MU was feeling itself a bit. Lot of stuff about being for the state. Giving up 40+ to the Badgers in the first half is a joke. Can't go on a run when you're taking the ball out of the hoop every trip down.
Doubled up on the boards. Losing 50/50 balls. Look scared to play. Completely out of sorts, taking the shots UW wants MU to take.
Hope Shaka has the boys ready to defend in the second half. Maybe find Klesmit on the perimeter is a start.
Jop with 9 shots. Kam with 3
Sean brick layer Jones with 2 3 attempts, Kam with 1.
Mentality inept performance on top of the zero care.
Good teaching moment in a December road game.
Jolp has really struggled. Hopefully Jop shows up to take his place.
absolute joke of an effort, wont have to worry about getting big heads about high rankings much longer...
Did MU have any deflections in the first half?
Nm
Quote from: Boone on December 02, 2023, 12:32:56 PM
The hubris of those who predicted we'd have an easy time was unbelievably moronic
Didn't think itd be easy but thought we'd be competitive. Guess not. Oshkosh put up a better effort ffs. These guys should ashamed
Quote from: Boone on December 02, 2023, 12:32:56 PM
The hubris of those who predicted we'd have an easy time was unbelievably moronic
I had a bad feeling about this game for this very reason. When teams go into drop they don't have a counter. Oso is a total non-factor.
They'll concede threes but MU doesn't have dudes that will make them consistently enough.
Same. How anyone could be overconfident is beyond comprehension
Team played really dumb today. That's what was so frustrating. Just poor decision after poor decision.
Sean Jones continuing to take 3s is just horrific basketball
No saying "thats the offense shaka wants" if so then thats bad coaching by Shaka.
Open 3s for certain guys are the equivalent of boner pills for the defense. Just stop
12 ...
I posted earlier today that I had a bad feeling... but this was AWFUL .
Well ... they will fall to 10th (?) ... so hopefully they won't get Ct stormed again
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 01:28:53 PM
Sean Jones continuing to take 3s is just horrific basketball
No saying "thats the offense shaka wants" if so then thats bad coaching by Shaka.
Open 3s for certain guys are the equivalent of boner pills for the defense. Just stop
Sean Jones has won us more than one game this year. I can live with his missed shots, he's been a major net + and is NOT the problem
But more importantly, did it kill the game vibe for you?
Quote from: Boone on December 02, 2023, 12:32:56 PM
The hubris of those who predicted we'd have an easy time was unbelievably moronic
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 01:28:53 PM
Sean Jones continuing to take 3s is just horrific basketball
No saying "thats the offense shaka wants" if so then thats bad coaching by Shaka.
Open 3s for certain guys are the equivalent of boner pills for the defense. Just stop
It's ridiculous. Dude shoots 22% and thinks he's got the green light. Had 4 wide open looks and bricked them all. There's a reason you're open. Needs to stop
Quote from: PistolPete on December 02, 2023, 01:51:14 PM
Sean Jones has won us more than one game this year. I can live with his missed shots, he's been a major net + and is NOT the problem
No, him shooting 3s is objectively a problem.
And while he has improved forsure, most of his damage is against cupcakes. Those stats were also shown on a thread.
Lets just be objective. Sean Jones should not shoot at all, and sure as sh it should never have as many 3s in a half as Kam.
I'll set aside the snark for a moment, and sum the concerns from most on this Board: (1) consistently poor rebounding effort (and rebounding is effort), (2) inability to make coaching adjustments against teams that cut-off the lanes/angles, and (3) poor outside shooting and no consistent 3-point threat.
Items 1 and 2 are correctable, but Item 3 is not. I don't know if the lack of a consistent 3 point shooter is enough to be a legitimate threat in March?
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 02:23:53 PM
No, him shooting 3s is objectively a problem.
And while he has improved forsure, most of his damage is against cupcakes. Those stats were also shown on a thread.
Lets just be objective. Sean Jones should not shoot at all, and sure as sh it should never have as many 3s in a half as Kam.
I disagree, in philosophy. I say shoot and shoot often. Kam is getting less because teams are guarding him better and we were stagnant. The way to get him more shots is for Sean, Stevie, Chase, Ben to take and make more. They will, I feel, if they keep shooting open looks. But, that's why I stopped coaching at the 8th grade level
Quote from: warriorfred on December 02, 2023, 02:24:04 PM
I'll set aside the snark for a moment, and sum the concerns from most on this Board: (1) consistently poor rebounding effort (and rebounding is effort), (2) inability to make coaching adjustments against teams that cut-off the lanes/angles, and (3) poor outside shooting and no consistent 3-point threat.
Items 1 and 2 are correctable, but Item 3 is not. I don't know if the lack of a consistent 3 point shooter is enough to be a legitimate threat in March?
Kolek, Jones, and Jop are consistent 3-point threats (aside from Jop being awful today).
The problem is the other guys taking shots from deep have been HORRENDOUS. I think Ben and Chase will come around there but Sean needs to stop taking them completely at this point.
Game shooting is all confidence. It will come around. Kolek was terrible his first year shooting. They will be knocking them down by the end of the year.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on December 02, 2023, 02:27:28 PM
Kolek, Jones, and Jop are consistent 3-point threats (aside from Jop being awful today).
The problem is the other guys taking shots from deep have been HORRENDOUS. I think Ben and Chase will come around there but Sean needs to stop taking them completely at this point.
Jop might be the most inconsistent player I've ever seen. It's maddening. Let him go back to sixth man, come in, shake things up, make a three or two without having to expend effort on D right away, see what happens. I'm not a fan, wasn't last year either, but he was better in his role then than he is as a starter
Quote from: CountryRoads on December 02, 2023, 02:28:45 PM
Game shooting is all confidence. It will come around. Kolek was terrible his first year shooting. They will be knocking them down by the end of the year.
Absolutely agree
Quote from: 21Jumpstreet on December 02, 2023, 02:26:43 PM
I disagree, in philosophy. I say shoot and shoot often. Kam is getting less because teams are guarding him better and we were stagnant. The way to get him more shots is for Sean, Stevie, Chase, Ben to take and make more. They will, I feel, if they keep shooting open looks. But, that's why I stopped coaching at the 8th grade level
But you cant just bomb away at 15% just because and pray it gets Kam shots later. We get boat raced.
Also Chase and Ben have good form for the most part and also have games where keeping the d honest and utilizing a shot fake helps to take some 3s.
Stevie is a off ball guard and finds himself wide open in the corner. While its quite embarrassing he cant hit the broad side of the barn on those right now, you basically have to take that shot.
Sean constantly has the ball in his hands. Constantly takes early in the shot clock 3s off his own damn dribble. And he CANT SHOOT. There is a massive difference.
His shot against UCLA was objectively bad. Thank god it was 1 of the 2 he made.
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on December 02, 2023, 02:27:28 PM
Kolek, Jones, and Jop are consistent 3-point threats (aside from Jop being awful today).
The problem is the other guys taking shots from deep have been HORRENDOUS. I think Ben and Chase will come around there but Sean needs to stop taking them completely at this point.
Other posters have made the point that teams are guarding Kam close and taking away his three point shot, which means others have to step-up and hit some open looks. I'll look at the stats for Kolek, but my impression is "meh," and Jop . . . I'll say nothing further because it would be cruel. Gold makes me cringe when he squares up to shoot.
There is not a lot there at the moment, and it is a BIG concern.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 02:23:53 PM
No, him shooting 3s is objectively a problem.
And while he has improved forsure, most of his damage is against cupcakes. Those stats were also shown on a thread.
Lets just be objective. Sean Jones should not shoot at all, and sure as sh it should never have as many 3s in a half as Kam.
It's not though. It might be a problem game to game but if he's hitting in practice and they think he's a 30%+ three point shooter, the only way through the slump and to build confidence is to keep shooting.
And if he starts hitting it adds another dimension.
If we play 15 more games and he's still struggling mightily, then it's a problem.
Quote from: Johnny B on December 02, 2023, 02:21:35 PM
It's ridiculous. Dude shoots 22% and thinks he's got the green light. Had 4 wide open looks and bricked them all. There's a reason you're open. Needs to stop
Sean Jones is 2 for 19 on threes at a 10.5% rate. He could shoot 4 for 50 and posters will continue to bring up the one shot he made against UCLA, also his last made three.
At least Mitchell only took one three today, he is 3 for 20 so far at a 15% rate.
Quote from: warriorfred on December 02, 2023, 02:31:47 PM
Other posters have made the point that teams are guarding Kam close and taking away his three point shot, which means others have to step-up and hit some open looks. I'll look at the stats for Kolek, but my impression is "meh," and Jop . . . I'll say nothing further because it would be cruel. Gold makes me cringe when he squares up to shoot.
There is not a lot there at the moment, and it is a BIG concern.
"I look at the stats for Kolek but my impression is "meh"".
This is so beyond stupid it's hard to comprehend.
As for Gold, he has good form but needs more arc. He hit 2 today.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 02:30:52 PM
But you cant just bomb away at 15% just because and pray it gets Kam shots later. We get boat raced.
Also Chase and Ben have good form for the most part and also have games where keeping the d honest and utilizing a shot fake helps to take some 3s.
Stevie is a off ball guard and finds himself wide open in the corner. While its quite embarrassing he cant hit the broad side of the barn on those right now, you basically have to take that shot.
Sean constantly has the ball in his hands. Constantly takes early in the shot clock 3s off his own damn dribble. And he CANT SHOOT. There is a massive difference.
His shot against UCLA was objectively bad. Thank god it was 1 of the 2 he made.
You're absolutely not wrong. For me, everyone shoots, keep shooting. Sean should be a drive and pass first player, but he has to shoot when open. The only person that shouldn't shoot is Jop, I kid I kid, he just gets me all worked up. Even Jop, who can sort of shoot, takes ridiculous attempts, but I still say shoot the first best open shot.
Quote from: BM1090 on December 02, 2023, 02:33:08 PM
It's not though. It might be a problem game to game but if he's hitting in practice and they think he's a 30%+ three point shooter, the only way through the slump and to build confidence is to keep shooting.
And if he starts hitting it adds another dimension.
If we play 15 more games and he's still struggling mightily, then it's a problem.
Wait, so if a guy is hitting them in practice just keep shooting even if you never make them??
He has TWO in EIGHT games.
Thats not 2 for 8. Thats two in 8 whole goddamn games.
This is not an arugment. Any objective measure says the guy should never at any point take 4 3s in a game. WTF is going on here.
According to ESPN, Kolek was 20% from three against the Bad gers, but is an outstanding 52.4% on the year.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 02:36:40 PM
Wait, so if a guy is hitting them in practice just keep shooting even if you never make them??
He has TWO in EIGHT games.
Thats not 2 for 8. Thats two in 8 whole goddamn games.
This is not an arugment. Any objective measure says the guy should never at any point take 4 3s in a game. WTF is going on here.
It's friggin hilarious they ran a play for him late for the a corner 3 wtf
Quote from: Vander Blue Man Group on December 02, 2023, 02:27:28 PM
Kolek, Jones, and Jop are consistent 3-point threats (aside from Jop being awful today).
The problem is the other guys taking shots from deep have been HORRENDOUS. I think Ben and Chase will come around there but Sean needs to stop taking them completely at this point.
Ben was 2-4 from 3 and saw 6 total minutes. I'm baffled by that.
Rotations were insanely bad today.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 02:36:40 PM
Wait, so if a guy is hitting them in practice just keep shooting even if you never make them??
He has TWO in EIGHT games.
Thats not 2 for 8. Thats two in 8 whole goddamn games.
This is not an arugment. Any objective measure says the guy should never at any point take 4 3s in a game. WTF is going on here.
So you just make him a complete non factor as a shooter? We don't beat UCLA without Sean hitting a three. Maybe Illinois too but that's probably a reach.
I'm agreeing on a game to game basis Sean shooting threes is bad. But if we want to make a final four he needs to start hitting. Which means he needs to keep shooting them.
That's because Ben can't guard my shadow. And I'm slower than hell.
Quote from: BM1090 on December 02, 2023, 03:16:46 PM
So you just make him a complete non factor as a shooter? We don't beat UCLA without Sean hitting a three. Maybe Illinois too but that's probably a reach.
I'm agreeing on a game to game basis Sean shooting threes is bad. But if we want to make a final four he needs to start hitting. Which means he needs to keep shooting them.
I mean they don't have to make him one....
Quote from: JakeBarnes on December 02, 2023, 03:09:45 PM
Ben was 2-4 from 3 and saw 6 total minutes. I'm baffled by that.
Well, there is the other end of the floor to consider.
Badgers will most likely enter the top 20 now. They play zona and Michigan state this coming week. Point is if they win that they will enter the top 10. No harm in losing on the road to a top 20 team. Games are never easy but everyone is acting like we just lost to DePaul by 30 at home
Quote from: 21Jumpstreet on December 02, 2023, 02:29:35 PM
Jop might be the most inconsistent player I've ever seen. It's maddening. Let him go back to sixth man, come in, shake things up, make a three or two without having to expend effort on D right away, see what happens. I'm not a fan, wasn't last year either, but he was better in his role then than he is as a starter
I agree with this analysis. Gold (despite his 3 fouls) should have gotten more than 6 minutes today. Brutal mistake by Shaka - reminiscent of the Michigan State NCAA game. I feel Zaide would bring just as much and likely more to the game than Joplin at this point too. Shaka of course love Joplin and wants to reward his dedication and hard work, but sometimes there just isn't enough athleticism to be able to effectively consistently compete at this level.
Wisconsin just wants this game more than we do. They played like it from the opening tip today. Very maddening. I wish our guys wanted this game as much as most of us fans do.
The loss in and of itself bothers me little. Lot of season left. But the effort and focus today was abysmal.
Shot selection was poor today. Part of that was Wisconsin's defense, the other part was self-inflicted.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on December 02, 2023, 03:30:39 PM
I agree with this analysis. Gold (despite his 3 fouls) should have gotten more than 6 minutes today. Brutal mistake by Shaka - reminiscent of the Michigan State NCAA game. I feel Zaide would bring just as much and likely more to the game than Joplin at this point too. Shaka of course love Joplin and wants to reward his dedication and hard work, but sometimes there just isn't enough athleticism to be able to effectively consistently compete at this level.
Oh god. This again?
Because Zaide showed athleticism against Southern (I repeat, against SOUTHERN for God's sake) he should be eating into a starter's minutes?
Maybe, you know, these guys who are paid millions to make these decisions and see the guys hours every day have a better idea than you based off of a(n extremely) low major.
Quote from: PistolPete on December 02, 2023, 01:51:14 PM
Sean Jones has won us more than one game this year. I can live with his missed shots, he's been a major net + and is NOT the problem
I agree with this analysis. No problem with Sean taking open 3's. Did not like one he took without any passing in the possession, but others were fine.
Jop going 1-9 from 3 today killed us. Will be really hard to win against good teams if Jop continues to get max minutes, and continues to struggle offensively (95 O-Rating for the season).
Quote from: withoutbias on December 02, 2023, 03:46:22 PM
Oh god. This again?
Because Zaide showed athleticism against Southern (I repeat, against SOUTHERN for God's sake) he should be eating into a starter's minutes?
Maybe, you know, these guys who are paid millions to make these decisions and see the guys hours every day have a better idea than you based off of a(n extremely) low major.
Yes, because Zaide has the requisite athleticism to be able to compete consistently at this level, and has a very good shooting stroke too. Zaide got 7 rebounds in 14 minutes against Southern (and IDGAF if they are a low major), this team needs an injection of additional athleticism/rebounding and Zaide can provide that.
But, carry on with your mentality of thinking it's better to do nothing than to make a change. Suits you well.
Quite frankly the most pathetic effort I've seen from a Shaka Marquette team so far.
Thankful it's early in the season heading into another big week so they can use it as motivation.
Ross or Gold could easily start next game at the 4 spot.
If either of them stop fouling.
Quote from: Elonsmusk on December 02, 2023, 03:50:12 PM
Yes, because Zaide has the requisite athleticism to be able to compete consistently at this level, and has a very good shooting stroke too. Zaide got 7 rebounds in 14 minutes against Southern (and IDGAF if they are a low major), this team needs an injection of additional athleticism/rebounding and Zaide can provide that.
But, carry on with your mentality of thinking it's better to do nothing than to make a change. Suits you well.
lol. Yes. Zaide's 7 rebounds against SOUTHERN (not Southern Cal...SOUTHERN UNIVERSITY) proves he can CONSISTENTLY compete at "this level." But Jop, the Sixth Man of the BE conference last year, cannot compete at this level.
Shaka has to go. Ners for player coach. He dunks on people, so he has the requisite athleticism to compete unlike David Joplin.
Ners gonna ners.
So, as mentioned, not a Jop fan. But as I sit and rehash the game it sort of dawned on me that maybe Jop isn't the issue. He is paid big bucks to make wide open, catch and shoot threes. That's all he can do, but is sort of good at it in the perfect situation. Perhaps we need to run specific plays for him to get the corner three, or tell him to stop driving to the bucket, come to a complete stop, keep his back to the basket, pivot once or twice, lose the ball or make a poor pass out. So, either he is used for the one thing he can do, or he has to sit. Maybe it's on Shaka, and I love Shaka.
Quote from: panda on December 02, 2023, 03:51:04 PM
Quite frankly the most pathetic effort I've seen from a Shaka Marquette team so far.
Thankful it's early in the season heading into another big week so they can use it as motivation.
This year yes by far. All time? Have you forgotten the UNC calamity of the age?
Quote from: BM1090 on December 02, 2023, 03:16:46 PM
So you just make him a complete non factor as a shooter? We don't beat UCLA without Sean hitting a three. Maybe Illinois too but that's probably a reach.
I'm agreeing on a game to game basis Sean shooting threes is bad. But if we want to make a final four he needs to start hitting. Which means he needs to keep shooting them.
Im not saying he literally never shoots again. But like 3 or 4 in a game? Anything off the dribble? Mental.
Like I said even the UCLA one. Insanse shot since it wasnt even a catch and shoot. You can also argue part of the reason we found our way in a closer than desired game is because throughout we didnt make shots whether it was sean or someone else.
Its a team wide issue. I get the philosphy but we cant just keep chucking bricks. And based on shooting ability + role Sean is the one least justified in ever taking a 3.
Basically he should take a 3 only in the very rare time he as the PG on the floor gives the ball up and gets it back on a wide open catch and shoot.
Him stepping into a 3, 10 seconds into the shot clock(hes done this many times) is the same thing as a team getting the ball in football and just decided to punt on 1st down.
Jop is a streak 3 pt shooter. Everyone knows who he is and what he is. Starting is different than coming off the bench. He could have off games last year and it didn't matter because of OMax. His release isn't faster. He has more responsibilities. He is higher on the scout. He is matched up with starting stretch 4's who are not leaving him.
Shaka is going to ride with him. He is going to either make the adjustments or he isn't. I am of the opinion that he is going to hit a couple and have the light go on.
Quote from: tower912 on December 02, 2023, 04:15:12 PM
Ners gonna ners.
He's always over-emphasized athleticism. This is no different.
Jop is what he is.
Hes a very solid shooter but its not consistently solid. Really the consistency is if hes really good one game, you can almost bet the house hes irrelevent the next. Vice versa.
Good news is our next opponent is another good team in Texas where we need his shot. So they should be worried about a 4/7 Jop game.
Quote from: tower912 on December 02, 2023, 04:48:25 PM
Josh is a streak 3 pt shooter. Everyone knows who he is and what he is.
Tell me more about this "Josh" feller.
My kid. Force of habit.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on December 02, 2023, 04:57:06 PM
Jop is what he is.
Hes a very solid shooter but its not consistently solid. Really the consistency is if hes really good one game, you can almost bet the house hes irrelevent the next. Vice versa.
Good news is our next opponent is another good team in Texas where we need his shot. So they should be worried about a 4/7 Jop game.
He is not a solid shooter. He is an inconsistent shooter
He's a one trick pony, who is totally unplayable if not hitting from 3. We needed another alternative from the portal
Amadou, Hamilton, Owens, Parham.
Yeah...ummm...none of those are portal options. Big missed opportunity
Quote from: tower912 on December 02, 2023, 07:58:00 PM
Amadou, Hamilton, Owens, Parham.
are they here now? love jop but the guy has been bad. No improvement. Slow as molasses. perfect 6th man type. Shaka missed on a transfer to replace
O max. Joplins not who you want starting on a supposed final four contender. His frosh year i said he was the next lazar.
He's not but still think he can get better. Learn some post moves
Quote from: Johnny B on December 02, 2023, 08:04:54 PM
are they here now? love jop but the guy has been bad. No improvement. Slow as molasses. perfect 6th man type. Shaka missed on a transfer to replace
O max. Joplins not who you want starting on a supposed final four contender. His frosh year i said he was the next lazar.
He's not but still think he can get better. Learn some post moves
Which transfer did you want?
Quote from: Uncle Rico on December 02, 2023, 08:09:20 PM
Which transfer did you want?
idk all of them off hand. Could at least try. Shannon from Illinois is miles better. Novas burton or hart I'd rather have. You try to replace o max. Joplin ain't him oh Arthur kulmua.
Marquette preaches 'First Team Ready' all the time. That is one of Shaka's staples. UW was definitely that yesterday. Marquette made their run, but that's all it was. Play like they did to start the 2nd half from the tipoff and things probably go differently.
Rebounding was an issue yesterday. Marquette has the personnel to rebound. Ben and Oso are each 6'11" 235 pounds or so...you don't need to be bigger than that to rebound. You need effort. Oso was a no-show. Kolek was only ok. 2 years in a row where our 2 best players were fairly limited in this contest. 2 years in a row though, where Kam was awesome. I loved how Stevie played. Hated how Joplin played. Chase, Ben, and Sean were somewhat non-factors because of fouling. Stay out of foul trouble early to give yourself a chance to be on the court late.
I'd love to see more Ben minutes, but that depends on him staying out of foul trouble. I'd love to see him and Oso out there together more often. Also love how Zaide rebounds. Maybe he can become a factor if Joplin continues to struggle. We have options to go to.
The atmosphere was awesome in arena yesterday. Loud crowd. I've been saying...UW-Madison is a good basketball team that can beat anyone in the Country. As can Marquette. This can be a great learning experience for this team, but that isn't a given. This should hurt, just like any loss should. Onto the next.
Quote from: Johnny B on December 02, 2023, 02:21:35 PM
It's ridiculous. Dude shoots 22% and thinks he's got the green light. Had 4 wide open looks and bricked them all. There's a reason you're open. Needs to stop
He shoots mostly when he is left wide open. He is not forcing three's.
Quote from: tower912 on December 02, 2023, 07:05:29 PM
My kid. Force of habit.
Force of Habit is an odd nickname but I guess it works if your kid dominates at consistency.
Need to replace Jolpin in line-up. He is 6'8 and plays like 6'2. If he isn't hitting 3's, he should be on bench. Mitchell can't hit 3 pt either Need a aggressive player who can slash or hit a 2 maybe.
Quote from: Don_Kojis on December 03, 2023, 02:23:57 PM
Need to replace Jolpin in line-up. He is 6'8 and plays like 6'2. If he isn't hitting 3's, he should be on bench. Mitchell can't hit 3 pt either Need a aggressive player who can slash or hit a 2 maybe.
Lol the heights are so inflated on this team. Dude is 6"6 Tops.
And who would that be? Not Ross. Not Jones. A freshman with 15 total minutes? Neither is playing better than JOPLIN.
I'd say give Ross a shot, he is a better defender and far more athletic with a far higher motor than Jop. If only to get Jop in as the sixth man, see if that mentally works better for him. Can't be Gold as he is the only backup to Oso. If Jop has to start, get him the first shot.
I am of the opinion that 4 guards is a terrible option for a starting line up. Especially for a team that switches 1-5 and has trouble rebounding.
Quote from: Don_Kojis on December 03, 2023, 02:23:57 PM
Need to replace Jolpin in line-up. He is 6'8 and plays like 6'2. If he isn't hitting 3's, he should be on bench. Mitchell can't hit 3 pt either Need a aggressive player who can slash or hit a 2 maybe.
Thanks, Dawn.
Quote from: tower912 on December 03, 2023, 03:19:32 PM
I am of the opinion that 4 guards is a terrible option for a starting line up. Especially for a team that switches 1-5 and has trouble rebounding.
Generally agree, and would like to see a little shake up even if temporary to start the game with a little more aggressiveness. I'm fine with Jop starting, if he makes one early and shows some of the grit has has displayed at times earlier in the year. We have been good and close to winning while playing poorly even as Jop has been awful, so maybe it's all good. He can't play much worse
Quote from: 21Jumpstreet on December 03, 2023, 03:17:10 PM
I'd say give Ross a shot, he is a better defender and far more athletic with a far higher motor than Jop. If only to get Jop in as the sixth man, see if that mentally works better for him. Can't be Gold as he is the only backup to Oso. If Jop has to start, get him the first shot.
yes, but ross has shown a propensity to get into foul trouble quickly and it diminishes his usability. if he were able to stay on the floor for longer periods of time-yesyesyes
Quote from: rocket surgeon on December 03, 2023, 05:56:23 PM
yes, but ross has shown a propensity to get into foul trouble quickly and it diminishes his usability. if he were able to stay on the floor for longer periods of time-yesyesyes
No doubt
Quote from: 21Jumpstreet on December 03, 2023, 03:44:00 PM
Generally agree, and would like to see a little shake up even if temporary to start the game with a little more aggressiveness. I'm fine with Jop starting, if he makes one early and shows some of the grit has has displayed at times earlier in the year. We have been good and close to winning while playing poorly even as Jop has been awful, so maybe it's all good. He can't play much worse
Does anyone have stats on when Jop hits his first shot and how his game goes versus missing his first shot and how that goes?
Beyond Tyler, Kam, Oso this team has zero offense.
Jolp improvement not existent.
Ross improvement not existent.
Gold - maybe some 3's
Sean - too short and can't shoot.
Stevie - great D, can't shoot
Quote from: PointWarrior on December 03, 2023, 09:16:24 PM
Beyond Tyler, Kam, Oso this team has zero offense.
Jolp improvement not existent.
Ross improvement not existent.
Gold - maybe some 3's
Sean - too short and can't shoot.
Stevie - great D, can't shoot
As someone else said, then those three are hitting makes it easier for the others to hit
I think the Zaide talk is crazy as far as being ready for more minutes right now.
But I do think Gold should get some of Jop's minutes.
Quote from: PointWarrior on December 03, 2023, 09:16:24 PM
Beyond Tyler, Kam, Oso this team has zero offense.
Jolp improvement not existent.
Ross improvement not existent.
Gold - maybe some 3's
Sean - too short and can't shoot.
Stevie - great D, can't shoot
They can. They will. Perhaps some crises of confidence. Wonder if the high ranking adds some pressure, though it doesn't seem to be bothering the top guys.
Quote from: BM1090 on December 04, 2023, 07:18:12 PM
I think the Zaide talk is crazy as far as being ready for more minutes right now.
But I do think Gold should get some of Jop's minutes.
Shaka tried to give Gold some of Jop's minutes. Gold was a defensive sieve. I was surprised at how easily whoever he defended went past him on several possessions. He also had missed a couple 3s after making his first two attempts, so Shaka didn't think he could afford the defensive liability.
Can't wait for Jo(l)p to knock down 5 or 6 treys in a game this week and everyone say, "he Win us that game. y he not do that every game?"
He has done it before, he will do it again.
David Jolpin faced several of the tougher matchups for him over the past month and he has struggled. I do not like there are tough matchups for him, but it is a fact, IMO. I am very confident he has not forgotten how to shoot or score. Better days ahead for Jolp.
I've mentioned it before, but his release is different on almost every shot, especially when he has time to think about it. I think that's the culprit for the inconsistency as much as anything.
Btw, guess what nba player has 0 blocks in his career??
Quote from: Jay Bee on December 05, 2023, 09:43:33 AM
Btw, guess what nba player has 0 blocks in his career??
Sam Hauser?
Bill Russell and Wilt Chamberlain. They retired before blocked shots became an official stat.
So you see records being set now and can only chuckle because you know that Russ and Wilt had way more in a quarter or game or season or career.
Quote from: Goose on December 05, 2023, 08:01:15 AM
David Jolpin faced several of the tougher matchups for him over the past month and he has struggled. I do not like there are tough matchups for him, but it is a fact, IMO. I am very confident he has not forgotten how to shoot or score. Better days ahead for Jolp.
Goose,
We need Jop. PERIOD.
34 minutes on Saturday, 3-13, 1-9 from distance, and count them.... 3 rebounds. We have to get more production and way better efficiency. Now obviously Tyko and Oso had off games Saturday, but as the 4th option in the offense Jop can't put up those numbers nor be taking the most shots. We desperately need him to defend and rebound at the forward position and score when he has open space. It changes everything when he plays a solid game and makes wide open shots. I would make a concerted effort to get Joplin an easy bucket or two early in games. I'm always concerned when a guy who's a good shooter misses badly on wide open J's. This is the same guy who lit up Purdue last year in West Lafayette. We need the young man, badly. Hopefully he breaks out tomorrow.
Quote from: Jay Bee on December 05, 2023, 09:43:33 AM
Btw, guess what nba player has 0 blocks in his career??
He should go back to college. Shaka and the staff probably would have tailored the team around getting OMax more blocks to make him more draftable
Quote from: MuggsyB on December 05, 2023, 10:26:00 AM
Goose,
We need Jop. PERIOD.
34 minutes on Saturday, 3-13, 1-9 from distance, and count them.... 3 rebounds. We have to get more production and way better efficiency. Now obviously Tyko and Oso had off games Saturday, but as the 4th option in the offense Jop can't put up those numbers nor be taking the most shots. We desperately need him to defend and rebound at the forward position and score when he has open space. It changes everything when he plays a solid game and makes wide open shots. I would make a concerted effort to get Joplin an easy bucket or two early in games. I'm always concerned when a guy who's a good shooter misses badly on wide open J's. This is the same guy who lit up Purdue last year in West Lafayette. We need the young man, badly. Hopefully he breaks out tomorrow.
I think Jop was shooting 40% from three prior to Saturday, so I'm chalking this up to a bad game for him and expect a bounce back. He does need to scale back on trying to drive to the rim.
Muggsy
I said it last year, if Jop is our biggest concern we are in very good shape as a program.
Quote from: Goose on December 05, 2023, 10:56:59 AM
Muggsy
I said it last year, if Jop is our biggest concern we are in very good shape as a program.
Perhaps. I think tomorrow is vital Goose. We must defend our home floor and drop the hammer. I'm still extremely upset about Saturday.
Quote from: Goose on December 05, 2023, 10:56:59 AM
Muggsy
I said it last year, if Jop is our biggest concern we are in very good shape as a program.
This is correct.