MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MU82 on June 26, 2023, 08:30:31 AM
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There's a great piece in The Athletic (written by C.J. Moore) about Shaka's philosophy re the transfer portal, about the improvement of several players, and other relevant stuff about our heroes as they look to excel again (and advance in the NCAAT) next season.
https://theathletic.com/4635858/2023/06/26/shaka-smart-marquette-basketball-culture/?campaign=5888993&source=dailyemail
It's behind a paywall, and I'm gonna respect that paywall because The Athletic "deserves" to have people subscribe. But here are a few things that stood out to me ...
++ Only 2 high-major coaches -- Shaka and Izzo -- did not use the transfer portal this offseason. Shaka repeated his mantra of investing in players already committed to the culture.
++ Interesting paragraph: Preseason rankings don’t matter, of course, but the way Smart is operating offers a case study in whether the old-school way of roster building is still a viable path to a championship. For those worried about what the transfer portal is doing to the sport, you should root for Marquette.
++ On how that philosophy helped Kam blossom into a standout last season:
Young guys like Jones were allowed an opportunity to make the leap because Smart didn’t recruit over them. Of course, it’s just not about the minutes available; it’s the message it sends.
“If your coach is fishing or looking for somebody to come to your school, that’s obviously saying to the guys that are here, ‘We don’t think we have enough to win at the level we want to win at,’ and I feel like that can mess with guys,” Jones said. “I feel like that is a mental challenge that I’m grateful I really don’t have to go through.”
++ Improvement already being seen in several players: Stevie's playmaking; Oso's shooting; Gold's confidence. And a lot on Joplin stepping in for Prosper.
The Marquette offense was already seventh-best in college basketball. It’ll look different without Prosper, whose speed generated some easy buckets in transition and who was also an excellent cutter. If sixth man David Joplin is the replacement, those are not areas he excels in. But he has been the team’s best pick-and-pop option. Marquette scored 1.361 points per possession with him as the roll man, per Synergy. He could look like a different player, too.
“He’s worked his butt off on conditioning,” Smart said. “We’d like for him to come into this next season in better shape than he was to start last season. Not that he was in bad shape, but we feel like the more he can move, and breathe, and cut and sprint, the more he’ll be able to be a really effective player because he’s a gifted scorer.”
Joplin is Jones’ answer when he’s asked who is the player outsiders will be shocked by this season. “He’s a load to deal with,” Jones said. “Can’t really force him to do anything because he can do what you’re trying to force him to do.”
++ Areas of team improvement Shaka expects to see: defense, rebounding, taking fewer "purposeless dribbles."
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I have only one concern about the 23-24 season. Frontcourt depth.
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Good article, thanks for posting.
This passage caught my interest.
Preseason rankings don’t matter, of course, but the way Smart is operating offers a case study in whether the old-school way of roster building is still a viable path to a championship. For those worried about what the transfer portal is doing to the sport, you should root for Marquette.
Should MU do something special this coming year (FF or better), this could be a transformational season not only for MU but all of college basketball ... especially if they meet Michigan State in the finals (the only other team not to use the portal).
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Don't like der odds wen goin' 'gainst MSU, aina?
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Good article, thanks for posting.
This passage caught my interest.
Preseason rankings don’t matter, of course, but the way Smart is operating offers a case study in whether the old-school way of roster building is still a viable path to a championship. For those worried about what the transfer portal is doing to the sport, you should root for Marquette.
Should MU do something special this coming year (FF or better), this could be a transformational season not only for MU but all of college basketball ... especially if they meet Michigan State in the finals (the only other team not to use the portal).
Agree. The whole article was great, but that was the one paragraph that really jumped out at me.
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Don't like der odds wen goin' 'gainst MSU, aina?
Why? A play or two last March and they win. Tournament is a crapshoot
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Good article, thanks for posting.
This passage caught my interest.
Preseason rankings don’t matter, of course, but the way Smart is operating offers a case study in whether the old-school way of roster building is still a viable path to a championship. For those worried about what the transfer portal is doing to the sport, you should root for Marquette.
Should MU do something special this coming year (FF or better), this could be a transformational season not only for MU but all of college basketball ... especially if they meet Michigan State in the finals (the only other team not to use the portal).
Meh. I love Shaka and I trust him to do what is best for Marquette. I am all in on him and his approach.
But even if Marquette wins a National Championship next year, I highly doubt it will impact the way other coaches are using the portal. College basketball has already changed and the toothpaste is out of the tube.
Is it still possible to win the old way? Sure. But coaches aren't going to completely change their approach just because 1 or 2 schools found a way to make it work without the portal.
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Meh. I love Shaka and I trust him to do what is best for Marquette. I am all in on him and his approach.
But even if Marquette wins a National Championship next year, I highly doubt it will impact the way other coaches are using the portal. College basketball has already changed and the toothpaste is out of the tube.
Is it still possible to win the old way? Sure. But coaches aren't going to completely change their approach just because 1 or 2 schools found a way to make it work without the portal.
True. “Oh Shaka won and added zero transfers before the season. Therefore, I am not adding transfers!” ain’t happening.
And, I’m not sure Shaka ignored the portal. Just nothing has made sense and/or worked out. Our roster is filled with talent, all of whom have at least 2 years of eligibility.
I think Shaka prefers keeping guys vs bringing in transfers… which makes sense for anyone. But depending on what happens in the future, hm bringing in transfers wouldn’t signal some crazy flip flop by him to me
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where it made no sense to be desperate.
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where i made no sense to be desperate.
Agreed.
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Did the article mention Oso's height?
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where i made no sense to be desperate.
So, MU violated NCAA rules is your claim?
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So, MU violated NCAA rules is your claim?
Picks up a phone. Dials the NCAA number.
"I would like to report a rules violation on 360 of your division 1 programs, yes ill hold."
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Picks up a phone. Dials the NCAA number.
"I would like to report a rules violation on 360 of your division 1 programs, yes ill hold."
I dunno, 3 clean programs seems high to me...
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where it made no sense to be desperate.
Shaka saw that none of them had good Blk% and wisely passed. If he had known OMax would have such a lousy Blk% he would never have recruited him from Syracuse. Lessons learned.
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Shaka saw that none of them had good Blk% and wisely passed. If he had known OMax would have such a lousy Blk% he would never have recruited him from Syracuse. Lessons learned.
Yes. Bet Boeheim was upset. U still hang w Bernie Fine, bruh?
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Just read the article - great stuff. Really looking forward to the development we're going to see from the guys.
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where it made no sense to be desperate.
Domination Squandered
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Domination Squandered
We could have paid for a horrible player like UConn did with Cam Spencer like Arkansas with El Elis.
We could have signed Elijah Hutchins-Everett like Seton Hall did.
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Yes. Bet Boeheim was upset. U still hang w Bernie Fine, bruh?
"This is addition by subtraction. Have you seen OMax's Blk%? We are better off without him. I pity Marquette." -- J Boeheim
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We low balled the 4ish transfers we wanted. They all went to different schools for more NIL and (more importantly) more playing time. If we ever got desperate we would pay the six figure deals some of these other schools were desperate to make and offer a larger chance of playing time. But we arn't desperate, so why would we do that, unless we have to. We have a team of 4 returning starters.
You need the right fit of person, player, and you also need to need them to be willing to open up the NIL coffer more. Marquette is in a spot where it made no sense to be desperate.
So while other NIL funds that benefit our competitors were being depleted ours was growing in interest bearing accounts. Sounds like we’ll be well “under the cap” when the next superstar we covet comes available.
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"This is addition by subtraction. Have you seen OMax's Blk%? We are better off without him. I pity Marquette." -- J Boeheim
You know Omax was at Clemson before Marquette, right?
Or are you saying once he transferred from Clemson he was down to MU and Cuse?
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You know Omax was at Clemson before Marquette, right?
Or are you saying once he transferred from Clemson he was down to MU and Cuse?
That doesn't fit the narrative. Clemson hates low Blk% too.
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I read the article (through the $1 month subscription). MU basketball is like a lot of successful organizations and businesses. Bringing in an external candidate, who makes more money than the existing employees, is promoted above existing employees, and may have a different attitude about team play, can have disastrous results. The value of earning playing time, buying in to the team success model, and trusting your teammates is how Shaka believes they will be successful. To the extent you can get the freshman coming in, this is the preferred path to long term success. The sum is greater than the parts.
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True. “Oh Shaka won and added zero transfers before the season. Therefore, I am not adding transfers!” ain’t happening.
And, I’m not sure Shaka ignored the portal. Just nothing has made sense and/or worked out. Our roster is filled with talent, all of whom have at least 2 years of eligibility.
I think Shaka prefers keeping guys vs bringing in transfers… which makes sense for anyone. But depending on what happens in the future, hm bringing in transfers wouldn’t signal some crazy flip flop by him to me
It is not "I'm not using the portal anymore." Rather it is "I'm going to look to have a system of developing guys and trust the process versus recruiting over them with the portal at the first available opportunity."
I read the article (through the $1 month subscription). MU basketball is like a lot of successful organizations and businesses. Bringing in an external candidate, who makes more money than the existing employees, is promoted above existing employees, and may have a different attitude about team play, can have disastrous results. The value of earning playing time, buying in to the team success model, and trusting your teammates is how Shaka believes they will be successful. To the extent you can get the freshman coming in, this is the preferred path to long term success. The sum is greater than the parts.
You also see this in professional sports all the time, especially baseball.
Every team talks about culture and development, but at the first instance available, they "recruit over" this process by signing a high-priced free agent. And way more often than not, it does not make things better and often makes it worse.
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It is not "I'm not using the portal anymore." Rather it is "I'm going to look to have a system of developing guys and trust the process versus recruiting over them with the portal at the first available opportunity."
Most coaches in their 3rd year aren’t gifted w the majority of their starting lineup being comprised of holdovers from Wojo
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It’s as sound of a strategy as you can have these days. Recruit well and pay to retain. Use the portal when you need it (ie reload a couple years ago).
We’re not going to win the chaos/mercenary approach that Ala, K-State, and others are pursuing. Nor would the high horse segment of the alumni base support it….
I’m just glad we have a strategy. Refreshing after the prior regime.
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I read the article (through the $1 month subscription). MU basketball is like a lot of successful organizations and businesses. Bringing in an external candidate, who makes more money than the existing employees, is promoted above existing employees, and may have a different attitude about team play, can have disastrous results. The value of earning playing time, buying in to the team success model, and trusting your teammates is how Shaka believes they will be successful. To the extent you can get the freshman coming in, this is the preferred path to long term success. The sum is greater than the parts.
As the article said, it will be an interesting experiment to see if Shaka can recruit, develop and retain enough top-level players to make it work the way he (and most coaches) want it to work.
These last two offseasons, the only rotation player Shaka lost to the transfer portal was Greg Elliott. This offseason, while hundreds of players were transferring willy-nilly from one end of the country to the other, Shaka didn't lose any.
That's pretty much the key to all of this -- if nobody transfers out, and you recruit well, you don't need transfers in. Can that outstanding record realistically continue? We'll see!
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As the article said, it will be an interesting experiment to see if Shaka can recruit, develop and retain enough top-level players to make it work the way he (and most coaches) want it to work.
These last two offseasons, the only rotation player Shaka lost to the transfer portal was Greg Elliott. This offseason, while hundreds of players were transferring willy-nilly from one end of the country to the other, Shaka didn't lose any.
That's pretty much the key to all of this -- if nobody transfers out, and you recruit well, you don't need transfers in. Can that outstanding record realistically continue? We'll see!
I agree with this. It all starts with holding on to your guys. If a bunch leave via the portal, then you might have no choice but to get others in.
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If three is the new zero, then yes
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If three is the new zero, then yes
Which three rotation players did Shaka lose to the transfer portal since the end of this past season?
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Which three rotation players did Shaka lose to the transfer portal since the end of this past season?
I may hold a non-traditional view here, but if feel more comfortable today with a vet like Keeyan on this roster. If he would have been ok with the possibility of the same or similar role this year, knowing he wouldn’t see any minutes without injuries to others, but just loved the team and program so much, I’d be happy with that.
Absolutely the right thing for him to explore other opportunities, but I damn sure would prefer he be on this roster today than not
Ps- yes, your point is correct
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I may hold a non-traditional view here, but if feel more comfortable today with a vet like Keeyan on this roster. If he would have been ok with the possibility of the same or similar role this year, knowing he wouldn’t see any minutes without injuries to others, but just loved the team and program so much, I’d be happy with that.
Absolutely the right thing for him to explore other opportunities, but I damn sure would prefer he be on this roster today than not
Ps- yes, your point is correct
But he had no role last year……..other then practicing and cheerleading.
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But he had no role last year……..other then practicing and cheerleading.
Yes. I’m fine with that. Emergency goalie. Hope we don’t need one this season.
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I may hold a non-traditional view here, but if feel more comfortable today with a vet like Keeyan on this roster. If he would have been ok with the possibility of the same or similar role this year, knowing he wouldn’t see any minutes without injuries to others, but just loved the team and program so much, I’d be happy with that.
Absolutely the right thing for him to explore other opportunities, but I damn sure would prefer he be on this roster today than not
Ps- yes, your point is correct
Agree about Keeyan. And you are otherwise forgiven.