ESPN created a list of their Top 20 All Time transfers https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32851736/best-men-college-basketball-transfers-all (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/32851736/best-men-college-basketball-transfers-all).
Except for a few, this list seems rather unimpressive. Are they missing obvious ones? Who would make a list of Marquette's all time transfers?
In my fandom, 1) Robert Jackson 2) Andrew Rowsey
Quote from: BLM on December 15, 2021, 08:36:35 AM
In my fandom, 1) Robert Jackson 2) Andrew Rowsey
Jackson was so much fun to watch. I'd add Trent Lockett, too
David Boone 8-)
David Boone is VERY high on my list of MU transfers.
Bottom of the list: Harry Froling.
That list is unimpressive because transfers weren't much of a thing before now, or even a few years ago. The penalty on transferring served as the exact deterrent the NCAA lords and masters intended it to be.
If I were to rate the transfers I can remember ...
1. Robert Jackson. Fine starting center on one of the only 3 Final Four teams in Marquette history, and we don't get there without him. Big gap between him and everybody else IMHO.
2. Andrew Rowsey. 20-point, 5-assist, cold-blooded mad bomber who invented The Thing and was a blast to watch. Played D slightly worse than me, though.
3. David Boone. Averaged 15.6 pts, 9.7 reb in bridging the Majerus-Dukiet eras. Super-solid player deserved better support.
4. Katin Reinhardt. Double-digit scorer for an NCAAT-bound team, and made the winning play in our first victory over a No. 1-ranked team in 14 years.
5. Trent Lockett. Classic "glue guy" for Buzz's Elite Eight team.
Honorable Mention ...
++ Luke Fischer. Averaged 11.4 pts, 5.7 rebs, 1.7 blks over 2.5 seasons and contributed to the 2017 NCAAT team (though replaced in starting lineup by Heldt late that season).
++ D.J. Carton. Accomplished too little given his talent, but a lot of fun to watch (when he wasn't turning it over).
++ Matt Carlino. Wojo's first hired gun, made a bad team slightly more palatable.
++ Walter Downing. Decent contributor for 2 years but ultimately a disappointment for non-NCAAT Majerus teams.
++ Koby McEwen. Lots of passion, a few big plays but not nearly enough of them. Musta set NCAA record for most travels in the middle of the key.
++ Jake Thomas. Will always be remembered for a 4-point play vs Cuse even though it really didn't change momentum (we ended up falling behind by more points later). Part of the worst starting backcourt in recent Marquette history, but it wasn't his fault he played 30 mpg.
Also ...
Darryl Morsell was looking like a shoo-in to be one of our great transfers after 4 games; we'll see what the rest of the season brings.
Tyler Kolek could make that list before his MU career is done; it would be great if he's good enough the rest of this season to make it.
Kur Kuath and/or OMP? We'll see!
Ed Morrow - pretty much a dud, but we'll always be grateful for that one blocked shot against Madison.
Brian Nyenhuis. Big center from my time at MU. Not very good but he kinda looked like Lurch, so I'll give him props for that.
Wally, cuz we probably don't get Henry without him.
Joe Chartouny - his inept missed layup, followed by his make on the rebound, left so little time at Creighton that it kinda-sorta set up one of the great buzzer-beaters in Marquette history.
Harry Froling, because Jay Bilas said so.
I'd put Ron Curry on the list.
Ron Curry was extremely big because it gave credibility to the program. He is high on my list.
Sam Worthen
AA PG
Does Jim Boylan count as a transfer?
Jamil Wilson wasn't too shabby.
We won 20 games in 98 with a guard who started 18 games and who shot 17 percent from 3 point land, - Marcus West
I'm embarrassed I missed some. That's why I usually leave this kind of stuff to brew, TAMU and others. D'oh!
But while I loved Sam Worthen, a guy from my era, he was a JUCO transfer. If we're gonna start including those ... Jimmy, DJO, etc. Not really what's been talked about.
I was gonna correct/add to my list but I'll just let it sit there for awhile and let others bring up ones I missed. Eventually we can do a more complete list.
My favorite transfer was Joey Hauser.
miles
That is a great line.
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on December 15, 2021, 09:48:09 AM
My favorite transfer was Joey Hauser.
Now THAT'S funny!
Vanilla Soft Serve might eventually be mocked on similar lists on MSUScoop.
Quote from: MUfan12 on December 15, 2021, 09:34:18 AM
I'd put Ron Curry on the list.
I was surprised that we got more than 5 posts in without a Curry mention. Him Jackson, and Rowdy were the first three I thought of.
An incomplete list but many Marquette transfers in and out can be found at www.muoverload.com > Players/Coaches > Roster (All-Time). Sort by the Transferred From column to see players who transferred to Marquette.
Quote from: Marquette Overload on December 15, 2021, 10:11:25 AM
An incomplete list but many Marquette transfers in and out can be found at muoverload.com > Players/Coaches > Roster (All-Time). Sort by the Transferred From column to see players who transferred to Marquette.
You're fooking killing it with that site.
JB...and its knot evan klose wit #2 RJax, hey?
4ever
JB is definitely #1 and Jackson is high on my list.
Quote from: Marquette Overload on December 15, 2021, 10:11:25 AM
An incomplete list but many Marquette transfers in and out can be found at muoverload.com > Players/Coaches > Roster (All-Time). Sort by the Transferred From column to see players who transferred to Marquette.
This is excellent stuff.
I know your list is incomplete but based on what you have, there is only one non-JUCO school that MU has ever got two transfers from. Mississippi State with Robert Jackson and Bob Black. We love our Bobs from Mississippi apparently.
Robert Jackson was so good.
That 24-15 performance he put on against Kentucky in the 2003 regional final is an all-timer, it just got overshadowed by Wade's triple-double.
Quote from: MU82 on December 15, 2021, 09:50:46 AM
Now THAT'S funny!
Vanilla Soft Serve might eventually be mocked on similar lists on MSUScoop.
Back atcha, 82, I hadn't heard the VSS moniker.
Bob Lackey
Lloyd Walton
Ulice Payne
Odell Ball
Artie Green
Quote from: MDMU04 on December 15, 2021, 10:26:03 AM
Robert Jackson was so good.
That 24-15 performance he put on against Kentucky in the 2003 regional final is an all-timer, it just got overshadowed by Wade's triple-double.
After Estill said he didn't remember Jackson from his time at Mississippi State. Oops.
Mo Acker is Top 5
Speaking of Odell Ball....he transferred into MU for the 1976-77 season. While he had to sit out that year, he was technically still a member of the championship team, yet is never acknowledged as such in reunions, etc. Why is that?
I believe we had this discussion at least once.
Here: https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=53873.msg911508#msg911508
Surprisingly, the discussion got off topic.
I thought Jim Dudley was a fun player to watch.
I am younger than alot of you, but Jimmy should be easy #1. Jae easy #2.
Quote from: Herman Cain on December 15, 2021, 11:10:24 AM
I thought Jim Dudley was a fun player to watch.
Although remembered as a BB player, I believe he was one of the best HS tennis players in the state.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on December 15, 2021, 11:36:29 AM
I am younger than alot of you, but Jimmy should be easy #1. Jae easy #2.
I think people are talking about NCAA transfers, not NJCAA transfers. If you include NJCAA, we are having a very different conversation.
Though if we are talking about just their time at MU, Jae is way above JFB and I would put DJO above JFB as well. Overall career then I agree that JFB is on top.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on December 15, 2021, 11:36:29 AM
I am younger than alot of you, but Jimmy should be easy #1. Jae easy #2.
If we're including jucos, then it's a whole nother discussion.
I love the names folks are throwing out there that I missed.
Quote from: NCMUFan on December 15, 2021, 11:47:13 AM
Although remembered as a BB player, I believe he was one of the best HS tennis players in the state.
I think he played Tennis at MU as well.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on December 15, 2021, 11:36:29 AM
I am younger than alot of you, but Jimmy should be easy #1. Jae easy #2.
As other say, the thread is about 4 year guys. Re the Jimmy / Jae comparison, Jae is waaaaay ahead of Jimmy in terms of what they accomplished at MU. You are conflating Jimmy's pro efforts into the discussion.
Quote from: BLM on December 15, 2021, 08:36:35 AM
In my fandom, 1) Robert Jackson 2) Andrew Rowsey
Bam and Bam.
Easily 1 and 2 for traditional transfers.
Pretty sure Jackson wuz knot traditional, aina?
Quote from: Nukem2 on December 15, 2021, 01:07:04 PM
As other say, the thread is about 4 year guys. Re the Jimmy / Jae comparison, Jae is waaaaay ahead of Jimmy in terms of what they accomplished at MU. You are conflating Jimmy's pro efforts into the discussion.
And Jae has made an NBA Finals without Jimmy. Jimmy hasn't made one without Jae.
Quote from: Nukem2 on December 15, 2021, 01:07:04 PM
As other say, the thread is about 4 year guys. Re the Jimmy / Jae comparison, Jae is waaaaay ahead of Jimmy in terms of what they accomplished at MU. You are conflating Jimmy's pro efforts into the discussion.
I don't know that agree with "wayyyyy". Jae's senior year was better than Jimmy's, but Jimmy was a three year contributor versus 2 for Jae. Obviously Jimmy didn't win a BEBOY, but his last 2 seasons in an MU jersey were excellent. Jimmy's jr season was better than Jae's jr season.
I think they're pretty close. Perhaps Jimmy's pro days inflate my thoughts a bit in my original post, but if we're including jucos (who are transfers so I don't see why you wouldn't) they're easy 1 and 2 since I became a fan in 2008.
Quote from: Nukem2 on December 15, 2021, 01:07:04 PM
As other say, the thread is about 4 year guys. Re the Jimmy / Jae comparison, Jae is waaaaay ahead of Jimmy in terms of what they accomplished at MU. You are conflating Jimmy's pro efforts into the discussion.
Waaaaay?
Jae was BE POY as a senior (2011-12), and that definitely carries a lot of weight.
But in 2010-11, Jae was Pippen to Jimmy's Jordan. Jimmy was better than Jae in almost every category; Jae came off the bench in more than half the games because Buzz was concerned about fouls. They both played well offensively in our run to the Sweet 16, but it was Jimmy who shut down both Tu Holloway and Scoop Jardine.
In Jimmy's junior season (2009-10), in addition to averaging 3 more points than Jae did as a junior, he hit 2 buzzer-beating winners to just about singlehandedly get us into the NCAA tournament. Jimmy was a valuable sub the previous year, too.
Again, Jae won POY and Jimmy was never more than All-BE honorable mention (which seems impossible in retrospect), and that certainly matters. But IMHO Jimmy's body of work as a Warrior refutes that he was "waaaaay" behind Jae, and one could make a pretty good argument that Jimmy's BOW was at least as good as Jae's BOW.
Quote from: Herman Cain on December 15, 2021, 12:13:27 PM
I think he played Tennis at MU as well.
I believe he would have been a senior went I was a freshman.
Just remember University School pretty much dominated tennis for private HS and his teammate Jud Shauffler and Dudley were probably rated 1 and 2 in the state for private schools and I am pretty sure could have held their own against any of the public HS best.
Dudley is a Praire School alum, not U School, aina?
Gary Brell
Ulice Payne
If JuCos are included: J Whitehead
Walter Downing and of course Rube Schultz.
Quote from: MU82 on December 15, 2021, 01:42:00 PM
Waaaaay?
Jae was BE POY as a senior (2011-12), and that definitely carries a lot of weight.
But in 2010-11, Jae was Pippen to Jimmy's Jordan. Jimmy was better than Jae in almost every category; Jae came off the bench in more than half the games because Buzz was concerned about fouls. They both played well offensively in our run to the Sweet 16, but it was Jimmy who shut down both Tu Holloway and Scoop Jardine.
In Jimmy's junior season (2009-10), in addition to averaging 3 more points than Jae did as a junior, he hit 2 buzzer-beating winners to just about singlehandedly get us into the NCAA tournament. Jimmy was a valuable sub the previous year, too.
Again, Jae won POY and Jimmy was never more than All-BE honorable mention (which seems impossible in retrospect), and that certainly matters. But IMHO Jimmy's body of work as a Warrior refutes that he was "waaaaay" behind Jae, and one could make a pretty good argument that Jimmy's BOW was at least as good as Jae's BOW.
Jimmy had 3 seasons. If you compare their first seasons, Jae was much better. Jae's other (senior) season eclipses either of Jimmy's other seasons. All depends how you look at things. No knock on Jimmy.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 15, 2021, 02:48:36 PM
Dudley is a Praire School alum, not U School, aina?
You are probably correct.
Too many years ago.
Quote from: Nukem2 on December 15, 2021, 02:53:00 PM
Jimmy had 3 seasons. If you compare their first seasons, Jae was much better. Jae's other (senior) season eclipses either of Jimmy's other seasons. All depends how you look at things. No knock on Jimmy.
Yes, it all depends how you look at things. I think it's more "fair" to compare each player's junior season at Marquette, each player's senior season, and each player's body of work. And I can understand a conclusion that, maybe, Jae gets the edge based on POY as a senior. I'm having trouble with the "waaaay." No knock on Jae! Loved 'em both!
Quote from: MU82 on December 15, 2021, 03:17:01 PM
Yes, it all depends how you look at things. I think it's more "fair" to compare each player's junior season at Marquette, each player's senior season, and each player's body of work. And I can understand a conclusion that, maybe, Jae gets the edge based on POY as a senior. I'm having trouble with the "waaaay." No knock on Jae! Loved 'em both!
We'll just have to agree to disagree.Seems fairer to compare their first seasons given the need to transition to Div l as well as assimilating into the program. Jae just did not have that extra middle season. But, glad we had them both!
Jimmy was better at getting into the headlines (or having MU have to scramble to keep it out of the headlines) for off court stuff than Jae was while he was at MU.
Let's have a little re-set. It all starts with #4 Benny Moore!! Brought a bit of excitement to Rick's dark ages. After that David Boone and Robert Jackson.
#4 Benny Moore was a great, great guy. How about Jay Zulauf? In Rick's doghouse from day one.
For you youngsters its:
Jim Boylan
Ulice Payne
#'s 1 & 2 with everyone else mentioned above listed below these two - I'm not sure MU wins the 77 Championship without them.
Quote from: MU1in77 on December 15, 2021, 05:11:12 PM
For you youngsters its:
Jim Boylan
Ulice Payne
#'s 1 & 2 with everyone else mentioned above listed below these two - I'm not sure MU wins the 77 Championship without them.
Possibly without Ulice. Zero chance without Jimmy.
Quote from: Goose on December 15, 2021, 04:39:38 PM
#4 Benny Moore was a great, great guy. How about Jay Zulauf? In Rick's doghouse from day one.
Jay Zulauf was a KO guy. Had several classes with him.
Quote from: MU1in77 on December 15, 2021, 05:11:12 PM
For you youngsters its:
Jim Boylan
Ulice Payne
#'s 1 & 2 with everyone else mentioned above listed below these two - I'm not sure MU wins the 77 Championship without them.
They won without UP. He had a separated/dislocated right shoulder for the entire Tourney. Didn't even put on his uni, hey?
It's unfortunate Joe Fulce didn't make the list, but I remember reports coming in that he was the better of the transfers in when compared to Jimmy.
I've always said that JFB was one of the players in any sport that improved from year to year more than anyone I've ever seen- what he became from year 1, to year 2 and then year 3 at MU was astounding. Still, I remember thinking that he wasn't going to be a very good NBA player when the Bulls copped in the draft.
Then, he wasn't very good in Chicago at first but the NBA player he became from year 1 to year 2 and beyond was again astounding.
That said, my mind has it that Jae was the more dominant MU player, and that's because of his one monster season. Jae was an absolute beast defensively, and averaged more points and rebounds in that one season than JFB in his best season. Also, Jae just felt like a bigger difference maker/game changer with his defense and overall presence on the court, despite some big memorable moments for Jimmy.
Lets get to DJO though- that dude was awesome and I feel never gets enough credit in MU history folklore. I was surprised that his 3P shooting percentage wasn't as impressive as I remembered when I just looked it up, but DJO could ball, he was a pretty elite scorer in his final season.
If there's one player in MU history that I feel almost never gets his due it's Jerel McNeal- that dude was was better than he's ever given credit for. Vander Blue is honorable mention here.
DJO may be the transfer version of that if we are counting Jucos
Dont know my transfers pre 88 so it goes
JFB
Rob Jax
R Curry
DJO
Quote from: 4everwarriors on December 15, 2021, 06:35:54 PM
They won without UP. He had a separated/dislocated right shoulder for the entire Tourney. Didn't even put on his uni, hey?
Yeah, he missed a bunch of that stretch run to get an invite as well. Boylan was obviously huge.
Quote from: MU1in77 on December 15, 2021, 05:11:12 PM
For you youngsters its:
Jim Boylan
Ulice Payne
#'s 1 & 2 with everyone else mentioned above listed below these two - I'm not sure MU wins the 77 Championship without them.
Ulice Payne was hurt, so he did not play in championship game. I am not sure if he played in any of the NCAA tournament games.
Quote from: bilsu on December 15, 2021, 08:23:18 PM
Ulice Payne was hurt, so he did not play in championship game. I am not sure if he played in any of the NCAA tournament games.
He missed the last 10 games of the year, which is far more than the tournament.