1. Xavier is going to be a pain for everyone. Deep. Pounds the boards, shoots 3s, switches defenses. Interchangeable. Attacks every loose ball. Undefeated for a reason.
2. Sure wasn't dull.
3. Freshman forward finally makes a three. Garcia and Lewis had combined to miss a bunch in a row.
4. Glad Symir came back. Clearly out of rhythm. DJ got in foul trouble. Symir or Koby in that situation?
5. Dawson attacked the rim well.
6. Crucial stretch in the second half where MU could not buy a call. Not bagging on the refs, but sometimes there are stretches where every 50-50 call goes against your team.
7. I like deeper rotations than Wojo does.
8. I love Theo's ambidextrous jump hooks. Finally missed a 3.
9. This team fights.
10. Fail to secure a crucial rebound and...
11. Poop. Helluva game, helluva finish, wrong side won.
So that's what it feels like to be on the other side of a finish like that.
Ouch
X outhustled MU.
X didnt miss in second half and we still only lost by a prayer. It fucking sucks. But it is what it is
Get that last rebound (or any other of multiples during the game), and it's likely MU's to win.
Got down and never quit right to the final second. Cannot knock the effort out of this team.
Of course it's the guy who shouldn't even be eligible.
So close ans yet so far. We will learn from tHis. If I'm Wojo, I'm talking about how this will Never happen again.
Kinda like Coach Lombardi after the Packers lost to the Eagles in 1960 in the NFL title game.
Best defensive team, and Xavier hangs 90 on them.
Some nice wins this year, but 5-4 is 5-4.
Quote from: ChitownSpaceForRent on December 20, 2020, 03:20:05 PM
Of course it's the guy who shouldn't even be eligible.
Why shouldn't he be eligible?
up 7 in first half and we let 3 straight defensive boards slip through our hands and they got points on each one. One was on a missed FT in which we had 3 of our own guys fight eachother for it.
Xavier shoots out of their mind and we still get beat on a prayer.
It feels like a lot of our 50/50 balls we lose are same team turnovers. Like our two or three fight and no one. gets it
Kunkel the new JP Macura. 22 points in like 17 minutes, 90% from field, perfect from line, two steals. Quite a performance.
Scruggs was too much for Koby, but at least Koby showed some grit in last five minutes.
MU shoots 55% and loses.
Loose balls, not grabbing them and some dumb passes lead to too many points. Hello Jamal and Symir tossing the inbound ball to X after timeout.
Again, doubling on defense and kick out threes for X. And they made them.
Tough loss.
Is it just me or has Marquette suffered more than its share of heartbreaking losses in the last 10-15 years?
Defensive team this year?
We gonna stick with that assessment?
Quote from: injuryBug on December 20, 2020, 03:22:27 PM
up 7 in first half and we let 3 straight defensive boards slip through our hands and they got points on each one. One was on a missed FT in which we had 3 of our own guys fight eachother for it.
Xavier shoots out of their mind and we still get beat on a prayer.
Xavier shot out of their mind because they had a lot of open looks. The defense was awful today.
Theo out for that bound hurt us
Quote from: injuryBug on December 20, 2020, 03:22:27 PM
up 7 in first half and we let 3 straight defensive boards slip through our hands and they got points on each one. One was on a missed FT in which we had 3 of our own guys fight eachother for it.
Xavier shoots out of their mind and we still get beat on a prayer.
Not only this game. The team, in general, has bad hands. I can't even begin to guess how many rebounds go off their hands to the other team.
This one might have broke me.
I just can't get past the fact that they just let X run their stuff and get look after look without even trying to make them uncomfortable.
When a team is in a rhythm like that you throw the kitchen sink at them. You don't do the same crap and hope they miss.
MU played hard but don't do the little things you need to win games like this. How many times did they not secure a rebound they should have had? How many turnovers, especially inability to catch the ball with open lane to basket? How many times were they a step slow on closing out a shooter.
For all the things they do well, they are not going to string wins together until they shore this up
Moving screen at the top of the key on X's last play.
Is it just me or are we unusually bad at 3 point closeouts this year?
Quote from: lurch91 on December 20, 2020, 03:31:11 PM
Moving screen at the top of the key on X's last play.
+1
Quote from: cheese ball chaser on December 20, 2020, 03:31:59 PM
Is it just me or are we unusually bad at 3 point closeouts this year?
Oddly enough I think the footwork has been better but they're not getting hands high enough to contest.
For a team that's supposed to be better defensively (a rep earned vs. cupcakes) we give up a ton of open 3's and back door bunnies. Over 240 allowed last 3. Went into this season optimistic but we're what, 2-4 against non-cakes? It's frustrating. People always go off on us and have career games. Koby made Scruggs work, but Scruggs is good. Too many other shots were uncontested. There could be a whole other thread about the offensive (in both senses of the word) rebounding.
Nova coming in and a 1-3 start is a hole to dig out of. A win would be a mitzvah but this team has not shown that they can play with the likes of Nova.
Long way to go. Most important thing is wojo not losing this team like in years past. If they can get to that second half of the season not buried, there are a lot of winnable games on that side of the schedule.
Quote from: Newsdreams on December 20, 2020, 03:27:30 PM
Theo out for that bound hurt us
Hard to fault anyone for that last board. Shot was way short and hit square against the front of the rim so the ball came off hard. Koby got a hand on it but didn't really have a chance to grab it. Tough to lose after such a great comeback down the stretch. In it to the end against a good team that shot extremely well. Frustrating but what an entertaining game. Would have been a huge W.
Quote from: Afroman on December 20, 2020, 03:24:27 PM
Is it just me or has Marquette suffered more than its share of heartbreaking losses in the last 10-15 years?
Think the last 8 (last Buzz year +7 Wojo) have been the real problem. Every team wins and looses close ones but ... same old same old results year in and year out is painful to watch. This is the best team in 8 years but we do need to start winning consistently. I am exhausted.
Quote from: MUfan12 on December 20, 2020, 03:29:48 PM
This one might have broke me.
I just can't get past the fact that they just let X run their stuff and get look after look without even trying to make them uncomfortable.
When a team is in a rhythm like that you throw the kitchen sink at them. You don't do the same crap and hope they miss.
Completely agree I get frustrated my son's HS team will sit in a zone the entire game and let a hot shooter sit in the same spot and go for 30 and the coach does nothing. My son even asked the coach if they could play man and the coach said no.
Even if you throw a team off for 1 or 2 posessions with a different defense (zone or switch everything) it gives them a different look and now they are out of a sync a little and unsure what might be coming at them.
100% I'm Broke
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on December 20, 2020, 03:21:45 PM
Best defensive team, and Xavier hangs 90 on them.
Some nice wins this year, but 5-4 is 5-4.
Does anyone still think this defense is good? Returns since EIU aren't very good.
Hard to believe a team can shoot like that after 2 weeks of inactivity. Looked like they had been practicing the whole time. They shot the lights out and had to win on a buzzer beater. I like our chances in the rematch.
Wojo's "most talented team" - staring at 1-4 in the league and will be fighting for the Big East mediocrity trophy yet again.
Yes they fought, yes they are tough but your record says who you are.
Would be nice if we pressured the inbounds pass after the made basket as other teams this year have successfully done to us to change the momentum of the game.
Quote from: Bad_Reporter on December 20, 2020, 03:21:45 PM
Best defensive team, and Xavier hangs 90 on them.
Some nice wins this year, but 5-4 is 5-4.
Yep.
Watched the game with a bunch of housemates from 20 years ago. 2 minutes into the 2nd half we all said "we'll keep it close but will lose at the end" - Again - this is a perfect example of the marginal game - couldn't keep separation when we were out in front, couldn't respond to their second half run until it was too late.
Again, not a bad loss in isolation - but 0-4 in "toss-up" games this year. Hopefully we even that out, but we'll see....
1. Defense has gone backwards.
2. We have loose handles and silly inexplicable turnovers.
3. Offensive rebounds hurt.
4. There was a stretch around 8-9 minute mark left in the second half, that I don't know how all those blocks and physicality by X were not fouls.
5. No idea how we almost stole that game.
6. Good to see Symir back and get some minutes.
7. This team is resilient.
8. No gimmies in the Big East. Saddle up and play another tough opponent.
Quote from: lurch91 on December 20, 2020, 03:31:11 PM
Moving screen at the top of the key on X's last play.
Yelled at the TV as it happened. Would have been called in my kid's Jr. High game, but I guess not in D1...
Is Jose Perez just that bad? I knew the advanced stats weren't favorable but figured he could give Woj some burn this year once deemed eligible
Quote from: mhendrick on December 20, 2020, 03:48:19 PM
Hard to believe a team can shoot like that after 2 weeks of inactivity. Looked like they had been practicing the whole time. They shot the lights out and had to win on a buzzer beater. I like our chances in the rematch.
Agreed that X certainly didn't look like a team that has been on any kind of pause.
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2020, 04:11:56 PM
Watched the game with a bunch of housemates from 20 years ago. 2 minutes into the 2nd half we all said "we'll keep it close but will lose at the end" - Again - this is a perfect example of the marginal game - couldn't keep separation when we were out in front, couldn't respond to their second half run until it was too late.
Again, not a bad loss in isolation - but 0-4 in "toss-up" games this year. Hopefully we even that out, but we'll see....
While I would agree that MU needs to do better in "toss up" games, MU's record is 2-4 in those games. You have to also count Wisconsin and Creighton, if you are counting the other four.
Wojo said the team is a bit tired. That is understandable. 4th game in 10 days. 4 different cities. Would be nice to use the 3 others on the bench!?!
Quote from: Mr. Nielsen on December 20, 2020, 04:57:04 PM
Wojo said the team is a bit tired. That is understandable. 4th game in 10 days. 4 different cities. Would be nice to use the 3 others on the bench!?!
Wojos comments are also tired.
I'd have to rewatch to be sure, but I feel like the defense was actually better this game than the Seton Hall game....but Xavier's offense was way way better than Seton Hall's. Seton Hall it felt like they were getting a ton of shots with no one within 5 feet of them. Other than a handful, it felt like we were challenging every shot today but they were hitting everything.
Bad on the boards today. That's usually a strength and we couldn't hang onto anything. Was the difference in the game.
Is the ESPN box score correct? 12 turnovers but X had 10 steals? That doesn't seem right but maybe it was.
Lewis is not a good defender most nights. Late on rotations. Gives up back door cuts and doesn't cut off passing lanes. Two of Carton's fouls were because he was trying to make up for Lewis being out of position.
We are going to win a lot of games in the last 16 games of the season (assuming we play all 16). After the Villanova game, we will have played 5/7 of our toughest games of the season with 16 games left to play. So far, we have won two and been competitive but lost the other two of the toughest games we've played so far. I still like the team and there is no quit in them. I think taking our lumps early will lead to a very good finish to the season.
Quote from: lurch91 on December 20, 2020, 03:31:11 PM
Moving screen at the top of the key on X's last play.
I won't blame the loss on the officials, but that was a HUGE missed call...especially since they called Theo for a moving screen just a couple minutes earlier.
Either call 'em all, or let 'em all go.
First of all, taking off our Blue 'n Gold colored glasses on these games this year, these have all been great games. The last season I remembered this many close games was when Buzz had all those OT games. Living on the edge in this crappity year has been a joy. Let's cherish this effort. Looking up in the sky for BD.
Orating of 1.28 is ridiculous. However, a dRating of 1.32 is well...Arby's. Wojo was pissed and dejected post-game. Fifty-eight 2nd half points given up is something I have to look up (as well as the 54 scored MU scored). It seems we had dead legs and stone hands today on the defensive. Yet, the boys stuck around and had a valiant effort to end. Hat tip to Koby.
Lastly, I will put this out here for discussion. Walk or not on that step back clincher. We were debating this on our thread text and I was voted down on my claim it was a travel (it's close and they will never call it but for hoops debate).
QuoteAt the conference's media day last week, Big 12 coordinator of officials Curtis Shaw announced a number of rule changes coming to college basketball this season. One of them: On step-back moves, players must land with both feet at the same time. Now, it's a travel if a player steps back and lands with one foot after the other.
So Diarra's 3-pointer would have been waved off.
"What we've told the teams is all step-back moves are going to be called travels except if he can push off one and simultaneously jump back and land on two at the same time," Shaw said. "If you push off one, land one, two, we want it called every time because it's indefensible. We want it taken out of the game."
https://themercury.com/k_state_sports/explaining-college-basketball-s-new-traveling-rules-and-how-big-12-players-and-coaches-plan/article_2415d6b6-c461-5f99-9e41-cdb121cdfc63.html
I see a dragging foot not a simultaneous step back under the fairly new rule clarification. Zar and Jamil used to do the drag off the dribble. I am open to being wrong, and I am not a fan of overlegislation and am ok the no call, but this looks to me to be a travel.
https://fb.watch/2vAXGCgKKN/
1. Down 6....under a minute....X has the ball....exciting comeback.
2. Jamal's stone hands showed again.
3. Creighton scores regularly and late on their OOB plays (did it again today). We turn it over and foul on our inbounds.
4. Hope this team can all get on the same page later in the year.
What we are seeing now is Justin plays well, Dawson doesn't. Koby plays well, DJ doesn't. Justin plays well, Theo doesn't, etc.
5. Games like this one all year for this team in the Big East.
The worst call for me was DJ's last foul, both were going after the ball and DJ dove, barely touches the kids foot and they blow the whistle
Quote from: shoothoops on December 20, 2020, 04:46:08 PM
While I would agree that MU needs to do better in "toss up" games, MU's record is 2-4 in those games. You have to also count Wisconsin and Creighton, if you are counting the other four.
2-3 is more accurate. The OK State game was not a toss-up. We were down 8 with 8 minutes left and never got closer then 7 after that. MU was not competitive in that game.
Quote from: TSmith34 on December 20, 2020, 03:16:36 PM
X outhustled MU.
T, I don%u2019t know if I agree. Fun game to watch. It was anybody%u2019s game. MU played at a high level in my humble opinion. Love the way this team fights. I see this team only getting better.
Quote from: CountryRoads on December 20, 2020, 03:41:03 PM
Long way to go. Most important thing is wojo not losing this team like in years past. If they can get to that second half of the season not buried, there are a lot of winnable games on that side of the schedule.
Correct. I could see us beating Villanova next as well.
Quote from: WarriorPride68 on December 20, 2020, 04:29:38 PM
Is Jose Perez just that bad? I knew the advanced stats weren't favorable but figured he could give Woj some burn this year once deemed eligible
That thought crosses my mind too. Then I wonder if Wojo is recalling that Chartouny wasn't as ready to step up to BEast competition as his Fordham stats hinted at. It's nice to be able to play Perez this season, but it may be that he needs a season of transition.
And, whose minutes would he have taken today?
Quote from: mug644 on December 20, 2020, 05:47:47 PM
That thought crosses my mind too. Then I wonder if Wojo is recalling that Chartouny wasn't as ready to step up to BEast competition as his Fordham stats hinted at. It's nice to be able to play Perez this season, but it may be that he needs a season of transition.
And, whose minutes would he have taken today?
I guess I don't understand what a season of transition will do to make him more ready to get play if he never actually plays.
Not that I think he should play or would make a difference.
What did you all think about Jamal driving into to the lane today? He seemed to do it 4-5 times and scored on a few of them. I don't recall him losing the handle and turning the ball over, as is etched in my memory.
I still don't want him doing it, but it seemed more successful today.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on December 20, 2020, 05:52:07 PM
I guess I don't understand what a season of transition will do to make him more ready to get play if he never actually plays.
Not that I think he should play or would make a difference.
Fair point, but even as a member of the practice/opponent team in game prep sessions, he's playing against MU players that are more BEast ready than his teammates from last year. At least that might be my logic, if I was logical.
Quote from: mug644 on December 20, 2020, 05:54:57 PM
Fair point, but even as a member of the practice/opponent team in game prep sessions, he's playing against MU players that are more BEast ready than his teammates from last year. At least that might be my logic, if I was logical.
Perez is 22 years old. I'd say he probably is what he is at this point.
Not gonna blame this on the refs. I mean, we lose a rebound when we have 3 rebounders and they have none ... and then they immediately hit a 3. Silly live-ball turnovers leading to X hoops. Some poor defense. Nobody can stop Scruggs.
However ...
That was a moving screen. I screamed at the TV and then they hit that effen prayer of a 3 and I had to leave the room because I didn't want to drive my wife crazy. I musta screamed, "That was an effen moving screen ... Call it!" 5 times.
I watched the replay later, and it was even worse than I thought in live action. Freemantle totally wiped out Koby on the play to let Scruggs in the lane, and after that we all were out of position.
If you want to ref at that level, you HAVE to have the courage to make that call. You make the call, and it's a tie game, Marquette ball, about 6 seconds left.
The 5th foul against DJ also was quite poor. Maybe his pinky fouled the X guy's pinky toe. Ridiculous in a physical game that you're letting a lot go.
But again, MU had a zillion chances to take a pretty nice lead in the first half but we didn't do it, and never could get multiple stops in the second half.
We actually are a very good rebounding team. The only other game we lost the rebounding battle was -2 to Madison, and we had the rebounding edge in the second half of this one. Long rebounds off missed 3s often are a little lucky, and we get our share of 'em when we miss 3s, too. And I agree with earlier Scoopers who said it was hard to blame our guys for not getting that miss by Scruggs given the bounce.
That's basketball. Sucks. We could be 3-0 in the Big East ... or 2-1 ... or 0-3. What we are is 1-2. Got a decent chance to beat Nova if we play well, just as I said the day before the Creighton game. I still like this team.
We Are Marquette!
Quote from: 1SE on December 20, 2020, 04:11:56 PM
Again, not a bad loss in isolation - but 0-4 in "toss-up" games this year. Hopefully we even that out, but we'll see....
and 2-0 in games we should have zero chance to win. I also hope we improve the record in what you call toss-up (we were underdogs in 3 of those)
Quote from: Silent Verbal on December 20, 2020, 06:09:28 PM
Perez is 22 years old. I'd say he probably is what he is at this point.
maybe by NEXT season he'll have dropped the jelly donuts and be able to contribute more than just as a scout guy.
Quote from: Marq3332 on December 20, 2020, 06:18:24 PM
maybe by NEXT season he'll have dropped the jelly donuts and be able to contribute more than just as a scout guy.
Wow. You don't have to go all "Mean Girls" on one of our players.
Quote from: Afroman on December 20, 2020, 03:24:27 PM
Is it just me or has Marquette suffered more than its share of heartbreaking losses in the last 10-15 years?
When you play a lot of close games, you win and lose a lot of heartbreakers/coin flips. We've had 4 this year and we're 2-2. They tend to even out.
Lenny with the perspective.
X is a good team. We battled and lost.
I see this team with a fighting spirit and looking forward to a strong performance in the next game.
Quote from: tower912 on December 20, 2020, 03:14:34 PM
1. Xavier is going to be a pain for everyone. Deep. Pounds the boards, shoots 3s, switches defenses. Interchangeable. Attacks every loose ball. Undefeated for a reason.
2. Sure wasn't dull.
3. Freshman forward finally makes a three. Garcia and Lewis had combined to miss a bunch in a row.
4. Glad Symir came back. Clearly out of rhythm. DJ got in foul trouble. Symir or Koby in that situation?
5. Dawson attacked the rim well.
6. Crucial stretch in the second half where MU could not buy a call. Not bagging on the refs, but sometimes there are stretches where every 50-50 call goes against your team.
7. I like deeper rotations than Wojo does.
8. I love Theo's ambidextrous jump hooks. Finally missed a 3.
9. This team fights.
10. Fail to secure a crucial rebound and...
11. Poop. Helluva game, helluva finish, wrong side won.
12. My kids had bragging rights until our next game with XU.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on December 20, 2020, 07:50:48 PM
When you play a lot of close games, you win and lose a lot of heartbreakers/coin flips. We've had 4 this year and we're 2-2. They tend to even out.
Great perspective, Lenny.
Quote from: Mr. Nielsen on December 20, 2020, 04:57:04 PM
Wojo said the team is a bit tired. That is understandable. 4th game in 10 days. 4 different cities. Would be nice to use the 3 others on the bench!?!
This is the biggest most disgusting excuse from the wojo era.
I am so sick and tired of hearing how tired Marquette is. As if the rest of the country is in some bubble that allows them to rest but not Marquette.
Quote from: injuryBug on December 20, 2020, 03:45:37 PM
Completely agree I get frustrated my son's HS team will sit in a zone the entire game and let a hot shooter sit in the same spot and go for 30 and the coach does nothing. My son even asked the coach if they could play man and the coach said no.
Even if you throw a team off for 1 or 2 posessions with a different defense (zone or switch everything) it gives them a different look and now they are out of a sync a little and unsure what might be coming at them.
I used to coach high-school and now coach the 5th to 8th grade program for a high school in Wisconsin (gives me more time) and I have been bewildered by the coach and his "system" and refusal to change it.
I've told him many times that you need to adapt the system to the players, not the players to the system... but he continues to fall to weaker competition and doesn't know why...
Quote from: #UnleashDiener on December 20, 2020, 09:02:49 PM
This is the biggest most disgusting excuse from the wojo era.
I am so sick and tired of hearing how tired Marquette is. As if the rest of the country is in some bubble that allows them to rest but not Marquette.
Let's be honest, when you you've used every excuse in the book you have to invent others.
Quote from: Silent Verbal on December 20, 2020, 06:09:28 PM
Perez is 22 years old. I'd say he probably is what he is at this point.
Dumb take. See countless seniors/NBA players who made huge strides after the age of 22. (Dwight buykes)
Quote from: cheese ball chaser on December 20, 2020, 09:08:49 PM
Let's be honest, when you you've used every excuse in the book you have to invent others.
I've seen this same tired excuse for the last 4 years :-[
Y'all take press conferences way more seriously than I do.
Quote from: Mr. Nielsen on December 20, 2020, 04:57:04 PM
Wojo said the team is a bit tired. That is understandable. 4th game in 10 days. 4 different cities. Would be nice to use the 3 others on the bench!?!
Team is tired and the last 2 teams we have faced have had 10+ days to prepare for us. Avoiding covid has some disadvantages too.
Quote from: #UnleashDiener on December 20, 2020, 09:11:51 PM
Dumb take. See countless seniors/NBA players who made huge strides after the age of 22. (Dwight buykes)
In his first year at Marquette, at age 20, Buycks averaged 23mpg and 6ppg for Marquette. Rowsey, in his first year at MU, averaged 20mpg and 12ppg. And he would've been a big contributor the moment he stepped on campus if he hadn't had to sit out a year after his transfer. Kunkel was playing his first Big East game for Xavier and torched us for 22 points in 17 minutes. Even Koby clearly belonged from the get go, and again, would've been a big contributor right away if he hadn't had to sit out a year.
There's a big difference between those guys and Perez, who is not even able to get off the bench for MU. This whole "he needs a year to get used to the higher level" thing is a myth. This isn't minor league baseball where you draft an 18 year old kid and hope in five years he's ready to contribute at a high level.
Quote from: rocky_warrior on December 20, 2020, 06:15:38 PM
and 2-0 in games we should have zero chance to win. I also hope we improve the record in what you call toss-up (we were underdogs in 3 of those)
Sure and we're also 3-0 in game we absolutely should have won.
But that's my point with Wojo's teams. It's like winning a couple we weren't supposed to gives us license to disproportionately lose the "toss ups".
That's why Buzz's teams always over achieved. They could steal a few they weren't expected to win, but then could also take care of business against the middle of the road teams. I'm not saying it was realistic to expect 9-0, but if we were sitting at 7-2 (with the wins against UW and Creighton) this would be an exciting start to the year. Instead it's another hum-hum stroll through mediocrity, the bubble, and a first-round exit.
Quote from: Doo on December 20, 2020, 05:24:50 PM
2-3 is more accurate. The OK State game was not a toss-up. We were down 8 with 8 minutes left and never got closer then 7 after that. MU was not competitive in that game.
"Toss up" games can mean a few different things. It can mean winnable games against good teams. Or it can mean an actual individual game down to the wire. I gave the benefit of the doubt of either one the poster wanted.
The Oklahoma St. Game was a winnable game vs a good team. It was one that was disappointing to lose, especially in the way it happened, and, especially catching them earlier in the season. But I agree that was not a down to the wire game.
So I look at it as six MU games vs good teams. MU has won two of those games. Long way to go, but I expected slightly better than that at this time. Others may disagree, and that's fine. We're here to win games.
I do see some referencing the schedule often, but things can and do change during seasons. New and unexpected challenges often present themselves as seasons progress. Closing out, and winning games when you can, helps.
Right now MU is good enough to be in most of the good games. They have won a few, and have lost a few more. And it changes game to game. Get a win over Villanova next game, and the results change again.
Quote from: Silent Verbal on December 20, 2020, 11:13:28 PM
In his first year at Marquette, at age 20, Buycks averaged 23mpg and 6ppg for Marquette. Rowsey, in his first year at MU, averaged 20mpg and 12ppg. And he would've been a big contributor the moment he stepped on campus if he hadn't had to sit out a year after his transfer. Kunkel was playing his first Big East game for Xavier and torched us for 22 points in 17 minutes. Even Koby clearly belonged from the get go, and again, would've been a big contributor right away if he hadn't had to sit out a year.
There's a big difference between those guys and Perez, who is not even able to get off the bench for MU. This whole "he needs a year to get used to the higher level" thing is a myth. This isn't minor league baseball where you draft an 18 year old kid and hope in five years he's ready to contribute at a high level.
In addition to Kunkel, Nate Johnson is another instant contributor for X. Ironically, also a transfer from Gardner Webb. Perez averaged 15.2 ppg and 6.5 rpg, while Johnson was at 13.5 and 4.7, though Perez shot 34% FG and 25% from 3. Johnson was 44% FG and 41%. Both played heavy minutes. Johnson is at 59% on 3s so far on 44 attempts. Have to think he comes back to earth at some point.
Quote from: shoothoops on December 21, 2020, 06:50:10 AM
"Toss up" games can mean a few different things. It can mean winnable games against good teams. Or it can mean an actual individual game down to the wire. I gave the benefit of the doubt of either one the poster wanted.
The Oklahoma St. Game was a winnable game vs a good team. It was one that was disappointing to lose, especially in the way it happened, and, especially catching them earlier in the season. But I agree that was not a down to the wire game.
So I look at it as six MU games vs good teams. MU has won two of those games. Long way to go, but I expected slightly better than that at this time. Others may disagree, and that's fine. We're here to win games.
I do see some referencing the schedule often, but things can and do change during seasons. New and unexpected challenges often present themselves as seasons progress. Closing out, and winning games when you can, helps.
Right now MU is good enough to be in most of the good games. They have won a few, and have lost a few more. And it changes game to game. Get a win over Villanova next game, and the results change again.
Yeah, I meant teams "in our ballpark" (kenpom wise or whatever)
So 4 "toss-ups"
Ok St 44
Xavier 48
UCLA 29
SH 52
Quote from: 1SE on December 21, 2020, 06:59:45 AM
Yeah, I meant teams "in our ballpark" (kenpom wise or whatever)
So 4 "toss-ups"
Ok St 44
Xavier 48
UCLA 29
SH 52
And those numbers can and do change. I just look at it simply, and say six "good" teams, some better than others. One could say MU has two stronger KenPom wins and goose eggs in the other four good team games thus far. It's all the same thing as long as you count both the wins and the losses. Only mentioning the losses isn't fair of course because those bigger wins count too. Fair is fair. 👍
Quote from: nyg on December 20, 2020, 03:23:30 PM
Kunkel the new JP Macura. 22 points in like 17 minutes, 90% from field, perfect from line, two steals. Quite a performance.
Scruggs was too much for Koby, but at least Koby showed some grit in last five minutes.
MU shoots 55% and loses.
Loose balls, not grabbing them and some dumb passes lead to too many points. Hello Jamal and Symir tossing the inbound ball to X after timeout.
Again, doubling on defense and kick out threes for X. And they made them.
Tough loss.
This killed us. Forgetting turnovers we fumble fingered several defensive rebounds where we had position (and a few on the offensive side, too) leading to extra opportunities and points for Xavier. This team does that strangely often.
Quote from: StillWarriors on December 21, 2020, 06:56:45 AM
In addition to Kunkel, Nate Johnson is another instant contributor for X. Ironically, also a transfer from Gardner Webb. Perez averaged 15.2 ppg and 6.5 rpg, while Johnson was at 13.5 and 4.7, though Perez shot 34% FG and 25% from 3. Johnson was 44% FG and 41%. Both played heavy minutes. Johnson is at 59% on 3s so far on 44 attempts. Have to think he comes back to earth at some point.
Didn't know that, good info.
Wonder where Nate Johnson was ranked on those offseason transfer lists compared to Jose Perez?
Imagine being Jose- your guy Nate, who you were less efficient but better than on the same team last year- is out there averaging 32 mpg and 14ppg on an undefeated Xavier team while you can't log a single minute on a 5-4 MU team.
It must make you feel very badly, like you've made the wrong choice.
Jose also led the team in scoring in one of the pre-season scrimmages and looked good enough to play in many of the clips so it's not like he hasn't performed in a year or something.
I wonder if there's something else there?
Complete conjecture, but I'm pretty sure that wojo didn't like when Symir decided he didn't want to redshirt and maybe felt the same when Jose didn't want to as well? I mean it's water under the bridge with everyone being eligible now and that would be pretty petty but who knows. Only other thing I can think of is a Todd Smith conditioning gripe or some odd off the court concern like social media.
I guess I just find it hard to believe he's really not good enough to play at all
Quote from: DoctorV on December 21, 2020, 07:55:21 AM
Didn't know that, good info.
Wonder where Nate Johnson was ranked on those offseason transfer lists compared to Jose Perez?
Imagine being Jose- your guy Nate, who you were less efficient but better than on the same team last year- is out there averaging 32 mpg and 14ppg on an undefeated Xavier team while you can't log a single minute on a 5-4 MU team.
It must make you feel very badly, like you've made the wrong choice.
Jose also led the team in scoring in one of the pre-season scrimmages and looked good enough to play in many of the clips so it's not like he hasn't performed in a year or something.
I wonder if there's something else there?
Complete conjecture, but I'm pretty sure that wojo didn't like when Symir decided he didn't want to redshirt and maybe felt the same when Jose didn't want to as well? I mean it's water under the bridge with everyone being eligible now and that would be pretty petty but who knows. Only other thing I can think of is a Todd Smith conditioning gripe or some odd off the court concern like social media.
I guess I just find it hard to believe he's really not good enough to play at all
I don't think its a case of him not wanting to redshirt. There is no reason to have him redshirt since everyone gets an extra year, and all transfers are immediately eligible anyway.
I do wonder if there is some reason why he isn't playing beyond his ability to play basketball however. Especially when we were short handed without Symir. Purely hypothetical, but remember that he left Gardner Webb about 2/3 the way through the season last year. Did that impact his academics? Did Marquette say "sure you can take him, but he has to sit this year?"
It's just really weird.
Grabbing loose balls is more of a Brad Davidson thing, aina?
I think I'm getting this down, Doc.
Quote from: CTWarrior on December 21, 2020, 07:55:11 AM
This killed us. Forgetting turnovers we fumble fingered several defensive rebounds where we had position (and a few on the offensive side, too) leading to extra opportunities and points for Xavier. This team does that strangely often.
Yep, Theo and Jamal are frequent offenders here.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on December 21, 2020, 08:45:10 AM
Grabbing loose balls is more of a Brad Davidson thing, aina?
I think I'm getting this down, Doc.
Nice.
Seriously, we had several fumbled rebounds yesterday. Including the one that ultimately led to the dagger through the heart. Big pile of suck.
The solution is.... what exactly? Put in Osa and Perez? Running until they vomit? Medicine balls? If you find a sure fire method to insure that rebounders never fumble the ball or fight with a teammate leading to a turnover, do yourself a favor and patent it. Basketball coaches the world over will pay you big money for your solution.
Quote from: tower912 on December 21, 2020, 09:08:04 AM
Nice.
Seriously, we had several fumbled rebounds yesterday. Including the one that ultimately led to the dagger through the heart. Big pile of suck.
The solution is.... what exactly? Put in Osa and Perez? Running until they vomit? Medicine balls? If you find a sure fire method to insure that rebounders never fumble the ball or fight with a teammate leading to a turnover, do yourself a favor and patent it. Basketball coaches the world over will pay you big money for your solution.
(https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/3685b9a1-1286-49e2-b72a-23321cad4348_1.fc1f6ab45ac9a040c1a5101f2017896c.jpeg?odnWidth=768&odnHeight=768&odnBg=ffffff)
Quote from: tower912 on December 21, 2020, 09:08:04 AM
Nice.
Seriously, we had several fumbled rebounds yesterday. Including the one that ultimately led to the dagger through the heart. Big pile of suck.
The solution is.... what exactly? Put in Osa and Perez? Running until they vomit? Medicine balls? If you find a sure fire method to insure that rebounders never fumble the ball or fight with a teammate leading to a turnover, do yourself a favor and patent it. Basketball coaches the world over will pay you big money for your solution.
+1
Lester Hayes had the right of it. It does, however, negatively effect your release and the other team might notice.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 20, 2020, 05:04:02 PM
I'd have to rewatch to be sure, but I feel like the defense was actually better this game than the Seton Hall game....but Xavier's offense was way way better than Seton Hall's. Seton Hall it felt like they were getting a ton of shots with no one within 5 feet of them. Other than a handful, it felt like we were challenging every shot today but they were hitting everything.
Bad on the boards today. That's usually a strength and we couldn't hang onto anything. Was the difference in the game.
Is the ESPN box score correct? 12 turnovers but X had 10 steals? That doesn't seem right but maybe it was.
Lewis is not a good defender most nights. Late on rotations. Gives up back door cuts and doesn't cut off passing lanes. Two of Carton's fouls were because he was trying to make up for Lewis being out of position.
We are going to win a lot of games in the last 16 games of the season (assuming we play all 16). After the Villanova game, we will have played 5/7 of our toughest games of the season with 16 games left to play. So far, we have won two and been competitive but lost the other two of the toughest games we've played so far. I still like the team and there is no quit in them. I think taking our lumps early will lead to a very good finish to the season.
Our turnover rate has cost us a few games. If we can reduce those we just might be on the winning side of a few games.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 20, 2020, 05:04:02 PM
I'd have to rewatch to be sure, but I feel like the defense was actually better this game than the Seton Hall game....but Xavier's offense was way way better than Seton Hall's. Seton Hall it felt like they were getting a ton of shots with no one within 5 feet of them. Other than a handful, it felt like we were challenging every shot today but they were hitting everything.
Bad on the boards today. That's usually a strength and we couldn't hang onto anything. Was the difference in the game.
Is the ESPN box score correct? 12 turnovers but X had 10 steals? That doesn't seem right but maybe it was.
Lewis is not a good defender most nights. Late on rotations. Gives up back door cuts and doesn't cut off passing lanes. Two of Carton's fouls were because he was trying to make up for Lewis being out of position.
We are going to win a lot of games in the last 16 games of the season (assuming we play all 16). After the Villanova game, we will have played 5/7 of our toughest games of the season with 16 games left to play. So far, we have won two and been competitive but lost the other two of the toughest games we've played so far. I still like the team and there is no quit in them. I think taking our lumps early will lead to a very good finish to the season.
Well I think Seton Hall, X and UConn will be tough games.
Quote from: muwarrior69 on December 21, 2020, 11:02:31 AM
Well I think Seton Hall, X and UConn will be tough games.
I didn't say they would be cakewalks. Just not as tough as vs. Wisconsin, at UCLA, at Creighton, at Xavier, vs. Villanova. I would rank at Hall and at UConn as the 8th and 9th toughest games on our schedule this season.