. But, is what it is at this point and the rest of the season.
Yeah, one of my larger disappointments in tihe offensive plan for the season is that it seems the plan out of the gate was for Jop to just replace Omax. But they are such different players. I get that people are frustrated with Jop, but I also feel like he hasn't been put in a great position to succeed this season. He's a bit of a square peg in a round hole fit-wise, but if schemed for on the offensive end, he could easily become our most consistent three point shooter - which is something we desperately need.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 10, 2024, 09:48:23 PM
I don't think it'll solve all this team's issues, but it's time to reduce his minutes.
I don't think it's time to reduce Joplin's minutes.
I think it's time ( like 6 weeks ago) to plant him on the 3 point line and let him be the recipient of drive-and-kick opportunities set up by Kolek and by our other guards.
David Joplin is a spot up 3 point shooter. Period. He is now and always has been at his best when he squares up and shoots. Period. When he puts the ball on the floor he is largely ineffective or useless. He cannot create his own shot well. Not always, but more often than not, his attemps to go to the basket are a disaster.
Put David Joplin in a position to succeed and I think he wll.
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on January 10, 2024, 11:03:25 PM
His perimeter defense kills me, but he's the only guy hitting threes at the moment. Not to mention the only guy besides our backup C who should be playing the 4 this season.
So, as we know, not a Jop fan. I have been able to get over his perimeter defense this year, some guys just aren't quick enough. But, my biggest issue is help defense, getting to the spot, ball watching, sleeping, losing his man. He needs to be mentally engaged, he isn't.
Quote from: 21Jumpstreet on January 11, 2024, 10:33:15 AM
So, as we know, not a Jop fan. I have been able to get over his perimeter defense this year, some guys just aren't quick enough. But, my biggest issue is help defense, getting to the spot, ball watching, sleeping, losing his man. He needs to be mentally engaged, he isn't.
I was using "perimeter defense" as a catch all for all that. Though I actually think he's been a good to very good help defender this season.
Quote from: Dickthedribbler on January 11, 2024, 10:29:11 AM
I don't think it's time to reduce Joplin's minutes.
I think it's time ( like 6 weeks ago) to plant him on the 3 point line and let him be the recipient of drive-and-kick opportunities set up by Kolek and by our other guards.
David Joplin is a spot up 3 point shooter. Period. He is now and always has been at his best when he squares up and shoots. Period. When he puts the ball on the floor he is largely ineffective or useless. He cannot create his own shot well. Not always, but more often than not, his attemps to go to the basket are a disaster.
Put David Joplin in a position to succeed and I think he wll.
Well, sure, but here's the problem.
All the teams we play know this. They also know that Stevie can't shoot, SJ22 can't shoot, Chase can't shoot and so on and so forth.
So, as the guards aimlessly dribble around with nowhere to go and Jop sits planter on the 3P line his defender sits right there planted right next to him like white on rice.
In the meantime, Stevie/chase/Sean etc etc defender sags way off and just clogs the lane so the two guards can't really go anywhere, and can't pass to an open Jop to shoot from 3.
Additionally, he's 6'8 and had games of 9,6,5 boards in the last 4, after being specifically called out and challenged by the staff to get more offensive rebounds.
If he's planted at the 3P line the rebounding will also suffer.
Now what?
Jop last 4: 127+ ORtg, 62.5 eFG%, 6.3 or%, 18.5% dr%, 6.1 to%, 7.2% blk%, 46.2% on treys
Prior to last 4... sub 97, 48.8%, 1.2, 13.0, 11.8, 1.3, 36.2
He's comin'
#Jolp
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on January 11, 2024, 09:43:42 PM
I was using "perimeter defense" as a catch all for all that. Though I actually think he's been a good to very good help defender this season.
Gotcha. He certainly has had moments of good defense. It's in there, he/MU cannot afford for him to fall asleep. It's in there, if he wants to commit.
Anyone coming away from the Butler game thinking Jop was the problem might need to have their eyes checked. And when our first two options off the bench are missing extended time, it doesn't seem like anyone in the current rotation will have their minutes reduced.
Quote from: The Sultan of Semantics on January 11, 2024, 06:05:38 AM
You can't reduce his minutes. You can change his role by starting Lowery and bringing him off the bench. Especially since Ben's struggling and Chase and Sean out with injuries. Getting a more proven scorer in that second wave might be valuable.
I actually really like this idea.
It would take a real sales job by Shaka to convince Joplin that he's not being demoted, but that would seem to be one of Shaka's strengths.
As Ners said, though, I don't think this will happen.
Quote from: MU82 on January 12, 2024, 09:54:44 AM
I actually really like this idea.
It would take a real sales job by Shaka to convince Joplin that he's not being demoted, but that would seem to be one of Shaka's strengths.
As Ners said, though, I don't think this will happen.
Cannot do this.
Quote from: Jay Bee on January 12, 2024, 10:18:53 AM
Cannot do this.
I agree with JB - Jop can fill it up and will need to for this team to be successful. But he's not a prototypical second unit, go get buckets scorer-type. He can't really create his own offense. He succeeds best in structure - on offense, catch and shoot rythm threes, and on defense as an undersized but strong defender against larger players who are more comfortable in the post than off the bounce. Without Sean and Chase, I think Shaka will have to start both of Kam and Jop, but be mindful to stagger Kam with second unit players and so that Kam is fresh and can go to work when TK and/or Oso need a breather.
Quote from: MUBurrow on January 12, 2024, 10:32:13 AM
I agree with JB - Jop can fill it up and will need to for this team to be successful. But he's not a prototypical second unit, go get buckets scorer-type. He can't really create his own offense. He succeeds best in structure - on offense, catch and shoot rythm threes, and on defense as an undersized but strong defender against larger players who are more comfortable in the post than off the bounce. Without Sean and Chase, I think Shaka will have to start both of Kam and Jop, but be mindful to stagger Kam with second unit players and so that Kam is fresh and can go to work when TK and/or Oso need a breather.
Maybe ... but Joplin succeeded enough as a second-unit guy last season to be Big East Sixth Man of the Year.
Again, I don't think Shaka will do anything as drastic as removing Jop from the starting lineup - just as I didn't think Shaka would take Stevie out of the lineup when others were clamoring for that. I just think it's an interesting idea.
We're not really gonna have a "second unit" anyway. Given the current injuries, there will almost always be 3 or 4 starters on the floor.
Jop wasn't going to be removed from the starting line up before. He certainly will not be now. Shaka has changed (and then changed back) his opening night starting line up once in 2.5 seasons due to performance and not injury. That is not changing the rest of this season.
Jop needs to elevate his game as do the rest our guys. I'm hoping the debacle on Wednesday, and the terrible injuries from two key guys, lights an inferno with these guys. Tomorrow is ultra critical. It's a must win imao and we are more than capable of getting the job done.
Quote from: MuggsyB on January 14, 2024, 08:48:31 AM
Jop needs to elevate his game up
Yep. Would hate to see him elevate his game down.
Quote from: MU82 on January 14, 2024, 08:53:14 AM
Yep. Would hate to see him elevate his game down.
That was a typo.. I realize he's not Dominique Wilkins.
Quote from: MuggsyB on January 14, 2024, 09:18:42 AM
That was a typo.. I realize he's not Dominique Wilkins.
You mean Jop is not a potential NBA HOFer? SAD
Jop needs to be better. He can't just be a spot shooter. Get him a few wide post touches where he doesn't need to dribble much
Quote from: MuggsyB on January 15, 2024, 09:01:03 PM
Jop needs to be better. He can't just be a spot shooter. Get him a few wide post touches where he doesn't need to dribble much
I was surprised yesterday at a couple of comments that Raftery made about Jop...paraphrasing, he first said, as Jop was backing into the lane, "Joplin can do that and needs to moving into the lane more" and later, as Jop pulled up for a 3, "Joplin has added that to his game." I really like Raftery but wonder if he started imbibing even earlier than normal yesterday, it being a holiday and all.
Quote from: mug644 on January 16, 2024, 11:33:02 AM
I was surprised yesterday at a couple of comments that Raftery made about Jop...paraphrasing, he first said, as Jop was backing into the lane, "Joplin can do that and needs to moving into the lane more" and later, as Jop pulled up for a 3, "Joplin has added that to his game." I really like Raftery but wonder if he started imbibing even earlier than normal yesterday, it being a holiday and all.
Jolp had a really nice spin move in the lane yesterday. Obviously, he's had some trouble in the lane off the dribble, which I in part is due to his lack of explosiveness. But what I've noticed is he's not decisive when he gets in there and often gets himself in trouble. If that's going to be a part of his game he needs to work on his footwork and some counters when his first option isn't there.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on January 16, 2024, 12:56:35 PM
Jolp had a really nice spin move in the lane yesterday. Obviously, he's had some trouble in the lane off the dribble, which I in part is due to his lack of explosiveness. But what I've noticed is he's not decisive when he gets in there and often gets himself in trouble. If that's going to be a part of his game he needs to work on his footwork and some counters when his first option isn't there.
Bingo. Plus, he needs to recognize traps and find an outlet.
Quote from: mug644 on January 16, 2024, 11:33:02 AM
I was surprised yesterday at a couple of comments that Raftery made about Jop...paraphrasing, he first said, as Jop was backing into the lane, "Joplin can do that and needs to moving into the lane more" and later, as Jop pulled up for a 3, "Joplin has added that to his game." I really like Raftery but wonder if he started imbibing even earlier than normal yesterday, it being a holiday and all.
the post game tv interview Raf did with Shaka, Raf is REALLY close to Shaka! And Shaka has this look on his face like...ok, firebreather!!
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 16, 2024, 01:13:12 PM
Bingo. Plus, he needs to recognize traps and find an outlet.
Yep. And if he can develop that and integrate it into his game, he could be really good. Without it, the ceiling is definitely limited. He's not blessed with great lateral speed or athleticism so the mental part of his game has to be more advanced for him to reach the next level.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on January 16, 2024, 12:56:35 PM
Jolp had a really nice spin move in the lane yesterday. Obviously, he's had some trouble in the lane off the dribble, which I in part is due to his lack of explosiveness. But what I've noticed is he's not decisive when he gets in there and often gets himself in trouble. If that's going to be a part of his game he needs to work on his footwork and some counters when his first option isn't there.
It was a great spin move, and I'd love to see more of it. I don't know if it was an instinctive play, but I think he totally caught the defender off guard, perhaps because scouting reports probably show Jop catching, moving slowly and backing in with a dribble. If he can be quick like that move, that changes things.
Update
Jop now shooting 41% from 3 for the season and a sizzling 46% in conference play.
Quote from: MuMark on January 25, 2024, 07:08:48 PM
Update
Jop now shooting 41% from 3 for the season and a sizzling 46% in conference play.
Hes also shooting the same 41% from 2
More evidence he needs to stick to what hes good at and thats firing from distance. Because even if his drive in the lane isnt a TO, its a low percentage shot.
I dunno.... It seems to me that when Jop drives, he loses site of the basket, and defenders and is trying to focus on dribbling, which is a disadvantage because it slows him down, giving defense more time to strip the ball.
Jop>Jolp
Mea culpa
https://x.com/markstrot/status/1751326195340243127?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Quote from: Uncle Rico on January 28, 2024, 12:01:35 PM
https://x.com/markstrot/status/1751326195340243127?s=46&t=QSiaGcOIKZrrpw0ciZkI5Q
Jop
Jop's offense seems to feed his defense. His effort and activity on D have improved a lot over last year, but yesterday there was a next level effort/energy/impact on defense. Hope that continues.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on January 28, 2024, 02:42:17 PM
Jop's offense seems to feed his defense. His effort and activity on D have improved a lot over last year, but yesterday there was a next level effort/energy/impact on defense. Hope that continues.
A few times, it was almost a "hey, who is this guy!" vibe. He wasn't just adequate defensively, he was a difference-maker on quite a few plays.
I also agree about offense feeding defense. That's not uncommon, but it can be especially prevalent with some players. Jop can take that next step if he has more of Stevie's mindset - even if the O isn't there. the defense is. Not easy, though, or else everybody would be like that.
Jop's chest bump with Shaka yesterday was a great moment. Jop had two deflections on that SH possession. He was playing on a whole new level.