You know how people always say they want more in depth articles and research from their news outlets, they're lying. They want ranks and lists.
So without further ado, I decided to rank the MU players and assign them grades through their early season play, starting with the guards. (But don't worry, there are lots of stats and charts because I can't help myself.)
https://painttouches.com/2020/12/29/grading-marquette-players-to-date-guards/ (https://painttouches.com/2020/12/29/grading-marquette-players-to-date-guards/)
Interest read, Andrei. Thanks for posting.
KOBY: Very pleased with his improvement and his adjustment to his offensive role, as well as his defense. Also seems to have matured; not as easily bothered by stuff out of his control. Need a little more consistency as a scorer from him. As for the actual grade, I saw where you said you grade on a curve and that's cool. For me, an A or A- goes to elite players, and as much as I like what Koby has done, he isn't that.
GREG: He is a willing defender but unfortunately is a liability. His guy simply goes around him, over him or both. I think Wojo needs to look for more opportunities to play him in certain situations despite that for all the reasons you state about Greg's instant offense capabilities.
DJ: I don't think his corner 3 against Creighton was "lost in the shuffle" at all. Many Scoopers, including me, called it Marquette's single biggest play of the game. Otherwise, agree with all you say. He is so important. When he plays well, we have a chance to win most games.
SYMIR: He was a bit of a disappointment even before he got hurt. Hoping the long break lets him get 100% healthy and really hoping he can play closer to what many (perhaps even himself) were expecting.
This exercise underscores just how hurtin' our backcourt would have been had Wojo not landed DJ. But he did land DJ, thankfully, so we still have a shot at a solid season.
Thanks for the feedback!
I do think it's important to grade to an individual baseline rather than overall production, but it's hard to come to an agreement on what that is, so can see it both ways. For Koby in particular, he'd be around an A even if I wasn't ridiculously down on him going into the season. He's had a few stinkers, and the 3pt shot is still due for more regression, but he's been near elite this season in terms of efficiency (with really good D to boot).
When I see an article like this, I always assign grades before reading it so I can see how knowledgeable the author is (determined, of course, by how closely his grades match the ones I assigned). You were never more than a half-grade off, and therefore must be quite intelligent.
Seriously, hard to argue with any of them.
Elliot a B+???? do you watch the games?
Quote from: mhendrick on December 29, 2020, 04:39:14 PM
Elliot a B+???? do you watch the games?
Yeah Elliot is like a C at best and DJ should be the B+
Quote from: mhendrick on December 29, 2020, 04:39:14 PM
Elliot a B+???? do you watch the games?
Quote from: Markusquette on December 29, 2020, 04:44:39 PM
Yeah Elliot is like a C at best and DJ should be the B+
If you read the article, Andrei explains that the grades are curved based on individual preseason expectations
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 29, 2020, 05:18:39 PM
If you read the article, Andrei explains that the grades are curved based on individual preseason expectations
Based on my preseason expectations, Elliott has played no better than a C besides the Creighton win.
I don't know what people are watching with Greg, but he's over 50% from 2, over 50% from 3, over 80% at the line, and has been our most efficient offensive player. If anyone should be playing more, it's Greg. He's been excellent.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 29, 2020, 05:33:58 PM
I don't know what people are watching with Greg, but he's over 50% from 2, over 50% from 3, over 80% at the line, and has been our most efficient offensive player. If anyone should be playing more, it's Greg. He's been excellent.
He's been roasted on defense the past few games but I guess that applies to all our guards other than Koby.
Quote from: BM1090 on December 29, 2020, 05:44:31 PM
He's been roasted on defense the past few games but I guess that applies to all our guards other than Koby.
Correct. I'm not going to discount that he is playing okay offensively, albeit with limited attempts and a bit sporadic in playing time. Relative to his play over the last couple years I would say he has been average. Not excellent. I prefer him playing over Torrence but that's not saying much.
Per Hoop Explorer, MU is 4.8 points worse on defense with Elliott on the floor (adjusted per 100 possessions) but 13.6 points better offensively, for a net rating of +8.8 against top 200 opponents.
He has the best offensive net rating of any of the guards, so his play has been great no matter what your baseline for him was. My issue is just that he hasn't played even 40% of minutes, so there's small sample size theater still needing validation.
Greg is a +5 in Big East play. DJ is a -24 and Koby is a -23. Sy is a -8 in two BE games with limited minutes.
The grades versus expectations seem right to me. DJ was 2nd Team Preseason BE. Koby wasn't even on the radar after last season.
Now, the grades overall without the curve?
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 29, 2020, 05:33:58 PM
I don't know what people are watching with Greg, but he's over 50% from 2, over 50% from 3, over 80% at the line, and has been our most efficient offensive player. If anyone should be playing more, it's Greg. He's been excellent.
Offensively Greg is very good, an A, but on defense, he can not guard anybody. So Wojo needs to play zone with him in to hide his defensive deficiency. Man, he is to weak and slow, probably not his fault due to all his injuries, to bad
Quote from: BCHoopster on December 29, 2020, 08:10:39 PM
Offensively Greg is very good, an A, but on defense, he can not guard anybody. So Wojo needs to play zone with him in to hide his defensive deficiency. Man, he is to weak and slow, probably not his fault due to all his injuries, to bad
Right now, his offense more than outdoes his defensive issues. And no one other than Koby seems able to guard a hat rack, so it's not like having one sieve instead of another is really much of an issue.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 29, 2020, 08:16:07 PM
Right now, his offense more than outdoes his defensive issues. And no one other than Koby seems able to guard a hat rack, so it's not like having one sieve instead of another is really much of an issue.
Greg's not exactly an offensive juggernaut. He's simply making the most of his limited opportunities. I like Greg, but he's basically been the same player throughout his career at MU. A hustle guy off the bench that adds a little jolt on offense every so often. To your last point, you're right. I'll reiterate that I'd like to see Greg get more of Symir's minutes.