First, the Big East.
Shaka Smart, Ed Cooley, Sean Miller.
End of list.
I can't really see anyone else making a play.
Obviously what happens at the end of the season will play a massive roll, but imo at this moment in time Shaka should be the runaway favorite.
Even if Marquette was to not win the BE, I think our new head coach, Shaka Smart, should be a lock for BE CoY in year #2 at Marquette barring something extremely unexpected.
FU*K EM.
National Stage-
Painter, Lloyd, Oats, Tang, Shaka.
I saw some stuff about National CoY recently that didn't include Shaka but that's insane.
Painter is the pick at this point, and likely will win the award.
However, I think Lloyd gets often underrated and I think that Tang and Otselberger (first off list) will fall off.
I think by seasons end this becomes a 3 horse race- Matt Painter, Nate Oats, Shaka Smart.
Coach Painter runs away with it unless Purdue falters, but still a great feat for Shaka if this ends up true.
Sean Miller should not be on the list.
Shaka's not our "new" head coach.
Don't agree with either of the above 2 comments, by two good posters
Quote from: DoctorV on February 01, 2023, 11:40:53 PM
Don't agree with either of the above 2 comments, by two good posters
You think Sean Miller should be on the list?
Did anyone else see the offensive set we ran in the 2nd half? We stacked 3 guys at the free throw line, OSO looped around the back side for a lob dunk. It looked like an 8th grade inbounds play, except we ran it from the top of the key in the half court, and it worked to perfection.
Now that's some creative stuff. For that reason alone, Shaka should win COY.
Tang is my leader for NCOY but lots of games left.
Shaka should be in the convo though
Quote from: 94Warrior on February 01, 2023, 11:46:35 PM
Did anyone else see the half court offensive set we ran in the 2nd half? We stacked 3 guys at the free throw line, OSO looped around the back side for a lob dunk. It looked like an 8th grade inbounds play, and it worked to perfection.
Now that's some creative stuff. For that reason alone, Shaka should win COY.
That was an outstanding play. Shaka had a very strong game tonight.
Quote from: JakeBarnes on February 01, 2023, 11:47:09 PM
Tang is my leader for NCOY but lots of games left.
Shaka should be in the convo though
Tang has been great. But theres no argument for him over Painter.
Purude started unranked and they are the undisputed #1 right now. Even if I personally believe they may get upset relatively early in the big dance. Cant argue what they have done so far.
Quote from: 🏀 on February 01, 2023, 11:45:48 PM
You think Sean Miller should be on the list?
I mean it's my list, so yes I do.
He's having an amazing season in just his first year at Xavier, and they are atop the conference with Marquette.
On the National stage I don't think he belongs, because I think Shaka usurps him and there's only room for 1 BE guy imo.
As for the not our "new"coach, if Shaka wins BECoY in his second season at Marquette I wouldn't bat an eye at someone saying the turnaround at Marquette is remarkable under their "new" second year coach
Quote from: DoctorV on February 01, 2023, 11:51:12 PM
I mean it's my list, so yes I do.
He's having an amazing season in just his first year at Xavier, and they are atop the conference with Marquette.
On the National stage I don't think he belongs, because I think Shaka usurps him and there's only room for 1 BE guy imo.
As for the not our "new"coach, if Shaka wins BECoY in his second season at Marquette I wouldn't bat an eye at someone saying the turnaround at Marquette is remarkable under their "new" second year coach
Ball asks what amazing coaching is Sean Miller doing?
Ball respects your answer though.
Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on February 01, 2023, 11:49:01 PM
Tang has been great. But theres no argument for him over Painter.
Purude started unranked and they are the undisputed #1 right now. Even if I personally believe they may get upset relatively early in the big dance. Cant argue what they have done so far.
Purdue started unranked? Kansas Started picked dead least in the Big 12!
If the season ended today, it would be Tang's IMHO. However, I think there is a bit of smoke and mirrors with K-State and I think their final record will bring them back down to Earth. If they win the Big 12 regular season, it should be Tang's.
Quote from: DoctorV on February 01, 2023, 11:51:12 PM
As for the not our "new"coach, if Shaka wins BECoY in his second season at Marquette I wouldn't bat an eye at someone saying the turnaround at Marquette is remarkable under their "new" second year coach
I was just having some nitpicking fun ... but when will he stop being "new"? In Year 4 maybe?
Quote from: MU82 on February 01, 2023, 11:59:20 PM
I was just having some nitpicking fun ... but when will he stop being "new"? In Year 4 maybe?
After he passes his first test ;D
Quote from: 🏀 on February 01, 2023, 11:53:13 PM
Ball asks what amazing coaching is Sean Miller doing?
Ball respects your answer though.
Ball don't lie.
Ball suggests it's not Miller time, and I like that
Quote from: DoctorV on February 02, 2023, 12:19:23 AM
Ball don't lie.
Ball suggests it's not Miller time, and I like that
For those who think Sean Miller is a cheat - he was just ahead of the curve. Everything he did is now legal.
Quote from: DoctorV on February 01, 2023, 11:51:12 PM
I mean it's my list, so yes I do.
He's having an amazing season in just his first year at Xavier, and they are atop the conference with Marquette.
On the National stage I don't think he belongs, because I think Shaka usurps him and there's only room for 1 BE guy imo.
As for the not our "new"coach, if Shaka wins BECoY in his second season at Marquette I wouldn't bat an eye at someone saying the turnaround at Marquette is remarkable under their "new" second year coach
Sean Miller inherited a veteran team that won the NIT last year and was picked to finish second in the Big East. He even got two first place votes.
What Shaka and Cooley have done is much more impressive.
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on February 02, 2023, 12:09:07 AM
After he passes his first test ;D
The eye test? Five years to judge?
Quote from: TAMU, Knower of Ball on February 01, 2023, 11:58:28 PM
Purdue started unranked? Kansas Started picked dead least in the Big 12!
If the season ended today, it would be Tang's IMHO. However, I think there is a bit of smoke and mirrors with K-State and I think their final record will bring them back down to Earth. If they win the Big 12 regular season, it should be Tang's.
Correct.
They started unranked and are now #1. Have 1 loss. Have been the most impressive team all year long.
Kstate has been great and very surprising but they are like a top 25 kenpom team. What Purdue is doing is incredible and I dont think the vote would even be close. Heck, right now theres a much better chance that Tang doesnt even get second.
Quote from: Hards Alumni on February 02, 2023, 06:26:02 AM
The eye test? Five years to judge?
Well into last season, a Scooper said something about Shaka passing (or failing; I can't even remember) his first test. He had already passed numerous tests (and maybe failed a couple, too, as he learned his team), so some form of "Shaka finally passed his first test" or "when will Shaka finally pass his first test?" has become one of those Scoopisms we love.
Yes, kinda like "5 years to judge."
Quote from: MU82 on February 02, 2023, 07:20:59 AM
Well into last season, a Scooper said something about Shaka passing (or failing; I can't even remember) his first test. He had already passed numerous tests (and maybe failed a couple, too, as he learned his team), so some form of "Shaka finally passed his first test" or "when will Shaka finally pass his first test?" has become one of those Scoopisms we love.
Yes, kinda like "5 years to judge."
Marquette needs to win more close games to truly know if Shaka can pass a test
Quote from: Uncle Rico on February 02, 2023, 07:31:48 AM
Marquette needs to win more close games to truly know if Shaka can pass a test
Lacks the close game winning skill
As far as BECOY, I think it goes to the outright winner if there is one. If it's a shared title, I think Shaka gets it. Here's the case for each as an outright winner:
- Shaka Smart: Picked 9th, if they win or share the title he should be the pick.
- Sean Miller: I know he was picked higher, but a new coach winning the league in his first year is always going to be a hard narrative to avoid. If they are 16-4 and Marquette is 15-5, I think Miller gets the edge.
- Ed Cooley: Almost completely new roster and winning a second straight title without an asterisk on it? He's also an East Coast darling, so he has a built in advantage.
- Greg McDermott: Written off in December, if they could take the title for themselves it would be a fitting comeback story.
Nationally, I think there are a few viable candidates. Smart is one, but I would say he's second or third in the pecking order.
- Jerome Tang: Picked last in his league and some have him fighting for a 1-seed. If he wins the Big 12 and gets a 1-seed, it's hard to see how he doesn't get it.
- Matt Painter: Unranked to start the season but with the best resume in the country to date and a clear path to the #1 overall seed.
- Shaka Smart: Some similarities to Painter and Tang, but didn't start as low as Tang nor bring his team to the heights (so far) Painter has.
- Close but not quite: TJ Otzelberger, Randy Bennett, Dusty May
Quote from: brewcity77 on February 02, 2023, 09:09:53 AM
As far as BECOY, I think it goes to the outright winner if there is one. If it's a shared title, I think Shaka gets it. Here's the case for each as an outright winner:
- Shaka Smart: Picked 9th, if they win or share the title he should be the pick.
- Sean Miller: I know he was picked higher, but a new coach winning the league in his first year is always going to be a hard narrative to avoid. If they are 16-4 and Marquette is 15-5, I think Miller gets the edge.
- Ed Cooley: Almost completely new roster and winning a second straight title without an asterisk on it? He's also an East Coast darling, so he has a built in advantage.
- Greg McDermott: Written off in December, if they could take the title for themselves it would be a fitting comeback story.
Nationally, I think there are a few viable candidates. Smart is one, but I would say he's second or third in the pecking order.
- Jerome Tang: Picked last in his league and some have him fighting for a 1-seed. If he wins the Big 12 and gets a 1-seed, it's hard to see how he doesn't get it.
- Matt Painter: Unranked to start the season but with the best resume in the country to date and a clear path to the #1 overall seed.
- Shaka Smart: Some similarities to Painter and Tang, but didn't start as low as Tang nor bring his team to the heights (so far) Painter has.
- Close but not quite: TJ Otzelberger, Randy Bennett, Dusty May
Idiotic take. Shaka for national coach of the 2020s is already locked.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 02, 2023, 09:34:52 AM
Idiotic take. Shaka for national coach of the 2020s is already locked.
Neither said nor implied by anyone, even in teal.
brew's take is reasonable, and objective. And you know it too, wades.
Quote from: 94Warrior on February 02, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
For those who think Sean Miller is a cheat - he was just ahead of the curve. Everything he did is now legal.
Just like Al Capone. He was just selling some booze.
Quote from: MU82 on February 02, 2023, 09:37:17 AM
Neither said nor implied by anyone, even in teal.
brew's take is reasonable, and objective. And you know it too, wades.
I mean, I'm pretty sure that's the take Seth Davis had. At the time he wrote it, Xavier had a 1 game lead on anyone else in the Big East and had a head to head win over Marquette. So why was that idiotic but brew's take is reasonable, and objective?
Quote from: 94Warrior on February 02, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
For those who think Sean Miller is a cheat - he was just ahead of the curve. Everything he did is now legal.
That is...not right. I'm pretty sure Sean Miller was allegedly paying Deandre Ayton $10K/month of his own money. Very much not allowed right now.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 02, 2023, 09:47:33 AM
I mean, I'm pretty sure that's the take Seth Davis had. At the time he wrote it, Xavier had a 1 game lead on anyone else in the Big East and had a head to head win over Marquette. So why was that idiotic but brew's take is reasonable, and objective?
Factually incorrect. Xavier was tied with Marquette and Providence when the article posted on January 30th but held the tiebreaker. However if the Big East season ended that date, Xavier, Marquette, and Providence all would've claimed a share of the title with Xavier the 1-seed, Providence the 2, and Marquette the 3.
Whether it goes from:
1. Booster to Assistant Coach to Player, or
2. Booster to Head Coach to Player, or
3. Booster to Player.
Does the route the money takes really matter in the end? The player gets the money which was originally offered up by the Booster. NIL has few if any parameters to it. Like I said, NIL allows for it above board now.
Quote from: MU82 on February 02, 2023, 07:20:59 AM
Well into last season, a Scooper said something about Shaka passing (or failing; I can't even remember) his first test. He had already passed numerous tests (and maybe failed a couple, too, as he learned his team), so some form of "Shaka finally passed his first test" or "when will Shaka finally pass his first test?" has become one of those Scoopisms we love.
Yes, kinda like "5 years to judge."
Ah yeah, we need that 'season checklist' thread back for this year. Shaka ticked off a lot of those boxes.
Quote from: brewcity77 on February 02, 2023, 09:54:45 AM
Factually incorrect. Xavier was tied with Marquette and Providence when the article posted on January 30th but held the tiebreaker. However if the Big East season ended that date, Xavier, Marquette, and Providence all would've claimed a share of the title with Xavier the 1-seed, Providence the 2, and Marquette the 3.
Got it. I was guessing the article wasn't entirely written minutes before it got posted.
I stand corrected.
Idiotic Seth take.
But in reality, I don't think a one game difference moves thing from an idiotic take to a reasonable, objective take.
STRONG words from the former Nova star on Shaka.
Brew-
Great summary, pretty much agree on all points.
The bias in me thinks that Shaka should win even if MU is one game back because of greatly overshooting the expectations that the coaches themselves, or their assistants, set in the preseason.
I think you're right though, Miller in his first season or Ed would probably win with Shaka as a close second.
I wouldn't be shocked to see Shaka win the award in that scenario though.
Who votes? The coaches?
GoldenEagles-
Who's tweet was that?
The tweet is former Villanova great Allan Ray.
Quote from: DoctorV on February 02, 2023, 12:58:39 PM
Brew-
Great summary, pretty much agree on all points.
The bias in me thinks that Shaka should win even if MU is one game back because of greatly overshooting the expectations that the coaches themselves, or their assistants, set in the preseason.
I think you're right though, Miller in his first season or Ed would probably win with Shaka as a close second.
I wouldn't be shocked to see Shaka win the award in that scenario though.
Who votes? The coaches?
GoldenEagles-
Who's tweet was that?
As Brew already pointed out it is Allan Ray who tweeted that about Shaka.
Pretty cool seeing former stars from the competition raving about Shaka and what he is rapidly building.
How can that guy see?
Good press here:
https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-power-rankings-virginia-moves-up-to-no-2-saint-marys-at-no-7-ahead-of-gonzaga-showdown/ (https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-power-rankings-virginia-moves-up-to-no-2-saint-marys-at-no-7-ahead-of-gonzaga-showdown/)
I think Creighton will win the Big East and therefore McDermott will be coach of year.
Quote from: bilsu on February 02, 2023, 04:49:10 PM
I think Creighton will win the Big East and therefore McDermott will be coach of year.
Doubt that Creighton will win the BE, but yeah, it's possible. I disagree with your "therefore". They were expected to do well while the BE coaches relegated MU to 9th and nat'l sportswriters did pretty much the same. Please explain why you chose to use the word therefore.